1979 07 16
REGULAR CHANHASSEN CITY COUNC IL MEETING JULY 16, 1979
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Mayor Hobbs called the meeting to order at 7:30 p.m. with the following members present:
Councilmen Pearson, Neveaux, Geving, and Matthews. The meeting was opened with the Pledge
to the Flag.
APPROVAL OF AGENDA: Councilman Matthews moved to approve the agenda as presented with
the additions of a report on the Highways 212/169 Advisory Committee and clean up of the
downtown area. Motion seconded by Councilman Pearson. The following voted in favor:
Mayor Hobbs, Councilmen Pearson, Neveaux, Matthews, and Geving. No negative votes.
Motion carried.
MINUTES: Amend 4.06 on page 7 of the July 2, 1979, Council minutes as follows: Outlots
A, B, C, E, H, & J. Upon the filing of the final plat with the Carver County Recorder,
the Developer and the respective fee and contract for deed owners thereof shall forthwith
grant to the City, without cost, an unrestricted perpetual easement over Outlots A, B,
C. E. H, & J of the plat for use by the City for City sanitary sewer trunk lines, storm
water holding areas and ponds, and soil and water conservation areas. Said easement
shall be in written form suitable for recording with the Carver County Recorder.
Councilman Matthews moved to approve the July 2, 1979, Council minutes as amended. Motion
seconded by Councilman Pearson. The following voted in favor: Mayor Hobbs, Councilmen
Pearson, Neveaux, and Matthews. Councilman Geving abstained. Motion carried.
Councilman Geving moved to note the July 12, 1979, Park and Recreation Commission minutes.
Motion seconded by Councilman Matthews. The following voted in favor: Mayor Hobbs,
Councilmen Pearson, Neveaux, Matthews, and Geving. No negative votes. Motion carried.
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Councilman Neveaux moved to note the June 27, 1979, Planning Commission minutes. Motion
seconded by Councilman Geving. The following voted in favor: Mayor Hobbs, Councilmen
Pearson, Neveaux, Matthews, and Geving. No negative votes. Motion carried.
Councilman Matthews moved to note the July 10, 1979, Park and Recreation Commission minutes.
Motion seconded by Councilman Pearson. The following voted in favor: Mayor Hobbs,
Councilmen Pearson, Neveaux, Matthews, and Geving. No negative votes. Motion carried.
KIOWA TRAIL SANITARY SEWER PROJECT: Staff held a meeting with the Kiowa Trail property
owners to discuss the proposed project on June 13th. Several residents were present
and those not attending the June 13th meeting expressed their vote either for or against
the sewer or in favor of gravity sewer only. The following conclusions were expressed:
8 - No - Did not want sewer regardless of option.
5 - Yes - Want sewer regardless of option.
4 - Not present or vacant property.
3 - Yes - Only if gravity sewer.
RESOLUTION #79-44 : Councilman Neveaux moved'theadopti onófa resol uti ónordermg a
public hearing for August 20, 1979, atï~30p:m. tb consider the instanation of s,anîtary
sewer along Kiowa Trail. Resolution seconded by Councilman Geving. The following voted
in favor: Mayor Hobbs, Councilmen Pearson, Neveaux, Matthews, and Geving. No negative
votes. Motion carried.
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COMMERCIAL/INDUSTRIAL PARK CHARGE ORDINANCE: Pat Boyle, Phyllis Pope, Mary Muehlhausen,
and Joe Betz, Park and Recreation Commission, and Fran Callahan, Community Services
Director, were present. The Park and Recreation Commission recommended a 1% park charge
on the building permit.
Councilman Neveaux moved to place this ordinance amendment on first reading; Motion
seconded by Councilman Pearson. The following voted in favor: Mayor Hobbs, Councilmen
Pearson, Neveaux, Geving, and Matthews. No negative votes. Motion carried.
Council Meeting July 16, 1979
Ed Dunn -
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I would like to restate some of our concerns that were expressed at an earlier
meeting. We have tried to identify,with the Park Commission, those areas
that seem appropriate to us as parks. I have a bit of a problem with
definitions as to what's active and passive or non-active uses. If the
only active park is one on which you can play baseball or tennis then some
of these lands are suitable for that. On the other hand we think active
park can very well include water such as Lake Susan or Lake Ann and other
communities do recognize this specifically by giving half credit in terms of
land dedication they give half credit for water. The same thing applies
to ponding areas although I couldntt say that's common but that is done.
Those lands around Lake Susan that we have identified in our plan as lands
which we dontt build, they were held out with our intention that they be used
in addition to easements, for recreational purposes of the trail nature and
that, in my opinion, is an active use. Along the creek, the entire area
can become a beautiful trail area. This is our concept. You have not told
us that this is your concept but this is what we envision and we are now in
the process of finding other areas, Lake Ann, Lake Susan the west shore
which if this is suitable and is a part of your park plan we would like
to have that confirmed or we should stop planning those areas within there
if we are going to talk cash. We certainly can't afford to do both because
the net affect, every time we reduce our net available land for development
and then in addition we-have to accept the imposition of a fee, if it's of
any amount at all, it puts us in an unmarketable area. If we use a 1% fee
for example, and if we were to take in Phase I and build, we have 31 lots
I have assumed 30 buildings in there that would average 30,000 square feet,
by ordinance we could cover more of the ground then that but that's probably
a nominal amount and not too many buildings today are built for less than
that, that's 900,000 square feet and as Mr. Larson has pointed out you don't I
build much for $25.00 a square foot, that's $23,500,000 worth of improvements
and on this basis then would be $235,000 and $3,360 per acre charge which
is more than we paid for the land originally. It's almost three times
what Eden Prairie, the highest of all the comparables that you received
I believe charged, and gets to be a substantial figure. Just using the
land price, we are selling the land currently for $12,000 to $15,000 an
acre. That's a net acre. We have to keep in mind that's different from
the gross that went into that because we have already had a shrink of 30%. .
If it was 10% of the value and.should you opt to go that way then it's
$1,200 to $1,500 an acre, so you have a very substantial dislocation between
what the proposal is with respect to building as compared to what it is
with respect to land. These are just rough calculations. We have not had
a chance to study the proposed ordinance. When we can, we would like to study
it further but I throw this out as being, I think, warrants your consideration.
Another point we made previously that I would like to restate is that there
must be an equity, and I think it is a responsibility to be equitable, between
residential and industrial users, some kind of equivalency and that if the
residential areas which produce the children they are currently paying, I
think your ordinance calls for $235 per residential unit and on an average
density of 2~ to 3, that's somewhere in the vicinity of $600 to $700 per acre
on residentially developed land from which the children come which is one
of your primary considerations. I think it should be relevant to what other
people in the community are paying. If the Park Commission, to carry out
its plan, needs more money then the case should be made and then that cost
spread evenly throughout the community. This expresses my concern.
Jul i us Smith -
The numbers that Ed indicated, just from a practical point of view,
that looks like around $8,000 a site for our existing industrial park
and that hurts in competition for trying to sell sites. $8,000 is a
substantial amount of money when compared to what we are getting for
the sites now. As an absolute rule, industry is far more interested
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Council Meeting July 16, 1979
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in keeping their front· end costs 1 ower and paying taxes rather than
go in with high front end costs. Actually the State Statute 'gives some
general guidelines as to values or reasonableness of charges and the cases
in the state and tell you something like 10, 12, they have stood still for
12% based on land value. These costs are substantially in excess of that
and the laws generally require that there is a reasonable relationship to
the needs caused by development. I think $3,200 an acre roughly is a pretty
stiff charge. - -'
The Park and Recreation Commission was directed to review the residential park charges
for the August 6th Council meeting.
POPE DRAINAGE POND, NORTH MANOR ROAD AND ORCHARD LANE: Jack Gill, City Engineer, reported
that he was unable to find any drain tilesfrom'the' pond., -Mr. Pope Was present asking
that something be done to reduce the level of the pond. Staff was directed to have the
city crews pump the pond to reduce the water level. If this does not alleviate the
prob 1 em a storm sewer' may have to be ins ta 11 ed.
COMMISSION APPOINTMENTS:
HOUSING AND REDEVELOPMENT AUTHORITY: Mayor Hobbs nominated James Bohn to the HRA.
RESOLUTION #79-45: Councilman Neveaux moved the adopti on of a resolution confi rmi ng the
appointment of James Bohn to the HRA. Resolution seconded by Councilman Geving. The
following voted in favor: Mayor Hobbs, Councilmen Pearson, Neveaux, Matthews, and Geving.
No negative votes. Motion carried.
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PARK AND RECREATION COMMISS ION: Councilman Neveaux moved to appoi nt Ell is Thomas to
replace Denis Stedman on the Park and Recreation Commission. Motion seconded by Councilman
Matthews. The foll owing voted in favor: Mayor Hobbs, Council men Pearson, Neveaux,
Matthews, and Geving. No negative votes. Motion carried.
Council members discussed representation on the Park and Recreation Commission from the
northwestern area of the City and felt that if Mr. Thomas Schoenecker is still interested
in this commission, members of the Park and Recreation Commission should interview him.
PLANNING COMMISSION: Councilman Pearson moved to appoint Tom Droegemuelìer to replace
Mal MacAlpine on the Planning Commissiun. Motion seconded by Councilman Geving. The
following voted in favor: Mayor Hobbs, Councilmen Pearson, Neveaux, Geving, and Matthews.
No negative votes. Motion carried.
Councilman Neveaux moved to accept Jerry Neher's resignation from the Planning Commission'
and direct staff to prepare a letter of appreciation from the Council. Motion seconded
by Councilman Matthews. The following voted in favor: Mayor Hobbs, Councilmen Pearson,
Neveaux, Geving, and Matthews. No negative votes. Motion carried.
Councilman Neveaux moved to accept":the Planning Commission recommendation and appoint
Jack Bell to ful fill ',the term remaining on Jerry Neher's appointment: Motion seconded
by Councilman Matthews. The following voted in favor: Mayor Hobbs, Councilmen Pearson,
Neveaux, Geving, and Matthews. No negati ve votes. Motion carried.
BILLS: Council members requested an explanation of the payment to Lakeland Ford, check
#7586.
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Councilman Matthews moved to approve the bills as presented; checks #10882 through 10939
in the amount of $25,312.97, checks #10796 through #10881 in the amount of $993,613.85,
and checks #7551 through #7622 in the amount of $536,708.17. Motion seconded by Councilman
Geving. The following voted in favor: Mayor Hobbs, Councilmen Pearson, Neveaux, Geving,
and Matthews. No negative votes. Motion carried.
Council Meeting July 16, 1979
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FLOOD PLAIN MANAGEMENT ORDINANCE: The City Attorney suggested the deletion of entire
Section 18 of the existing Zoning Ordinance and incorporate the new Flood Plain
Management Ordinance in its place. He further recommended changing the non-conforming
use section in the Flood Plain Management Ordinance to be more restrictive.
Councilman Pearson moved the adoption of the Flood Plain Management Ordinance
subject ot the City Attorneyts revisions as discussed. Motion seconded by Councilman
Geving. The following voted in favor: Mayor Hobbs, Councilmen Pearson, Neveaux,
Geving, and Matthews.' No negative votes. Motion carried.
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FILL PERMIT - CHANHASSEN'AMERICAN LEGION'POST 580: The Legion is áskîng for a permit
to fill the area south of the existing ball fields located on their property at 7995
Great Plains Blvd. Riley Purgatory Creek Watershed District has reviewed the application
and state in their letter dated June 8, 1979, that a permit would not be required.
Councilman Geving moved to table action pending a report from the City Engineer and
a further explanation from the Legion on exactly what, if anything other than
beautifi cati on, they intend to do. Moti on seconded byCounci lman Matthews. The
following voted in favor: Mayor Hobbs, Councilmen Pearson, Neveaux, Matthews, and
Geving. No negati ve votes. Motion carri ed.
ADDRESS CHANGES - HILL STREET:
address changes to Hill Street:
Ted Bentz, 7570 Chanhassen Road to 31 Hill Street
Wesley Arseth, 7520 Chanhassen Road to 20 Hill Street
John Seyner, 7530 Chàñhassen Road to 30 Hill Street
John Melby, 7540 Chanhassen Road to 40 Hill Street
Motion seconded by Councilman Pearson. The following voted in favor:
Councilmen Pearson, Neveaux, Geving, and Matthews. No negative votes.
Councilman Matthews moved to approve the following
Mayor Hobbs,
Motion carried.
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DEVELOPMENT CONTRACT AND SECURITY AGREEMENT, HOLIDAY/HAPPY CHEF: John Lee and Larry
Zamor were present. Section 26,Continuing Obligation to Maintain Green Space, was
discussed. It was decided to modify this section to include the following: 18 months
after planting, no removal without City approval and the City has the right to replace
plantings within the green area. Section 27, Outside Storage Limited, of the Holiday
Stationstore Permit will include the outside storage of a coin operated ice machine
and pop machine.
Councilman Neveaux moved the adoption of the development contract as presented and
modified this evening for the Holiday/Happy Chef developments on Highways 5 and 101.
Motion seconded by Councilman Geving. The following voted in favor: Mayor Hobbs,
Councilmen Pearson, Neveaux, Geving, and Matthews. No negative votes. Motion carried.
Council man Matthews moved the adopt i on of the Security Agreement for Ho 1 i day S tati ons tore
and Happy Chef Restaurant as presented. Motion seconded by Councilman Pearson. The
following voted in favor: Mayor Hobbs, Councilmen Pearson, Neveaux, Geving, and
Matthews. No negative votes. Motion carried.
169/212 ADVISORY COMMITTEE: Councilman Geving gave a report on the status of this
committee. MnDOT representatives will meet with the Council and Planning Commission
regarding the impact the proposed routes will have on the city.
DOWNTOWN CLEAN UP: Council members discussed the 1 ack of maintenance t9l ass and I
debris) in the area of Great Plains Blvd. and West 78th Street. This will be an agenda
item for August 6. The City Manager was directed to notify the two bar owners that
the Council is proposing to hire an employee to clean up the area and if the Council
has to they will put the charge on the liquor licenses.
Council Meeting July 16, 1979 -5-
PLEASANT VIEW ROAD ~ PAVING; The City Attorney will present a status report for the
next Council meeting.
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CONSENT AGENDA: Mayor Hobbs asked if any council member wished to discuss any items on
the consent agenda. As no additional comments were received, Councilman Geving moved
to approve the following items pursuant to the City Manager IS recommendati ons:
a. Environmental Assessment'Worksheets - SunrtseBeach Development.
b. Accept Plans and Authorize Bids:
1. Kerber Drive Paving - RESOLUTION #79-46
2. South Lotus Lake Drainage - RESOLUTION #79-47
c. 1979 Diseased Tree Program.
1. Modify Ordinance re: Storage
2. Des i gna te Advi S ory Committee
Motion seconded by Councilman Pearson. The following voted in favor: Mayor Hobbs,
Councilmen Pearson, Neveaux, Geving, and Matthews. No negative votes. Motion carried.
Councilman Geving moved to adjourn. Motion seconded by Councilman Neveaux. All Ayes.
Meeting adjourned at 11 :30 p.m.
Don Ashworth
City Manager
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