CC 2014 03 24
CHANHASSEN CITY COUNCIL
REGULAR MEETING
MARCH 24, 2014
Mayor Furlong called the meeting to order at 7:10 p.m. The meeting was opened with the Pledge to
the Flag.
COUNCIL MEMBERS PRESENT:
Mayor Furlong, Councilman McDonald, Councilwoman
Tjornhom, Councilwoman Ernst, and Councilman Laufenburger
STAFF PRESENT:
Todd Gerhardt, Laurie Hokkanen, Paul Oehme, Kate Aanenson and Terry Jeffery
Mayor Furlong: Thank you and welcome everybody. Glad that you joined us this evening. Those here
in the council chambers as well as those watching at home. At this time I would ask members of the
council if there are any changes or modifications to the agenda. If not we’ll proceed with the agenda as
published without objection. We have a presentation we’d like to do tonight in recognition of Mark
Littfin’s 40 years of service in the Chanhassen Fire Department so at this time I’d like to invite Assistant
Chief Murphy to come forward and, Mr. Gerhardt perhaps you’ll join me down there as well.
Assistant Chief Murphy: Thank you. Good evening. Well it’s an honor to be up here on behalf of
everybody here at the Chanhassen Fire Department to recognize one of our longest serving members
that’s served on the fire department. On May 10, 1073 Mark Littfin joined the Chanhassen Fire
Department and to put that in perspective, 23 of our current active fire fighters were not even born when
Mark joined on his first day with Chanhassen so with that, in his 40 plus years since 1973 Mark has pretty
much done it all. He’s been a fire fighter. He’s been an officer. Lieutenant. Captain. Engineer.
Assistant Chief and through all that leadership what he has done is, he’s brought compassion. He’s
brought vision and he’s made every one of us that you see here, sitting here wearing these nice pretty
uniforms, we’re all better fire fighters for it. So without further ado, Mark could you come on up?
Mayor Furlong: Stand in the middle there. On behalf of the Chanhassen City Council Mark, thank you
for your years of service represented with a Certificate this evening and some other things. I’d just like to
read for everybody what’s on this Certificate. Presented by the Chanhassen, City of Chanhassen and
Chanhassen Fire Department to Mark Littfin for outstanding service with the Chanhassen Fire
Department from May 10, 1973 to December 24, 2013. After 40 plus years of service Mark Littfin will
retire from the Chanhassen Fire Department. He is the second longest serving member of the department
in it’s history. Over the course of his career he is, as a paid on call member Mark has served in a variety
of roles as we just heard. Fire fighter. Captain. Fire Marshal. Assistant Chief. Even as Mark was hired
by the City as a full time Fire Marshal in 1988, he continued to serve paid on call member for the
department for over 25 years. Mark has been a great asset to our fire department and to the citizens of
Chanhassen. We’ll miss his knowledge, dedication, experience, passion and Mark we’re just going to
miss you being out there and making those early morning calls and you’re staying on with the City
though?
Mark Littfin: Yes I am. I still love what I do.
Mayor Furlong: So this is not a retirement from the City. Just from the fire department so we’ll miss you
in your role in the fire department so congratulations. (Applause). Chief you have some input.
Assistant Chief Murphy: Yes. Can we have Derice come up because as all of you know being an on call
volunteer fire department we carry pagers and our significant others put up with us and Derice, you’re in
this just as much as Mark was and so we’d like to.
Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Mayor Furlong: You’re giving her my flowers?
Derice Littfin: Thank you very much. Appreciate it.
Assistant Chief Murphy: And not only has Mark and Derice put 40 plus years into this, their son Chris
has been a significant part of not only their family but our family. I’ve known Chris since I got on 17
years ago. Chris has probably been there longer so Chris why don’t you come on up. Chris is also an
honorary member of the Chanhassen Fire Department. He’s been there every Monday night, almost for I
don’t know however long it’s been. Since before I met him and we got Chris his own helmet…and Chris
pretty much went wherever we went so thanks Chris.
Todd Gerhardt: You get to say a few things.
Mark Littfin: Let me get my act together here. This all started, it started with my grandfather. He was on
Winsted Fire Department. He was 47 years. I couldn’t quite get to that. 25 years of that was Chief
which is unbelievable. So I still, I started when I was, or I started here he was still alive so we told some
stories back and forth. Skipped a generation with my dad. He did 25 missions as a pilot and he probably
had enough of that type of stuff so I got kind of into this working at the Dinner Theater. Saturday night
was emergency and I thought this looks kind of pretty cool so that’s kind of what got me going. Then a
couple guys that worked at the Bronco Bar, Rick Anding was, he’d get me going because he was talking
it up all the time. A couple other guys and they said, you know can you walk and chew gum. Come up
Monday night and we’ll get you going and here’s a pair of boots and a coat. Come up… And then what
we’re most proud of is our son Jake who started full time Red Wing Fire Department. Fire paramedic.
He just started his first shift, his first 24 hour shift here 2 weeks ago so we’re just extremely with that. He
quit work and went to paramedic school. Graduated and now he’s full time with Red Wing so he’s going
to carry on with our tradition but my biggest helper has been Derice because when the pager goes off, we
know what we’re getting into. Her and every other spouse, significant other is at home wondering,
worrying what’s happening. When we go there, yeah it’s a fire. We’re in control. We know what we’re
doing. We don’t take chances. We drive careful, the whole bit but they’re lying in bed. Awake. Waiting
for the front door to slam and everything is cool and, but they put up with a lot. An awful lot so, and
when the pager goes off at birthdays, holidays, Christmas you know, we’re up and out the door and
they’ve got to kind of deal with that so. Lot of stories. Lot of memories. We had a bad, nasty call last
Monday down at the wye but first time in 25 years so hopefully it’s another 25 years before we see that
one again too so. It was unfortunate but that’s life so. But we’ll keep trying to make…better so that
doesn’t happen so, but I’ll still be around during the days. I’ve got a couple wonderful years yet. I love
my job full time with the City Fire Marshal. I don’t want to give that up. I look forward to coming to
work every day and that’s due to Todd and Laurie and the Mayor and staff. I mean it’s a great place to
work. I love it so my hats off to these folks.
Todd Gerhardt: No joke?
Mark Littfin: We’ll tell those at the station. But I don’t have any good jokes. It’s just been a wonderful
20 years. Or 40 years, I’m sorry.
Derice Littfin: You’re still wearing your 25 year jacket.
Mark Littfin: I’ve still got a jacket that says 25 year member and people say geez, you’ve been on a long
time and I said well add 15 to that.
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Todd Gerhardt: Well I’m sure the volunteers all here are going to miss Mark and so if you miss him
really bad you come over to City Hall and you can see him because he’s not leaving us here. We still
need him and he does a great job for us and I’m glad he’s still here and he usually has a joke but I’m a
little disappointed that he doesn’t have a joke today but I’m sure he’ll have one later on over at the
department so, Mark on behalf of all the City staff, thank you. We really appreciate your service and 40
years.
Mark Littfin: My pleasure.
Todd Gerhardt: Has gone by fast.
Mark Littfin: It’s my pleasure so thank you.
Mayor Furlong: Okay, as we continue with the next items on our meeting.
CONSENT AGENDA:
Mayor Furlong: We’ll start with the consent agenda items. These items will be considered in a single
motion and that motion will be to adopt staff’s recommendation on each item respectively. These items
are listed in the agenda under Section E, items 1 through 13. At this point I would ask if there’s any
member of the council or others present that would like separate discussion on any of the items. Sir.
Mark Anderson: Honorable Mayor, we’d like further discussion on item number 6. Lyman Boulevard
Wetland Alteration Permit.
Mayor Furlong: Okay, thank you.
Mark Anderson: Thank you.
Mayor Furlong: Why don’t we go ahead and bring that up under I guess new business would be the place
to bring it up. So we’ll bring that up under, as the 1.5 under new business. Between items 1 and 2 if
that’s okay. Without objection. Any other items for separate discussion? If not is there a motion to
approve items E(1) through (13) excluding item (6).
Councilwoman Ernst moved, Councilman Laufenburger seconded to approve the following consent
agenda items pursuant to the City Manager’s recommendations:
1. Approval of City Council Minutes dated March 10, 2014
2. Receive Planning Commission Minutes dated March 4, 2014
3. Receive Park and Recreation Commission Minutes dated February 25, 2014 and Work Session
Minutes dated March 11, 2014
Resolution #2014-17:
4. 2014 Street Reconstruction Project: Call Assessment Hearing
Resolution #2014-18:
5. 2014 Vehicles & Equipment: Approve Annual Purchases
Resolution #2014-19:
7. Approve Resolution for Advancing State Aid Funds for Lyman Boulevard
Improvements
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
8. Approval of Liquor License Renewals
9. Approval of Collaborative Agreement with Carver County for ESRI (GIS) Software
10. Deleted
Resolution #2014-20:
11. 2014 Sealcoat Project: Approve Resolution Accepting Bids and
Awarding Contract
12. Powers Pointe: Approve Access Easement Agreement
13. Approval of Arbor Day Poster Contest Winners.
All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 5 to 0.
VISITOR PRESENTATIONS:
None.
LAW ENFORCEMENT/FIRE DEPARTMENT UPDATE.
Mayor Furlong: Good evening Lieutenant.
Lt. Jeff Enevold: Mr. Mayor, council, good evening.
Mayor Furlong: Good evening.
Lt. Jeff Enevold: Boy, looking at Mark Littfin after 40 years and I take a look at myself after 25 and all
these gray hairs, how does he not get gray hairs? I don’t understand it. I’ve got to ask him how he does
that. I’d like to introduce these folks standing next to me. This is Nick Warren and Jackie Warren and I
have the honor of recognizing these two folks for providing assistance to the sheriff’s office for the
apprehension of an intoxicated driver. On March 15, 2014 Nick and Jackie noticed a vehicle driving in
front of them erratically. They witnessed the vehicle drive onto the shoulder. Over the center line. It
would stop. Slow down. Speed up. Nick called 911 to report the incident and then Jackie took out her
phone and started videotaping the driving behavior. They were able to follow the vehicle into Shakopee,
back into Chanhassen onto County Road 61 where an Eden Prairie officer got there and made sure
everything was okay. Our deputies responded. They gave a PBT and arrested the driver for DWI. The
driver’s blood alcohol content was .30 and the legal intoxication is .08 so very intoxicated. Because
Jackie took the time to film this incident we were able to take that. Transfer it onto a CD. We’ll be able
to use it in court as evidence so without these folks willing to get involved this could have easily ended in
a tragedy so it’s really my pleasure on behalf of the sheriff’s office and the City, it’s my pleasure to award
the Citizen Coins to Jackie and to Nick for helping remove an intoxicated driver off the streets. Thank
you very much. Alright, let’s go to the next slide here.
Todd Gerhardt: Thank you.
Mayor Furlong: Yes, thank you very much. Appreciate it.
Lt. Jeff Enevold: Yeah, without the eyes and ears of the folks you know we can’t do it all so it was a
great thing they did.
Mayor Furlong: Did you have any hesitation?
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Nick Warren: No.
Mayor Furlong: No?
Nick Warren: No. We saw the car driving towards us and I knew at that moment I needed to turn around
and follow him.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. Thank you very much for doing that. We appreciate it and on behalf of the
person they didn’t hit or the tree that they didn’t run into themselves, extend their appreciation as well.
Thank you.
Lt. Jeff Enevold: You guys don’t have to stick around if you don’t want to.
Nick Warren: Thank you again.
Mayor Furlong: Thanks.
Councilman Laufenburger: Is that commentary on the council meeting Lieutenant or what?
Lt. Jeff Enevold: Well I think they’ve had enough excitement for one night.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you.
Lt. Jeff Enevold: Last month I received a call from the sheriff who had received a call from a concerned
citizen who had heard from other citizens that they got the impression that the deputies in Chanhassen
were maybe a little heavy handed in writing too many citations so we set up a meeting with this
individual over a cup of coffee and we listened to the concerns and before I met with him I did some
research into statistics and I’ll share that with you on the next slide but if you remember this is one of our
goals for the year and I shared this with the person as well. We want to identify and address traffic issues
and concerns within the city and then look for creative solutions to solve those issues with an emphasis on
prevention and education, and I stress those two. So the next slide here I’ll kind of share with you what I
did with him in case you’re hearing concerns like this or there are other citizens who have concerns like
this. This is a 6 year comparison and as you can see over the 6 year period, you look at the left side are
the number of traffic stops and the right are the number of citations and over the 6 year period it amounts
to an average of 43% of traffic stops result in a citation being issued so I think we’re meeting our goals
and I think it’s a great balance of education and enforcement and that individual was pleased to see this
and kind of surprised to see this so we’re meeting our goals. Any questions on that? Okay.
Unfortunately the Citizens Academy that we were going to run this spring, I only received 6 applications
so we had to postpone it and we’re going to re-advertise in the fall and I’ve talked with each of those
individuals and they’re willing to keep their applications on file for the fall so we’ll do some additional
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recruiting for our fall Citizens Academy. Public safety seminar we held on Tuesday, March 18 from
5:30 to 9:30 p.m. Beth Hoiseth and I hosted this event out at the Scale facility. We kind of wanted to
change things up a little bit so we took them out there to use the shooting simulator and the driving
simulator and there were 19 folks that came out there and here’s just some action shots. You can see
Sergeant George Pufahl is teaching half the class there about kind of use of force. Deadly force and how
the simulator works. You can see one of the citizens of Chanhassen there making some decisions and it
looks like he’s ready to shoot there. Here’s the driving simulator and you can see this particular call for
service, you can see the smoke in the distance there. This was a call, a response to a car fire and they
have to drive through intersections and be cautious and take turns and I tell you, these folks had a great
time and I probably even had a better time. It’s just fun to see folks do this and it was a great time had by
everyone so that’s my presentation for you Mr. Mayor and council. Any questions for me?
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Any questions for Lieutenant? Mr. Laufenburger.
Councilman Laufenburger: Lieutenant Enevold.
Lt. Jeff Enevold: Yes sir.
Councilman Laufenburger: I’m catching a little bit off guard on this but I’ve observed, the subject is
regarding E cigarettes and what I’m, my question is, I saw something that was quite alarming that there
seems to be a lot of mis-education or lack of education regarding E cigarettes and I’m wondering if you’re
observing anything in the nature of either poisoning associated with the vapor that’s used with these
cigarettes. Are you seeing an escalation of abuse by minors? Do you have any observations or is the
County seeing anything like this right now?
Lt. Jeff Enevold: I haven’t heard of or seen any issues related to that. It’s my understanding that the
vapors coming out of there are only water vapors. But I know there’s some of these folks are using,
putting different substances in there to try and hide you know that they’re smoking nicotine in there but I
haven’t, I mean the deputies haven’t come across anything. I haven’t seen anything in the blotter so to
my knowledge there’s no issues with that.
Councilman Laufenburger: Then my only request Lieutenant would be that, just kind of keep an eye on
this and if you, if you get a chance to see any statistics in the county or in the metro area where this is
something that perhaps we need to be aware of, or at least in tune with and if there’s some education that
might be appropriate. I know Bob Zydowsky, the School Resource Officer, I know he’s in touch, or he
observes the students over there. I’d just ask that you just kind of raise your antenna on this a little bit if
you wouldn’t mind.
Lt. Jeff Enevold: I will absolutely do that.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay, thank you very much Lieutenant. That’s all I have.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Any other questions? Lieutenant I have one regarding the monthly report.
Lt. Jeff Enevold: Yes sir.
Mayor Furlong: With regard to activity and that is regarding Part I crimes in the month of February. The
only Part I crimes were theft but unfortunately there were 14 of them.
Lt. Jeff Enevold: Right.
Mayor Furlong: And I guess I’m curious if you have any idea what was driving that? Year to date Part I
crimes are the same as they were a year ago so it’s not driving them up but we’re running much higher
year to date on thefts. Is there a trend there? Is there some, anything that you can observe or share with
us?
Lt. Jeff Enevold: You know I took a look at that Mr. Mayor and I printed out all the thefts from the
beginning of the year and what I see is, we have thefts from vehicles accounted for 7 of those and since
the first of the year we’ve had about 5 thefts from vehicles at the dog park out at Minnewashta Park and
we’re working with Marty Walsh and the parks to put additional signage and there’s talk about putting
some cameras out there to try to deter or capture some of that stuff.
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Mayor Furlong: Okay.
Lt. Jeff Enevold: There was 8 of those were gas drive off thefts. 6 were shoplifters and then there was
some miscellaneous stuff in there. There was some stuff stolen from the Rec Center. There was a theft
from purse at work and then a couple cab fares were not paid so I don’t see anything that’s out of the
ordinary there.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. Alright. And again total Part I crimes year to date is the same as last year it’s just
sometimes there are different ones that are created so.
Lt. Jeff Enevold: Sure.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you.
Lt. Jeff Enevold: You’re welcome.
Mayor Furlong: Appreciate that. Also this evening with the fire department is Assistant Chief Cori
Wallis. Good evening Assistant Chief Wallis.
Assistant Chief Cori Wallis: Mr. Mayor, council, good evening.
Mayor Furlong: Good evening.
Assistant Chief Cori Wallis: After our presentation with Mark, I am one of those that was not born in
1973 so I can put myself in that category. I don’t have much to report tonight. Year to date as of the end
of February when this report was written we were at 124 calls. As of today we’re at 164. We are at least
one-third up on calls for the year so far. We are currently working on 3 fire investigations that we’ve had.
nd
One was on February 2. A piece of equipment in a home that was actually recalled several years ago
started on fire. The homeowner put that fire out. We assisted them with smoke removal and a little bit of
overhaul. We had a second call last week, Monday which is our first fatal fire that we’ve had in the first
25 years. The State Fire Marshal’s office is leading the investigation on that with Carver County and Fire
Marshal Mark Littfin. We don’t have any results on that yet but as soon as we get them we will get them
to you. And we also had a third fire last I believe it was Friday morning. We had another fire. Some
chemicals had mixed. Started on fire. Started a load of dirty laundry on fire and luckily the homeowner
was an early riser and took care of that. We’re going into spring which means that we are starting our
compliance issue. Hose testing. Ladder testing. Equipment testing. Fire truck testing so as soon as the
weather starts to cooperate we will start getting those things done and then making repairs as needed to
the fleet. That’s all I have unless you guys have questions for me tonight.
Mayor Furlong: Any questions for the fire department under their report this evening? Councilwoman
Tjornhom.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: And this is probably to the fire department and staff both regarding the, I
don’t know what you call it. The property where the fatal fire occurred.
Assistant Chief Cori Wallis: Yes.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: What is the story with that parcel? Is it a rental units? Is it inspected
regularly? It seems it doesn’t necessarily fit in I don’t think with a lot of the surrounding development
that we have in town.
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Kate Aanenson: I can address that.
Mayor Furlong: Ms. Aanenson.
Kate Aanenson: Thank you council members. This property is a legal non-conforming use so I did speak
to the owner after the fire. They have a right to rebuild where the fire was because it is legal non-
conforming so they can build it back to the way it was. MnDOT is acquiring part of that property with
the roundabout so we talked about that so there will be a building being removed but this is part of the
upgrade that we talked about with the study that we’re doing down there. The corridor study. The vision
that we have for that area to upgrade. The underlying property owners, well some of the other property
owners along there anticipate being able to get higher and better uses down there but that does have legal
non-conforming rights so what we do is, we do inspect it to make sure that they haven’t increased in the
number of units or buildings. They did put a new septic system in a number of years ago when they had a
failing system so we do check on that.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: Another question if that’s okay.
Mayor Furlong: Sure.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: When you drive by there, there’s kind of like an RV with a tent or something
wrapped around it.
Kate Aanenson: Yes.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: Don’t we have some sort of ordinance about that?
Kate Aanenson: Actually the non-conformity also includes some of the RV campers so there’s a number
of buildings that they can have and a number of RV’s that can be permitted there so. And we have
followed up on times when there’s added rooms or places put on, then we do follow up and inspect them
and ask, or send letters to follow up. Yeah.
Todd Gerhardt: Mayor, council. We have inspected the units. They did have working smoke detectors
in them. This is outside of our service area for municipal sewer and water so it does have an operational
septic system as Kate had mentioned. It is on an individual well. However the units are not sprinkled.
They’re not required to be sprinkled and not to say that you couldn’t have them sprinkled in a rural area
but they would have to have their own individual well for that to occur and some type of pressure system
to handle that. My guess the cost benefit of that for the units for the property owner to install those
doesn’t make sense so right now they are in compliance with all our ordinances.
Mayor Furlong: Okay.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: Thank you.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Any other questions regarding the fire department monthly report?
Assistant Chief thank you.
Assistant Chief Cori Wallis: Thank you. Have a good night.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. We’ll move now to the next items on our agenda.
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
BUSINESS IMPACT GROUP: REQUEST FOR REZONING FOR A MINOR AMENDMENT TO
THE CHANHASSEN WEST BUSINESS PARK PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPMENT (PUD) TO
INCREASE THE MAXIMUM BUILDING SQUARE FOOTAGE WITHIN THE
DEVELOPMENT; AND SITE PLAN REVIEW TO CONSTRUCT A 39,240 SQ. FT. OFFICE/
WAREHOUSE BUILDING ON PROPERTY ZONED PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPMENT (PUD);
LOCATED ON PART OF LOTS 1 & 2, BLOCK 1, CHANHASSEN WEST BUSINESS PARK,
2410 GALPIN BOULEVARD.
Kate Aanenson: Thank you Mayor, members of the City Council. This item did appear before the
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Planning Commission at their March 24 meeting. They did recommend approval. There was a concern
from the property owner to the, adjacent to it regarding buffering and I’ll go through that in a little bit
more detail when we get to that slide. So there’s two actions for you tonight. One is rezoning for a minor
amendment to the Chan West Business Park and the other is a site plan review. The rezoning itself is less
than 5% so we consider it a minor amendment. In your staff report there’s a compliance table that shows
all the buildings so every project that comes in we measure that so this is a 12,000 square foot addition
but it’s still within the threshold of the overall project area. It’s also what we would consider you know
the traffic increase is pretty nominal compared to what, what could have been. Another building with a
little bit larger footprint so we felt the minor amendment made sense. So then the second action would be
the review of the site plan for the 39,240 square feet for BIG. The project is located on Galpin Boulevard
so you have Lyman Boulevard here and then Galpin Boulevard so it’s this property in front here. Just
anecdotally there is one more site that you have given site plan approval so that could just come forward
with a building permit and that’s this area right in here. The subject we’re talking about is the highlighted
in blue. Just a little over 2 acres. So again the square footage breakdown and the total office, 30%. Light
industrial 70% and then 12,000 square foot increase. The original threshold of this was approximately
450,000 square feet so they are still with under that in the PUD but when we do a PUD we establish kind
of with that PUD what we believe were the anticipated uses. So that would be the minor amendment.
Again we are recommending, as did the Planning Commission recommended approval on that. So the
site plan itself, the orientation. The front of it would be towards the Galpin Boulevard and then loading
would be on the western side of the building. Again meets all the requirements for parking. This is the
perspective. I do have the building materials here if you’re interested in seeing the specific details but it’s
a highly articulated building and, with the stone veneer, arched copper, is the stucco on the remaining
portion of the building. The majority portion of the building. Again a very nice looking building as all
the other buildings within that development. Elevations on all, articulation on all four sides. Grading.
And then the landscaping plan. So this is where the issue came up with the property owner to the north
here just making sure there was enough buffer and also the view then that you would see of the loading
docks so in the staff report, the gentleman who has a business to the north then came and met with city
staff to review kind of what his concerns were and had a meeting with the City Forester. Came back with
some specific recommendations and those are identified in condition number 29 so they have been added
to your staff report so we’ve gone over that condition with both parties. The neighboring party and the
applicant itself to make sure that that makes sense for what we’re trying to do there. I think the concern
with the, with BIG is to make sure that, because there’s a parking lot there, that something would be
viable if we tried to put some additional elements in there so we’ve got shrubs and some trees within there
so both parties are happy with that condition. So with that we are recommending approval of the minor
amendment and the site plan and I’d be happy to answer any questions that you have.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Any questions for staff? Ms. Aanenson, what’s on the north property line,
what’s the setback there?
Kate Aanenson: How close the building is?
Mayor Furlong: Right. Property line. What space are we fitting the landscaping in?
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Kate Aanenson: I have to go back to the first slide, I’m sorry. Yeah, it’s to get the parking lot in front so
it’s the parking. But they have windows on this side too so you’ve got the parking lot between.
Mayor Furlong: Right.
Kate Aanenson: So it’s probably about 60.
Mayor Furlong: What about from the property line? Setback from the property line.
Kate Aanenson: Oh it’s like 10 feet.
Mayor Furlong: Northern property line.
Kate Aanenson: Yeah, yeah.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. So within that 10 feet that’s where they’re going to be planting.
Kate Aanenson: That’s correct.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. And you said it was direction from, reading the Minutes the Planning
Commission gave direction based upon the comments made at the public hearing and the result of the
subsequent meetings was condition number 29.
Kate Aanenson: That’s correct.
Mayor Furlong: And you met with both the applicant and with the property owner to the north?
Kate Aanenson: That’s correct.
Mayor Furlong: Okay.
Kate Aanenson: Yeah, because I think the concern was that they want to make sure that whatever we
recommended there was viable to grow and so, yep.
Mayor Furlong: Okay, thank you. Any other questions? For staff at this point. Is the applicant here?
Yes? No?
Kate Aanenson: No.
Mayor Furlong: No?
Kate Aanenson: No, I think they’re as long as we put the condition I think they were amenable to us
moving forward with that.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. Alright, that’s fine. With that a public hearing was held at the Planning
Commission meeting. The only change of the specifics was condition 29 here. I don’t know if there’s
anybody here that would like to provide comment with regard to that change but we’d certainly entertain
that if there is. Sir. If you’d like to come up to the podium please.
Peter Larson: Mr. Mayor, council.
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Mayor Furlong: Good evening.
Peter Larson: I’m Peter from Waytek.
Mayor Furlong: Yes.
Peter Larson: And I’d like to thank you guys for considering all the changes and everything. The only
thing that we’re concerned about with the vegetation along that north side of where the loading dock
would be is that may die and then if it needs to get replaced and what not and we just, you know Bob our
president was talking about perhaps having a wall there. I don’t know if that’s feasible or not with space
but just something to think about because you know with the snowplowing and all that, there’s a good
chance that snow will hit that and could damage the trees.
Kate Aanenson: I think we did evaluate that. Even with a wall when you’re pushing snow up against it
sometimes either they also can have issues but I think we’ve had pretty good success with property
owners managing their buildings when those issues arise.
Peter Larson: Okay. Okay.
Kate Aanenson: And if the trees do die then they may take the perspective of maybe a wall would be
better.
Peter Larson: Okay, great.
Kate Aanenson: We get a little bit more height with some of the trees I think was the issue too.
Peter Larson: Okay, yeah. Okay.
Kate Aanenson: So I think we tried to identified, our forester did a species that would be probably more
tolerant for that and be a little bit better but if there’s a problem you can certainly contact us in the future.
Peter Larson: Okay. Okay. Alright, thank you. Have a good night.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Anyone else? Thank you. Appreciate that. With that we’ll bring it to
council for comments and discussion and a motion. Any thoughts or comments? If I’m not mistaken
BIG is located right across the street here so they’re expanding, or their business is expanding. They need
more space and they’re choosing to stay here in town.
Kate Aanenson: That’s correct.
Mayor Furlong: That’s a wonderful statement for what they’re doing. Another 40,000 square foot
building coming into town so, any other thoughts or comments? Mr. McDonald?
Councilman McDonald: I had no comments. I was just going to go ahead and read the motion.
Mayor Furlong: Please do.
Councilman McDonald: Okay Mr. Mayor, council. The Chanhassen City Council approves the minor
amendment in the Chanhassen West Business Park Planned Unit Development to increase the maximum
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
building square footage within the development and the site plan review to construct a 39,240 square foot
office/warehouse building subject to the conditions of the staff report and adopts the Findings of Fact.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Is there a second?
Councilwoman Tjornhom: Second.
Mayor Furlong: Motion’s been made and seconded. Any discussion on the motion? Mr. Laufenburger.
Councilman Laufenburger: Thank you Mr. Mayor. Kate, I just have a question for you. You made
reference to a building site just to the west of this that’s included in the original PUD, is that correct?
Kate Aanenson: That’s correct.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. And so did I read you, did I hear you correctly saying that if anybody
chooses to build on that area all they have to come forward is a building permit? They must comply with
certain maximum square footage in the PUD wouldn’t they?
Kate Aanenson: That’s correct. That one’s already been calculated in there. They’ve gone through site
plan review. The builder chose not to go forward at that time.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay.
Kate Aanenson: So it already has gone through the entitlement process so it’s factored in there but you’re
right. You are correct in saying anything that would change it would have to come back before you but if
it stays in that same format with just some minor change it would just get a building permit.
Councilman Laufenburger: Perfect. Thank you Mr. Mayor.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Any other discussion on the motion? Hearing none without objection we’ll
proceed with the vote.
Councilman McDonald moved, Councilwoman Tjornhom seconded that the Chanhassen City
approves the minor amendment to the Chanhassen West Business Park Planned
Council
Unit Development (PUD) to increase the maximum building square footage within the
development; and the Site Plan Review to construct a 39,240 square foot office/warehouse
building subject to the following conditions and adoption of the attached Findings of Fact
and Recommendation:
1.The developer shall enter into a site plan agreement with the City.
2.The developer shall pay the park fee of $23,121.00 with the building permit.
3.The developer shall install a pedestrian access to the Galpin Boulevard trail.
4.The developer shall provide benches and/or picnic tables for employees.
5.The developer shall provide detail of the bioretention areas is provided showing:
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
a.Any soil amendments and corrections,
b.Pre-treatment practices to be employed and these shall be shown on the plan view and in
the detail sheet (It is highly recommended that something similar to the Rain Guardian
developed by Anoka Conservation District be used.), and
c.Steps that will be taken to prevent compaction and siltation of the area resulting from
construction activities on the site.
6.Hydrologic calculations demonstrating that the features will draw down in 48 hours or less
are provided.
7.Hydrologic and water quality calculations demonstrating the features will treat 1-inch water
quality volume from impervious areas is provided.
8.An exhibit showing pre- and post-development drainage is provided.
9.Calculations shall be provided demonstrating that no increase in runoff rates will result at any
point leaving the site after build out.
10.The SWPPP shall be modified such that it is a standalone document which includes all
elements required by the permit. At a minimum this shall include the following elements:
a.A narrative of construction activity per Part IIIA 1.
b.A listing of the chain of responsibility for oversight of SWPPP implementation per Part
IIIA 2.
c.Training documentation for those involved in the design and implementation of the
SWPPP per Part IIIF.
d.Designs and calculations for meeting Stormwater Discharge Requirements although it is
understood that this project was originally permitted under different rules so design
requirements will be to that approval as administered by Carver County WMO.
e.Estimated preliminary quantities tabulation for al erosion prevention and sediment
control BMPs per Part IIIA 5.
f.Impervious coverage pre-development and post-development per Part IIIA 5.
g.Site map showing soil types per Part IIIA 5.
h.A map of surface waters and wetlands within one-mile of site which will receive
stormwater. The SWPPP must identify if these are special or impaired waters. Lake
Hazeltine receives runoff from the site and is listed as a 303D impaired water.
i.The SWPPP must indicate who is responsible for the maintenance of the permanent
stormwater management practices on the site and a maintenance plan to assure
performance of the practice as listed in Part IIIA 5 k.
j.The plans must show all elements required under part IV.C of the permit.
11.The existing Storm Catch Basin identified as ST CB on sheet C5.01A shall either be
abandoned and have the conveyance eliminated or shall have inlet protection provided prior
to disturbance within the area tributary to the CB. This shall be shown on the plan sheet and
included within the Sequence of Construction.
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
12.The bioretention area must be designed and constructed following the guidelines set forth in
the on-line Minnesota Stormwater Manual.
13.Because the site connects to city infrastructure, the City and/or their representatives shall be
represented at the pre-construction meeting and shall approve the installation of BMPs. The
Sequence of Construction shall be changed to reflect this.
14.Bioretention areas cannot be brought on-line until all tributary areas are stabilized. The
Sequence of Construction shall reflect this.
15.Inlet protection shall be called out at all curb cut areas and the practice shall be included in
the details. The Sequence of Construction shall reflect this need.
16.The swale areas must be stabilized with ditch checks, erosion control blanket or other
approved best management practice.
17.Silt fence or other acceptable perimeter control practices shall be extended to protect all
down gradient areas including the entire frontage along Galpin Court and shall be shown on
both C5.01A and C5.02A.
18.The Sequence of Construction found on Sheet C5.02 A shall have “if required by contract”
removed.
19.On sheet C5.03A, the city does not allow for the use of wooden posts for silt fence. The silt
fence detail must be modified to reflect this.
20.On sheet C5.03A, change Maintenance Note 7 to include compaction and sediment
protection from all construction related activities.
21.The plans must meet all requirements set forth by other agencies with authority over the site.
The applicant is responsible to procure all necessary approvals and permissions. This
includes, among others, the MN Pollution Control Agency and the Carver County
Watershed Management Organization.
22.The developer must submit a soils report to the City.
23.The engineer shall revise the proposed grading plan to show the existing and proposed
elevation at the corners of the proposed building.
24.The plan shall be revised to show locations of proposed stockpile areas.
25.The plan shall be revised to show the top and bottom wall elevations at points along the
wall.
26.The engineer shall show the truck turning movements in the loading area on the plan.
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
27.The plan must follow all applicable State and Federal guidelines, including ADA standards
for the sidewalk reconstruction.
28.Sanitary sewer and water main to be installed for this project shall be privately owned and
maintained.
29.The applicant shall work with staff to develop a revised landscaping plan, which shall be
submitted for review and approval prior to issuance of a building permit. Additional
landscaping shall be installed along the north property line. Suitable species for the area
next to the building include arborvitae, such as Techny, and columnar trees such as Apollo
or Sugar Cone maple. To block views of the truck loading docks, the applicant shall install
a hedge along the property line north of the loading docks. The shrub materials selected
should provide year round coverage to a mature height of at least 5’ – 6’.
All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 5 to 0.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you everyone. Thank you. Let’s move now to item number E(6) which was
request to be removed from our consent agenda.
CONSENT AGENDA: E(6). LYMAN BOULEVARD WETLAND ALTERATION PERMIT:
REQUEST FOR WETLAND ALTERATION PERMIT FOR PROPOSED ROADWAY
RECONSTRUCTION AND IMPROVEMENT PROJECT OF THE SEGMENT OF CSAH 18
BETWEEN CSAH 15 (AUDUBON ROAD) AND CSAH 17 (POWERS BOULEVARD),
APPLICANT: CARVER COUNTY.
Mayor Furlong: Why don’t we start, sir if I can invite you back up here. If you could state your question
and reason for, desire for discussion then we can perhaps go to a staff report.
Mark Anderson: Sure. Mr. Mayor and council, my name is Mark Anderson with MFRA and I’m
representing PPB Holdings. Landowner on the south side of Lyman Boulevard, adjacent to the proposed
Lyman Boulevard improvements of which the mitigation plan and permit that you’re considering tonight
is a part of. The concern with the proposed mitigation plan that.
Mayor Furlong: Lay that right over the top of, there you go. Ms. Aanenson, could you pull those things
out of his way if they’re in his way? Thank you. Thank you.
Mark Anderson: So on the screen I’ve got a copy of the county highway plans and what’s shown here is
PPB Holding property on the south side of Lyman Boulevard and part of the application that you’re
considering tonight is impacts that the roadway is having on existing wetlands in this area and we’ve
communicated with the County on a couple of occasions. My client and myself about our concern for a
proposed 24 inch culvert crossing from north to south on Lyman Boulevard that then drains onto PPB
Holding property and consequently flows across private property without an easement in the direction of
the orange arrow. This is concerning for our client because one, the pipe size is being increased from an
18 inch to a 24 inch. As well the pipe is being extended into PPB property. They do have a small
easement for the pipe itself but not for the conveyance of water in the direction of the orange arrow.
Along with that the toe of slope, this is a low area on my client’s property and so the toe of slope is being
extended into the property approximately 40 feet without any additional permanent easement so those are
all things that we’re working through with the County to address so that they don’t negatively impact my
client’s property. How it relates to the discussion tonight, since those items haven’t quite yet been
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
formally addressed is that in conversations again with the County public works department, there will
likely be additional wetland impacts to convey this water properly to the west and so the report that
you’re considering and the permit application that you’re considering tonight does not fully address these
items and will likely be amended again so that our client’s property is not negatively impacted. So rather
than approve it tonight we’d like to request that it be tabled, hopefully not longer than the next council
meeting so that we can fully address these items. Fully address the wetland impacts that occur within the
temporary easement that’s noted here and then amend the report and approve accurately addressing the
drainage concerns.
Mayor Furlong: Okay, thank you. Mr. Oehme, Mr. Gerhardt, Mr. Jeffery, good evening. Welcome to
the seat. Perhaps you could address Mr. Anderson’s comments.
Terry Jeffery: I can speak to the sequencing and the wetland replacement as to the design issue in the
procurement of easement for that drainage that’s, that falls to the design of the plan. What is before you
is a wetland alteration permit, Wetland Conservation Act replacement plan based upon the design that
was provided. The design that was provided meets the Wetland Conservation Act in that it minimizes to
the greatest extent practicable the impacts necessary to build the project. To the extent that there may be
additional impacts or may not be additional impacts depending on if any design changes occur would be
outside of the germane of what has been requested by the County in terms of the wetland replacement
plan so under Chapter 8420 they are to look for ways to avoid impacts. If that is not possible, look for
ways to minimize impacts and then those impacts which are unavoidable to either try and rectify on site
over time or to mitigate for somewhere else. It is staff’s and the Technical Evaluation Panel’s opinion
that this application meets all of those requirements and has in good faith achieved the goals of the
Wetland Conservation Act. That does not preclude at a future time, if changes to the plan are deemed
necessary that that would then be handled under a separate application but right now that is a design
question is outside of the scope of what is being presented with this application.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. So the issues raised by Mr. Anderson, am I understanding it correctly that those,
that there may be changes that occur in the future depending on the results of additional work on, if there
are changes to the design there may be changes or an amendment to the Wetland Alteration Permit? May
or may not.
Terry Jeffery: May or may not. If the design, if the engineers decide for whatever reason that additional
changes need to be made and that results in impacts then yes, we would address that at that time but to
speculate on what may or may not happen without a plan is beyond the scope of this wetland application.
Mayor Furlong: And does the plan include the 24 inch culvert?
Terry Jeffery: Yes it does.
Mayor Furlong: Okay, so Mr. Aanenson help us understand if, if the application meets the plan design
that was approved, and that includes the 24 inch culvert, do you disagree with the permit application?
Mark Anderson: Only with regard to the water that’s conveyed through the 24 inch culvert so Mr. Jeffery
is certainly accurate that the county plan does include the 24 inch culvert. What it doesn’t address is that
it’s discharging public waters from the north side of Lyman Boulevard to private land without any
easement to convey it downstream. As well it doesn’t present a positive ditch slope to convey it to the
west so that it doesn’t negatively impact the PPB Holding property so the pipe is part of the plan but the
conveyance of the public water has not been addressed.
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Mayor Furlong: And Mr. Jeffery or Mr. Oehme, I mean with regard to that, is that part of the application
you have to consider that?
Terry Jeffery: It is not part of the wetland. It is not part of the application to consider what in fact are
design issues. So we don’t, as the LGU I don’t look at it and say well I disagree with your design Carver
County. You should do this instead and therefore there should be more, more impacts. I look at what
was presented to me. Does it meet those requirements? I think Mr. Oehme could speak better to the
actual design of the culvert underneath though and the process that was gone through to get to that point.
Mayor Furlong: And does the Wetland Alteration Permit that’s before us this evening, does that address
questions of easements or slope and runoff?
Terry Jeffery: It does not.
Mayor Furlong: Okay, it’s strictly relating to what? To.
Terry Jeffery: Are the wetland impacts that are proposed necessary to complete the project as designed,
and the intended purpose of that project, and any avoidable, unavoidable impacts, are they being replaced
in kind?
Mayor Furlong: And with regard to those issues, it’s your opinion that this application does meet those
objectives and those requirements?
Terry Jeffery: That is correct.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. Thank you. Mr. Anderson, anything else?
Mark Anderson: I think the only point left in the discussion is whether or not it fully addresses all of the
impacts. We realize that there will be equipment running to develop the toe of slope. They’ll be running
outside of the proposed impact area. I believe they would also impact the wetland areas beyond what’s
proposed so I think there’s some disagreement in that matter as to how much construction activity will
impact what’s being permitted or might the impacts extend beyond. We believe they will extend beyond.
Mayor Furlong: Mr. Jeffery.
Terry Jeffery: Mr. Mayor, through the process one of the, one of the requirements of the contractor and
the project proposer is an Affidavit of, it’s, I forget the name of the form that BWSR uses but in essence
it’s saying that we are response, we understand that there are additional wetlands in this area. We are not
to stockpile material in those areas. We are not to use those areas to stage this project. If there are
temporary impacts that result as, because of construction. If it’s deemed for instance at a pre-construction
meeting that look, we won’t be able to construct this embankment without working, without staging from
that wetland area, then at that time we could look at a temporary impact and allowing that temporary
impact knowing that it’s going to be self mitigated on site. However, we’re looking at a plan. The plan
shows that the grading limits will be to that point and that’s what, that’s what we go by. Is the proposed
grading limits.
Mayor Furlong: Okay.
Mark Anderson: Maybe if I could just one last question. If it’s determined that different design method
is required to convey the water that might have additional impacts, can this application be amended
versus submitting a new one?
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Terry Jeffery: Mr. Mayor, the Wetland Conservation Act does speak to that. I apologize I don’t have the
exact figures. There is some percentage of which if the replacement or the impact doesn’t increase by X
amount, then you can just issue an addendum to an existing application. So my short answer would be
yes with conditions. There may be some, you know if we’re only looking at a thousand or a few thousand
square feet then yes we can amend it.
Mayor Furlong: Based upon some circumstances it can be.
Terry Jeffery: Correct.
Mayor Furlong: In others it would not be able to be, is that a fair assumption?
Terry Jeffery: Correct. That is correct.
Mayor Furlong: Okay.
Terry Jeffery: So it.
Mayor Furlong: Is the County aware Mr. Anderson of your concerns? You say you sent them a letter.
Mark Anderson: Yes, and we’ve been communicating with them and as of last Friday they had indicated
that they would talk to BWSR about the additional impacts. BWSR being the Board of Water and Soil
Resources.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. And with regard to the construction concerns and the limits of construction, are
they at all concerned about going outside of the limits that are included in the plan?
Mark Anderson: They recognize that the conveyance of this water hasn’t been fully addressed yet and we
need to resolve it. Whether that means a different construction method or pipe or something like that, that
yet is to be determined and that’s what we were hoping we could do is work with them to determine that
and then just have this application finalized in addressing all potential impacts instead of you know
coming back and amending it later or applying for a new one. It’s just more process and paper and time
when obviously we’ve got a construction project that wants to get moving forward as the weather permits.
Terry Jeffery: Mr. Mayor if I may speak quickly to that.
Mayor Furlong: Mr. Jeffery.
Terry Jeffery: If in fact what is determined is that they want to run a pipe conveyance down, then we
would need to look at treatment for that because we can’t have a new pipe discharge. That being said, if
what it is, is that they need to re-grade that area to insure that there is proper conveyance, that there is
positive drainage towards Bluff Creek, the Wetland Conservation Act allows for excavation within a
Type 1, 2, and 6. 1, 2, 3 and 6 wetland which this would fall under. So it would not be considered an
impact that would require mitigation if it was simply to grade down a few inches to a foot to correct the
drainage pattern.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. Alright. And so based upon the information and the issue before the council this
evening, Mr. Jeffery is there anything that you’ve heard tonight or earlier tonight that would suggest that
we do not have enough information or that within our purview to go forward?
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Terry Jeffery: No Mr. Mayor I do not. I think we have enough to go forward with this application and
replacement plan as submitted.
Mayor Furlong: Okay, thank you. Thank you Mr. Anderson.
Mark Anderson: Thank you.
Mayor Furlong: Any other questions? Councilwoman Tjornhom, did you have a question?
Councilwoman Tjornhom: I don’t know if I do or not. Well it’s, this may be a silly question. Something
struck me that part of, part of your concern was the fact that there was public water that was being
directed on private or someone else’s land without an easement.
Mark Anderson: That is correct.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: Is that what I’m hearing correctly?
Mark Anderson: Yeah.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: I don’t know can staff kind of explain that to me? If that means water’s
water. Is that not correct or can someone just clarify that for me as a point of interest for myself I guess.
Mayor Furlong: Mr. Oehme.
Paul Oehme: Sure. Mayor, City Council members. That’s correct. The County did take an easement
over the pipe itself but did not take a drainage utility easement or right-of-way to convey water through
the proposed drainage way. It’s my understanding that some of the water that the culvert discharged prior
to the proposed, or the existing conveyance system, some of that water did go on private property as well
too so I think the County’s aware of that issue. I think they’re talking about potentially needing
additional easements in this area to convey that water so I think that’s still in negotiations with the
property owner.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. Is there a representative from the County here? Is there anything you’d like to
add at this point?
Bill Weckman: Sure. Mr. Mayor and council, Bill Weckman with Carver County Public Works. Yeah
so we’ve been working on this project and we did have a meeting with Mr. Anderson and Mr. Dorsey, the
property owner back in February where these concerns came out and I think it’s included in your packet
as far as background information. Letter that Mr. Anderson had sent the County and our response to that
letter. Yes there are some issues out there. If you look at the drawing there, we do have temporary
easement to do the project. When this concern came out about the water going out and such, yes there
was a recognition there may be a need to increase or maybe upgrade that to a permanent easement if in
fact it is a drainage area and a permanent easement is needed as one solution to this. I know the property
owner has a desire to have turn lanes and such there. I mean we have talked with the City as far as that
possibility and the City is, I mean yes that’s a possibility but there’s a process to go through as far as
review of the wetlands. Potential wetlands and impacts and such. Unfortunately this project is under
th
contract to be built. A starting date is supposed to be April 15. Everything is in line to get this project
going so there’s a need for this permit so we can continue on with the project. We’ll certainly try to work
with the property owner in resolution of this. These concerns but we also have to work with the City as a
partner in this project and the City’s process to make this happen so. So I guess my request would be
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
approval of this permit which addresses the project which we are trying to complete and yeah, we will
continue to work with the property owner to resolve these other issues.
Mayor Furlong: Okay, thank you. Any questions for Mr. Weckman? Mr. McDonald.
Councilman McDonald: Okay I’m a little confused by all this because you’ve brought up a couple of
points. How can you go forward with a design where you’ve got water going and you don’t know where
it’s going to go? You’re also, you’re going to impact private property and you’re telling me that yeah, we
could mitigate that. We can do something else. Maybe we’ll go and get an easement at that point. Isn’t
that like kind of closing the barn door after the cows have already left? A thorough design would have
already accounted for all of this. What’s happened here is that we have a landowner that’s been rather
slow as far as what he wants to do with the property so there’s issues of egress and those kind of things
with the property and he’s slow doing it. By you putting the water there, now you’re driving where any
turn lanes or egress is going to go without getting the proper easements to do that. I don’t understand
how everybody can say the design is good to go when you admit you don’t know where this water’s
going to go. It’s going to flow over private land. It will totally change the characteristics of this land at
that point and no one has really accounted for any of that. That says your project’s not ready to go in my
mind. Tell me where I’m wrong because something’s missing here. You can’t do part of a design and
say you’re going to figure out the rest of it later and yet at the same time you’re going to impact private
property. Explain it.
Paul Oehme: Mayor, City Council members, Councilman McDonald. The current drainage pattern really
isn’t changing from the existing conditions to the design conditions. There is an existing culvert there
currently. That culvert’s not moving. The drainage flow is remaining the same from the south side of
Lyman Boulevard, discharging onto the south side of Lyman then down to Bluff Creek. Bluff Creek so
the pattern’s still the same. The location of where the drainage flows from the end of the culvert to the
creek, that’s where it’s changed a little bit so in my judgment you know the drainage design more or less
stays the same. It’s just that the water’s channelized in a different location than it currently is. And to
Terry Jeffery’s point, you know that’s something that goes on with every project with looking at wetland
impacts and how drainage patterns potentially will occur over time so those type of things can be looked
at in the future but in terms of what’s before us tonight in terms of a, the wetland permit, I think from
staff’s perspective that’s pretty much set.
Councilman McDonald: But okay, you say there’s no change but yet you’re going from what, an 18 inch
culvert to 24?
Paul Oehme: Correct.
Councilman McDonald: So the water flow is going to increase. That’s going to change the way the water
moves.
Paul Oehme: No, not necessarily. The drainage pattern, the drainage area is more or less staying the
same. There is about 7 acres of drainage to the north side of Lyman that’s still going to flow through the
culvert. Actually there potentially will be less drainage onto private property or to this area based upon
because it’s going from a rural section roadway where the water can flow, sheet drain off the road to an
urbanized section where there’s actually going to be storm sewer catching the water before it ends up on
private property so potentially there’s going to be less water going in this direction. That existing culvert,
that 18 inch culver that Mr. Anderson had talked about, that existing culvert is going to be replaced with
24 inch. That culvert was installed back in I think in the early 80’s replacing another culvert that was
there prior. Drainage designs change over time so based upon a 1980 design versus what a 2014 design
is. It’s a little bit different design than it was back then so. The pattern’s going to stay the same. The
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
flow of water through that culvert is more or less going to stay the same. The only thing that really
changes is the direction of the water. Where the water is going to be going after it leaves the culvert on
the south side of Lyman.
Councilman McDonald: Okay, if I could get Mr. Anderson back up here. I’ve got a question for you too.
Okay you heard what the City and the County have said about all this, what is your proposing? What is
the problem then with this culvert going through the way it is? It’s following an existing drainage
patterns. What would you look at for a design change? Have you proposed anything? I mean what’s
wrong with that design the way it currently is?
Mark Anderson: Certainly. So you know one of the primary, one of them is they’re pushing the water 40
feet further into our client’s property so it used to be conveyed further to the north with a narrower
roadway and a narrower slope that projected into our client’s property so now it’s all getting pushed
further back south onto his property. The toe of slope is being extended and no easement so they’re more
or less just taking this land away from our client. Conveying a bigger pipe. You know even if design
standards have changed, I believe this pipe will convey more water than it used to in larger events and so
maybe they’re designing it for a larger event. Well that will allow more water to come through and so
what we’d like to see ultimately is no impact to our client’s property. No negative impact and that would
happen by conveying the water downstream where they actually have a ditch. An adjacent property, you
can look at the cross sections for the road design. They have a ditch to convey that water. They don’t
have any ditch here. It’s just going to spill out onto the landowner’s property and poor, and drain at a
very poor fashion to the west and likely flood it and expand, expand you know the wet areas so the water
needs to at least get conveyed to the west without negatively impacting this. That could either be done by
conveying it on the north side of the road or they can continue this pipe to the west where there is a ditch
being proposed.
Councilman McDonald: So are you saying in effect what you’re afraid of is that we’re going to end up
with a Defacto drainage pond on your client’s property before it all drains down the ditch to Bluff Creek?
Mark Anderson: That is correct because now the toe of slope for the new roadway is anywhere from a
half a foot to a foot higher than the old roadway. Plus we’ve got a 24 inch. Plus it’s coming 40 feet into
the property and that’s where we’re here tonight because we believe there will be further wetland impacts
to address this properly once they have a plan that’s complete and doesn’t have a negative impact on PPB
Holding’s property.
Councilman McDonald: And when you say have a plan complete, who’s they? You or the County?
Mark Anderson: The County. It’s their design project. We just need to see them revise it so that it
doesn’t impact our client’s property. It’s their.
Councilman McDonald: Well what the County says to us is that it’s fine the way it is and we ought to go
ahead and approve it. They don’t seem to share your concerns. Why is that?
Mark Anderson: Well I think they, Mr. Weckman recognized, I think you said they recognized there
were some issues. They just haven’t addressed them yet. I think any one of us as property owners would
object to water and a pipe being pushed 40 feet onto our property with no solution on how to handle that
water. It’s not just a little bit of water. It’s a 24 inch pipe and so it’s a pretty substantial impact which
you know based on our conversations, you know they’re working with us but really not seeing any action
and this is you know, this is one avenue that they need to address is the wetland permit tonight. The other
is how do they resolve the drainage concern and if they just keep forging ahead and they say they’ve got a
th
contractor underway. They want to start April 15. Well when are they going to solve it or are they just
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
going to build what they’ve got and push the landowner aside and say well, you know you need to go hire
an attorney and deal with this and just put more burden on him or can we stop. Take a look at this.
Resolve it and then approve what’s right for the project and what’s right for this permit application.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: Mr. Mayor?
Mayor Furlong: Councilwoman Tjornhom.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: Question I have is you I think just stated that this is a County project. Have
you been to the County yet and addressed your concerns and addressed the County Board about this?
Mark Anderson: We did talk to the County Public Works Department. Mr. Bill Weckman and Lyndon
Robjent. As well we sent them a letter and our client has communicated with them. The plan has not
changed. So a lot of time and effort has been spent with no resolution yet to date.
Councilman McDonald: And okay if I could, let me ask you a question about what he says if all the water
drains the way it is, are we going to create kind of a retention pond there? All the water will go there and
pool there until it drains down or does it go into an existing ditch and it drains there and there’s no impact
on all that land? Either one, Mr. Oehme or.
Terry Jeffery: Mayor, Councilman McDonald. Positive drainage is still to the west on this project. So
the water would continue to drain westerly through that area.
Councilman McDonald: I agree with that. The question is before it drains to the west is it going to pool
because now we’re dumping all that water directly into that swale that’s in there and then it will reach a
certain height and then at that point it will continue down or is there accommodation so that now we don’t
take all of that land back in there to form a retainage pond?
Terry Jeffery: I haven’t seen the model yet as to how high that area will bounce. I can’t speak exactly to
that. However the drainage patterns not changing the volume, not changing, I don’t anticipate that it
would behave hydrologically different from what we are seeing currently. Although it would be further
south on the property that that channelization occurred. That the outflow occurs.
Councilman McDonald: Okay, and if there were a problem, since we didn’t, that land’s not part of any
easement, are we looking at an additional design at some point to bend the water around so that it now
follows the path you want it to? Is that a possible future possibility?
Terry Jeffery: Yes it is definitely possible that the ultimate design changes such that they design a
deliberate conveyance from that area, whether it be over land flow or through a ditch or piped out or
saying well let’s make this then be the stormwater treatment area for a larger, for the remaining property
but yes, there is certainly a number of scenarios I could see under which they might possibly change that.
Councilman McDonald: But then what you seem to be telling me is that we wouldn’t know that until we
build it and we try it out for a while and we see what the natural course of things are. Is that what I,
because you wouldn’t change the design within the next 6 months?
Terry Jeffery: That is correct. To an extent. We do have, I would assume SRF has modeling data that
we could review to see what we are anticipating for a bounce in that area which would be very, a very
good indicator of what we would expect to see for the hydraulics in that area.
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Mayor Furlong: Is that applicable to the wetland alteration permit that’s before us this evening? Is that
part of that process?
Terry Jeffery: Again no because it is not, we are not designing for the County. We are weighing in on
what was presented to us to accomplish the project which is to build the road. If their discussion with a
private property owner leads to design changes or procurement of additional easement to accommodate
additional flow, that could be addressed at that time under a permit but what has been presented to us is,
have they minimized the impacts to the greatest extent possible? Take another scenario. It is not
uncommon to say okay, well you can’t minimize the slopes any more than 3 to 1 but what we could do is
go 3 to 1 to some point and then put in a retaining wall on top of it thereby making the flow stay within
the right-of-way. And minimizing impacts even further. I mean it’s a double edged sword. It could go,
there are a number of ways that this could be addressed and I don’t, one of those might result in less
impacts to the wetland.
Todd Gerhardt: Mayor, council.
Mayor Furlong: Mr. Gerhardt.
Todd Gerhardt: Just add a couple of things here. I think we’re, it’s obvious you know you can not push
water onto private property and I think the County and the property owner and his representatives are
having discussions regarding that. And what Terry is saying, that should have nothing to do with the item
before you. It’s more of a road design element that should have been handled as a part of the road design
and what should have been a permanent easement versus a temporary construction easement and those
discussions are going on. And if there isn’t some type of conclusion to those discussions, unfortunately
the property owner does have legal rights to come back against probably the County and the City in this
matter and, but I believe that the County and the applicant will come to some type of conclusion on this
and probably expanding that permanent easement boundary. I can’t sit here and say it’s going to happen
but they’re having discussions and, but it doesn’t have anything to do with the wetland alteration.
Councilman McDonald: Yes but if I could, I mean it would seem then that that needs to be tied up before
you start letting anyone get in there and do any kind of construction because what you’re telling me is that
down the road all this could change. And what I mean by that is what Terry’s talking about. If okay you
can’t push the water onto private land. Something’s got to be done at that point. Either an
accommodation has to be reached or you’ve got to redesign the way that, you know that pipe’s coming
out there and dumping water. As to where the water goes.
Todd Gerhardt: But this application took into account the calculation of the amount of water coming and
the impacts onto the existing wetlands and they’ve endorsed that the measures being used are appropriate.
Councilman Laufenburger: Who’s they?
Todd Gerhardt: The engineer, SRF. The consulting engineer on the project and how they designed it.
BWSR has confirmed how they designed it worked. BWSR didn’t come in and say you can’t push water
on private property. That wasn’t you know their job to tell them how to design the project. It was just the
impacts onto the wetland is what BWSR was asked to review and how they’re going to mitigate and
impact those wetlands.
Mayor Furlong: Mr. Oehme.
Paul Oehme: So Mayor, City Council members. The County is acquiring temporary easements for
installation of the culvert and then grading in this area as well and that includes the area that we’re talking
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
about for the wetland impacts. So we’re not, the County’s not planning on grading or going on private
property on this project at all. There is a temporary easement out there during the construction process.
We do have time when the, right now for negotiations that the County’s already started for acquiring
those additional potentially drainage easements. Turning those temporary easements into permanent
easements in the future so we’re not theoretically impacting private property right now because the
County is acquiring those easements necessary to construct this project.
Mark Anderson: So I think the concern is, you’re asked to approve a permit application tonight for a
project that’s incomplete and because the project is incomplete in addressing this item, as well a permit
application tonight is incomplete. It hasn’t been fully resolved and you know the owner has to bring me
to this meeting tonight and work with the County and all these sorts of things when the County should be
doing this right in the first place so I would force their hand. Get them to resolve this. Then once they
have the full resolution that doesn’t negatively impact our client’s property, then come back with a full
permit application and then you can approve it.
Mayor Furlong: And Mr. Anderson thank you for your comments but if I understand correctly, and Mr.
Jeffery, Mr. Oehme, the issues you’ve raised about the easements. The ditch slope. The construction
process are not necessarily pertinent to the wetland permit. Is that correct? The permit that is before us
this evening is addressing issues of.
Mark Anderson: Of the road.
Mayor Furlong: Effects to the, based upon the design of the effects to the wetlands.
Mark Anderson: Yeah it addresses an incomplete design and a complete design will likely change this
permit.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. Mr. Jeffery, any final comment?
Terry Jeffery: No, I think that’s fine.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you Mr. Anderson.
Mark Anderson: Thank you.
Mayor Furlong: Any comments from, comments? Thoughts by the council.
Councilman Laufenburger: I do.
Mayor Furlong: Mr. Laufenburger.
Councilman Laufenburger: Mister, thank you Mr. Anderson for your comments and your description. I
think these are simple questions but I need to ask them. Could you explain the term mitigation and it’s
use here, and I’m quoting from the staff report. These impacts will be mitigated for by wetland credits.
Can you explain that Mr. Jeffery please?
Terry Jeffery: Mr. Mayor, Councilman Laufenburger, yes. Under the Wetland Conservation Act, if an
impact is deemed unavoidable in order to accomplish the goals. If you’ve looked at all other alternatives
and.
Councilman Laufenburger: And in this case to accomplish the goal is build a roadway.
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Terry Jeffery: To build a road to the safety design standards that have been put forward.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay.
Terry Jeffery: The alternative to look at would be another alignment entirely.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay.
Terry Jeffery: And clearly that’s not an option. If there are impacts that are deemed unavoidable then
they must have their functions and values replaced. And to replace those you can either replace in kind
on site, and that’s typically done with a larger block parcel.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay.
Terry Jeffery: But when you have linear parcels you’re very limited in where that can occur so then you
look to establish wetland banks. And the way that this is set up, the Board of Water and Soil Resources
has two banks that they manage, or two bank programs that they manage. One is the road replacement
program and that is for any improvement that is deemed germane to the safety improvements themselves.
That are intrinsic in order to improve the level of service of that road and improve long term safety. They
will replace from their program so the applicant does not need to replace. Whether it be the City, the
County, the State or the Federal agencies. Any impacts that are not deemed germane to that safety, and
that typically tends to be stormwater ponds, pedestrian trails, those types of pertinent items to the project
can be replaced by purchasing credit from a private held bank. So I would own a bank. You would come
to me and you would purchase those credits that would be applied to the mitigation for the impacts that
you couldn’t avoid and all of this is done as long as the credits are established prior to the impacts being,
taking place it has to happen at 2 units to 1 unit ratio. So for every acre of impact, 2 acres of mitigation
must occur.
Councilman Laufenburger: So this project, 2 acres of wetland will be impacted.
Terry Jeffery: Correct.
Councilman Laufenburger: And that is, that is 2 acres of wetland on the south side of Lyman. Is that
correct?
Terry Jeffery: That is actually 2 actually 2 acres of wetland throughout the entire corridor of this phase of
the project.
Councilman Laufenburger: Do you know how much of this is on the south side of Lyman on PPB
property?
Terry Jeffery: I’m looking for it right now. So Wetland 1A will be impacted in it’s entirety. That is the
pond that is closest to the, actually can you put that onto, just that slide right there will work. 1A is if you
look at where Sunset Trail. Yep, that’s 1A and 1B are right there.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay.
Terry Jeffery: So those impacts combined.
Councilman Laufenburger: Go past that. Go down on the left side of the.
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Terry Jeffery: So now we’re at Wetland 2. Impacts total to Wetland 2 are 1.42 acres.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay, 1.42 acres then. I think that’s, if I’m not mistaken it’s that area where
the culvert is okay?
Terry Jeffery: Yep.
Councilman Laufenburger: So 1.4. So that means the agency, the County who is building this road, they
will have to buy 2.84 acres of wetland credits in order to offset the impact that they have on 1.42. Am I
say that right?
Terry Jeffery: That is correct.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. Alright. That answers that question. So in other words the credits
means we’re giving permission to alter this wetland in exchange for 2.8 acres of not altering somewhere
else.
Terry Jeffery: Yes.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. So some other property owner or some other wetland is not going to
be impacted whereas 1.42 acres will be impacted. Okay. Let’s talk about this culvert. You said there’s
an 18 inch culvert right now, is that correct Mr. Oehme?
Paul Oehme: That’s correct.
Councilman Laufenburger: Is that culvert fully functional right now?
Paul Oehme: I have not inspected it but I believe it would be.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. I’ve seen this land on the north side and I’ve seen water accumulate
there so that suggests to me that at, for various reasons it’s possible water’s not running through that
culvert and in fact it goes over those driveways and continues in a westerly movement. Have you
observed that Mr. Jeffery at all? How about you Mr. Weckman, have you observed that at all?
Bill Weckman: No.
Councilman Laufenburger: No.
Terry Jeffery: I have not observed that although I do know that one property to the west had issues with
their culvert and the conveyance through that but whether that is from this watershed I do not know.
Councilman Laufenburger: Is there a culvert underneath those two driveways?
Paul Oehme: Councilman Laufenburger there is a culvert at this location.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay.
Paul Oehme: That was replaced by the City, I don’t know 3-4 years ago maybe.
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay, okay, okay. But the culvert, if you can just with your arrow, the
culvert we’re talking about here is going from there to there and right now it’s 18 inches and you’re
making it, and the County’s going to make it 24.
Paul Oehme: Correct.
Councilman Laufenburger: Why the increase in size?
Paul Oehme: Again the County engineers did the analysis and the design for that culvert and they believe
a 24 inch culvert is necessary for today’s standards.
Councilman Laufenburger: Oh for today’s standards. Not necessarily because there’s going to be 33%
more water going through.
Paul Oehme: No. I mean again the watershed, the area that potentially would flow through this culvert is
theoretically not going to change under this design.
Councilman Laufenburger: And in fact your argument about the road directing the surface water of the
road is going to go to storm sewer, right?
Paul Oehme: Correct. The road is going from a 2 lane rural section roadway which is I don’t know 30
feet wide. Now it’s going to be significant wider. 4 lanes with a median inbetween so the surface area
that used to drain to this culvert is going to go down some.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. That’s logical to me. That you build a road that directs the water from
the roadway rather than it just going off the side, now it’s being directed. I can see that that would be less
water. Let’s see. This is a wetland alteration permit. Why are we seeing this right now? I mean we’ve
seen a lot of approvals on this project over the last 2 years. Why are seeing this wetland alteration permit
right now? Mr. Jeffery.
Terry Jeffery: Mr. Mayor, Councilman Laufenburger. There is a very long history with this parcel dating
back to 2007.
Councilman Laufenburger: Who is this parcel? The PPB parcel?
Terry Jeffery: The PPB parcel, yes.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay.
Terry Jeffery: There have been no fewer than 3 delineations done on this property. There was a
completed application that was submitted. I don’t have the.
Councilman Laufenburger: By the County?
Terry Jeffery: By the County and at that time, due to questions about access onto the PPB Holding’s
property it was asked to remove that application so it did not go forward. That was in, that was in March
of 2013 this was originally going to come, yeah. There’s the history of this area here. Not to go through
it in great detail but each color grouping is a different phase. Whether it be the delineation. The green is
the original when the entire corridor was delineated. 2012 they came back with a replacement plan
application. March it was decided we should probably, March of 2013 we should probably pull this back.
DNR decided, they went through the DNR culvert application on their own because they realized that this
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
was kind of getting, let’s get this one moving forward so the culvert was approved in one month in
October, August, September, October of ’13. SRF delineated the property separately on the Dorsey
property. Huston Engineering then came in and did some more delineation.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. I think you’ve answered my question. Does Chanhassen have the
authority to approve a wetland alteration permit? Before you answer that, who owns the wetlands in the
State of Minnesota?
Terry Jeffery: They are considered waters of the State.
Councilman Laufenburger: Of the State.
Terry Jeffery: Not like a public water inventory like a lake would be. Under the Clean Water Act or the
PCA’s permit for the Clean Water Act they are considered waters of the State but, but the land that the
wetland is on is owned by that landowner. That fee title so I cannot come onto it and utilize like I could a
lake. I couldn’t come onto it.
Councilman Laufenburger: But the use of that and the modification of that is subject to guidelines by the
DNR, am I saying that correctly?
Terry Jeffery: Yes. The State through various agencies have determined that they are important enough
to project.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. So not only is, the homeowner can’t, or the landowner can’t just be
willy nilly they can’t do anything? If there is wetland there, the DNR oversees what can be done with
that?
Terry Jeffery: The DNR or other agencies.
Councilman Laufenburger: Or other agencies. And Chanhassen is one of those agencies, right?
Terry Jeffery: Correct.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay, so this wetland alteration permit applies only during construction?
The 1.42 acres of wetland.
Terry Jeffery: They are allowed to permanently fill 1.42 acres of wetland in that area for the completion
of this project provided that they mitigate that at a 2 to 1 ratio elsewhere.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. And once that’s, once that 1.42 acres has been altered as necessary to
complete the project, will it be returned to it’s original state or not?
Terry Jeffery: No. No.
Councilman Laufenburger: So this permit says you don’t have to return it to it’s original state. You have
permission to modify that 1.42 acres for purposes of building this road.
Terry Jeffery: Correct.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. We’re getting somewhere here Terry, thanks. Why 40 feet into the
property?
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Terry Jeffery: In order to meet safety design standards, and please step in if I’m wrong, they need to have
a minimum side slope of 3 to 1.
Councilman Laufenburger: So this is related to the corridor. The road corridor, is that right Mr. Oehme?
Terry Jeffery: Correct.
Paul Oehme: Correct.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay, so 40 feet. So is it, is it 40, 40 additional feet onto the property or is it,
is it 12 additional feet onto the property as opposed to, Mr. Weckman do you know?
Todd Gerhardt: Bring up the plan that shows the culvert. I think you bought some additional right-of-
way…
Paul Oehme: Well here’s a.
Mark Anderson: Yeah this plan is one representation of the additional land area that is projecting into the
PPB Holding property.
Councilman Laufenburger: Mr. Anderson do you know with certainty how long the current 18 inch pipe
goes into the property?
Mark Anderson: I believe it’s within the right-of-way at this time.
Rick Dorsey: No it isn’t.
Mark Anderson: It’s not. Okay.
Rick Dorsey: I currently have about 90 feet…
Councilman Laufenburger: I really need to have him answer that at the.
Rick Dorsey: Mayor, council, my name is Rick Dorsey. The pipe, this road has since I’ve owned the
property in 1979, it started out about 25 foot wide dirt road and it had a 15 inch culvert originally and
about 25 feet long. In 1981 the road was widened. A big embankment was put on my property and that
pipe extended then to 90 feet in length. Most of it on my property. There’s been no real additional land
purchased on the north side of the road so that hasn’t changed and it’s going from 90 feet to 130 feet.
Current plan so it’s coming another 40 feet in. Now again.
Councilman Laufenburger: So let me just make sure. My question was, how much more does the pipe
protrude onto your property than it did before and you’re saying it’s almost 40 feet.
Rick Dorsey: Correct and prior to that the end of it was not on county property either. They put it in
unbeknown to me when it was being constructed in 1979, or 1980. The road easement was coming in I
believe about 40 feet from the center of the road and that pipe came in approximately another 20 feet
beyond the right-of-way at that point in time.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. Thank you Mr. Dorsey.
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Rick Dorsey: Yep.
Councilman Laufenburger: I just have one last question and I think it may be, I’m not sure who this goes
to but, was there right, was there additional right-of-way purchased for the, in order to build the road?
Mr. Oehme, do you know? Was there additional right-of-way purchased from PPB Holding in order to
build?
Bill Weckman: Or easements.
Councilman Laufenburger: Or easements, yeah.
Paul Oehme: Or easements. There, I believe there are and do you have that drawing?
Mayor Furlong: So it’s in the process? Is it in process of condemnation?
Paul Oehme: It’s in, it’s going through the right-of-way acquisition process right now. There is in place
or proposed right-of-way that’s going to be acquired plus the temporary easement that we had talked
about as well so there is both.
Councilman Laufenburger: I don’t need to know the exact amount but my assumption is that if the
County needs more land in order to build this road they will buy that in the form of, either buying the land
or buying the easement for that land from PPB Holding, is that correct Mr. Oehme?
Paul Oehme: That’s correct.
Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. Alright. Thank you Mr. Mayor. That’s all I had.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Any other questions? Mr. Jeffery or Mr. Oehme, the wetland, the 1.42 acre
portion of the wetlands, is that the entire wetland at that location or is the wetland actually larger and
they’re just mitigating or dealing with 1.42 acres?
Terry Jeffery: Mr. Mayor, the wetland is actually larger and they’re just mitigating or impacting the 1.42
acres.
Mayor Furlong: So with regard to, so what’s before us tonight is that, impact on a portion of the wetland
in that location and that’s being mitigated and so the question is, is it being mitigated?
Terry Jeffery: That is correct.
Mark Anderson: There haven’t been any improved wetlands on the PPB Holding property at this time so
it’s unknown.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. Thank you Mr. Anderson. Directing the question to staff.
Terry Jeffery: There is no legally approved wetland boundary extending beyond the approved right, or
the proposed right-of-way.
Mayor Furlong: And when…
Terry Jeffery: And in my professional opinion having done this since 2004 or since 1994 there is
additional wetland that extends beyond.
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Mayor Furlong: And when would that wetland be delineated and.
Terry Jeffery: If in the future the, Mr. Mayor if in the future the property owner of that land chose to
delineate it for a project.
Mayor Furlong: For a development project?
Terry Jeffery: For development project for instance, they would be delineated at that time.
Mayor Furlong: Okay, thank you.
Councilman Laufenburger: Just a follow up Mr. Mayor?
Mayor Furlong: Yep.
Councilman Laufenburger: Did I hear you correctly Terry? You said that there is no approved wetland in
this area on the PPB?
Terry Jeffery: Beyond.
Councilman Laufenburger: Beyond the 1.42.
Mayor Furlong: No.
Terry Jeffery: Mr. Mayor, Councilman Laufenburger the, can you bring up my slide again?
Mayor Furlong: Is the 1.42, that’s within the construction limits?
Terry Jeffery: Yep. Yeah, bring up that one right there. Yep. So the red that is shown on there.
Councilman Laufenburger: That’s the one.
Terry Jeffery: Is the limits that were looked at. The yellow that is shown are the delineated boundaries
that were approved as part of this process through the final Houston Engineering delineation. Oh, they
are not impacting in it’s entirety.
Mayor Furlong: So does the wetland, that yellow line through there, that’s the edge of the wetland based
on the delineation of the permit process? Is that what I heard you say?
Terry Jeffery: Correct.
Mayor Furlong: And does the wetland extend to the south or to the north of that yellow line?
Terry Jeffery: It extends south of that yellow line.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. And so the 1.42 acres is the distance between the yellow line south to the red
line? Or wherever there’s wetland within that, within the red line area.
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Terry Jeffery: It is from the northern yellow line to that point at which, which is not shown on this. This
just shows the delineation. South of that yellow line to a point where the limits of the grading for the toe
of slope occur. In some places, it’s not that entire area that’s being shown.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. Does the red line, what does the red represent?
Terry Jeffery: Their scope. Their limit of review for doing the delineation.
Mayor Furlong: And they being?
Terry Jeffery: Houston Engineering.
Mayor Furlong: Okay.
Todd Gerhardt: And that would either be the permit or construction easement boundary.
Terry Jeffery: Perhaps, yes. It should coincide with that. Clearly moving east though they’re not
showing the full boundary but yes. It would coincide with the right-of-way.
Todd Gerhardt: Yeah.
Terry Jeffery: And the Notice of Decision for the wetland delineation specifically states this applies only
to that portion which is within the proposed right-of-way for Lyman Boulevard. So the delineation itself
was approved.
Mayor Furlong: Okay. Alright. Thank you. Any other questions? No? Thoughts or comments by
council?
Councilman McDonald: Yeah I’ve got a couple comments. Okay I’ve listened to all of this and I guess
where I’m having a problem with it is that, again as I said who’s going to drive development on this site
and it really didn’t make any difference. If the County’s got a better idea then that’s fine but my problem
is they should pay for that. It bothers me that you haven’t finalized easements, right-of-way’s, how much
property is going to be taken. You’ve got a landowner that’s coming before the City as this is kind of his
last gasp to get the County to negotiate because once we approve this and you start construction, you put
the landowner at a difficult position. Or you force the landowner’s hands and now we’re in a lawsuit and
this road doesn’t get built for a couple years and that wouldn’t be good for anyone. I’m in favor of
tabling this and forcing resolution at the county level to get these issues resolved while there is still some
leverage at this point to get a fair market price for the landowner. Or they get a fair assessment you know
as to what’s happening to the property. I hear what Terry says and then at the same time you tell me but it
could impact it and it could do this. There’s too many if’s. There’s no certainty. You can’t build
anything without certainty. I mean I’m an engineer. You can’t do that or else you’re asking for trouble.
I’m also the lawyer in all of this. You’re also asking for trouble. It bothers me that you have not brought
a completed package before us so I’m in favor of delaying it. I can’t vote for the delineation at this point.
Mayor Furlong: Alright, thank you. Other thoughts. Comments. Councilwoman Ernst.
Councilwoman Ernst: Yeah, I’m in agreement with Councilman McDonald. You know we’re asking to
approve a project that really doesn’t convey the entire design of the project, in particular where the water
will ultimately end up or the conveyance of the water and based on all the gray areas and the predictions
that seem like well, we’ll wait and see. Then we might do something about it. I’m just not comfortable
approving this at this time. Once we know what it really looks like then we can take another look at it.
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Mayor Furlong: Mr. Gerhardt.
Todd Gerhardt: Mayor, council. We have to go back and look at the issue before you today. We already
awarded contract on this project. We’ve enter into a contract with a builder and any delays may come
back as damages to the City in this project and so it’d be my recommendation that you approved the
wetland alteration permit before you and have staff direct a letter to the County to work with the property
owner and have this resolved within 60 days. If not bring it back to council and you know, to see why we
haven’t got some type of conclusion within 60 days.
Mayor Furlong: You say we’ve awarded contract. Haven’t we also approved the plans?
Todd Gerhardt: Yes.
Mayor Furlong: I mean the plans for this project were approved by both the County and the council.
Todd Gerhardt: Correct.
Mayor Furlong: Previously so I think, Councilwoman Tjornhom.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: Mr. Mayor, and forgive me I’ve been listening to this quietly trying to soak it
all in. I’m still confused about why there’s a project that we’re supposed to approve or not approve and
it’s still not coherent or conclusive that it’s complete or not complete and what role I guess the City has in
this project versus the County and why it would come to us if there’s still outstanding questions. I don’t
have a problem with the project. I just want to make sure that we are acting within our rights as a city and
you know and like I said why this is even coming to us like this so if someone could just explain that to
me.
Mayor Furlong: Mr. Gerhardt.
Todd Gerhardt: Mayor, council members. The property owner is at his wits end. He is asking you to
help him in getting negotiations with the County underway and completed and this is his last straw to be
in front of a board. And unfortunately it’s under the wetland alteration permit and it’s after we’ve already
entered into a contract with a builder. You know I can feel for him but delaying this is not in the best
interest of the City or the project. You know it would be my recommendation that staff be directed to
work with Carver County Public Works in getting something resolved here regarding pushing water onto
a private property.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: And that was my question I think a half hour ago when you know we started
really delving into this I said, you know is this a county issue? Has the applicant dealt with the County
because this clearly is an applicant/County issue. Not a City/applicant issue.
Todd Gerhardt: Well we’re kind of in this jointly with Carver County.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: Right. I understand that we’re all married into it somehow.
Todd Gerhardt: Yeah.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: But at the same time like I said, I just don’t understand. I don’t want to be
played in that role as being you know part of that piece of the puzzle that either delays a project for
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
whatever reason so I just want to make sure that tonight we do the best thing for the city of Chanhassen
and our projects and our commitments that we’ve made so far.
Todd Gerhardt: Well I don’t know if the property owner would you know support my recommendation to
you or not you know where we would get involved and have the three parties sit down and get some
conclusion to this within the next 60 days and if not bring it back to council and say we still haven’t
resolved the issue and, and we can bring this issue back as many times as you want and try to get the issue
resolved.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: But it’s not our issue. I mean it is but it’s not.
Mayor Furlong: Well I guess the question I have is with regard to the issue before us, which is the
wetland alteration permit.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: Right.
Mayor Furlong: And does it meet the requirements of that? What I’ve heard tonight is it does based upon
the design. The question, and you know these questions come up. Property owners have a right to
question and continue to question and question and question if they want to, and there’s nothing that says
either that they have to agree with the proposal from the County or the City at any point in time. Whether
that’s 60 days or 6 days or 6 years. I mean but there’s a process there that’s available if there still is
disagreement so the question I think before us tonight is does the wetland alteration permit meet the
requirements of the State. The State statutes on all the issues and, and does it meet the requirements
before us and if it does I think we should go forward with the approval. I certainly think the city staff and
county and the property owner need to sit down and try to resolve some of these things, and if with that
resolution there’s a change in design and that change in design requires an amendment to the wetland
alteration permit, it will be back before us. But with regard to the design that’s been approved and that’s
moving forward what I heard tonight is that this application meets all those requirements. Meets the State
statues and any other guiding requirements and so I think you know, is the issue before us should it be
approved? I think it should be. That doesn’t preclude us from directing staff to say, sit down with the
County. Try to facilitate this. See if something can be worked out okay and going forward. Mr.
McDonald.
Councilman McDonald: If I could Mr. Mayor. First I’ve got a question for Mr. Gerhardt. Okay, it goes
out 60 days. What’s our remedy at that point if we’ve already approved all of this and everything’s now
going down a road, what difference does that make? Yeah you’re right you can bring it back to us forever
and ever but how does that resolve the problem?
Todd Gerhardt: Well what it does is it reserves a right to bring it back on an agenda item you know so
there’s a message between you, the property owner, the County and the City saying in 60 days if we don’t
have resolution or moving this item along that we bring it back and have to answer to you, Mayor and
council why we didn’t get resolution to this item regarding putting public water on a private property.
Councilman Laufenburger: Could we mitigate the matter by withdrawing the permit? Could we, could
we withdraw our approval of a permit in 60 days?
Todd Gerhardt: I don’t know if there’s an appeal process once you approve it.
Terry Jeffery: This is one time I wish Roger were here. Mr. Mayor I cannot answer that question
intelligently.
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Councilman McDonald: Then Mr. Mayor if I could, a comment to what you brought up to us. I agree.
Where I disagree is that when this project was brought before us I was under the impression it was
complete. What I’m finding out tonight is, ah it wasn’t quite complete.
Mayor Furlong: Well and what’s complete and what’s item of disagreement perhaps with the design.
Councilman McDonald: Well yeah and you’ve got a major problem here that could impact a lot of things
if they can’t reach resolution about where does this water go. I mean that’s a failure. Again that should
have been disclosed where we could have asked a lot of questions a lot sooner in all this. You’re right
about the wetlands permit and stuff, what does that have to do with anything? But as Mr. Gerhardt said,
you know we’ve got a property owner within our city that is having a problem and he’s coming before the
council and the only leverage that we’ve got, which is why I asked the question is, we don’t approve the
permit and that forces people, okay you want to get this project done on time. You’d better solve the
issue quick. That’s the only leverage we’ve got within the city and that’s why I’m concerned about okay,
we push it out 60 days. Where’s our leverage? It’s yeah you’ve got to come in here and talk to us.
Todd Gerhardt: Well I’m just telling your leverage is going to hurt the City in the pocketbook also.
Councilman McDonald: Right and I understand that and that’s where I feel as though yeah, we’re
between a rock and a hard place.
Councilman Laufenburger: Explain, Mr. Gerhardt. Explain how does our leverage of 60 days, how does
that hurt the City? You’re speaking with, with conviction and certainty and I’m wondering where that
comes from.
Todd Gerhardt: Any delay in the construction process, the contractor who we have awarded bid to can.
Councilman Laufenburger: We did or the County has awarded?
Todd Gerhardt: We did.
Mayor Furlong: We concurred.
Councilman Laufenburger: We concurred.
Todd Gerhardt: Yeah.
Councilman Laufenburger: The County awarded, we concurred. They’re using some of our money
okay?
Todd Gerhardt: Correct. And we gave our Municipal Consent for them to move ahead with the design
and with that any delays would be damages back against the property which we would be subject to based
on our road agreement and the percentages that we would contribute back to this project.
th
Councilman Laufenburger: But are they going to rip up this culvert on April 15?
Todd Gerhardt: It may not just be the culvert. It may be just mobilization. You get into road restrictions
and a variety of issues and.
Councilman McDonald: Well okay let me ask this question, and again I wish Roger were here but so we
go ahead and approve all this and if the landowner then proceeds to court and they get an injunction, are
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
we off the hook? I mean we’ve done everything, well hey he’s the one talking about you know we’re in a
difficult position about penalties. What does the contract say about okay the landowner who has a
recourse from a legal perspective, where’s the contract on that? Are we still in jeopardy even if we
approve this tonight?
Todd Gerhardt: Potentially.
Councilman McDonald: Potentially.
Rick Dorsey: Mayor could I come up one second?
Mayor Furlong: For what purpose?
Rick Dorsey: I’m not trying to stop this project, number one. I’ve been working.
Mayor Furlong: Two minutes Rick please.
Rick Dorsey: I’m not interested in stopping the project. I put that forth 2 weeks ago when we met in
front of the Planning Commission. We asked to get the County to sit down and get this, a plan worked
out. It hasn’t happened. We’ve had a little talk but it hasn’t happened. My biggest concern is dealing
with the water. With respect to the wetland issue, and that’s really what we’re here for is dealing with the
wetland issue. I have legal recourses if I need to take them I guess. I’d just as soon not do that but with
respect to the wetland issue, the issue that’s before you is, is there more wetland that’s being impacted
than what is being disclosed and you’re not going to see anybody come back and tell you more was
impacted unless I do because you’re not going to go out and inspect it and you don’t know what’s there
today and what’s been marked off. There will be more wetland impacted because they’ve only gone to
the toe of the slope. That slope is 25 feet high at 3 to 1 slope. I believe it’s 3 to 1. There’s no way a
tractor’s going to be able to do anything without going another 20-30 feet beyond that to back up and
down the side of that hill. There’s well, there’s water that’s going to be brought in. It will not drain. It’s
coming in my property basically flat. They say positive drainage. My neighbor to the west will have a
ditch. I’ll have flat drainage. It’s going to sheet drain across until it gets to their ditch. It’s going to
create more wetland perhaps. How do I deal with that because they’re not putting the ditch in that’s
necessary to replace the ditch that’s there? Now the other thing is that they’re coming further into my
property. Every time, this is the third time. Or third time this road’s been built. Two of them I’ve been a
part of. The first time it was 25 feet wide.
Mayor Furlong: You mentioned that earlier.
Rick Dorsey: Okay, it’s now comes into my, it came in 40 feet. Now we’re into about 90 feet into my
property and we’re pushing water in that used to come 20 feet or whatever into my property. Now we’re
in 50-80 feet further. Every time it comes in further, and there’s no easements. There’s nothing there but
I get the water. The size of the pipe, I’m sure the consultants are dealing with that because the
anticipation is there’ll be growth on the north side of town. There’ll be more hard surface.
Mayor Furlong: Okay.
Rick Dorsey: So there are issues that are there.
Mayor Furlong: Alright, thank you.
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Rick Dorsey: I’m willing to take, I don’t want 60 days. I’m ready tomorrow. I’ll meet with somebody
tomorrow. Let’s get it done. Let’s get it done.
Mayor Furlong: Alright, thank you Mr. Dorsey. When is the construction due to start on this project
based upon, Mr. Oehme do you know?
Paul Oehme: Mayor I believe right after road restrictions so May timeframe.
th
Bill Weckman: The contract is April 15.
th
Mayor Furlong: April 15, alright.
th
Paul Oehme: April 15.
th
Mayor Furlong: Alright. Do we have a couple meeting between now and April 15? I think we have one
th
on the 13 don’t we?
Todd Gerhardt: Yeah.
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Mayor Furlong: Alright. Would it make sense to table this until the 13 to give the County and City time
to sit down with the property owner and he’s just stated he’s willing to meet right away, tomorrow if
necessary and maybe there can’t be a resolution but if not at least we’ve. I mean I believe based upon the
issue at hand, I think this is being used for something which it’s not intended and I would be comfortable
moving forward tonight approving this based upon the facts presented to us for this permit. I think this
other issue is still going to be there. If a majority of the council wants to allow this to be used as a tool to
delay then I would certainly support that we minimize that to our next meeting which would be I think
our first meeting in April. But I would certainly pursue, or prefer to go forward this evening because I
think the facts and circumstances justify us doing so. Mr. Laufenburger.
Councilman Laufenburger: Yeah I just, and I don’t want to challenge your words Mayor but I am going
to challenge just 3 words you used.
Mayor Furlong: Okay.
Councilman Laufenburger: Tool to delay. I don’t believe this is a tool to delay. This is a tool that the
property owner would like to use as leverage to move quickly forward and this appears to be movement
that he has not seen from the County to his, to his acceptance so I don’t think it’s a tool to delay. I think
it’s a tool for action. Mr. Weckman I think you had a comment.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: Yeah I guess.
Mayor Furlong: Councilwoman Tjornhom.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: I’m sorry.
Mayor Furlong: Oh.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: I’m sorry. No I didn’t mean to interrupt or anything.
Mayor Furlong: Do you have a comment?
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Councilwoman Tjornhom: I do. Talking about tools for delaying and the County, I mean the County is
here. Why hasn’t this been resolved before tonight? Why do we have to be a tool to you know for Mr.
Dorsey to come back and negotiate with you.
Mayor Furlong: For whatever purpose.
Councilwoman Tjornhom: Yeah.
Bill Weckman: Okay Mr. Mayor and council. I believe this response letter is included in the packet or
somewhere in there. It’s.
Mayor Furlong: Do you know what page it’s on?
Bill Weckman: When these concerns came up and Mr. Anderson sent a letter to the County and February
ththth
24 we responded. February 25 but I mean there was work done before this February 25 response as
far as trying to find the answers in order so we could respond. Regarding the 24 inch culvert and such,
there is concern as far as redirecting that water whatever. What impact that may have to potential
wetlands to the south. Well not being able to delineate those wetlands, you don’t know for sure what is
there and what the potential is so.
Mayor Furlong: And why weren’t those delineated then, if that would be necessary to respond?
Todd Gerhardt: We didn’t have permission to go on the property.
Bill Weckman: We didn’t have permission to go onto the property to delineate the wetlands. So we
don’t know will diverting that water what the impacts may or may not be and there again we talked to the
City about that and yes, that’s something that could be done but it’s a matter of sequencing and doing
that. In doing that job. As far as addressing some of these other things we, Mr. Dorsey, well the property
owner had an interest in us putting a right turn lane on and extending that slope and we asked the City is
that a possibility but again yes, it’s a possibility but there’s a process that has to be gone through and that
process has to be initiated by the property owner. So I don’t know, Mr. Dorsey is saying the County
th
hasn’t done anything. I think this letter of February 25 in essence puts it in Mr. Dorsey’s hand that if he
wants something done on that property, to initiate it.
Mayor Furlong: And that letter’s in the packet on page, or electronic packet on page 233.
Bill Weckman: Yes. Yes it is. And so if Mr. Dorsey wants to come into the City and initiate this and
work through the process, the County is willing to work with Mr. Dorsey and the City to address these
concerns. The other process that is going on here is the right-of-way acquisition process and we’ve been
going through that process and had an appraiser look at the plan and the impacts of the property and an
appraisal was done as far as the impacts and an offer was made for the right-of-way. We haven’t resolved
that. We are in negotiations. Because of the scheduling of the project, yes. There was condemnation that
is filed. We do have the right to access the property through that process. In that process, if Mr. Dorsey
is impacted, if it’s a negative impact here, a damage he has the right to compensation for that. That has
yet to be determined. I mean if we cannot negotiate a settlement it will go through the Land
Commissioners. As far as that process unfortunately we’ve been having a difficult time getting a third
land commissioner. The land commissioners that we agree upon, when we try to get an appointment we
find out they are not available or have a conflict of interest and cannot be a land commissioner for this
particular project but, so that is another process that is going on. So if there are damages there and the
property owner has legal rights to fair compensation for those damages and that will be determined
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
through the land commissioner process or appeals to that process if we cannot reach a negotiated
settlement.
Councilman McDonald: Well excuse me, something you said you need to clarify that. Have you started
a condemnation action at this point?
Bill Weckman: Yes.
Councilman McDonald: Okay.
Bill Weckman: Mr. Mayor, councilman, yes. The condemnation, I’m sorry I’m not prepared to answer
as far as specific dates but it was a few months ago where the condemnation hearing was held. We have
right to access this property or, and yes there is additional right-of-way being purchased. The permanent
roadway right-of-way is a fee title. It is a property purchase. That flood line is a temporary easement.
Around the culvert it’s a drainage easement. In our letter we do mention that yes, we do need to look at is
there a need for some additional permanent drainage easement as compensation to the property owner due
to the impacts of this project.
Mayor Furlong: Any other questions?
Councilwoman Ernst: Sure Mr. Mayor.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Councilwoman Ernst.
Councilwoman Ernst: So can you tell me if we go, if we do approve this and we say tonight okay
County, City work with the resident or work with Mr. Dorsey and see if you can resolve this in the next 2
weeks, is that possible?
Bill Weckman: Mr. Mayor and councilwoman, I guess from the responses I’ve been hearing to have it
completely resolved, it doesn’t sound like it is possible because to go through some of these is a process
and it needs to be looked at.
Councilwoman Ernst: So do you have a timeline as to how quickly it could be resolved?
Bill Weckman: I first as I see it the property owner has to make a proposal on what they want done here.
So we can address that.
Councilwoman Ernst: Have they not told you what needs to be done?
Bill Weckman: They’ve not formally applied to the City or, I mean we can’t.
Mayor Furlong: Are you referring to the road project or are you referring to development of his property?
Bill Weckman: Work on his property and what would occur on his property.
Todd Gerhardt: Yeah I think you know where we’re at is that Mr. Dorsey can go through the
condemnation process. That is the set schedule. As soon as we can find that third commissioner that
could hear each side’s story and make a determination on value. I think Mr. Weckman has said that
there’s been a counter proposal to change the construction easement into a permanent easement. Is that,
did I hear you correctly?
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Bill Weckman: No there has not been a formal counter proposal. In our response to Mr. Dorsey we did
indicate that.
Todd Gerhardt: You would look at it.
Bill Weckman: We would look at that as a possible resolution to his concerns as far as is water going
over private property or whatever. To in fact put a permanent drainage easement on that area and
compensate for that drainage easement.
Todd Gerhardt: But at any time your right-of-way people would sit down with Mr. Dorsey if he would
like to try to settle this but you have parameters of which you have to work within.
Bill Weckman: Well right. I mean we have, we have our appraisal on what the values are and what the
impacts are and we can work with that. The property owner has a right to have their appraiser and own
appraisal done and which in fact the County would have to pay for. We haven’t seen that type of an
appraisal. That’s one way to try to negotiate this way out and there again, if we can’t negotiate it, well
then it’s go to the Land Commissioners and each side present their case and the Land Commissioners
determine what’s fair compensation for damages or impacts we’re doing to the property.
Councilwoman Ernst: It’s just hard for us, for me to approve this tonight when I don’t know it’s going to
get done and when. That’s my concern.
Mayor Furlong: Mr. Gerhardt.
Todd Gerhardt: It’s going to get done.
Councilwoman Ernst: But when?
Todd Gerhardt: You know it’s sometime. It’s got to be done. As soon as you can find a third
commissioner to hear it, but you know you can’t but he’s assured that he’s going to get some type of
compensation. I think you have already settled with some property owners along the corridor.
Bill Weckman: Ah yes. We’ve settled with a number of property owners or close to a settlement on a
couple more.
Councilman McDonald: Mr. Gerhardt if I could. One of the things that he just said at the end that
changes a lot of things for me is the fact there is a condemnation process. That wasn’t brought up earlier.
Under the law they can go in there and start doing all this construction and you can settle it out later but
you know they’re forced by law, by statute, you’re right. There’s a process. So that’s why I asked, okay
if you’ve already started a condemnation proceeding then this has kind of gone beyond us but if you want
to have Mr. Knutson you know write to the council and express that yeah, our holding up this permit is
not going to accomplish a thing. Just because of where that’s at so I mean, that’s where it’s at. It’s
already transitioned over to the legal recourse side of all this. If it’s in condemnation then there’s nothing
we can do so.
Mayor Furlong: So are you suggesting, Mr. McDonald are you suggesting that we go forward with the
proposed resolution this evening?
Councilman McDonald: Yeah, I’m proposing now yeah. We might as well go forward with the
resolution because we have no impact and there is the down side of, as Mr. Gerhardt says, there’s
probably penalties built into the contract. I don’t feel comfortable incurring penalties when there’s
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
nothing I can do about it and at this point I can’t do anything about it. You know we hold it up, it’s not
going to make that process of condemnation go any quicker or any faster. It’s a set process and it does
under statute it allows the state entities to come in. You can start construction and we’ll argue over fair
market value and everything at a later date. It allows projects to move forward. That’s why the law was
written that way.
Mayor Furlong: Mr. McDonald, would you like to make the motion then for this evening?
Councilman McDonald: Sure if they put it back up. I’ve forgotten what it was.
Mayor Furlong: It’s in your packet as well.
Councilman McDonald: Okay.
Councilman Laufenburger: Page 124.
Councilman McDonald: I would make a motion Mr. Mayor that the Chanhassen City Council approves
the Wetland Alteration Permit #2014-05 and the WCA Permit #2013-01 for the purpose of the
reconstruction of County State Aid Highway 18 (Lyman Boulevard) Roadway Improvement Project,
Phase 3 and authorize the Water Resources Coordinator to sign the joint notification application for
approval of the wetland replacement as shown in application dated February 11, 2014, subject to
conditions within the staff report.
Mayor Furlong: Do you want to continue then? And.
Councilman McDonald: Oh, and adoption of the attached Findings of Fact and Recommendations.
Mayor Furlong: Okay, thank you. Is there a second?
Councilwoman Tjornhom: Second.
Mayor Furlong: Motion’s been made and seconded. Is there discussion on the motion before us? Mr.
Laufenburger.
Councilman Laufenburger: Thank you Mr. Mayor. I think as has been made clear, this wetland alteration
permit is needed for the building of the road. I do not disagree with Mr. Anderson’s position as he’s
expressing them on the part of Mr. Dorsey that what we don’t know is what’s going to happen to the
water that comes through that culvert after the construction is complete. But it’s clear to me that the
conveyance of that water, whether it’s flat. Whether it’s graded or whatever, that’s outside of what this
permit is supposed to do so I don’t believe that there’s anything that we can do to accelerate, to prone,
you know work for action. All we can do is encourage and support Mr. Dorsey in his efforts with the
County to try to get them to understand that in his view his property’s going to be impacted and the
County needs to at least listen. Maybe not agree but at least listen to that in an effective way. I’m
prepared by support this motion as it stands.
Councilwoman Ernst: Mr. Mayor?
Mayor Furlong: Councilwoman Ernst.
Councilwoman Ernst: Yes now that I’ve had some clarification on the condemnation process, that does
change it for me as well but I would also like to see the County continue to work diligently to try and
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
resolve this issue. And I know that there are processes that you need to follow and it sounds like it’s kind
of on their timeline but I would only ask that that happens so I would support this as well.
Mayor Furlong: Any other discussion? Hearing none, without objection we’ll proceed with the vote.
Councilman McDonald moved, Councilwoman Tjornhom seconded that the Chanhassen City
approves Wetland Alteration Permit #2014-05 and WCA Permit Number 2013-01 for the purpose
of the reconstruction of County State Aid Highway (CSAH) 18 (Lyman Boulevard) Roadway
Improvements Project, Phase 3; and authorizes the Water Resources Coordinator to sign the joint
notification application for approval of wetland replacement as shown in application dated February
11, 2014 subject to the following conditions and adoption of the attached Findings of Fact and
Recommendation:
1.Wetland replacement shall occur in a manner consistent with the Minnesota Wetland
Conservation Act (MR 8420). The applicant shall receive the City’s approval of a wetland
replacement plan prior to any wetland impact occurring.
2.An appeal has been filed on behalf of Mr. Rick Dorsey. This is an appeal of staff decision to
deny a request for a No-Loss determination for Wetland 1A. Any approval of mitigation
quantities shall be contingent upon the outcome of this appeal. The county may hold any
additional credits and apply those credits to future phases of the Lyman (CSAH 18)
reconstruction project.
3.If it is determined that secondary impacts will occur to wetland 1A as a result of the proposed
improvements, these impacts will need to be mitigated for at a 2:1 ratio.
4.Wetland buffer areas shall be preserved, maintained, and/or created around all existing
wetlands in compliance with Sections 20-401 – 20-421 of Chanhassen City Code.
5.The applicant shall apply for and obtain permits from the appropriate regulatory agencies, e.g.
Minnesota Pollution Control Agency, Minnesota Department of Natural Resources,
Minnesota Department of Transportation, Minnesota Board of Soil and Water Resources and
Army Corps of Engineers and comply with their conditions of approval.
6.The applicant must submit a Bill of Sale for Wetland Banking Credits to the Minnesota Board
of Water and Soil Resources signed by both the buyer and seller of designated wetland
credits.
7.The applicant must obtain, and the city must have received copy of, an Application for
Withdrawal of Wetland Credits from the Minnesota Wetland Bank signed and approved by
the Minnesota Board of Water and Soil Resources prior to any wetland impacts.
8.A signed Landowner Statement and Contractor Responsibility form shall be provided to city
prior to commencement of activity.
All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 5 to 0.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you everyone. Hopefully we can find a resolution quickly.
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
APPOINTMENTS TO COMMISSIONS.
Mayor Furlong: Over the course of our last two work sessions the City Council interviewed a number of
applicants who are interested in serving on one of our four or as an alternate different commissions.
Planning Commission, Park and Recreation Commission, Senior Commission, and Environmental
Commission and tonight I’d like to put forth nominations or move the nominations for some of our
residents who have agreed to give of their time, talent, and service for the benefit of all of us and we
appreciate that. With regard to the Environmental Commission, if it’s okay with the council we’ll just
move through these in it’s entirety and then I’ll ask for a second. We’ll discuss at that point. With the
Environmental Commission there are two 3 year terms. We move the nomination of Katie Mahannah and
Matthew Myers for those two 3 year terms. With regard to the Senior Commission we would move the
nomination of Carol Buesgens and David Wisniewski, and excuse me if I mispronounce for 3 year
appointments and Jean Mancini for a 2 year appointment with that term expiring in March of ’16 and the
other two in March of ’17. With regard to the Park and Rec Commission we would move for the
appointment for 3 years each for Brent Carron, Luke Thunberg and Steve Scharfenberg. And for, as
commission members, 3 year commission members and two youth commission members for 1 year term
each, Jacob Stolar and Tyler Kobilarcsik. And then with regard to the Planning Commission move
forward for a 3 year appointment, Mark Undestad. At this time I would ask for a second to those
nominations.
Councilwoman Ernst: Second.
Mayor Furlong: Motion’s been made and seconded. Is there any discussion on the nominations? Mr.
McDonald.
Councilman McDonald: Mr. Mayor I know you’re getting tired of hearing from me but.
Mayor Furlong: Not at all. I always appreciate your comments.
Councilman McDonald: I just want to say, I want to thank the residents, everyone who came out.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you.
Councilman McDonald: It’s a, you know without our commissions it makes our job that much more
difficult. They do act as a filter as a point of contact for us for the residents. They perform an invaluable
service and I think you know the council, if I could speak for everyone but we do appreciate their works
and we do appreciate people who volunteer for these positions so if you didn’t get selected it has, we just
ran out of room, that’s all there is to it but I would encourage everyone to apply again to these
commissions. Openings pop up quite often and again thank you for everybody.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Appreciate those comments. Any other comments? Seeing none we’ll
proceed with the vote without objection.
Mayor Furlong moved, Councilwoman Ernst seconded to approve the following commission
appointments:
Environmental Commission:
3 Year Term: Katie Mahannah and Matthew Myers
Senior Commission:
3 Year Term: Carol Buesgens and David Wisniewski; 2 Year Term: Jean Mancini
Park and Recreation Commission:
3 Year Term: Brent Carron, Luke Thunberg and Steve
Scharfenberg; 1 Year Youth Commission Term: Jacob Stolar and Tyler Kobilarcsik
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
Planning Commission:
3 Year Term: Mark Undestad
All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 5 to 0.
Mayor Furlong: Congratulations to those appointments and again we appreciate your willingness to serve
for our benefit and benefit of all the residents and businesses in town. With that, that completes our items
of new business.
COUNCIL PRESENTATIONS:
Mayor Furlong: Any comments from members of the council under council presentations? Tomorrow at.
Councilman McDonald: If I?
Mayor Furlong: I’m sorry, Mr. McDonald.
Councilman McDonald: I’m just full of all kinds of…
Mayor Furlong: Not at all. I should have just said Mr. McDonald at the beginning.
Councilman McDonald: Well it’s one of those days. I just wanted to say that you know one of the things
that I did last week, I attended the AIS symposium that the watershed district puts on and I met quite a
few people and this, each year it does get bigger. It’s interesting to see how things are beginning to
change a little bit as to the outlook of how this needs to be resolved and in my opinion one of the things
that we as a city have done is what everyone says needs to be done. The only way you’re going to deal
with this problem is education and I think we have set up programs where that’s been our primary focus is
to educate the boaters and the users of the lakes to all of these various species and the thing that was
interesting was, the list has grown. You know from the 2 years ago that I attended but again it’s being
born out that what we have done in trying to educate boaters and explain to them what to look for. Where
to look for and to do as much as what is humanly possible, I again think that we’re within the norm and in
fact a little bit ahead of the curve so it was interesting.
Mayor Furlong: Good, thank you. Any other comments under council presentations? I am looking
forward to presenting an update on city events at the Buy Chanhassen luncheon tomorrow. 11:30 at the
American Legion and I know that there’s still space available so anybody interested that would like to
attend. I know that Buy Chanhassen organization would appreciate your attendance so. Mr. Gerhardt,
administrative presentations.
ADMINISTRATIVE PRESENTATIONS:
Todd Gerhardt: Just one item to announce to the public that we have selected a new fire chief. This is
our first full time Fire Chief and happy to announce that Don Johnson from, he lives in Lakeville. He’s
got a Farmington address so it’s kind of nice to know that we’re not alone.
Mayor Furlong: He understands.
Todd Gerhardt: Yeah. I said that’s nothing. We have a mayor that has an Excelsior mailing address so,
but Don has been a volunteer fire fighter in Lakeville for 14 years. Is a station captain. The end of this
month he will have finished his Fire Science degree and he also has over 20 years of experience working
with the Hennepin County Sheriff’s Office and has had a variety of different roles through the sheriff’s
office. Promoted within the ranks several times. Is currently working for Hennepin County Corrections
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Chanhassen City Council – March 24, 2014
and in helping them out on some special projects and he was hand selected to do that so I’m excited to see
th
Don come to Chanhassen. His start date is May 5 and he will be in front of the council, be sworn in on
th
our May 12 meeting and so everybody will have a chance to meet Don and probably have some cake. I
know that’s a special day when we have cake in the council chambers so, but I have sent out a press
release informing people of Don’s background and informed the volunteers of my decision and some of
them have expressed support during that process and appreciate that and, because you can’t have enough
support around here but I’m excited for the placement of Don as our new fire chief.
Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Any questions for Mr. Gerhardt or his staff?
Councilman McDonald: Mr. Mayor?
Mayor Furlong: Mr. McDonald.
Councilman McDonald: I’m sorry but you know I mean whenever someone does something really good I
think you should recognize him and the only point I wanted to make was that, you know I’ve been aware
of what Mr. Gerhardt’s been doing for the selection of the fire chief and I have to say I think he ran a very
fair and thorough process and what he looked at was what’s in the best interest of our community. I mean
he could have just gone out and hired somebody himself and you know we would have gone through with
it but I think because he solicited the input from so many different areas within public safety that my hat’s
off to you for that selection process and the way you did it so I appreciate it. I think that we’ve got a good
fire chief for the community and going forward we’re in good hands so thank you.
Todd Gerhardt: Thank you. Yeah it was a long day last Wednesday and we put a few of the applicants
through a series of questions. I want to thank Sheriff Jim Olson for sitting in on the initial interviews
along with Joel McColl. Savage Fire Chief and Laurie Hokkanen, the Assistant City Manager did a lot of
the leg work on all of this and so it was quite a process. We had over 17 volunteers that sat in. All the
department heads sat in on a series of interviews last week and so we got a lot of input and I think with
that you usually get a good conclusion and that’s where we are.
Mayor Furlong: And I guess I, when you extend appreciation for a job well done I think we’d be remiss
without making comment too about our current chief, Chief Wolff and the work that he has done over the
years as chief and his ability to move the department forward to where it is today so we can take this next
logical step towards a full time chief and so I’m hoping that we’ll have an opportunity to extend our
thanks to him at a future date more formally but I think for the record this evening I think it’s important
that we recognize his efforts and extend our thanks and appreciation on behalf of the residents and
businesses as well. Any other questions or comments for Mr. Gerhardt? Mr. McDonald?
Councilman McDonald: No. No…
Mayor Furlong: The one time I go straight to you and now you don’t have any.
CORRESPONDENCE DISCUSSION.
None.
Councilman McDonald moved, Councilwoman Ernst seconded to adjourn the meeting. All voted in
favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 5 to 0. The City Council meeting was
adjourned at 9:30 p.m.
Submitted by Todd Gerhardt
City Manager Prepared by Nann Opheim
45