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1e. Fire Dept. Concept Plan ta CITY of AN EN 690 COULTER DRIVE • P.O. BOX 147 • CHANHASSEN, MINNESOTA 55317 ' (612) 937-1900 \ Z MEMORANDUM TO: Don Ashworth, City Manager t FROM: Jim Chaffee, Public Safety Director DATE: March 9 , 1988 SUBJ: Fire Department Concept Plan - Final Approval ' Background On September 21, 1987, the City Council was updated and appraised ' of the status of the Fire Department expansion and remodeling. At that time they were presented with the initial concept plan as worked out by the Fire Department and designed by E.O.S. The concept plan was well received and only a few questions were aired. On December 7 , 1987, the Fire Department, with E.O.S. , came back to the Council with a revision and cost breakdowns as requested by Council. The original concept plan was once again presented with clarifications on costs for specific items . It was well received by the Council and a motion was made and passed to pre- sent to the voters a fire department referendum which would include the original concept plan plus an aerial platform truck. Recommendation ' It is the recommendation of this office to give final approval of the Fire Department expansion and remodeling plan as presented. ' Staff will then initiate the site review process with the Planning Commission and recognizing that time is a factor, this office would recommend simultaneous authority to proceed with the plans and specifications . I I t - 4. li .s....■. I i CITY OF _70 4••1 `t-�A t , . G cEANHAssEN „,L, 1 690 COULTER DRIVE • P.O. BOX 147 • CHANHASSEN, MINNESOTA 55317 (612) 937-1900 1 MEMORANDUM 1131 TO: Don Ashworth, City Manager I_ _I I FROM Jim Chaffee, Public Safety Director -.--/2/3-/ J- IIDATE: December 3 , 1987 _____________________ IllSUBJ: Fire Department Referendum II Four years ago there was a recognized need for additional space at the Central Fire Station on Laredo Drive. Because of dif- ii fering priorities and capital improvement timetables, the Fire Department Building Committee was asked to wait. In May of this TA year, the go ahead for the Building Committee to meet with the architect was obtained. At that time, an expansion to the II apparatus area was the only addition anticipated, costing in the Ili neighborhood of $300 , 000. The question now is "How did we go from that to an expansion costing more than three times as much?" II The answer is not simple and involves many complex and sometimes competing issues . IIWhen the original concept of additional apparatus space was II discussed four ( 4 ) years ago, it was reflecting a present need. li BM Since that time, the City has seen tremendous growth which has 1 necessitated taking a closer look at the Fire Department' s needs then, its present needs , and its future needs . As was mentioned I previously, the Fire Department needs four years ago appeared to II be space, especially in the apparatus bays . There was not ade- quate space to accommodate the Fire Department vehicles and equipment presently on hand. Consequently, emergency response IIvehicles were forced to be stacked in an unsafe and cramped II manner. This necessitated hazardous vehicle movements during emergency call outs when speed ( response time) was critical. IIAt the present time, these needs are still as critical as they II were four years ago. In addition, two events during this last il summer suggested some other needs . The first event occurred in the beginning of July when the Fire Chief, 1st Assistant Fire II Chief, and the Public Safety Director attended a two day weekend seminar on recruiting, training, and maintaining volunteer fire- II fighters . The seminar was instructed by Jack W. Snook, a nationally recognized expert in the field of volunteer II firefighters . _ II II I I/ J , IIMr. Don Ashworth December 3 , 1987 Page 2 I Mr. Snook pointed out that the best value in municipal government I is the volunteer fire department. The City is reaping a tremen- dous service for what little remuneration is received by its mem- bers. Typically, the volunteer firefighter is recruited from the I ranks of the blue collar worker and Chanhassen' s growth is occurring in the white collar area. efforts must be geared toward the white ncollar tmembers roftthet community. The suggested methods toward white collar recruitment I includes providing challenges, recognition, and rewards. Good equipment, hacilities, and training are the most important deter- mints of force. subsequently a dedicated volunteer The second event occurred on July 23rd, during the "storm of the century" . I Y • During the course of the storm and the evening, it became readily apparent that the Chanhassen municipal facilities were inadequate to handle a relatively simple, but intense 1 dnatural disaster. These two events provided fuel for concept esigns and subsequent schematic additions to the original bay expansion that was four years old. ' Throughout the summer, as the Fire Station addition and remo- deling began evolving, the concept of a multi-faceted facility took form. These uses include civil defense, emergency opera- tions center, command post, rescue coordination, physical fit- ' ness, emergency shelter, and meetin g rooms The needs were apparent, but how totransformuthese need a ftw. economically feasible, albeit adequate, design were complex. nn I a paid fire department, employees are on hand at the fire station I 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. This response times. Although a volunteer lfireedepartmentcdoesonot have the luxury of 24 hour staffing, I crucial. Some of the methods that volunteer efire edepartments commonly employ to ensure quick response are incentives by which members are attracted to the station during their time. hich I These include pool tables , g spare time. movie channels, kitchen facilities, cable tv' s with work-out rooms, and the list sleeping quarters, excercise Ithat were looked at in the design of •the lfire estation. It was also designed to meet the perceived needs of the community years or longer into the future, recognizing a service population of approximately 13, 000 to 15, 000 . population IThe initial concept was o I r 1987, to include the cost estimattesoforetheuconstrructioneatter 21 $ II 900, 000. 00 . It appeared to be relatively well received by the Council, except for comments concerning the raquetball court. II I On November 30, 1987, the Fire Department members met to discuss the design. They voted to go with the design as originally pre- sented to the Council. In deference to the Council ' s concerns; II . r ill II 1 Imo Mr. Don Ashworth December 3, 1987 II 1 Page 3 i IIIhowever, an alternate design was suggested, eliminating the rac- II quetball court. If the Council voices strong objection to the racquetball court, then the alternate design could be looked at keeping in mind that no cost savings may be realized. The argu- ments in favor of the racquetball court appear to be convincing: II 1 . The ability for an amenity such as the racquetball court to a) attract ( recruit) , and b) retain members to the I 14 volunteer Fire Department. lj2 . The racquetball court' s relatively low cost compared with II the entire cost of the project ( less than 4 . 5% ) . 171 3 . The designed ability for the court to be converted to office/storage space at some point in the future if it II is needed. Ill .. 4 . Use of facility open to all city employees. II 5 . Physical fitness guidelines to comply with anticipated PIOSHA mandates and liability concerns. I 6 . An attraction for rescue/fire personnel to be on premises when the alarm is sounded. II101 7 . Emergency shelter/storage. a Hopefully, there is more than adequate justification for the design as presented, including the racquetball court. The three II ( 3 ) critical areas as measued by past, present, and future needs I are 1) apparatus space, 2 ) command station/emergency operations IIcenter, and 3 ) exercise aerobic area. The fire station remo- deling is designed to meet these needs ten years into the future and beyond. alAerial Platform Truck: In a memo from Jim Castleberry to Don II Ashworth dated June 5 , 1984 , it was suggested that an aerial platform truck may be needed in 1989 , depending on Chanhassen ' s II industrial growth. The industrial growth is here and very much on the horizon. ilCan the City use an aerial platform truck at present and is the II need there for one? The answer to both these questions is yes . To paraphrase from the 1984 memo, it has been well documented I that an aerial fire apparatus enhances the attack capabilities of I the Fire Department. An aerial platform truck can place fire- fighters on the top of roofs and can direct master streams into II large areas in a short period of time. To fight a large fire II from a safe distance is crucial for safety and the aerial plat- form allows for that capability. An aerial would prove valuable in fire suppression needs for Chanhassen apartment complexes and II multi-family units . II a II Mr. Don Ashworth December 3 , 1987 1 Page 4 1 In rescue operations alone, an aerial platform truck could prove its worth with its extended reach capabilities . All things considered (mutual aid and sprinkler systems ) , an aerial 1 platform truck is a needed piece of apparatus that the City of Chanhassen cannot long be without. Public Safety uses for an aerial truck are numerous and varied. The cost for an aerial 1 platform truck is $450, 000. 00 with a two year lead time antici- pated. 1 The total Fire Department package approximates $1, 500, 000, fulfilling a present need and representing an investment in the future for the City of Chanhassen. 1 Manager' s Comments: This office fu ce t as fully endorses the design con- e presented. I doubt that we will be able to fund an 1 aerial truck from the operating budget. The space needs have been evident for a number of years and the incident this last summer points out a real need for a command/emergency operation 1 center. In a time of initial chaos following a large emergency, a truly coordinated command and dispatch function is needed. The Department appears to believe that the community will support the fire station addition including the racquetball court. I would 1 recommend that they be given the opportunity to see if they are right. 1 1 OfY 1 1 t 1 � 1 r 1 f 1 i 1 I 1111 _ , . • tEos 1 CORPORATION I J.NICHOLAS RUEHL,A1A IBERTIL E. HAGLUND,AIA I . September 28, 1987 I 1 Mr. Jim Chaffee, Director of Public Safety II City of Chanhassen 690 Coulter Drive I PO Box 147 1 Chanhassen, MN 55317 Dear Jim: 111 I Enclosed please find our revised preliminary estimate for the proposed Chanhassen Central Fire I Station, Chanhassen, MN. I have incorporated the previous additional cost items into our original estimate. Also I have II Indicated the line item deletions for the racquetball court area and skylights. I As per our previous conversation,the possible re-design of the lower level which would involve changing the racquetball court into another type of use could push the occupant over 100 people ' which would then require an elevator for handicapped access. 1 If you have any questions, please call. Sincerely, - - I a ` _ 1 Jack Andekson,AIA iii JA:jc I Enclosure I I Ill _ _ II ' 2 9 138 err Y SEP OF CHANHASSE7 N 1 II ARCHITECTS - SPACE PLANNERS • INTERIOR DESIGNERS I al 684 EXCELSIOR BOULEVARD • SUITE ONE • EXCELSIOR, MINNESOTA 55331 • (612) 474-3291 1 „I .. , Eos 1 CORPORATION J. NICHOLAS RUEHL,AIA BERTIL E.HAGLUND,AIA CHANHASSEN CENTRAL FIRE STATION 87146 CHANHASSEN, MINNESOTA I SEPTEMBER 24, 1987 • PRELIMINARY ESTIMATE II GENERAL: Site Work 59,000 II Demolition 12,183 Concrete 24,405 Masonry 134.640 :1 Metals 51,360 Carpentry 10,000 Thermal & Moisture 41,010 Doors&Windows 43,302 ,1 Finishes 47,588 Specialties 12,400 Special Construction 28.000 SUB TOTAL - 463,888 MECHANICAL: II HVAC 51,900 _ Plumbing 50,300 ISprinkler 22,800 SUB TOTAL 125,000 IELECTRICAL: Electrical 53,000 I Site 7,000 Emergency Generator 35,000 TOTAL 95,000 SUB TOTAL 683,888 IG. C. OH & Profit (15%) &General Conditions 102,582 SUB TOTAL 786,470 IContingency (5%) 39,323 I I ARCHITECTS • SPACE PLANNERS • INTERIOR DESIGNERS 1 684 EXCELSIOR BOULEVARD • SUITE ONE • EXCELSIOR, MINNESOTA 55331 • (612) 474-3291 .• . .1 � Eos CORPORATION SUB TOTAL 825,793 II Architectural/Engineering (9.25%) 76,387 TOTAL 902,180 1 Additional Costs: I Equipment and furniture Soil Testing ll Reproduction and Printing _ Kitchen Appliances Deletions I A. Racquetball Court:walls,floors, ceiling structure, finishes, mech., and elec.. 61,200 B. Raquetball Court: finishes and elec. .39,600 C.Skylights 42,200 I I I II II I I I I _ I tCity Council Meeting - December 7, 1987 tS ICouncilman Johnson: I'd like to suggest one improvement to the final report and that is that information be placed in the report detailing the other sites that were looked at. Make this report as complete as possible. A good I document to stand on. Talk about why we didn't place it outside the MUSA line. Why the group decided against the other free standing options and what the costs where. Place that in the report rather than merely referring to it. IMake this report a complete report on all the actions taken by the Task Force. Councilman Horn: My concern in referendums is that we should give the voters as many options as we can. I'm going to push for that in all the referendum Iitems. That we separate them as much to give the people as much input into this thing as possible. I think by lumping things together we're giving away those options and I don't feel that's right. IICONSIDER POTENTIAL 1988 REFERENDUM ITEM: REMODELING OF FIRE, NICK IIRUEHL, EOS CORPORATION. — Jack Anderson: I'll let Jim speak first and introduce I come up and focus on the planning then we'll dal with the questions.then I'll Jim McMahon: 4 years ago there was a recognized need for an addition on the fire station. However, at that time there were not funds available to I consider that project. Then about a year and a half ago we were informed that the time was such that we were to review our problems and needs, and propose an addition onto the fire station. In doing that, reviewing our problems and R 4 needs, we came up with the facts that we needed added room for equipment, 4 Ioffices, meeting rooms and some type of a fitness facility or room. In addition to that, we reviewed our situation as far as membership is concerned. New members as well as keeping those existing members. We've also reviewed II the growth of the city, where the city is going. There has been a lot of discussion tonight in regards to the new downtown, the community center, industrial park is growing and our residential population is growing in leaps and bounds. For example, to date we are up 21% in calls over last year. We I also reviewed what our needs were as far as added equipment at this time and with all the industrial growth, downtown and so on, we also came to the conclusion that we now are in need of a aerial platform. This is in I conjunction with industrial growth and residential construction changes, designs, setbacks in buildings throughout the community. Basically what we've come up with as far as solutions to some our problems. Obviously we will II cover the room situation with the presentation of the plan that we have for the building. However, as far as our membership is concerned, which also is tied into this plan, after visiting with other communities and other chiefs in the area who have similar problems to us in regards to new members and keeping members, they recommended that we attend a school seminar that was put on by an individual out of Cleveland who specializes in volunteer fire departments. After attending this we also designed into our building and found areas where I we felt we could help fill the requirements as far as membership and keeping our members. One of the aspects that they pointed was that the overall picture as far as planning your department you should consider what your II population is, what your membership is, where it's coming from and after doing [7:: that, we've determined that Chanhassen is pretty much now, and moving more so 48 1 r3 4. 1 City Council Meeting - December 7, 1987 towards a white collar community and therefore, the use of two or three things that we feel will attract people of that particular standing. We also propose a Plan A and Plan B to the membership. What you're going to see tonight is the choice of the total department. Obviously not 100% voted but definitely a unanimous vote in favor of the plan that's going to be presented to you tonight. There was some question at one of the meetings in regards to a portion of the station which will be addressed tonight and that's our multi- use fitness facility. In regards to what we would like to recommend to the council, we would like on the referendum that both the aerial aparatus and the fire station be a single issue. At this point Jack can go over the planning aspects. Mayor Hamilton: Could you repeat what you just said? You want to have the aerial with the station? You want them to go together? I just want to clear on that. Jack Anderson: I'll start out with the lower level. Basically, the existing , building there is about 7,000 square feet and the new would be about 15,000 square feet. The lower level, the green area is where you come in, pile storage, training officers, womens and men's locker area, courtyard, exercise area that could be used as a racquetball court or multipurpose uses. The intent was to design it so a second floor could be put in. With this four across here, there could be some expansion in offices in the administrative area here and down here, expansion of the exercise area and additional storage. This exercise area down here... On the first floor, I'll start out with the apparatus area. That essentially has grown twice as large and as you • can see, this is basically, putting the aerial here... We maintain a back access. There's an emergency generator, I think the plan previously said to not have it. This would be an emergency generator here and this would tie into the City Hall for emergency power. This is the existing building presently goes from here and goes like this. The office, the more administrative part, one of the key planning aspects was this manned conference dispatch located centrally between the chief and other offices, entry with dispatch lookout into the apparatus room. It also gets the dispatch out of the traffic which it presently is in right now. It's a much better planning for that room. Then, the chief's office here, assistant and an additional office located there, a lounge area in the upper area of the courtyard. Parking is up front, predominantly in back and then along the side over here. I guess that pretty much takes you through. You had expressed some concerns about cost. We have indicated a skylight area here and some additional orientation of the local post tower, those came to about $42,000.00 and we could look at those as an alternate. Mayor Hamilton: Did you have anything else you wanted to present Jim? ' Jim McMahon: No, I think that's pretty much it other than the fact that I forgot to mention one of the things involved in the multiuse fitness room..., one of the things at the entrance was the fact that we attended three meetings in the last year that were attended by OSHA and OSHA has on all three occasions stressed an emphasize on the need and the fact that they will be enforcing fitness programs as far as fire fighters are concerned and they expressed an interest in seeing to it that many new stations building 49 ' ICity Council Meeting - December 7, 1987 Iadditions will include some type of a fitness facility for their fire fighters a as it's been determined on a national numbers, the number one cause of fire fighters fatality is heart attack from physical exertion. Our multiuse I fitness room includes a program for strenuous cardiac exercise program. I might also add, this facility will be open for police officers that are also under the same requirements as we are. Other public servants that would fall Iunder that _requirement. Councilman Johnson: I don't have many questions on here. I have looked at this. I work with OSHA regulations and are familiar with the requirements I here. I see the entire need for this. This is probably one of the most vital services that this city provides to our citizens. It's an excellent fire protection system, our fire fighting. We're working more with our fire I marshalls and everything to get fire prevention going and the entire facility I believe is totally necessary if we want to continue providing our citizens with this current level of service. With the changing. demographic nature of this city, we are going to have to have something that will attract more fire I fighters into the area. We're going to need more fire fighters as we are growing. The need for the aerial truck I believe is there. It's past due. You have to fight fires, it doesn't necessarily mean a tall building to fight I a fire in. It would mean a wide building. If you want to hit a fire that's 'in the center of a building like United Mailing or Instant Webb, the Press, you can't reach those from the ground. If you have to get into the attic of a I building that has a high pitch on the roof, it becomes very dangerous fire fighters to try and negotiate those pitches. With the, I all it far the cherry picker type ladder truck here where you have a platform that people can stand in, they can go right up onto those high pitch roofs and fight their I fire. You look at Near Mountain. A lot of those houses have a high pitch roof in it. I have a neighbor near me that probably has at least a 1 to 1 pitch on his roof. It's almost an A-frame. I think it's due and I'd like to I see this go to referendum. I'd like to see our citizens pass this and get this project built because I think this is an essential service that we must have. I Councilman Boyt: I can save us some time. I'm for them both. I got no questions and no comments. I Councilman Horn: The only question I have is just one minor one. I believe in our packet you talked about the space being available to city employees. Are you referring only to public safety employees or all city employees? IJim McMahon: It would be available to all city employees. It's important for the City. When we have looked at facilities that have been built in this I town, Instant Webb, they have an exercise facility for their employees. The Press and what they've found is one, they keep people on the job. Two, they get less people missing work because they are physically fit and their performance is better. So whether or not everybody will use that facility, it I will be available to them and those who do use it, will be better workers as far as the city's concerned. Councilman Horn: I just have one more comment. It should be obvious to I everybody here that if we buy an aerial truck we're going to need someplace to kr I . 50 I City Council Meeting - December 7, 1987 put it so if we get an aeria I 1 truck with no facility, we can't get an aerial truck. Again, in this case, I think there is an option of expanding the facility without an aerial truck. I don't think that that's a good idea to put them together. Councilman Geving: I've been here for many years and I can tell you that I've I always appreciated what the fire department has done for our community. For the most part we've tried to take care of their needs with good equipment and supported them wherever it was needed. The proposal that I see before me tonight is one that's highly important to our community. We have not had any I expansion to our fire hall since it was built. Our community has probably doubled in that time. We know that the need is there for a command center. We need to have additional office spaces as we mentioned when you were here I last time. We need to have the additional two bays for the placement of our vehicles that are pretty well crowded in there now. I don't think we need to be embarrassed about asking for a recreation room or an exercise facility. That goes with the department and if it's a need that's going to be placed on I us by OSHA and we recognize that it's for the good of our firemen, let's call if a fitness facility and let's use it for that. I highly endorse this whole proposal. I'm more concerned about where we're going-to get our additional I firemen and I think the two go hand in hand. If you have good facilities, you have good equipment, you're going to attract additional firemen. At least you're going to attract and keep the people that we have signed up. I I understnad we've lost some people. Maybe these are the kinds of things that will hold them if we do have a good facility but it's highly needed. It's i absolutely essential to the community. As far as reciprocal agreements i between our communities, whenever we have a major fire or catastrophe, we have I an agreement to have an aerial truck come in from Excelsior or Eden Prairie and we don't have anything to reciprocate with other than our good will so I think down the line we're going to have to have an aerial facilit I build our community it's absolutely essential. The thing that I think however is how best to package this in a referendum. I believe if I were to give my priority of the three or four items that we're going to talk about tonight, I'd place the fire department's needs first. That's my number one I priority over the community center, over an ice arena, over trails. To me this is where it's at because this is something I can feel, I can touch, I can see. The need is here now. I believe we can get along with some of the other proposals later but this is a need that should go to the referendum and people I think will support it. I think that you've done us a favor in identifying some of the things that we probably would have asked you to delete from the I plan. Originally there was some skylights in here that I know we all asked questions about and Clark asked that the items be enumerated and you have done that. I believe that the skylights could go. Whether or not we finish off that exercise facility, I guess I have to ask the question from you, if we put I in the exercise facility in the lower level, would we build an upper level over it with office space? Is that the plan? Jack Anderson: Not right now. I I Councilman Gevin I— g. You wouldn't complete that? I Jack Anderson: It would be an open space right now. 51 1 U City Council Meeting December g - er 7, 1987 t Councilman Geving: Okay, I didn't understand that. I guess I have a difficult time trying to put all these packages together. Where I'm coming II from is whether or not to package the aerial ladder truck with the facility itself, with construction of the expanded fire station. I happen to realize that two years from now when we really need the aerial truck and somebody says let's go buy it, we won't have the half million dollars that's needed to come ' out of the general fund. We just won't have it. We may not even have the levy authority to buy it so the strategy and I'm going to have to look to Don for an answer on this but it seems to me that the only smart way to package this is to put it all in one. Then if the need is absolutely essential and two years from now, or a year from now, whatever it happens to be, the Council decides to go ahead with the truck, we will have had the referendum approval ' from the people to go out and do it. Whereas, if we don't package it that way, we won't have the money so that's the real strategy. I guess I've given you most of my comments except to say, I think you guys have done a nice job. The fire department is unanimously behind this proposal and I hope we can get ' it for you. That's all I have. Mayor Hamilton: I guess I can take the easy way out and not make any comments ' either but I'm going to continue to be honest with you as I have been right along to say that I do have a lot of concerns about what you're asking for. I think there are a lot of questions that we don't have the answers to so we can ' deal with this issue effectively yet. For instance, we talked about the need for equipment, additional equipment, a $500,000.00 piece of equipment but when we look at developments and the building of new buildings we continue to put more and more restrictions on the building. Putting in sprinkler systems, new ' sprinkler systems, up in the roof, up in the rafters, then lower, then everything has to be with all the bells and whistles on it so the alarms blow in the central location someplace so it can respond to it in an instant. I ' think we've been told when you start adding those things to buildings, that you don't need the equipment or as much equipment or personnel that you would need if you didn't have those things. Then we immediately turn around and we have a request for a $500,000.00 piece of equipment. Maybe it's needed. I'm ' not saying it's not needed. What I am saying is exactly what I've said to you before is, I think it's time that we find out what is needed. I think there are ways to do that and that's by having a consultant coming into the City. ' Look at what the needs are of the fire department and the police department and then to evaluate what is said in that study and then to make some adjustments from there. Just because our town is growing and we have additional population doesn't indicate to me, nor does it to the experts that ' I've talked to, doesn't indicate that you need to add additional people to your fire department, to your police department nor do you need to add additional equipment. One of the things you need to look at is response time ' to calls and you have to come up with a response time that you feel the community can live with. If you can meet that response time on a consistent basis and if the people in the community are happy with that and with the job once you do get there, you don't need to keep buying equipment. You don't need to keep adding people. OSHA, I'm sure it's true that they're looking at physical fitness for fire fighters but do they say that it's the city's responsibility to give them facilities to use to keep themselves in physically ' good shape? When there's a community center proposed for about 3 blocks away that can be used by all members of the fire department at no cost, I find it ' 52 } City Council Meeting - December 7, 1987 II / i Fdifficult in going along with the proposal to put a rac il I i what's now being called a multipurpose court in the facility for of 30 s people. One of the things I'm mostly concerned about is I know there is great need for the expansion of the space. You need more room. Whether it's office II space. You certainly need more bays for your equipment. I'm concerned if you package this whole thing into one lump, that you may end up not getting anything. At least not for a period of time so I guess I was surprised that II you wanted to put the aerial truck on' with everything else that you wanted to do. I think that might be an invitation to not have it pass. I think you need to think about that. I really think you need to have the expansion of the facility and I suspose you can split those things off but I think it's II just absolutely essential that you get the expansion space for the station but not necessarily all the equipment and some of the other goodies that you've added on there. I guess those are my comments. It's the same thing I've told II you before and I'm going to continue to say it and I think until I have more information to deal with the issue, I'm not sure I can change my position. Councilman Boyt moved, Councilman Geving seconded to support the placing of I the remodeling of the fire station and acquiring of an aerial truck on the referendum ballot as one item. Councilman Boyt, Councilman Geving and • Councilman Johnson voted in favor of the motion. Councilman Horn and Mayor II Hamilton voted in opposition to the motion. The motion carried with a vote of 3 to 2. Councilman Boyt: Clearly they're going to go out to the community. If the II community tells them we think you ought to split it, then we've got time between now and the referendum to come back and split them but to me, it makes sense to go at it initially as one package. It's all related to the same kind II of thing so my motion would be to present the aerial truck and the fire station remodeling as one it on the referendum. Councilman Horn: I'd like to comment. I'm not opposed to these as a II referendum item. I don't like bundling referendum items. People can make that choice. Mayor Hamilton: I think you need to come back to us with II some �nformation because I really am afraid that by putting them together, it's an invitation to lose the whole works. II Jim McMahon: We appreciate your comments and we will review the whole package and as Bill stated, we do have some time to come back after a little study and ' possibly asking some of the residents their opinion. CONSIDER 1988 REFERENDUM ITEM: TRAIL PLAN AND LAKE ANN IMPROVEMENTS, PARK AND I RECREATION COMMISSION. Mark Koegler: I think you're familiar with the basics on this one so I'll run II through it very quickly. It was referenced earlier tonight about the survey i that was done. I think you're well aware that of the top 10 responses, five of those, particularly 1, 2, 6, 7 and 10 were trail oriented. Being either II skiing, bicycling, walking, whatever so there was a strong public sentiment 53 I II