Loading...
1 Approval of MinutesCHANHASSEN PARK AND RECREATION COMMISSION REGULAR MEETING NOVEMBER 27, 2001 Chairwoman Lash called the meeting to order at 7:30 p.m. MEMBERS PRESENT: Jan Lash, Rod Franks, Mike Howe, Dave Moes, Tom Kelly, Jack Spizale, and Jay Karlovich MEMBERS ABSENT: None. STAFF PRESENT: Todd Hoffman, Park and Rec Director; Jerry Ruegemer, Recreation Superintendent PUBLIC ANNOUNCEMENTS: None. VISITOR PRESENTATIONS: None. ESTABLISH 2002 PICNIC RESERVATION FEES. Ruegemer: We have, like you said, on an annual basis the Park and Recreation Commission does review the picnic fees. I typically like to bring those up in November-December. I have booked picnics already for next year with graduations and a wedding already, so I'd like to get those established as soon as we can here just to make sure that we get the appropriate fees assessed to the picnic people for next year. Again, this year we did have 90 total reservations with a total revenue of just a little bit over $8,000. That was down a little bit from last year's totals, both in number of reservations and revenues. So again I'm going to come here again tonight and say that I think we should hold pat with our picnic fees and I don't want to see a declining factor I guess because of the fees increase so that's my recommendation tonight. That we approve the fees as they were in 2001 for the picnic schedule season for 2002. Lash: Do you have any idea why we would be down? Ruegemer: Not that you can certainly pin point. I mean there certainly is, you know with layoffs and tight money, I know people are starting to kind of cut back on company functions. Hoffman: It wasn't anything dramatic. Ruegemer: Nothing dramatic no, but. Hoffman: Just seasonal flux. Ruegemer: Yeah. Lash: Okay. But we didn't have any kind of bad feedback or anything like that about any particular thing? Franks: Well fees have always been the major complaint. Park and Rec Commission - November 27, 2001 Ruegemer: Excuse me? Franks: Fees have always been the complaint. Karlovich: And you strongly feel they're as high as they can go right now? Ruegemer: Right. Yeah we are significantly higher for non-resident businesses. Much higher than Hennepin Parks and other. Karlovich: How much do we get for the wedding? Can we charge more for the wedding? I'm just kidding. Hoffman: For the level of amenities that we offer, these fees are very adequate. Lash: Okay. Any other questions or comments? Is there a motion? Franks: I'd move that the Park and Recreation Commission approve the fees, park fees for 2002 which are consistent and the same as the 2001 picnic fees. Lash: Is there a second to that? Spizale: I'll second that. Franks moved, Spizale seconded that the Park and Recreation Commission approve the picnic fees for 2002 to be consistent with the 2001 picnic fees. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously 7 to 0. APPROVAL OF MINUTES: Lash: Okay, and I forgot to call for a motion on the minutes. Sorry. Can somebody make a motion to approve the minutes? Karlovich: I'll make a motion to approve the minutes. Lash: Is there a second? Moes: I second. Karlovich moved, Moes seconded to approve the Minutes of the Park and Recreation Commission meeting dated October 23, 2001 amended to change Frank Spizale to Jack Spizale. ROUNDHOUSE RENOVATION PROJECT UPDATE. Hoffman: Thank you Chair Lash, members of the commission. What you have in your packet is the information which was distributed by Deanna Bunkelman to the City Council at a recent City Council meeting. And action taken as a result of that conversation that evening included council's continuing interest in moving forward with the renovation by the committee, but they do want to see that a joint powers agreement be formulated between the City and the Committee to specify responsibilities of the Park and Rec Commission - November 27, 2001 City and responsibilities of that neighborhood group. And one of the primary points of that agreement will be that the $25,000 in city money is not the first money invested. That some number will be set, say $10,000 that would need to be raised by the community in cash or in kind services and be invested in the project prior to the City's $25,000 being kicked in to assist with the project. Lash: That's a condition of the City Council? Hoffman: Yes. Karlovich: And they're saying $10,0007 Hoffman: That would be, it's going to take more than $35,000 to finish the project and so the community gets the 10 in there right upfront and we get the city money involved, they're still going to have to raise more money or in kind services to finish it off. Lash: So it could be donations of materials, labor or cash? Hoffman: The way I'm addressing it. Lash: That would be full $10,000. Hoffman: ! can't say if that's going to satisfy the council but that's the way I'm approaching the joint powers. Karlovich: And I don't know, just as a general observation. To raise $10,000, that would be quite a feat for this group and is the city at least contemplating chipping in additional funds beyond the 25? It just seems like. Hoffman: The City Council is not anticipating chipping in more money than that. Karlovich: How much do you think there needs to be to make it a go or make it happen? Hoffman: Well if you recall the bid which was rejected was over $100,000 and so the neighborhood thinks they can accomplish it at a lower cost than that. But if it is at $50,000 in cash and in kind or $60,000, I can't tell you because I'm not sure what their thoughts are. They're keeping the same plan that was developed. The architectural plans and they're actually looking at going beyond that because they would like to put restroom facilities inside the building. Karlovich: That's just going to be how much extra? Franks: How much money can go into a project before it needs a competitive bid? Lash: Didn't you say 50? Hoffman: For $50,000 now, yeah. Franks: 50,000 now. Is that per year or for the entirety of project? Park and Rec Cormnission - November 27, 2001 Hoffman: That'd be the entirety of the project and I don't believe that will include in kind contributions so I don't think we're going to hit that. Then once this joint powers is discussed and drafted by our city attorney's office, that would be presented to the City Council probably at their December meeting for additional conversation and then hopefully approval by the City Council. Lash: So for their $i0,000, can that just be commitments or. So say someone is saying I'm willing to do the plumbing for free when it comes time to do the restrooms. But that's not going to come until way down the plan. Can they count that money or does it have to be something that's upfront? Hoffman: I don't know. I don't know. I'll talk with Tom about that on Friday. How we want to present that to the City Council. The City Council is somewhat apprehensive about the project so they're going to want some pretty concrete guarantees from this committee that they're going to come forward. What the City Council does not want to see happen is that the city invests the $25,000 and the project fails flat on it's face and we're left holding the bag on the project so, and I think we can understand that from the City Council's perspective so. Lash: Tom who? Hoffman: Excuse me? Lash: You said Tom. Hoffman: Oh, Tom Scott from the City Attorney's office. And Deanna Bunkelman and I will meet on Friday. And Tom has done these before for similar projects. He's confident he can write it and make it reasonable and that it will make sense to both sides. And this will help the committee as well because they need to know in black and white paper what the City's role is going to be prior to making commitments and going out and selling the project. Lash: Okay. Anybody else have anything? That particular night for the City Council meeting, Michael and I came but we got there just as they finished so we didn't get to hear anything but we did have a chance to talk with Mrs. Carlson and Mr. Kling out in the chambers for a little bit and they gave us a copy of this so. They said that they thought it went well and that they were given the extension based on some certain conditions that they thought they could meet so they were feeling good about it. REPORTS: RECREATION PROGRAMS. 2001 TREE LIGHTING CEREMONY AND 2001 HALLOWEEN PARTY EVALUATION. Lash: Under reports we have rec programs, and that's Corey's things. Like the tree lighting and the Halloween party. Jerry, are you representing Corey or are we just supposed to do it on our own or what? Ruegemer: I am representing Corey. Just give you a little update on the tree lighting ceremony. That is coming up again this coming Saturday. There has been a change of location. It will not be down south, right down here by City Hall. It will be back at the clock tower. Just east of the Medical Arts Building. You know where the clock tower, little plaza is there? Then refreshments. Bonfire will be on the other side. Refreshments will be served down at the Old Village Hail, which is the Chamber office. And they'll have a little bonfire and stuff where the old Pony-Pauly's establishments were. At that area so just keep that in mind. That's the only change. It will be similar to last year. Santa will be making a Park and Rec Commission - November 27, 2001 visit and have some refreshments and just kind of kick off the holiday season. Chamber's involved with that again this year with us so. A lot going on in town that day. Lash: Anybody have anything on the tree lighting? Okay. Franks: Is that the same day that Market Boulevard's having their big deal? Hoffman: And then Breakfast with Santa is Sunday. Sunday, 8:00 to noon at the Rec Center. Lash: Okay. And then how about the Halloween Party evaluation. Ruegemer: It seems so long ago. We did have a pretty decent amount of kids and parents out there again this year. Around 700. It just seemed like everything was very again relaxed. We didn't have real massive you know groups of people coming in. It wasn't crazy. Just seemed to be a very nice steady flow throughout the course of the night. A lot of people were on the hayrides and it was a lot of fun again this year. It was, gave people an opportunity to socialize with neighbors maybe they haven't seen for a while and it's just a real fun, kind of a community event. It worked out very good again having the Bluff Creek school gym again. Have the games and kind of spread things out. I think the games were very well received as well. Gives kids an opportunity to play some games. Get some cool little, fun little prizes and get a lot of candy. No hard candy of course but they do have fun at the event and we do. We had a great representation from the Boy Scouts again. The Chaska Key Club. I think they sent 30 or 40 volunteers so that pretty much takes care of all the volunteers. They come and help with games and wiping down tables and hayrides and so it's Corey's really found some very good volunteers there so. Anybody have any questions at all? Lash: No, I was there. Thought it was great. I agree with everything you said. One woman walked through and said, to me, who puts this on? I said why do you ask? Howe: What's your motive? Lash: Once I established that she was friendly, because she just thought it was great and she wanted to make sure to pass onto to whoever put it together that she just thought it was just absolutely great. So then I told her it was the Park and Rec. Who are all these people? I said it's all volunteers. Park and Rec Commissioners. Staff and I didn't know who all else so I just gave it to us but she was very pleased. Ruegemer: Thanks to all the commissioners that were there as well. Lash: And tell Corey thanks. He did a good job. Okay. Anything else under the party? No? Okay. ADMINISTRATIVE: FOX CHASE TRAIL PRO~IECT UPDATE. Hoffman: Has anyone been out there? Photos do it justice? It's very nice. Lash: Can I just ask, you know me. I never know my way around. Is this little group of pine trees, this right here? Hoffman: Yep. Lash: Okay. Just wanted to make sure I had my bearings. Park and Rec Commission - November 27, 2001 Hoffman: Just going up the stairs. So I think what really brought this project to a conclusion was the meeting in the cul-de-sac and Mike was there, so very similar to the referendum. When the referendum was passed by a vote and people said, these trails are going to go in and we know they're going through people's front yards and side yards, but you know what the community has said that it's going to happen. Same thing needed to happen here. Because this was very controversial. Going through side yards, front yards. Going through a park which was formerly used as people's front yards, but when all the neighbors met in the cul-de-sac and they argued out the points and they stood in front of the neighbor and the other neighbor and they said you know what, we know you're affected by this but this is what we paid for. This is what we bought into. This is why our property values are the way they are, and this is what we expect for services and it's going to go in and so the construction went very smooth. The two property owners obviously at the top of the cul-de-sac were very involved in the construction process and keeping in tune to what was going on. And the trails could only be 4 feet and when they smashed it out with the paver it was 4 foot 9 inches and they were right there to make sure that that contractor cut that 9 inches off so, but there was some of that going on out at the project. And the restoration was nearly complete. They did go out there and work yesterday. The day it snowed and they could not find sod. They contacted 10 places to try to find sod so they'll come back in the spring and do a little restoration and the path will be complete and it's just a beautiful walk along the lake. The remaining lakeshore that you see there on the right hand side, you can see at the top picture how the vegetation stops. That's because those property owners maintain right down to the lake which was causing erosion and so we will post our little signs which say, do not mow and allow that vegetation to grow back and hold that bank to stabilize it. Other than that, management of it will not change a great deal. We will continue to mow and there will be, you know where the property, private property owners come down to you and then where we start. If you look to the left of the picture, the city property goes a long ways up that hillside and so it's, that's up quite a ways and what formerly was mowed from the folks that were utilizing that shoreline there. The spur you see on the top picture is for the dock, and so that's a spur that goes down to the fishing dock, into the lake and just the project went very smoothly and the response has been positive. Lash: So once though it went in, you know between those 2 houses, did it end up going over on the lot where it wasn't right next to the house? You know what I'm talking about? If you're facing where the trail was going to go, the house on the right. Hoffman: No. It went on the lot, the closest alignment. Lash: It did? Hoffman: Yep. Lash: And then it went across the back of the other one? Hoffman: Yep. And it takes a very hard 90 degree turn which is not navigable but I did offer the Hedlund's $1,000 to purchase an easement there and they didn't want to get involved in it. People are still going to cut the comer I think unless they put a fence up. Lash: Okay. Anybody else have anything on that? Franks: It does look very nice. Moes: It does. Park and Rec Commission - November 27, 2001 Hoffman: It's really a nice addition. I don't like to say take back but to utilize that remaining parkland is a nice thing for the city and it's residents. Franks: The one thing I can't tell Todd is on the stairway. Is it limestone inbetween the risers or? Hoffman: Yep, rock. Franks: Rock. Lash: So not really bicycle or. Hoffman: Sorry, I ran out of disc space before I got to the top but they're going to cut out the same way they did before. And so the bikes are going to come down through the 2 houses and they're going to cut out onto Mohawk. There were 2 alignments. Either we go straight through to Mohawk or we take the stairway. So bikes are continuing to go straight through just like they did before. And that's allowable because our easement abuts right up to street right-of-way and so it's really 2 different trails. Lash: Okay. SKATE PARK IMPROVEMENTS. Hoffman: The second one we talked a little bit about tonight. This was basically generated out of the fact that okay, the ramps are in. $30,000. This site is popular. We've invested money in the infrastructure. The tar and the lights. Now let's see what we can do to make sure that our front lawn maintains a nice appearance. The stairway is directly across from a crosswalk, and the concrete walk is to get the users from the parking lot up into the skate park. One thing I think we can do with the fence in addressing that is to make it like a tennis court fence. We'd have to take a jog in there anyway, and so right at the top of the stairs, where it hits the asphalt. Currently the fence stops right over here and you have to take it and start it so we can box in this whole thing so as the fence comes down here, we'll do one of these jogs and then do the same thing up in here. Where you hit the top of the stairs, you have to go around to get in and then there can't be this activity where... We have to make an adjustment anyway because our fence is coming here and we have to get to here so before we just contemplated an angle. Instead of doing that we'll create this tennis court type of approach. Franks: And is there anyway to make that jog narrow enough to disallow or the comer sharp enough so that people can get their bikes around that. Lash: That's what I was thinking too. Hoffman: We could do it, if we do it here we have to do it on the other side and we certainly could. Franks: I would just suggest that. Since you're going 10 foot chainlink fence, right? Well let's. Hoffman: ...chainlink that's out there is 6 foot. Franks: 6foot? It's not 10. Oh. Park and Rec Commission - November 27, 2001 Hoffman: 6 foot fence around this thing. One thing that we'll have to take, we have a gate over here and I believe it's paddle locked. We have to have ambulance access to the site and so currently they drive on the trail and come right through the fence. If we're going to gate both of these up, we'll probably have to start leaving this open and then on weekends there will be some activity where the vehicles back out of there but we have to maintain ambulance access to the site so there's got to be a gate somewhere. Franks: I suppose you don't want to invest in a remote lock. You know a gated ambulance site with a remote unlock. Hoffman: I'm not sure. I'll talk with the ambulance folks and see what they want me to do. They can also park. Franks: But you can't get a stretcher out one of those things though. Lash: No, but can't, I mean can't the key be somewhere that they. Hoffman: Oh the fire...and you don't want to restrict yourself to where we have a problem. We can deal with that. Franks: Just a thought. Hoffman: They're not, an ambulance is not going to get in one of these gates whether we make it tennis court, without bike proof or not so we'll have to deal with that. Lash: What's the snow fence around? Hoffman: Oh, footings for the shelter. So there's a park shelter there. A covered shelter that will go up. Lash: Inside of the skate park? Franks: Well the hockey boards are just right out of the picture, right? Hoffman: Yep. Franks: The hockey board wail. Ruegemer: To the left. Lash: This is just a little shelter for the skate park? I didn't know we were putting that in. When did we decide to do that? Hoffman: Well I think it was labeled skate park improvements, $30,000. Lash: When you were saying that tonight I thought you were talking about the picnic, the big shelter was going in someday. Karlovich: I thought that was the foundation for more equipment. Ruegemer: That's for the garbage cans. 8 Park and Rec Commission - November 27, 2001 Hoffman: Yeah, there's 7 ¥2 thousand for additional equipment for next year. This shelter will have picnic tables, which are chained onto the surface and then it's to encourage, the biggest complaint we received from parents is they don't have a place to sit and they don't want to sit up there in the sun. And so this will allow for some seating. The big beautiful maple tree is in jeopardy of dying and that was where most of the spectators spent their time was under that big maple tree. It's got some disease showing up on the upper reaches of it so. Lash: Okay. Anybody have anything else on that? Franks: Just a quick comment about shelters. Now are we considering putting in any other shelters in any of the neighborhood parks that we did before? Do we have any? Hoffman: Nothing's scheduled in the C1P. Franks: Nothing is scheduled in the CIP. Hoffman: We did 3 or 4 with the referendum. Ruegemer: 4. Franks: 4. Hoffman: And I'll continue to be an advocate for them. They're a great focal point. I walk through Meadow Green and there happened to be some tournament activity going on and there was rain and you know they had a hundred people underneath that shelter and it's the tournament headquarters and it was the refreshment headquarters and it's just, when you put these things in these parks, they really create a nice atmosphere for different activities. Karlovich: After our meeting tonight do we need to take any action or direct city staff to facilitate the parents or a skate park association or additional police or drug enforcement in the area? Hoffman: Only if you want. It's up to the commission. Karlovich: What do you think Chair? Lash: Well I think that's our obvious next step. I think what we need to do is have Todd look over the notes that he took tonight. He was busy writing down all the ideas, and put it together in some kind of form for us and either bring it back at the next meeting or the January meeting or whatever, and hash it over and decide where we want to go with it and what we want to do and make a recormnendation to the City Council that we pursue some of these options. Franks: I'd prefer that Todd takes, or staff takes some time to come up with a plan in a thoughtful way, since the pressure' s off right now anyway. Hoffman: Season's over. Franks: I mean we have what, 6-7 months. Park and Rec Commission - November 27, 2001 Lash: Yeah, but it takes a while to get something like this going, Franks: Right that's what I mean, but let's. Lash: Yeah. But I mean if we want to say an example is to do an association, that's going to take a few months to get off the ground. Hoffman: I think in this effort, that association can be key because those people, you know just getting this thing in the paper and so I go over and I talk with the sergeant and I talk with the deputies and we talk about the skate park and wouldn't it be great if you guys could stop up there and talk with these kids. And they say on fine you know. The Park Director would like to see that happen. These are contractual employees of the city. They're not my peers and it's not like I'm walking over there and talking to a town cop. It's different and that's something that I don't think a lot of people recognize in the community. They're responsive but it's not, it's just not the same. And I know many of them, I know most of them on a first name basis and, but if you have an association that says you know what, we're taking a vested interest here and they meet with these people and they say you know...help us out and then they see it in the paper and they say oh. The community's kind of taking an interest and there's a lot of people out there that say boy, we want to be creative. The police would have a presence there. That's just going to take on a whole new value to these folks and they're going to be able to pay more attention to it. And that's why I think the group community effort is the way to go. It's not government take care of it. Solve our problems. Watch our kids. Make sure that nobody misbehaves, but it takes some responsibility on everybody's part so. We talked about this during the parent, and there was interest. Mr ..... he expressed his doubt that such an association could operate or get off the ground because it's difficult enough in organized sports. I said well, I mean look at the number of parents, there's a lot of users over there. Lots of kids over there and those parents are going to be, they'll respond to that so ! think it will be successful. Lash: And if they don't make it into some huge complex organization with a whole ton of by-laws and elected officers and required meetings, if they could try and keep it informal the way the whole structure is here, I think it might have a shot. Karlovich: Just after hearing that young gentleman though, it would be nice if there were some type of drug law enforcement or you know undercover. Hoffman: There is. They've been active at the skate park. Karlovich: Have they? Hoffman: Sure. Karlovich: Okay. Hoffman: These things aren't, that kid didn't tell the police anything they didn't know. Lash: The mom that was here, seemed supportive of the association thing. So maybe we have a shot. She said to check with the kids because I said do you know of other parents who would be interested and she said check with the kids. They'd have the best sense of. 10 Park and Rec Commission - November 27, 2001 Hoffman: Well we'd just post a flyer at the skate park. Have an organizational meeting and start from there. Lash: Okay. Anything else on the skate park? Franks: What about developing a contact in the Chamber? You know, I mean this is just such a project. Hoffman: Jerry, which committee...was formed to deal with specific issues specifically to the downtown? Franks: Because you know, they're indirect beneficiary of this facility. Hoffman: Huge economic impact to this community. Franks: Right. Lash: Well plus all the skateboarders are off their sidewalks. Franks: Right. No. But they definitely have an interest as a stakeholder as well. Karlovich: What was your opinion on the immovable trash receptacles? Is that doable? Hoffman: Yeah, we have additional dollars budgeted in 2002. If they make it through the budget we'll go ahead and. Karlovich: Can't we use the old blue one as jumps? Hoffman: The old blue's are being phased out. Lash: Here's just an idea. If you can get any buy in from some of the businesses like Subway or any of those other places, if we had some kind of a little event or competition or something, maybe they'd be willing to donate little prizes. You know say here's a way that you can show. Hoffman: That would be up to that association to go ahead and those are the type of things. The skate park is so successful and yeah it'd be great to put on these events and it's something we've been talking about and we can take a look at but if there's other volunteers out there to do it, we're going to let them take on that duty. It'd be really fun. They could use it as a fundraiser actually. Franks: What I find interesting is being the old former YMCA program director, it was always my goal to go where the kids were and it just shocks me that people who, you know it's kind of their idea to work with that age group are not going there. That's where I would be once a day if that place like that, well I was at places like that. Once a day, every day. Stopped by. Talking to the kids. Lash: If you were the officer? Franks: Well or like the church youth directors or the whatever it is that are out in this community that are doing that kind of work. They must be here. Hoffman: They're here. 11 Park and Rec Commission - November 27, 2001 Franks: Yeah, well they're here but they're not here and so I'm wondering, it's something about skateboard as a sub-culture. It's that. Hoffman: We have one church that organized an activity up there so they did, actually a fairly large exhibition and so the youth person recognized that as a place to go to reach the kids and so we have some of that taking place. Lash: Okay. I don't think we have any committees, do we? Okay. We'd better start making some up, right. Hoffman: Skate park committee. COMMISSION MEMBER PRESENTATIONS: Kelly: I just want to say that I went to the Minnewashta meeting last month and there were a few people there. A couple dog owners that were there to promote using part of Minnewashta for a dog park. There was a resident there that pointed out that I guess pheasants nest on the ground and that he was afraid the dogs would trample over the nest. But the commission seems open to having a dog park at Minnewashta. They're looking for a way to attract people to come to their park as opposed to the other regional parks or Carver Park and they think a dog park would be something that they could offer that nobody else could offer. One resident said he would prefer paying a $25.00 annual fee as opposed to paying $25.00 every time he was caught with his dog off the leash. And they actually had a good idea. The commissioners said to a couple of these residents. They said why don't you go out to the dog park in Minneapolis or St. Paul and go there and see how it's set up because the commission really has no idea how to set up a dog park. What works. What doesn't so they kind of threw it back to the residents to say, hey if you are really interested in a dog park at Minnewashta, we'll listen but come back to us with some concrete ideas so I think the idea of a dog park was well received by the Minnewashta Commission so that may solve the problem. Hoffman: Thanks for going to that Tom. Lash: Anybody else have anything? Hoffman: Marty Walsh, the Parks Director really appreciates the input from this commission because he feels a responsibility to the community as a park that's within the city limits of Chanhassen so any input you can give to Marty and the park commission there in Carver County would be appreciated. Lash: That's nice to hear. ADMINISTRATIVE PACKET. Spizaie: I have one thing. Are they thinking about closing the rec center on Sundays? Hoffman: Yes. Spizale: Would that be a seasonal thing or permanent year long? Hoffman: Permanent. 12 Park and Rec Commission - November 27, 2001 Karlovich: Is that something new or when did that come about? Hoffman: As part of the budget talks. Budget reductions. Sundays are, I'm not necessarily in support of the closing on Sundays. What you have is a facility which is open to your residents who are off on weekends, and you close it one day out of the week but the reality is, Sunday's are used very lightly and we lose money on Sundays so is it worth continuing to have it open? It's one of those things where public perception I think would be very bad. Here we have a recreation facility that's closed on one half of the weekends so what's the deal with that? Karlovich: Yeah I don't think you have to make money on every day. I mean close the rec center on the weekend, it just doesn't seem right. I personally know Linda Cramer and I just, hopefully there's others out there that agree with her. Kelly: On the flip side it's nice to go to the rec center on Sundays because it's not jam packed yeah, and it gives me the only opportunity I can watch the NFL pre-game shows without interruption so I'm hoping that it does stay open. They do line up for the aerobics class. I know I've gotten there a couple times at 10:00 and there was half a dozen people lined up for the doors to open to take that 10:00 class. Hoffman: If the commission has a desire to send a resolution to the attention of the staff and council, have at it. Lash: Well has the City Council already acted on this or is this just a suggestion? Hoffman: No. Suggestion. They'll act on the budget later in December. Franks: What kind of monetary impact are we talking about here? Hoffman: About 4 grand. Franks: In how long of a period of time? Hoffman: A year. Franks: Have we been, I can't remember our budget talks but are we making movement still towards that break even point or? Hoffman: We're stopped at $175,000 revenue, $250,000 expense. And we feel that's. Franks: About where it's going to be? Hoffman: Yep. For a facility that size it seemed very well. Franks: And this part of the, what was the number, 200,000 or something that was asked to be cut from? Hoffman: Yep. Directive by the city manager to cut 10%? Ruegemer: 10% from this year's budget. 13 Park and Rec Commission - November 27, 2001 Spizale: Are the fees going to remain the same or is there talk about maybe raising the fees 50 cents or a buck every time? Lash: We just raised the fees. Hoffman: Yeah, we just raised them. Franks: Well personally, just my personal feeling is if we're going to go ahead and up the fees, which we just did and then cut services, it's a pretty sad message to send. I can understand the monetary reasoning behind it but you know we didn't set this thing up ever to be a money maker. At best it was always going to be a break even proposition. Karlovich: What are the alternatives to meet your budget goals as opposed to, where can the $4,000 come from as opposed to closing the recreation center on a weekend day? I guess is what I would be interested as to what are some other options. If you have to meet that budget it just seems goofy to have a community recreation center that isn't open on the weekend day. Hoffman: Okay. Everybody agree? Franks: Absolutely. And the reason why I'm agreeing too is I was one of the people way back that said we should get rid of the daycare because it was losing money and a little bit of creativity was applied to what was I thought a bad situation and it turned around. And so maybe what that same approach is needed here on Sunday. Lash: Now can't, aren't there organized, aren't there practices? Aren't there dance classes? Aren't there? Hoffman: Sunday's not that popular. Ruegemer: We schedule pretty light. Well not with anticipation but just not knowing. So with the community based community hours on the weekends, we just did it for like Saturdays and Saturday nights and did nothing as of right now on Sundays. Karlovich: Is there an option? What are the hours on Sunday? Are there just some really dead hours on Sunday as opposed to the closing of the whole day? Lash: Could it open at, what are the hours? Ruegemer: 10:00 to 4:00. 10:00 to 5:00. Lash: Well what if we opened at noon? Do that many people go in the mornings? I would guess most people wouldn't go in the morning. Franks: Look at it more creatively, that's what I'd prefer. Lash: Put MaryAnn's Dance class in there. That brings people at least. I mean if I have to take my kid for dance lessons, then I might go use the fitness room instead of sitting around or driving around or something. I don't know. But you can't do that until you know, I mean you can't start scheduling winter session stuff for Sundays unless the City Council acts on it so. It's kind of a catch 22. 14 Park and Rec Commission - November 27, 2001 Karlovich: The other question I had about the administrative packet. This Ingraham and Associates, type of park dedication survey. Is it telling us we're too high? Too low or what was our opinion on that? Hoffman: It's done every other year and it always tells us that we're in the top 10% and that we're where we should be. We have some of the highest land values in the metropolitan area and we continue to move it higher. Lash: They keep coming. Hoffman: Yep. Lash: It's the place to be. Hoffman: Based on the, how the ordinance is written, it could go considerably higher and still be defended so we'll continue to move it. Lash: Does anybody else have anything on the packet? No? Anybody have anything else on anything? Hoffman: December meeting, coming up quickly. 101 feasibility study will be presented by the consultant for the trail. Lash: The meeting is what date? Hoffman: 12th? 14th? Franks: 101 North? Hoffman: 101 North. 101 North. I looked at two different budget numbers. $920,000 and $1.1 some million, and there's $800,000 that's on the line for park dedication. Franks: What's the status of that turnback? Hoffman: I don't know. That's a good, they're dual tracking. The turnback and the trail development and so they need to move forward and decisions to be made based on information on both sides of the issues. Feasibility studies for 101 South and the two trail connections will be in December so those budget numbers can move forward in the CIP for the council. And then the seminary and the property owner has put together a very nice video presentation and DNR's again showing interest in the property and so if we have time we'll show portions of that in December as well. Karlovich: What is the date again? Hoffman: Excuse me? Karlovich: What is the date again? Lash: Is it the 18th or the 1 lth? Hoffman: 11th. Second Tuesday. 15 Park and Rec Commission - November 27, 2001 Lash: Okay, that'd be fine. I'll be gone next week. Karlovich: 1 might not be there. I'm not sure how that works. Hoffman: Second Tuesday in December. Lash: Is that going to be holiday...? Jay... Karlovich: Schedules just get all mixed up in December, Lash: Okay. Anybody have anything else? If not, is there a motion to adjourn? Karlovich moved, Moes seconded to adjourn the Park and Recreation Commission meeting. All voted in favor and the motion carried. The meeting was adjourned. Submitted by Todd Hoffman Park and Rec Director Prepared by Nann Opheim 16