PRC 2011 02 22
CHANHASSEN PARK AND
RECREATION COMMISSION
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 22, 2011
Chairman Daniel called the meeting to order at 7:30 p.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT:
Jeff Daniel, Steve Scharfenberg, Tom Kelly, Scott Wendt, Glenn
Stolar, Elise Ryan and Cole Kelly
STAFF PRESENT:
Todd Hoffman, Park and Rec Director; and Jerry Ruegemer, Recreation
Superintendent
APPROVAL OF AGENDA:
Daniel: If there’s any items that need to be added or deleted, please let us know.
Ryan: I have a Red Birds update.
Daniel: Excellent. Where do you want to put that Todd? Should we just put it in the visitor, or
public announcements or do you want it at the end?
Hoffman: Commission member reports.
Daniel: Okay. Thank you Elise. Todd.
Hoffman: I have a couple I’d like to add. Some dates for tours throughout the year so we can
get those on your calendars, and then also talk about an invitation from the Environmental
th
Commission for a couple of members to attend their April 13 meeting, and we can do those
under Admin. Just after reports so item 6.
Daniel: Excellent. Alright, anything else? Okay, then let’s go ahead and approve the agenda.
Tom Kelly: I move to approve the agenda with the changes noted previously.
Scharfenberg: Second.
Tom Kelly moved, Scharfenberg seconded to approve the agenda with additions under
commission member presentations by Commissioner Ryan and administrative packet. All
voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 7 to 0.
PUBLIC ANNOUNCEMENTS:
Ruegemer: As of today the rinks are officially closed for the season. The kind of warm weather
that we had last week, along with the snow that we had over the weekend and the effort to kind
of, sun angles are getting so much higher and the rinks are really starting to really melt even
Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
when it’s below freezing. It’s just at this point it doesn’t seem worth the, for the remaining
season that we do have so we did officially close the rinks today.
Daniel: And how’s that in comparison to normal rink shut downs?
Ruegemer: You know I’d say we’re you know, compared to last year, earlier than last year. I
think we went into March last year.
Cole Kelly: Last year was an unusual year. When my son was skating when he was younger
outside a lot, this seems about normal.
Ruegemer: It’s about in that area.
Daniel: Last week in February as I remember most of the official closes.
Hoffman: Yeah, end of third week. And mostly due to the sun angle. The sun just takes it out
on the north side of the boards. Basically it’s just not worth the investment in time to clear off
13 inches of snow and try to get back in skating conditions. I think we’d fight a losing battle.
Daniel: Thank you Jerry.
VISITOR PRESENTATIONS:
None.
APPROVAL OF MINUTES: Cole Kelly moved, Tom Kelly seconded to approve the
verbatim and summary minutes of the Park and Recreation Commission meeting dated
January 25, 2011 as presented.
REVIEW CONCEPT PLANS FOR NEW NEIGHBORHOOD PARKS TO BE LOCATED
IN “REFLECTIONS AT LAKE RILEY” AND “PIONEER PASS”, AMY BOWER,
HOISINGTON-KOEGLER GROUP, INC.
Hoffman: I’ll start just with a little bit of background. Chair Daniels, members of the
commission, tonight is really the first in almost a three part series of what the commission will
work on for these two neighborhood park sites. Generally we want to get a concept plan on the
board so we have, as we move into neighborhood meetings and publishing newsletters and those
type of things that we have an official concept plan for the park sites and also for the developers
in the area. That people moving in to give an idea of what eventually that site might look like.
Once this is approved you’ll make recommendation to the City Council to approve these concept
plans. Then we’ll move into at an appropriate time, a neighborhood meeting concept and it takes
neighbors to have a neighborhood meeting so they want some of the houses to be built and some
of the neighbors to move into the actual properties where these parks are sited. Obviously there
are other adjoining neighbors already in place and then you’ll hold a neighborhood meeting at
that time. Receive any additional feedback. Make a final recommendation to the City Council
for a park master plan. That then would move into the CIP process for the commission to
continue on with the eventual development. You’re familiar with both these sites so I’m not
going to go through how we’ve acquired them. Pioneer Pass acquired through the development
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
with that name and then the Riley Ridge Park, which is being recommended as the name for the
new park in the Reflections at Lake Riley neighborhood. That started as being known as
Lakeview. Then it changed to Reflections at Lake Riley. The developer likes the name Riley
Ridge Park and in fact they want to name the street out in front of the park Riley Ridge Drive so.
And we have Amy Bower with Hoisington-Koegler Group here tonight. She’ll walk you
through the site plans that she’s developed. Concept plans for each one of these parks and she’s
the landscape architect so Amy, come on up.
Amy Bower: Thanks Todd. I have some context maps. I know you’re familiar with where these
parks are located but I thought it’d be helpful to have some context and see how the developing
neighborhoods are, what phase they’re at. The Pioneer Park Pass is over in this area, north of
212 and Audubon Road. Then you can see a lot of the areas which we developed and Riley
Ridge Park is up near Riley Lake and south of 212 and north of Lyman Boulevard. Again you
can see how the neighborhoods are yet to develop.
Hoffman: And most of the commission has toured both sites but it’s good to see in context
where these are individually.
Amy Bower: Okay. So I’m going to zoom in on Pioneer Park Pass. Sorry, Pioneer Pass Park.
And here you can see the 8.7 acre park and you can see how it’s located and these parcels are
situated because they have great access to a public road and visibility. They’re surrounded by
residential areas and also they are both adjacent to some great natural features. You can see a
big woodland area that’s adjacent to the park. Zooming in closer I’m going to show you the
concept plan. I think you have this in your packet.
Wendt: Hey Todd real quick, that woodland area, is that, that’s probably not going to be
developed or is that part?
Hoffman: It’s part of the primary Bluff Creek corridor and it will not be developed. The
property across the little alfalfa field, that could be developed and then the houses in the bottom
corner are in Chaska.
Wendt: Okay.
Amy Bower: With Pioneer Pass Park concept plan, again I thought this was a great parcel to
work with. We have plenty of room for the typical neighborhood park amenities that we want to
put in. We have some great topography. You’re going to be able to put in a sledding hill and
some overlooks and again with some great natural features with the wooded area in the park and
adjacent to the park. This parcel also has great visibility from Bluff Creek Boulevard. A lot of
public viewing in and also has great connections to the future neighborhoods. All the sidewalks
are connected by crosswalks in the plan. The…to here you’ll be connected with a sidewalk and
some great connections. This park has the added feature of having a 10 foot kind of regional
trail that links the rest of the city on one side of the park so really this concept only needs to put
in a, kind of a loop here to complete almost a half mile loop within the park. Typical
neighborhood parks is a really small parking lot for those that need to drive. It’s a 20 stall lot.
We have room for two age group play areas on a 5 to 12 and then a 2 through 5 and also a picnic
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
area. A shelter between those that offers a view of the open field area and views of the play
areas. The half court hard surface for basketball and other court ball games located near the
parking lot and then there’s room for a future ballfield with a backstop or kick ball or small pick
up games of whiffle ball or baseball. As you can see they talk about…this is almost 45, 35 to 45
foot drop in elevation so it’s kind of a large sledding hill. We want to show here the brown trees
would be new trees that need to be installed because I think this is a farm kind of field and then a
lot of your trees are existing trees that would be preserved. So you can start with some wooded
areas but you also need to do some plantings and get the shade and you just want more scenic
park. I’m going to move on to Riley Ridge Park and then take questions.
Cole Kelly: Amy can I interrupt you for a minute? I’ve got a question for Todd. Thank you for
putting that back up. Todd I think you talked about this but just refresh my memory. The
ballpark, and I see the open field that could be a soccer field type of thing. Now are we planning
to open these up to some of the sports groups for them to play there or are we planning on this
park just to be for walk-in for the neighborhood type pick up games or, what are the thoughts?
Hoffman: Well the basis is that neighborhood parks are not scheduled but we have some that are
and this one’s large enough that I think it would become a point of conversation so the couple
that are are North Lotus Lake Park. Meadow Green Park and those are the only, and then Sunset
Ridge.
Scharfenberg: Sunset Ridge, yeah.
Hoffman: So we have a few neighborhood parks that are scheduled and I think this one would
lend itself to possibly allowing for some practice activities because you have a parking lot which
you could extend to even you know 24.
Cole Kelly: And that’s my question is if we were planning on that, the parking lot looks a little
small to me and you know so what, you know what can we do because if you’re going to have
teams there and you know if the streets are big enough they’re going to need to be out in the
streets no matter what size we make the parking lot but you said there’s room for the parking lot
to be bigger. How much bigger and what are we thinking and should we be looking at that up
front?
Hoffman: I think that’s an appropriate conversation for the commission to have. Do you feel
this is a site that could accommodate those activities.
Scharfenberg: Is the Sunset Ridge parking lot a 20 space or is there a little bit more than that?
Ruegemer: I don’t think it’s any more than 20.
Hoffman: Not more than that because it’s single stacked. It’s not three stack like this one.
Scharfenberg: Right. Right.
Daniel: Are there parking issues there?
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Scharfenberg: I don’t think so. The people that park at Sunset Ridge are usually able to, that are
playing there are usually within the, I don’t think I’ve driven by there when they’ve had t-ball
that they’re parked on the side of the road there on Lake Drive so I think that they’re able to
accommodate it for the most part. Because most of the people that go to the park at Sunset
Ridge, if they’re going to the park are neighbor people. They don’t drive there to come to the
park. It’s people that are there to use the ballfield.
Hoffman: And the City before Bandimere and there was activities at Carver Beach. A variety of
other neighborhood parks but those were pretty small and tight. Rice Marsh Lake, and a lot of
parking issues and so that was the basis once Bandimere was developed that we would take those
activities out of those neighborhood park sites but again I think this one lends itself. You know
you heard tonight some of the desires of the candidates utilized and I think that would be one
way. You wouldn’t have to schedule this 5 nights a week but you could schedule it.
Cole Kelly: Right. Well I’m looking at that you know, being a former soccer coach and player I
see that nice, big field and it’d be a shame not to utilize it. You know especially put it in the
rotation so to speak but you do, you know then you’re going to have parking and cars stacked all
over and so what’s the answer to that? You know can we make the parking lot a little bigger and
is the street going to be big enough to handle cars parking on one side or both sides and then do
you have to put signs up no parking on this side or something like that.
Hoffman: We’ll get you the answers on the street. I’m not certain on what the accommodations
will be there just yet.
Daniel: Yeah and I think if there’s going to be any concern it would be, I think multiple events
with practices one after another or a combination of the ballfields being used with the open field
practicing but you know certainly if we have to stay within the scope of the design right here, it
would certainly limit what we’d be able to do but certainly I would be in favor of seeing it used
in some sort of capacity.
Cole Kelly: Right.
Daniel: For recreation.
Cole Kelly: I’d be in favor of a bigger parking lot if we can accommodate that.
Daniel: Any other questions?
Scharfenberg: We’re going to come back to that.
Amy Bower: You can come back to it.
Cole Kelly: Thank you Amy.
Daniel: …specifics with regards to the discussion.
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Amy Bower: The Riley Ridge Park plan shows the context again. Riley Ridge Park is a 4.8 acre
parcel near Riley Lake and as you can see there’s no residential…but there’s more yet to come.
Again this is I think a great parcel because it has good visibility from Lyman Boulevard. To
keep some of your Chanhassen open space visible from driving through it. Also adjacent to a
really large open space wetland so it helps make that part of the park as well. Again it also
includes zoom into the concept plan. The concept plan, I just told you that north is, to the east
now… Lyman Boulevard is over on this side and again this park has great topography features
that make the park interesting. It allows us to get a smaller sledding hill in here but nonetheless
it has some very good topography. It’s not just a flat plane. It has great woodland area already
adjacent to it and a wetland in it and adjacent to it and a greater wetland overlooking it. The park
is also going to be well connected to the neighborhoods. It has good sidewalk connections
within this neighborhood. Crosswalks. Lyman Boulevard has a big city wide trail on the south
side of it to bring people in from further. If I talk about the park features, this park’s a little
smaller. We have a 10 stall parking lot. Smaller trail loop that’s a quarter of a mile and trail
loop is nice because it starts angled to the woods and comes open spaces. We have just one
room for one play area. A court. Hard surface court area and a picnic area, a pavilion could be
nicely nestled right on the hillside overlooking the playground and also looking at slope and the
woodlands. Park signs near the parking lot. It’d also be nice to have a park sign on the
intersection of Lyman and Riley Ridge Drive so that people know this is a public park. I think
it’s yet to be seen how this outlot is handled. There might be an option for an informal trail out
to, further into the wetland and a bench or something. A natural surface trail.
Hoffman: It’s all going to be public space so it will all be owned by the City so the park will, in
the end we’ll actually call it you know 15 or 20 acres or whatever it is, the wetland. 10 acres
maybe.
Daniel: Is that publicly owned?
Hoffman: Yes. It’d be owned by the City.
Daniel: Okay.
Amy Bower: Again the concept is suggesting keeping the edge next to Lyman Boulevard more
unmowed and trees and shrubbed up to add kind of a buffer on that side of the park and other
areas, the darker being shows unmowed areas. Not mowed. Not high maintenance. And again
the brown trees would be trees that would need to be planted because it’s open space right now
and if you try to preserve… Again both these parcels have pretty good natural features to begin
with and we’ve fit in some of the typical neighborhood park amenities and you can see how they
fit in very nicely and welcome any comments or any more suggestions you might have.
Hoffman: One more thing. Neighborhoods need sewer and water lines as well and Amy if you
can just describe how that ties into this site plan and what the impacts are.
Amy Bower: We were working back and forth with this, with the engineer that’s grading this
and I keep sending my grading plans and they go okay. So the sewer lines, I think the idea is not
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to bury it too deep because it’s hard to maintain but not to remove a lot of trees so where we
thought, Todd I don’t remember where.
Hoffman: Right along the back and then it’s going to be directionally bored from there up to.
Amy Bower: It just serves…so the compromise they came up with.
Hoffman: So the engineering staff, Hoisington-Koegler and then the developer’s engineer
worked on the siting for the sewer. Originally it was much higher up on the park and would have
been a 30 foot trench and in the future you know a sewer line’s going to have to be dug up at
some point and you would basically destroy much of this park to maintain that sewer line so we
pushed it down. Got it into a more appropriate location. Much of it is along that trail and so if
you needed access for maintenance you could access via that trail. And then the last piece we
worked with the applicant, the developer/applicant to directionally bore it so you don’t disturb
that mass of trees that goes through there and makes for a nicer trail experience as you walk this
neighborhood trail.
Daniel: Okay. Questions. Comments. I think obviously there’s, if you look at a proposed
motion, the name. Any concerns as far as activities. Anything’s on the board here I think.
Hoffman: And physical layout is important so we want your comments on the physical layout.
Facilities that you see there so we can fine tune this for you.
Cole Kelly: Again my concern is, and this one is more of a park where people are going to walk
to but 10 stalls seems kind of light to me. Are we trying not to take down trees, is that one of the
reasons or?
Hoffman: Just there’s no ballfield.
Cole Kelly: I understand that. And I’m not saying we need a big parking lot but.
Hoffman: Historically in this kind of setting 10 stalls is going to accommodate.
Cole Kelly: Okay. Majority.
Daniel: What does Curry Farms have?
Hoffman: Vast majority.
Daniel: Is that 10 or oh is that 8?
Hoffman: Might be 8 or 10. Sugarbush is very similar. Basically it’s moms and dads with kids
with strollers and younger ones that drive down to the playground or taking a walk into it but I
think it will accommodate and we have limited site here to expand. The other one.
Cole Kelly: We do, right.
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Daniel: If you’re really like where I live with Curry Farms. I mean you take away using the
open space I guess once in a while for practices on the little kiddie soccer. Outside of that.
Hoffman: Two cars.
Daniel: Two at the most.
Cole Kelly: Then it’s not an issue.
Daniel: Probably more popular in the winter for sledding. When they come over from other
neighborhoods.
Tom Kelly: I know as an adult I would really like that trail that goes through the wooded area. I
know as a teenager I would really like that trail that goes through the wooded area. You have
about 150 teenagers across the road in the Springfield neighborhood so I don’t know if that’s a
concern that you have or not.
Hoffman: No.
Tom Kelly: Okay. It wouldn’t be my son but it’d be all these other people.
Hoffman: A good opportunity for the leaders in that group to lead them in the right direction.
Scharfenberg: Tom, you can be the look out.
Daniel: Scott.
Wendt: No. I really like the design of the Riley Ridge Park. It’s kind what we were picturing I
think when we were talking about it all along so. Other than that, yeah I don’t know how many
parking spaces we could squeeze into the other one. What would make it worthwhile or not. I
mean even if you got four 8’s you know, that’s probably a guesstimate probably, or park along
the road if you know, for an event.
Cole Kelly: So Todd is this in the CIP yet?
Hoffman: No. The development is not. And Amy and her colleagues have, they’ve done some
cost estimating. From what I can see, I believe that we’ll be coming back once we get to that
point with doing a lot of this work in-house and we have the expertise and the ability on staff to
complete the majority of the work and then we can also act as the general contractor in the
project. And I think create an ability to complete both of these sites in a timely fashion. Once
the neighborhoods start to grow it’s difficult to see a wheat field which is intended to be a
neighborhood park and so we would like to work with the commission to hopefully facilitate
their development and I think we can do that in-house. And so then you’re starting to take a look
at costs like playgrounds and asphalt and you know instead of overall development. There’s you
know, not that we want to keep the job market any lower with the dirt movers but there’s a lot of,
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
that are involved in all that and we can do that stuff in-house. We have heavy equipment
operators. People that can build these parks and that is really the basis of our entire parks,
neighborhood park system. Most of them were built in-house.
Cole Kelly: Okay.
Hoffman: But no dollars are currently allocated in the CIP. You’ll be seeing that as a part of
this year’s CIP process we’ll start programming those dollars in. Or making recommendations to
the program…
Tom Kelly: I think a lesson, I know we’re years away from it but a lesson learned from
Bandimere that you may want to consider is, I’m not certain how useful a 2 through 5 play lot is
because the kids seem to always migrate to the big one anyway so I don’t know if you want to
put money into two separate lots or just put money into one bigger lot because I think, if I could
go back 5-6 years at Bandimere and maybe we wouldn’t put that second lot in.
Stolar: When we did the neighborhood parks, I think almost all of them said they didn’t want the
2 to 5. They wanted more money on the regular one.
Hoffman: I think we had one mention it tonight. Lake Susan is popular because you get enough
kids there. The younger ones want to migrate down or the parents to the smaller one but a
neighborhood park setting we don’t have quite that level of use. And it’s also a CPSC,
Consumer Product Safety Commission guideline and so as an agency we really should be taking
a look at that and at least challenging the commission to say this is a neighborhood that should or
should not have that type of facility.
Tom Kelly: Okay.
Ryan: I think it’s a, I have kids between those ages and I think it’s really nice to have that. The
frustration comes or the challenge comes is that they’re often put too far apart and so when you
have you know a child that’s 5 that may want to be, if you know he can play on the older
structure. The little one’s going to want to follow and you can’t have them at two different
places so I think the younger, you know the smaller age group would, it would get utilized more
if it was closer to the bigger facility.
Tom Kelly: One more question too about the other park. Not the one on the screen but the one
over at Pioneer. I realize a sledding hill isn’t as long as it is on Powers Hill but how does the
gradient of this proposed sledding hill compare to the one at Powers? Is it as steep?
Hoffman: It’s going to be similar.
Tom Kelly: Okay.
Hoffman: And the difference here is this is going to be a southwest facing slope which is going
to have more melting.
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Tom Kelly: Okay.
Stolar: A lot this year.
Hoffman: Power Hill is west. Ideal. The other one, the smaller hill is ideal. It’s facing north so.
And then we’re going to have to work with the runoff. The bottom runoff. The developer
already performed some of the grading and so we’re going to have to take a look at that and see
if we have to modify the grading so we have sufficient runoff at the bottom of this hill because it
doesn’t matter if you call it a sledding hill or not. Once you have a hill in a neighborhood park
or a community park site, it’s going to be a sledding hill so we want to make sure that we design
it and build it appropriately.
Ryan: And what kind of pond is it? Is it any kind of a visual.
Hoffman: It’s a storm water pond.
Ryan: Oh, okay.
Hoffman: The developer might try to dress it up but it’s a storm water pond.
Ryan: Would there be an opportunity to put a wooded path down to that or is there nothing to
really see down there? Down there with a bench or.
Amy Bower: Yeah the developer just grading, maxing out the ridge to it and…do you want
people just to look at it or do you want people to wander down there and get too closer to it.
Hoffman: Yeah I think the trails that we have there are appropriate for this kind of site. The one
on the road and then the other. It’s really a challenge to get down and back up that grade.
Amy Bower: Yeah I suppose up here you could see down but from here to here…
Hoffman: Straight down.
Ryan: Oh it is.
Scharfenberg: Regarding Pioneer Pass, I get the whole loop thing but Amy did you look at
potentially taking the loop and shortening it and bringing it more from the court to the south side
or north side of the court and coming that way? Just as a ball player with a trail running through
the middle of the outfield, sometimes if that, you know the field is used that way.
Amy Bower: Having this trail on the outfield?
Scharfenberg: Or just getting rid of that part of it and moving it way over to the.
Amy Bower: Just bringing it in?
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Scharfenberg: Right. That way. Was that something that you considered at all or?
Amy Bower: Yeah I think so that one time but then we didn’t want to mess up this kind of space
so it’s.
Scharfenberg: Okay.
Amy Bower: And I don’t know, having an edge to this helps just speeds up the ball right when it
hits… And you know offering people views over the hill too. And I don’t know 180, it’s a pretty
small…
Hoffman: Yeah, there’s not going to be a lot of kids there but to maximize that, if that trail stays
there to maximize that separation is what you would be after if it stayed there.
Scharfenberg: Yeah.
Stolar: There’s a question whether, given that’s all you want to do in 180 feet, is that the best
use of that piece of land or might that be something where you would have fields that you could
use for other purposes. I don’t think that’s finalized yet has it?
Hoffman: What would you schedule there?
Ruegemer: You know probably young age. Probably 8 or so or under. Girls softball would be
appropriate for that location. 180 feet is fairly standard for a youth sized field.
Scharfenberg: Youth size, okay.
Stolar: I guess that’s what we have over at the Rec Center.
Hoffman: And the scheduling would flip flop. I don’t think we would want to put, for both the
neighborhood and then the parking so if you scheduled Lacrosse or soccer on the open field you
would leave the ballfield open for the neighborhood so if somebody came down to fly a kite or
throw a Frisbee they’d have that space and vice versa so that would also play into the calculation
of how many stalls we would be looking at for the parking.
Stolar: So based on that usage the trail may not be an issue because it may be further out the
teams will be retrieving on other than ones that get past them.
Hoffman: At that age, yeah. A lot of them don’t make it that far.
Cole Kelly: So what we’re looking to approve tonight is the plans?
Hoffman: Concept plans.
Cole Kelly: Yeah, concept plans and any modifications that we think necessary.
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Hoffman: Correct.
Cole Kelly: I mean I like the plans how they look. At Pioneer Pass I think we should start out
though with the largest possible parking lot we can get. That’d be my opinion. Even at
Bandimere, which is a great, great facility. I’ve been there when there’s parking issues and no
matter what size we make the parking lot there’s going to be parking issues and I know that so
you look at it and say okay, what’s the biggest we can fit to make it, for it to make sense and then
we go with that and that’s what it is, would be my opinion.
Hoffman: Well I would think if we, the largest neighborhood parking lot we have would be, this
would be about it. We’re already at 20.
Stolar: What’s North Lotus?
Hoffman: Less than that. It’s close to this one.
Stolar: But you can park on both sides.
Hoffman: Yeah. 24 stalls. There’s a point of diminishing returns as well so 24-26 stalls is I
think where we would stay. Trying to bring that in at.
Stolar: The thing is there’s really short windows of time when you’re going to need that parking
and there’s a bunch of windows of time where you won’t.
Hoffman: Yeah, it’s just blank space.
Stolar: So figuring out that balance is going to be the tough part but I would say, you know how
is this in relation to the size of like Lotus? North Lotus Park. About the same acreage?
Hoffman: Slightly less.
Stolar: Slightly less.
Hoffman: About 3 acres less.
Stolar: So it would seem to me whatever we have over there. See I thought we had more. I
thought we had about 20 over there too.
Hoffman: We’ll have to count them up.
Ryan: I think we need to be cognizant of, this is a neighborhood park and not everybody is
involved in sports and coaching and what not and when we go to present this to the
neighborhood to say that we’re going to have a 26 stall parking lot that we’re going to invite you
know people from all around the community to come and utilize your park, you know some
people may not like, you know like having that so I think we still need to be mindful of that.
This is a neighborhood parking lot and you know to keep it within the scale of everything else.
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Daniel: I think going back to what Cole had said, the expansion of the parking lot. If it’s
feasible and if it makes sense and Elise I certainly have taken into consideration your same,
given the lack of open space that we do have though and the need for filling recreational needs,
20 stalls in my mind I think is a good. If we’re able to get a couple more stalls that’d be great.
Out of it. I think just you’re right, everything counts. I don’t know the parking structure on what
Bluff Creek Boulevard will contain and how much traffic there’s going to be there so that I don’t
know if it’s been studied or not but that’s certainly to take into consideration. The small 2 to 5
age park certainly I would say in the future is something that we may not necessarily need to
play for when we get to that point. My only other comment would be on Riley to make sure that
there’s no good humor on the park and recreation side of the business and you don’t put the
basketball hoop right next to the hill there. Just trust me, two boys who played down at Curry
Farms all the time, they’ll be walking all day long down that hill and missing. We’re almost
sending them out to the pond half the time so, but I think the overall layouts are taking advantage
of exactly what we have. I do like the loops and I think actually that little dip into the woods
there I think will be something very unique for a small neighborhood park. I don’t know if we
really have that in any of our parks. I mean as far as neighborhood parks are concerned. And
then with regards to the, as I mentioned the amenities that are going to be available over at
Pioneer Pass, they’re both going to be just fantastic so I think when we get to the point of
planning with CIP obviously you want to take into consideration, you’re right Todd. It’s just not
an open field right now. What are the amenities are going to be important that we can start
laying out, so they can start utilizing much sooner than later. Whether it be playground
equipment to the paths, or the trails I should say to the basketball courts, whatever it may be.
Hoffman: Yeah what you’re going to find in that process is it makes sense just about to
complete the entire site. There’s not a lot of steps that can be left out. Once you grade, mass
grade you know and fill. Once you start on asphalt you build the parking lot. You build the
trails. You build the basketball. It’s done. You grade the site. You seed it. You start planting
trees and so we’ll put a package together. One thing I do, can we put that Pioneer Pass? Are you
comfortable with that separation between that road and the playground? I hadn’t really thought
about that. I’d be interested to hear Amy’s comments on that and then the commission’s as well.
Daniel: What’s the distance from the, approximately? From the road to the edge of the
playground.
Amy Bower: …the way this trail and with kind of a trail separation.
Hoffman: 40 feet to the trail?
Amy Bower: So maybe 60, yeah.
Scharfenberg: So what is your concern Todd? That kids would run out towards the road?
Hoffman: My concern is the, yeah. The buffer distance for a parent to grab a kid and stuff. So
if there was some attraction on the road that the kid looked at and the playground and they
started going for the road or the trail, did the parent have the reaction time or should we try to,
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
are people comfortable with that? Bluff Creek Boulevard is going to be a busy road. It’s going
to be a major connector to Pioneer Boulevard and there’s going to be a large volume of traffic on
that road.
Daniel: I think if you start to move the orientation of what Amy has laid out, then we start
impacting the open field spot. We start impacting other areas. I mean I can see possibly where
you want to flip flop maybe the court would be, with the playground but then you’ve got other
issues with the basketball court.
Stolar: But with a basketball court it’s a little bit less of an issue. Well for some would.
Hoffman: It’d be older kids on the basketball court.
Stolar: Plus the other idea being able to see from the parking lot the kids on the play field if you
switch them around. You have better visibility. Whereas here you would, yeah I know it’s an
older kids playground but you don’t actually have visibility from the car to go back to the car.
Ryan: As well as parents that have their kids playing baseball you know.
Daniel: It’d be right there across the parking lot. That’s a very good point. Same with soccer,
lacrosse or whatever event they want to use for the other field. Maybe that’s something that we
would make a recommendation on is to have that, the playground and the court flip flop.
Hoffman: Amy what were your thoughts when you designed it?
Amy Bower: Oh, no that starts to make sense too because I know yeah if you have your kids and
you’re at an event, you want the playground nearby and that’d be quite a distance. It mainly was
just to keep this whole area more, with a more open field. I think at one time we had the court
over here.
Daniel: You can still maintain it based off the width. We’re just going, based off the width.
Still length wise we can go out a little bit further.
Stolar: Yeah, even if it doesn’t keep that open, there’s plenty of open space to either the left or
right of it so yeah. Plenty.
Ryan: And then you eliminate the actual 2 to 5 play area but maybe integrate some of the
structures onto one.
Hoffman: You can’t do that.
Ryan: Oh you can’t? Has to be totally separate?
Amy Bower: And then if I bring the picnic area down you know to this area too so it’s closer to
the playground…
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
Hoffman: Yeah that’s the, those guidelines mandate separated and if you do, either one or the
other or both but you cannot combine them.
Ryan: Okay.
Hoffman: It’s just too confusing for the parents when they use these. Visually obviously it’d be
very attractive. People would see that playground. I think you’re still going to be able to see it
on the other side of the parking lot if you choose to move it over there.
Daniel: Oh I think you would, yeah. I know for years now that, it’ll be years before those trees
really develop or mature so you’ll be able to see right through.
Hoffman: Yeah, and there’s enough separation there for a basketball. You can landscape it as
well to slow down, keep your balls off.
Daniel: I think that would be the, yeah. Put in shrubs or something or slight berm.
Hoffman: Are you comfortable with that?
Amy Bower: So putting the court over here, yes…
Daniel: I think the other thing you could do is, I mean you could put it certainly closer to the
parking lot as well.
Wendt: What size is that court shown there?
Amy Bower: 55 by 55.
Hoffman: And what do we, 50 by 50’s probably.
Ruegemer: Yeah, that sounds about right.
Tom Kelly: Is that a half court basketball or is that full court?
Hoffman: Half court.
Tom Kelly: So you could line the baskets so it’s, so missed shots wouldn’t go into the street.
Hoffman: Yeah, it’s a single basket, yeah. You play half court.
Amy Bower: Yeah, that would help. Play so…60 feet from the trail and stuff so.
Stolar: So on the bottom here, is that, is there a development over here at the bottom?
Hoffman: Oh huh. That’s Liberty at Bluff Creek. 300 some units.\
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
Stolar: And they have access over here through these.
Hoffman: Either through the main sidewalk or to that, the main trail or the single sidewalk
access point. The grades start to prohibit other access points as you move to the south.
Stolar: So it’s only these two right?
Hoffman: Yep.
Amy Bower: So those exist right now. The sidewalks… We’re proposing a connection into the
park.
Stolar: Because I was just going to say if you end up moving the playground here, if we end up
doing that, when we talk about this now eliminates this open field. Then Steve’s thought about, I
don’t know about necessarily getting rid of the one leg of the trail but you could have a trail
going through the playground. That way a family coming from here, goes over here. Walks in
and then goes straight to the playground. Through the trail system. Something to think about
also. If we do that other move.
Daniel: I would say based off the size of the development that is around both Pioneer Pass and
Liberty Heights, Liberty Heights just has a pool and that’s a community pool? That’s part of
their association fee?
Hoffman: Yeah I don’t know what.
Daniel: I don’t know if they have a park do they? Maybe a small playground or.
Hoffman: Pool and a little walking…
Daniel: Okay. Then you’re going to talk about a very popular park. So I mean that’s right at the
heart of their center between obviously the round about there but knowing the development
that’s, I think it’s going to be extremely popular.
Hoffman: They’re very excited. They will be well represented at your neighborhood meetings.
Daniel: So and I do think, you know I think everyone’s agreeing that we’re moving that park.
That we should move the playground. Separate behind the parking lot on the west side there.
Hoffman: Anything else on Pioneer Pass that you’re seeing? We’ll work, we’ll play with that
trail alignment as well. Those connections. People especially with strollers and really do like
that hard surface connection to those type of amenities. And moms.
Ryan: Yes we do.
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
Amy Bower: So I hear you switching the court over here and putting the playground more
central which really makes sense to me now that I think about it because with your kids out, they
want to be able to see the playground. And the parking lot, you deem that suitable for now?
Hoffman: Yeah, 24 to 26 I think is what we’ll look at and see if it fits. And then we’ll take a
look at some of the larger and do a calculation on, if you scheduled you know 10 cars per team
is.
Ruegemer: Little light.
Hoffman: Yeah.
Ruegemer: I’d say 24. Add 12.
Cole Kelly: If you say we’re going to have a large volume of traffic on Bluff Creek Boulevard
it’s even more important to try and fit a few more cars in there I think.
Hoffman: Yep, absolutely. Yeah the people that live out in the Degler developments are already
utilizing this. They’re very excited to have this second connection and the connection that’s
going to continue through this whole neighborhood over to Powers Boulevard eventually through
the Dorsey property, you know that could be 10-15 years so this is an important connector. Even
when those other, that other connection is made, this is going to continue to be a cut through
because people want to make their way over to 212 and this is a way they’re going to go.
Daniel: Alright Pioneer Pass, any other comments? Okay how about Riley Ridge Park?
Hoffman: It’s a tongue twister.
Daniel: It is. Pioneer Pass Park and Riley Ridge Park.
Ryan: I think we should again consider the, where the play area is in relation to the parking lot.
If that matters on this layout or not.
Stolar: Isn’t it an issue with the grade though because of the hill there.
Hoffman: Really what you’re working with is the only available and useable space.
Ryan: Okay.
Amy Bower: There’s a parking lot kind of a flat area and then 5% slope coming up to the flat
area and then everything’s kind of 5% maxed out and the intention here is to have to grade it and
have berms here and here to separate the playground more from any streets.
Daniel: What’s the distance from the parking lot approximately? Best guess. The playground.
Amy Bower: It’s about 60 also.
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
Daniel: From the parking lot itself? So probably about, maybe 100.
Amy Bower: Yeah.
Hoffman: Is there an opportunity to put it at the base of the hill there or not?
Amy Bower: Yeah, just move all.
Hoffman: Right here.
Amy Bower: We could have, you know the court would be at one layer and the playground at
another. Kind of you know plateaus.
Tom Kelly: Do you worry about runoff from water if you had the playground at the base of the
hill? Is it always going to be wet?
Hoffman: We have, could be a challenge depending on.
Amy Bower: Yeah this is still all up high and then sloping that way. So you’re saying you’d
like to see the playground…
Ryan: No I mean not that I, I don’t mind walking to a park certainly so just considering you
know moms carrying a lot of their things and you know making the back and forth from the
playground to the parking lot. Just something to consider. But if the grading doesn’t allow it
then I think that’s understandable in this situation as well.
Hoffman: You can throw your kid from the car to the playground.
Daniel: What we could do what we did at Curry just put it at the bottom of the field, at the
bottom of the hill down there. That’s one heck of a long time.
Ryan: I know.
Daniel: Okay. Any other comments or changes that you would want to propose or suggest or
discuss? Okay. If not why don’t we go ahead and motion to, or propose a motion for the
department’s suggestions to the City Council with the addition of the changes to Pioneer Pass
that we’ll list and I think those changes are change, flip flop the basketball court and playground
location and then evaluate the parking lot size of 24 spaces. Does that sound about right? Okay.
Someone want to go ahead and make that motion?
Wendt: So moved.
Cole Kelly: Second.
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
Wendt moved, Cole Kelly seconded that the Park and Recreation Commission recommend
that the City Council approve the proposed park concept plans for new neighborhood
parks to be located in “Reflections at Lake Riley” and “Pioneer Pass” with changes to
Pioneer Pass Park flip flopping the basketball court and playground locations and
evaluating the parking lot size of 24 spaces, and approving the park names of “Riley Ridge
Park” and “Pioneer Pass Park”. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously
with a vote of 7 to 0.
Daniel: Will that work Todd? Excellent. Alright, thank you Amy. I appreciate it.
CONSIDER 2011/2012 LAKE ANN PARK BEACH CONTRACT WITH MINNETONKA
COMMUNITY EDUCATION AND SERVICES.
Ruegemer: Thanks Chair Daniels. The City of Chanhassen has contracted with Minnetonka
Public Schools for the provision of lifeguard services at Lake Ann Park since the 70’s. 1970’s
with that so it’s been a long time. Have had a long, really great history with the Minnetonka
Public Schools. The City and Minnetonka have worked together to develop a new contract
format which I believe now is our third multi year contract. Or third contract of a multi year.
Hoffman: Arrangement.
Ruegemer: Arrangement. Thank you for that. The City Council definitely has endorsed kind of
this concept as well for a multi year. It really seems to be a really efficient way of doing the
contracting with that and we certainly endorse it as well. The, going through the last multi year
contract that was 2009-2010 contract years we did reduce at that time the service hours and the
duration of the dates and how long the beach was open during the course of the summer. That
certainly did lower costs without affecting or impacting our beach users so at that time we
dropped from the hours of 10:30 a.m. to 8:00 p.m. were the old hours and we did reduce those
from 11:00 to 7:00 and that didn’t really have any negative impact on our beach users and that
really was a, really a great way of doing that. In looking at the attached list of options, I’m
recommending that we take a look at Option A and that would essentially be the same contract
that we’ve had for the 2010 season with that. We’re going to take a look at that dollar amount,
the 2010 contract amount was $27,388. With the new proposal on the table for 2011 and 2012,
the contract amount increase $141 for basically the contract amount would stay the same for
2011 and 2012 so it seems to be a really good option for us for another 2 year contract to take
care of 2011 and 2012 so staff is recommending that the Park and Recreation Commission
recommend that the City Council approve the attached 2011/2012 Lake Ann Lifeguard Services
Contract with Minnetonka Public Schools. This contract includes providing lifeguard services 7
days per week from 11:00 a.m. to 7:00 p.m. The beaches will be open from June 11 through
thth
August 14, 2011 and June 9 through August 19, 2012. The contract fee is proposed to be at
$27,529 per year and that is consistent with Option A on the list of options. Funding for this
contract is included in the Lake Ann Park Operations budget for 2011 and will be again budgeted
in 2012.
Daniel: Okay. Jerry what do you mean by initially, the initial proposed 2011/2012 contract that
you enlisted here was $26,674 for 11 and 12?
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
Ruegemer: Yeah those were, you’re looking at the initial proposed. That’s kind of what I had
proposed to Minnetonka but that was really trying to reduce a little bit more at that point but
really kind of look at staffing levels. They had come back with Option A. Presented Option A
and a list of other options as well with that so really in looking at it we thought really
interrupting our kind of service levels that we’ve had out there in the past, it really did make a lot
of sense to go with Option A, in my opinion.
Daniel: Okay. Questions, comments.
Cole Kelly: Jerry I haven’t seen this before so I’m kind of curious. How’s it facilitated over at
Minnetonka? Who’s there, there’s a point person in charge. Do they hire their swimmers from
their team?
Ruegemer: There was, it since the last contract it was reorganized a little bit within the school
district. Tim Litfin used to be kind of our point contact person. He’s the Director of Community
Education and Services. They kind of reorganized everything now that all the aquatics now are
under Ben Bartell and Ben Bartell is the head coach I believe for the Minnetonka High School
team so he you know kind of takes, oversees that portion of the aquatics for the district and also
then their, the beach contracts now are also under his supervision as well. So and Ben reports to
Superintendent Peterson. So where they hire, yeah it’s the same pool of kids that they have had
in the past so there isn’t, really isn’t any changes other than kind of what opposite it comes from
at this point so.
Hoffman: Commission Kelly they lifeguard a variety of beaches in the south Minnetonka Lake
area.
Cole Kelly: Okay.
Hoffman: We contract with them. Other municipalities contract with them. Carver County
contracts with them for lifeguard service. Essentially we have no interest in $100,000 lifeguard
program underneath the City of Chanhassen Park and Rec and so we need to find a contract
service provider. This is a 35 year? 40 year?
Ruegemer: Yeah.
Hoffman: 35 year contract history with Minnetonka Community Education. For those that were
around, there was a split at some point and we stayed with them and the other service provider
has since gone out of business and so it’s been a tried and true value service. Lifeguards were
recommended for elimination at one point at Lake Ann as a service reduction, budget cutting
measure and the community spoke loud and clear that it was something that they valued. They
wanted to see, when they sent their 15 or 16 year old children down there after school in the
summer or in the summer that they had some supervision there.
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
Scharfenberg: And that was one of my questions Todd. I mean given the push back in some
aspects by the community about increasing things in the community and that, do you anticipate
any push back from the Council on this as a service?
Hoffman: I do not.
Scharfenberg: Okay. Because I think it is a wonderful service and the beaches and know that
there are people there that should people need, you know little kids and that that are watching
and taking care of that so I think it is a wonderful service that is provided.
Hoffman: Yeah I think the community considers it’s a good value.
Scharfenberg: Yeah.
Daniel: Okay. Scott any questions?
Wendt: No.
Daniel: Tom?
Tom Kelly: No.
Daniel: Alright. Why don’t we move ahead with the proposed motion.
Tom Kelly: I move to accept staff’s recommendation to approve a 2 year contract for Lake Ann
Park Beach Lifeguard Services with Minnetonka Public Schools in the amount of $27,529 per
year.
Wendt: Second.
Hoffman: We need to make sure that the City Council is in there.
Tom Kelly: Oh. Oh sorry.
Hoffman: Friendly amendment.
Tom Kelly: Friendly amendment, make sure the City Council’s in there. No okay, I’ll restate
the motion. I move to recommend to the City Council that, I move to recommend that the City
Council approve a two year contract for Lake Ann Park Beach Lifeguard services with
Minnetonka Public Schools in the amount of $27,529 per year.
Scharfenberg: Second.
Tom Kelly moved, Scharfenberg seconded that the Park and Recreation Commission
recommends that the City Council approve a two year contract for Lake Ann Park Beach
21
Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
Lifeguard services with Minnetonka Public Schools in the amount of $27,529 per year. All
voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 7 to 0.
RECOMMENDATION TO THE CITY COUNCIL CONCERNING PARK AND
RECREATION COMMISSION APPLICANTS.
Tom Kelly: Can I just start with the motion for that one? I’d like to move that the Park and Rec
Commission rank the six candidates for the City Council evaluation in the following order.
Steve Scharfenberg, Brent Carron, Matt Myers, Rick Shea, Glen Kaufmann, and then Peter
Aldritt.
Daniel: Alright. Second?
Wendt: I’ll second.
Tom Kelly moved, Wendt seconded that the Park and Rec Commission rank the six
candidates for the City Council evaluation in the following order:
1. Steve Scharfenberg
2. Brent Carron
3. Matthew Myers
4. Rick Shea
5. Glen Kaufmann
6. Peter Aldritt
All voted in favor, except Commissioner Scharfenberg who abstained, and the motion
carried unanimously with a vote of 6 to 0.
Daniel: Alright, thank you. Is there any other discussion on that? If not, I think we’ve already
talked about that earlier. Let’s just move on.
Cole Kelly: We voted. It’s too late for discussion.
Daniel: Just in case anybody had any comments.
Stolar: Actually someone in the majority can bring it up for consideration…
Daniel: Thank you Glenn. Alright.
Scharfenberg: If you voted with the majority.
Stolar: If you voted with the majority, it’s the only time you can bring it up for reconsideration.
Scharfenberg: Okay, fascinating. I should have known that.
Ryan: Steve, don’t start sweating over there.
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
Hoffman: Any one of you could bring it back up.
Daniel: Okay.
RECREATION PROGRAM REPORTS:
FEBRUARY FESTIVAL EVALUATION.
Daniel: Jerry, talk about the February Festival. The evaluation.
Ruegemer: Yeah first of all I’d like to thank all the commissioners that were present and that
partake in the wonderful event that we had down on the ice. Record numbers in terms of fish
and participation with that and a great day out there so, hopefully a good time was had by all.
We’re in the process of you know kind of going through everything and re-evaluating. John,
Dean Schmieg, our foreman and I met down on the ice last week or the week before. We kind of
went through kind of everything again and we’re going to re-lay things out a little bit differently.
We’re going to try to look at some on ice parking and have a parking lot out on the ice itself for
about roughly around 300 cars for that so working on that layout right now with our GIS person.
I kind of chicken scratched out the details on a map. She, Joleen Devens is putting all that
together for us right now and we hopefully will have that done here within the next week or so
and we’re going to re-orientate the horse loop a little bit and kind of move that over on the west
side of the tent versus the east side of the tent. Just to allow us some more room for kind of car
parking and other, that other kind of road that goes to the other part of the lake for people that are
non, or not fishing in the contest area and want to partake in a day of fishing out on the lake itself
so they’ll kind of drive right through our fishing contest area itself so we’re just going to, just
kind of re-orient everything just a little bit to the other side. Skating rink will stay in about the
same area but we’ll just kind of lay that out a little bit differently for that so just improve the
efficiency of the layout a little bit. We’re going to try to do a couple new things. Ice fishing
demo was new this year. Camp Tanadoona was out there…to the great turnout. They were
extremely pleased. We were happy to have another partner with the contest and the event itself
with that so they definitely are interested in coming back and we think it’d be a great thing for
them to come back. It was a great partnership that we’ve had with the camp. We’d certainly like
to you know kind of foster and grow that relationship in the last. Into the future. We had record
number ticket sales this year for fishing with that and you can see the total number. It’s 709
which is definitely up from last year. It’s interesting to see how many pre-tickets we had sold
and then how many tickets we sold on the day of so. A nice day. Warm day certainly helps in
that department so that’s great so you can kind of see the tendency of purchase there so.
Stolar: Last year we talked about potentially differing the price if you bought it ahead versus the
day of.
Ruegemer: Yeah, we used to do it that way when it initially started and.
Hoffman: It didn’t make a difference.
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
Ruegemer: Yeah. Yeah we used to have all kinds of different ticket pricing and kind of it is
what it is and it’s just less confusing to have one price so but with that but we had a lot of great
door prizes. You know we’re certainly going to tweak, tweak some things to better serve our
customers with the, a number of different things from ticket sales to computer printouts and
sorting and different things so we have a lot of different key people on that right now to make
sure that we have all those taken care of here for next year so. Thanks again for everybody that
was there that day. We couldn’t have done it without you and we look forward to having you to
participate again in the future.
Daniel: Well I will say Jerry it was a fantastic event. I mean year in and year out it’s one of my
favorite things, favorite events to go to with the City of Chanhassen and the fact that we had
record ticket sales, record number of people showing up and participating as well as record
number of fish caught.
Hoffman: Writers cramp. Writers cramp.
Daniel: That never ended, which was good to see. I mean I think the only fish lost was about 5.
That wasn’t bad given about the 300 fish that rolled through so that was fantastic. We even got
to see some nice big sized fish. I mean some northerns. Some nice size sunnies so I think the
most important thing is that everyone there seem to have a fantastic time. The weather was
perfect. Fishing was at least active and there was hope so. You know my only comment for
suggestion next year based off of that is, to give serious consideration to a video display board
for showing both results of the fishing contest. Kind of rotating between that and also the door
prizes. And if somehow if we can just, you know I don’t know what, I don’t know what they
consist of or what’s available and how expensive they are to rent but I think it would make sense
if we were going to integrate a computer with the program, somehow have a display out there
instead of constantly running out and people guessing because I think that was the one thing that
people always to know at the time. Where do I stand? What’s the biggest fish and I think that
really will create some interest. I think more importantly I think it will also draw people in
quicker more often into the vending areas and other areas too so I think that’s something to give
consideration is an active board display.
Hoffman: Daktronics comes to mind and we’ll check on the rental policy.
Stolar: See how cold it can get before it stops running.
Daniel: That certainly is something that we have to take into consideration.
Stolar: If you put it in the tent still you know again…you can actually have it as part of the tent.
That they have to walk in to see.
Daniel: Well again that’s going to open up all the, especially for the concession stands.
Culver’s. Boy Scouts. I mean everybody who participated and help support.
Wendt: Yeah thank you. We participated as full participants so I could not help but my dad
came down and there were 4 of us out fishing. It was a really good time. Didn’t catch anything
24
Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
unfortunately but sounds like we were… Yep, not a bite but it was really fun and like the idea
too to allow parking on the ice if that’s possible. It gets to be a ways, We had to trudge back to
the car once and it’s quite a ways back.
Hoffman: Yeah. Yep, that’s our desire is to move, minimize that walking distance. You have
winter gear on and those type of things. Buckets and gear.
Daniel: What was the previous concern about that. Is it just because, was it ice thickness?
Liability?
Hoffman: No it’s just, if the festival could be kept without parking on the ice, you know we
wanted to give that a try. It just keeps the arrangements a little bit simpler but yeah, if ice is not
14 inches or thicker we won’t be allowing on ice parking anyway.
Daniel: Hopefully that’s not a problem in February.
Hoffman: It hasn’t been. There’s been a couple years when it’s been close.
Ruegemer: Not very often though.
Hoffman: From time to time. Did you receive the Minnesota Park and Recreation magazine
with Feb Fest on the cover? Are you still receiving that as commissioners? And so Feb Fest was
highlighted as the Minnesota winter festival so I can’t help but think of Matthew Myers
comments about Chanhassen being recognized as one of the places to be so there it was on the
Minnesota Park and Rec magazine. Chan Feb Festival is one of the top things to do in the
winter. I’ll show it to you.
Stolar: Was it the most recent one?
Daniel: Is that the Park and Rec’s one?
Scharfenberg: No, I don’t think we get it because I don’t get it.
Daniel: I’m thinking Park and Rec’s.
Scharfenberg: Jerry gave me his copy because I.
Stolar: Which one is this?
Hoffman: It’s Minnesota Park and Recreation.
Wendt: We get the national one, yeah.
Hoffman: You get the other one. National magazine.
Wendt: Yeah.
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
Ruegemer: I think it was right in the center. If you open up the magazine right to the center
fold.
Hoffman: There it is.
Ryan: Oh wow.
Wendt: This picture here is Feb Fest.
Hoffman: Here it is. Oh, look it.
Ryan: Will you sign this? That’s very cool.
Daniel: Okay, any other questions or comments for Jerry?
Cole Kelly: Yeah, there were a lot more than 709 people out there. It was a great event and I
saw some of my neighbors out there who weren’t fishing just to come down and check it out and
all the different things that you can do. I made one suggestion to John. I took the February flyer
and I scanned it in and sent it out to a bunch of my buddies who are ice fishermen and it was of
course a little, too little too late by the time I did it but they were impressed just by seeing the
flyer they had and I suggested to John that at least you should email the commission and maybe
employees of the City so they can send it onto their friends and people they know who like to ice
fish because it is impressive what the City is doing and we all can just with a button forward it on
and that’s probably better marketing that we’re going to get anywhere else you know other than
obviously magazines like this are a great help.
Wendt: And post it on Facebook I think.
Daniel: Again based on this year’s attendance obviously whatever the City is doing and word of
mouth and I think it’ll start to expand. We won’t be as big as Brainerd someday but.
Hoffman: We hope not.
Daniel: I don’t know if the lake can handle that but nonetheless glad to see it’s extremely
popular. I think weather certainly did help this year. I don’t know if we’d have that attendance
when like a couple years prior when it was about minus 5. Still nonetheless the diehards showed
up and again everyone had fun.
Hoffman: And we’re also happy we’re not the Alexandria Sportsmen. They didn’t catch a
single fish. 1,200 participants paid $35 bucks a piece and they sent them home without their
money because due to gaming laws you have to keep it. You can’t draw for it. You can’t give it
out. They had moved the lake. One of the Chairs of the event said it makes sense to move this
downtown so they moved it to a lake just north of Alexandria to keep the people closer to town
so they’d spend their money in town. Unfortunately that lake is almost void of fish. Apparently
there was one northern that was almost reeled in and brought out of the hole but broke off before
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
they got the fish out of the water. That would have been a $10,000 fish. First prize was $10,000
so there was zero prizes claimed. That would be a tough day. They were catching a lot of heat
up there. And what they said is next year they’re just going to double the prizes so next year
they’ll have record attendance.
Ryan: What lake was it on recently where the kids were ice fishing and the guy came up who
was diving? What lake was that?
Scharfenberg: That was Waconia.
Hoffman: Waconia.
Scharfenberg: Yeah.
Ryan: Luckily you didn’t have that.
Hoffman: Almost gave the guy a heart attack. Shoved his hand up into the fish house.
Tom Kelly: Wasn’t a case last year we had it at Lake Susan no fish were caught? Which maybe
why it was the last year.
Hoffman: …no fish. Maybe 5 fish.
Ruegemer: It wasn’t very many. Not that much.
Hoffman: That’s why it was moved.
Tom Kelly: Yep.
Daniel: There’s an abundance of small, point one ounce perch that you can catch at Lake Ann.
That I can guarantee you. Alright, thank you Jerry and again I want to congratulate the staff and
everyone involved in and that helped participate because it was just another great event signature
for the City. Let’s move on.
DADDY/DAUGHTER DATE NIGHT EVALUATION.
Ruegemer: Had that last couple, last weekend here. Had 63 couples attend for the two nights for
that and a really nice turnout for that. Just a lot of the same amenities you know with the
dancing and the games and activities. Just a fun night for daughters and their dads to get
together. Get dressed up and go out for a fun night at the Chan Rec Center for that. Had a lot of
the same things with the face painting and you know different portraits being taken by the
photographer and that sort of thing here so, you know it seemed like it was nice to move it. We
used to do it on a Thursday-Friday and we kind of moved it now to Friday and Saturday nights.
Seemed like attendance has been fairly good with that move with that so you know just keep
looking for different ways to you know improve different things. Whether you know have
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
different meal packages or we’ve had a wide variety of meals through the years from you know
chicken and potatoes to spaghetti to finger food to a lot of different things so.
Hoffman: How’d that spaghetti go?
Ruegemer: Not very good. So we think we’re going in the right direction at this point with that
so, but it just continues to be a fun event. Started many, many years ago. Probably the early to
mid 90’s with that so it’s been a popular event and we look to continue it again into the future
here so.
Hoffman: The dads, the moms really like this event.
Daniel: Any questions for Jerry? Comments. Anybody go this year?
Hoffman: The mayor.
Daniel: Well wonderful. Alright. Thanks again Jerry.
CHANJAM ’11 PREVIEW.
Ruegemer: Yeah just an update for the commission. The event date will certainly be Friday,
th
March 18. That’s oh roughly about a month earlier than previous years with that just with you
know spring break schedules for all the different schools and that sort of thing. We did move it
up roughly about a month here with that so. Getting you know bands interested and that. Eric
Sawyer with the high schools has been extremely involved with that this year and he’s been
bringing a lot of really great things to the table with recording time and information to go to
camps and scholarships for the winners and it’s going to be a great event for that. Posters are out
in the schools already for that so we’re going to change the, I think go to kind of more of a panel
judging system along with some other things. The applause meter will be a portion of that but
the focus I think will be on the judges for that. Working on a number of celebrities and
community members to be part of that panel at this point so it should be a fun event again. We
certainly are going to tie in the food shelf. I know we talked about that as a commission I think
last year as part of some goals that we had and I am certainly encouraging people to bring a non-
perishable food item and they will get kind of a break at the door. You know save a little bit of
money if they would do that so it seems to be popular. People certainly do bring some food
items to that and it’s a great way to kind of give back to our community as well with that so.
Purely information at this point. Please feel free to stop by. There’s a lot of talented kids out
there and a lot of them have really good stage presence already for being high school aged kids
and extremely talented so come on out that night.
Daniel: I had an opportunity to go last year and it was fun. I think some of the ears are still
bleeding from last… Yeah it was a good time and again you have some talent. Really a diversity
of music as well which was good to see. Alright.
ADMINISTRATIVE PRESENTATIONS:
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
Hoffman: This will be the second year that the Environmental Commission would like to work
with the park commission to plant trees on Arbor Day at Lake Ann and fields number 3 and 4
will be ringed with new trees. Field number 3 will necessitate taking every other ash tree that is
currently there and replacing those with new trees and Field 4 will be replacing trees that are,
putting trees inbetween the ones that are currently there. They have a wider spacing and they are
all ash trees as well. The commission, the Environmental Commission would like to invite as
th
many commissioners, a couple of commissioners at least to their Wednesday, April 13 meeting
at 6:00 p.m. To sit down with them and work out the details for this exciting day. I know last
year we had Steve there speaking on behalf of the Park and Recreation Commission. Thank you
for doing that and it turned out to be a very successful project and really it’s a transformation
from the old Arbor Day celebration which was right here at City Hall and the Environmental
Commission felt it was important to get actual people on the ground planting trees in the
community and so they’ve changed it last year. It seemed to be very successful so looking for a
couple volunteers for that assignment.
Cole Kelly: When is Arbor Day?
thth
Hoffman: Arbor Day is May 7. Well the event is May 7.
Cole Kelly: That’s what I meant, yeah.
thth
Hoffman: Yeah. May 7. Saturday, May 7. It’ll be in the morning.
Wendt: It was cold last year.
Hoffman: It was cold and rainy.
Ryan: I’d be happy to volunteer.
Hoffman: Thank you.
Daniel: Maybe I can attend as well.
Hoffman: Okay. Elise and Jeff, thank you. We’ll send you a reminder.
Daniel: Thank you. Alright. And then tour dates.
Hoffman: I’d like to talk, I was thinking March but it sounds like there may be some
commissioners gone that day so maybe take a look at April. What I’d like to take the
commission on is some tours of all of the different components that you see here in the
chambers. The Rec Center, public works and then our senior center but you’re going to meet
some of the people that actually do the on the ground work so tonight when we’re talking about
field maintenance you’re going to get the chance to stand around a lawn mower that does all that
beautiful lawn moving and talk to the operator. Meet some of the people behind the scenes at the
Rec Center that really make the facility run on a day to day basis. So this would be our meet and
greet tours just before your meetings on those particular days. We’ll wrap a meal into those and
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
so it would be April for the Rec Center, June for the senior center and September for public
works. And those are the dates that you’ll also see those folks. I’ll send you a reminder so you
can schedule those.
Daniel: What was public works, August?
Hoffman: September. Public works.
Ryan: And June the senior?
Hoffman: June the senior center right here and then April we’ll go to the Rec Center.
Daniel: That’s a great idea.
Hoffman: Really meet some of the behind the scenes, get to talk with some of the folks that are
actually making it happen on a daily basis.
Daniel: Now at the public works do we get an opportunity to drive the ground masters.
Hoffman: Absolutely. You’re over 18. We’ll train you.
Daniel: That’s my retirement job.
Hoffman: And it’s interesting. Our lawn mower, the crew that we have, they’ve been mowing
lawn here, I hate to estimate. Over 10 years.
Ruegemer: Yeah, 10 plus years.
Hoffman: These are gentlemen that when they get on a lawnmower in the spring they know
where they’re going. They’ve been there before. They’ve been there a hundred times before and
they really take great pride in what they do and we hear about it. We hear about when things are
not going well. We hear about it when we’ve allowed teams on the fields when they’ve been wet
because they take pride in what they see and when they can’t perform and they can’t because you
know schedulers, administrators have done things to harm what they’re out there on a daily basis
so that interaction is important to us and so you’re going to get a chance to meet some of those
people.
Daniel: Excellent. Okay. Alright, Elise.
COMMISSION MEMBER PRESENTATIONS.
Ryan: Actually before I do the Red Birds, what happens with like the people that came to
interview tonight and then they didn’t make the cut or whatever. Do we?
Hoffman: They get a thank you letter.
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
Ryan: Okay, from you or?
Hoffman: The City Council. The Mayor.
Ryan: Okay, because I’m a big believer in following up and thank you notes and I think it would
be a, you know they took the time to come to us. I think it’d be a nice gesture to send them an
email or write them a note or a letter, whatever coming from this commission thanking them for
their interest you know in pursuing the commission and I don’t know if that’s all the time.
Hoffman: It’s all taken care of.
Ryan: It is.
Hoffman: Yep. The letter, the mayor thanks them for coming to the commission’s interview and
thanks them for participating in the process.
Ryan: Okay. So nothing separate is needed.
Hoffman: No. Or probably not appropriate. The mayor takes.
Ryan: You don’t want to trump the mayor. Oh I see how that works.
Stolar: …more than one commission meeting. It’s all on the same.
Hoffman: It’s all noted, yeah.
Stolar: Yeah, it’s all noted.
Ryan: Alright, perfect. Onto Red Birds. Let me preface this by saying that I’ve taken a, I’m
still going to be involved but I’ve taken a little bit step back from my involvement on the weekly
meetings just because of my involvement with a few other things but I’m still going to be
involved in doing a lot of their writing and marketing and you know some of the support services
that they need. That they don’t have really the time or you know the resources to you know have
somebody do it for them so I’ve offered to you know continue to be involved and help however I
can with you know that function as well as whenever I’m around to you know participate in the
different events so I want to preface it by that so if there’s anybody on the commission that wants
to you know step up and be involved on a you know more serious basis, I know they’re always
looking and welcome for volunteers as part of the Red Bird’s Board and then they’re also
looking for, they’re going to be doing some fundraising on you know helping raise money for
field maintenance and if you are good at fundraising, they’re looking for people that are, would
be helpful you know kind of raising some funds to maintain the field so it’s up to what they’re
hoping to have it at so that’s kind of the beginning but they are, the planning is definitely under
way. The schedule is made. They have almost double the amount of games that they had last
year so they’ve, you know people have really taken an interest to come and play at our facility
and play against our guys so they’re very excited about you know a longer schedule and really
trying to make some headway with some more wins. But prior to that, back to the fundraising
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
piece. They’re going to be hosting a Chanhassen Red Birds fundraiser. It’s called a Red Birds
th
Rally and it’s going to be held on April 9 and it will be at the Legion from 7:00 to 9:00 and
they’re going to do some give away’s. Obviously there’s tickets. Right now they have it at $20
a ticket which includes meal, drink ticket and a raffle ticket. They’re contacting the sponsors
that we had last year asking for donations. Again if you know anybody that’d be willing to
donate for this fundraiser you can certainly pass them my way or Todd’s or Terry’s or whoever
you have, you know easiest for you to contact and then you know make a donation for the silent
auction that they’re going to have there so more information’s going to come out in the Villager
and I will keep updating you, you know at the, well I won’t be at the next meeting but I’ll send it
to Todd and send it out to you guys as I get more information so you know they really need to
raise some money not only for the field but also some of the you know just the upfront cost that
they’re faced with when starting still only in the second year of running this team so they’re
pretty excited. You know Denny complimented, Councilman Laufenburger is on, has been very
active and has been a huge asset to the Board this year so it’s nice to have somebody from the
council involved in the Red Birds just helping to you know to promote it and get the word out in
the community so they wanted, they had asked me to mention it tonight and if you have any
further questions or suggestions, please direct them my way. Thank you.
Daniel: I’d say Elise, if there’s any information via email forward to all of us.
Ryan: Alright, great. Thank you.
Scharfenberg: Elise are they looking to do similar for ticket sales that they had last year? A lot
of it I know buy the family pass and that.
Ryan: Yes. Yes. And I’m sure same pricing but they’re going to do a lot more promoting.
Kind of the upfront pre-sale, ticket sales, family passes and what not so they’re, I think they’re
working on currently some restructuring to make it a little bit easier for the package deal.
Scharfenberg: I don’t know if any of you are fans of the Chaska Cubs but I was over at the Rec
Center the other day, or the community center and there’s a big proposal there with the
community and their park and rec department about expanding the park or making some
additions and amenities for that so if you’re interested in that I know they have some stuff up at
the community center about that.
Daniel: First build a big dike around the outfield lawn. It’d solve most the problem.
Hoffman: A mini dike is a part of the plan.
Daniel: Is it?
Hoffman: It’s not as high as the major dike there but it’ll handle 8 out of 10 floods.
Daniel: Well perfect. Nothing like playing all your spring games away. Had to deal with that
for 2 seasons.
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Park and Recreation Commission - February 22, 2011
Hoffman: Might be dealing with it this spring.
Daniel: Okay. Well thank you Elise. Appreciate the update and again thank you for working
with the Red Birds.
Ryan: You’re welcome.
Daniel: Alright, is there anything Todd you want to point out in the administrative packet at all?
If not, I want to make sure we got everything covered here. Commission member presentations.
We covered administrative packet. Why don’t we move onto adjournment.
Scharfenberg moved, Tom Kelly seconded to adjourn the meeting. All voted in favor and
the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 7 to 0. The Park and Recreation
Commission meeting was adjourned.
Submitted by Todd Hoffman
Park and Rec Director
Prepared by Nann Opheim
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