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CC 2013 01 28CHANHASSEN CITY COUNCIL REGULAR MEETING JANUARY 28, 2013 Mayor Furlong called the meeting to order at 7:05 p.m. The meeting was opened with the Pledge to the Flag. COUNCIL MEMBERS PRESENT: Mayor Furlong, Councilman McDonald, Councilwoman Tjornhom, Councilwoman Ernst, and Councilman Laufenburger STAFF PRESENT: Todd Gerhardt, Laurie Hokkanen, Paul Oehme, Kate Aanenson, Todd Hoffman, and City Attorney, Andrea Poehler PUBLIC PRESENT: Robert Sommer 6239 Chaska Road Dale Johnson 2240 Melody Hill Road John Knoblauch 1450 Knob Hill Lane Alan Nikolai 6570 Galpin Boulevard Bruce Mattson 2200 Crestview Drive Steve & Carol Lahto 8591 Tigua Lane Mayor Furlong: Thank you everybody. We're glad that you joined us this evening and starting a couple minutes late. We apologize for that for any inconvenience but at this point I'd like to ask members of the council if there's any changes or modifications to the agenda. If not we'll proceed as published. PUBLIC ANNOUNCEMENTS: Mayor Furlong: First thing I'd like to do tonight is extend an invitation to all Chanhassen residents and businesses, families and friends to join us for our upcoming community event this coming Saturday, February 2nd which is February Festival. This is the 20 Annual February Festival in the city of Chanhassen and the first of our year long series of special events that are sponsored by the City, local service organizations and our local business community. February Festival will be held on Saturday, February 2 d . I invite residents, guests, families, friends to join me and my family and others out at Lake Ann for just a great afternoon of fun time. The events will begin at noon and include ice skating, sledding, sleigh rides, bonfires, medallion hunt, and an ice fishing contest. Hot food and beverages will be sold on the ice by the Chanhassen Rotary Club and by Culver's. Boy Scout Troop 330 will be selling live bait and S'more kits. The ice fishing contest will run from 1:00 to 3:00 p.m. and includes over $6,000 in prizes for participants. Each Feb Fest attendee will receive one free door prize ticket with a chance to win over $3,000 indoor prizes. Ora portion of the $3,000. I guess not all of it. Ice fishing tickets are $10 per person and are available at City Hall and some local businesses. For more information I would encourage you to check out the Chanhassen Villager. Visit the City's website. This is a great event and should be a lot of fun. The ice is thick and the snow these last couple days will make the ice less slick and so that should be a great event. Mr. Hoffman, how many holes do we drill in Lake Ann for the ice fishing contest? Todd Hoffman: Just over 1,200. Mayor Furlong: 1,200 fishing holes so there's one for everybody. Please come out and join us. Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 CONSENT AGENDA: Councilwoman Tjornhom moved, Councilman Laufenburger seconded to approve the following consent agenda items pursuant to the City Manager's recommendations: a. Approval of Minutes: -City Council Work Session dated January 14, 2013 -City Council Verbatim and Summary Minutes dated January 14, 2013 Receive Commission Minutes: - Planning Commission Verbatim and Summary Minutes dated January 15, 2013 b. Resolution #2013 -04: Rice Marsh Lake Trail Extension: Resolution Approving a MnDOT Limited Use Permit to Use TH 212 Right -of -Way. Wynsong, 7042 Galpin Boulevard: Table Final Plat and Development Contract. e. Approval of Request for a Temporary On -Sale Intoxicating Liquor License, Athletic Department Fundraiser, February 23, 2013, St. Hubert Catholic Community. f. Approve City Consent to Assignment, Limited Revenue Tax Increment Note, as related to Rottlund Homes/Northbay. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 5 to 0. VISITOR PRESENTATIONS. None. LAW ENFORCEMENT /FIRE DEPARTMENT UPDATE. Mayor Furlong: Good evening Lieutenant. Lt. Jeff Enevold: Thank you Mr. Mayor, council, good evening. I have a short power point there if you could pull that up for me. It's crime comparisons in your upper left there Paul. Or upper right, I'm sorry. There we go. Just want to take a few minutes and do a little comparison. A 4 year comparison of '09 through `012 on some of the crimes, Part I and Part II and kind of show you what that looks like. If we can move on. Does this work? Look at that. You can take a look at the Part I crimes here from '09 to '12. They're pretty steady but what I found interesting here is, if you look on the left there's the total Part I crimes and then the darker color are the thefts so you can see the majority of our Part I crimes are thefts. We've had a, you've heard me up here talking about thefts from vehicles and thefts from garages so you can see we did drop down a little bit in 2012, and my goal was to reduce thefts but I'm not going to shout from the rooftops on you know 3 of those. I got more work to do so, and you can see burglary's was another high percentage of our Part I crimes so those are the two items that I'm going to work on for this year. Try and reduce those numbers. Part II crimes, you can see at the bottom what the Part II crimes are. The total, and you can see property damage and theft related are the two biggest out of those Part II crimes so those are the crimes that I'm going to focus on for next year. For this year. See the same thing for non - criminal calls for service. The two biggest, or two of the largest ones were alarms and medicals. Then I found this next slide pretty interesting. With all the discussion and debate on gun control and gun safety going on, you can see '09 to 'I I how the stats stayed pretty steady and then in `012 when the debate started going up, you can see the increase in acquire permits of 65% and the carry permits of 180% so be interested to see if that carries into this year also. Councilman Laufenburger: Lieutenant, is this across Carver County or only the city of Chanhassen? Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Lt. Jeff Enevold: This is just the city of Chanhassen here. Yep. And then 2013 goals, I just wanted to share some of the goals that I'll be working on and this was pretty timely in light of the recent tragedy that took happened at Sandy Hook Elementary School. One of my goals is to strengthen our partnerships with the elementary schools here in town. I'm going to meet with the principles to review safety plans. I've got a meeting scheduled actually for this Thursday for one of them to review the plans and see if we can enhance those. My goals is to develop a short program to get into the schools and present to the children. I want to get in there and eat lunch with them and greet the children before and after school. Really my goals is to normalize the interaction between law enforcement and the students. You know there are times when we walk into the schools and people say oh boy, the cops are here. Now that's not what I want. I want them to say boy there's Lieutenant Enevold. There's Lieutenant, you know Sergeant Bromwell. That's my goal for 2013 to kind of normalize that behavior. And then one thing I wanted to do is improve our customer service to people who call in complaints. At least once a week I receive a call from somebody who had called in a complaint on a reckless driver or something and they ask me what happened and I you know I have to say boy, I'll have to look that up and get back to you so my goal is, after that deputy handles that call he's going to call that complaintant back and let him know what happened with that call for service. I think that's the right thing to do. I think that will improve our customer service. Then in 2013 we've got, we're going to continue our Citizen's Academy. I've got one scheduled for April 2 d through May 21S and then a fall academy is yet to be determined. One update is on Thursday we're going to have a drug take back box delivered and installed in the lobby of the Public Safety building up here so I think that's going to be a great convenience to our citizens, instead of having to go down to Chaska to drop that off or wait for us to do that once a year. They can come up here anytime they want to and drop off prescription drugs so look for that this week. And that's what I've got for you this time. Any questions? Comments? Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Questions for Lieutenant. Todd Gerhardt: Lieutenant, can you give a little update on some of the thefts and burglaries that kind of occurred this past couple of weeks. Lt. Jeff Enevold: Yeah we've had a rash of burglaries that have occurred in the city of Chanhassen. We've worked with the City of Eden Prairie and other surrounding cities and we found some similarities and we have a suspect and I'm hoping shortly we'll have those burglaries solved and a suspect arrested and put in jail. Todd Gerhardt: And the stolen vehicle, any update on that? Lt. Jeff Enevold: Stolen vehicle, it was recovered. We went and tried to pull a video and we actually had a witness. One of the folks who worked there identified the guy. We went to the house and found the vehicle about a block from his house so we're working on that one also. Todd Gerhardt: Great, thanks. Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Councilwoman Ernst. Councilwoman Ernst: Lieutenant I just want to compliment you on your strategies for 2013. You definitely have a full menu of opportunities there. I'll be anxious to hear what the outcomes of some of these are but good job. Lt. Jeff Enevold: Thank you, I appreciate that. Mayor Furlong: Okay, very good. Any other comments? Questions? Very good, thank you Lieutenant. Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Lt. Jeff Enevold: Thank you Mr. Mayor. Mayor Furlong: Chief Wolff is here this evening as well from Chanhassen Fire Department. Good evening Chief. Chief John Wolff Good evening Mayor, council. Also have some statistics that I'm going to share. Just we've had a chance to briefly look at our year over year 2011 versus 2012 sort of at a high level. Our requests for calls were down just over 8% and you may recall at the end of the first quarter we were down 25% and last year it was kind of the winter that didn't happen and we had no calls in January and February to speak of I think we had 45 at the end of February and we're already almost at I think 50 to date so far in January so kind of the normal winter stuff. You get car accidents. Lots of frozen pipes which will engage fire alarm systems. That sort of stuff And then fires of course too and we've had a couple of fires this year which I'll comment on. The big driver I would say for overall calls being down, CO alarms were down 60% and to a degree that is somewhat, somewhat weather driven. Folks that, you know when the houses are kind of closed up you start the car. It's going to trigger a CO alarm if you open the door to the garage. So and just not using the heating system as much so CO calls were down 60 %. That's a big number. It's you know 35 is the normal. We had about a dozen. And then our false alarms were also down and that's just a function of our fire prevention folks just staying on top of you know doing the fire inspections. Making sure those systems are running correctly. They've been properly tested and so forth. Inspections were up by 10% this year and almost 30% over 2 years ago so I think we're really hitting the community, you know all the businesses and important target risks that we have, that have fire alarm systems on a real regular basis. So on an overall basis 8% down on fire calls. Last year was 15% down from the year prior so 25% down from 2010. That's kind of a bigger number. Just wanted to make a comment. A very alert public, on December 23r an employee at Summerwood, which is a skilled nursing facility here in town, spotted a fire on the Foss Swim School and called the fire department right away and we got there and it was a very manageable event. If that person hadn't seen the fire I think we would have had a much different situation. They were doing roofing work and it was some of the mechanical work that they were doing caused a small fire that eventually grew and at 3:00 a.m. in the morning we got called out for that fire. And then down in one of our new neighborhoods, on Bellevue Court a house under construction caught on fire on the 5 "' of January and typically these fires really burn fast and they burn these homes down quickly and sometimes you know the way homes are built close together, the next house over gets also damaged but alert construction workers that happened to be working that Saturday saw the fire and contacted the fire department and we were able to put that fire out pretty quickly. The interesting thing about this fire was the cause and it, we've never run into it and we've kind of done some research but it was caused by the sun reflecting off the window of the building next door and I'm very impressed that our fire inspector and fire marshal discovered this. Because there was no electrical there, there were just, we were looking at all the options. Smoking, whatever from the construction workers and nothing was adding up and this fire started at about 12 feet above ground level with nothing around it and doing some interviews we learned that the construction workers had discovered a small fire 2 weeks earlier in the same spot so they started doing some further investigation and actually filmed it the next day with that same area starting to smoke again with the sun hitting it so the developer and the builder came up with a solution and they took care of the problem in terms of the window but kind of an unusual situation so, very proud of our fire inspector and fire marshal for their work there. In terms of goals for the fire department for this year. A big goal for us is to update our documents so our operating guidelines and kind of our policies and with the great work of city staff, Laurie Hokkanen and some folks in City Hall we were able to get that accomplished actually and delivered those new documents to our members last week so we have got some updated guidelines. Updated personnel handbook and so forth so one of our key goals, the fire study that's going to be, you know we're going to be getting findings from probably in March will be a real driver I think for us to refine our goals for this year so we haven't really put a lot of flesh around it beyond that because knowing Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 that that work was going to come through and that will really drive a lot of what we do in 2013. So with that I'll take any questions. Mayor Furlong: Okay, thank you. Any questions for Chief Wolff? Chief, just a couple on the fire study you said information back in March timeframe. Is that the current timeframe? Chief John Wolff Yeah, it appears to be the timing. Yeah, I think we might see some preliminary stuff late February. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Okay. Chief John Wolff And we're working closely with them. They're starting to crunch the numbers now. Mayor Furlong: But we're still on track for sometime this quarter? First quarter. Chief John Wolff Absolutely. I think that's the plan. Mayor Furlong: See some preliminary information at least. Chief John Wolff Yep. Yep. Mayor Furlong: And get some graphs back. Okay. And then the other comment that I would make is in our packet the council gets copies of the customer comment cards for the fire department and these, the ones we got this month are very similar to the other ones. Excellent rankings up and down and everyone very positive comments on the professionalism so always nice to see those and please extend our gratitude back to the department and to all the fire fighters for their excellent work so. Chief John Wolff Thank you. I will. Mayor Furlong: It's nice to see them and please continue to keep putting these in the packet. We appreciate them. Chief John Wolff Certainly. Alright, thank you. Mayor Furlong: Alright. Thank you. We'll move on now to the next items on our agenda. 2013 STREET IMPROVEMENT PROJECT 13 -OIA: PUBLIC HEARING ON FEASIBILITY STUDY FOR THE MELODY HILL NEIGHORHOOD. Mayor Furlong: We'll start with the staff report tonight from Mr. Oehme and then council may have some questions for staff. We'll then open it up for a public hearing so that the council can understand comments and questions but if there are questions as well we'll try to get those answered from the public this evening, if we can or certainly get back to you with answers to those questions if necessary so Mr. Oehme, let's start with a staff report please and we'll move forward. Paul Oehme: Sure, thank you Mayor, City Council members. I'd like to just briefly walk through a power point presentation on the improvements proposed for the Melody Hills area which consists of 6 streets in this area. In your packet there were a couple comments that we received lately from property owners and just today we did receive one additional comment from a property owner so that I handed out to everybody as well so if you have any questions on those please direct those to me as well. So I just wanted to briefly go through why we're doing, we're proposing the streets that we are. The projects were Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 selected using our pavement condition index, pavement management software that we have here in the city. We also had some visual inspections that were done on the streets and that's the impetus for proposing the streets to be worked on this year. The streets proposed for rehabilitation can no longer really be maintained cost effectively with minor maintenance. The streets in this area are old. Up to 50 years old. They are deteriorating. We can't typically use cost effectively sealcoating anymore. We do, we are out here constantly patching these streets and it's in staff's opinion it's, the streets have come to a level where they should have additional improvements done at this time to give it better street quality. Again if the streets were left alone they would deteriorate more. We'd have more patching, more costly money that we annually put on these streets to keep the potholes down and the complaints at a minimal. This is basically showing an overall exhibit of the project areas that we're proposing to make in 2013. As council may recall we did talk about Greenwood Shores at our first council meeting in January. Tonight we'd like to focus in on the Melody Hills, Murray Hill area neighborhood up here in yellow. In all there are 4.6 miles of streets that the City is proposing to work on this year. In the first meeting in February we'll be talking about, staff would like to talk about Horseshoe Curve area and Sandy Hook area as well for similar street improvements. But tonight we'd like to focus on Melody Hills and Murray Hills area. So this area shown here in the aerial, it's about 1.2 miles worth of streets that we considered for improvements. Streets again they vary in age anywhere between 25 years and up to 50 years old. I think Whitetail Court is the youngest street in the area. Most of these streets have been sealcoated several times. Some of the streets have been sealcoated up to 2007. However you know cost effectively we can't really do that moving forward so what we're proposing to do is grind up the streets. Use that as base aggregate and then repave the streets with 4 inches of bituminous. New mat. New pavement surface. This is a cost effective approach that the City has used on other streets in the area. We also in conjunction with that we also do roll tests. Making sure that the sub -grade is set properly or has enough strength so we, if there are any soft areas we always will be digging those areas down and improving that structural base before we pave. We did have a neighborhood meeting on this area back in November 15 and I think about 30 residents did show up for that meeting so we had a great discussion I thought. Moving forward we'd like to look at making some utility improvements in this area too. City sewer and water and storm sewer improvements specifically. This drawing kind of shows what some of the highlights of what we're looking at. First off the watermain in this area is mainly cast iron pipe which you know it does have a tendency to break. However we have not recorded a lot of watermain breaks in this area. Therefore we're proposing that we leave the watermain alone at this time. We're not proposing to replace it. However looking at the gate valves we have had some gate valve issues up here. We'd like to replace the bolts and recondition those gate valves. Replace some of the hydrants up in this area too and then put some Anode bags on those, that improvements to try to reduce some of the corrosion on the pipe as well. The sanitary sewer improvements that were proposed, minor sewer improvements in the Melody Hills /Murray Hills area. Just some I and I barriers in the manholes. However in Chaska Road we did find that some of that pipe has settled out and is not flowing as properly as it should so we're actually looking at replacing a majority of the sanitary sewer that's along Chaska Road at this time just to make sure that flows properly in the future. With that we also are proposing to work with the future developer in this, Fretham development which is proposing to subdivide a parcel out here into 4 lots. That development has not come through City Council yet for approval but if it were to be approved the city staff is just proposing to work with the developer on extension of sewer and water services to that property and assess those costs back to the developer in conjunction with that project so it's more efficient so that's something that we're looking at in the future, if and when that development were to come through. With that summary of the project. The costs are shown here for the Melody Hills /Murray Hill area. About $590,000 worth of improvements that are proposed associated with mainly the street improvements are shown here. Storm sewer improvements. Water utility improvements and then sanitary sewer improvements as well. I should touch on some of the storm sewer improvements that we were also proposing on Murray Hill we're looking at extending some drain tile up Murray Hill Road and then also along Melody Hills Road here onto Chaska Road. This intersection specifically at Melody Hills and Chaska Road has a tendency to ice up and hold water. We're looking at trying to make some Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 improvements there to have that water flow out of that intersection in that area a little bit better. And then also on 63r Street there is, appears to be a need for additional drain tile along that roadway too to try to get some of the ground water removed from that area so we are looking at extending some of the drain tile in that section of road as well. So reviewed the cost, total cost for all, basically 4 projects is a little over $2.1 million dollars and the budget was in the CIP, capital improvement project is a little over $2.1 million dollars right now so. With that Melody Hills /Murray Hill area assessments are proposed to be calculated and assessed back to benefiting property owners per the City assessment practice so basically assessing 40% of the benefitting costs for the streets to the property owners. There's 65 property owners in this area which is an estimated assessment amount of about $2,885. Originally when we had the meeting, neighborhood meeting back in November we did give the neighborhood an estimate of just over $3,000. However we've reduced that cost a little bit since we have additional soils information that we received after the neighborhood meeting. Terms of the assessments for these separate projects the City has practices to assess over an 8 year period at 6% interest. Estimated 6% interest. That interest rate is based upon prime rate plus 2% so last year I think it was, the interest rate was about 5 1/4 percent, which is I think might, it'll be coming in similar to that this year as well. And then for the cost estimates and the assessments staff has included an 8% contingency and also 5% indirects to pay for soil investigation, engineering time, those type of things into the project costs too so with that the project schedule, if it would move forward tonight would be to approve the plans and specs, authorize advertising for bids on February 25 Between February 25 and April 22 d we would bid out the project. On April 25 we'd have the assessment hearing, accept bids and award of contract and then starting in June we'd actually start this construction project and have substantial completion August 30 Before August 30 We would have a neighborhood meeting sometime again in early April just to review the assessment amounts and project scope and schedule with the neighborhoods prior to that next hearing so. With that if there's any questions I'd be more than willing to try to answer them. Otherwise I would like to request that a public hearing be opened as well. Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Any questions for Mr. Oehme? Councilwoman Ernst. Councilwoman Ernst: Paul, you know I've heard this brought up a few times from some of the residents. This pipe that is sticking, I think it's sticking out of a culvert or it's sticking out of the curb. Is this drain tile going to take care of that runoff? Paul Oehme: Yep. That's over on Melody Hills I think. Councilwoman Ernst: Yeah. Mayor Furlong: Do you have a map? Paul Oehme: Yeah, let me try to pull that up. I believe it's right in this area right in here. Melody Hills neighborhood. There is, I think there's a drain tile that comes in from the back of the school and picks up some of the water back of the property owners out here that discharges onto the road. That drain tile that we're proposing to extend up the road would connect into that drain tile system and bring that water down to the road here and discharges into our culvert system or the drainage system so that's one of the improvements that we'd like to make with this project. Also there's some sump pump water I think that discharges in this area. We're looking at trying to connect some of that sump pump drainage system into the new drain tile improvements that we're making as well so we're trying to address both of those issues under this project. Councilwoman Ernst: Thank you. Mayor Furlong: Other questions? Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Councilman Laufenburger: Mr. Mayor. Mayor Furlong: Councilman Laufenburger Councilman Laufenburger: Thank you. Paul can you, looking at this map, there are some streets here that are not targeted to be worked on. Sommergate, Melody Lane, continuation of Murray, Hill Road, etc. Can you talk about why those streets are not included as part of the plan? Paul Oehme: Sure. Thank you for the question. Those streets are newer. Those have been platted and developed back in the 80's and 90's I think. Those streets are in fair condition. Newer utilities. We don't have any issues with utilities or the street's condition in those areas so that's why we're not proposing to make improvements to those cul -de -sac at this time. If and when those streets come up for improvements, down the road, you know those improvements will be assessed back to those particular neighborhoods and not the Melody Hills streets that we're proposing here. Councilman Laufenburger: Sure. So in the, you said there was a neighborhood meeting. Did the question of these streets not being included, did that come up from the neighbors at all or not? Paul Oehme: You know I don't recall that question coming up Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. Paul Oehme: To me specifically. We had I think 2 or 3 other staff members there at the time. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. You spoke about this subdivision, Fretham, is that right? Can you highlight that? Is that on the north side of Chaska Road there? Paul Oehme: Correct. That's this parcel here that I'm showing. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. So is that, how many parcels are there on the north side of Chaska Road? Right now. Paul Oehme: Currently I think there's, let's see 1, 2, 3, 4. I think there's probably 3 houses but I think there's 4 lots. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. And the, if I understand correctly the assessment to the citizens is based on, has nothing to do with frontage on a street. It has to do with, if you own a lot that's on a street, then you get the same assessment as everybody else, is that correct? Paul Oehme: That's correct. The assessments that the City of Chanhassen practices to assess based upon per lot instead of front footage. Councilman Laufenburger: Per lot, okay. Did I understand correctly that this Fretham that they're considering doing a subdivision? Kate Aanenson: I can answer that if I may. Councilman Laufenburger: Is that correct Kate? Yeah, please Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Kate Aanenson: That subdivision is actually going to the Planning Commission next week. The packet will be going out tomorrow or Wednesday and they are proposing 4 lots. Moving the existing home over and then creating 3 additional lots. Councilman Laufenburger: So there would be 3 additional lots along Chaska Road? Kate Aanenson: That's correct. Councilman Laufenburger: So does that mean, I'm just thinking monetarily, does that mean you would add 3 more lots to the assessment universe for Melody Hill? Paul Oehme: Yeah, that project hasn't been approved at this time so there's no way that we can assess for those lots at this time. Councilman Laufenburger: When does the assessment occur Paul? Paul Oehme: April, it's proposed to be April 22 d Councilman Laufenburger: So if April 22 d if all of the lots are identified on April 22 d then the assessment will be based on the lots that are of record on April 22 dc) Paul Oehme: Correct. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. You understand my question Kate? Okay. Alright, thank you Mr. Mayor. Mayor Furlong: Okay, thank you. Other questions? Mr. Oehme with regard to, this is the second of three portions of local street projects. You mentioned we had the Greenwood Shores at our last meeting. We're going to have a couple more neighborhoods. Is it your expectation that all of these neighborhoods will be included in the bid package and that a single contractor would be hired or engaged to work on all of these different neighborhoods, is that? Paul Oehme: That is the intent like I said. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Alright Paul Oehme: The larger the scope of the project typically we see better construction bids, thus lowering you know the overall cost to the city and also the assessments to the benefiting property owners. Mayor Furlong: In that, ultimately if we go forward with whatever neighborhoods we do, staging and minimizing interruption but at the same time making sure everything gets done by a certain time period, are we going to have, I don't know deadlines or components in terms of scheduling? Paul Oehme: Yep. Mayor Furlong: I'm sure there's some efficiencies the contractors are going to want to put in place and also we want to make sure that this doesn't stretch out too long. Paul Oehme: Exactly. Yeah and so you know what the staff envisions is, having a schedule for each of these neighborhoods. Allowing the contractor you know what we think is enough time to get in there, do the utility improvements. Have a sub timeframe for the road improvements as well. This is not a Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 complete reconstruction of these streets so we anticipate the road improvements to go a lot quicker than say the reconstruction streets so what we're envisioning is once the streets are milled, milled up, utilities are made. You know we're going to give them probably 2 to 3 weeks at the most before they have to, they're scheduled to pave the streets so the roadway wouldn't sit as gravel for you know more than 2 weeks we're thinking in these areas so. Mayor Furlong: And I guess that's the question. I could envision where each neighborhood is at different stages throughout the summer. Paul Oehme: Right. Mayor Furlong: For some efficiencies but you don't want to be milled down in May and paved in September. Paul Oehme: Yeah we're not going to have a contractor just come in here and mill up all the streets and go away for 3 months or 2 months so that's, we're trying to. Mayor Furlong: Okay, and we control that with the contract? Paul Oehme: We will, yeah. There'll be interim completion dates that we're going to set aside specifically for these streets and you know once a contractor's in here we want him to make the utility improvements. Complete the roadway improvements and get out as quickly as we can so, and then more onto the next section. Next neighborhood. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Are there other storm water improvements that are being looked at in this neighborhood or fixes? Corrections that are being planned. Paul Oehme: Yeah. I kind of highlighted some of them. The drain tile. Murray Hill /Melody Hill area. Chaska Road. I think there's a culvert too that we want to take a look at that I think that's heaving. Whitetail Court, there's a culvert too that's heaving. We want to replace that as well coming out of the ground. It's, that one specifically is metal or corrugated metal that I think is starting to rust out so we want to replace that one with concrete so, and then so that's basically the improvements that we're proposing in this area. Mayor Furlong: And then I guess just being good neighbors, some of these roads continue on in Shorewood so if we do move forward with this neighborhood, will you be in contact with the City of Shorewood so they can use whatever means they want to to inform their residents on what's going on. Paul Oehme: Right, absolutely and we have to work in conjunction with the City of Shorewood too. Some of that sanitary sewer improvements that I originally talked about, we are going to be right on the border there with the city of Shorewood as well so we need to coordinate that work. Mayor Furlong: Is there any joint type of work on their side that is expected? Paul Oehme: You know yeah, I haven't heard that Shorewood is planning, anticipating to do any work next year in this area. Mayor Furlong: Okay. If there is maybe looking at doing it at the same time rather than constructing both neighborhoods. Paul Oehme: Right 10 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Mayor Furlong: Multiple years might be helpful, if possible. Okay. Any other questions? Todd Gerhardt: Mayor, council. Mayor Furlong: Yes, Mr. Gerhardt. Todd Gerhardt: Paul can you just explain again, we've got the 3 different neighborhoods. When you receive bids you're not going to do it all as one project. Each neighborhood will be addressed based on the work that's going to be done in each of those neighborhoods. Paul Oehme: Correct and you know we haven't, we don't, we haven't really decided which neighborhood would go first but we've got basically 3 months of construction work to do the 4 neighborhoods so, you know once we're, once say Greenwood Shores is the first one that gets worked on, we're going to have the contractor work on utilities and improving the streets before he moves onto Melody Hill so each of these neighborhoods would have a separate schedule. Separate timeframe when the work has to get done based upon you know the scope and what not but yeah, the intent is to let all these projects under one contract. One contractor would have the sole responsibility of completing the streets for this project. Todd Gerhardt: But in determining your final assessment numbers for the neighborhoods. Paul Oehme: Right, yep. The assessments would be based upon the individual neighborhoods so Greenwood Shores would not be part of the Melody Hills assessments. They're each individually separated assessment calculations for each of these different neighborhoods so, because each of the neighborhoods are slightly a little bit different in terms of scope and what's, you know what will be needed. Again the assessments aren't based on the utilities, costs included. They're just based upon the roadway improvements. 40% of those roadway improvements. Mayor Furlong: I guess to follow up just for clarification, is it your sense if we end up going with all the neighborhoods or more than just one, that each neighborhood that the work would begin and be completed before any work is done in one of the other neighborhoods or? Paul Oehme: Well that's Mayor Furlong: I'm sorry Paul Oehme: Yeah the intent again would be the utilities be completed in say one neighborhood before they jump onto another neighborhood to complete the utilities so the biggest issue that we have and that we struggle with is the construction is when the roads are being worked on and you're driving on gravel We want to try to limit the amount of time that those roads are in gravel and those driving conditions so we want to try to you know limit that amount of time as much as we can for the contractor but still give them an ample amount of time to complete the work. Mayor Furlong: And I understand that. I guess the other thing is, if there's an opportunity to reduce the costs both to the residents and for the City, from a mobilization standpoint if there's a specific piece of equipment where they can bring it into all neighborhoods within a week. Paul Oehme: Right, yep. Right. 11 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Mayor Furlong: Are you going to be open to that or see if those opportunities exist as we, so we can lay out the bid package correctly? Paul Oehme: Yeah we are. The biggest caveat I think there is the milling machine. You know we don't want to go into Melody Hills and Greenwood Shores and with just have them mill all the streets up all at once you know. Mayor Furlong: Right. Paul Oehme: The efficiency is you know, like you had talked about Mayor would be to have, for the utility contractor to replace those hydrants and those gate valves into some of the storm sewer systems in one neighborhood and then jump to the next neighborhood. Mayor Furlong: Immediately Paul Oehme: Immediately, exactly. Mayor Furlong: Have the next neighborhood ready for them to go straight to. Paul Oehme: Exactly and that's the intent is to have that. It's the scheduling of the milling and how long those streets are going to be gravel, that's the timeframe that the staff really wants to hone in on and make sure that we can limit that time as much as we can. Mayor Furlong: And while those streets are gravel, I know that's where we've had challenges with some rain events and such like that, what do we have in the plans or what are we going to ask the contractor to do to, I mean some of these, especially this area they're, obviously by the name of the roads, it's hilly you know. Paul Oehme: Yeah, right Mayor Furlong: There's going to be runoff and when the streets are gravel we could have a lot of sediment moving around. Paul Oehme: We could and the, the type of construction that we're looking at here is not as say evasive as the total reconstruction where we're ripping all the storm sewer out and you know completely digging out all the watermains so there's potentially less sediment that will be leaving this site. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Paul Oehme: However we will have silt fence in the contract. Making sure our NPS permit is up to date and following those procedures through our MS4 permit so. Inlet baskets to catch the sediment before it ends up in our storm sewer system so those type of, those type of things so. You know once the roads are gravel and ground up, typically we come in with a compactor and make sure that the gravel is drivable so that's definitely going to help runoff as well as long as the asphalt, or the millings are put back down again. Mayor Furlong: Okay, very good thank you. If there are no other questions at this time, let's go ahead and open up the public hearing and I would invite any interested party to come forward and address the council. Or ask questions of staff so, if you'd like to address the council please come forward to the podium stating your name and address for the record. Thank you. Good evening sir. 12 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Robert Sommer: My name is Robert Sommer, 6239 Chaska Road. You sealcoated in '94, '99 and '07. What does a sealcoating cost? Paul Oehme: A sealcoating? It's about a buck 25 a square yard. Robert Sommer: What would be wrong with sealcoating again and letting this go for another 7 years or whatever? Paul Oehme: Sure, yep. We get that question all the time. The condition of the roadways, the amount of cracking and the amount of alligatoring and cracking, the amount of deterioration in the street section, it's, it doesn't last as long. The last sealcoat was done in 2007. We feel that the sealcoating right now is not performing like it should. Typically you get about 8 years out of a sealcoat so re- sealcoating this area typically we're, the roads are so rough that plow trucks will grind off the sealcoat in some areas. It doesn't do enough for sealing the road. Typically you will sealcoat will seal the top surface. There's enough cracks in here, wide enough cracks. Alligatored pothole areas where you're still going to get water seeping into the sub - grade. Moving that street around during the winter months and. Robert Sommer: What would the life expectancy of a new surface? Paul Oehme: What we're looking at is, at least 25 years. Robert Sommer: One thing I've noticed is that you have ditches on the east side and yet there's water running down the street because people have their lawns up higher than the street so that the water can't go down into the ditch. Paul Oehme: Right. Robert Sommer: Is that, can that be corrected? Paul Oehme: Yeah that, we did look at that. It'd be on the south side of Chaska Road. That area used to have ditches is my understanding and there are culverts under. Robert Sommer: Well there still are. Paul Oehme: Yeah, underneath yeah. Underneath some of the driveways. We are looking at you know trying to dig out that, the drainage ditch on that side of the roadway and try to get the water off, especially at the Melody Hills /Chaska Road intersection there where it typically ponds up so try to get that water off the road as much as we can so there is some fine tuning or some grade work that has to get done in that area as well. The sanitary sewer I believe is on that south side of the roadway too so that's going to be dug up and at that time we'll reshape the road. Robert Sommer: Is 276 involved? Paul Oehme: Excuse me? Robert Sommer: The school district. Paul Oehme: The school district. Robert Sommer: They put the sanitary sewer in, the school district. 13 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Paul Oehme: Oh they did, okay. Yeah that, they are, they're not part of the assessment roll. Robert Sommer: Oh, why is that? I mean it's their sanitary sewer. Paul Oehme: It's the City's sanitary sewer. We own and maintain it. They may have put it in. they don't have any frontage in terms of access to the, permanent access, public access to the project area, Melody Hills area so I don't think they're part of the assessment roll. Robert Sommer: I mean they're using it aren't they? Paul Oehme: On occasion I think they are to get to their park but I think a majority of their access is through 41. Robert Sommer: Can this be negotiated or? Paul Oehme: Excuse me? Robert Sommer: Can this be negotiated? Paul Oehme: In terms of? Robert Sommer: That they would accept some responsibility. Have you discussed that with them at all? Paul Oehme: We have not discussed that with them. Robert Sommer: Okay. Maybe you might try it. Paul Oehme: Okay. Robert Sommer: Now I'm not aware of, you would have this information. Have there been, the public complaining about the road at all? The roads. Paul Oehme: We do get complaints from property owners on Melody Hills area for potholes in this area. Murray Hill, we get complaints about stormwater, you know sump pump discharges, those type of things so we do get complaints up in this area. Robert Sommer: But I'm talking about the roadway. Paul Oehme: Yeah we do get complaints for. Robert Sommer: For how many? Paul Oehme: At least a couple a year I would imagine. Robert Sommer: A couple a year, okay. Well I'm glad to see you're talking about a better interest rate than you were talking about in November. I suggested that you might investigate that. I'm still at a loss as to why you're doing it but, and I oppose it but you do as you please I guess. Thank you. Paul Oehme: Alright, thank you. Mayor Furlong: Thank you Mr. Sommer. Others that would like to address the council. 14 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Alan Nikolai: Name is Alan Nikolai, 6570 Galpin. It's a corner lot adjacent to Crestview. Question for the City Engineer. What type of curbs, you say you're going to go full width, what type of curb are you going to be putting in on Crestview? Paul Oehme: On Crestview, I don't think there's curb out there right now. Alan Nikolai: There's asphalt curb. Paul Oehme: There's, well there's asphalt. We're basically replacing with in kind. Asphalt. Alan Nikolai: Are you going to put a high curb or low curb? Paul Oehme: It would be a low curb. I mean it's probably only 3 inches. Alan Nikolai: Okay because I know when they initially did it when they did the sewer and water years ago and then they put a curb up this high and every time a truck drives on it and then it and then it goes, squishes it down and just a point is I don't want a high curb there. Paul Oehme: Okay. Alan Nikolai: I don't know if you had to do anything you know how you have the concrete curbs like this? Paul Oehme: Yep. Alan Nikolai: Those are, it's just nice for you know. Paul Oehme: We're not proposing concrete curbs in this neighborhood. Alan Nikolai: Yeah, okay. Well I just wondered what part of the assessments what you were doing some of the curbs, you mentioned earlier so I was wondering if they were going to do the curb, you know what type of curb there. On that, when you're doing the asphalt, are you going to do two layers then? Paul Oehme: There'll be two lifts, correct. Alan Nikolai: Okay. Paul Oehme: Two 2 inch lifts. Alan Nikolai: Are you going to then space them apart a few weeks to firm up a little bit? That base. Paul Oehme: Typically we let it, you know let it cure out. Let it cool down a little bit for a week or so. Alan Nikolai: Okay. The one question I guess I, I guess part of this I don't understand is, why should improvements to the utility, namely over on Chaska Road, the storm sewer, or excuse me, sanitary sewer, 4 blocks away, why should us over 4 blocks away be paying for that? It's a sanitary sewer. Shouldn't that be under the sanitary section of it? Why is it included in roads? 15 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Paul Oehme: There's a separate enterprise fund that pays for improvements to the sanitary sewer system so the assessments that are proposed do not, are not part of the sanitary sewer improvements. Those are paid 100% by the City utility fund. Alan Nikolai: Okay, so we're not getting pro rated? Paul Oehme: Correct. Alan Nikolai: Or whatever you call it... Paul Oehme: You're not getting, no. There's no direct cost to the. Alan Nikolai: ... okay I was kind of wondering doesn't make sense 4 blocks away why. Paul Oehme: Likewise any storm sewer improvements or watermain improvements, those aren't being assessed either. Mayor Furlong: Mr. Oehme, could you pull up that funding split. So just explain, the only ones that are part of the assessment portion is that top line correct? Paul Oehme: Correct. Yep, everything else is paid by the storm sewer, utility fund, water utility fund, storm or utility fund so, and then just going forward just the assessment is based upon that same number as shown on the assessments. Alan Nikolai: That wasn't clear so that's why, thank you for pointing that out Mayor. I guess I have one last point about this whole project. You know Crestview's really not that bad of a road as far as, yeah you've had to do some sealcoating, etc. There's no potholes where you know gosh you get these chuck holes you know 6 inches, there's none of that. There's never been any of that ever since the road was redone in the late 80's. I guess I'm looking at what the economic condition of our economy is overall. You know this is bad timing people. This is bad timing. There's a lot of people or have lost their jobs or they're working at half the rate that they used to have their job 4 or 5 years ago and now you want to assess people $3,000 bucks or roughly. You know that's some may tip some people that they have to sell their house. They can't afford to stay where they're at. I'm just kind of one of these type guys, very frugal with my money and I look at this street, Crestview that it is not bad a condition. Now put it this way, if it was a private road I wouldn't even think about milling it and replacing it. Wouldn't even enter my, I'm a contractor for a living okay. I know what we have in my industry, how many people are still laid off. We have two - thirds of the work force from 6 years ago are still not hired. You know the government, the federal government can say what they want, it's an economic depression. Not a recession. A depression. When you have two - thirds of the people laid off in my industry, so I look at always with my clients, how can we do things, keep it economical, etc, etc and if somebody came up to me and that was a private road and says hey, should I sealcoat it or should I put an overlay? Maybe an overlay I could see maybe but to spend the money to mill it and put 4 inches over it, I don't see the cost benefit. It's just, that road is in fairly good condition. I've got to give credit where credit is due. The City has done a fairly good job of maintaining it over the years as far as sealcoating, that type of thing and a couple times when there's some skim coating with lines, they did a really good job you know. Yeah, I understand it costs money but at the same time you start looking at the big picture of how much more that costs to mill. Mill it out and replace. In these economic times I would ask to frankly, I'm asking the council to vote down for the whole Melody Hill area. Not approve it. This is not the time economically to do it. I understand there's over $2 million dollars. If you really want to make a bold statement, return all $2 million dollars back to us taxpayers in the form of a rebate. 16 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Audience: Yes, I agree with that Alan Nikolai: You know, it's not your money. It's our money. Us taxpayers paid that in. You know same as this, you know we need to live within our means. We're not the federal government and we can't keep taxing. I know if I my rates went up, I kind of laugh. My assessment on the house went down 2% but my taxes went up 5% and it's like huh? I don't know what the cost of inflation is but it, that's a 7% switch people. Inflation's not 7 %. And it keeps up and up and we keep taxing more and more. We need to live within our means and I think that's maybe being less ambitious on a road resurfacing plans is part of that goal. It should be so I'm asking for a formal, I'd like to see one of the council members here you know stand up and put it forward to not have this go forward on the Melody Hill because this is economically, it's going to be a hardship. I know for me it's going to be a real hardship. You know. This idea well 6 %. I don't care if it's 2 %, it's the whole amount of money to begin with. I have to come up extra. The economic resource isn't there. This economy is not booming so as such, and I know others are the same way. They're just not going to say it publicly because they're embarrassed. It is what it is with this economy. This economy has not recovered. Even though we all would have liked to have been, be like it even was like say 10 years ago. It's not going to I don't think happen anytime soon and as such maybe something like this road, I'm not saying if it's 5 years down the road or 7 years down the road, yeah maybe we need to look at it then but as a, one of the city staff pointed out to me at the November meeting, it is not by far the worst roads in the city of Chanhassen. Greenwood Shores is. Or not Greenwood. Wasn't Greenwood Shores. Carver Beach I think it was. Was by far the worst and so I'm going like, kind of defies reason. Why aren't we attacking the worst roads? Why are we tackling the roads that are iffy? I do not think that is wise use of public taxpayer money. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Thank you, I appreciate those comments. Mr. Oehme, couple questions. Just a follow up to his comments. Thank you sir. Crestview here from a pavement index is higher out of these groups of roads. You said there were other streets that were, are not being included in this neighborhood. I think Mr. Laufenburger asked about that. It's 63. Is that, why are you including Crestview here and not including some of the others when the other pavement indices and maybe talk a little bit about the pavement indices. Paul Oehme: Sure. So I'm going to go back to that slide, and you're correct Mayor. Crestview Road right currently, the last time we evaluated it for the pavement condition is at a 63 so the pavement condition index goes from 100 down to 0 so 100 being basically a brand new road. 0 being a unimproved road or very poorly maintained roadway so the majority of the roads out here are between you know 23 and 40's. Crestview Road is however at 63. The reason why I think it's a little bit inflated versus some of the other streets is that we did significantly patch Crestview Road a couple years ago. It was sealcoated in 2007 and subsequently we've had to go in and patch that area and. Mayor Furlong: So by patching, was it small patches? Was it kind of a... Paul Oehme: No. They're more. It's more, it's not an overlay but it's a skin patch I would call it. It's more with a finer mix with a sand mix. Filling in some of those pothole areas. Some of the bigger cracking, cracked areas so you know our pavement condition reports, evaluations are based on visual observations so once you have a patch over some of the maybe some of the stress pavement areas, you're not going to be picking that up on your pavement condition indices so I think that's why it's a little bit inflated. You know what triggers some of the improvements, or the observations that we have is the, since 2007 we had to go in, back in and spend a significant time and resources patching the roadway. That tells me that there's something else going on with the roadway just not from a superficial aspect but more of a structural issue going on there... Mayor Furlong: So if I hear this right it was sealcoated in 2007. 17 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Paul Oehme: I believe it was, yeah I think the last records I think it was 2007. Mayor Furlong: And there's been additional patch work since that time? Paul Oehme: Correct. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Todd Gerhardt: Mr. Mayor, council members. The road was installed in 1979 so you're talking about 32 years since the road has been in place. Paul Oehme: I think that's when the road was paved. The road might have been there a little bit before then. Alan Nikolai: You did sewer and water and it was, not 1979. It was in the late 80's. Actually I think it might have been '87. If I recall. '86 or '87 because we, they dropped, the City Engineer at the time dropped the road by over 2 feet and the garbage truck when they were backing into the driveway, it would actually hang up on his garbage truck because they put such a steep ramp and we had to take my dad out of his pocket, had to go back over 60 feet and re -grade so we actually get a garbage truck or any vehicle to get into our driveway without hanging up. That's how I remember that and we had the big storm, those August rains. Those 12 inch rains and washed out 20 yards of gravel out of the driveway twice. We had 20 inches of rain in 3 shots in a 7 days time so that's how I remember that very distinctly. Mayor Furlong: Alright. Alan Nikolai: If I may, I'm going to address his comment a little bit what's going on. Why they're having to seal patch a little more. It has to do with the springs. This whole neighborhood up here is nothing but springs. You wonder why it's going on up on 65" I remember in drought years like in '87- '88 before they started building that, or '77 it was and there was ducks up there in, because of the springs leeching out of the ground and they had cattails growing and you know springs, there's no different when you guys if you recall had to do, put the draintile in along the trail along Galpin on the hill that's going to the north because of all the, it was flooding across the county road there and it was nothing but an iceberg. Literally it was, there was times the ice was this thick across the whole roadway and you had to put a draintile but the whole top of that hill is a bunch of springs. Well what's going on on Crestview is springs coming down that hill and also the contractor that did the job originally never put a crown on the street and familiar, some of you may or may not, it's basically I'm going to over exaggerate, it's like this. You have the, you want it to slope off to both sides. They never did it. It's on a hill so they just put it flat. The water runs right down the middle. Okay. That's where, it's what they call the sealcoat's raveling. It's coming up. That's right, it's basically it's like a gutter there and that's why you have a lot more freeze and thaw effect and with that freeze thaw that's what's deteriorating that top of the surface. I question whether it's actually the bituminous base is going bad because there's no potholes. I mean like I said, if you see these chuck holes, you know how it is in the springtime. We'll see them around different roads and they're 4 or 5 inches thick and you know that big and water and cars are hitting them and people are complaining because they're damaging their suspension on their vehicle. We don't have that problem there. It's just been the top raveling a little bit and it is again where that's raveling consistently the same area. It's where that middle of the street where the water's running down so I kind of question is, is it really that bad the overall road or is it because it's improperly drainage system to begin with? What I look at is, what was it he said, what a buck 25 a square yard. That's cheap. That's cheap. You know someone says hey you know we're going to have to assess a buck 25 a square yard to help patch, 18 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 you know I'd say I get that but to you know do, that we're going to do $2,900. Now that's a little, I question that so. Mayor Furlong: But sealcoating wouldn't affect drainage. Paul Oehme: It wouldn't affect drainage at all. Alan Nikolai: No. No. Paul Oehme: It'd seal up the road a little bit in some of those cracked areas but I mean what we're talking, he's talking about wouldn't address any of those issues. Mayor Furlong: And would this proposed project address those? Paul Oehme: Yeah we always put a crown or if the road's narrow enough we always have at least 2 %, 2 1/2 percent grade on the roads just to make sure the water gets off the road. That's the biggest challenge with the roads is you know trying to get the water off. Get it out of the sub - grade. That's where you're going to see the best bang for the buck. Alan Nikolai: Part of the problem, if I may. When you have a road, this road is this deep and you have a 2% which is about there, it wants to go down the pathway of least resistance. Downhill. 2 %'s not enough for a crown on a situation like that. If you want to get it in layman's terms what you really need to do is you need to get it a neck crown about a, you almost have to have a 3 inch hump if you will to make it go to the sides on a steep hill like that. But then again, like I said, the problem, there's no alligatoring on this, on Crestview. There is, I know exactly what alligatoring is and that is a sign it is ready to go. When you start getting this, kind of these big cracks and it's like, that is a sign. There isn't any of that so that's why I question why is that, and what was the rating for, you said the rating for that road? Crestview. Paul Oehme: Crestview is 63. Alan Nikolai: So 63% out of 100, like I said, it's not that bad. 100 being brand new. I question why that is even included and to the extent maybe we should exclude it. Mayor Furlong: Well and that's our question too. Alan Nikolai: I think we should be excluded. Thank you. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Bob Sommer: Excuse me, I have one more minute Mayor Furlong: Mr. Sommer. Bob Sommer: This used to be Chaska Road was Highway 41. State Highway 41. It got redesigned. There are people that use that as a cutoff so we get a lot of traffic that does not have anything to do with residences on that road. As a matter of fact I go 30 miles an hour and I'm being tailgated all the time. You get rid of any of those bumps, a smooth surface, you're going to be seeing 45 -50 miles an hour down Chaska Road. 19 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Mayor Furlong: Okay, thank you. Others that would like to address the council this evening. Please, come forward sir. Bruce Mattson: Bruce Mattson, 2020 Crestview Drive. I have to agree with Alan. I mean the road just isn't that bad but I came in late so I wasn't privy to the prior conversations. One question I have is, is this standard operating procedure to assess the residents for rebuilding a road? Mayor Furlong: Yeah, Mr. Oehme if you want to, the answer is we're following consistent practices that we've had for quite a few years but go ahead. Paul Oehme: It's probably over 10 years that the City has considered assessing benefiting property owners for street reconstruction projects, or street overlays, reconstructions or mill and overlay projects of this sort so it is a consistent practice of assessing 40 %. Bruce Mattson: Within the past 10 years. Paul Oehme: Right. Bruce Mattson: Okay, because I've lived there 30 years and I got a bill for the sewer going in, which I understand but maintaining a road, what do we pay taxes for? And I have to agree, I mean a 63% rating, did I hear it correctly, the average in the city is 20 to 40 percent? Mayor Furlong: No, I don't think that's correct. Let's clarify that. Paul Oehme: No, the average is approximately 72 right now so, 63 again, 63 I think is a little bit of an elevated pavement condition index for this street. I think the street has been patched significantly the last couple years and when we get out there and rate some of these streets, I think some of the rating wasn't picked up in terms of the distresses because of those patches are out there. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Bruce Mattson: Well the street ain't that bad. Paul Oehme: Okay. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Thank you Mr. Mattson. Councilwoman Tjornhom, do you have a question? Councilwoman Tjornhom: Mr. Oehme, when we talk about the street, do you have any idea in the springtime how much time we spend patching? Paul Oehme: Oh we're you know, just anticipating Crestview, you know I don't have the records with me and how much time was spent out there but you know annually our crews are out there basically from April, not on consistent basis but they're out there until you know September patching roads so we do have a significant program in the spring to address the potholes and the patching that are elevated or are apparent because of the winter months. We also patch during the summer months and then into the fall as well catching some of those smaller ones in some of the areas that we missed the first time around too so. You know it's a significant amount of time and resources that are put into patching roadways on an annual basis and you know as this whole street system ages we try to, we're trying to maintain that level of patching, if not try to reduce it a little bit. Adding more patching yearly you know we just get more complaints the longer streets are deteriorated and more patching, we get more calls about conditions of 20 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 roads and what not so we're trying to be aggressive in terms of you know repairing the streets before they get to the level of needing significant amount of patches in these neighborhoods. Councilwoman Tjornhom: And then to piggyback on that question, we've done in the past Laredo Drive and other streets similar to what we're doing now and how many patches do you think we do on those streets compared to say this neighborhood? Paul Oehme: Well after Laredo Drive was improved we haven't done any patching. Before that it was significantly more. Those streets had, were in the reconstruction area. Those are in worst condition than these were. These streets are in so that's why we're not going with a total reconstruction is just kind of a medium type of improvement with the mill and the overlay of the asphalt so. Does that answer your question? Councilwoman Tjornhom: I think so and then you said that this starts probably in April or May and goes until September with patching. Is that pretty typical with most neighborhoods in town or just this area specifically? Paul Oehme: No, I mean this is one of the worst areas. The resident mentioned Carver Beach. That's another area. Greenwood Shores. The neighborhoods north of Minnewashta. Lake Minnewashta. Those are some of our worst neighborhoods too. Those are all on the schedule to be improved in the next 10 years as well so there's a schedule for all those roads to be improved. You know Melody Hills just came up this year as, in the system as needing improvements and funding was available so. Mayor Furlong: I guess, oh I'm sorry. Go ahead. Councilwoman Tjornhom: No, I was done. Mayor Furlong: And I guess that's a question of Carver Beach area was mentioned and anyone who's driven in that area understands the conditions of those roads as well. If my memory's correct I think those are scheduled, we're looking at 2015 for the Carver Beach area. Greenwood Shores is one that we're looking at this summer as well. Help us understand and if you can, you say the 63 rating on Crestview is inflated. Do you have a sense based upon knowing what work has been done and how inflated it might be? Paul Oehme: Well I mean just based upon the other streets that were constructed or built at the same time. Same, were the same type of a base or the same type of pavement structure, you know I would envision Crestview Drive would be more in the Melody Hills and the, or Murray Hill area. You know in the 40's. Maybe upper 40 area if it wasn't patched as much so. Mayor Furlong: And what's the schedule if 100 is a brand new road and 0 is the dirt, gravel road, do you have a sense, and maybe you have a slide and maybe you don't but when do these come up and what's the reason for doing this type of project now versus waiting? Paul Oehme: Yep. The city staff looks at you know what are the needs of the entire neighborhood. How many watermain breaks have we had. Do we have any sanitary sewer, known sanitary sewer back -up issues or any storm sewer, major storm sewer issues. We will take that into consideration in terms of when we program these types of projects. For example Carver Beach Road, that's programmed out 2 more years because we know there's some significant utility work that has to be done in that neighborhood and you know this year we've got other utility improvements, projects programmed that we just, to get the costs in the CIP and funding levels to where we want them, you know those projects were just postponed a couple more years til they fit into the program so. 21 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Mayor Furlong: So I'm sorry. To understand that, there's utility work in the Carver Beach area that's not necessarily in this area? Paul Oehme: I think there's more. Mayor Furlong: Or there's more that's needed in that area? Paul Oehme: Correct, yeah exactly. There's more work on the watermain. There's more work with storm sewer. There's more work of sanitary work and those type of projects cost or exceed what we had budgeted for this year in terms of, for the overall project costs so that's why that streets are postponed a couple more years. Mayor Furlong: And we're going to do the streets and the utilities at the same time Paul Oehme: Exactly. Yep, exactly. Mayor Furlong: Rather than one one year and one two years later Paul Oehme: We always have to look at what is the overall budget for the year. What are the needs for the system and based upon you know our funding, based upon the needs, that's the way we program or propose these type of streets to be funded in which year so. Todd Gerhardt: Mayor, council, some of the surrounding roads that we're not suggesting to do at this time, Paul are kind of in the range of you know 70 to 80. I know Crestview Circle, I looked at that one today. That was in the 80 range. We're probably not going to be back in this neighborhood in the next 10 years so you know my guess Crestview Drive will probably be in the 40 rating within 5 years and we're not going to be back in this area for probably over 10 years and we're going to have to go in there and do additional patching, sealcoating. Even the neighbors have talked about the drainage is occurring down the middle of the road and that's typically not what you want to see. We want to get back out there and put some curb in. Be it just bituminous but directing that water away from the middle of the road and get it to crown. So it's on the border line but in 2 years when we go in and do Carver Beach, you don't want to come back over and do Crestview and do that small segment of a road. And the other ones in the neighborhood you're probably not going to do within minimum of 10 years if not longer. So there is some efficiencies of scale of trying to include this with the overall project where most of the roads are 29, 38, 46, 23, 46 so when you're in a neighborhood you like to kind of make it uniform. Not just for now but into the future that you have all your roads in one neighborhood trying to be addressed at the same time. But the neighbors are correct, they're at a 63. That's kind of the borderline and Paul is there a way that we can go back and evaluate that 63? Paul Oehme: Yep. Todd Gerhardt: Before the assessment hearing when we can really decide if it should be included or not. If it is got a good base underneath it you know that's something maybe we can come back and recommend to the council that maybe this could last and so I think we have some options here. Mayor Furlong: Okay, so that decision of including or excluding, if the rest of the neighborhood went forward, keeping it in tonight doesn't necessarily mean it will be in at the end? 22 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Todd Gerhardt: Correct. And we'll keep the neighbors abreast of what we're doing but if we can get back out there. Re- evaluate, you know if it's a short term 63 that was caused by a patch or the latest sealcoat you know, just do an evaluation of Crestview Drive in detail. Councilwoman Ernst: You know I do think that that would help us make a better decision too because on one hand we're hearing 63% and another hand we're hearing maybe 40 so if we could get a better understanding of what that really is, I think that would help us make a decision. Paul Oehme: Sure Councilwoman Ernst: Paul I do have, Mayor if I could, I'm sorry. Mayor Furlong: Yes, Councilwoman Ernst. Councilwoman Ernst: Do you, if we went back into this and hypothetically if we went back into this residential area and we did sealcoating, is there a way to take care of that drainage problem? Paul Oehme: Not with your normal sealcoats. It's just a fine coating of oil with the aggregate over the top of it. There's no way to crown the road or get the water to drain off of the road any better than it already is. Councilwoman Ernst: Right, yep and I heard you say that but I'm wondering if there's another way to take care of that drainage in that area as part of the project if we decide to go down that path? Paul Oehme: I mean. Councilwoman Ernst: Without the curb or the seal because I know... Paul Oehme: Right, I mean the other option too is just an overlay. Instead of milling it up, milling up the street you can overlay it and do some work that way to reduce some more costs. However you know with the amount of cracks and the amount of movement with the street we are hearing because of the underground water conditions, you know those cracks that are currently in the roadway, they're going to reflect through right away so you know there's some choices there. There's some benefits and drawbacks to going with that direction as well too. The roads probably wouldn't last as long either with, if you're only putting 2 inches, say an overlay over the top of it too so there's. Todd Gerhardt: There's some short term fixes that you can make but you're investing into a short term fix every 5 years and that's not what you want to do. Councilwoman Ernst: Right. No, but I do think that it is going to help when we get this rating with... Todd Gerhardt: Yeah, I think so too. Just take a good look and evaluate the road is our assumption that you know the sealcoating and the patching is what's inflated the 63 and do a better evaluation on that number and then bring that back when we talk about assessments and see if it should be included or not. Councilwoman Ernst: One last question. So when we take this out to bid, are we going to take this out to bid as just this project or are we going to include other projects as part of this? To reduce the cost. Paul Oehme: Sure, we're including the other neighborhoods in the contract. Into the bid documents. The ones we had previously talked about. 23 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Councilwoman Ernst: Yep Paul Oehme: Greenwood Shores. Those, that will all be let together but the assessments would be broken out separately for each individual neighborhood. Councilwoman Ernst: Right, but those are the only 3 that are included in here? Todd Gerhardt: Four. Councilwoman Ernst: Or 4, sorry. So you know where I'm going with this. You know how we do the, when we take something out to bid with our sister cities and we can lower our costs on our sealcoating projects, is this something that we could take out to bid that way with some of our, in collaboration to reduce those costs? Paul Oehme: Well yeah, you know it's a little bit tricky even if this, there is, this is approximately a $2 million dollar project right now. To lump it with other cities, I don't think you're going to get the benefit of scale if we include it with other cities in the area so I don't, plus there's logistical problems between communities too when those projects would be lumped together of this magnitude. Councilwoman Ernst: I would really like to know what those challenges would be if we did something like that and it may be that you know our project is the one that has the 80% higher than everyone else but it would just be good to know what that is. Paul Oehme: Sure. We can put that together. Mayor Furlong: The hearing is still open so I invite anyone else that would like to come forward and address the council. Okay. No one else? Alright, without objection then we'll close the public hearing and bring it back to staff, or excuse me. Back to council for comments. Thoughts and comments on the project. Councilman McDonald. Councilman McDonald: Yes Mr. Mayor, thank you. Mr. Oehme, can you give me some projections if we didn't do this project at all, what's going to be the impact? What does it look like? What are we going to have to do as far as you know maintenance? You can't just walk away from the streets or anything but what's going to happen? Tell me what's going to happen to these roads over time? Paul Oehme: Sure. You know pavement typically, when roads get to this age they deteriorate at a quicker pace so we would anticipate there would be more potholes. More distresses that we see in these neighborhoods. More that would typically in turn relate back to more complaints, More call out's. More costs in terms of city staff patching the potholes and not a good roadway system or roadway structure so you know we're not, we wouldn't be addressing the drainage issues that we had originally talked about that were brought to our attention through this process. We wouldn't be addressing some of the sanitary sewer issues that we know should be taking place so you know, like Mr. Gerhardt had indicated, these streets will deteriorate over time. 5 years you know is probably a good timeframe where we would see some significant deterioration of the streets. Councilman McDonald: Now when you talk about deterioration of streets, at what point does it get into the sub -base to the point where we're having to redo the entire sub -base? The road and everything from pretty much the dirt up. Paul Oehme: Yeah, when we're seeing a lot of alligator cracking. A lot of the distresses that you know that you can tell that you've got some problems with the underlying base when there's a lot of water or a 24 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 lot of moisture in the sub -base. That typically will decrease the strength of the streets and when heavy vehicles, garbage trucks, regular vehicles are running over those distressed areas they're going to be pumping and moving the sub -grade around and the asphalt around and that kind of distorts and goes out farther from it's point of original so it's going to migrate as time goes on so. Councilman McDonald: Okay so, and we don't do anything, what's the timeframe before you think that we could get back in here? I mean there's other roads within the city and I know they're all on a cycle as far as getting things fixed and you did elaborate today a little bit of what you look at, you know whether it's sewer or water or those kind of things because you've got a certain budget to work with there. What are we looking at, how bad could these roads actually get before we could go back in and fix them? Paul Oehme: Well right now we're, we've got, have about 10 years worth of streets that we've programmed and the next 5 years out are pretty set in stone. Out 10 years we're fairly confident in which streets we want to do so I would say you know in 10 years we would probably revisit this area. Councilman McDonald: Okay, so really this is a matter of opportunity. If we don't do it now, by the time we can get back around to doing it, it may be a lot more expensive to fix. Paul Oehme: Yep, it would be with inflation and cost of materials. Labor costs. Mayor Furlong: The scope of the project is going to be bigger. Paul Oehme: The scope of the project, correct. Mayor Furlong: Plus you have inflation on top of that. Councilman McDonald: Right because if you don't fix the sewer and the water problems, and you can't do those without really doing the road at this point because you've got to dig up around where the road is so if we don't fix that, at what point do we begin to have water and sewer problems because of deteriorating pipes or valves or. Paul Oehme: Right, and watermain breaks and, or gate valve breaks and those type of things so it's just a level of service issue as well. If you're not fixing them now, you know we're going to get complaints and typically Murphy's Law says a lot of these repairs are done at night and at the most inconvenient times so. Councilman McDonald: Okay, and we've heard very eloquently from a couple gentlemen tonight but you said that you've had neighborhood meetings. What's been the sentiment that comes out of the neighborhood meetings as far as these roads and what the residents would like us to do about it? Paul Oehme: Well I think overall I think the property owners you know have been receptive to the project. I think we had maybe 30, 35 people show up to the neighborhood meeting back in November. We have sent out 65 notices to the property owners in the area and we've had 2 or 3 comments so I think you know, it's hard to gauge I guess an overall evaluation but just based upon the comments I've had, I think and the level of maybe non - comments that we've had, you know I think people are in support of doing something out here. Councilman McDonald: Okay because without doing these fixes, I mean you are looking at property damage and escalating into bigger problems if the water and sewer begins to fail. Paul Oehme: Yep there, I mean we know there's some improvements that we need to make in the utilities out in this area and we'd like to do those improvements at this time. 25 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Councilman McDonald: Okay, thank you. I have no more questions Mayor Furlong: Any comments? Councilman McDonald: Well if you want comments, I'll start it off. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Councilman McDonald: You know this is about, I like doing this almost as much as I like going to the dentist and it's kind of the same reason. Every one of these projects has been very difficult. I mean we've heard from residents and you know I, the gentleman asked the question why am I paying taxes? Well 60% of that money pays for other roads so that's why you're paying for taxes. It's not that you're, we went to this system 10 years ago to be fair. We've looked at it a number of different ways. I'm always open, you give me a suggestion of a fairer way to fix roads and spread the cost around and we'll look at it because each year it comes up as part of our strategic initiatives but there isn't a better way. If you wanted to have no assessments, well the money's got to come from someplace so the only other choice we've got is to raise property taxes. People don't want to do that either so I think this is the fairest system right now that we can come up with. Again, I mean on that one street I've heard a lot of things today so it'll be, I'll reserve comment on that. I'll wait until you do the other assessment but if we don't fix the street now it's going to cost you more money in the long run because we'll be back out there fixing it here and there and at some point it's going to go over the edge to where it's going to be really expensive. I know that's small solace now at this point but I'm in favor of moving forward on this project. Every other project as I've said, we've heard the same thing and the economy's been the way it's been for the past 5 years. Every project that we have done, yes it effects the residents. They have to pay for this. That's why we came up with this approach of trying to finance this by only charging 2% over prime to give you a cheaper way to borrow the money. I guess having said that I'd be in favor of moving forward on the project. I'll reserve on the one particular road until you can get back to us but. Mayor Furlong: Okay, when we get more information, alright. Thank you Mr. McDonald. Other comments or questions? Councilwoman Tjornhom. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Tonight I think we're here as a council to decide if we're going to approve or make the orders to prepare the plans and specifications for the road and I think Mr. Sommer and Mr. Nikolai, I appreciate you coming and lending your opinions and comments and obviously hopefully you were heard because we're going to go back and assess to see if it is a 65 or it's a 40 or what the road truly is and so until we do that, you know there's not much more we can do to resolve your issues. I do agree that we should go ahead and do what we plan to do tonight to keep this project moving forward. I think we do a pretty good job as a city when it comes to maintaining and upkeeping our roads and this is just another neighborhood that it was time to do it. Everybody in the city will at some point be facing street improvements and I think so far the street improvements we've done in neighborhoods, the neighborhoods have been actually relatively happy with what's happened and so I think it's important that we do move forward yet we do take seriously your concerns and analyze Crestview a little bit more and see if it's premature or if it seems to make sense for the times that we're there right now so. Mayor Furlong: Okay, thank you. Councilwoman Ernst, thoughts. Comments. Councilwoman Ernst: I, you know I've heard from some of the residents, a couple of the residents who really want to move forward with the project but I've not heard anyone in favor or that has contacted me anyway, in terms of Crestview so I would also be in favor of moving forward with the project but waiting to see what the rating comes back for Crestview. So does, what does this, can you help me understand 26 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 what this means in terms of moving forward with the specifications? Does that mean that Crestview would not be part of that or, how do we do that? Mayor Furlong: I guess it was my sense that we'd keep all of them in right now but we're going to gather more information. Mr. Gerhardt was that, I shouldn't speak for you. Mr. Gerhardt. Todd Gerhardt: Yeah, we're going to include Crestview in the plans and specifications. We'd move ahead with that and when we bring back the assessment hearing and award of bid, at that time the council can decide to include Crestview or not and based on our analysis, additional analysis that we'll do at that time and give you a recommendation. Councilwoman Ernst: Okay. Todd Gerhardt: And we will keep the neighborhood involved with our research. Councilwoman Ernst: Okay, thank you. Mayor Furlong: And I guess the question, in terms of, because when it comes back to us the next time we'll have, it will have been out for bids? Is that correct? Paul Oehme: The next time. Mayor Furlong: Or the next time is, what's the next time that we would see it? Paul Oehme: Right, the next time that would be proposed that it come back to you would be February 25 to approve the plans and specs. You know once we. Todd Gerhardt: Okay, so we could. Mayor Furlong: And do we think we're going to have an answer within that timeframe? Paul Oehme: Yeah, absolutely. That was, yeah I was going to get to that. Mayor Furlong: On Crestview, or the additional information? Paul Oehme: Correct. On February, the first meeting in February we'll have that information for Crestview Road identified so at that time maybe we can discuss if we want to move forward with that section of street or not. Mayor Furlong: Continue to keep Crestview in or at that point consider not. Paul Oehme: Correct, yeah so, another 2 weeks or so. Councilwoman Ernst: Alright, thank you because as Mr. Gerhardt said it may make sense, depending on what that rating comes back as, it may make more sense to do it later. Todd Gerhardt: Yeah. Paul Oehme: Okay. Councilman McDonald: Mr. Mayor? 27 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Mayor Furlong: Yeah Councilman McDonald: Two things. If you're going to do the assessment of Crestview, also do the roads around it that aren't on the map tonight and also if we don't do Crestview, what does that do the assessment because now you're going to have fewer houses as part of that. Can you bring that back also? Paul Oehme: Okay. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Thank you. Councilman Laufenburger, thoughts. Comments. Councilman Laufenburger: Thank you Mr. Mayor. Thank you Mr. McDonald. That was my question too. If we're going to evaluate Crestview, let's look at some of those other roads because that may be appropriate to consider them too. I had just a couple questions Mr. Oehme. Last fall the council considered all the roads in the city and you gave a report that created essentially an average of the PCI and if I'm not mistaken, at that time the council considered steps to accelerate the process of transferring funds into the revolving assessment account, is that correct? Paul Oehme: That's correct Councilman Laufenburger: Okay, so historically we transfer a certain number of dollars but we had some dollars available to us, not from property taxes but from another source and the council elected to move, transfer some additional funds in there so that we could step up the road, the street improvement program, is that correct? Paul Oehme: That's correct. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. Was Melody Hill part of the original plan for 2013 or was it added as a result of those additional funds, do you recall? Paul Oehme: It was added as a result of those additional funds. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. So it was on the track. Paul Oehme: Correct. Councilman Laufenburger: But these additional funds, some of which were not property taxes, allowed us to move in to do this. What was the other, the other area that was added as a result of that? Paul Oehme: The Sandy Hook neighborhood and then also Indian Hills. Councilman Laufenburger: Cool. And then those funds are also going to make it possible for us to essentially double, double build in 2015, is that correct? Paul Oehme: That's correct too. More money from those dollars you had mentioned would be, go towards the Carver Beach area so in 2015 we have, the original plan was to do half of the Carver Beach area. Now that we have those additional funds we can do the entire Carver Beach all in one project. One contract. 28 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. And Mr. Oehme this may not be a question that I should address to you but you're there so I'm going to ask you anyway. You can defer to others but, the assessment of roughly $2,900, it's our practice to accept the payment of that assessment all in one, is that correct? Paul Oehme: That's correct. Councilman Laufenburger: If somebody wants to do that, they can. Paul Oehme: Or it can go on their taxes too. Councilman Laufenburger: Or it could go on their taxes for a period of how long? Paul Oehme: Eight years. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay, so have you calculated what the annual dollar impact of that assessment would be over 8 years at the interest rates? Paul Oehme: I don't have that with me. Councilman Laufenburger: I think it's about $400 Paul Oehme: $400, yeah. Councilman Laufenburger: Yeah, okay. Alright. Let's see. Okay, thank you Mr. Oehme. Mr. Mayor, I agree with the other council member's comments. I think Crestview, and I think perhaps we should review some of the other streets as Mr. McDonald suggested but I think that we, when we make decisions about the street improvements, we're making a decision about this neighborhood just as we make decisions about all of the neighborhoods and it's not just the people who live in that neighborhood that use those streets. I know that when our streets were redone in front of our home there were parts of it that looked just fine and I couldn't see why it needed to be done but in fact I'm glad that it was done because it improved not only the streets for the people who live there but also for the visitors who come into the community so I would, I would support this project contingent on the re- evaluation of Crestview and some of the other streets. Thank you Mr. Mayor. Mayor Furlong: Thank you. And my thoughts are similar to other members of the council. I think, I appreciate Mr. Gerhardt's suggestion of going back and getting more information so that we can, city staff can better respond to the resident's concerns about the need and personally I always appreciate the statements of need as much as questions about how the project would go about so I'm very attuned to that and if there is areas or roads that residents don't believe it is needed, I think we do need to get more information so thank you Mr. Gerhardt for your suggestion there and I'm glad that it's something that Mr. Oehme you think we can get quickly enough to make a decision and keep things moving forward but we have the flexibility just because we move forward with the neighborhood this evening we have the flexibility on that street to make adjustments if appropriate. With that being said I think moving forward tonight makes sense and all told I think as we look at our street maintenance projects over the years many of the issues are similar, as was mentioned earlier, but we still, and I think appropriately and what we're doing tonight, look at each neighborhood and each road individually. Not all of the residential streets in this neighborhood are included in this project because not all are warranted. Those that are included appear to me from personal observation as well as the information that staff has gathered from an objective pavement index standpoint seem to be at the point where it's appropriate to move forward with this project so I'm comfortable moving forward tonight. Looking forward to getting additional information on Crestview and then additional information as was suggested on some of those streets that 29 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 were not included, and Mr. Oehme I guess at that point we would certainly look to your thoughts and opinions as to best course of action and for the reasons that you see most appropriate so with that I am comfortable moving forward, as we have discussed this evening and would certainly entertain a motion at this time. Councilman Laufenburger. Councilman Laufenburger: Mr. Mayor, I move that. Mayor Furlong: Oh, you can second it if you want to. Councilman McDonald: I'll second it. Mayor Furlong: Why don't we have him make it first and then you can second it. It's a point of order thing. Councilman Laufenburger: Thank you Mr. Mayor. I move that the City Council orders preparation of plans and specifications for the 2013 Street Improvement Project 13 -10 -2 Melody Hill area. Councilman McDonald: I'll second. Mayor Furlong: Mr. McDonald, thank you. Motion's been made and seconded. And I think that's with the understanding of the additional information that we've requested. Any thoughts or comments or discussion on the motion? I will have one comment because I forgot to say it, thank you to the residents that came this evening and spoke to us. For those that sent the emails with their questions and thank you to staff for getting us those comments as well. There were some others in the packet and for everybody that came out to the open house, we appreciate you coming and getting involved and helping whatever happens here or doesn't happen here, make sure that it's the right thing to do. So with that if there's no other comments, we'll proceed with the vote. Resolution #2013 -05: Councilman Laufenburger moved, Councilman McDonald seconded that the City Council orders the preparation of plans and specifications for the 2013 Street Improvement Project 13 -01 -2, Melody Hill area. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 5 to 0. PRESERVE AT RICE LARK, LOCATED SOUTH OF WEST 86 STREET, APPLICANT: JOHN KNOBLAUCH: REQUEST FOR CONCEPT PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPMENT (PUD) FOR A 15 LOT SINGLE FAMILY DEVELOPMENT ON 13.2 ACRES OF PROPERTY CURRENTLY ZONED RSF- SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL AND R4 -MIXED LOW DENSITY RESIDENTIAL. Kate Aanenson: Thank you Mayor, members of the City Council. The application, as you mentioned is from Mr. Knoblauch. Preserve at Rice Marsh. This item, the applicant did hold a neighborhood meeting back in January 12 and then on Tuesday, January 15' the Planning Commission held a public hearing. This is our second experience in our new revised PUD process. As we go through it we did a detailed report as we do to again to set the course of action not only for what the staff will be reviewing but also to put the applicant on notice of the regulatory things that they must follow to go through that. Again the PUD concept has no legal standing but again in good faith we're trying to give the direction to the applicant to the right course of action. As his application was submitted has gone through several iterations and I think we finally arrived at what we believe, the staff believes is the right course. At the Planning Commission hearing on January 15 they also concurred that they think the direction that we're going to recommend, had recommended is also the right course and while there's a lot of details in the staff report, I'll go through the power point I think to kind of explain kind of the history of this property. 30 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 So again this property gets access off of West 86 Street. This property here. The Mission Hills piece was actually guided for mixed use and this property here is still vacant but the access then would come through the Mission Hills, which is a medium density. Mayor Furlong: Excuse me Ms. Aanenson, are you looking at something on your screen? Kate Aanenson: Oh I'm sorry. Paul turned it off. I'm sorry, Paul turned it off. Thank you. Mayor Furlong: Now it'll be easier for us to follow. Kate Aanenson: That's right, I'm looking at something. Mayor Furlong: Yeah, and I'm sure it was exactly what you were talking about. Kate Aanenson: Paul and I need to work out our buddy system. So anyway so yeah, we get so this property is vacant and then coming off of West 86 Street getting access to the property so this piece is actually surrounded by a couple different land uses. We've got large lot coming off of Tigua Lane and then also the Marsh Glen neighborhood that comes, has direct access with a right out onto 101. So this area was able to develop before we did the realignment of 101 so all access was gained there and some of it's changed now with the 212, and I'll go through that in a minute. Existing land use is actually guided for low density and the low density allows for 1 to 4 units an acre. And the zoning on the site is actually dual guided. Dual zones. Actually it's low density, so that would allow twinhomes and then single family residential for single family development. The complexity comes in on this piece of property, this site looking at it in 2005 prior to 212 being built. You can see the Mission Hills was put in place. The large lots on Tigua were in place and then the Marsh Glen neighborhood. This was all one piece with the original farmstead here and then you see with the development of the 212 it actually moved that property and cut it in half. So you ended up with the parcel split as such so now you have this piece. The pedimus to this piece are that the existing conditions are that the parcel, you know the 212 segment. What you could have balanced on the site was less, with less flexibility. It's within the shoreland district of Rice Marsh Lake which is 1,000 feet. While it's not riparian lots it does still fall within the shoreland district. There are wetlands on the site, which you can see here. And then just to point out again the DNR has jurisdiction over the, for doing a PUD and our ordinance just for the PUD section of the shoreland regs would go through the DNR so whatever approval we would give is still subject to their jurisdictional review. This is a buildable parcel. Access would be gained via West 86 Street. There was residents at the Planning Commission meeting and we did attach some of their emails that came through that were concerned about this and the layout as proposed, we didn't spend a lot of time reviewing the layout, and I'll go through that in a minute but really the goal here is to decide what the appropriate course of action would be. The closest home, proposed home on this proposed plat would be within 250 feet of the closest home here or the existing home here. So this is all a buildable area. Access would come through this wetland. Some of the neighbors at the Planning Commission asked that the road be moved over but that impacts the wetland more. We're actually kind of going through the existing part of the property that there's a conveyance. The issue with the low density zoning district, as our ordinance moved forward, it's more prescriptive in the minimum lot size and the minimum lot width so because the applicant is desiring to do a low density development, as you can see here. So with the shoreland district, low density is prescriptive in the lot width requirements and so in order to accommodate the single family detached, what we do believe is, what the applicant wants to do and we do believe is a desirable use for this site as opposed to the twinhomes, that we would have to actually upzone the property. Go to a medium density to allow the flexibility of the minimum lot size and still stay within that range. And having said that, you have to meet the minimum 4 units an acre in order to qualify for that so that would mean to get to the 16 homes, which we believe can be accomplished. 31 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Mayor Furlong: Ms. Aanenson? Kate Aanenson: Yes. Mayor Furlong: Question for you on the, if you go back to the last slide. What's that shaded area? Kate Aanenson: I'm sorry, I'm going the other way. Mayor Furlong: Other way. Kate Aanenson: Can you move it back? One more. Go the other way. Mayor Furlong: Yeah, the shaded area there, you said that's the. Kate Aanenson: That's the shoreland district. Mayor Furlong: Shoreline district. And what's the distance, is that the distance from the shore of the lake? Kate Aanenson: 1,000 feet from the ordinary high water mark. Mayor Furlong: 1,000 feet, so that's quite a distance Kate Aanenson: Yep. Yeah, there's actually tiers within the, the first tier within the shoreland district doesn't fall on this property. The first tier would be somewhere in this area here. The way the DNR has the shoreland regs set up under that is their goal is to try to transfer that density. Our ordinance under the low density can't accommodate that. Mayor Furlong: Can or cannot? Kate Aanenson: Cannot. We don't have that tool put in place the way our ordinance, the rules that we have in place in our low density single family which is why we're recommending going to the medium density zoning district. Did I answer that question? Mayor Furlong: Nope and that's fine. Let's keep going. I'll have other questions after. Kate Aanenson: So again when we're looking at the zoning district and what would be appropriate application we always ask the developer what's their desire for housing on the site to make sure it can accommodate because our goal is always to make sure, when we have a resident on a piece of property that the lot size is big enough to accommodate needs in the future, whether it be a patio. Some additional things that they may want to put out in their yard. A storage barn or the like, we want to make sure the lots are big enough. In this circumstance the applicant is a little bit challenged on some of those and that's where we want to make sure, we didn't give a lot of review to the proposed site plan because we believe that moderations or modifications can be made going to lower density which allow a little bit smaller lot size. For example in the PUD would allow for the 50 foot right -of -way. As such so this area here would be, this right -of -way would be 50 feet. It also allows for the 5 and the 10 foot side yard setbacks, which we have used in other medium density, and then allowing the lots to go smaller. There is no minimum lot size but would be dictated by the home size that the applicant has demonstrated so while we haven't actually done through the details on all of these lots, we do believe that these 16 lots can be accommodated with modifications. Again this isn't showing you the wetland buffer. We do allow averaging for the buffering. There is some anomalies on the site. And while you showed this colored 32 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 drawing, I just want to show it for the illustrative showing the wetland and the buffering. These can be averaged to make sure that we do have enough lot area but that's the goal we want to make sure a future resident has a big enough lot area to accommodate future needs for expansion and livability of their site. Mayor Furlong: Could you expound upon that a little bit? Kate Aanenson: Sure. You have a building envelope on every lot. The PUD allows you to take, to accommodate some of this other open space to, for your green space area. But having said that you still need to have a building envelope that allows some expansion, whether it be a deck, a yard barn, a swing set, a dog run, those sort of things that you're outside of the buffer wetland requirement setbacks. Again that would be under the DNR's jurisdiction to find where those are but based on our ordinance we can average some of this buffering to make that work. Again the goal, trying to match both goals, what we believe for the land use, which we said before, low density. It meets that but because our PUD ordinance doesn't match the DNR regulations we need to change it to a medium density. Still allowing for that single family and the low end of the medium density, as I mentioned before, is 4 units an acre and that would accomplish this and we have to stay within that 4, which also under the low density the highest you would go is 4 so we're still at that 4 units an acre. Again 50% of the site pretty much would be left in open space and would accommodate that. We did put in the staff report other things that would need to be accomplished with this project would also include a sound wall along Highway 5. Councilman Laufenburger: 212. Kate Aanenson: Excuse me, 212. Thank you. And then the trail connection. Yeah, that'd be a long ways away. Yeah. So again trying to match the developer's goals and what the City had originally envisioned on this which was a lower density single family, taking into account the separation of this property by 212 and to allow for that so we would, we had recommended going to the medium density. The concern that I think we talked about and shoreland staff, what if this project went away. Would you want townhouses on there if you went with the medium density so we could always go back and go with dual guiding which would say low or medium if this project did go away for whatever reasons. If another project came back that would give you discretion of what land use you would want to pick so again we believe under that PUD, you know the goal of the developer was you know trying to do a single family detached. The City's goal is to save as many natural features on the site and following regulations with the DNR. Again we have the discretion, the City has the discretion to amend the Comprehensive Plan. We're still within that 4 units an acre, following with that single family detached we believe that meets that what we're doing is trying to find the mechanism, the tool, the right track to allow this project to proceed. So with that I'd be happy to answer any questions you have but we are recommending that the process would be then if you give some direction the developer would then come back through. It does require a land use amendment. Would have to come back through another public hearing. Meeting all the requirements of the City's zoning ordinance, the DNR regulations, etc. Mayor Furlong: Okay, thank you. Questions for staff. Mr. McDonald. Councilman McDonald: Okay I have a really dumb question but I've got to ask it. Can you put that map back up there that shows the development again? Yeah, I think it's back. Yep, that one. Okay you said that the DNR has some control over this because of shoreline and everything but yet where that's located there's already houses above it. Why would, what's the problem because? Kate Aanenson: Can you go back to the shoreland, go back one more. It's this one right here. Yeah, the shoreland district itself when you're doing a PUD, they have jurisdiction. We have a shoreland ordinance in our code. We do it for the PUD within the shoreland district they felt that we didn't address it so they're within 1,000 feet of Rice Marsh, which is where this line here is. There's jurisdiction by the DNR 33 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 with what happens in there and really their goal under that is really to transfer things out and so if it was their goal it would be more of a multi - family potential project and outside that first tier, which they're outside of but they would cluster that. Mayor Furlong: When you say, they would like development outside of the shaded area? Kate Aanenson: Every tier you go outside of you can transfer density, which is what we're doing. We're keeping it at a lower scale so we're meeting those criteria by making the smaller lots, and that's their goal is to have more in preservation. Councilman McDonald: Okay so we're putting more units per acre. Kate Aanenson: We're really not. We're actually doing the same project the developer had, we just have to up zone it because our ordinance under the low density is prescriptive as far as 90 foot of frontage, 15,000 square feet. In the medium density our ordinance allows you to go to, there's the freedom to decide what lot size you need so what we ask the applicant to say is, what house size were you doing? We want to make sure the lot matches the desired house size and that we have a reasonable lot size to match the house and what a resident's expectations would be. Councilman McDonald: Okay, and that would come in with the 25% impervious surface to make sure. Kate Aanenson: Yep, it's actually would be 30% but you can account for that with all of the other, that's the other thing with the PUD, what's being preserved in the upland area. Anything else that would be in the upland area which there is some areas that are left out would be counted towards that. Councilman McDonald: Okay, and then because this is within 1,000 feet and the other developments also, what problems did we have with those developments? Was there anything special that happened there with the? Kate Aanenson: It only comes into place when you're doing this, in this circumstance, the PUD Councilman McDonald: Oh okay. So it didn't come into effect in the other developments. Kate Aanenson: Yes, if we go back and look what we did on the south side of the Lennar project on Lake Riley, those first lots that were adjacent to Lake Riley actually fell within the shoreland district there. They did an RLM zoning district. What the RLM says you also have to preserve something so they created a park and they also preserved some additional property in order to accommodate or to secure the RLM zoning district? They met the intent of our ordinance which is what this property is trying to do. Councilman McDonald: Okay, and then. Kate Aanenson: So what they did then is those lots that fell within the shoreland district, by that zoning district had to meet the 90 foot of frontage and 15,000 square feet. Then the rest of the lots could go smaller under the RLM zoning district. In this circumstance, because the street right -of -way, we want to try to pinch that through the wetlands and some of those other things under the PUD ordinance which this allows us to do, to get the 50 foot of right -of -way, our ordinance allows you to go to a 5 and 10 foot setback on the sides and also a 25 foot front yard setbacks so it's built in the flexibility, which we've applied in other zoning districts to make it buildable so what we've done is created a zoning district to still get the same product that the applicant wanted. A 16 lot subdivision. Councilman McDonald: Okay 34 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Todd Gerhardt: Mayor, council, as you look at this slide, don't look at it as wherever it's shaded light green you can't develop in that area. What the shading is telling you, anything within that area has to follow the shoreland district regulations so you can still develop. You can put homes in there. You just need to meet the setbacks that were established in that shoreland district. It's not that you can't develop in that area, you just need to meet those requirements and that's where Kate will show you the slide with the multi - colors shows you those different setbacks. Kate Aanenson: Right. So those are the buffer areas around the wetlands and so you can see, again this isn't the project that's going. We've seen numerous iterations so I don't want anybody to be hung up on any particular project. It's going to meet our ordinance but this is just for illustrative purposes to show you that some of these lots have bigger rear yards. Some of them have less so you can average some of the buffering which our ordinance allows but what we're recommending and challenging is that we want to make sure those lots work and provide adequate rear yards for somebody into the future, which we believe through the tweaking of the development, oops. As shown here on this one. This one has 16 with some minor tweaks to this one we believe that project will meet the original intent to get 16 lots. We just needed to change the, the zoning on it. In order to change the zoning we needed to change the land use designation. Councilman McDonald: Okay so impervious surface then, because it's a PUD, we can average that across the entire development. Kate Aanenson: Exactly. Todd Gerhardt: And Mayor, council, that would allow each of the lots to put a deck in the back yard. If somebody wanted to put an accessory building in the back yard. A pool, we'd have to work with. That's going to be a little tough. Councilman McDonald: It'd fill itself Todd Gerhardt: Yeah, and but from staff's perspective you could do this under a single family development. If you went with a twin home development, more than likely you probably wouldn't see the accessory buildings in the back yard. You don't see the variety in decks or play structures usually with a twin home development and your setbacks are a little different with twin homes. You probably see more density here than what's being proposed with the twin home so staff is asking for direction from council if they prefer to see single family development versus more of a twin home, townhouse type. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Councilman McDonald: Thank you for answering the question. At least that explained that part of it so thank you. Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Any other questions for staff at this time? Mr. Laufenburger. Councilman Laufenburger: Thank you Mr. Mayor. Kate, could you talk a little bit about why the road is in this, or why the access point off 86 is here versus what appears to be a shorter distance. Mayor Furlong: Off the curve? Councilman Laufenburger: Yeah, off the curve where the red car is. 35 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Kate Aanenson: Sure. Councilman Laufenburger: Can you just speak to that a little bit Kate Aanenson: Yes, in reviewing that, you're coming through a larger segment of the wetland. All this area here is actual, is wetland. Coming through here you're actually coming through an area that's not a wetland so less impacts to the wetland. Councilman Laufenburger: So it would impact the wetland less? Kate Aanenson: That's correct. Councilman Laufenburger: So there would still be wetland adjustments that would have to be made, is that correct? Kate Aanenson: Yes, right. And what we're recommending and the feedback we've got from the DNR is the only impacts to this site for wetlands would be for the road itself and that would be one place and then maybe up in here would be the only other place would be impacts to wetlands for roads. A cul -de -sac. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. The second question relates to the DNR. The way you explained it earlier on you said that the DNR kind of has trumping authority over this. Can you just explain that a little bit. What jurisdiction, if the council says yep, this looks like a pretty good plan with this concept PUD. Let's go to the next step. What role does the DNR play and what could, how might they act? Kate Aanenson: Good question. As with any other project we always send it out for jurisdictional review. Whether it would be, under this circumstance MnDOT because it's adjacent to 212. And then because our PUD ordinance is, doesn't address some of these issues with the single family part of it, the DNR does have jurisdiction on that and under the shoreland regulations so when we get a project that, meets our city ordinance then we'll send it out. When it comes in for an application for jurisdictional review. At the same time we would send it up to the Met Council for, get their comments on a land use amendment. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay, and do we have any history of what happens when we submit these for other jurisdictional review? Kate Aanenson: Yes, we've actually sat down, well actually we've had numerous phone conversations to make sure that we're in alignment. We don't want to go down a course of action that we believe is not going to go anywhere so we believe that we're meeting the intent of what the DNR is trying to do and we also believe that the land use amendment is keeping with the spirit of the underlying zoning district that we had before which is single family detached housing. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay, thank you Kate. Thank you Mr. Mayor. Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Any other questions? If not, Mr. Knoblauch, the applicant is here this evening. Good evening Mr. Knoblauch. John Knoblauch: Good evening Mayor, council. I'm John Knoblauch, 1450 Knob Hill Lane, Chanhassen, Minnesota. Proposing a 16 lot development on the Klingelhutz parcel north of 212. This, can we go back to the other drawing there with the, this is the most recent sketch if you will that we've come up with. My engineer, this is the actually the eleventh drawing that he's made. We've actually been, had 6 different small, short meetings with Terry from engineering staff to try to address these 36 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 wetlands and buffers as best as possible to present a plan that will meet or exceed any ordinances or DNR issues. We think this recent drawing is a very nice drawing for single family for this parcel. It addresses, the lot sizes in this drawing are all over 10,000 square feet. Right now in Shakopee I've been building on 8,900 to 9,400 with this same house plan. This drawing also does show 8 foot setbacks on the garage side instead of 5. I'm really not a big fan of 5 foot garage side yard setbacks. Just for getting your mower into the back yard. If you have any edging or anything like that. I don't foresee this property, I definitely would develop some pretty serious covenants for these neighbors and address issues like possible pools. I don't see problems with these homes, I don't this price range probably not going to see a lot of pool issues I don't think but as far as decks, we have drawn some decks on these proposed house pads. We are definitely seeing smaller decks in the marketplace right now. Basically a grilling deck, some chairs and so forth. We're not seeing the monster decks of the 80's and 70's on the back of homes. A lot of decks people prefer them actually now not blocking windows in the back of the homes. We're doing a lot of decks behind the garage which has become very popular so people have better view out the back. I do plan to, I know that there'll be a landscaping plan in the event that this concept plan came forward down the line in front of your desks but I am proposing a tree plan that will be very extensive. There's a number of cedar trees east of the tree line in the middle of the property that I would propose to hopefully be able to be moved. I think there's about 30 or 40 of them. We'd like to heavily tree the perimeter. This whole property. And obviously along MnDOT's or the property line that abuts MnDOT's line. Also leave the open space to the east, which would be a nice setting in the back of the homes to the end of the cul -de -sac. And as far as the buffers go, yeah we would definitely be looking at some kind of wildflower plantings in all the buffer areas and feel that we can address that with the homeowners to make sure there's obviously signage restrictions and to keep people out of those areas. So we're asking for you to look hard at this medium density proposal. This property's 13.2 acres. We're only proposing 4, is it 4? Kate Aanenson: Yeah, less than half John Knoblauch: Yeah, less than half to go into development for these lots and feel it's the best use for this parcel. Thank you. Mayor Furlong: Okay, thank you. Questions for Mr. Knoblauch. Mr. McDonald. Councilman McDonald: Ms. Aanenson mentioned something way back when about a sound wall. What are you proposing to put up? Similar to what MnDOT put up you know for the rest of the development or something else? John Knoblauch: Yeah, right now to the southwest corner of this parcel the townhome sound wall ends right at the property line. It's a, and it's about a 7 foot tall for maybe 20 -30 feet at that point. We're proposing from, to connect to that and have an 8 foot sound wall on top of the berms. There's two berms. Very, very large berm that's on the south side and then those, the treed berm to the southeast. We're propose an 8 foot sound wall across both those berms. Unfortunately we've got a pretty deep hole where that one wetland area touches. It doesn't actually a wetland area. It doesn't go into MnDOT property very much. Unfortunately there would be about a 20 foot sound wall to patch that hole and connect the two berms. And we are proposing that that would be straight across hopefully as long as MnDOT would allow that. I've been told by one of the MnDOT staff they would allow up to 20 feet there. Councilman McDonald: Okay, so the wall would be 20 feet high at that one spot. John Knoblauch: It's about 60 feet, 20 feet wide. Or 20 feet high and then it's 1,150 foot wall from tip to tip. And there's about 60 feet of it only that would be the high wall. Most of it would be that 8 foot. Now we haven't done a formal, well there was a preliminary noise study done by a previous, well actually I don't think they went to, they didn't get an, they actually did some previous studies last year on this and 37 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 they were proposing a 6 foot wall which put the top of the walls at about 3 feet below soffit heights of those homes. We've actually checked a lot of elevations out there to make sure because I developed, I built some homes in Shakopee and to my dismay the developer did not put in a sound wall and it was incredibly disappointing and so we had a lot of sound problems. We were on the south side of the road, which is even worst when you got the wind direction, our dominant winds coming from the northwest. This parcel being on the north side will help but the 8 foot wall will definitely work well. The berm and the 8 foot wall, we'll have a 921, I'm sorry 923 elevation and the pond, the bottom of that pond to the right is at 896 so we feel that we give a lot of noise protection to the whole area, not just these homes. Councilman McDonald: So you'll have a consistent height then tying in with the sound wall that's by the townhomes and everything going across. And will that be at the same height as that other wall or will it be a couple feet below it? John Knoblauch: The existing townhome wall right now where we have connected is at 7 foot for maybe 20 feet. Then it goes to 8 and then it gets higher but they're not on quite as much a berm as this berm that was built here so. Kate Aanenson: If I may, they're going to do a noise study. We've got one kind of and so we'll look at that. Whether or not it needs to be a certain height in certain areas. We'll look at that. There's ways to modify it. We had to do it on the other side of the with the Lennar project on Reflections. There was some modification made there so we'll look at that to see what needs to be done to make it work and there might be some flexibility in certain parts but again the goal is to provide the noise mitigation, which is what Mr. Knoblauch wants to do so. John Knoblauch: Yeah I would mention that Lennar cut their wall short and only has chain link and they've got direct sound coming right from 101 intersection and northwest wind blows right into that neighborhood. This would be much more protection than what they've got. Mayor Furlong: Okay, other questions for Mr. Knoblauch? Councilwoman Ernst. Councilwoman Ernst: Couple questions. Can you, so these homes are going to be 1,500 square feet, is that correct? On an average. John Knoblauch: The home that's been sketched on about over half the lots actually is a two story home and it's about 1,400 square foot per level there so that's a 2,800 square foot two story. I believe originally I told staff that we would be hoping in that 2,500 to 3,000 square foot, two story home range. The garage, actually the drawings that you have are actually over sized by 2 feet from what I normally do. Those are 30 foot garage drawings. Just in case someone wanted a 9 foot, third stall door so I've drawn them 2 feet bigger than in this sketch here than I normally have built before on a 28 foot wide garage. We built a garage like this a lot where there's a little bit of room for storage in the back, either work bench and so forth so that's why the bump back area there 4 feet in the back, but no these would be two story homes mostly because you know we're proposing a 52 to 54 foot pad and as a result ramblers a little tougher to work with. Not a lot of curb appeal unfortunately in a 54 foot rambler but we wouldn't say that we wouldn't build any ramblers but chances are it'd be mostly two stories. Councilwoman Ernst: Okay and you mentioned the price range. Can you give me an idea of what the price range would, is going to be? It may have been in your report Kate but I didn't get through the whole thing so. 38 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 John Knoblauch: Total of the home and lot package that would go in this neighborhood for instance would be probably similar to across the street at Lennar or your other projects, Pioneer Pass and LDK's project. Be very similar. $400,000 to $500,000 I would say total package. Councilwoman Ernst: Okay. And Kate, I have a question for you. So when we originally talked about PUD's I thought that the requirement was that they had to have a 30 foot setback but it sounds like. Kate Aanenson: Nope, our PUD ordinance, it's in the findings, our PUD ordinance does allow the flexibility to go to do the narrower side yards and then it also allows you, under the PUD, to do a 25 foot front yard setback. Councilwoman Ernst: Okay. So this one is intended to be a 25? Kate Aanenson: Correct. John Knoblauch: That's correct. The new drawing, the last drawing that was up there shows 25 the front yard setback and by the way just to mention patios and decks again, we are again seeing very small decks. We're seeing a lot of patio, free standing patios. Fire pits. We're not seeing the old style patios as much in the last 5 to 10 years so we presume that will be, follow through in this development if this went forward. Councilwoman Ernst: Okay, thank you. Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Mr. Laufenburger, questions. Councilman Laufenburger: Yeah thank you Mr. Mayor. Mr. Knoblauch, nice to have you here tonight. We always like to consider developments in the community. What's the length of the road from 86 I to the end of the cul -de -sac, do you know? John Knoblauch: You know I don't. I know that. Councilman Laufenburger: Maybe Kate knows. Kate Aanenson: It's over 800 feet which is our normal. Councilman Laufenburger: It's over 800 feet. Kate Aanenson: Yeah. John Knoblauch: It's going to be over the, yeah I think it's 1,300 Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. Okay. John Knoblauch: And this path, as you can see, the dark line on the bottom is a sidewalk proposal. 5 foot sidewalk and I believe the park, Todd might be able to, they're looking for a I think an 8 foot blacktop path from, coming off the cul -de -sac to service into the Rice Lake trail connection. Councilman Laufenburger: I noticed that too and that was my next comment so the plan would be, you would provide, you would build that trail connection to the Rice Lake Marsh trail, is that correct? 39 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 John Knoblauch: Yeah, my understanding with Todd was that I was providing the concrete sidewalk but there was budget allowed in the Rice Marsh trail to pay for the blacktopping as long as I think we prepped it to pay for the blacktopping to get to the MnDOT parcel. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay, well I'm sure you can work that out but I'm pleased to see that there's a connection there. Do you have any room for any kind of a, any kind of an outlot like a central park area. I noticed that this, the closest park would be a mile away which exceeds our Comprehensive Plan so do you have any thoughts or any plans for any kind of an outlot? John Knoblauch: Not on this parcel. You know unfortunately with, there's just not a lot of high ground with the 5 or 6 wetlands and so you know staff has said you know we really need to be very restrictive and. Councilman Laufenburger: So this is part of the covenants that you're planning to have in place for the homeowners? John Knoblauch: No, not necessarily. I'm just saying that the wetlands are very restrictive as far as having some other open. There is an open area outlot. Kate Aanenson: Outlot A, yeah. John Knoblauch: To the east. That was at least my impression from the parks department was that was going to be open space left open. Kate Aanenson: So that's all this area here John Knoblauch: And as far as parks go, I really see these folks heavily using this 3 mile Rice Lake trail. You know I understand that there's a distance from over, is it a mile? From the nearest park but I see this being very desirable for a walker or a hiker that would want to go around that whole marsh which is going to be a very neat trail for the city. Councilman Laufenburger: Sure, okay. Thank you Mr. Mayor. Mayor Furlong: Thank you. I guess to follow up Mr. Hoffman too, parks or access for the other homes in the neighbor, in the adjoining neighborhoods. Typically what parks they use with the trail system I guess, they can get over to Lake Susan or up to Rice Marsh. Todd Hoffman: Yeah the closest city parks are Lake Susan Park and then Rice Marsh Lake Park. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Todd Hoffman: But as the crow flies it's about a half mile so this neighborhood would fit within that neighborhood park service area but once you get on the city trail system to get there it's just about a mile. Mayor Furlong: Okay. With this connection for these homes and we're actually looking at the Rice Marsh trail connection which is I think further north of here, that's going to provide better access for all these, for everyone that lives in these areas. Todd Hoffman: It will. Mayor Furlong: Either one 40 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Todd Hoffman: To have connection to that 3 mile trail loop, like Mr. Knoblauch said is going to be a tremendous valuable connection. Recreational amenity to these neighbors. Mayor Furlong: Okay, thank you. Mr. Knoblauch, just a couple questions. I think we clarified here with Councilwoman Ernst that you're looking at probably 2,800 square feet on average for the homes, the two story homes. The 10,000 foot lots. Is it your sense that with the current guiding or zoning of low density, Kate's saying, Ms. Aanenson's saying let's use the PUD. Let's move it to medium density to give us the flexibility. Is that, are you in agreement with that? Is that something that you think makes sense for what you're trying to accomplish here? John Knoblauch: Well the neat thing that that does, it brings the lot size down but it definitely gives more protection to the wetlands which you know I'm a big duck hunter so obviously wetlands are important in my book but I think that's the important thing is it pulls those lots, I mean we could make 12,000 square foot lots and have these people out dabbling in these areas but it wouldn't meet the, the medium density drives us to bring those lot lines back so that we keep those people out of those areas in my opinion and they enjoy the view. They don't, out there not mowing around and it also gives the city a lot of flexibility in my opinion, because of the drainage on the north side of the property, in the springtime you get some drainage through there and that will keep people from disrupting that possibility too. Mayor Furlong: So with, and maybe back and forth between Mr. Knoblauch and Ms. Aanenson, so with the suggestion of going to a medium density with the PUD, is that going to accomplish what you were asking for in terms of the use of the lots or the expected use of the lots for these sized homes and these size lots? Kate Aanenson: Correct. So we're meeting the desire of the developer to do single family. Mayor Furlong: Yep. Kate Aanenson: It gives the right tool to allow for the smaller lot by up zoning so I think we, and preservation so it really is kind of a. Mayor Furlong: So it meets everybody's objective. Kate Aanenson: Exactly, everybody's objectives. Mayor Furlong: And goals. Okay. Alright. Okay, very good. Thank you. Any other questions for Mr. Knoblauch? Very good, thanks. John Knoblauch: Thank you. Mayor Furlong: I know there was a public hearing at the Planning Commission. I don't know if there's anyone here that would like to provide public comments but if there's anyone, we have read the Minutes of the Planning Commission meeting but if you'd like to provide some comments, we'd be happy to listen. Good evening. Carol Lahto: Hi. My name's Carol Lahto. I live at 8591 Tigua Lane, so we are the green roofed house there at the end. Kate Aanenson: This one? 41 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Carol Lahto: Yep. That's us Kate Aanenson: Okay. Carol Lahto: As far as the development, I understand that this property will be developed by somebody. With that said I would suggest doing single family homes. I think at the meeting two weeks ago other people who lived in the townhouse development were here and some of their concerns were traffic. You know when and if you have a bunch of twin homes, sorry. I'm nervous, can you tell? Mayor Furlong: That's okay. You're doing fine. You're doing fine. Carol Lahto: There'll be more you know cars, more people in that area. One concern I do have is that by our driveway, 2 years ago we had a lot of rain and we actually had water coming up from that wetland. Enough that I thought we need flood insurance because it was creeping up so it's just one of the concerns I have with development, to make sure that you think about drainage and take that into consideration. Mayor Furlong: And could you just clarify. Maybe the driveway goes under the trees there. Do you share a driveway with the house to the west there? Carol Lahto: Yeah. It goes out and then it goes into the corner. Kind of that open spot Mayor Furlong: Okay. Carol Lahto: So that would be one of my concerns. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Okay. And I guess then the question would be. Kate Aanenson: We'll check that but there is a storm water pond being proposed in that area so we'll make sure we include that in the calculations to accommodate. Mayor Furlong: Can you show where that is? Kate Aanenson: Yeah. There's a proposed storm water pond right here. So right now it's just sheet flowing that way so we would look at that and make sure that, in the analysis of this project that we make sure we look at what's coming this way to your property and they have to maintain that on their property. Carol Lahto: Okay. Mayor Furlong: And the water flows towards the lake here so it flows to the northwest? Kate Aanenson: Yes, exactly. So we'd make sure that this pond is, proposed pond is sized appropriately so it's not going towards their property. Mayor Furlong: Okay. I'm sorry. Councilman Laufenburger: Carol, that's your own private driveway, is that correct? So you maintain from 86 the road that goes past the home to your house, that's a private road, is that correct? Carol Lahto: Yes. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. Thank you. 42 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Kate Aanenson: And I would say too, just to remind everybody that's listening to this that this project would come back for another complete public hearing so we'll make sure that, you know if we haven't answered that, please make sure that you ask that again and all those questions are addressed as far as we would with any other subdivision. Carol Lahto: Okay, thank you. Mayor Furlong: Alright, thank you. Steve Lahto: I'm Steve Lahto and I happen to live with Carol at 8591 Tigua. One question I had Mr. Mayor and council, is the proposed change from low to medium density, would that mean if this particular plan were to fall through that two plots of land which are now zoned differently would now share the same zoning and therefore be able to have townhomes or twin homes on both of those properties where now it's just zoned for single family? Mayor Furlong: Ms. Aanenson. Kate Aanenson: That's a good question. I had to train the city attorney, Mr. Knutson on this issue but I think I was the first one to kind of recommend dual guiding and that's what we were suggesting on this one. That we'd actually still dual guide it. Keep it low density so if this project was to go away, this could would have the discretion, let's say we rezoned it or re- guided it and then the developer chose sometime down the future not to execute, then that project went away, another project would have to come back through the process and at that time this council would have the discretion to say you know what, we still want to keep it low density or change their mind and not have to go with 8 units per acre project. Steve Lahto: Excellent, thank you. Mayor Furlong: So provides flexibility and we're not making any decision for guiding tonight, correct? Kate Aanenson: Well you're going to give them a recommendation. Mayor Furlong: We're going to provide comments and recommendations on whether it's something we would consider or not. Kate Aanenson: Correct. At the next go around Mayor Furlong: At the next go around, correct. Okay. Alright, thank you. Appreciate those comments and questions. Let's bring it back to council for thoughts and discussion. Councilman Laufenburger: I'll start. Mayor Furlong: Councilman Laufenburger. Councilman Laufenburger: Mr. Mayor, I can and I would support this project. Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Other thoughts and comments. Councilwoman Tjornhom: I think ditto. 43 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Mayor Furlong: Okay Councilwoman Tjornhom: You know there's not much, I think this has been a really good process. There were discussions in work session and now just having a relaxed, informal conversation about the vision for this parcel, right? Kate Aanenson: Yes. Councilwoman Tjornhom: And how things could work or what some of the potential hazards could be. You know a lot of times, 5 years ago we'd have a development come through and no deck was planned and all of a sudden we had lots of problems with everyone wanting a deck or patio and it wasn't going to work and so I think we've learned a lot from history and I think this has been a very positive experience I think for council and hopefully the residents and the developer, just to see if it's something that really is workable and so I too would support it coming back and seeing what they have in mind for the next phase. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Great, thank you. Other thoughts? Councilwoman Ernst. Councilwoman Ernst: Yeah, and I really want to compliment Kate on all the challenges and you spent a lot of time on this project in working through many different challenges and scenarios. I would support this project. I think it's a good project and I want to make sure we do address the storm water issue, the drainage issue and with that yeah, I would support the project. Mayor Furlong: Okay, thank you. Mr. McDonald, thoughts. Councilman McDonald: I too would support the project. I'm just trying to be brief. Mayor Furlong: And everybody is. It must begetting late because you all are never this brief but, so I'll take up your time. Thanks for yielding as they say on the Senate. No I think there's been a lot of challenges and Mr. Knoblauch thank you for your efforts and I think you said this was iteration number 11 which says there's been a lot of work on everybody's side. Maybe too much work but this is a challenging parcel and I think you know there were questions raised at the Planning Commission as far as the location of the road. We talked about that tonight. Clearly this design makes the most sense as well. I think working with a PUD makes a lot of sense so thank you for coming forward with that idea. Looking at the dual guiding for medium provides the flexibility and really that's ultimately what I think to summarize what makes it easy for all of us to support this continuing forward is what's happening here is we're trying to seek the best way to accommodate the developer's goals and objectives. Staying within the rules. Staying within the guidelines but where's that flexibility that meets their objectives while meeting all the other requirements and so Mr. Knoblauch thank you for your efforts there working with staff. Kate and others, thank you for all your efforts as well. I mean this is a challenging parcel to say the least, but clearly it can support some development and it's fair to seek to, while keeping in mind the natural features of the property, do it right and that's what I hear happening here so thank you everybody for your efforts but I certainly would support this moving forward with the plan to look at the dual guiding, the PUD and all the other tools that we have to try to get this done so thank you. Any other questions or comments or questions from staff or Mr. Knoblauch for clarification? No? Todd Gerhardt: Mr. Mayor. Mayor Furlong: Mr. Gerhardt 44 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Todd Gerhardt: I thought Mr. Knoblauch was one of our planners or engineers as much time as he spent at City Hall so I was surprised that he was the builder so, but Kate, Sharmeen, Terry, it would have been really easy just to say there's just too many hurdles on this project and to walk away from it so you know Kate and her staff just did a fantastic job of trying to figure out how to make this a successful project and they did that so look forward to getting down and getting the details out there now and appreciate everybody's efforts in making this work. Mayor Furlong: No, I hear Mr. Knoblauch's a pretty good builder of homes so if we can get through the development process I'm sure these will be 16 wonderful homes here as well so, very good. Thank you. Thank you all for your comments. For those that spoke at the Planning Commission and we look forward to seeing this back just as soon as it's ready. If there's nothing else we'll complete that item then and move onto the next item. TH 101 (LYMAN BOULEVARD TO PIONEER TRAIL) IMPROVEMENT PROJECT 12 -06: RESOLUTION APPROVING PLANS & SPECIFICATIONS AND AUTHORIZING ADVERTISEMENT FOR BIDS; APPROVE JOINT POWERS AGREEMENT WITH CARVER COUNTY; AND APPROVE COOPERATIVE AGREEMENT WITH MNDOT. Paul Oehme: Thank you Mayor, City Council members. I'd like to just briefly review, what we'd like to talk about tonight. We're giving you a quick overview of the project itself. We'll talk about a little bit of the construction and phasing and staging plans. Where we're at with right -of -way acquisitions on the project. Estimated costs and financing, we'll run through that. And then project schedule and if there's any questions at the end we'll be more than happy to try to answer that, those with, for you. Tonight Jon Horn from Kimley -Horn and Associates is here. He was the engineer on the project and he can answer some questions as well. So the purpose of the project, again the project is from reconstruction of Highway 101 from Lyman Boulevard down to Pioneer Trail. It's about three - quarters of a mile roadway. It's currently two lane, rural section roadway. We do have some documented traffic safety issues. Running off the road type of crashes. Those type of things. Capacity issues are an issue right now and currently moving forward with development, growth in the area that will increase and become a challenge for this corridor. So with that, again the issues associated with 101. Steep grades. Sharp curves. Inadequate sight distances and blind intersections and then poor shoulders as well. With that, staff and the City did receive federal funding for this project back in 2009. With that funding we were able to partner with Carver County and MnDOT and plan for the future improvements of the roadway. The proposed improvements are to reconstruct this section of roadway to 4 lane design, urban section, including curb and gutter. Adjacent Lyman flatten out the curves and grades, basically making it to a county roadway, current county roadway design standards. 40 miles an hour design. Adding turn lanes at the intersections for public streets, at public streets. Stormwater drainage improvements are included in the project. We have 3 that are proposed. Pedestrian and bike trail and underpass by Bandimere Park. There's some Bandimere Park improvements that are associated with these improvements. I'll run through that a little later and trunk watermain is also improved, proposed along the corridor on the west side of 101. This is to facilitate future growth in the area. And then we'll also have some sanitary sewer improvements, specifically on 96 Street. The lift station and the force main that discharges out of that area will be improved and reconstructed and then also a future stub for sanitary sewer to the Foxford Road area as well. This is a drawing of what the proposed improvements are. To the right of your screen is Lyman Boulevard. Currently that section of roadway just south of Lyman is 4 lane so the project limits are about 400 feet south of there. Moving south, the intersection at Bandimere Park would be proposed to be moved approximately 400 feet north to accommodate better sight lines, turn lanes and future park improvements as well. Moving south from there, still a 4 lane design urban section, divided roadway. There'd be a proposed underpass of 101 at this location and trail along the west side of 101 along the corridor as well. The existing trail on the east side will be realigned through Bandimere Park and then slightly as we move farther to the south as well. At Kiowa Trail intersection would have turn lanes, left 45 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 and right turn lanes into this neighborhood. Currently there are none. This area, again this is kind of the steepest and most winding area of 101. That area is going to be straighten out. Ponds are shown here in blue and turn lanes over at 96 Street, left and right turn lanes with a median and then moving farther to the south, reconstruction of the intersection of 101 and Pioneer Trail. That intersection will be approximately raised up about 3 feet from it's current elevation to plan for future improvements to the south on 101. So the final design considerations, working with the neighborhoods on this project, one of the biggest concerns that they expressed to us as the staff is tree impacts so we try to avoid as much tree impacts through this project as we can. There is a reforestation plan that we also have included in the project as well. Try to minimize wetland impacts as well. Try to locate these ponds so they don't impact wetlands as best as we can on roadway alignments as well. Foxford Road neighborhood, buffering. Several property owners had requested that we look at berming along that section of roadway if it makes sense. We were able to work with several properties out there to accommodate those needs in conjunction with the project. The property acquisition is too, we're currently wrapping that work up as well, and then future Bandimere Park improvements as well and with that the Bandimere Park improvements are currently, with Highway 101 improvements are currently shown in pink here. The current access to Bandimere Park is shown at this location. Again the new access will be just north of there. There are currently two houses at this location, north of Bandimere Park. Those parcels were acquired by the City and by, with City funds and then also with State funds for the property closest to 101 to move that access to a better location for sights and access to Bandimere Park so with these improvements to Bandimere there will be parking stalls made in conjunction with the project but it also facilitates future redevelopment of Bandimere Park and there are opportunities to build tennis courts in this location and also a hockey rink in the future as well. The underpass of 101, for trail purposes, that was a big design consideration through this project. Try to minimize impacts to adjacent properties and try to maximize the grades potential in this area so we did look at above grade, a bridge type structure for 101 to get pedestrians across but cost effectively it was more advantageous for us to look at an underpass at this location so that's the improvements. The roadway will be realigned within Bandimere Park as well to facilitate some significant retaining walls along 101 as well. And then access to the west is, would align with current driveway onto Mr. Wilson's property and would facilitate future development of a public street in the future if so warranted. So construction phasing, majority of the project will be constructed this year. We are anticipating to go out for bids very shortly. I'll show you that schedule. Surcharge removal of southbound lane of 101 would however be delayed until 2014. There are some poorer soils out in this area. We just can't excavate out completely so the most cost effective approach that we found was to surcharge this area. Let the massive, basically dirt sit over the poorer soil area. Compress that soil out as best as we can and then re -pave that section of roadway in 2014. So 101 will be, have to be closed though through this entire corridor in 2013. There's no safe and economic way to construct temporary traffic control and access through this area so there will be detours associated with the construction process. Official detour route will be through Powers Boulevard. Four construction stages are proposed through the staging of this project and I'll go through that in a later slide, and temporary construction access through Kiowa Trail will be through Springfield on a temporary basis and 2014 work will be completed under traffic though. So won't be a complete closure of 101. So this is the phasing schedule that's currently being proposed. We'd like to start the project in May of this year under the north area. Basically constructing a new access to Bandimere Park with the turn lanes and roadway at this location. That would be able to utilize the southern access, current access to Bandimere Park currently to access people, anybody that wants to use the park on a fulltime basis through this way. However that does require a detour so anybody wanting to access Bandimere Park through the May -June timeframe would have to go down south of 101 onto Pioneer Trail and back up to Powers Boulevard and Lyman here so this is a detour route that's shown. The 101 project area here is shown, that's circled in red. Once that section of roadway is built, traffic would be allowed on that section of roadway to access Bandimere Park. This area shown here in green and blue would be reconstructed at that time and closed off to traffic so this area would be reconstructed between say June and August. The surcharge area is shown here in red circled. That area would be, actually be 2014 so that area would be, those two lanes of 46 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 traffic will be reconstructed in 2014. Moving south from there, the last section of phase 4 would be from October to November, 2013 from Pioneer Trail up to 96 Street with the ponds being constructed at that time. The intersection of Pioneer Trail and 101 would be reconstructed however earlier than the Phase 4. We want to get that access open as quickly as we can so I think we're at about a 2 to 3 week closure of that intersection. We wanted to get that intersection opened prior to school start in 2013 so that's kind of a short term phasing approach as well. Kiowa Trail currently accesses 101 right in the heart of our project area so we were looking for opportunities to divert traffic from Kiowa Trail outside of the project area so we'll just propose to remove the current barricades onto Springfield and allow all the Kiowa traffic to access Springfield throughout the project timeframe under when this phase of the roadway is under construction. Right -of -way access, there are 12 parcels that had to been acquired to reconstruct this roadway to a 4 lane design standard. Straighten out the curves. City dedicated the right -of -way for Bandimere Park. A sliver of right -of -way along the south and west portion of Bandimere Park. However with the development, with this project there is a lot of opportunities and some land will be rededicated to the City with the improvements for 101. Like I said the City did acquire those two Nettesheim properties for future park improvements as well. The funding and estimated cost are shown here. We are through the final design and right -of -way acquisition phase. We are on budget with that section, or that phase of the project here. We are looking at constructing the project again this summer. The estimated construction cost is about $9.7 million dollars and the engineering, administration, geotechnical surveying work is about $800,000 for a total construction project cost of just under $10.5 million dollars and again when you add in the design aspect, the pre- design and the right -of -way acquisition the total is just about $12.9 million. Mayor Furlong: Mr. Oehme, a question. Where's the source of funding for the design and right -of -way acquisition? Paul Oehme: The design? That was, if this council remembers there, we did receive funds from MnDOT in that amount probably about 2 years ago. There was a. Mayor Furlong: For the design and right -of -way? Paul Oehme: For the design and yeah, right -of -way acquisition. Back in April of, April 23r of 2012. Mayor Furlong: Okay, thank you. Paul Oehme: So funding source for that. Like I said, the City did receive a $5.6 million dollar worth of Federal STP funds to help support this project. It was a competitive grant application process that the City did receive those funds for. MnDOT funds moving forward for construction are shown here at about a little over, or right at $3.6 million dollars for Flexible Highway Account and then State Aid Loan Fund. This is, will be funds that will be eventually paid back through the turnback account. The City does have some responsibility or funding costs associated with this project that have been budgeted. Right now it's $825,000 in your packet and then Carver County costs are, for the intersection of Pioneer Trail and 101 plus some conduit they would like are a little over $466,000. That number is going to change a little bit. Carver County has requested that they implement their cost sharing policy with the locals. There's about $5,000 worth of sidewalk and curb and gutter that Carver County has asked us to pay for so the City's cost would go up to about $830,000 and Carver County's cost would go down to about $461,000 of additional cost that we're looking at would be paid for by MSA dollars and we do have budgeted money to cover those costs so. Mayor Furlong: What's the change in their policy? What did it used to be? What is it now? 47 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Paul Oehme: It's not a change from their current policy. They just implemented or they just looked over the cost allocations and what's participating for their ledger and they found that there is some sidewalk and some curb and gutter that they would request that the City pay for. Councilwoman Ernst: Didn't they commit to that $466,000? Paul Oehme: They did. They did and that's in the agreement right now. Councilwoman Ernst: Thank you. Paul Oehme: So those are those costs. Moving forward, the proposed project schedule is here. Approving plans and specs and the MnDOT Cooperative Agreement and the Carver County cost share agreement is in your packet. The City Attorney has reviewed both of those documents and thinks they are acceptable. The bid opening is currently scheduled for March 15 Award of contract is right now with the City Council is proposed on April 8 If everything goes fine from there we would have an open house sometime shortly thereafter and then start the construction in May of this summer and substantial completion again for this year in November. Getting 101 completely, or getting 101 opened and then final wear course paving and that surcharge area would be reconstructed by August of next year. With that, if there's any questions you'd have I'd be more than happy to try to answer them. Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Questions for staff. Mr. Laufenburger. Councilman Laufenburger: Yeah, this is a simple one Paul. Can you go to an overhead of the closest area of the Kiowa Trail, Bandimere Park access area there. Yeah. Is, just a scoge to the right of the word trail, is there parking there for use by people who want to use Bandimere Park? Todd Hoffman: Yes Councilman Laufenburger: Is there? How many stalls, do you know? Todd Hoffman: Approximately 10 and that was for the original Kiowa neighborhood park before Bandimere was even developed. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. Is that used a lot do you know Todd? Todd Hoffman: Those parking stalls are used less now because of the major parking lots up in Bandimere. Councilman Laufenburger: But I'm wondering if when the access is restricted or redirected might people use that? Todd Hoffman: Sure. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. Todd Hoffman: To get access to those. Councilman Laufenburger: So alright, and there's signs posted that say parking is acceptable or stuff like that? Todd Hoffman: It's just, there's no signs there. 48 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Councilman Laufenburger: But it's clearly recognizable as parking? Todd Hoffman: Absolutely. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. And then Mr. Oehme, that red dot which shows the barrier, that you're going to just take that down. Is there any other work that you'd have to do on the road to make the road smooth there for drivable for all of that traffic? Paul Oehme: I'm not aware of any. I think there is just posts in the ground that we'd have to remove the posts and then just maybe patch in, patch in those little areas there. I can't recall, I don't think there's any curb that's out there. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. And you're going to bring that barrier down at what time? It looked like March, is that right? Paul Oehme: Actually it would probably be maybe June when we, when the second and third phase is under construction. Once that first phase, here I'll get it back to that slide. Once this phase is under construction, the property owners on Kiowa would still have access. Councilman Laufenburger: They can go south. Paul Oehme: They still can go south. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. Paul Oehme: So we'll still allow that but once we get into June and through August timeframe, that's when this section of roadway would have to be shut down. Councilman Laufenburger: I was just thinking if they had a choice of going north through Springfield up to Lyman and then that way, if they had that choice when Bandimere closes that might be attractive for them. Paul Oehme: That's a great point. Maybe we'll look at taking it down earlier. Thank you. Councilman Laufenburger: Thanks. Thank you Mr. Mayor. Mayor Furlong: Okay, thank you. Other questions? No? I think we've been through this project a few times and so it's good to see it again and continue to see it moving along. If there are no questions, any other comments? What's before us this evening are approving the plans and specifications, authorizing bids and then also the agreements with MnDOT and Carver County. Councilwoman Ernst: I'll make a motion. Mayor Furlong: Okay, that's fine. Please. Councilwoman Ernst: I make a motion that we approve the resolutions approving plans and specifications and authorizing advertisement of bids and cooperative agreement with MnDOT and approve Joint Powers Agreement with Carver County. Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Is there a second? 49 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Councilman McDonald: Second. Mayor Furlong: Motion's been made and seconded. Any discussion on the motion? It's a big project. It's a good project and it's nice to see it moving forward so thank you Paul for all your efforts and likewise Mr. Horn, appreciate your help along the way. Sorry we didn't ask you any questions but then that means you don't have to give any answers too so, sometimes that's alright. Councilman Laufenburger: Just a brief one Mr. Mayor. The plan, everything looks really good and I think we need to support Mr. Gerhardt and Mr. Oehme in their discussions with Carver County. Councilwoman Ernst: Yes. Councilman Laufenburger: Thank you. Mayor Furlong: Absolutely. Absolutely. Todd Gerhardt: Thank you. We need all the support. Mayor Furlong: Is there any other? Todd Gerhardt: I just want to recognize Paul and Jon on this project. I mean this is unbelievable to get this kind of funding and Bethany's left and I know she played a big roll on the TAB board to get the funding and you know, you saw all the resources from different funds to pay for this road. It's just amazing and to have trails on both sides and to match up the new access into the park and expanding the park, it just, it's just perfect for this area. When and if the property to the west of 101 develops we're ready for it so that's just key. Usually it kind of comes after the fact so kind of ahead of the game here so that's good. Mayor Furlong: Yeah, it really does open up opportunities and it's, even though we've been challenged as a council for making improvements south of Highway 5, I think most of this project is indeed south of Highway 5. Councilman Laufenburger: Duly noted Mr. Mayor. Mayor Furlong: No it's, it's nice to see that we're finally at the point where we're approving plans and we're going out for bids and now it's time to get it built. Todd Gerhardt: Yeah, it's just. Mayor Furlong: A lot of work up to date and Todd, thank you for recognizing everybody and we also thank Carver County, MnDOT, everybody else that's been involved because they really have stepped up. Once we got over and got that initial funding through the TAB, which you raise a good point. Bethany was instrumental in that, that really brought everybody together and is getting a project done here that's going to benefit many, many people for many years so thank you all for your involvement. There's been a motion made and seconded. If there's no other discussion we'll proceed with the vote. Councilwoman Ernst moved, Councilman McDonald seconded that the City Council approves Resolution #2013 -06: Approving plans and specifications and authorizing advertisement of bids; Resolution #2013 -07: Approving Cooperative Agreement with MnDOT; and approving the Joint Powers Agreement with Carver County for TH 101 (Lyman Boulevard to Pioneer Trail) 50 Chanhassen City Council — January 28, 2013 Improvement Project 12 -06. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 4 to 0. (Councilwoman Tjornhom had left the meeting at this point and did not vote.) COUNCIL PRESENTATIONS. Mayor Furlong: Presentations by the council? Perhaps, I'm sorry did you have something? Councilwoman Ernst: Yeah I just again I want to thank Paul and his group for the snowfall that we had and getting out there. I heard the trucks and it's always a good feeling to hear them out there so when we get that kind of snow and ice so thank you for and thank your department for that because it's greatly appreciated. Mayor Furlong: Just a reminder, I think an email went out to council this evening but we are going to be meeting this Thursday morning with Representatives Hoppe and Pugh I think for sure, and from the State and then also Carver County Commissioners and Mr. Van Eyll, Representative to Metropolitan Council as well I think are going to be there so hope that works for everyone's schedule. If it doesn't we apologize but if you can't make it and have some comments or thoughts you'd like to share, please either call another council member or Mr. Gerhardt so that we can be sure to have those comments included in our discussion so, but with that if there are no other council presentations, Mr. Gerhardt. ADMINISTRATIVE PRESENTATIONS. Todd Gerhardt: Nothing this evening. I think you hit them all on the snowplowing and our legislative priorities. I did send those out. Take a look at those. If there's any changes or anything, let me know but that's kind of what we're going to work off on Thursday morning. Mayor Furlong: Thank you. CORRESPONDENCE DISCUSSION. None Mayor Furlong: If there's nothing else to come before the council this evening, we'll continue our work session item as we discussed so if there's nothing else to come before this evening, is there a motion to adjourn? Councilwoman Ernst moved, Councilman McDonald seconded to adjourn the meeting. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 4 to 0. The City Council meeting was adjourned at 10:00 p.m. Submitted by Todd Gerhardt City Manager Prepared by Nann Opheim 51