CC 2012 01 23
CHANHASSEN CITY COUNCIL
REGULAR MEETING
JANUARY 23, 2012
Mayor Furlong called the meeting to order at 7:05 p.m. The meeting was opened with the Pledge to
the Flag.
COUNCIL MEMBERS PRESENT:
Mayor Furlong, Councilman McDonald, Councilwoman
Tjornhom, Councilwoman Ernst, and Councilman Laufenburger
STAFF PRESENT:
Todd Gerhardt, Laurie Hokkanen, Paul Oehme, Kate Aanenson, Todd Hoffman,
and Roger Knutson
Mayor Furlong: Welcome to those here in the council chambers as well as those watching at home.
We’re glad that you joined us this evening and I would ask for those in the council chambers, there should
be a sign up sheet over on the table or coming around. If you could be sure to get your name on that list.
At this point I would ask members of the council if there are any changes or modifications to the agenda.
If not, we’ll proceed with the agenda that was distributed without objection. Our first items today will be
considered under the consent agenda.
PUBLIC ANNOUNCEMENTS:
None.
CONSENT AGENDA: Councilwoman Tjornhom moved, Councilman Laufenburger seconded to
approve the following consent agenda items pursuant to the City Manager’s recommendations:
a. Approval of Minutes:
-City Council Work Session Minutes dated January 7, 2012
-City Council Work Session Minutes dated January 9, 2012
-City Council Verbatim and Summary Minutes dated January 9, 2012
Receive Commission Minutes:
-Planning Commission Verbatim and Summary Minutes dated January 3, 2012
Resolution #2012-04:
c. TH 5 Improvement Project, PW067B2: Approve Cooperative Agreement
with MnDOT.
d. Approval of Legislative Policies.
All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 5 to 0.
VISITOR PRESENTATIONS:
Laurie Susla: Hi. My name is Laurie Susla. I’m a Chanhassen resident and on the board of the Lotus
Lake Conservation Alliance. We represent about 500 homes around the Lotus Lake area. People who are
concerned with Lotus Lake and we just wanted to say thank you very much to all the council members for
ranking AIS prevention for Chanhassen lakes high for 2012. We very much appreciate that. We look
forward to working with you all on a plan real soon so thank you very much.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Anyone else for visitor presentations this evening? Okay, thank you.
Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
LAW ENFORCEMENT/FIRE DEPARTMENT UPDATES.
Mayor Furlong: Good evening Lieutenant, how are you?
Lt. Jeff Enevold: Good evening Mr. Mayor, council. My plan was to bring you some year end stats and
kind of compare ’09, ’10 and ’11. However our records division hasn’t quite put the finishing touches on
those and I don’t want to, I want to bring you complete and accurate statistics so tonight I’ll just take a
few minutes and say how much I enjoyed working with all of you last year and I look forward to working
with you again in 2012 to enhance the services that we’re providing to our citizens and I also want to say
thank you for supporting the public safety plan that I presented last year which includes adding the two
new sergeants. I think that’s going to be a great enhancement for our citizens in Chanhassen. Just want
to take a few minutes and share a few programs that I’m working on implementing for the first half of
next year. One of them is implementing a domestic violence response team that’s going to provide extra
services to those folks who are involved in domestic violence. A couple of the goals are to provide for
the safety of the victim and then creating an environment in which they feel safe, secure and protected
throughout the entire process. Second thing I’m going to be working on this year is to implement a
citizens academy and I understand that you had one here years ago but I think the academy is going to
give participants an opportunity to learn more about their law enforcement professionals in the
community. There’ll be some classroom stuff. Some hand’s on activities. I’m going to make it
informative and fun. It’s going to give citizens a better understanding of what we do, why we do it and
how we do it. So as I move ahead with these projects next year, or this year I’ll keep you guys updated
and I wouldn’t be surprised if I come and recruit some or all of you folks to be the first recruits or the first
graduates of the citizens academy so, so stay tuned for that. I’m really excited about the 2012 work plan.
These new programs and working with you again. I think it’s going to be a great 2012 and with that I’ll
answer any questions that any of you folks may have of me.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Any questions for Lieutenant Enevold? The changes that are going to occur
in terms of staffing changes, are those in process of being done? Are they already been implemented?
Lt. Jeff Enevold: Week from today we’ll have our new deputies and sergeants up here.
Mayor Furlong: Okay.
Lt. Jeff Enevold: Very good.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Chief John Wolff is here with the Chanhassen Fire Department. Good
evening Chief.
Chief John Wolff: Thank you Mayor, council members. Just thought I’d share some macro stats
comparing 2010 and 2011. We haven’t done a lot of analysis yet but we do have the data. Overall
inspections are up about 10% year over year. Our response time dropped between 1 and 2 percent. I
think some of that is just the growth we’re seeing in the south with additional residents down there and
just getting more runs further south end of town. Overall calls were down 15% from 2010 but really in
line. If you take 2010 out of the picture our calls were on par with what we have seen really in the last 5
years notwithstanding 2010. In terms of calls, I think the last time I was here I mentioned and talked a
little bit about holiday safety. Holiday fire safety and I’m pleased to report there were no even minor fires
in our town over the holiday season as a result of you know holiday, either decorations, Christmas trees,
those sorts of things. We did have a couple small house fires in December. There was a basement
bathroom fire that was probably $30,000-$40,000 worth of damage. The homeowner, the son of the
homeowner actually put that fire out. It would have been extensive if that hadn’t happened. And then we
also had a dryer fire closer to Christmas that probably had a little more damage than that but both of them
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
we kind of put in the minor category just because the majority of the home was not damaged and folks
were able to stay in their homes. I guess if there’s one thing that I am concerned about it’s ice safety. We
had two skaters skate, skating across Lake Riley skate actually into open water so the point on the Eden
Prairie side to the creek, there’s a lot of moving water there or even fish that are congregating there and
these were Chanhassen residents that were skating across the lake to the Eden Prairie side. They were
able to self rescue so they got themselves out, which is really a feat in and of itself and by the time we
arrived on scene they were in their homes and we were able to assist EMS with evaluating them. The
reason why I mention that because that’s 3 weeks ago is a truck went in this weekend and Eden Prairie
got called to it. There were 2 people in the pickup. It went, drove into the open water, or it drove onto
thin ice in that same area and the truck actually went in and both of the individuals got out, which is
unusual the way the truck actually went in because it went in sort of the back tires first down and usually
it’s the other way with all the weight being in the front so the warning I would share is that I really don’t
feel like our lakes this year are safe for vehicles. We don’t know enough about what’s going on
underneath the ice and typically by this time folks are very comfortable with having vehicles on our lakes.
Lake Riley in particular appears to have you know some issues in terms of ice safety and I would just
caution our residents about driving on lakes. I live near Lotus Lake and spend a fair amount of time on
that lake and I did see some vehicles and Lotus feels very safe out there. I think there’s 10 plus inches but
most of the vehicles were on the edges and you know I think if you’re going to risk it, that’s where you
want to be. You want to be close to the edges. I’ll take any questions.
Mayor Furlong: Any questions for Chief Wolff? Very good, thank you.
PUBLIC HEARING: REQUEST FOR ON-SALE INTOXICATING LIQUOR LICENSE,
SPECIAL EVENTS CATERING COMPANY, INC., DBA CHUCK WAGON CHARLIE’S
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SMOKEHOUSE, 545 WEST 78 STREET, BYRON KORUS.
Laurie Hokkanen: The item before you is to hold a public hearing for the request for an on-sale
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intoxicating liquor license for Special Events Catering Company. They’re located at 545 West 78 Street
is the space you’ll recall formerly occupied by Millie’s Deli. We did conduct the necessary and required
background checks and other than driving infractions that have been satisfied, there were no outstanding
issues and the owners have previously held a liquor license in the city of Minneapolis and there were no
violations associated with that. Staff recommends approval.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Let’s start with any questions for staff on this. If not then, we’ll open up the
public hearing on this matter and invite any interested party to come forward and address the council.
Seeing no one, without objection we’ll close the public hearing and bring it back to council for action.
Any discussion on this? If there’s no discussion, would somebody like to make a motion?
Councilwoman Ernst: I’ll make a motion.
Mayor Furlong: Councilwoman Ernst.
Councilwoman Ernst: I make a motion that we approve the request for an on-sale intoxicating liquor
license from Special Events Catering Company Incorporated, dba Chuck Wagon Charlie’s Smokehouse
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for a restaurant at 545 West 78 Street. Approval is contingent upon receipt of the license fee and a
certificate of insurance.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Is there a second?
Councilman McDonald: Second.
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
Mayor Furlong: Motion’s been made and seconded. Any discussion on the motion? Seeing none. Oh!
Councilman Laufenburger: Mr. Mayor. I’m excited to have Charlie’s come to town. Another option.
Another food option. They might even offer them to feed us at a council work session perhaps.
Mayor Furlong: No, that is good and it’s, while they’re taking the place of another local restaurant, as I
understand it they’re also going to be expanding services into the event center and seeking to create some
more opportunities there for some events.
Councilman Laufenburger: Good addition to the downtown area I think.
Mayor Furlong: Very good. Thank you for the comments. Any other discussion? Seeing none we’ll
proceed with the vote.
Councilwoman Ernst moved, Councilman McDonald seconded that the City Council approve the
request for an on-sale intoxicating liquor license from Special Events Catering Company Inc. dba
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Chuck Wagon Charlie’s Smokehouse for a restaurant at 545 West 78 Street. Approval is
contingent upon receipt of the license fee and a certificate of insurance. All voted in favor and the
motion carried unanimously with a vote of 5 to 0.
PUBLIC HEARING: 2012 STREET IMPROVEMENT PROJECT (MINNEWASHTA
HEIGHTS); AUTHORIZE PREPARATION OF PLANS AND SPECIFICATIONS.
Public Present:
Name Address
Genevieve Harings 6300 Elm Tree Avenue
Bill Coldwell 3501 Shore Drive
Randy Raddatz 6340 Elm Tree Avenue
Tom Ruhland 6211 Greenbriar
Paul Oehme: Thank you Mayor, City Council members. This is an item for the 2012 street
reconstruction project. Annually the City considers making improvements to streets that are in poor
condition. For the 2012 street improvement project staff is proposing to reconstruct approximately 1.1
miles of streets in the Minnewashta Heights neighborhood. The street segments within this project area
were identified using the City’s pavement management software, site investigations and utility problems
that have been identified over the years. The streets are over 40 years old and cannot cost effectively be
maintained by a simple overlay or a sealcoat at this time. Staff is requesting a public hearing again be
held tonight after we give a brief presentation about the project. Kevin Kowalski with WSB will be
giving a brief presentation on the project. WSB is the consultant that has been working with the city staff
to draft the feasibility studies and cost and associated improvements so. I did hand out a couple
correspondences that we received since the package has been published from property owners in the area
so I just wanted to share that information with you. With that, I’ve asked that Kevin Kowalski give his
presentation.
Kevin Kowalski: Thank you Paul. Good evening Mr. Mayor, members of the council. I appreciate the
opportunity to come and speak with you tonight. This is the public hearing for City Project #12-01.
Public hearing is a required step in the Chapter 429 process using assessed funds as a part of project
funding. Project area that we’re looking at, Minnewashta Heights. It’s right along the north edge of Lake
Minnewashta. Just south of Highway 7. West of Highway 41. It does include Maplewood Circle on the
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
very west end, Greenbriar Avenue, Fir Tree Avenue, Elm Tree Avenue, Dogwood Avenue and Shore
Drive along the very south end of the project. It does include Minnewashta Heights park in the northeast
corner of the project. As Paul was talking about pavement condition earlier, we do have a slide in here
that shows the pavement condition index for each of the streets out here. Pavement condition index is the
value assigned to a roadway based on the number of distresses that are measured on it. We talked about
pavement distress as we look at the severity of them, edge cracking, longitudinal cracking, transverse
cracking. There are some locations out here where the pavement is actually broken up. There are
potholes. As you can see we do have a wide range of pci’s. As we start looking to what those pci’s mean
we do have a range from 0 to 64 in this area. The average pci of all the streets combined is 38. Per City
standards when we look at streets that have a value less than 45 for the pci, street reconstruction is
warranted. We do have two sections on Shore Drive that are a 52 and a 64. They’re on the west end of
that street. We have had 3 watermain breaks in that area and the pci is artificially influenced by the
patching that’s been done, okay. So the 52 and 64, based on the patch work, indicative of what’s going
on with the street out here. The pci values that we have are indicative of streets that have reached the end
of their useful life and need to be rebuilt. The condition of the pavement is also compounded by a
substantial watermain break history. I believe we’ve had one out there this winter already. We also have
limited stormwater collection and management facilities in the area. As we look at the improvements
proposed with this year’s project, we’re looking at full reconstruction of the streets to their existing width
and geometry so we’re not going to be changing a whole lot as far as the width and the alignment of the
street. We’re looking at sand sub-grade construction consistent with previous projects. Looking at these
style curb and gutter with knock down’s for driveway opening. We know where the driveways are. It’s a
very nice look. We’re looking at drain tile installation along the edge of the sand sections. The drain tile
serves to eliminate water from the frost zone on the pavement. It minimizes frost heave and future
damage in the springtime. Looking at replacement of the watermain system in it’s entirety. We’re
looking at reconstructing portions of the existing sanitary sewer network. You have some cases where
they settled. Now we have sags inbetween manholes that need to be replaced. And again we’re looking
at stormwater collection and management improvements. This is a map showing the watermain and
sanitary sewer replacement. The blue indicates the watermain, and there are pieces of red you’ll see. Ah
my laser’s not pointing up but you’ll see the red sections. There’s one. So we’ve got areas all the way
through here where we’ve got some sanitary sewer that’s proposed for replacement. The depth varies
anywhere from 15 to 23 feet so some of it’s going to be quite extensive. Our standard residential
pavement section includes 24 inches of select granular bottom. 12 inches of Class V underneath 3 inches
of pavement. Now we have had our geotechnical engineer review the soils underlying the streets. With
the work we’re going to do we can reduce our pavement section to 3 1/2 inches of bituminous, 8 inches of
aggregate base and 18 inches of sand. Now this is recommended by the geotechnical engineer. It’s
consistent with what we did on Erie Avenue and what we did on Red Cedar Point, okay. It does represent
a cost savings of about $200,000 just by going with a shallower paving section. Stormwater management,
we’ve got 3 options proposed. These are kind of the highlights. We are looking at curb and gutter in
each option. Option A, it’s the most extensive. It includes a pipe network and we’ll walk through these.
These are the highlights. Pipe outlet to Highway 7. We’ve got rain gardens. We’ve got a stormwater
retention cell proposed for the park. Option B, same features with a little bit less piping. Option C is
piping. Little less piping but we’re proposing to put in an underground iron filtration system for
treatment of the stormwater, and we’ve got some pictures of that and we’ll walk through that. This is
Option A. The most prominent features you’ll see is the stormwater holding cell up in the park. That’s
going to be a 2 to 3 foot vegetated swale. It’s going to be mowable. There will be times that there’ll be
water standing up to half a day, okay. What that does is allows some rate control coming out of this area.
We’ve got rain gardens proposed at various areas. You can see the little blue areas along the edges of the
road. Now these are going to be dependent upon residents because there is some maintenance agreement
that goes with it. Some degree of effort required by the residents. The main feature of this is the
stormwater pipe going from Dogwood Avenue through the central portion of the project, all the way out
through the end of Maplewood Circle to Trunk Highway 7 right-of-way. Okay. This is fairly difficult. It
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
will require the acquisition of easements across private property to put this in. As we look at Option B,
you can see the stormwater holding cell in the park is still there. We’ve still got the rain garden features.
Substantially less piping because the only piped outlet now is from the west end of Maplewood Circle
over to the ponds west of the project area, okay. We have talked to MnDOT about discharging into their
right-of-way. They are okay with that. We can get a permit to do that. Third option, and the most
significant feature here is the iron filtration system along Shore Drive. This is an underground filtration
system. Stormwater is passed through it. It’s like a filter. It removes the sediments and the solid and
what comes out is a clean water prior to discharging to the lake and we have no stormwater treatment
facilities out here. This introduces that feature and it does clean water before it’s going to the lake. This
is a picture of what these iron enhanced sand filtration systems look like. It’s sand mixed with iron
shavings. It’s wrapped in geotextile fabric to prevent migration of soils into it and there’s a draintile at
the bottom that allows water to filter from the top to the bottom and out the draintile, okay. So as it goes
through there all the sediments and the phosphorus. Phosphorus is big. Phosphorus removal is a big
component of the Minnehaha Creek Watershed District’s initiatives for all of the cities in their district,
okay. Most of you have probably seen your surface water management plan. Phosphorus reduction is
one of their primary goals. This is a step towards helping the City achieve that goal. This is a picture of
what rain gardens can look like. They’re shallow depressions. We do have curb cuts to get water to them
and to allow the water to escape, okay. The rain gardens typically have a draintile system. They’ll filter
through. They’ll hold water and it will clean the water as it gets out, okay. But again these do require
some maintenance by the residents. Some of it is in the right-of-way. Some of it is on private property.
There are agreements that need to be put in place to put these features in. As we look at the cost for the
stormwater management options, Option A is the most expensive. It has the extensive piping. $392,830
and that’s, we only work our way down from there. Option B does not have the iron filtration system.
Has the short piping for Maplewood Circle. That option’s $287,130 and Option C, $345,350. What
we’re recommending is a combination of Options B and C. The stormwater holding cell in the park. The
outlet to Highway 7 from Maplewood Circle. Rain gardens. Sump manholes will be included so we’ve
got a settling basin essentially at the bottom of each manhole for solids and then the iron filing system.
As we look at how the construction will proceed, we’re not going to allow the contractor to open the
whole project up at once. We’re going to maintain access off of Highway 7 at least at one point at all
times, okay. Open cut installation of sanitary sewer and water. We also are going to look at an
alternative. Direction drilling installation. That’s going to help so we don’t have to have as much time
with the roadway under construction and torn up. If we can drill in all the watermain, there’s no open
trench for that okay. The sanitary sewer we will have to open cut just to get to it, okay. There will be
temporary sewer and water services while we’re replacing it. You will have a city construction observer
on site at all times every day while the work is going on. He’ll be out there to coordinate the work with
the residents and the contractor. Keep people informed of what’s happening in the project. Mailbox will
be relocated. That will all be coordinated by the City through the post office. Garbage collection will
continue. Typically the contractor will pick up garbage cans. Move them to a place of pick up and then
bring them back so it won’t be up to the residents. They’ll still have to put them out to the street but the
contractor will get them to one pick up location. As we look at the cost of all these things, at what’s
presented in the feasibility for surface improvements, it’s $1.58 million dollars. If we look at the revising
the pavement section our cost drops to $1.377 as you can see on the top here. The watermain
improvements were $449,000. $358,200 for the sanitary sewer and stormwater $392,380 and we put the
most expensive option in here just for giving you a total picture cost here. So as we look at the total, as
presented in the feasibility it was $2,781,730. With the revised pavement section that cost drops to
$2,577,830 okay. These costs do include a construction contingency in the amount of 10% and indirect
costs also in the amount of 10%. This is typical for feasibility level costs. As we look at assessments, we
look at a single family residence we’ve got 91 single family houses in that project area. Based on what’s
in the feasibility, with the full typical section of 24 inches of sand, the 12 inches of Class V the
assessment comes out to $6,952 roughly per unit. With the revised pavement section that drops to $6,025
okay. Those assessments are calculated at 40% of the street costs okay. Private sewer, sanitary sewer
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
and watermain are not included in the assessments. The storm sewer and the street okay. The proposed
terms of assessment, we’re looking at 10 years and typically the rate’s been around 10%. I’m not sure
Paul if that’s a percent and a half above bonding rate.
Oehme: About 2% above prime.
Kevin Kowalski: Prime rate, okay. Thank you. If you look at how the funding works out, we’re looking
at $632,662 collected through assessments. If we go with the reduced section that number drops to
$548,300 recovered through assessment, okay. So it’s a substantial number just by changing our
pavement section. You’ve got the revolving assessment fund of 949. Water fund for the 449. 358 from
the sanitary sewer fund and 392 from the stormwater fund. Now that stormwater component is going to
vary depending on the final options built okay, or selected. Again total project costs, total project 2.78 as
presented in the feasibility. With the reduced pavement section we’re looking at just over 2.57. As we
look at the project schedule, we’re here tonight to conduct the public hearing. If the council decides to
move forward the project will be ordered. Plans and specifications will be authorized. Looking out, we’ll
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be bringing the plans back February 27. Looking to advertise for bids at that point, okay. Opening bids
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in March. Calling for the assessment hearing and contract award April 23. Assuming there are no
problems with the assessment hearing we’ll begin construction in May. It’ll be substantially complete by
October. There’ll be one layer of bituminous on. We’ll put the final wear course on next spring. Okay.
With that I’ll open it up for questions and discussion from the council.
Mayor Furlong: Okay.
Kevin Kowalski: And I do have a map here with addresses on. If folks want to come up and have
questions. Address the council and show me where they live.
Mayor Furlong: Sounds good, thank you.
Kevin Kowalski: I’ll be here for any further questions.
Mayor Furlong: Let’s start with questions from the council.
Councilman Laufenburger: I have one.
Mayor Furlong: Mr. Laufenburger.
Councilman Laufenburger: Can you speak to the maintenance on the iron filtration system that works the
water before it goes into the lake? Can you just talk about that?
Kevin Kowalski: There is no maintenance to it.
Councilman Laufenburger: None whatsoever.
Kevin Kowalski: It’s underground. The storm sewer is gravity flowing. The water filters through it.
Filters to the bottom and is carried down by draintile. There’s no additional maintenance.
Councilman Laufenburger: So the phosphorus that is trapped by the iron, does it just stay there or is it
converted.
Kevin Kowalski: Yes, it combines with the iron chemically.
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. Alright. Can you give me an example of what commitment you’re
looking for from the residents to maintain the rain gardens?
Kevin Kowalski: It’s essentially keeping it clean because there will be debris, leaves, garbage that will
blow into it. Keeping it clean. Making sure the plants were staying alive.
Councilman Laufenburger: So we would put in the plants. We would essentially build the rain gardens.
We just would ask them to maintain them as if they’re own.
Kevin Kowalski: Yes. Yes.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. Alright. Thank you Mr. Mayor.
Mayor Furlong: Other questions? Mr. McDonald.
Councilman McDonald: On this reduced pavement, you say that we have used it before?
Kevin Kowalski: Yes.
Councilman McDonald: Where at?
Kevin Kowalski: It’s the same typical section that we built on Erie Avenue. It’s the same typical section
we built on the streets in Red Cedar Point.
Councilman McDonald: Okay, and what’s the impact as far as wear and road limits and those types of
things upon roads?
Kevin Kowalski: As far as, your state trunk highways are designed for 9 ton axle loadings. Typically for
residential streets we go to a 7 ton design.
Councilman McDonald: And this will meet the 7 ton design?
Kevin Kowalski: Yes.
Councilman McDonald: How about the longevity of it? What’s the projected life of that versus going to
the 5 inch? Is it 5 inch or, the top coat?
Kevin Kowalski: The pavement thickness stays the same.
Councilman McDonald: Okay.
Kevin Kowalski: So we’ve got 3 1/2 inches of pavement. What’s changing is the thickness of the
aggregate base and the sand underneath that.
Councilman McDonald: Okay, and by making those changes do you affect the lifetime of the road?
Kevin Kowalski: Not necessarily. Pavement longevity is extended through maintenance and taking care
of it. Sealcoating. Overlaying and a continuous cycle of that.
Councilman McDonald: Okay. And on the sand filter. Changing to that subject. Are there grants
available for doing this to put this type of a system in?
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
Kevin Kowalski: We could explore that. I know the watershed district has given grants for different
types of storm water management features. It’s something that we could look into certainly.
Councilman McDonald: Have we used this within the city yet?
Paul Oehme: Mr. McDonald, we have not used a filtration system within our community but there’s
several communities in the metro area here, and watershed districts in particular have used it successfully
with some track records.
Kevin Kowalski: Specifically MnDOT is using it. We’ve installed them in Prior Lake and Maplewood
so are in use.
Paul Oehme: And to your question too about grant funds. We did explore that with the watershed
district. At this point in time we have not received any grant dollars. We may be able to capture some in
the future for this project but we should know hopefully within a month or two yet so.
Councilman McDonald: Okay and then as far as the rain gardens. Are there any offsets available for
that? Any funding or anything to get those started because this will actually be the first neighborhood
that’s really used this.
Paul Oehme: Yeah we did include some rain gardens in the Laredo project and I think Erie we had there
was one or two property owners that we worked with on that particular project. But yeah in terms of
grant funds, again both of those items we’ve been talking to the watershed district about and trying to
partner with them on those costs.
Councilman McDonald: Okay. And then I noticed in the options that you’re suggesting, if I’m correct,
you’re eliminating the pipe that runs out to Highway 7. The long run. The only one that’s left is from the
holding pond out to 7. I think it’s in your Option, is it B? Or A?
Kevin Kowalski: A has the main run going all the way through from Dogwood to Highway 7. Option B
has the short pipe from the holding cell and the short pipe at the west end of Maplewood Circle.
Councilman McDonald: Okay, are those in there as offsets to the filtering system?
Kevin Kowalski: No they are not.
Councilman McDonald: Okay.
Kevin Kowalski: The water, those, the water from those particular areas is going to the north. If you see
that yellow line that kind of jags, wanders through there. Jagged through there. That’s the drainage
break. Everything to the north of that goes to Highway 7. Everything to the south goes to the lake.
Councilman McDonald: Okay.
Kevin Kowalski: So the iron filtration system is essentially taking everything from the south of that line
and it will all go through prior to getting to the lake.
Paul Oehme: Mr. McDonald, we were, on Option A we were trying to make the improvements at
Minnewashta more atypical to a development that you would see today where you have a collection
system pipes and catch basins collecting a lot of the drainage and discharging into a stormwater pond for
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
treatment. This is more the typical features that you see with newer developments. Unfortunately the
impacts I think and some of the costs associated with that improvement kind of don’t lend itself to this
area. So we’ve backed off on this option and looked a little bit harder at Option C.
Councilman McDonald: Okay. That’s all the questions I have. Thank you.
Mayor Furlong: Okay, thank you. Other questions? Maybe to follow up a little bit and as long as you
have this picture up I’ll start with some of my questions here. Help me understand the pond that’s going
in through, what looks to be the middle of the park there. That neighborhood park. What is that going to
do to the use? It looks like it’s going right through a ballfield at this point.
Kevin Kowalski: It’s going to be a slight depression. It’s not going to be a deep pond. Maybe a foot and
a half, two feet deep. It’s going to be vegetated. It’s simply a place to hold water, retain water until it can
drain off.
Mayor Furlong: Well what’s that going to do to the use of the park field? Mr. Hoffman, is there, I mean
is it going through a ballfield or soccer field areas or open areas or what’s it going to do to the people that
are using the park if you have a depression of 1 to 2 feet?
Kevin Kowalski: The grading will be gradual enough that it shouldn’t be a detriment.
Mayor Furlong: Mr. Oehme.
Paul Oehme: Yep, we have looked at that area too and there is some play equipment that potentially
would be impacted. That would be relocated on the site to keep basically the same features that are there.
It’s, basically it’s, the use of the park would stay the same. It’s in the depression areas where you have a
larger rain event there might be some water sitting there for upwards of 24 hours but right now the open
space would stay the same. There would be some depressions but people can still play Frisbee or you
know catch and those type of things in the open spaces.
Mayor Furlong: Is there any opportunity with the MnDOT right-of-way from a still maintaining traffic
safety to have the collection occur there as opposed to in the park and then slowly drain down the right-
of-way area? Are there some other alternatives I guess?
Paul Oehme: Right, and we’ve tried to look at as much of those alternatives as we can. We looked, we
talked to MnDOT about taking more water actually west of here. Over almost to Minnewashta and
basically tried to treat some of the water in that storage drainage system. Unfortunately, you know that
drainage system has some capacity issues with it already and we’re mitigating that by redirecting some of
the water on the north side to the west. It’s kind of a balancing act I think.
Mayor Furlong: Understand.
Paul Oehme: We looked at that in short but you know typically MnDOT does not like to have cities
address their stormwater improvement system within their right-of-way. Their system is pretty much
maxed out already and we’re, we don’t want to overload it I guess.
Mayor Furlong: Very eloquently said. I guess what I would ask is that we try, I’d like to see some more
detail on the park there and what the stormwater, what’s being proposed.
Paul Oehme: Certainly.
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
Mayor Furlong: And how that would affect the use of the park and just what some of the other
alternatives are…to say similar, I view this similar to the Red Cedar Point project where we’re trying to
st
incorporate 21 century stormwater management into a neighborhood that really wasn’t designed for it
and so there are going to be some limitations and some give and take so I understand that. At the same
time I’d like to understand where those are going to be. And with regard to the rain gardens, I think the
other area that we did that was in Chaparral neighborhood by the parks there where we put in some rain
gardens as well. Am I saying that correctly or what’s the area with the medium density? There’s a park
just north. Just between Kerber and Powers. Todd, Meadow?
Hoffman: Meadow Green?
Mayor Furlong: Meadow Green. In that neighborhood I think we also looked at some rain gardens there
so, so I think there does have to be a cooperative agreement between the residents. For maintaining, from
a cost sharing standpoint from all those things but certainly those are a viable, viable alternative as well.
On the iron sand, is there, what’s the expected life of that? If it’s self contained, what’s the expected life.
Kevin Kowalski: Upwards of 20 years.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. And then it has to be taken out and regenerated?
Kevin Kowalski: Yep.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. So how do you know, what’s the way to measure whether it, when you say
upwards of. I mean at some point it’s going to reach it’s capacity I would imagine.
Kevin Kowalski: I mean typically it’s 20 years.
Mayor Furlong: Okay.
Kevin Kowalski: The way you check it is the water coming out of it. The water quality. If there are lots
of suspended solids and phosphorus in the water coming out, you’ll know it’s time to replace it.
Mayor Furlong: What does it come out to? I mean the picture you had up there was.
Kevin Kowalski: It will come out to the outlet that goes down to the lake.
Mayor Furlong: Okay.
Kevin Kowalski: All the water will filter through there and discharge to that single point.
Mayor Furlong: And what is there if, what’s there to catch the sand and the iron if for some reason it isn’t
contained?
Kevin Kowalski: The sand, the iron pilings are contained within a fabric itself so it won’t wash out.
Okay. So if that’s not put in, there’s nothing there to treat that water. It will go directly into the lake.
Mayor Furlong: Right now nothing’s happening with that water correct?
Kevin Kowalski: Right.
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
Paul Oehme: And Mayor, to that point too. We are looking at putting sump manholes prior to the iron
filing improvements. Or proposed iron filing improvements. Those sumps will capture the fullable solids
and some of the bigger sediment material before it ends up in the iron system so that we anticipate would
lengthen the life expectancy of that improvement.
Mayor Furlong: Alright. With regard to the pavement design, following up on Mr. McDonald’s
questions. Is this standard we used in Erie, that was a couple three years ago, four years ago perhaps that
we did that.
Kevin Kowalski: Yes it is.
Mayor Furlong: Is the expected life the same as the traditional?
Kevin Kowalski: Yes it is.
Mayor Furlong: Construction materials. Is this something that, that we expect to continue to work well
with clay soils or the soils in this area of our town similar to those in Erie and?
Paul Oehme: They are. They’re still tight clay soils. Some higher water content in this area. We are
proposing to put drain tile in each side of the roadway system. Currently I think there’s only about 6 to 8
inches of Class V with 3 inches of bituminous over the top of it so I mean this is probably 3 times the
strength of what the pavement system that’s out there right now so.
Mayor Furlong: Okay, thank you. With regard to the timing and the schedule, you said substantial
completion October, 2012. What is going to be accessed through this neighborhood during the
construction projects? You said there’s always going to be access from Highway 7.
Kevin Kowalski: Right. There’s two access points now. Dogwood and Greenbriar both access Highway
7.
Mayor Furlong: Okay.
Kevin Kowalski: We’re going to have to stage the project such that we keep one point from Highway 7
open at all times. So when we’re working on one end, the other end will be open for traffic.
Mayor Furlong: Alright. And if, you said you’re going to have to dig down to get to the sanitary sewer
anyway. While we’re doing that, is the watermain right next to the sanitary sewer or is it in a different
alignment that directional boring.
Kevin Kowalski: The watermain is 10 feet. Is 10 feet off vertically. In some cases it’s much shallower.
The intent behind the directional drilling would be to eliminate the need for a temporary water system
because you can drill in the watermain.
Mayor Furlong: A new one.
Kevin Kowalski: And you can test it and pressurize it without having to connect. So as the time comes
when you’re got all your testing completed and the water is safe, then you re-tap.
Mayor Furlong: Okay.
Kevin Kowalski: Then you don’t need the temporary water system.
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
Mayor Furlong: Is there an expectation of a cost savings then with that?
Kevin Kowalski: Absolutely.
Mayor Furlong: And what about with regard to the sanitary sewer and replacement of that and access to
homes? Is that going to be done similarly to other projects?
Kevin Kowalski: Yes.
Mayor Furlong: Where there’ll be kind of a dig down during the day. Fix it, fill it back up.
Paul Oehme: Yeah.
Kevin Kowalski: Absolutely. The streets will be passable at the end of the day. There may be times
during the day if they’re digging that there won’t be traffic to get through but at the end of each day
everything will be packed up and passable.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. Mr. Oehme have we had discussions with the school district with regard to bus
transportation, and I’m thinking during the fall between, in September and October prior to substantial
completion.
Paul Oehme: Right. Yep, we always coordinate those activities with the school district prior to these
type of projects.
Mayor Furlong: Alright. And communication with the residents during the project, what practices are
you planning on using there?
Paul Oehme: Very important. We send out newsletters at the beginning of the project. It’ll be weekly
updates. Fliers hanging, door hangers, we put those out. There’ll always be a resident inspector on site.
We’ll give that cell number out to all the residents if they have any issues and there’s a website that we
utilize too so just identifying information on the website as well too. We’re looking at maybe a Facebook
page too, trying to update that and get that information out there. Some people like to use that
information as well so. Number of different options that we’re, or number of different items for
communication that we’re looking at.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. And then back to stormwater management, and this is managing stormwater
runoff during the construction period when we’ve got the streets opened up and no curb. Nothing to catch
anything. We’ve got a bunch of sand, dirt out there. We get a major rain event. We’ve seen this happen
in other street projects and then we have a real mess. What are we going to do during the project itself to
minimize stormwater problems in the event of a major rain event, or even a regular rain event because of
the nature of the.
Kevin Kowalski: Construction activities are all governed by National Pollutant Discharge Elimination
System permits (NPDES). We also have people that stop in by the job occasionally. Weekly to look at
the erosion control to make sure that’s all up to date. Minnehaha Creek is on site weekly. It’s really in
the hands of the contractor. We’re there to enforce the best management practices that’s supposed to be
required through the permit process. If the contractor fails in that there are administrative fines that they
can levy to the contractor and that goes to making sure he’s doing his job correctly.
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
Mayor Furlong: Okay. And I guess part of my thought is just from experience. We’ve had some
projects where, as much as all the practices are handled, there was a lot of dirt ending up in people’s
driveways and other things and I guess what should we be doing? What can we be doing to try to
minimize those events from happening? And the elevations may not be the same here as other
neighborhoods so we may not have as much problem but have we looked at that?
Kevin Kowalski: There are locations in this project area that are susceptible. Down off the very end of
Greenbriar, the road curves and everything goes down to the lake.
Mayor Furlong: Okay.
Kevin Kowalski: So that’s going to be our most problematic area. We’re going to be putting up heavy
duty silt fence. Reinforced silt fences. The problem we’ll have with that is we’ll still have to keep
driveways open so we won’t be able to put those erosion control measures across those driveways. That’s
going to be our biggest point of concern on how do we handle that? We’ll have to talk to stormwater
specialists and the erosion control specialists to see how we can handle that. There’ll probably be some
short term settling basins on the project. As much as we can do but there are some areas that could be
susceptible to that.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. And it might be just in a, I’m sorry Mr. Gerhardt were you going to say
something?
Todd Gerhardt: No. That’s fine. I was just going to say you don’t want the Mayor and the City Manager
to have to go out there and clean up a driveway.
Mayor Furlong: Hypothetically on a Saturday morning.
Kevin Kowalski: Absolutely not.
Todd Gerhardt: Yeah. Luckily I wore my Iowa State shirt and I was good to go with another Iowa State.
Kevin Kowalski: Trust me, we don’t like that anymore than you do.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. That’s, those are my questions at this time. Any other questions for staff?
Otherwise let’s go ahead and open up the public hearing and invite residents to come forward. If you
would, we do have a map there on the table. If you would, when you come up, state your name and
address. Give us an idea of where you live by pointing it out on the map and if there are questions, we’ll
try to answer those questions tonight. We may have to get back to people. Some information that the
council’s already interested in is whether or not you believe that the improvements need to be done, first
of all. If they do need to be done, are they being done in a way that makes sense to you or is too much
being done or not enough being done to improve the streets and stormwater aspect, and other aspects of
the project. And then finally if you have any thoughts and comments on the proposed financing,
including proposed portion of the street projects being assessed. I should say to clarify Mr. Oehme, I’m
assuming that this project or the proposed findings for this is similar to past projects where the streets and
the curbs are being assessed 40%. City taxpayers picking up 60%, but all the utility work and all the
stormwater work is being picked up by the City in it’s entirety, is that correct?
Paul Oehme: Correct. Yep.
Mayor Furlong: Except for maybe some cost sharing on the rain gardens.
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
Paul Oehme: Correct.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. Alright. So that would be information that the council would like to see and
anything else you’d like to share with us so, at this point I’ll open it up to, open up the public meeting and
invite interested parties to come forward and address the council. So anyone who wants to come first, just
come up to the podium and we’ll get it started. As everybody looks back and forth. There we go.
Somebody’s got to be first.
Genevieve Harings: Okay, I’m Genevieve Harings and I live at.
Mayor Furlong: If you can speak into the microphone, one of them that’d be great.
Genevieve Harings: It’s not working. We’re having trouble hearing.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. Nann, if you could check the speaker volume in the council chambers please.
Genevieve Harings: Anyway I’m Genevieve Harings and I live at 6300 Elm Tree Avenue which is right
in the middle of Elm Tree Avenue block.
Mayor Furlong: Could you just point to it with your finger please.
Genevieve Harings: Right there.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you very much.
Genevieve Harings: I think.
Councilman Laufenburger: One over. One street over.
Genevieve Harings: There we go.
Councilman Laufenburger: That’s Fir Tree.
Genevieve Harings: Oh that’s Fir Tree, you’re right.
Councilman Laufenburger: There’s Elm Tree.
Genevieve Harings: 6300, okay. Helps to have my glasses on. Alright. I did hear, he said something
about, the gentleman here said something about putting in some piping and having to do easements over
properties and then someone said maybe we’ll do number C so I’m wondering where exactly these
easements would be for number C and when you’re doing easements over properties, I assume you’re
digging up properties. If you’re taking out trees, lawn, whatever. Are you replacing what you’re taking
out?
Kevin Kowalski: Certainly. If the council decides to go with Option A, easements would generally be
located along side lot lines. If we go through, whatever we disturb we replace okay.
Genevieve Harings: So if you end up taking out a fence or a tree.
Kevin Kowalski: Absolutely. It would all be replaced. Now with the options we presented Option A
isn’t really a viable option due to costs and due to difficulty in working in easements.
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
Genevieve Harings: So you talked about number C. What exactly does number C involve?
Kevin Kowalski: Option C involves, the only pipe would be here and up here. We wouldn’t be installing
the pipe across here.
Genevieve Harings: Cool. Okay. My other concern is the pond at the park. I don’t have young children
now but when we moved in 31 years ago we did have young children. I know there’s a lot of young
children in the neighborhood. At that time there was a creek that ran through the park. They took it out.
They filled it up. People were concerned about the mosquitoes. About children playing in the creek, that
type of thing so I guess that’s my concern putting a pond back in again. This is a well used park. A lot of
kids down there. So I guess they were going to do some more study on that but how long will the water
be sitting there? Will there be a mosquito problem? Will there be a problem with children playing in the
water?
Kevin Kowalski: There isn’t going to be long term retention of water in there. Half a day to a day should
be a maximum time that there’s water and it’s only going to be this much. If it’s determined here tonight,
and we can certainly get back to the council and let you know how long water is going to be standing in
there. Typically if it’s a day you don’t have a mosquito problem because it takes a certain amount of time
for them to grow and hatch so. The biggest concern of course is water standing in a public area. Public
play area so it’s certainly something we can look at. There may be other options in there. We’re certainly
open to looking at other alternatives.
Genevieve Harings: Okay, thank you.
Mayor Furlong: And overall ma’am, before you leave. In terms of the street project itself, do you believe
it needs to be done or not or?
Genevieve Harings: Well that I really don’t know because I had not known that there were watermain
breaks. That there was a problem in the neighborhood with that. Now I know they repaved our streets
not that long ago. I mean Elm Tree Avenue is not that bad. It’s not broken up as far as I know. And
Dogwood so those are the only streets I drive.
Mayor Furlong: Okay, and that’s fair.
Genevieve Harings: So I’m you know, I’m hoping that you all know what you’re doing.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. That’s fair enough. They do. Thank you.
Bill Coldwell: I’ll be next.
Mayor Furlong: Bill.
Bill Coldwell: Sure. My name is Bill Coldwell. I live at 3501 Shore Drive. Right on that big swooping
curve where Shore turns into Greenbriar, or vice versa so yeah, right there. Couple things. I’ve been kind
of following this since you started the meetings last year and I think it’s a good job so thank you and
thanks to you guys for all your hard work on this. We attended the rain garden session 6 months ago,
whenever it was so appreciate getting the feedback from the neighbors for that. Couple things. I would
say one is, is it needed? Well certainly Dogwood is all potholes right so it definitely needs repaving.
Can’t speak for the watermains but there’s been 3 breaks. I think they’ve all been on Shore, is that right?
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
Paul Oehme: Most of them.
Bill Coldwell: Yeah, that’s why you don’t see them because they’re all on my street.
Paul Oehme: Fir Tree.
Audience: There’s two on Fir Tree.
Bill Coldwell: Oh, okay. The last couple years. The only questions I had was just a little bit on that iron
filtration thing because that’s really what we’re doing by having curb is we’re actually getting the water
to the lake faster than it currently gets there, so this is kind of helping but does it sit under the street or is
it in the right-of-way on the properties?
Kevin Kowalski: It sits under the street in public right-of-way.
Bill Coldwell: So it won’t be.
Kevin Kowalski: It won’t be on your private property, no.
Bill Coldwell: Okay, I mean not that I’m worried about it it’s just, it wasn’t clear so much from the thing.
Okay.
Kevin Kowalski: It will be completely contained under the pavement.
Bill Coldwell: Okay.
Todd Gerhardt: And how does the water get underneath there? Can you explain.
Bill Coldwell: Through the storm sewer?
Kevin Kowalski: If you could flash back to that Paul.
Paul Oehme: This one here?
Kevin Kowalski: Yeah. You’ll see the storm sewer. It will get into those inlets and it will filter through
this system and it will go out the bottom with the draintile.
Todd Gerhardt: Sort of like a septic system.
Kevin Kowalski: Yeah. Yeah.
Paul Oehme: And we’re trying to address the more problematic storm events. It’s typically the one inch,
the two inch rain events. There is designed in the system for bypass during those heavier rain events
when we get the 4 or 5 inch rain events so that’s not going to be addressed in the iron filing system. It’s
the smaller rain events that we’re trying to address under this, under these improvements.
Bill Coldwell: Okay. Just two other quick things. The park thing, I hear what you’re saying but if you
go by there today after a big rain there’s standing water for many days, right. Especially toward the, on
the east end of it right there. The water just sits there so you’re going to create a.
Kevin Kowalski: Just like a rain garden…drainage and filtration system.
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
Bill Coldwell: Yeah, so it shouldn’t sit there as long as it does today. And on the west side of it there’s a
hill so I assume that comes out. There’s a big hump.
Paul Oehme: There is a little bit yeah. We’re re-grading in that are area too.
Bill Coldwell: Yeah, so you’re taking that all out.
Paul Oehme: Right so, and you know we can design these, or the park improvements numerous ways. I
think there’s enough area out there, maybe a two cell approach or something else to, you know to lessen
the impact to the park in the open spaces area as much as we can so we’re going to be working on that.
Bill Coldwell: Okay. And the last thing I wanted to say was interest, I think you misspoke because you
said 10% but your slide said 6%. Is that right?
Paul Oehme: I’m sorry, for what?
Bill Coldwell: The financing.
Kevin Kowalski: 10 years at 6%.
Bill Coldwell: So the interest rate.
Paul Oehme: 6%. And to clarify that 6% too. That’s estimated. We base our interest rates off of prime
rate plus about 2% for carrying costs and fees associated with bonding for these type of projects so that
number might change a little bit when we get close, or at the time of the assessment hearing so that’s just
kind of a place holder right now.
Bill Coldwell: Okay. That’s all I have. Thank you.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Good evening.
Randy Raddatz: Good evening Mr. Mayor, council members. My name is Randy Raddatz. We live at
6340 Elm Tree Avenue. Right at the corner of Elm Tree and Shore Drive. I would respectfully disagree
in terms of the condition of the street on Elm Tree. It’s in really bad condition. I would say it’s better
than Dogwood, which is in really, really bad condition. This is a long time in coming. We really need
these improvements. I really appreciate the work the City has put into this. I think we need the street
improvements, the curb and gutter. It can’t come too soon as far as we’re concerned. Probably my
biggest concern is the, what do they call it? The rain gardens or whatever they’re called. The private
ones in particular. Well let me take a step back. The City of Edina I believe has tried this and has met a
lot of resistance because what started out as a really nice idea turned into a weed garden essentially and so
the City of Edina has had a lot of problems on it’s public property with that, with the rain garden idea.
The concerns that I have on the private side of the rain gardens is what, what if we go with kind of a
combination of B and C which I think is the option that the City is looking at, and no one either opts for
going with the rain gardens or let’s say people do and then they don’t maintain them? What are the
ramifications to homeowners who you know sign up. They’re all gung ho and then 2 years from now you
know what, it’s a lot more work than what, than what they originally thought it would be. What happens
in situations like that?
Paul Oehme: Well what other communities have done, and typically those agreements, there would be a
clause in there for a lack of maintenance so the City would inspect those rain gardens on a you know a
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
yearly basis or whatever and if the maintenance is not being taken care of, letters are gone out. We mail it
to property owners to see what we can do to improve the situation there. If nothing gets done there is a
clause in the agreement typically that states that the City has the right to assess improvements back to the
property owner and we would make those improvements.
Randy Raddatz: Okay. And I believe the combination of B and C is about $50,000. $45,000-$50,000
less than C alone. What would happen if the City approves the combination of B and C and then no one
opts in?
Paul Oehme: It would be cheaper. I mean they’re obviously we’re not making as much improvements in
terms of the rain gardens so the overall cost of the project goes down. Obviously the water quality
improvements that we’re trying to achieve in this area we’re not going to be able to meet so. It saves
money in the long run. There’s no assessment costs associated with those rain gardens anyway. The City
picks up 100% for those improvements as a part of the street improvement project so there’s no, you
know there’s impact to the assessments. It’s just the water quality in this area and you know the runoff
would be you know, would be greater than if we had those rain gardens.
Randy Raddatz: Okay. Perhaps I misunderstood but I thought the infrastructure cost itself, the
development cost was less under the combination of B and C.
Paul Oehme: Well I think there’s some pipe improvements that maybe are a little bit different. There’s
some other costs associated I think with between B and C.
Kevin Kowalski: Right. The main thing with B and C, the iron filtration system is what’s driving the
cost of alternate C, or Option C. Rain gardens, if we don’t get the opportunity to do the rain gardens, our
water quality is not going to be as good as it could be, number one. Is that the end of the world?
Typically not because the way the watershed views it is something is better than nothing. Okay. So we’d
still be getting some water quality. We wouldn’t be getting the retention that we like. We’d not be
getting as much for the water quality treatment as we would like but it’s, that’s what we’re ultimately
after is to try and help the lake and the water quality of the lake. If we can’t do as much, well then that’s
what we can do. So it’s not, it wouldn’t be the end of the world if we don’t do it. It doesn’t necessarily
affect the remaining portions of those options.
Randy Raddatz: Okay, thank you. I guess with that said my preference I believe, without knowing a lot
about the iron filtration system, my preference probably would be for Option C only because of the
concern about the aesthetics associated with going with a combination of B and C but other than that, like
I said, as far as the street improvements, the curb and gutter concern, thank you. I appreciate it. Thanks a
lot.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you.
Tom Ruhland: My name’s Tom Ruhland. I live at 6211 Greenbriar. From the drawing that shows the
piping it looks to me like it’s going to run right through our property, judging from what it looks like and
in talking to one of the residents on Maplewood Circle, they have some piping in their yard and it’s
exposed so I’m hoping this won’t be exposed piping.
Kevin Kowalski: No it won’t. It will all be underground.
Tom Ruhland: All be underground. And then is there any chance of the utilities that Xcel will do
anything about running underground power?
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
Paul Oehme: We have talked to Xcel about that. They do not have any plans for undergrounding the
power. The power in this area is overhead with power poles. Typically for Xcel to install their
equipment underground, they would charge the City or property owners a fee for that and we’ve had,
researched that cost in the past and it is significant so, and we have not explored it any further with Xcel.
Tom Ruhland: It would be nice to have more reliable power. Other than that I think it’s a good idea with
what they do have planned. The streets definitely need it, although I don’t get to use much of it where I
live. Thank you.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Anyone else who would like to address the council this evening? No?
Okay. If no one else would like to address the council let’s go ahead and without objection we’ll close
the public hearing and bring it back to council for discussion. Thoughts and comments.
Councilman Laufenburger: I had just a follow up question, if you wouldn’t mind.
Mayor Furlong: Councilman Laufenburger, certainly.
Councilman Laufenburger: Can you just speak to how does the water flow from the iron filter, filtration
system to the lake? Is that underground or is that over.
Kevin Kowalski: That’s underground.
Councilman Laufenburger: It is an underground.
Kevin Kowalski: There’s a drain tile at the bottom of that filtration system that will go directly to that
storm sewer that goes down between 3471 and 3451. Straight off the end of Fir Tree.
Councilman Laufenburger: Gotch ya. And then to inspect the quality of the water that is being
discharged, there’s an end of the pipe there I’m assuming, is that correct?
Kevin Kowalski: Yes. Yes.
Councilman Laufenburger: And that pipe does not exist right now does it?
Kevin Kowalski: Yes, it’s there now.
Councilman Laufenburger: So it’s there right now and it’s essentially the storm sewer is delivering water
directly to that. No filtration.
Kevin Kowalski: There’s some storm sewer at the, on the south end of Shore Drive. That goes directly to
the lake.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay, thank you. That’s all I had Mr. Mayor.
Mayor Furlong: Okay.
Councilwoman Ernst: Question.
Mayor Furlong: Councilwoman Ernst.
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
Councilwoman Ernst: Question for Paul. Can you tell me, you were talking about an agreement that is
signed for the rain gardens for the residents that are living there. So what if you have a household that, a
resident that moves out and another one in? How do you manage that?
Paul Oehme: Sure. A good question. The agreement is recorded at the County under that property so it’s
perpetual with the property itself so any property owner that’s interested in potentially purchasing a
property that’s for sale that would have one of these agreements on it, it would come, it’d be identified
under the title search so typically the buyer would know exactly what that agreement states and be
informed about that at that time.
Councilwoman Ernst: Okay, thank you.
Mayor Furlong: Any other questions? Discussion, thoughts or comments about the project. Mr.
McDonald.
Councilman McDonald: Well I’ve got a question on the rain gardens. I see that there was a meeting
about 6 months ago. What’s been the response of the neighborhood as far as being in favor of this?
Kevin Kowalski: We’ve had 4 or 5 response saying they’d be interested in it. We haven’t done much
follow up since then. Waiting to see what the council’s direction is tonight. Once, if the council decides
that that’s preferred we could, we would make an effort to talk to more people to follow up.
Councilman McDonald: So if we wanted to go forward with it based upon the rain gardens at this point,
and then you go out and you talk to people and find that you can’t get more 50% to agree to participate, it
could be removed out of the project without any impact on anything else.
Kevin Kowalski: Certainly.
Councilman McDonald: Okay.
Mayor Furlong: I guess to follow up, in terms of the expectation of the number of properties that you’d
expect to have rain gardens, was your thought that yeah, the potential of each and every property to have
a rain garden or would they be more.
Kevin Kowalski: There really wasn’t an expectation.
Mayor Furlong: Small distribution around the neighborhood.
Kevin Kowalski: Yep. Rain gardens are sensitive still. Some people like them. Some people don’t.
What we’ve identified here are areas that are good spots for them.
Mayor Furlong: Okay.
Kevin Kowalski: Okay. We’re not really expecting that we’re going to have that many. There might be
an opportunity to put in more. It just remains up to the property owners.
Mayor Furlong: So they’re going to go in places where they’ll do the most good.
Kevin Kowalski: Yes.
Mayor Furlong: So if a property owner wants them but they’re at the top of the hill.
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
Kevin Kowalski: Exactly.
Mayor Furlong: It’s not going to do much good and you’re not going to put our money there. Likewise if
somebody’s at the bottom of the hill but they don’t want a rain garden.
Paul Oehme: For example South Shore Drive on the south side there, there’s no opportunity to put a rain
garden there just because of the topography.
Mayor Furlong: Topography.
Paul Oehme: Yeah, so it’s not going to do any good there so it’s on a case by case basis that we’ll look
at, see if these improvements are, we’re getting the bang for the buck.
Mayor Furlong: So what I hear coming indirectly a question to the council tonight is are we opposed to
going forward with any rain gardens or if we’re interested in using this as one of the tools to try to
improvement storm water runoff in this area.
Kevin Kowalski: Right.
Mayor Furlong: You know are we okay with it, assuming proper agreements are put in place.
Kevin Kowalski: And if I may Mr. Mayor, we’re not going to select locations where we have to take
trees to put them in. So if a homeowner wants it and there’s a big tree there, you know we’re not going to
take down the tree to put in a rain garden. Okay.
Mayor Furlong: Sure. Okay. Councilman Laufenburger.
Councilman Laufenburger: Mr. Mayor, I think it was Mr. Raddatz that said something about the City of
Edina, is that right Mr. Raddatz? Yeah. I think rain gardens are good for the community and, but there is
also, there’s a resource use for the rain garden. Manpower of the homeowner and potentially we would
pay to initially put whatever flora goes into that rain garden, is that correct? So maybe some
consideration should be given to a refresh fund on those rain gardens somewhere down the road like
maybe 5 or 10 years. I would trust your good judgment on that or what history says that a homeowner
who agrees to this agreement, that they can look forward to maybe in 7 or 8 years there a refresh on the
rain garden based on, that would be not their expense. That would be a fund that would come out of the
City’s but expecting that they would do whatever work was necessary to then maintain it after that point
so I think we shouldn’t just say do you want one or don’t you. I think we should give them some benefits
as to what those rain gardens do. Just a comment.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Questions or if not questions, is there discussions on the various aspects of
the project? The request before the council this evening, if I’m not mistaken is to authorize, authorize
plans and specifications, is that correct? So one of the things that we’ve talked about is to get some more
detail on the stormwater management activities in the park area. Are people comfortable with the iron
sand option along, is that Shore Drive I think?
Councilwoman Ernst: Is that C? Is that Option C?
Mayor Furlong: Yes, that’s included in Option C. The aspects that I see here with all the stormwater, I’m
hearing from staff that they’re not recommending Option A, which is the transverse pipe and.
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
Kevin Kowalski: That’s correct.
Mayor Furlong: And so the components are B and, which include some sump manhole covers. There’s
the rain gardens where appropriate if we get agreements. There’s stormwater retention proposed for the
park area. One outlet to the Highway 7 right-of-way at the northwest part of the neighborhood. Those
options there and then also, is staff recommending that we consider the iron sand option as well?
Paul Oehme: That’s correct.
Mayor Furlong: For potential reduction of phosphorus going into the lake. Maybe starting with the
council on that. Does anybody object to any of those items?
Councilman McDonald: Well are we going to be able to quantify the benefit of the iron sand? I mean are
you going to be able to measure phosphorus. You know what it is now without anything. Can we
measure it afterwards?
Paul Oehme: Yep. We’ll have to monitor it and see how well it’s performing.
Mayor Furlong: Do we know what it is right now?
Kevin Kowalski: Pardon me?
Mayor Furlong: Do we know what the phosphorus flow is right now into the lake from this
neighborhood?
Kevin Kowalski: Not specifically, no. We could probably check with the watershed district to get that
information.
Mayor Furlong: I mean Mr. McDonald you raise I think a good question. Are we putting something in
that is necessary and what level of performance are we expecting out of that?
Councilman McDonald: Well I guess I’m willing to do it on a test because this is the first place we’ve
looked at it and if it works, it could work other places too so, but I just want to make sure that we can
measure the benefit of it. If the benefit’s there, that’s fine. It becomes something you can use in the
future. If the benefit’s not there, then yeah we don’t use this anymore. So I just want to make sure we
can measure.
Mayor Furlong: And I agree with you but I think before we spend the money on it we should find out
what the flow of phosphorus is through this area to see what level is needed.
Kevin Kowalski: Absolutely. We’ll research that with Minnehaha Creek Watershed. Find out what data
they have.
Mayor Furlong: And then find some way of monitoring it.
Paul Oehme: Right.
Mayor Furlong: I think reduction of phosphorus is one of the goals that they have across the watershed
district but again it may not be the same throughout. Any other concerns about any of the stormwater that
we’d like to get some feedback on that have been mentioned? In terms of the construction of the streets,
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
the option of the alternate for the utilities. The alternate for directional boring of the watermain,
everybody’s comfortable I assume going forward with that at least as an alternate.
Councilman McDonald: Yeah.
Councilwoman Ernst: Yes.
Mayor Furlong: The improvements, clearly it’s needed. When you look at some of the pci indices as
well as comments from residents that that streets need to be done. Any other questions or concerns or
thoughts?
Councilman McDonald: I guess the only other thing, going back to the rain gardens. I understand what
you know Councilman Laufenburger’s talking about the refresh and stuff. I guess what I would like to
see is what percentage do you need to make it worthwhile and can you get that percentage to start out
with. If you can’t then I’d say we forget the whole thing and move on but you need to identify a number
because there’s so many homes that makes it beneficial and if you can’t get that number then we’re just
kind of wasting time and money so if you could look at that too.
Kevin Kowalski: Sure, certainly.
Councilman Laufenburger: When you percentage you’re saying what percentage of the locations where
the rain gardens would be good, could we get approval, is that what you’re asking?
Councilman McDonald: Right. In order for the rain gardens to become beneficial you need so many.
Councilman Laufenburger: Yeah.
Councilman McDonald: And a certain percentage of those and it’s good to go. A certain percentage
below, it has no effect whatsoever. I just want to make sure that we get the proper percentages because
your idea is not a bad one to look at but if it’s not beneficial to the project then that’s not you know good
use of money.
Councilman Laufenburger: I understand.
Mayor Furlong: Okay.
Todd Gerhardt: Mayor, council. The rain gardens, are they being assessed back?
Kevin Kowalski: They’re not proposed to be assessed.
Todd Gerhardt: That’s on the City’s side?
Kevin Kowalski: Yes.
Todd Gerhardt: Okay. Because I would think we’d need to know that before the final assessment
hearing.
Kevin Kowalski: Yes. Well that, we should have it answered by the time we’re ready to put this thing
out for bids and when we come back to the council to ask for your authorization to advertise for bids,
we’ll have all of that locked in.
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
Councilwoman Ernst: So just to clarify that that’s not included in the $6,000 number in here to each 91
homes.
Kevin Kowalski: That’s correct. The rain gardens are not included in the assessment calculations.
Mayor Furlong: Any other questions or discussions on the project in total or any aspect of the project?
Councilwoman Tjornhom: I just, I think this is a good night for assessment hearings. It’s good to see
that neighbors see the need for it and have been wanting this to be done. I know I was at the National
Night Out at that park we were talking about earlier and you know that was one of the main questions is
when are you going to fix our streets and you know, and so it’s good that we’re here tonight in January
and we’re making plans to get this done for you this summer so I think we should move forward. It’s a
good thing and so on that I say let’s go ahead.
Mayor Furlong: Over the years I’ve received calls from some of the residents in the neighborhood here
wondering about the street improvements exactly and 2012 I think was the year that we had told them,
Mr. Raddatz’s in the back smiling. I think he was one of them that called but for many years this
neighborhood has been scheduled for this year so it’s nice to not only see the improvements happening
but happen on time and on plan and to continue to look long term so I think I’m glad to see the project’s
moving forward and look forward to getting some of the information back.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: And I just want to say one more thing. When I was at the National Night Out
what I was most impressed about was the residents and their knowledge already. You know staff had
already been communicating with them. Letting them know you know what the plans were and working
with them with whatever problems they were having with it. Whether it was please save my tree or you
know what’s going to happen to the park so the neighbors seemed confident in what was going on with
the meetings and so that really was good to know too that City Hall’s doing their job so thank you for
that.
Mayor Furlong: Good, thank you. Any other comments? If not, would somebody like to make a
motion?
Councilman Laufenburger: Mr. Mayor.
Councilman McDonald: Well I have a question before you do it. You’re asking for Options B and C but
the motion doesn’t talk as far as that. Do we need to add that in there?
Mayor Furlong: What’s our direction are you looking for tonight in terms of a motion?
Paul Oehme: Well we’re looking for directions on plans and specs so if you would like to add some more
clarification to the proposed motion that’d be fine. Staff’s recommendations in the background is for
Option C with those rain gardens so it’s already been identified but if you want to make clarification on
the motion that’d be.
Councilman McDonald: But you wanted B and C. You wanted a combination of B and C.
Paul Oehme: Well C with the rain gardens.
Mayor Furlong: C includes, if I understand it correctly, C is B plus the iron sand filter.
Paul Oehme: Right.
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
Kevin Kowalski: That’s correct.
Mayor Furlong: So B and C is…
Councilman McDonald: I just want to make sure.
Mayor Furlong: No, and that’s fine. And I guess, is it your expectation that the elements of B, or the
elements of C would be bid as an alternate on the project or is that, or as part of the main project?
Paul Oehme: We’re proposing to bid it as the base bid. As part of the base bid. We can always add it as
an alternate bid if you so choose. We are scheduled to take this item back for City Council before we
actually go out for bids so at that time you know we can decide if it’s, if you’d like to see it as the base
bid or an alternate. At that point in time I’ll provide more information on the, on the iron filing system
and the park and those type of things so there’s still some time where we’ll have to get some feedback.
Mayor Furlong: And I think that gets to Mr. McDonald’s questions about cost benefit.
Paul Oehme: Yep. Yep.
Mayor Furlong: On the iron sand.
Kevin Kowalski: Yes.
Paul Oehme: And we’ll know before we…plans and specs or authorizes, bidding of the project so we’ll
know exactly you know if we get enough feedback from the property owners about how many rain
gardens we’re going to be having and at that point in time we’ll make a decision if you want to add those
in or not.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. Alright. Mr. Laufenburger.
Councilman Laufenburger: Mr. Mayor. I move that the City Council approve the resolution which
authorizes the preparation of plans and specifications for the 2012 Street Reconstruction Project #12-01.
Councilman McDonald: I’ll second.
Mayor Furlong: Motion’s been made and seconded. Any discussion on the motion? Seeing none, we’ll
proceed with the vote.
Resolution #2012-05: Councilman Laufenburger moved, Councilman McDonald seconded that the
City Council authorizes the preparation of plans and specifications for the 2012 Street
Reconstruction Project No. 12-01. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a
vote of 5 to 0.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you everyone. Appreciate your comments. Participation and look forward to.
Kevin Kowalski: Thank you.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you and look forward to seeing this come back in a few meetings. That
completes our items of business this evening. We’ll move to council presentations.
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
COUNCIL PRESENTATIONS:
Councilwoman Tjornhom: Mayor I have one.
Mayor Furlong: Councilwoman Tjornhom.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: Well it’s Monday night and I’m sure everyone in Chanhassen’s probably
watching us at our council meeting or reading about us online I’m sure. Tuesday night, I don’t know
what’s on TV but I’m sure it’s wonderful but Wednesday night there’s nothing on. There’s no council
meetings. There’s nothing on TV. The only thing that is happening on Wednesday night is the benefit
concert at the Autoplex and the sponsors are Beyond the Yellow Ribbon and it’s been 6:00 and 9:00 and
it will be former members of the Steve Miller Band. I can probably say I’m not sure if I’m old enough to
really know what they sing but, I’m kidding but I’m sure…on Wednesday but it’s going to be a great
time. It’s going to be kind of one of their, you’ll be able to sit through one of their rehearsal sessions for
their big concert they’re having in Cass Lake and so I would like to welcome and invite everyone to come
at the Autoplex and it’s between 6:00 and 9:00 on Wednesday evening.
Mayor Furlong: Very good, thank you. Other presentations from council? I’d like to let people know or
remind people if they saw the ads in the Chanhassen Villager that the City is currently accepting
applications for all of our four commissions. That includes the Planning Commission, Park and Rec,
Seniors and Environmental Commission. These are boards that act as advisory format to the council and
each have 2 to 3 positions available for candidates that are interested. Appointments will be made in the
th
March-April timeframe. Applications are due to City Hall currently February 10, is that correct Mr.
Gerhardt?
Todd Gerhardt: That is correct.
Mayor Furlong: So if you’re interested in that or have questions about any of the commissions, please
feel free to call City Hall. Send an email. Someone will get back to you to answer your questions but I
would encourage people that are interested in getting involved to consider applying for one of the
positions on our various commissions.
Todd Gerhardt: Mayor I’d just also like to point out that applications are available on the City’s website
and also on our Facebook page.
Mayor Furlong: Very good. So again if you have any questions, look to the website. Look to Facebook
and contact someone at City Hall.
ADMINISTRATIVE PRESENTATIONS:
Todd Gerhardt: Just a couple of items here. We were able to get a hold of Representative Hoppe and
Senator Ortman. Unfortunately they’re only available at 7:00 a.m. this coming Wednesday. I know I’ve
met the deadline for the Mayor’s wife in giving him 24 hours notice so.
Mayor Furlong: Barely.
Todd Gerhardt: So I know it’s short notice. They are very busy and Laurie’s been communicating with
them and trying to find what dates work and unfortunately you know unless we go later into February this
was the soonest they could get together.
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
Mayor Furlong: Can I just ask members of the council how many think they’ll be able to make this
Wednesday at 7:00?
Councilman Laufenburger: I think it’d be a great warm-up for the Steve Miller Band.
Mayor Furlong: It’s a 7:00 a.m.
Councilman Laufenburger: Oh. Yes, I can do that.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. I’m planning to be there and I know people may need to look at schedules
and make some changes but unfortunately I think given the legislature going into session tomorrow and
they’re planning for a short session, meeting with them earlier rather than later, weeks may make a
difference in terms of promoting some of our initiatives so.
Councilman McDonald: Well due to prior commitment I can’t be there Wednesday at 7:00.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: That was my only day off but I’ll be there at 7:00. But I’ll bring T-bone with.
Mayor Furlong: Alright, that’s fine. Councilwoman Ernst.
Councilwoman Ernst: Were you able to connect with Congressman Kline at all?
Laurie Hokkanen: I left a message with his aid Brooke but I haven’t heard back. We just pulled this all
together at like 4:32 so, but I will work on that and make sure that they’re aware.
Councilwoman Ernst: Okay.
Mayor Furlong: If they can make it and if you know there’s another time that works for the
congressman’s schedule, we can certainly meet with him on a separate occasion. I know we’d all be
happy to do that if he’d be willing to so.
Todd Gerhardt: And I know Kline does attend the Chamber here in the next couple of months so maybe
if we can get his schedule and find out, or contact the Chamber to see when he might be giving his
legislative update there. That we can give the council a head’s up on that. One other, or two other items I
have is, I wanted to recognize Doug Hoese. Doug is one of our building inspectors and Doug, and I did
hand out the certificate. It should be in front of you. The International Code Council is the agency that
oversees the building codes throughout the U.S. and internationally, thus their name, and Doug served as
the 10,000 Lakes Chapter President here in Minnesota so I just wanted to thank Doug and recognize Doug
for his efforts in leading and serving for the 10,000 Lakes Chapter. Appreciate his time and effort in
doing so. I encourage all my department heads and staff to lead their organizations and Doug did a great
job this past year and was recognized for it.
Kate Aanenson: Can I just add one thing to that?
Mayor Furlong: Ms. Aanenson. I’m sorry, sure.
Kate Aanenson: I meant to give Todd a script and I apologize to him. I just wanted to add one thing and
that’s the International President from Washington D.C. actually came to present the award to Doug.
He’s got a picture of it and it’s pretty rare that the President would actually come but Doug did such a
great job. He was on for 8 years. The last year, as Todd said was the President and they do a lot in
education and so it was architects. It’s not just building officials. Fire inspectors. Engineers and Doug
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Chanhassen City Council – January 23, 2012
did some reorganization so he just did a great job with the Chapter so he’s really recognized so Todd
wanted to make sure that we got that out there too so.
Mayor Furlong: No, it’s great to know. Please extend to him our appreciation and congratulations as
well.
Todd Gerhardt: Alright. And the last one I did mention earlier that we are applying for AIS grants. Both
on the educational and the inspection side and we will keep the council updated on the progress of those
th
grants once and if they are awarded. The deadline is February 15.
Mayor Furlong: Okay.
Todd Gerhardt: And that’s all I have this evening.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Any questions for Mr. Gerhardt or his staff?
CORRESPONDENCE DISCUSSION.
Mayor Furlong: I’d just like to congratulate our Director of Finance, Greg Sticha and his staff for having
received the Certificate of Achievement for Excellence in Financial Reporting for the, how many years is
this now? Number of years. They do a great job in terms of supporting, or conducting the financial
activities of the City and it’s nice to see them recognized as well.
Todd Gerhardt: They do a great job.
Mayor Furlong: Any other discussions on the correspondence packet? If not, if there’s nothing else to
come before the council this evening, we will continue our unfinished work session items immediately
following the meeting. At this time I would entertain a motion for adjournment.
Councilwoman Tjornhom moved, Councilwoman Ernst seconded to adjourn the meeting. All voted
in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 5 to 0. The City Council meeting was
adjourned at 8:35 p.m.
Submitted by Todd Gerhardt
City Manager
Prepared by Nann Opheim
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