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1979 12 12 EXCERPT OF PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES DATED DECEMBER 12, 1979 e CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT, SITE PLAN REVIEW, CANNONBALL KITCHENS, PUBLIC HEARING: The public hearing was called to order by Chairman Roman Roos at 7:50 p.m. The following persons were present: Charles Novak, 14750 South Robert Trail, Rosemount, MN; Larry Zamor, Excelsior; L.J. Renner, Tonka Bay; and Robert J. Davis, 4212 Alden Drive, Edina. Bob Waibel, Assistant Manager/Land Use Coordinator read the notice of public hearing. Bob Waibel reviewed his planning report and noted that the only real changes in the plan were the removal of the 11 parking spaces that were proposed east of the structure. The number of parking spaces is now reduced to 65. Mr. Waibel noted that consideration should be given for postponement of utilizing the full proposed capacity of the restaurant until a neighboring development occurred, wherein cross easement or shared parking could be incorporated into these plans. Shared parking would have to be in place before ultimate facilities are in operation (that would be the banquet area). - The Housing and Redevelopment Authority reviewed these plans at their meeting of November 12, 1979, and found the plan to be acceptable. They suggested that some low lying shrubs be plan~ed on the berm in front of the trash enclosure and that a couple more deciduous trees be added on the western property line and that a couple ash trees be added on the northern property line. Bob Waibel recommended that the Planning Commission recommend to the City Council to approve the site plan and building moratorium variance for Cannonball Kitchen with the following conditions: I 1. That the perimeter of all manuevering and parking areas be lined with concrete curb; 2. That the city engineer approve the grading, drainage, utility, lighting and parking sub-surface preparation plans of the applicant; 3. That proposed signage is reviewed by the Sign Committee and approved by the City C~uncil; 4. That the final plans include the landscape recommendations of the HRA; 5. That the capacity OD the restaurant be limited to the 60 parking spaces provided with the extra five spaces reserved for employee parking which includes reservation for the utilization of the proposed banquet facilities since the use of said banquet facilities would potentially exceed the parking ar.eas provided on the plan by 15 to 20 spaces. Clark Horn - You're ruling out ever expanding into this eastern section? .e Bob Waibel - I am going along with what the HRA set aside for that soft entry portion into Chanhassen. Roman Roos - What your saying is that if development occurs to the west whatever it might be, office building, office/warehouse, etc., that at only that point in time you feel that the shared parking should permit the improvements of the banquet ar ea ? -2- Bob Waibel - Yes, any ~increase i:n the capacity. ~ Roman Roos - Your saying that parking right now is adequate for three persons per space. Bob Waibel - Parking right now is 65 spaces, counting 60 for customers and five for employees. They are estimating five employee parking spaces for each shift. That puts it at about 180 capacity. The upstairs right now is somewhere around the neighborhood of 150. That leaves them approximately 10 spaces short for the banquet :'.area that they had indicated which would be 60 persons in capacity. Roman Roos - I'd like to have the people from Cannonball Kitchens respond to that. Charles Novak - I guess before we proceed I'd like to have my memory refreshed to the HRA recommendation. Bob Waibel - The HRA had reviewed the new plan, it had just been received that day so they accepted the plan that was revised that you have right now. Their endorsement was based upon the new plan, showing the deletion of the 11 spaces. Charles Novak - Who elimiated the 11 parking spaces? e Bob Waibel - The HRA did from our recommendations at the last meeting. I think they found it obvious the HRA had set aside that green space and this is a great diverence from their previous rulings on that. Charles Novak - In our last discussions your recommendations were that 11 space parking area would be a problem. Roman Roos - We went along with the recommendation based on the green space, but moreso than that we were concerned, as I recall, with the signage. Bob Waibel - I have no indication of free standing signage in any plans. Charles Novak - We haven't shown that at the present time. We knew the signage was going to come up at some point and we did show a picture last time on what type of pylon sign we would like to have but we haven't gotten to a point of finalization. e Roman Roos - I'll try and recall back to a discussion we had and one of the things of course was the viewability of that parking area from Highway 5. The green area of course, and you can attest to this Mr. Zamor, from day back we have been talking about a greenway area, moderate width, but something that would be viewable as you enter Chanhassen and that discussion has ever changed even back when Holiday and Happy Chef were working in conjunction. I am sure that thing still holds true. I know that I -3- e expressed the question that would the number of parking spaces that you have now be adequate, and in that point in time they stated that it would be. I'm just trying to recall from memory some of the other items brought up. We expressed some concern about the entry, the cross easement parking was brought up but at that point in time I don't think there was any firm indication that you might use cross easement parking with the development to the west. I think this is something new that I had not heard before. You showed us a picture of the restaurant and we would like to discuss the structural design of that building. We have a physical layout and we would like to hold that structural design to 'something in the line of that which we saw in that photograph. It's very difficult to look at a drawing like this and say "yes that's the shape of the building" without knowing physically what it's going to look like. Charles Novak - I brought a set of plans with me today showing that it is basically a copy, although the floor plan is slightly larger. The Cannonball Kitchens, Inc. from st. Cloud owns the facility and land and they would be building this second building as a corporate facility, not a franchise. e Roman Roos - The reason I asked that question would be very desirous at this point in time to do all the construction complete in that building rather than going back as you are talking about and if the banquet room proves to be the thing that is a bread winner to increase the capacity of that banquet room is that they are desirous to put together as one total package or are they doing this as they "answer to" staff concerns. Charles Novak - No, they basically build the building totally, that's why we didn't want to get a recommendation saying to reduce the size of the building and then add onto it later. It's better construction-wise to build the building the size that they need it now and just prove that the parking capacity is adequate or use it at a slightly less because we plan to have some dividers in the banquest area to make a couple small rooms and one large room so we can just use it at a half capacity until such time as we i.can make further arrangements for the parking. Roman Roos - Just one other question, in your determination, based on the other two Cannonball restaurants, what do you feel is adequate for parking, I'd like to know that factor. I know what the ordinance says, but I'd be very curious to know what you think. - Charles Novak - I would like to see them personally have a few more cars than the 60 that are there and I think the additional 11 that we had put them at what I feel a reasonable (capacity for use of a banquet;~acility on a part time basis and the upper restaurant on a full time basis, but I don't think that reduction down to the 65 cars is in the long run adequate parking for both areas in full operation and an additional 10 to 12 spaces will be needed for that to run properly. -4- e Roman Roos - Just one more question - Again, coming back to the corporation, would it be their desire then if you had the parking spots .or if you did to finish off the total banquet room or are you going to try and feel out the market place. Charles Novak - They'll finish off the total area because of the construction costs. To finish off half of the banquet room and put the rest of the carpeting and paneling or whatever it takes, mechanical systems have to go in in tact - so I don't think the final costs of the difference between finishing half the banquet:room and the entire banquet room are really an unreasonable amount of costs to project for future use. Tom Droegemueller - I'm curious what type of a market study you did. Charles Novak - I didn't do the market study. It was the Cannonball people themselves. e Walt Thompson - My comment is and I don't know if I'm reading this correctly or not, it sounds to me like they're limiting the capacity of the restaurant to the number of parking spaces and while I do not have any arguments with three people per car, I can see an occasion,lwhere you're going to have more than 3 people per car, maybe it will average out, but I really don't think they ought to be limited. I would like to see some more parking spaces put in where they had them originally, I think they can berm that and put some low growing vegetation in there and it would cover that. Personally, it seems kind of nebulous to me to anticipate something happening on the west, which at this time we don't have anything before us, hopefully, they are saying something will come in there that will let us expand our parking to the area, but I hate to see them limited by the cold number of parking spots. Roman Roos - But are you certain about expanding that parking back intoi\.the original location south of the Holiday - because that's quite contrary to everything we believe in Walter, from day one. Walter Thompson - It could well be, but I believe that that 11 space parking area could be concealed by landscaping and that is not really my primary premise. I don't think they should be limited to seating capacity when they have more capacity available to them because they only have that number of parking spaces there based on three people to a car. e Roman Roos - Let's talk about intensification Walter. When we talk about intensification on a piece of land, and this has been a problem Mr. Zamor from day one, and I talk about intensification I'm not only talking about the building structure but also blacktop and Walter, h~(~J what -5- e you're saying and I also know these people are in that business, they know their business and I have a feeling when I look at that overall project right now, I feel that it's a much better use right now than when the first time I saw it. There's been alot of work, and alot of thought went into this triangular piece of land, but I do see right now an intensification of their portion, but I can live with it, I sure would not want to see any more blacktop than I see already. The restaurant is considered as a money making proposition and you start talking about a banquet room with the futur.e growing in Chanhassen I think its a good idea. It might be a little premature. Cross easement parking, again, if I had a crystal ball I could tell you what's going to happen to the west, it might not be conducive to cross easement parking and then you are going to be pigeon-holed and maybe in that point in time the choice of the banquet room was wrong, I just feel that right now there is an intensification, I don't want to see any more parking on there Walt. Walt Thompson - I would draw my objections to 11 additional parking spots if we did not limit the downstairs to Roman Roos - I don't think it should be limited, if they want to build it, fine, let them build it. I don't think that has any bearing e Walt Thompson - Well it seems to indicate here that they are going to be restricted to a certain number of people until additional parking is available - I don't go along with that. Roman Roos - That's by ordinance. That's what we have the ordinances for. Charles Novak - I think the market place tends to limit things as well. People start coming 2 or 3 times a week to find out if restaurants uphold and they can't find a place to park so they think twice about coming to the resuaurant again, so that tends to limit how the restaurant is used to the capacity of the parking as well without saying you have to have a certain number of seats. - Would another possibility be to put the employee parking over there and cut that spot down to five. Would that soften up the entrance. Roman Roos - Your talking about the part we wiped out? Yes. I would like their comments. e I think you're approaching very closely to what would Charles Novak - be a very workable parking situation. I guess it is a possibility. r -6- e A motion was made by Tom Droegemueller and seconded by Clark Horn to adjourn the public hearing. Motion unanimously approved. Roman Roos - I guess we've had enough time to throw this around and I would like a motion on the floor and in that motion I would like to have the staff recommendation be considered as a part of that motion with whatever modifications we might want to make to number 1. We've looked at all the various ways of looking at it. I'd like to see if we can get this thi.ng moving along. If we try to adhere to ordinance, what would be the proper;way - can we say Bob Waibel - As far as orciUmance standard would be the building could be constructed but no commissioning of the banquet facilities could occur until such time as the amount of parking needed is constructed. The capacity would be limited. Larry Zamor - You can't control that. e Bob Waibel - Clark Horn - Roman Roos e The key is the cross easement. Until that is available some limitations would be in order by the letter of the ordinance. I feel uncomfortable by having this cross easement thing as our only out, our only option. I would entertain a motion at this point in time that the Planning 'Commission recommend to the city council that the site plan as presented is accepted with the allotted parking spaces they have shown, that the banquet room be part of the total project be self limiting and that's the reason we feel that we can somewhat deviate from the ordinance standards. In addition to that I would like to see the other four items of the staff report be included and conclusive to the recommendation. Walter Thompson seconded the motion. Motion unanimously approved. A motion was made by Tom Droegemueller and seconded by Clark Horn that the building moratorium variance be approved. Motion unanimously approved..!'