1983 04 04
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CHANHASSEN CITY COUNCIL MEETING APRIL 4, 1983
Mayor Hamilton called the meeting to order with the following members
present: Councilwomen Swenson and Watson, Councilmen Geving and Horn.
Bill Ryan from the Planning Commission, Craig Mertz, Bill Monk, Scott
Martin, Don Ashworth, and Bob Waibel were also present. The meeting
was opened with the Pledge to the Flag.
APPROVAL OF AGENDA: Councilwoman Swenson moved to approve the agenda as
presented. Motion seconded by Councilman Geving. The following voted in
favor: Mayor Hamilton, Councilwomen Swenson and Watson, Councilmen Geving
and Horn. No negative votes. Motion carried.
CONSENT AGENDA: Mayor Hamilton asked if council members wished to
remove any items from the consent agenda to be discussed separately.
Item b, Ordinance lOA, On-Site Septic Systems,
Item e, Zoning Ordinance Amendment Extending Moratorium on the Issuance
of Building Permits for IIFast Food Restaurantsll,
Item f, Resolution Opposing Governor's Plan for Distribution of State Aids,
were removed from the consent agenda. Items hand i were deleted from
the agenda.
Councilman Horn moved to approve the following consent agenda items
pursuant to the City Manager's recommendations:
a. Approve Traffic Signalization Agreement and RESOLUTION #83-11 for
TH5/CR17 Intersection.
c. Approve Street Light Conversion of NSP Fixtures from Mercury Vapor
to Sodium Vapor.
d. Approve Construction Plans and Specifications for Murray Hill 2nd
Addition.
g. RESOLUTION #83-12 Proclaiming Volunteer Recognition Week (April 17-23)
j. Reset Special Meeting Date, Receipt of Bids, 1983 Bonds. April 26.
Motion seconded by Councilwoman Watson. The following voted in favor:
Mayor Hamilton, Councilwomen Swenson and Watson, Councilmen Geving and
Horn. No negative votes. Motion carried.
FIRST READING, ORDINANCE lOA, ON-SITE SEPTIC SYSTEM ORDINANCE:
Councilwoman Swenson moved to amend Section 3, 3.01, of proposed Ordinance
lOA by changing the following sentence. All such installations,
construction, alterations, extensions, and repairs shall be executed in
accordance with the standards set forth in Section 2 of this Ordinance;
provided, however, that the Inspector lIand Engineerll, may, by permit, allow
an existing system which is in a state of IIfailurell, as defined by this
Ordinance, to be restored to its original configuration, rather than being
fully re-constructed in accordance with the standards set forth in Section
2 of this Ordinance, if in the opinion of the Inspector lIand Engineerll such
restoration will abate the system's failure and that such restoration will
reasonably assure satisfactory performance of said system. Motion seconded
by Councilman Horn. The following voted in favor: Mayor Hamilton,
Councilwomen Swenson and Watson, Councilmen Geving and Horn. No negative
votes. Motion carried.
Councilwoman Swenson moved to place on first reading proposed Ordinance
lOA as amended. Motion seconded by Councilwoman Watson. The following
voted in favor: Mayor Hamilton, Councilwomen Swenson and Watson,
Councilmen Geving and Horn. No negative votes. Motion carried.
Council Meeting April 4, 1983
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ZONING ORDINANCE AMENDMENT EXTENDING MORATORIUM ON THE ISSUANCE OF
BUILDING PERMITS FOR IIFAST FOOD RESTAURANTSII: Councilman Geving moved
to deny the ordinance amendment. Motion seconded by Councilman Horn. I
The following voted in favor: Councilman Geving. Mayor Hamilton,
Councilwomen Swenson and Watson, and Councilman Horn voted no. Motion
failed.
Mayor Hamilton moved to approve Ordinance 47K-8 Temporarily Prohibiting
the Construction of Fast Food Restaurants within certain areas of the
City. Motion seconded by Councilman Horn. The following voted in favor:
Mayor Hamilton, Councilman Horn, Councilwomen Swenson and Watson.
Councilman Geving voted no. Motion carried.
RESOLUTION OPPOSING GOVERNOR'S PLAN FOR DISTRIBUTION OF STATE AIDS:
RESOLUTION #83-13: Councilwoman Swenson moved to approve a Resolution
opposing S.F. 487 and H.F. 545. Resolution seconded by Mayor Hamilton.
The following voted in favor: Mayor Hamilton, Councilwomen Swenson and
Watson, Councilmen Geving and Horn. No negative votes. Motion carried.
MINUTES: Councilman Horn moved to approve the March 7, 1983, Council
minutes. Motion seconded by Councilwoman Watson. The following voted in
favor: Mayor Hamilton, Councilwomen Swenson and Watson, Councilmen Geving
and Horn. No negative votes. Motion carried.
Councilman Geving moved to approve the March 21, 1983, Council minutes.
Motion seconded by Councilman Horn. The following voted in favor: Mayor
Hamilton, Councilwomen Swenson and Watson, Councilmen Geving and Horn. No
negative votes. Motion carried.
WATER SURFACE USAGE ORDINANCE: At the Council IS request Kim Elverum,
DNR, was present to discuss the proposed Water Surface Usage Ordinance,
specifically areas of the ordinance which the DNR denied. It was decided
to set up a committee of Craig Mertz, Councilman Horn, Wally Coudron,
and Henry Sosin to meet with Mr. Elverum and resolve the issues raised
by the DNR. Mr. Elverum will prepare a written response to the ordinance
as it currently stands and this letter will serve as a starting point
of discussion for the committee. Wally Coudron will chair the committee.
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Councilman Geving moved to table action on this item. Motion seconded by
Mayor Hamilton. The following voted in favor: Mayor Hamilton,
Councilwomen Swenson and Watson, Councilmen Geving and Horn. No negative
votes. Motion carried.
NON-CONFORMING USE PERMIT FOR INSTALLATION OF A WASH-OUT SYSTEM, APPLE
VALLEY RED-E-MIX: Matt Fischer, Hugh Fischer, and Bruce Goldstein were
present.
Bob Waibel - Apple Valley is seeking approval of a conditional use permit,
non-conforming use permit and ordinance variance request to install a
wash-out system. They have been determined as a non-conforming use and
as such are allowed to exist there until, I believe, the year 1992 at I
which time they would have to terminate. The property is zoned Central
Business District which does require a conditional use permit. The system
would essentially re-use the water that is used for flushing out partial
loads in the trucks and also cleaning out the plant at the end of a days
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Council Meeting April 4, 1983
-3-
operations. The PCA acknowledges that they have little information on
this type of system or the cement industry itself but they agree that
this has some potential or apparent benefits from an environmental
standpoint. The City Attorney has concurred that a permit with the
recommended conditions as found in the March 3rd staff report is
acceptable.
Mayor Hamilton moved that the conditional use permit and zoning ordinance
variance for Apple Valley Red-E-Mix, Planning Case 82-4, be approved with
the following conditions:
1. That Apple Valley, Inc. will immediately, upon the execution of the
conditional use permit, install at its Chanhassen plant and at its
own expense, a wash-out system, which installation shall be in
accordance with the detailed plans and specifications as presented
in Planning Case 82-4 Conditional Use Permit and as approved by the
City Engineer.
2. That Apple Valley, Inc. agrees that it shall te¡minate the non-
conforming use of its property located at 201 West 78th Street no
later than July 1, 1992, in accordance with Section 20.01 of
Ordinance 47 and furthermore shall not claim compensation from the
City of Chanhassen for the investment costs of the wash-out system
and appurtenances thereto in the termination of the use either through
public acquisition or through the provisions of said SectiDn 20.01 ~f
Ordinance 47.
3. That Apple Valley, Inc. obtain any necessary discharge permits for the
wash-out system from the Minnesota Pollution Control Agency and/or
Metropolitan Waste Control Commission.
4. That Apple Valley, Inc. fill in the existing wash-out pit on the
property to existing grade utilizing clean fill.
5. That the wash-out system have compliance to the performance standards
for noise as contained in Ordinance 47-1.
6. That the silo that is laying on the ground be removed from the
premises.
7. That a fence, similar to the fence around the Hanus facility, be
constructed around the tank areas at a height of eight feet.
Motion seconded by Councilman Horn. The following voted in favor: Mayor
Hamilton, Councilwomen Swenson and Watson, Councilmen Geving and Horn. No
negative votes. Motion carried.
DEVELOPMENT CONTRACT, CARVER BEACH ESTATES:
Councilwoman Swenson noted that she had talked with Joe Troendle and
there is some question about the access to his property from new Nez
Perce Drive.
Councilwoman Swenson moved to table action until Mr. Troendle is satisfied
that access is provided to his property. Motion seconded by Mayor
Hamilton. The following voted in favor: Mayor Hamilton, Councilwomen
Swenson and Watson, Councilmen Geving and Horn. No negative votes.
Motion carried.
Don Hess - I believe there has been a very honest attempt here to have
an easement which has been drawn and given to the attorney and presented
to Mr. Troendle granting him rights of easement over Lot 5 until such
time that there is an alternative access provided. That1s been offered.
I don It know why it has not been accepted.
Council Meeting April 4, 1983
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Mayor Hamilton - Until it has been signed by Mr. Troendle, we are not
going to deal with it. All this Council has asked for repeatedly is
that there be an agreement so that we know that Mr. Troendle is not
going to be landlocked. We want to see an agreement in writing.
Joe Troendle - The first agreement that we signed with the understanding
that I would have an access to the south. I wouldn't be landlocked. The
reason we bought that strip of property on the north end of Carver Beach
and the south end of our property is so we would have an out to the
road that is just south of the lots that we own. I understand that
Carver Beach Properties suggested that they would leave a lot open there
that we can get through there. What I am interested in knowing, would
the City of Chanhassen allow a road to be built in there? Just the fact
that he leaves a lot open doesn't mean that you people would allow a
road in there. That's the reason I didn1t sign the letter I got. At
the present time I just have their say so that they leave a lot open but
that doesn't assure me that the City would allow a road to be built in
there.
Don Hess - We can't presume to know what your action is going to be unless
you take action on that.
Joe Troendle - If I had the assurance from the City of Chanhassen that
that lot would be open and available to whoever owns that property,
whether it1s me or somebody else, to come in there with a road if we
wish to, there would be no problem.
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Don Ashworth - To do that there would have to be some type of a I
contractual agreement entered into. You can It bind a future Council.
I guess that's what Mr. Troendle wants to know is if we would guarantee
a future Council. We can It do that short of literally some type of
a contractual obligation so that means the agreement as written would
have to be changed so that it would become a three party agreement
wherein we would contractually commit to allowing that street to go
through.
Mayor Hamilton - Rather than debating this here, I think you ought to
get together with the staff and try to reach some type of an agreement.
Bill Monk - I don It think there is a plan in your packet that showed Lot
5. The Council as a whole does not, Don correct me if I am wrong, have
any problem with pursuing a supplimentary agreement for access across
Lot 5. I think that can be accomplished between Mr. Troendle, the City,
and the developer. I am sure we can have that back on the next agenda
for Council approval as long as the Council as a whole does not see any
problem with that.
Mayor Hamilton - Get together and work that out.
Councilwoman Swenson - Would that be binding on future Council IS?
Don Ashworth - I think it would have to work back with the Attorney's
office.
Councilwoman Swenson - Let's leave it there then.
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Council Meeting April 4, 1983
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ZONING ORDINANCE AMENDMENT, INTERIM REGULATIONS FOR SUBDIVISION AND
DEVELOPMENT IN THE UNSEWERED PORTIONS OF CHANHASSEN:
Councilwoman Swenson - The motion as I read it in the minutes here, March
21st, is using Ordinance 64C as an interim ordinance adopting only Section
6 and that internal access must be provided for subdivisions of two or
more lots and I guess I don't understand where did all this come from?
Scott Martin - After going through the discussion at our last meeting
and prior to my having knowledge of how the minutes were written, Pat,
which I, too, had some problem with that after I saw the minutes and after
I had done this, it was very apparent to me that if we are going to deal
with the unsewered area we can It just slap some frosting on what we have
got and say, now we are going to say you can It put a driveway access onto
a certain type of street and that will take care of all our problems.
What I tried to do was go a step further. The first thing we already did
tonight was the first reading of Ordinance lOA which goes beyond the
emergency septic system regulations and establishes the definitive septic
system regulations when that's adopted. We went further than your action
in that area because we were prepared to and we felt why fool around
with a band-aid approach if we can do it right the first time.
Councilwoman Swenson - We already have a restriction in 33 that says it
has to be on a public street. We went through this exercise with Waldrip
if you remember and we wouldn't allow any accesses onto Galpin Blvd. so
I don't see that this is any different than that.
Don Ashworth - This is a new ordinance as it would apply to the unsewered
area so you are going to have to really take those features that you want
from 33 and say, here is what is being included. If you don't explicitly
say those, again, the court is going to have the same problem that they
did with Dypwick.
Councilwoman Swenson - Why do we have to have 500 feet on an ordinary
street?
Scott Martin - First of all the 500 foot frontage only takes affect for
lots of 10 acres or more. The basic reason for that is so you don It
get some very unusually long narrow lots, West 96th Street is a good
example, that's going to make it very difficult in the future to re-
subdivide with urban services. What you are trying to do is have the
tracts rectangular in shape because it1s a lot easier to re-subdivide
those in the future. Our definitive regulations, whenever they come into
affect later this year, will not only provide for but require provisions
for re-subdivision. This ordinance does not go that far. That's why
I selected the larger lot size and a lower gross density so we can allow
some development since you basically had the unsewered area shut down
for new development in the last ten to 12 years, I think you ought to go
gradually in this area rather than open up a can of worms and find that
you have got a bunch of Hesse Farms allover that are going to be
impossible to resubdivide.
Councilwoman Swenson - Maybe that1s not all bad.
Councilman Horn - I have a question about gross density, where do you
draw the border line?
Council Meeting April 4, 1983
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Scott Martin - It would be on the property to be subdivided. If a guy
has got ten acres and he has a house on it he can It re-subdivide it
because he has already got a density of one for ten.
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Councilman Horn - I don't see a developer coming in here and doing these
lots. I see people like Dypwick coming in here and buying ten acres.
What's a development. Where do you draw the circle around this gross
density figure?
Scott Martin - It's from the parcel as of the date of the enactment of
the ordinance.
Craig Mertz - Using Clark's example of Dypwick, the developer would have
been Teich.
Councilman Horn - You are saying, the original property owner.
Scott Martin - It's the size of the property that's recorded as a separate
tract of land as of the date of this ordinance.
Councilman Horn - Let me give you another example, let's say I go buy
five acres from Al (Klingelhutz) and Pat (Swenson) goes and buys five
acres from Al, is Al a developer now?
Scott Martin - He is a subdivider. If Al has 40 acres, the most he can
subdivide out of there are four new lots including the residual and the
minimum of those lot sizes can be five acres.
Councilman Horn - What I am getting at is where we apply this gross
density and who is the developer? I donlt see this as a developer
situation.
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Scott Martin - You go back to the original subdivision of the tract as of
the adoption of the ordinance.
Councilman Horn - But it isn't subdivided as a tract.
piece by piece years later and that's my whole point.
you can assign a gross density.
It's subdivided
I don't see how
Scott Martin - Itls the same as telling Lotus Lake Estates that your
minimum lot size is 15,000 square foot but you can't have more than 2.9
dwelling units per acre so what's to say that the way a house is sited
on a lot that ten years from now this guy wants to split his lot. It's
the same difference but on a smaller scale.
Councilman Horn - The difference is that Lotus Lake Estates comes in as
PUD development. It's a subdivision.
Scott Martin - So is this.
Councilman Horn - It's a PUD subdivision as compared to a single unit
subdivision. You can put a gross density figure on what he is doing I
but how are you going to do it when he is not going to have an overall
plat layout for those four, five acre chunks he can get rid of on this
40 acres.
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Counci 1 Meeting Apri 1 4, 1983 -7-
Scott Martin - You can certainly require it. I would suggest that you do.
Craig Mertz - Carver County is keeping track of what parcels are being
cut off of farms and judging then from time to time whether the farm is
in compliance with this density.
Councilwoman Swenson - If I would like to buy 15 acres of property and in
my minds eye I am planning on giving five acres to each one of my
children so all three of us have five acres, you are telling me I can't
do that.
Scott Martin - You could if you are buying 15 acres out of an original
40.
Councilwoman Swenson - One of the problems I have with Ordinance 45 was
the fact that is somebody had ten acres and want to divide their property
in half for a son to build a house and we say no, you can It do that and
to me this is repugnant. Somebody ought to be able to sell part of their
land if they want to as long as it's within the five or 2~ acres. I just
don't go for this maximum density.
Councilman Horn - I think if we have got five acre minimum we don't need
any gross density figure.
Councilman Geving - We instructed staff to come back with a reasonable
plan because we turned down the moratorium and I, too, was looking for
Section 6 to be just lifted right out of there and that's what I expected
to see tonight. I actually saw something better. I think staff went
beyond what we asked them to do and I like what I saw. My personal feeling
is that I saw five acres originally and then I got to thinking about it and
I really think now my preference is for 2~ acre size lots. I think if
we look down the road long enough or far enough you will find that if a
person were to buy that 2~ acre lot there is less chance that he will in
the future subdivide it into a lot of an acre or an acre and a half.
I think the whole issue of maximum gross density should be thrown out.
The main thing that we instructed staff is to go back and tell us how
we could build in these sewage problems into the overall plan. That's
really our problem and that's why we had Ordinance 45, at least that's
my interpretation of the intent of 45 was so that we had some standards
for sewage treatment in the unsewered area. I do think, as far as
access restrictions are concerned that we should try to encourage the
sharing of driveways to the maximum extent to keep the number of accesses
onto Hwy. 101 or any other public road to a minimum and I don't know how
you do that because once it gets divided up it's a matter of sharing and
common agreement between two landowners. As far as the minimum building
setbacks, I think they are fine. I think personally that these are
reasonable. This would give the people that own the land an opportunity
to sell, to develop into smaller pieces. I am going for the 2~ acre size
lots.
Al Klingelhutz - Item 1 on the first page concerns me a little bit. liThe
Ordinance should apply only to lands lying outside the 1990 MUSA Line.1I
I realize we all want sewer but what if there is a farm or two lying in
between and that has to be developed before this third farmer, how is he
going to do anything with his land and it's very possible that piece of
land won't be developed before 1990. I guess that's my question on item
Counci 1 Meeti ng Apri 1 4, 1983
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1. Are we going to let that farmer sit there and not be able to, Pat
I couldn't sell you a piece of land according to this ordinance. I did
have a question mark on the density. I don't like the idea of being able I
to sell a lot and give up five acres of land that I can't really do
anything with according to this. Minimum lot width, 200 feet on a public
street and then I go down to access restrictions, actually I don't believe
there is a farm in Chanhassen except mine on West 86th Street that doesn't
abut on a collector or a minor arterial or one of these other streets. In
order for any of these farmers to sell a lot they would have to put a
public street into their property. Another concern of mine, if you had a
son that wanted to build a house or a daughter on your property, just want
to subdivide off one lot, how would you get access to that lot if you
can1t get onto one of these public streets? I went down to number 3 under
Physical Site Requirements, IINo lot shall contain more than one acre of
SCS Class I or II soilsll you have got a five acre lot, you have got a
corner of land of 2t acres that's non-productive but adjacent to that you
have got three acres of productive land, you couldn't sell that building
site because you have got more than one acre of productive land. The
next one that I have was IIAn SCS soil analysis report for the entire
tract or parcel proposed for subdivision.1I Maybe I am wrong on this,
if my farm was outside the MUSA Line and I was to subdivide it into five
acre tracts, would I have to get an SCS report on the entire farm?
Scott Martin - All that is being subdivided.
Al Klingelhutz - If we went to the five acre minimum lot size and the ten
acre density, would I have to do it on the whole farm?
Scott Martin - Yes, thatls being subdivided. The idea there Al is that I
works hand in hand with the requirement to preserve prime agricultural
land, Class I and II soil. If you throw out the preservation of Class I
and II soils and you are not concerned about the holding capacity of the
property for septic systems on a general basis as the planning process
begins. That kind of information has got to be provided to staff up front
so that we can make some judgments on whether the layout of the proposed
development, whether it's 2t acres or five acres, whether it makes any
sense.
Al Klingelhutz - If they go into a five acre minimum density and not the
one in ten, I can see it makes some sense, but why would I have to do it
on the balance of the farm that I can't subdivide until sewer get in there?
Say I had a 100 acre farm and you went on the ten acre density, I could
get ten units on that farm and I could put them on 50 acres and the other
50 acres would stay in agricultural land, why would I have to do it on
that 50 acres?
Scott Martin - I don't think you would. I mis-understood your question.
The purpose of the soil analysis report is to look at those lots that are
being subdivided for building not the residual that1s being retained in
agricultural production.
Scott Martin - If you are of the opinion to allow greater development than
what's suggested in here, that might be a throwaway because you can't
preserve farm land and then allow 2t acre parcels to be developed at the
same time.
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Al Klingelhutz - I guess my biggest problem with taking all Class I and II
soils, that's about the only soil that's really good for building too.
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Council Meeting April 4, 1983
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Councilman Geving - I doubt that we are going to be able to preserve much
farm land.
Al Klin~elhutz - There is one other question I have on the 12% slopes. I
know 12~ slopes are quite a hill but you get a nice 12% south slope, the
most beautiful place to build a solar home that you have ever seen or an
earth home, you are building into the slope, where you come out of the
house it's fairly level, that's one other question I had, too.
Mayor Hamilton - What we need to consider right now before we go any
further is whether or not the Council wants to consider the ordinance as
it has been presented to us or do we want to do as we had moved on March
21st to recognize Ordinance 45 and adopt Section 6 of Ordinance 64C.
Personally I am not in favor of being as restrictive as the ordinance
that Scott has presented to us this evening. I think if we did what we
originally intended on the 21st of March and I think we discussed it at
some length at that time, and we all felt comfortable with that. Now we
are looking at something completely different.
Councilwoman Swenson - We might mention also, that our motion, although
we don't rubber stamp the Planning Commission, coincided with the Planning
Commission's recommendation.
Mayor Hamilton - That's a good point because we decided this is something
we wanted to do this should go back to the Planning Commission for their
recommendations. We followed the Planning Commission recommendation and
I thought it was a good one and still do.
Councilman Horn - I am uncomfortable with moving ahead with this too,
based on the fact that the Planning Commission hasn't seen it. I see two
possibilities, one would be to go as they had originally recommended or
the other possibility would be to run this past them for their review to
see if they agree with us that it's not as good as what their
recommendation was or at least get their recommendation on what's been
presented. I suspect they will probably feel the way we did on it. It
puts us in a bad situation. We are seeing something that they haven1t
seen. I would like to get their comments on it.
Craig Mertz - They would have to have a public hearing on this. I am
really puzzled about what the Council IS intention is with respect to
Ordinance 45. We have one section in 45 that says that subdivision is
prohibited until sewer is available. A motion was made by the Planning
Commission to repeal. 45, that failed. The Council IS action appears to
be basically the same thing. Is it the Council IS intention that we are
going to enforce all of Ordinance 45 except for one provision that
prohibits subdivision until sewer is available?
Scott Martin - Which means you are allowing 2~ acre lots. What I was
trying to do was eliminate Ordinance 45 so we don It have all these
conflicts between ordinances. Ordinance 45 tries to do two things. It
tries to be a subdivision ordinance and a zoning ordinance. The court
didn't like that.
Mayor Hamilton - Ordinance 45 is not a bad ordinance.
Council Meeting, April 4, 1983
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Craig Mertz - If you do want to allow these 2~ acre lots and you want to
dO it in a simple fashion, which is what I seem to be hearing, I would
suggest that you repeal Section 2.01 of Ordinance 45, that's the one that
says that sewer has to preceed the subdivision, and then also enact
the emergency septic requirements which were in Section 6 of the draft.
Bill Monk - That's already been done with lOA.
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Mayor Hamilton - Bill, do you recall if that's what the Planning Commission
did?
Bill Ryan - No, we did not repeal it. We were being asked to interpret
what the intent of Ordinance 45 and 33 were when they were passed and
how they should interpreted now, what is the intent of the document that
we intend to draft and it just wasn't the right place to answer that but
we did want to do something to protect the public welfare and safety of
the people that if they do develop out there we insisted they develop
something that's going to protect them and their neighbors. Public health
was our main concern. We didn't want to try to interpret at that time
what was the intent of Ordinance 33. The real question that came up in
our meeting was, was the Subdivision Ordinance drafted to allow development
in 2~ acre parcels or was it written to restrict development and none of
us felt in a position to be able to answer that question.
Mayor Hamilton - It seems like what I hear the Council saying is they are
in favor of five acres and repeal the portion of 45 to allow subdivisions
and include adoption of Section 6 of Ordinance 64C.
Councilman Geving - Could we ask for a show of hands on the 2~ or five
acres? I think that's a key issue.
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Mayor Hamilton - Let's just ask, would you be in favor of 2~ or five acres?
Councilwoman Swenson - I can't say because we have a lot of farms on
Highway 5 and I would rather have five acre farms if we are going to give
access onto Highway 5.
Mayor Hamilton - We said here, also, to add a section, internal access
must be provided for subdivisions of two or more lots.
Councilwoman Swenson - I am going to abstain.
one way or the other.
I don It have a feeling
Councilman Geving - I will stay with 2~ acres.
Councilwoman Watson - Some day we are going to run sewers in here and who
is going to pay for those sewers? With five acre tracts there is not
going to be anybody who can afford to pay their sewer assessment. Would
2~ acre parcels make it easier for the potential for paying for putting
the sewer in some day?
Mayor Hamilton - It is so depressing to talk to the Metro Council and I
seeing what they are trying to do and I am not so sure we will ever
develop this area.
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Council Meeting April 4, 1983
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Councilwoman Watson - It's a long ways off but you know we have already
had sewer projects that didn't pay for themselves because we bet that
things would develop and people couldn't pay it and we forced development.
Mayor Hamilton - Now we are talking about the year 2000 before they allow
us to do much of anything so we were asking these people who have land
that perhaps they would like to sell or build something on to wait until
at least the year 2000, that's not fair to them. Hopefully, by the time
we get that far down the road there will be another sewage disposal system.
Councilman Horn - I see this as somebody going out and putting a house
in the middle of nowhere and eventually thatls going to get into an area
that has all housing development in there. I think what will happen is
that with five acres you have allowed enough space that you could plan a
subdivision around that at a later point. I don't see this thing being
crowded or any sewer going in until you have eventually put a subdivision
in. With a subdivision you have changed the whole character and you are
talking about 15,000 square foot lots and by putting a five acre parcel
there you have given yourself enough flexibility that you can work that
house into the rest of the subdivision. The guy that moves out and buys
five acres isn't going to look at that as a thing that he can subdivide
later and put a neighbor on. He moving out there to get away. The only
time he's going to subdivide again is when he has got sewers in. That's
really the way I see this concept working.
Councilwoman Watson - Five acres.
Al Klingelhutz - I guess you could have been pretty well protected by that.
The ordinance states that the one side yard has to be so many feet and the
other one so many feet so that you can get another lot or two in there.
I am not adverse to the five or 2~ acres.
Councilwoman Swenson - I would hope that the City has learned a lesson
in regard to the North Service Area and that if in fact the sewer goes
through people with five acres, for example, understand that these are
the number of assessments on that property and they are going to be levied
right away.
Mayor Hamilton moved to support Ordinance 45 and repeal Section 2.01 of
Ordinance 45, adopt Section 6 of Ordinance 64C, set the minimum lot size
of five acres, and include a provision that internal access must be
provided for the subdivision of two or more lots. Motion seconded by
Councilman Geving. The following voted in favor: Mayor Hamilton,
Councilwomen Swenson and Watson, Councilmen Geving and Horn. No negative
votes. Motion carried.
LAKE DRIVE EAST FEASIBILITY STUDY: In light of the letter received from
Dean Scheff of CPT, Councilwoman Swenson moved to direct the Engineer to
prepare a resolution authorizing the Engineer to prepare a feasibility
study for the extension of Lake Drive East. Motion seconded by
Councilwoman Watson. The following voted in favor: Councilwomen Swenson
and Watson, Councilmen Geving and Horn. Mayor Hamilton voted no. Motion
carried.
DOWNTOWN REDEVELOPMENT PROJECT: Mayor Hamilton presented a outline of
steps to be taken by a subcommittee comprised of the Chairman of the HRA,
Chairman of the Planning Commission and himself, to insure that work
continues on the downtown redevelopment project. No action was taken.
Counci 1 Meeti ng Apri 1 4, 1983
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SOLID WASTE LANDFILL SITING AUTHORITY: A bill has been introduced in the
Legislature (H.F. 883) which would change the county site selection
authority to basically an advisory committee and give the county boards I
the final authority to make the actual selections. Representative Dimler
was present. Council members voiced their opposition to the proposed
legislation. No action was taken.
Councilwoman Swenson moved to adjourn. Motion seconded by Councilwoman
Watson. The following voted in favor: Mayor Hamilton, Councilwomen
Swenson and Watson, Councilmen Geving and Horn. No negative votes. Motion
carried. Meeting adjourned at 11:30 p.m.
Don Ashworth
City Manager
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