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CC 2014 11 10Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 11. Dakota Retail Property, Chanhassen Dakota Retail One, LLC: a. Approval of Amendment to Purchase Agreement. b. Approval of DEED Grant Agreement. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 5 to 0. VISITOR PRESENTATIONS: None. TWIN CITIES SELF STORAGE, 1900 STOUGHTON AVENUE: APPROVAL OF AMENDMENT TO CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT 1987-02 TO INCREASE THE NUMBER OF STORAGE BUILDINGS; AND APPROVAL OF SITE PLAN FOR FIVE ADDITIONAL STORAGE BUILDINGS; APPLICANT/OWNER: BRUCE LAMO, TWIN CITIES SELF STORAGE, CHASKA, LLC. Kate Aanenson: Can I just get clarification if you can see this on your screen? Mayor Furlong: Oh I should say, yeah. We are having some technical difficulties with the monitors this evening so we may not be able to. I don’t know if we can broadcast them or not but we don’t have them in the council chambers. Kate Aanenson: Okay. So this item as you mentioned Mayor, council members is on 1900 Stoughton Avenue. Mr. Bruce Lamo, the applicant. This property is zoned Business Fringe. If you recall the history on this property, we did do a conditional use amendment on the, he’s requesting a conditional use amendment from the original one that was done. As you recall this property was split and the conditional use that over rode the entire property, there was some ambiguity there so we changed our ordinance to make sure that there’s an existing conditional use. You can administratively split the property. So that, the storage unit did put in a stormwater pond to the back to resolve some of those issues and now Mr. Lamo wants to continue with additional phases so it needs a CUP amendment. Some of the concerns when we had the Planning Commission public hearing was to make sure that there’s screening across the street on Stoughton Avenue. They were concerned about the visibility. The staff did require Mr. Lamo, I do have the material samples here to match the existing or the architectural standards. Not what was put in place then but to meet the new standards. As you may be aware, these types of buildings can last quite a while on a piece of property so we wanted to make sure. I think the other discussion that we had with Mr. Lamo and Mr. Generous and myself talking to him about long term wise we looked at some of the access points to this property. We talked about this on our 61 corridor study that we did. We informed Mr. Lamo that that is our intention to bring sewer and water down in this area and that if we’re down in that area before this developed there’s still an opportunity to provide municipal services to the back of this property coming through an access way through Chaska and making sure that he’s provided an opportunity so I think we’re in sync on that to make sure that, provide him the most opportunities for future development as possible. So right now he’ll be kind of doing the buildings in increments. Not attending them all see how he, how much use there is but again he’s planning on five additional buildings again to taking those incrementally. So the BF district again was intended to look at limited use of commercial properties if this was guided industrial it still could be a use in that zoning district so we did take a look at that but again we are coming forward with the Comprehensive Plan amendment in this area itself. The difference with the BF district in the, when that was put in place is intended to be kind of a temporary use without municipal sewer and water. If this was some other type of facility we’d want to see that. The one issue with the BF district it does require the 40 percent, which is a higher percent of green space requirement so that does limit the ultimate development of the property so again looking at providing municipal service and giving him that opportunity. So cold storage warehousing is permitted in the BF district so we are saying it does meet the standards of the zoning district and as the site plan, 2 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 architectural renderings have been provided to the staff and represented here. Again the neighbors were concerned about landscaping. Not only the architectural view. Some of the lighting issues that are out there and I think those were all addressed at the Planning Commission so with that the staff is recommending the amendment to the conditional use permit to allow the 11 storage buildings for the cold storage warehousing. For 5, for the 5 new buildings and subject to the conditions of approval and adoption of Findings of Fact and I’d be happy to answer any questions that you have. Mayor Furlong: Thank you Ms. Aanenson. Any questions for staff? Mr. McDonald. Councilman McDonald: I have a question. I remember when this came to us before. Wasn’t there an issue about a storage water pond? Kate Aanenson: Yes. Councilman McDonald: At one corner. Did we get all of that resolved? Kate Aanenson: Yes and that was one of the issues that our Water Resources Coordinator has worked with the applicant on to making sure that additional stormwater can be addressed and we believe that can be executed with the site plan agreement. Councilman McDonald: Thank you. Mayor Furlong: Thank you Mr. McDonald. Any other questions? Mr. Laufenburger. Councilman Laufenburger: Thank you Mr. Mayor. Kate there are 6 buildings on the site right now, correct? And the existing CUP allows 8, correct? Kate Aanenson: Correct. Councilman Laufenburger: So he could do 2 more without any approval but what he’s asking for is approval to do those, in addition to the 2 that he already has approval on, 3 more for a total of 11, is that correct? Kate Aanenson: (Yes). Councilman Laufenburger: So the action that we take tonight, if we approve this, he can build out his, he can take use of this permit all the way to 11? Kate Aanenson: That’s correct. Councilman Laufenburger: Thank you. Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Any other questions? Ms. Aanenson, you mentioned the 61 corridor study which I know has been ongoing. Kate Aanenson: Yes. Mayor Furlong: And has been looking at land use down in this area. What’s your sense, because a conditional use permit as I understand it, or maybe this is where I start. To the extent that the conditional use is allowed within a current zoning district, really the matter before the council this evening is whether or not they meet the criteria for that approval, correct? 3 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 Kate Aanenson: Correct. Mayor Furlong: It’s a quasi-judicial type of a decision in our case for the matter before us tonight. Kate Aanenson: Well the. Mayor Furlong: If they meet the standard then. Kate Aanenson: Right. A conditional use you can just attach conditions to mitigate any impacts. You couldn’t deny the conditional use. Mayor Furlong: Right. Kate Aanenson: So I think right, our first conversation was that we wanted the standards to meet, not what was the steel buildings that were built in the past but to do a higher architectural grade and then additional landscaping. Mayor Furlong: Which is part of the conditions that we’re looking for. Kate Aanenson: Correct. Mayor Furlong: Or that the City, is being recommended to the council. Kate Aanenson: Right. Again to mitigate that and I also just wanted to point out too that we did talk about, depending on the rate that those buildings that we could provide opportunities for office industrial is what we’re looking at in the revised Comprehensive Plan that would allow him additional buildings of a higher value. Mayor Furlong: And I guess that’s my question. That while this is, this type of use is allowed with a conditional use permit in the BF zone. The existing zoning. Kate Aanenson: Correct. Mayor Furlong: It sounds like your expectation is a different zoning would be more appropriate as we go through the Comprehensive Plan amendment. Kate Aanenson: Yes. Mayor Furlong: That’s already in that process, that planning process. Kate Aanenson: Right, if it was office or industrial, which is what we have on Highway 5. We do have storage units on Highway 5 and those also are. Mayor Furlong: So this would also be a permitted use. Kate Aanenson: Correct. Mayor Furlong: Under what you think most likely will be the recommendation. 4 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 Kate Aanenson: Yeah because I think we talked about that early on when we were doing the corridor study. Whether or not we needed to do a moratorium but we felt like these, because this use would probably fit in the other category. We just wanted to apprise the property owner of the potential for higher and better uses that, and that be just very careful and considerate of how the property develops. Give himself the most opportunities. Mayor Furlong: And that would still be available, if I look at the schematics correctly, there would still be room to develop on this. Kate Aanenson: That’s correct. Mayor Furlong: On the property beyond what’s just being requested for these additional 5 buildings but 3 in addition to the current. Kate Aanenson: Correct. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Alright that sounds, thank you. Any other questions for staff? Is the applicant here? Is there anything? Good evening. Would you like to address the council this evening or anything you’d like to provide for us to consider? Bruce Lamo: Well I think Kate has done a good job of presenting exactly what I’m looking at doing. Mayor Furlong: Okay. If you could state your name and address for the record too, I’d appreciate it. Bruce Lamo: My name is Bruce Lamo. I live at downtown Minneapolis, 607 Washington Avenue South, Unit 503. Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Welcome. Bruce Lamo: Thank you. I appreciate your consideration of my proposal. I am, you know to your earlier question. I do have the, on the books permission to build 2 additional buildings. I brought the adjoining property and put the original 16 plus acres that this was built on back as one large, larger piece and my plan is to expand. I want to put a slightly different design building on so the buildings that are there, you know they’re basically metal sheds. Buildings that are going up will be a little more elaborate. They’ll have a drive through feature to them. They will be the exterior, you what you’ll see on the street will be a higher quality finished material so I won’t be building buildings like I have. They’ll actually be a little nicer building. Both I think from an outside appearance standpoint and from my customers access and use so I think it will be a better product for everybody. I have been full for about a year and a half, two years so I’ve been looking for an opportunity to expand. You know I think I service Chanhassen and Chaska. Most of my customers are fairly close to my facility so I think I’m providing a service. I get paid for it. I’m happy with that but I think I’ve got a good group of customers and I don’t want to lose them. Frankly if I don’t get to expand I think somebody else somewhere probably will take the opportunity to do so and then it’s not going to be good for me and not necessarily good for them if they can’t fill their business up either so I think this is a good proposal for all parties considered. I don’t know if, I feel like I am, this is a little more expensive proposition for me because I am having to incorporate the higher design features in it but at the same time I don’t have the municipal water supply so it’s an expensive proposition for me to put in a sprinkling system. It’s required now. I’m not arguing that I don’t have to put it in but it is an added expense that if this did have the city water that would come with an industrial zone, you know it would be a significant savings for me but I’m willing to incur that cost because I have to do it in accordance with your code which isn’t a problem but there are, it’s not as easy a business to get into when, it was when these original buildings were built. You know they’re fairly 5 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 inexpensive. Fairly simple buildings. They’re sturdy. They last a while but this will definitely be a better building all around. It will be a safer building. More attractive building and a better built building so hopefully you’ll see it that way and approve my request. I am building only 2 buildings now and if I fill those up quickly I will want to continue to build as there is demand but I don’t really know how much more demand there will be. By building where I am and building fairly close to my existing buildings, it will leave me the most flexibility to, if it gets rezoned and there are services provided. Someone else can use the land in a better way. That I can sell the land, I’d be happy to do that. If I can, if I have demand for it and I can use it, it does leave both me and potential uses you know the most flexibility. So that was, that’s been my design. That’s also what we worked out with Kate. I know the potential for roads coming through. That was incorporated into my site plan. Where the buildings are located so if any roads do come through I don’t, there won’t be any access issues. I won’t be in anyone’s way. You know there’ll still be plenty of room for my driveways. Adequate screening so it shouldn’t be a problem for anyone if and when that time comes. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Bruce Lamo: Did you have any questions for me? Mayor Furlong: Very good. I guess the first question I’ll ask is, are you comfortable or in agreement with the conditions that are being proposed by staff for the proposal here? Bruce Lamo: Yes. I’d prefer they not be but yes. No, there’s no surprises. I mean I knew when I started on this path that you would have some concerns and we’ve talked about them and I understand them and I’m comfortable with them, yes. Mayor Furlong: Okay, alright. Thank you. Any other questions? Mr. Laufenburger. Councilman Laufenburger: Mr. Lamo I appreciate your willingness to take advantage of perhaps a market opportunity that might be there for you and I realize there’s investment associated with them and I wish you good luck with that. Tell me this, is there a utility that runs through the north side of your property? Is there a utility easement there? Bruce Lamo: There’s a power line. Councilman Laufenburger: Power line. Bruce Lamo: That runs through there, yes. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay, alright. I wasn’t sure if that was affecting your property or just to the west of you. Bruce Lamo: Yeah it does cut across my property, yes. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay, alright. And I’m assuming that anything that you do you’re, we’re operating in accordance with that utility easement, is that correct? Bruce Lamo: Yes. In fact on the property before I bought it there was a garage that was put up sometime ago that was partially under that line. That was demolished prior to me taking, that was one of the conditions I put before I took ownership of the property to make sure that that non-complying building which was under the power line was removed. 6 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 Councilman Laufenburger: Okay, alright. Well very good. Thank you Mr. Lamo. Bruce Lamo: Thank you. Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Any other questions for Mr. Lamo? No? Thank you very much. Bruce Lamo: Thank you. Mayor Furlong: There was a public hearing was there not I believe I saw at the Planning Commission. Kate Aanenson: That’s correct. Mayor Furlong: And so with that, unless there’s specific, anything that’s changed specifically since the Planning Commission that the council needs to be aware of, we’ll bypass any public comment this evening unless somebody has something that’s pressing that they want to share with us. Seeing nobody, why don’t we bring it to council then for discussion and consideration of a motion. Thoughts and comments. I think it’s, just a comment as Mr. Lamo expressed, he sees a market opportunity. He’s looking to invest here in Chanhassen recognizing that the expectations have changed over the years in terms of construction and requirements but we still appreciate his looking to invest and grow his business here in Chanhassen so with that thank you for that. I think the proposal seems to make sense. It seems to be in line with the zoning requirements and conditions as well so unless there are any other thoughts or comments, I’d certainly entertain a motion at this time. Councilman Laufenburger: Mr. Mayor? Mayor Furlong: Councilman Laufenburger. Councilman Laufenburger: Mr. Mayor I move that the Chanhassen City Council approve the amendment to the conditional use permit to allow 11 storage buildings for cold storage and warehousing and approve the site plan for five 14,250 square foot one-story storage buildings subject to the conditions in the staff report and adoption of the Findings of Fact. Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Is there a second? Councilman McDonald: So moved. Councilwoman Ernst: Second. Mayor Furlong: I’ll let you guys fight that one out. I’m sorry. Motion’s been made and seconded. Any discussion on the motion? Hearing none we’ll proceed with the vote. Councilman Laufenburger moved, Councilman McDonald seconded that the Chanhassen City Council approves the amendment to the Conditional Use Permit to allow 11 storage buildings for cold storage and warehousing; and approves the Site Plan for five 14,250 square foot one-story storage buildings subject to the following conditions and adoption of the Findings of Fact: Conditional Use Permit 1. The 60 parking stalls for vehicle storage shall be confined to the area labeled Building P4. 7 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 2. The development shall comply with site plan 2014-31, plans prepared by Carlson McCain dated September 5, 2014. Site Plan Building: 1. The buildings are required to have automatic fire extinguishing systems. 2. Building plans must be prepared and signed by design professionals licensed in the State of Minnesota. 3. Retaining walls over four high must be designed by a professional engineer and a permit must be obtained prior to construction. 4. Detailed occupancy related requirements will be addressed when complete building plans are submitted. Engineering: 1. The applicant must provide adequate evidence that there is no area on the subject property suitable for infiltration. The discussion must include the practicality of altering the site layout. 2. The hydrologic modeling must be completed with accepted literature values for the soil type present or the applicant must provide evidence that the infiltration rates are equal to the 3.97 inches per hour assumed for the model. The applicant must provide water quality modeling, acceptable under Section 19-144(a)(1)c. of Chanhassen City Code, showing that the water quality treatment conditions are met for the required water quality volume from all new impervious surfaces. 3. A comprehensive, standalone SWPPP document with all elements required by Part III of the NPDES construction permit, the provided checklist and Section 19-145 of city code shall be prepared and submitted to the City for review and comment before any earth-disturbing activities, including but not limited to removal of any existing surfaces or structures, and removal of vegetation will be allowed or any grading permit will be issued. 4. The conveyance must be stabilized along the entire length and energy dissipation and erosion prevention practices must be designed and implemented to protect the infiltration basin from unnecessary sediment deposition. 5. The applicant shall include a materials list and engineers opinion of cost for all items necessary to meet the SWPPP requirements for erosion prevention and sediment control including the materials necessary for six (6) inches of topsoil and final stabilization. This amount shall be collected as escrow for erosion control. 6. The applicant shall prepare an operations and maintenance manual for the channel. 7. Assurances shall be provided for the conveyance channel consistent with the MS4 permit requirements for systems not owned and maintained by the MS4 permittee. Specifically: 8 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 a. It must allow for the city to conduct inspections, perform maintenance and assess costs when the permittee determines that the owner and/or operator of the structural stormwater BMP has not conducted maintenance. b. It must include conditions that are designed to preserve the permittee’s right to ensure maintenance responsibility...when those responsibilities are legally transferred to another party. c. It must include conditions that are designed to protect/preserve structural stormwater BMPs and site features that are implemented to comply with Part III.D.5.a(2). If site configurations or structural stormwater BMPs change, causing decreased structural stormwater BMP effectiveness, new or improved structural stormwater BMPs must be implemented to ensure the conditions for post-construction stormwater management in Part III.D.5.a(2) continue to be met 8. The applicant must procure and comply with the requirements of all other jurisdictional agencies with authority over the project area. 9. The plan shall be redrawn to 50-scale or larger, and must show the location of the benchmark used in the survey. 10. The first floor elevation and corner elevations of the nearby buildings must be labeled to confirm that the grading will allow water to flow away from all structures onsite. 11. The pond’s Emergency Overflow Elevation and location must be shown on the plans. 12. Due to the location of the open channel drainage, the developer’s engineer shall submit phased grading and erosion control plans. The plan phasing shall illustrate the erosion control that will be in place as the different buildings are constructed in Phase 1 through Phase 4. 13. The plan sheets must identify any proposed stockpile locations and the erosion control measures to contain them. 14. The aisles around the perimeter of the buildings must meet a minimum of width of 30 feet to allow 8- foot parking on one side and a 22-foot driving aisle. 15. The corners of the parking lot shall be modified to provide adequate aisle width. Environmental Resources Specialist: 1. The applicant shall provide landscape buffers to the north of buildings P2, P3 and P4 and the west of P3. The required number of trees for the vehicular use area shall be incorporated into the buffer landscaping. 2. The applicant shall submit a revised landscape plan showing the additional buffers as well as an alternate selection to blue spruce. Fire: 1. The new buildings will be required to have an approved fire sprinkler suppression system installed. Plans shall be drawn by a sprinkler design professional and submitted to Chanhassen Fire Marshal for review and approval. 9 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 2. Twelve-inch building address numbers must be installed on each end of the building. Numbers must be of contrasting color. Contact Fire Marshal for additional information. 3. “No Parking Fire Lane” signs will be required. Contact Fire Marshal for specific areas to be signed. Planning: 1. The applicant shall enter into a site plan agreement with the City and provide the necessary security to guarantee erosion control, site restoration and landscaping. 2. The applicant shall create a zoning lot and recombine the two properties as one parcel. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 5 to 0. 7015 SANDY HOOK CIRCLE: REQUEST FOR A VARIANCE TO EXCEED THE IMPERVIOUS SURFACE LIMITATION TO CONSTRUCT A DRIVEWAY; APPLICANT/ OWNER: RICK KOLBOW. Kate Aanenson: Thank you Mayor, members of the City Council. This item did appear before the st Planning Commission on their October 21 meeting. The commission voted 4 and 3 against so therefore it gets appealed to the City Council. As you mentioned the property address is 7015 Sandy Hook Circle. This area, they’re requesting a hard cover variance to allow them to expand their driveway and create a, expand their property to allow for a driveway and a garage pad. The garage pad itself meets all the requirements of the zoning district as far as setbacks. The problem that they’re having then is the 2.7 percent hard surface coverage. The staff had recommended if the Planning Commission wanted to approve it and wanted for mitigation for the variance provide a rain garden that was also shown on the site. There was a lot of back and forth regarding the discussion of the future, the applicant’s desire to future put a garage on the site and then the driveway, you’d have to widen the driveway to make the move, turn movement to get to the garage so again they wanted that additional space in the future. So we pointed out at the Planning Commission meeting too your side yard can, as a plan you can put a boat. A camper, those sort of things. Storage can go on your side yard. You don’t have to use hard surface coverage as you could with a car but as the applicant’s had indicated, when you have people getting in and out of a car all the time it’s different than a parked storage on the side of your when you have to do snow removal to get in and out of the vehicle. Again they wanted to provide that pad today to allow for future use of the garage and any structure on that if they stay within the pad limits would then meet the setback requirements so it’s the hard surface of the 2.75 that was the problem. The staff did look at several properties in the area that have a larger than a two car garage. There were several in the surrounding properties and in addition we looked at some of the lot sizes. When they project came in in 1980 the, anything over 24 lots was required to do a PUD so when it came in there was lots that were smaller in the area. The subject site is smaller in the 12,632. Smaller than the 15,000 square footage requirements, as are the two properties immediately behind and then the one adjacent are also between 10 and the 12,600 square footage so a little bit of an anomaly there. Those being the smallest lots within the neighborhood. So we looked at some of the surrounding properties. Back in the 1980’s we didn’t do the detailed surveys that we do now and we found that out when we rezoned a lot of those PUD’s that some properties did work without permits. We didn’t manage stormwater calculations as we do today. The applicants did come in and go through the correct process to do that so some of the surrounding properties are over the hard surface coverage so while this application isn’t today, the surrounding properties are over the 25 percent. Anywhere from 26 to 28 percent. The largest lot adjacent to this one, the property to the south is a little bit larger so that is under the 25 percent. So with that there was a split decision. The staff had put approval conditions, findings and denial but again the Planning Commission went back and forth regarding is it appropriate to do a rain garden? Does that make sense? Can this is something that, 10 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 too much of a variance? I think one of the things that we didn’t provide at the Planning Commission was these, we did provide the lot area but we didn’t provide whether or not they were over the hard cover and again that’s based on our calculation using aerial photography because back between 1980 and when we started doing these in probably 2000 things were sometimes done without permits or off the calculation requirements so with that we did have both findings for the recommendation and I’d be happy to answer any questions you have. Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Questions for staff. Councilwoman Ernst. Councilwoman Ernst: Kate so what are they, what’s the hard surface coverage right now? Is it under the maximum percentage? Kate Aanenson: Yes, they’re slightly under yeah because then they would be adding the hard cover of approximately 312 square feet for the garage pad and then another 360 feet for the drive approach to get to that pad. Councilwoman Ernst: And when we talk about rain gardens how much typically do rain gardens compensate? What percentage of? Kate Aanenson: The recommendation given from our Water Resources Coordinator was that the volume, it was given a volume area and designed to hold like an additional 6 inch of inundation so that could be accomplished using that but one of the concerns we talked about at the Planning Commission is often, you have the initial owner that wants to maintain it and manage it and feels ownership of those but often times if the property changes hands or sometimes they are not maintained. So there was a concern of whether or not that was an appropriate mitigation technique to apply to this case. Or valid since the other ones are immediately around there don’t have that same burden. Councilwoman Ernst: Okay. Mayor Furlong: Other questions for staff. Mr. Laufenburger. Councilman Laufenburger: Thank you. Kate, can you talk a little bit about the, I’m not sure what the technical term. If Terry Jeffery was here he’d be able to tell us but there’s a percolation capability of the soil. Is the soil in this area, does it accept water very well or does water tend to run off? Do you know? Kate Aanenson: I believe what the Water Resources Coordinator said based on the type of soils that it’s poorly drained and, well there’s some that’s poorly drained and some that’s moderately drained. Well drained so. Councilman Laufenburger: So poorly drained would mean the water would not go into the surface. It would not go into the ground. Instead it would travel across the ground, is that correct? Kate Aanenson: Correct, more clay type. Councilman Laufenburger: More clay type, okay. And where does this water go? The stuff that. Kate Aanenson: I’ll let. Councilman Laufenburger: Mr. Oehme do you know the answer to that question? Paul Oehme: Mayor, City Council members. So the runoff for this area. 11 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 Councilman Laufenburger: Runoff, that’s right. Paul Oehme: Would end up primarily in Lotus Lake in this area so the, there is storm sewer on Sandy Hook Circle heads north into Lotus Lake. There’s no stormwater treatment, very little stormwater treatment in this area currently. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay so if this soil is less accepting of water than one might assume that all the water, whether it’s hard cover water or even the normal water if it comes down in torrents it’s going to be runoff as opposed to seep into the ground, is that correct? Paul Oehme: That’s correct. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. Alright. Thank you. Kate you spoke about the hard cover surface of some of the surrounding lots and based on a question that you answered for me earlier today, I think you said that the lot immediately to the north of the subject lot has a hard surface, estimated hard surface of 26.7, is that correct? Kate Aanenson: 26.3. Councilman Laufenburger: 26.3. And then the two lots to, directly behind this property, that would be to the east, they are what percentages? Kate Aanenson: Approximately 28. Councilman Laufenburger: Both of them at 28? Kate Aanenson: Correct. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. Alright. And presently if we approve this permit 7015 would be at what percentage? Kate Aanenson: 27 point. Mayor Furlong: Seven. Kate Aanenson: Is that what it was? Yeah. Councilman Laufenburger: 27.7. Okay. Alright. So do we have on record that was a variance requested from either of those 3 lots? Either to the north or two to the east that got them to that or was that part of what you were talking about back in the 80’s when we didn’t have good calculations or good rules in place? Kate Aanenson: I believe that’s kind of what happened. People did additions or did minor alterations and for accessory structures and the like and those may not have been calculated to see what they were for the hard cover as they are today. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. Alright, thank you. And then one last question. There was some correspondence from neighbors that expressed views about this development, is that correct? Kate Aanenson: Yes. 12 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 Councilman Laufenburger: Can you just summarize that for us? Kate Aanenson: Yes, thank you for bringing that up. I apologize for not mentioning that. I know some of the neighbors were concerned about the aesthetic view. Again that’s where the discussion came in. Now this is about the garage parking pad. That they could see that but again. Councilman Laufenburger: Just to clarify, did some or one neighbor express that? Do you recall? Kate Aanenson: I know for sure one did. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. So there may have been others but you have, okay. Kate Aanenson: There may have been others but, yeah. And so again that’s where we talked about that our ordinance does allow next to your garage, and that’s the most common place that someone would store a boat. A camper or snowmobile trailer, those sort of things. Could go there. Could be a summer car that you use so that does meet the setback requirements. So the one thing that could be done, obviously the neighbor could put additional landscaping there or for the mitigation that you may want to apply and that would also provide some additional distractions. Stormwater would be to provide some additional landscaping on the property line to screen. Effectively screen that. Councilman Laufenburger: What you’re saying is that could be a condition that we put in place to approve this would be requiring some landscape on the homeowner of 7015 to eliminate that visual aesthetic problem, is that right? Kate Aanenson: That’s correct. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay. Is there enough setback between these two homes to allow that? Kate Aanenson: Yes. It’s over 10 feet. Just over 10 feet. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay, alright. Okay, thank you very much Kate. Appreciate it. That’s my questions Mr. Mayor. Mayor Furlong: We’ll start with Mr. McDonald and then Councilwoman Tjornhom. Councilman McDonald: Yes Kate, in reading through this I see that what they’re saying is one of the future plans would be to add a third stall. If we give this variance would they still have to come back to the council at that point if they decide to build a third stall and ask for a variance or? Kate Aanenson: No, because the hard cover would already be calculated if they stay on the existing pad. Paved parking area that they’re providing so they, we did look at that. It does meet all the setback requirements so that would just be a building permit. We still do a zoning check on it but to make sure it’s staying within that pad but no, they would not need to come back for a variance. Councilman McDonald: Okay. And then Mr. Oehme a question on the water. Where does the water run to? Is there a holding pond or does it go straight into the lake or what’s the path of the water? Paul Oehme: Sure. Councilman McDonald. So there is storm sewer within Sandy Hook Circle here but this neighborhood was developed in the 80’s and at that time there was no stormwater management practices. Water quality improvements required at that time so there’s very little stormwater water 13 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 quality, water quantity improvements in this neighborhood. Just last year we did resurface and reconstruct these streets in this neighborhood. We did add some stormwater improvements within the right-of-way but very little opportunity to do a full storm sewer improvement project that we would per se when a development would come in. Councilman McDonald: And in the past when we’ve had say, not necessarily significant but above normal rain events, have we had water problems in this area? Paul Oehme: I think in this area, I know Cheyenne has had some water problems. I don’t think Sandy Hook Circle that I’m aware of has had any. Dakota Circle at the western end I know has had some water problems. I know there’s been some background drainage issues in this neighborhood too but for the condition, the type of the road that’s out here and the age of the streets and the age of the neighborhood, I think it’s pretty similar to what we see in other neighborhoods within the community. Councilman McDonald: Okay, so there are curb and gutters in this neighborhood? Paul Oehme: There, bituminous curb and gutters in the majority of the neighborhood. I think Sandy Hook Circle is a little bit newer neighborhood and that does have storm, concrete curb and gutter in it. On it but the majority of this neighborhood does not. Have concrete curb and gutter. Councilman McDonald: Okay, thank you. No more questions. Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Councilwoman Tjornhom. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Yeah Kate during the Planning Commission meeting it seemed like there was some discussion whether or not the rain garden was justifiable and if it would be implemented correctly and maintained but part of their proposal was you know to mitigate with this rain garden. Have we done that before for people? I don’t recall that that, it’s kind of been like a bargaining chip to say that? Kate Aanenson: Well obviously sometimes with a variance then you may want to provide a mitigation measure to reduce the impact so I think that’s where the Planning Commission was struggling on this when you do these small of a ones. That’s why I think if we looked at the landscaping and that those trees also provide some extraction of holding, of maybe doing a swale over that way would probably be more effective. I think that’s where the Planning Commission was wrestling back and forth, trying to do something that small. Would it be maintained? Would it be effective? Councilwoman Tjornhom: And what’s your professional opinion? Kate Aanenson: I think I’ll let Paul answer that question. Paul Oehme: So I think if it’s done right it can be effective and like I think staff has indicated prior it’s the long term maintenance, upkeep of the rain water gardens that we’re struggling with I think. There’s just, you just can’t build them and walk away from. There’s ongoing maintenance. You have to clean them out and make sure the vegetation is performing like it should and there’s typically an under drain system there that has to be cleaned out regularly so those type of things you know we’re, we’re I guess we’re concerned with long term. Mayor Furlong: What’s an under grade system? Paul Oehme: Under drain. 14 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 Mayor Furlong: Under drain? Paul Oehme: Drain tile typically. For these. Mayor Furlong: So it’s not just digging out an area and planting plants? Paul Oehme: Well typically in these heavier clay soil areas you have to have some sort of under drain system to allow the water to go. To release itself. Typically you design the rain water gardens to hold water for maybe a 12 hour or 24 hour period and then it should go away just so the plants have the viability of living so it’s an engineered system so you just can’t dig a hold and help the system work so. Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Councilwoman Tjornhom, sorry for the interruption. Councilwoman Tjornhom: No, you’re not interrupting at all but I mean you do raise some good points that I know in the past years we’ve had that discussion before about rain gardens and if they’d be maintained. Who does it you know and you know what’s their future or their life expectancy so I’m sure does Terry Jeffery or does someone track that so we kind of have answers? Paul Oehme: We, you know where we’ve put these in on private properties in the past we’ve had maintenance agreements that for perpetuity of the property so, and they’re supposed to, property owners are supposed to submit or keep track at least of records of their maintenance responsibilities over the years so it’s, we only have a few of them in town right now but if we have a large volume coming in, I mean that’s the thing that we’re going to be struggling with. How to keep track of the maintenance of those things. Mayor Furlong: Mr. McDonald. Councilman McDonald: Yeah I’ve got a follow-up for that. A couple years ago you know we incorporated rain gardens as part of, up at Minnewashta and that area where we redid all the streets and stuff and we had a number of problems. We did a number of things up there. How many people actually signed up to do a rain garden up there? Paul Oehme: Well initially we had I think right around 20 and what actually got built was I think 6 or 7 of them. Councilman McDonald: And then what’s our history with those particular rain gardens? Are they still working? Are people following up? Paul Oehme: I think the ones that we built that are in Minnewashta Heights are working at this current time. I was just out there last week and they look great from a visual standpoint so I think those have been maintained and are doing fine right now. It’s just, it’s only been in the ground for now 2 years or 3 years now so we don’t really have a history there yet of how long term maintenance will perform in that area. Councilman McDonald: Well in your opinion then when we put these in, does there need to be an agreement in place with the City about maintenance and making sure that it actually does what everybody intended it to do when they put it in the ground? Paul Oehme: Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. With all the rain gardens that we have installed that are privately maintained there always has been an agreement associated with the installations. 15 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 Councilman McDonald: And then I’m not sure if it’s you or Ms. Aanenson here, is there an agreement in place with the people at this home to do a rain garden? Kate Aanenson: That would be a condition of approval. I’m just checking on that to see if that was one of our conditions of approval. If that was done. If not then it certainly should be if that’s the direction you’re going. I think part of the challenge is for, if it’s going to go over, there’s a compelling reason for water resources to say, well if we’re going to go over we should try to mitigate somehow and that’s why I was kind of looking at the other option if there’s concern about long term maintenance of this, to look at another way to provide some of that would be with the buffer and that would solve another issue with the property owners to the north and provide some extraction with some shrubs. Councilman McDonald: Okay so the better way to address this would be with a buffer between the yards? Kate Aanenson: It’s another way. I don’t want to say it’s the better way. Mayor Furlong: Can I? Kate Aanenson: Yep. Mayor Furlong: If I can ask a question. And I’m just trying to understand, and maybe backing up to the 10,000 foot level. The property has a two car garage currently, correct? Kate Aanenson: Correct. Mayor Furlong: And they want to add the triangle piece if you will that would go to a third stall when they eventually build it, but also to build not only the driveway but basically the parking area for where somebody could park a car or vehicle or trailer or whatever. Kate Aanenson: Correct. Mayor Furlong: Similar to any house with a third stall so, so that’s their request. Is the, so I guess I’m just trying to keep the request in perspective here as we talk about some things. With regard to, I’m sorry Mr. McDonald did you have some more questions or I’ve got a couple follow up ones. Councilman McDonald: Well I have a couple but go ahead. You may you know do mine and then I won’t have to do mine. Mayor Furlong: Okay. The questions I had, and maybe this following up a little bit on Mr. Laufenburger’s questions about the other properties nearby. Those properties have, are above the 25 percent ordinance level of impervious surface coverage. I think you mentioned 26.3 and a couple of 28 percent out there, correct? Kate Aanenson: That’s correct. Mayor Furlong: Are those properties, parcels are they also, are they at the standard 15,000 square foot level or are they. Kate Aanenson: They’re also smaller. Mayor Furlong: They’re also smaller similar to this property. 16 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 Kate Aanenson: Correct. Mayor Furlong: The development here I heard was built in the 1980’s. When did our stormwater management practices come into play where we established the 25 percent, do you recall? Kate Aanenson: Late 1995, 96, 97, something like that. Todd Gerhardt: Mid to late 90’s. Mayor Furlong: Mid to late 90’s? Kate Aanenson: Yeah. Mayor Furlong: Okay. And the 25 percent was established based upon the standard, well it’s a percent of whatever the lot is but we have the standard lot size of 15,000 square feet is our standard now. Kate Aanenson: Correct. Mayor Furlong: You’re saying the way this development occurred, because it was a PUD and because of the ordinance and the requirements of that time, some lots were larger. Some were smaller. Kate Aanenson: That’s correct. Mayor Furlong: But this one happens to be smaller, as are the neighboring properties. We don’t know when the neighboring properties necessarily, or maybe we do. I mean they could have expanded beyond that at any point in time from when their house was first built until whenever. Kate Aanenson: Could have added a porch on. Could have widen the driveway. We don’t know. Mayor Furlong: Yep, exactly. Okay, alright. But we do know that none of them put in any rain gardens when they did that I’m assuming anyway. We don’t know that they did. Kate Aanenson: Right. And maybe they got permitted. I’m not saying somebody did something without getting a permit but we didn’t check that level of detail. Mayor Furlong: Yeah, okay. And I’m just trying to get, understanding get back to the basics of what the request is here and what the, because our standard I think, as far as the considerations that we look at and just looking at the proposed Findings of Fact there are questions about whether or not this is in harmony of the general purposes of the development code which in this case would be single family residential, and by in harmony I mean the request right? The request to put in a driveway for a third stall and what would eventually be the third stall and whether or not they put, build even the roof and the walls over it right now or later on. Are there other 3 car, homes with 3 car garages in the neighborhood? Kate Aanenson: Yes. Mayor Furlong: Okay. And I assume they have a similar type driveway that you need for a 3 car garage. Kate Aanenson: Yes. 17 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 Mayor Furlong: At that point so, okay. I may ask for comments but I think I’m understanding what I need to understand. Thank you. Councilwoman Tjornhom: And, if I could just ask one. Mayor Furlong: Councilwoman Tjornhom. Councilwoman Tjornhom: One just to clarify one more thing. What is the actual percentage that they are needing? Kate Aanenson: 27 point. Todd Gerhardt: 2.7. Councilwoman Tjornhom: 2.7. Kate Aanenson: Sorry, additional for a total of 27.7. Mayor Furlong: And Councilwoman Tjornhom your question had something that I was going to ask if I could. While they’re going to 27.7 percent, that’s based upon their lot size of 12,600 square feet. Kate Aanenson: That’s correct. Mayor Furlong: If this was a standard lot size of 15,000 they would be under the 25 percent and we wouldn’t be talking about it correct. Kate Aanenson: Yes. Yes. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Alright. Because I think it works out too if I’m doing my math correct, which is always dangerous, the 27.7 works out to about, a square footage of about 3,500 of impervious coverage that they would be allowed which is 23 percent of a 15,000 square foot. 23 plus or minus percent so that was the other question and thank you for asking that because it’s, if it was a standard lot we wouldn’t be here talking about this. Thank you. Other questions for staff? Councilman Laufenburger: One but I want to give Mr. McDonald an opportunity if his question is not asked. Councilman McDonald: I think I’m all done. I’ll have further questions when we discuss the motion. Mayor Furlong: That’s right. At this time. You’ve got to remember at this time. Councilman McDonald: At this time, that’s right. Mayor Furlong: Yes, Mr. Laufenburger, did you have a question? Councilman Laufenburger: I do. Mr. Oehme, when you talk about a rain garden I’m picturing an area, I don’t know let’s just say it’s 10 feet by 15 feet. That would be 150 square feet right? I’m picturing a 10 foot by 15 foot area that has vegetation in it and it also has kind of a cup so it would accumulate water correct? Paul Oehme: A depression correct, yep. 18 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 Councilman Laufenburger: A depression, okay. That’s a better word than cup. So the depression accumulates the water and the idea of a rain garden is that the water would settle over like a 12 hour period of time, is that correct? Paul Oehme: Correct. Councilman Laufenburger: That’s in a good situation. Then you also put a drain tile at the bottom that would dissipate in addition to the percolation of the water it would dissipate to some other area like a storm sewer correct? Paul Oehme: Yeah in certain situations you need that tile. If you have very sandy soils then you just get that infiltration and it goes away. Councilman Laufenburger: It goes away. Paul Oehme: Right. Councilman Laufenburger: These are not sandy soils. Paul Oehme: These are not sandy soils. Councilman Laufenburger: So do you think this rain garden if water’s sitting in clay soil for 12 hours, is it going to dissipate or is it going to stay there? What, your professional opinion. Paul Oehme: Well again so for rain gardens they are engineered so in clay, tighter soils typically you would have to make the depression. You would have to replace some of the soils with more sandy soils. You put the drain tile around it for water to go someplace and. Councilman Laufenburger: The water would then go to. Paul Oehme: Go to the tile so it has some ability, the water would still have some ability to sit there and infiltrate into the soils but under those larger storm events it still has someplace for it to discharge. Councilman Laufenburger: And it would go through the drain tile which would take it to? Paul Oehme: To I think there’s storm sewer that’s under. Councilman Laufenburger: And it would then go to. Paul Oehme: Into Sandy Hook Circle and into the storm sewer system. Councilman Laufenburger: And then go to. Paul Oehme: The lake. Councilman Laufenburger: Exactly. Paul Oehme: Lotus Lake. Councilman Laufenburger: Okay, so the water’s eventually going to go to Lotus Lake. 19 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 Paul Oehme: Right. Councilman Laufenburger: Here’s my, oh excuse me. That was my last question. Thank you Mr. Mayor. Todd Gerhardt: Mayor? Mayor Furlong: Yes. Todd Gerhardt: Paul for a rain garden to fail the drainage system would have to be silted in and then there would be basically no outlet and then you would have a pond in your front yard. Paul Oehme: Potentially. Todd Gerhardt: So my guess a homeowner doesn’t want a pond in his front yard so he’s going to try to figure out how to fix it. Right? Paul Oehme: Right. Councilman Laufenburger: Unless he wants mosquitoes in his front yard. Todd Gerhardt: Right so. Paul Oehme: Or if it fills in too it’s just not holding the capacity that it was originally designed for. Todd Gerhardt: Right. It’s going to fill up and then go over and sheet drain to the lowest point. Paul Oehme: Potentially. Todd Gerhardt: In the area. So we know when they’re not working so that’s a good thing so then we can get out there and fix them. We have them at Lake Ann off of Laredo and then we put in a couple up off of Hummingbird so. Councilman Laufenburger: Oh yeah. Paul Oehme: We just put one in in last year’s street project too. Todd Gerhardt: Yeah. Mayor Furlong: But they take effort. They take maintenance. They take monitoring. They take, from what I’m hearing engineering design, construction costs and it’s not as simple a putting a depression in your front yard. Todd Gerhardt: No. Mayor Furlong: Let me try to move on here. Is the applicant here? Is it Mr. Kolbow, is that how you pronounce your name. Is he here? Is there anything you’d like to address the council or any comments you’d like to make? Rick Kolbow: I just have, Terry Jeffery sent. 20 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 Mayor Furlong: If you don’t mind coming up to the podium here and stating your name and address for the record, for those at home. And for our recorder. Thank you, good evening. Rick Kolbow: I’m Rick Kolbow, 7015 Sandy Hook Circle. Mayor Furlong: Welcome. Rick Kolbow: Terry had sent this, I know there were some questions regarding that. I sent it over but I think it didn’t get transferred in the email. I saw that it was, his email came through but it did not show the photo. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Rick Kolbow: So he came up with 119 square feet. That would be the area that would compensate for the 341 square feet which is what I was looking for which is the, you know the 2.7 percent I guess. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Rick Kolbow: So I don’t know if you guys wanted to look at that. Okay. So other than that, you know we’re just trying to improve our property. You know we’re doing some construction now. Originally we thought that while we’re doing that I could make a third parking area with the hope of in the future putting a third stall garage there. That was our intent. We’ve got teenage daughters. We’ve got 4 cars. We’re switching around. It’s a real hassle. I kind of wrote an addendum with some of the things. Just talking about you know we, we I think originally I thought maybe we could put down some gravel but I didn’t realize the city code required bituminous or concrete or some sort of so we would agree to that. And the other was you know we agreed to compensate for the 341 square feet with a rain garden and went through Terry to try and figure out the design and the size and it’s everything that you guys described. It’s kind of a bowl. You’ve got an under drain system. You dig it down. You fill it with you know real pervious gravel or soil at the bottom and so, and it’s from our standpoint it’s not something we wouldn’t not want to maintain. I mean we spent a lot of money on our home and our lawn and, not to mention this parking area. The last thing I want to have is this kind of a pool of water sitting down there. And in fact we had even talked about putting a, kind of a rain garden of sorts in that area anyway so this all fit. It’s like oh, well this is already something we were going to do just to kind of pretty up that area. And it’s not a big area. 119 square feet. You know it’s like 10 by 11 or whatever. 10 by whatever the math is but, but that’s what he was saying would compensate if we had to build a little bit bigger than we’d have to do that and it may even actually be bigger because aesthetically it might look a little better maybe if we have a triangle type shaped thing or something but some of the other issues, you know the, we have to deal with is you know we have multiple cars. We have guests coming over. We have things so we’ve got winter and we’ve got a plowing issue. In fact this morning one of our contractors pulled up. Couldn’t pull in our driveway because we had 2 cars in the drive. 2 in our garage and he parked out in the street so then he plowed around and then, so then there’s a big bank sitting there half the day and from our standpoint we don’t like that. I mean we’re trying to make our neighbors happy as well as make the safe environment. There were some letters, I know the neighbors or 3 neighbors that wrote letters of recommendation and then there’s one neighbor that is opposed to it. The neighbors that wrote recommendations are across the street, next door to the south, and kitty corner across the street. The other neighbor is right here and he’s to the north so we’ve had discussions about arborvitaes. Some kind of blocking. You know tall bush or something like that which we’d be willing to do. The other thing is that I’d like to point out is, you know we have 300. We’re over by 341 square feet. To meet the 25 percent we still have like right now 330 square feet or roughly so our intention was to maybe do something with that. Right now I have a boat and I can park a boat and a trailer according to your code on an unimproved 21 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 surface. That has a big cover on it. That water runs off the cover. I mean essentially is acting like a you know hard surface. You know the water’s going to run off in the same place the water would run off the pad. I’m trying to improve the area where I put that boat and have the ability to put a car there. So you know all I’m asking for is a little bit more distance along the side of our garage rather than going about a quarter or half the way along the side of our garage, I can go the extra 15 feet and then I you know have more because otherwise I’ll end up parking a car there and then I’ll put the boat back there. The surface is still being in the same use and the same runoff so if I get the extra 15 feet now I’m putting in a rain garden. I’ve got bushes. I’ve got you know, and I have the ability then if at a later date to build a garage that can be a deeper garage versus a 15 foot deep garage and it meets the setbacks. I think I was looking at, you know we’re 48 feet away from that other home so even if I add 12 feet I’m still at 36 feet away from that other home. Mayor Furlong: I’m sorry, which home is that? The home to the north? Rick Kolbow: The home to the north. Mayor Furlong: Currently you’re how far? Rick Kolbow: 48 feet. So there’s a big distance there so if we go you know 12 feet out with a pad, or a garage, I’m still 36 feet and from the property line I’m 13. Mayor Furlong: 13. With the pad in place you’re still 13 feet. Rick Kolbow: Right. Mayor Furlong: From the property line. Rick Kolbow: From the property line and then the other distance is the other homeowner’s distance. Mayor Furlong: Alright. And what’s the setback Ms. Aanenson? Kate Aanenson: 10 feet. Mayor Furlong: 10 feet. Rick Kolbow: So I’m within that by 3 feet. So some of the other homes, in fact that home is tighter on the other, they have a third stall and they’re 27 feet so I’m actually you know I’m going to be 36 feet. They’re actually tighter on the other side so there’s a lot of homes that are, this wouldn’t, you know our home wouldn’t stand out because it’s right next to another home. But one of, you know from an aesthetics standpoint that’s important but there’s the other thing is you know with parking and rotating the cars on the street, I wrote this addendum because we have a lot of little kids in that neighborhood. Our neighborhood has turned over and there’s literally 10 kids probably, or what I wrote down. Is it 15 or 10? 15 kids. There’s 15 kids under 10 years old and with the cars in the street, we’re in a circle so we don’t get a ton of traffic but I just don’t like the idea of the cars out there. I don’t like the kids kind of popping out from the edge of the car and somebody’s driving by so I’m trying to do, get our cars off. Get our you know things off the street and make it aesthetically pleasing. Mayor Furlong: Okay. Great, thank you. Rick Kolbow: That’s all I really have. 22 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 Mayor Furlong: Anybody have any questions for Mr. Kolbow? Mr. McDonald. Councilman McDonald: I’ve got a couple for you. Where would the rain garden go? Between you and your neighbor to the north or would it go on another part of the property? Where were you planning on putting it? Rick Kolbow: It’d go to the north and it would be toward the street so it intersect any water running off that area. We have a swale that we’ve, through this construction I’m doing now where I created a swale. Well there was actually one there before and we’ve just made it better so it, it comes around so that water, any water would run off that pad and it would be, actually there’s a mound between us and the neighbor too so it’d stay on our property and it would run towards the street and that’s where the rain garden would be. So I even thought I’d make, I’d put some rocks to kind of break up that water if it’s flowing fast and then maybe it would hit the rain garden. I’m trying to aesthetically pleasing as well as make it functional. Councilman McDonald: Okay. Mr. Jeffery ha explained to you what you know rain gardens really are and it’s more than just planting stuff in a swale. You’ve got to be able to take care of it. You understand all of that? Rick Kolbow: Right. Councilman McDonald: And you’re willing to go ahead and do that as far as the maintenance and make sure that we don’t end up with a failed rain garden. And then the other problem that you know came up that I’d just like to know how you would want to address that is evidently the view from your neighbor looking at this, you know that’s something that they’re very concerned about. Rick Kolbow: Right. Councilman McDonald: A rain garden isn’t necessarily going to take care of that because if you’re pushing that more toward the front, what would be your plans as far as that side yard? Rick Kolbow: Well we talked about some tall bushes. Some arborvitaes. Something of that sort and that would be on, near the property line. I would work with our neighbor and decide you know where’s a good area to put these. They don’t have any windows on that side of the house. It’s the view from the driveway or their front steps or walkway. Councilman McDonald: Okay. Rick Kolbow: That’s, there’s a big pine tree on one side so it’s just that view. So that would be the line. There would be probably a, it’s really a span from me to the wall or less that would probably plant some arborvitaes or whatever we come up with that’s agreeable. Councilman McDonald: Okay. Mayor Furlong: We don’t, if I could interrupt real quick. We don’t have our monitors working but there were pictures I think in the electronic packet. It’s on page 242 of those pictures. Rick Kolbow: The view from one side and view from another. Mayor Furlong: Right, a view from one side and then view to the other. Rick Kolbow: You know if there was a. 23 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 Mayor Furlong: And I guess for clarification, you’re saying there’s about 48 feet between the two homes currently. Rick Kolbow: Correct. Mayor Furlong: And so you’re about 25 feet from your property line. I’m just doing again dangerous math out loud but 12 feet for a pad and then you’d still have 13. Rick Kolbow: Yeah, about 12 feet and, well. Yeah, something like that. Mayor Furlong: So I’m guessing there’s about 23 feet from the property line then to your house. Correct? Rick Kolbow: Probably yeah. Yeah, that’s right. 13 and 12 so, right. Mayor Furlong: So there’s quite a bit of difference on both side yards there. Rick Kolbow: Right. Mayor Furlong: Quite a bit of distance I should say, not difference. Distance so okay. Any other questions of Mr. Kolbow? No, thank you very much. Rick Kolbow: I just had one thing. I own a water treatment environmental company so it’s not something that goes lightly for me to have untreated water. I’m treating water all over the country and it’s contaminated with gasoline. It’s contaminated with chlorinates, all this, we filter it. We absorb it. I mean we have big scale stuff so I’m not you know new to the drain tile. The, you know exactly what Terry sent over. I just didn’t know the size but we’re really familiar with what’s going on and it’s not something that I would kind of skimp on in my own home so. Mayor Furlong: Okay, that’s good to know, thank you. Alright with that maybe we should, questions for, I guess we had questions for staff and council. If there’s any comments that councilors would like to make. Bring it back to the council for comments. There was nobody appeared at the Planning Commission public hearing based upon the Minutes I looked at. There were some letters and correspondence from, that are included in our packet from neighbors so the council has taken a look at those so thoughts and comments from the council standpoint? Mr. Laufenburger. Councilman Laufenburger: Thank you Mr. Mayor. First of all I think that the considering the size of the lot and the 341 square feet that Mr. Kolbow is asking for to bring it to a 27.7 I think the fact that he is now here going through this, and I’ll use the word laborious process and he’s being very patient with us, I think he should be able to expand to a 27.7 percent hard cover. And the other thing that I, I’m really attentive to and that is the types of soils that are here. While I appreciate that Mr. Kolbow is willing to do a rain garden, Ms. Aanenson has already said that a rain garden isn’t necessarily the only way to mitigate this. That some landscaping could do some of that mitigation but I think the fact that the soils are so clay laden, I don’t think that a rain garden would, I think a rain garden would likely be more problems for the City and even for Mr. Kolbow than it’s worth so I would be in favor of approving this variance at 27.7 percent and I would not require a rain garden. If Mr. Kolbow decides that that’s the landscaping that he would like to do, I think that’s great but I would not want to put a burden on the City to have to go out and check on Mr. Kolbow’s rain garden every year. That’s, I’m going to use this term. I think that’s more red tape than we need our city to be responsible for so that’s my view on this. And I like the fact that he would work with his neighbor to figure out what kind of landscaping would be in order in order to 24 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 provide a visually pleasing situation. And by the way, any neighbor can put a tree anywhere they want on their property I believe, is that true Ms. Aanenson? Kate Aanenson: Yes. Councilman Laufenburger: Except well if they put it in the right-of-way they’re putting it at risk of potentially. Kate Aanenson: Correct. Councilman Laufenburger: Oh yeah so. Kate Aanenson: Or an active easement. We check on that. That’s like 5 feet on the perimeter. Councilman Laufenburger: Is there an active easement on this? Kate Aanenson: I’m not sure but you still have enough room on the other side of the easement, yeah. Councilman Laufenburger: So I think we can let the neighbors work it out on what visually would be appealing. That’s my view. Mayor Furlong: Other thoughts and comments? Councilwoman Tjornhom. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Yeah I think I’m kind of on the same page as Councilmember Laufenburger. I think the problem isn’t what’s being proposed. I think the problem is the lot size and so I think it’s more than reasonable for him to be able to add an additional parking spot. His comments regarding safety in the street and not parking in the street were very accurate and thoughtful and so I am going to be supporting him being able to get this variance. Mayor Furlong: Okay, thanks. Councilwoman Ernst. Councilwoman Ernst: Yes, I agree as well. I would support the 27.7 percent variance for the hard surface coverage and you know I really like it when we can, the City can work with our residents to try and come up with a positive solution that is a win/win situation and obviously the applicant has really come up with some ways to really compensate for the hard surface and I really like when a resident will come in and present with ideas as to how you can collaborate on such an issue and so I really appreciate you coming in and I have great confidence in the fact that you know you’ll work with your neighbors. Obviously you’ve agreed to plant trees or whatever for the landscaping and in terms of the rain garden, it sounds like you really want to do that anyway so I would encourage you to do that if that’s what you want to do but definitely I agree with Councilman Laufenburger. I don’t think the City would have to check up on to make sure that the rain garden is being maintained so. Mayor Furlong: Thank you. Mr. McDonald, thoughts. Comments. Councilman McDonald: Well one of the things I looked at in this is a couple years ago we’ve had some th people down in West 96 Street come in and it was the same problem there was use of their property and they rain into the hard surface and a few other things but you looked at the nature of, or at least I looked at the nature of the neighborhood. What they wanted to do fit in with the neighborhood. It was not something that was different or was actually going to draw any kind of a I think a bad connotation down there. So you know based upon that I’d be in favor of it. I asked a lot of questions about the rain garden too because I don’t think the City ought to be checking in on this. We’ve got enough to do. I applaud 25 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 you if you want to do it. If you understand how they work and all like that but if you move in 3 or 4 years, what do we do about the person who buys your house? I just don’t think the City needs to get into that. You understand what the problems are. You seem to be addressing them as far as the landscaping and there’s other issues to look at so I would applaud you for that. I mean I’d be in favor of it too because again I think you’re doing nothing that’s out of the ordinary within your neighborhood. There’s quite a few homes there with 3 car garages so it’s not as though you’re asking for something any different and as the Mayor says, if it wasn’t for the lot size we probably wouldn’t even be having a conversation so I’d be in favor of doing it and as Mr. Laufenburger stated, I think I’d also be in favor of not having anything in there about a rain garden requirement. Mayor Furlong: So no conditions on. Councilman McDonald: As far as a rain garden. Mayor Furlong: Really no conditions. Just approval without conditions. Yeah and that’s exactly where I am too and I appreciate the comments from the council members. Again the request here, while it is, exceeds the standard 25 percent for hard surface coverage, the issue is practically, the practical issue is the lot size relative to the current lot size. The current standards with, upon which that 25 percent is based. Practically we’re looking at putting in the equivalent area that would be a third stall. Not initially but eventually perhaps at the property owner’s desire and then the driveway to access that. Very typical. Very, as Mr. McDonald said, certainly in keeping with other homes in the neighborhood from the standard of Findings of Fact certainly in harmony with other homes in the neighborhood. The lot size obviously is an issue. When we just had 3 examples of the property I think it was to the north and two to the east that were of similar size that were also over the hard surface coverage by about a similar amount so you know to grant the variance I think makes sense for all those reasons. I agree, putting additional conditions upon him for a rain garden to me is over kill and the landscaping issues, if the neighbors, you know they both have it sounds like pretty wide side yards. Much wider than what we see in some of our current developments. There’s plenty of room on either property I think for trees or bushes or whatever people want to plant. To plant if they want to do that. It looks like there’s already some big pine trees and some other trees in between there and people are free to plant bushes or trees or anything they want on their property. You know so I think there again there’s no reason to add any conditions at that point so I think from my standpoint it sounds like the rest of the council concurs, certainly approval of the variance request without conditions would be my position so, with that unless there are additional comments would somebody like to make a motion? Councilman Laufenburger: Mr. Mayor? Mayor Furlong: Mr. Laufenburger. Councilman Laufenburger: Mr. Mayor I move that the Chan, excuse me one moment. Mayor Furlong: Chanhassen. Councilman Laufenburger: I move the Chanhassen City Council approves the request for a hard surface coverage variance and use of gravel and adopts the attached Findings of Fact and Decision without a condition for a rain garden. Mayor Furlong: Or landscaping. Councilman Laufenburger: Or landscaping. 26 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 Mayor Furlong: Correct. And just for point of clarification, are the conditions for approval, those are the facts. Kate Aanenson: Yeah, there are Findings of Fact for approval in your packet. Mayor Furlong: For approval. Kate Aanenson: Yes. Mayor Furlong: And those would be the adoption of those Facts. Councilman Laufenburger: Yes. Mayor Furlong: Thank you for clarifying that. Is there a second? Councilwoman Tjornhom: Second. Councilman McDonald: Second. Mayor Furlong: I’ve got lots of seconds tonight. I’m glad everybody’s engaged. Do you want to give that one to Councilwoman Tjornhom? Alright, thank you Mr. McDonald. Councilwoman Tjornhom seconds that motion. Is there any discussion of the motion? Hearing none we’ll proceed with the vote. Councilman Laufenburger moved, Councilwoman Tjornhom seconded that the Chanhassen City Council approves the request for a 2.7 percent hard surface coverage variance and use of gravel and adopts the attached Findings of Fact and Decision with no condition for a rain garden or landscaping. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 5 to 0. COUNCIL PRESENTATIONS. Mayor Furlong: I’ll start by congratulating Mayor elect Denny Laufenburger and in the audience tonight are two council members elect, Elise Ryan and Dan Campion are here so congratulations to all three of them for their success in last week’s election. Look forward to their service on the council in the coming 4 years. And also a thanks I’d like to extend earlier tonight the Council sat as the canvassing board which is the official adoption of the results of the election and Karen Engelhardt who is, leads our election process here in the city of Chanhassen, was there presenting the results. She does a fantastic job. Has been doing it year in and year out and I know Mr. Gerhardt maybe you could expand a little bit on the time but I’d like to thank her. All the election judges. Everybody that was involved with the election. It was a very, very smooth process. Mr. Gerhardt, your thoughts. Todd Gerhardt: Very smooth process. You know the judges, we have I think most if not all of the judges start like at 5:30 in the morning and they go until, until the polls close and if they don’t have any problems they can go home but some have to stay there until midnight if they had a jammed ballot so it’s just some of the little things but it’s unbelievable the detail that you get into and the rules and regulations that are involved with the election process and to Karen and Kim and the rest of the judges, thank them for giving of their time and making sure we have an open and honest process so great job. Mayor Furlong: Great, thank you. Any other comments with council presentations? If not, Mr. Gerhardt. 27 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 ADMINISTRATIVE PRESENTATIONS. Todd Gerhardt: Well get a little update from Paul on Lyman. I never did hear the last word if they got the final lift down and everything’s going to be open with the snow. Looks like bad news. Mayor Furlong: Mr. Oehme. Paul Oehme: Yeah so they did pave I think Friday and into Saturday and I don’t think they’ve got, I know they didn’t get the second to the last wear course of pavement done so kind of struggling right now with what to do there. I think if we open it up we need to figure out some drainage solutions there but that’s the goal for this week is we’re meeting with the contractor tomorrow. We’re actually, there’s a meeting tomorrow with the contractor to discuss that so we’re going to try to do our best to try to get it open yet this year. Todd Gerhardt: Okay. Paul Oehme: The big thing too is striping too. It’s not striped. If we can open it up so we need to figure what we can do there. Under the cold conditions it’s really difficult to put the striping down. Todd Gerhardt: And our reconstruction project in Minnewashta? Paul Oehme: That one’s, yep. That one’s pretty much done. We’ve got some punch list items to do. We’ve got most of the siding done. Driveways are in so we do have some restoration work to do next year unless it does thaw out but we’re definitely going to have to do some restoration next year to wrap up that project but everything, all the streets and all the utilities are in. Todd Gerhardt: Okay. And then Laurie’s last day, the Assistant City Manager was last Wednesday and we had a sad going away party for her and, but we have opened up the process. We had 103 applicants for the position and we narrowed it down to 17 for a phone interview and we’ll be sitting down and interviewing 8 out of the 17 this week and hope to get it down to 2 to 3 candidates for final interviews from there so, good candidates. I don’t know that one of them stood out above the other but we’ll see how the next step in the process goes. Mayor Furlong: Okay, very good. Thank you. Todd Gerhardt: That’s all I have. Mayor Furlong: Any questions for Mr. Gerhardt or his staff? CORRESPONDENCE DISCUSSION. Mayor Furlong: Any discussion on the correspondence packet? No? Councilman Laufenburger: Just one Mr. Mayor. The, Dale Rusch who does the blueberry. Blueberry. Bluebird houses. This is a man who is so committed to the health of bluebirds in Chanhassen. It’s just a, it’s a pleasure to see him work so hard with all of these bluebirds and I think it’s an indication of kind of the health of the city and when we have 43 fledglings of bluebirds that’s a good thing so I just wanted to recognize Dale Rusch. Nice job Dale. 28 Chanhassen City Council – November 10, 2014 Mayor Furlong: Good. Thank you. And before we leave tomorrow is Veteran’s Day so to all our veterans, thank you very much for your service and please thank a veteran tomorrow during Veteran’s Day. If there’s nothing else to come before the council this evening, is there a motion to adjourn? Councilwoman Ernst moved, Councilman McDonald seconded to adjourn the meeting. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 5 to 0. The City Council meeting was adjourned at 8:20 p.m. Submitted by Todd Gerhardt City Manager Prepared by Nann Opheim 29