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PRC 2012 07 24CHANHASSEN PARK AND RECREATION COMMISSION REGULAR MEETING JULY 24, 2012 Chairman Scharfenberg called the meeting to order at 7:30 p.m. MEMBERS PRESENT: Steve Scharfenberg, Cole Kelly, Tom Kelly, Elise Ryan, Brent Carron, and Jim Boettcher MEMBERS ABSENT: Peter Aldritt STAFF PRESENT: Todd Hoffman, Park and Rec Director; Jerry Ruegemer, Recreation Superintendent; and Mitch Johnson, Recreation Supervisor ELECTION OF CHAIR AND VICE CHAIR. Scharfenberg: We have nominations for Chairman. We will entertain nominations for Chairman. Cole Kelly: I'll nominate myself. Tom Kelly: I'll second. Scharfenberg: Any discussion? Cole Kelly moved, Tom Kelly seconded to elect Cole Kelly as Chairman of the Park and Recreation Commission. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 6 to 0. Carron: Tough competition. Cole Kelly: It was real tough out there. First of all since I wasn't here last week I'd like to welcome Jim to the board. Tom Kelly: Thank you. Cole Kelly: And then secondly we need to move on and have nominations for approval of a vice chair. It's open for nominations. Carron: I'll nominate Tom. Ryan: I'll second. Cole Kelly: Any other nominations? Carron: Steve are you interested? Scharfenberg: Nope, I'm not. Cole Kelly: Okay, at this point there are no other nominations. We'll take a vote. Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 Carron moved, Ryan seconded to elect Tom Kelly as Vice Chairman of the Park and Recreation Commission. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 6 to 0. PUBLIC ANNOUNCEMENTS: Cole Kelly: Next, do we have any public announcements tonight? Hoffman: Last evening at the City Council they approved the award of the skate park... so we've been working with them... and also the award for the asphalt both for the skate park and the... When you're watching the asphalt go in, they're going to take down all the fencing. Take down the bottom boards of the hockey rinks so we get a nice even, uniform surface all the way across. That's a 200 by 200 foot path there and we wanted asphalt... so if you don't take the fences down, if you don't take the boards off then you're going to have, the boards... We think it's worth taking extra investment and time and labor to take those off. We'll be cutting the bottom off and afterwards... Carron: It's just an overlay then? Hoffman: Yep. Carron: Thanks Jerry. VISITOR PRESENTATIONS: None. APPROVAL OF MINUTES: Hoffman: Those were abbreviated minutes due to the, there was a button that was off in the council room so, in the recording room so you'll see verbatim minutes coming back after this. Carron: Motion to, well. Cole Kelly: We don't need a motion. I think we just approve them right? Hoffman: Motion to approve and motion to second, yep. Carron: Make a motion to approve the Minutes. Tom Kelly: Second. Carron moved, Tom Kelly seconded to approve the summary Minutes of the Park and Recreation Commission meeting dated June 26, 2012 as presented. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 6 to 0. RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF 86,039 S.F. OF PERMANENT EASEMENT TO THE STATE OF MINNESOTA, BANDIMERE COMMUNITY PARK, TH 101 IMPROVEMENT PROJECT. Hoffman: Thank you Chair Kelly. I've got to remember who we're talking to now, members of the commission. This is part of the Highway 101 project and it includes some land transfer at Bandimere Community Park. Basically I think all of you can visualize the road. It's going to be straighten out a little bit east to west and up and down and one of those curves is right on the outside of the ballfield at Bandimere Park. So the existing entrance is here at Bandimere. These are the ballfields, are we labeled 1, 2, 3 this way Jerry or the other way? Is this one? Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 Ruegemer: That is the furthest, yep. That's one Hoffman: Ballfield 1 and then 2 and 3. Baseball, softball and the pink area, all the shaded area is the land that will go back to the State of Minnesota and then eventually to Carver County so this is a state highway that is being improved and then it will be turned back to Carver County. Carver County requires that all right -of -way be permanent easement or permanent right -of -way so that will be transferred first to the State and then eventually the State will take all of the road back or give all of the road back to the County. In the early conversations we were going to be compensated for this but then with the new entryway into the park and the acquisition of the front lot, it simply became a trade situation with the State and then eventually the County and so for the State acquiring and paying for the front parcel of the Nettesheim's and then constructing the new entrance road, closing off the old entrance road, we will be giving this land to the project free of charge so I think it's a very good situation for us to be in. We're not losing any utility of the park. It will change the aesthetics of that particular area a little bit, especially as you walk on that trail. You know it's the outside of a ballpark so there's not a lot of activity there but the people that use that trail they're probably going to have a pretty good view because there's very little room between you and about a oh 16 foot retaining wall that will go down. It will be fenced on the top and then you'll have a retaining wall going down to the highway at that location. So that's how it will feel at this particular location. In the initial acquisition of Bandimere Park we knew this was going to be one of those situations that was going to happen. In fact the County approached us at that time and tried to negotiate with us to give us, to have us give them that land at that point for the future road but we said we'll just, we'd rather go ahead and build the park and wait for the future project and so now some 15 years later so we're at that point. So with the park commission's recommendation and blessing the City Council will take this up as a matter of business as a part of this road project and decide if they want to give this land to the State of Minnesota for this roadway. Ryan: I have a quick question, not in regards directly to this but when they start construction on the road how will that affect the park being open or scheduling of games? Hoffman: There'll be some inconvenience but it won't affect the scheduling of the park at all. So the first phase of the construction will start right on the north end and the State will shut down, or the contractor will shut down the road just north of the existing access and they will build all this new access road. They'll build all this new access road into the park and so at that time if you're coming from northern Chanhassen you'll have to loop around on Powers Boulevard. Go down to Pioneer and then come back up into the park from the south so that will happen for a few months until this new access road is completed. Then they will move the shut down and you'll start accessing from the north then and they'll move the shut down into this location. Ryan: At no time will there ever be no access? Hoffman: The park will never be closed, yep. And that's not always a guarantee in these construction projects so we're actually pretty lucky to be in this situation that we're moving that access point and there is the availability to have full access at all time. There'll be construction going on in the park, or adjacent to the park I should say most of the time or much of the time at least in Phase I and Phase II, but that won't hinder the activities going on in the park. Tom Kelly: Is that retaining wall going to span the entire shaded pink area? Hoffman: No. Tom Kelly: Okay. Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 Hoffman: You can see, I think an underlying dark line in there. That's the wall right here Tom Kelly: Okay. Hoffman: Then on top of the wall will be a fence and so that's the extent of that wall. There'll also be some fairly large walls right in this area to accommodate the trail that needs to go downhill to get to the box underpass so you'll see some retaining walls in this area as well as you drive around. And so these parking lots become a little bit closer to the front and then it kind of almost reverses the plan and then these parking lots, the larger parking lots, it starts to feel a little bit more like Lake Ann where you have to drive you know down through some parking areas or some park roads to get to the parking lots. Tom Kelly: And it looks like too, part of the parcel that we're giving to the State cuts the trail that links the park down to old 101. Will that still remain open and still be a viable link? Hoffman: It will remain open and what we'll do then is we'll acquire back an easement at this location for that trail connection as a part of that so this will remain open. It's shifting and being rebuilt to that point. Tom Kelly: Okay Hoffman: And again in the original design the trail, we knew the trail would never be able to be accommodated down on Highway 101 and so we brought it up into the park and we knew that would be the future plan so this trail coming off of the highway into the park has always been the plan. But then there'll be a second trail on the west side all the way north to south. There was some push back from the State, especially their waters and natural resources people that there is going to be an impact to the wetland in the west and so we had to validate that health and safety, quality of life access. Being able to travel. Used it as a work to the parks and as a route to work and other things and so the general guide plan, if you can visualize this area of the town is you have this large 35 acre and growing active park here and over here in the Fox Woods you've got a 35 acre and growing nature preserve. You're going to have vibrant neighborhoods both, on both sides of the road but they're going to have to go to the other side of the road to get to the kind of park that they want to use at that particular time so if you're on the Bandimere side and you want to get over to a nature park you're going to have to walk underneath and up and down 101 so we want to make sure that those pedestrian improvements are all installed and available for those residents to do that. The State pushed hard to try to eliminate that west trail but then that just really throws a wrench into everything. There would be no real purpose then for the underpass because you couldn't access it from the west side. You couldn't get there and so they stuck with the plan and they'll build both of those trails. Cole Kelly: Any other questions or comments? Anyone looking to make a motion? Carron: I'll make a motion to recommend to the City Council that we authorize transfer of the 86,000 square feet of permanent easement for the Trunk Highway 101 project. Cole Kelly: Is there a second? Boettcher: Second. Cole Kelly: Any more, now we've got a motion on the floor. Any comments? Questions on the motion? Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 Carron moved, Boettcher seconded that the Park and Recreation Commission recommends that the City Council authorize the transfer of 86,039 square feet of permanent easement to the State of Minnesota at Bandimere Community Park to accommodate the improvement of TH 101. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 6 to 0. COMMISSIONER DISCUSSION /RECOMMENDATIONS CONCERNING 2013 THROUGH 2017 PARK AND TRAIL ACQUISITION AND DEVELOPMENT CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PROGRAM (CIP) PROJECTS. Hoffman: Chair Kelly and members of the Commission, this is really your work session tonight and so I sent some notes, did everyone get the notes towards the end of the day or the middle of the day? I want to make sure everybody's got that information so Commissioner Scharfenberg asked for the spread sheet which we emailed. If you don't have a copy we'll provide you a copy, and then we also talked via email and by phone about what would be the cost of the Rice Marsh Lake trail. Again a conservative estimate on the upper end is about $400,000. There's quite a bit of trail there and so it's going to take some planning. Basically you get into the real cost when you start crossing waterways and those type of things so with planning, consulting, engineering I think $400,000 would cover that entire trail segment. And then the other question was about, we had the big bump in income in 2011 and that was that $647,000 transfer back to the park fund from the Lyman Boulevard project. If you remember the history on the Lyman Boulevard trail project and road improvement project, it was a difficult negotiation with the County and others to get that project funded and so the council tapped the park fund for a pretty significant chunk of money to make those pedestrian improvements happen. When the project finally was closed out after about 3 years they had the money available to pay for those pedestrian improvements with other funds so they transferred back that $647,000 in park funds into the park dedication fund so that's why you saw that big bump there. So if you do the math we really only made about $100,000 more or less that particular day, or that particular year and we've been estimating about $200,000 so I think we're still you know probably in a little bit on the high side depending on how you think development's going to come in. The other things that you need to consider when you're looking at income is we didn't take any income on Pioneer Pass. We didn't take an income on the Lake Riley development and so Riley Ridge Park development so we're really pretty full up in our parks and we think development's going to start off again and then we can start to collect some more park dedication fees and so that $ 200,000 number is going to come into play here shortly. So staff will be here to answer questions. Get you any information you need to have. We're interested in allowing the commission to prepare some recommendations for those years needed. Out 5 years and I'm not sure if it's getting harder or easier because the budget is going down but maybe a little of both so Cole I'll leave it up to you. Cole Kelly: Todd does the City have some recommendations, especially on the Riley Ridge, moving that from one year to the next because of how fast the development is growing? Hoffman: We do. We talked about it as a need that we would need to make a recommendation to pull that money from 2013, or where is today? Cole Kelly: It's 2014 right now. Hoffman: 2014, yep. Up to 2013 and to start those improvements next year. We've already got the parking lot in place. When Pioneer Pass and Riley Ridge came on board we really thought Pioneer Pass was going to be in the lead and now it's just switched so we're investing more money in Riley Ridge right now than we are in Pioneer Pass but I think both of those parks are pretty well positioned to happen in 2013. We continue to take probably weekly calls from residents inquiring. A lot of residents have heard our schedule and so 2013 would be a good time table for both of those. And those budget numbers that you see then, that's a tight budget. Those are not luxurious budget amounts. And in fact when we Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 worked with our consultant on the park plans they would estimate if you just went out to bid that project it would be at least twice that amount and probably more than that so we're just going to build them as the general contractor and we'll farm everything out and utilize the neighborhood labor for the playground installation so that saves about 10 grand in that particular item so we're hoping to get everything done that we have in the first phase but if we run out we'll just have to come back in a future year and put some of those things in. The two items I think that, if you remember the park plans, that probably won't happen right off the bat are those little gazebos so there's little neighborhood gazebos and those won't go in in the first round. Tom Kelly: If I can ask, what's the $180,000 difference between the two parks? I'm assuming we're giving the residents of both areas the same allotment of money for playground equipment. Is that true or not? Hoffman: No, it may not be true because the one is much larger so they've got a larger site in Pioneer Pass. It's just a larger park overall. There's a ballfield there. There's no ballfield at the other one so you need fencing and you've got a 4 acre park and an 8.7 acre park so Pioneer Pass will, it's larger and it will probably be a little bit more established and built out by the time it's all said and done. Ryan: Todd, do you have an extra copy of the... Hoffman: Yep. I'll go grab it. The spread sheet. (There was a short break in the meeting at this point.) Cole Kelly: Todd, does the City have any other recommendations other than the change we discussed about Riley Ridge for any other changes that you're looking for or something that might be coming to pass that we haven't heard or something that's not coming to pass that we have listed here? Hoffman: I think everyone's aware the Rice Marsh trail opportunity is here. Eden Prairie has completed two segments and they said if we get our segment to our border they'll complete the final segment and make that final connection. And then the pedestrian trail at the Arboretum is 275 and that's just a match in 2015. That project is over a million to do a pedestrian trail at the Arboretum and underpass at 41 just south of Highway 5. We have a grant out right now for that and we have two grants out for that one at the federal level and that is the trail to the Arboretum and then the trail down Bluff Creek Trail to the trail head. That one didn't score very well at all. This other one is in the running but it's at about the 50% mark and so that money should probably stay around at least for the meantime until we find out if that grant went through, and if it doesn't go through but it was close we'll go ahead and rush up that grant application and reapply again. That's another important trail connection if we can get underneath Highway 41 and get into the Arboretum, especially in lieu of the picture which we sent you today about the box culvert on the west side so. And beyond that everything else that is on here is pretty well set. The Chanhassen Nature Preserve trail final phase, that's $90,000 in 2016. That's a place holder and that may move around. That's based on the development contract for the final lot. If you know where the Maniac building is up near Lifetime Fitness, Century Boulevard. Once that lot is sold and they start building a building, that trips the development contract and it says you have to build this trail for us. We'll pay you approximately $90,000 for gravel and asphalt to build this trail but as you do your grading and so that one needs to stay there and it may move, slide back and forth. Trees and picnic tables and miscellaneous. There's really nothing else on this list that is going to move around or come and go. Cole Kelly: So the $10,000 for the picnic tables and park benches, that's a reasonable number still? Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 Hoffman: Yeah and it's not used every year but it's also utilized to purchase memorial benches which there's 2 or 3 or 4 a year and so that's $2,000 or $3,000 a year we're purchasing and then we're putting money back into the fund as those payments come in. It's $1,000 a bench. And then we're replacing tables that get broken and so it's a reasonable number. We don't always spend it up to that level and then trees, we're investing. That's bounced around. It was up to $30,000 and now it's back down to $15,000. Scharfenberg: Todd, when the road work is done on Lyman from Audubon east, and I think that's what, scheduled for next year? Are we anticipating that there'll be any funds needed? Any park and rec funds needed for trails with respect to that? I thought we had some money in when we did the previous project. Hoffman: Yep. Scharfenberg: And so are we going to be looked at for money with respect to that building? Hoffman: Not that I'm aware of and that's coming in 2014 so the section of Lyman between Galpin and Powers is 2014 and it's, I think the thought process there is similar to you know, we access the park fund when we did that middle segment because funding was just tight and then when they ended up not needing it they gave it back to the park fund and so there's been no discussion to date that that trail on the north side is going to be accessed or built with park fund money. I think it's going to be built with road money. There is one item in here, there's a matching fund, it's PK &T -083. Bluff Creek Drive gap trail. That has $75,000 in the same year as the other one and that's just a matching fund amount and so that $75,000 will not be used in 2015. That scored very low. It's a nice trail project but it's just not going to score in a grant process so that section of trail, it's on the bottom side of Bluff Creek trail is just going to have to wait until the park fund firms up or some other funding source comes forward. And that's a tight spot. You know unfortunately we're down to a half a dozen trail segments that that's a tight spot. People are using it and they have to drive in the driving lane and there is no room. If you walk, bike, if you're not in a vehicle and you're in the driving lane, everybody else has got to move over one lane so. Carron: Todd what about with the project there at Bandimere, I saw that they were going to be taking down some trees. Are we going to have to plant any more trees on the back side of the baseball field? Hoffman: It's all part of the project. Landscaping is all coming back in. Carron: So they're going to remove some but they're also going to replace? Hoffman: Yep. Carron: Okay. Hoffman: If you watch the paper during that public hearing process, the trees were the number one issue for the neighborhoods down there and so the council added back pretty aggressively a nice tree planting plan and so that's being worked on right now as a part of that design process. Tom Kelly: And I'm guessing too what isn't on this 5 year plan right now is the amenities we plan to add to Bandimere Park after we re- acquire that land. Hoffman: More than a quarter million. Tom Kelly: More than a quarter million. Hoffman: If you want to stick it on the outside of 2017 Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 Cole Kelly: And that breaks down for a hockey rink and what else are we putting in there? Hoffman: Tennis court, hockey rink, parking. There's a lot of money in additional parking. Right now when you view that park, the smallest lot fills up first because it's got the two soccer fields and now it's got disc golf and it's got the playgrounds and so that's where all the new parking is going is on that side. Over on this end and so this gets filled in with new parking lots. A hockey rink. Warming house. Skating rink and tennis courts here. But the park will be perfectly serviceable by having a new entry road. You'll be able to drive in and out. We'll continue to kind of maintain and mow that area where the two homes are. The homes will be gone and so it's really not going to look out of place. It's just going to have some available land for future improvements, which you know that's the most important part of the process. I'm sure those other improvements will come on down the line somewhere. Cole Kelly: Would the improvements probably be piecemealed at some, at whatever point. Hoffman: They could be. I think what this park board or future park board's going to look for is an opportunity on when something else is going on or you know you could piecemeal parts of it but there is, you know there is efficiencies to doing it all at once too once you get into it. It's kind of a compact site and if you have to tear it up more than one time you have some additional costs that come back. The tennis court could probably be separate but I think once you get in there to build all those other facilities you probably just want to get it all said and done. Tom Kelly: And in the interim would it be possible, do we have room to turn those into serviceable fields? Soccer fields or things like that until we actually go in and build something on that open space. Hoffman: There's probably room for kind of a practice field, especially on that, on the inside. I wouldn't want to put a field probably out where that tennis court's going to be. It's too close to the road but on the inside. And depending on what we end up with, with this grading that would be the only thing because there's going to be a lot of imported dirt I think to build the future park amenities and so if we wouldn't be in the position to import that dirt as a part of this so we'd have to see how we could balance the dirt. At least level the site off for now. Carron: You have some extra dirt at Pioneer Pass. Hoffman: They're working on that. It's actually coming along pretty nicely but every, it seems like every week we find out that there's even more there then they had expected. So I guess people are keeping score and we probably took $75,000 out and we want to add about $400,000 in. Tom Kelly: For Rice Marsh, is there a time limit on Eden Prairie's willingness to connect the path? Hoffman: Any time you get it there. Scharfenberg: It took them that long just to build the one recently so, and by the way that new trail is done and people are using it. It's very nice. Cole Kelly: Yeah, I've been on it a few times. It's really nice. Hoffman: Yeah, if we get to there and they don't build it it's just going to be a beaten trail because you're going to be see one end to the other and so Jay Lotthammer, their director said we'll build it. You get it to that far and we won't back away. Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 Cole Kelly: Todd and I talked about this a little bit before the meeting but I think I'll just bring it up now. The fund, current fund balance we're told is $2,242,000 and the estimate for the end of the year is $1,148,000 and Todd said that we're pretty much on par for having spent, we'll spend the money to be close to that figure of a $1,148,000. So that will be what we'll have in the piggy bank at the end of the year. Scharfenberg: So based on staff recommendations it sounds like at least we should flip flop Riley Ridge and Pioneer Pass in the next 2 years and then throw Rice Marsh in at least at 2015, although you'd like to have it done earlier but I mean given the spending limitations that we have, I think we've got to push that out. And then I think it's a matter of you know what other projects do we leave in in those last 2 years. Carron: I think Rice Marsh too we're waiting for the development as well. For access purposes. Hoffman: It'd be a nice thing to have. I think we could do it without it but it would be a nice thing to have and the other thing, it's not that we're waiting for it, MnDOT has said they'll grant us the Limited Use Permits for the two properties that they own. It would be nice to have that other development but I'd hate to have to sit around. You might be sitting around for 10 years so I'd just as soon plan for it. If it happens we'll use it. If not, I think we can build it. Commissioner Carron we have the opportunity to negotiate with at least those two homeowners that have that driveway to do a construction access there and that would be the other option. Right in the middle. Not at the end but in the middle. We would use all three. We need all three access points. I think Commissioner Scharfenberg I don't think we should flip flop but leave Pioneer Pass at 2013. Hope that the grading gets done. Hope that we seed it yet this fall and we get grass growing and we're going to start building a parking lot yet this fall as well and then put the playground in next spring. Those people are really getting nervous that they're going to have to wait another year and I don't want to see that happen for that neighborhood as well so it would be moving forward Riley Ridge and then basically we'd be building those two parks at the same time, kind of back and forth. Working at Riley Ridge and working at Pioneer Pass. What we're going to do this fall is work with their street contractor that is in putting their final phase. Get a price from them to build that parking lot and then get another price or two from some other folks to build that parking lot and then get that in so we have that to work from and then move from there. Scharfenberg: So are you suggesting then potentially that we skip a year in terms of not having anything in 2014? Hoffman: 2014 could be skipped or you could put Rice Marsh in there. There's going to be some years in here where things start to lean out simply because of the nature of this timing and then the cash balance. There's just going to be. Carron: Go on sabbatical. Hoffman: There's still always planning to do and hopefully future development will start bringing those dollars back. Carron: Is there a preliminary dollar amount of what the Rice Marsh trail connection's going to be? Hoffman: I think $400,000 is going to be an estimate. Carron: 400. Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 Hoffman: Yep. And that would include plan engineering, development costs. I think that's pretty conservative. It'd probably be built closer to $300,000 or $350,000 but there's a lot of potential unknowns in there once you get into those soils and that woods. Cole Kelly: I was just playing with some preliminary figures. If we add Riley Ridge back into 2013, I've got us spending $575,000. Taken from the $1,148,000 takes us down to $573,000 and then if we add back in $200,000 for what we expect for revenues, and that figure might be a little high, that would take us up to $773,000 at the end of next year. Scharfenberg: Wouldn't that be $550,000? I think you said 575 Cole Kelly: Oh yeah, we took out something didn't we. No. Carron: That park benches and trees. Scharfenberg: I thought you were just talking about the two large projects. Cole Kelly: No I'm talking about what our expenditures would be for 2013 Scharfenberg: Well you could take the trees and benches out if you wanted to and move them to a different year too. Cole Kelly: You could but we've kind of got them planned every year so either you'd take them out or you'd make it higher another year I guess if you don't want to do that but I don't see where those make a big dent on the budget where we'd want to move those around at this point. But maybe we do. Carron; Well the way I'm thinking, even though you like to spread it out and kind of do stuff each year it does make sense to me to have Pioneer and Riley together. I think we'll get more bang for the buck with the playground equipment that we've been talking about and just getting both those done with the residents as well. So that makes sense to me but doesn't leave much for 2014. Cole Kelly: No and right now we don't have much so if we're down to about $773,000 and you expect another $200,000 that would take you back up close to a million and in 2014 we've got the picnic trees. I mean the picnic benches and the trees and that might be the area to say let's add back in Rice Marsh Lake, which I know we're also going for a grant but we're not necessarily certain we're going to get the grant and we won't hear probably til sometime this winter about the grant. And Todd, let's say the grant comes through and of course we don't know what the amount will be, is that, let's say they give us the grant, does that move up our time table of when we have to do this as far as the State is concerned or the DNR? Hoffman: They will have a timeframe on it but at that time if they award it to us in 2013, we would probably have to the end of 2014 to use that based on my understanding of that grant program. But there's going to be a timeframe on it. Cole Kelly: Okay. Hoffman: If it is awarded. Tom Kelly: What's the likelihood of that one you think? Hoffman: It didn't go through the first time and we reapplied and tried to beef it up somewhat so again I think it's 50150. And the, whatever the timing is, if it's 2014 -2015 we'll use that time to go ahead and 10 Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 secure those Limited Use Permits. Start to negotiate with neighbors. We haven't started that process of neighborhood meeting because we just don't want to get, it's going to, some neighbors are already understand it's going to happen but others are still want a conversation with the park board and the council probably so. A brand new neighbor just bought and he said geez, I just walked to the back of my lot with my wife and discovered that there's a trail back there. Is that really going to be a trail? So he had just bought the house. Cole Kelly: He didn't walk it before he bought it? Hoffman: No. Cole Kelly: Personally I'd be in favor of trying to put Rice Marsh Lake into 2014. That will be the first lake we have in the area that we could have a trail going all the way around the lake, which would be a feather both in Chanhassen and Eden Prairie's cap, in my opinion. Hoffman: Yeah the fund's going to start to dwindle but there's going to be some, you know after this we've got Bandimere set up. You're going to have two parks coming on line with two new neighborhoods being served and then a future trail project and so those are great projects and then you're just going to have to work. Carron: We really don't have anything solid going forward. It's based on grants and matches and Hoffman: Yeah after that. Carron: What's the Highway 41 trail extension stairway, is that going to go this year? Hoffman: Yes. Carron: It is, okay. And signed off on and everything Hoffman: Yep. Carron: Okay Hoffman: It's being advertised the first of August and it will be awarded in September and then it'll start, and there may be some things that go into next spring but. Cole Kelly: We also don't expect that the Bandimere Community Park expansion that we have in for half million, you'll probably go the full half with the purchase price and the removal costs? Hoffman: It'll be a little less than that, yep Cole Kelly: Okay. Hoffman: So there's probably $50,000 or so that will be left in that fund after that acquisition Cole Kelly: So just playing with the numbers, if we get to 2014 and we only have $773,000 in the fund roughly, give or take $50,000, and we do add in Rice Marsh Lake, that will give us a total of $425,000 in expenditures for that year, which we'd expect to have income of about $200,000 so that would reduce us to 3, roughly $350,000 plus $200,000 would reduce us to about $550,000 at the end of 2014 as far as the piggy bank would go. 11 Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 Hoffman: (Yes). And then the trail to the Arboretum is a place holder if the grant comes through. It doesn't get spent unless that grant comes through in 2015. Tom Kelly: Do we just remove the Bluff Creek trail gap since that scored so low or is it cause no harm to keep that $75,000 around? Hoffman: Well I would remove it right now as a, because I don't think that's a viable grant application so they would have to come back as a different type of a project. It's likely it'll either have til that road is upgraded or the park fund can pay for the entire trail project. Or development occurs on the state lot. You know if development occurs there and they upgrade that road. Cole Kelly: So right now the way I see it is we're looking at moving Riley Ridge into 2013. We're looking to eliminate the Bluff Creek gap. I don't see any other changes we're looking to make except maybe add in the Rice Marsh Lake for $400,000 at some point and I think as far as the addition of the Rice Marsh Lake, so far only Steve and I have commented on it so I'm curious if anybody else would like to weigh in. Tom Kelly: I would agree. I agree with you. I would like to add that in in 2014. Making that our big project for that year. Cole Kelly: Elise, any thoughts? Ryan: I too think that we should add it. My only concern is that we have a lot of expenditures in 2013 and to roll right into 2014 with such a large amount, unless we feel like it must go in 2014 I'd be more in favor of pushing it out to 2015. Cole Kelly: Jim. Boettcher: You said at the end of 2000, or going into 2014 we'd have about $350,000 in the bank with $200,000? Cole Kelly: No, about $550,000. Boettcher: $550,000 with the 200,000 Cole Kelly: With the $200,000 coming back, correct. Boettcher: So if you're looking at $400,000. Cole Kelly: If you take out the $400,000 you'd have $950,000 at the end of that year. Boettcher: Okay. What do you look for as a cushion in the fund? I mean like. Cole Kelly: You know a million would be a nice number but. Boettcher: Not always realistic. Cole Kelly: It's what can we accomplish. What's going to come in down the road. What makes sense. I'd hate to ever go under a half million but if you do look at the numbers over the years, we have been down to about a half million in the early 2000's and then of course there was a lot of development so we 12 Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 had a ton of money to play with and so now there's been no development for a few years. Well there's a little bit going on now and as you can see the fund balance has decreased each of the last couple years and we forecast that into the future. Boettcher: So based on the history we've probably, because that's the big project in 14 is the $400,000 for Rice Marsh. We don't see anything other than the $275,000 for the trail in 2015 as far as the last big expenditure in this. Cole Kelly: At this point, that is correct. Boettcher: So we'd be okay at that 550 level probably. Cole Kelly: That would be my thinking at this point. Brent, we haven't heard you weigh in. Carron: I think we should put it in. I think 2014 -15, the way I'm thinking, if we move Riley Ridge into 2013, I guess I don't have a problem putting it in 2014. It's a good place holder. We'll see what happens with Limited Use easement or permit or what not from MnDOT and kind of just put it as a place holder but put it on the CIP so that it's on there and we can discuss it in the future and that sort of thing next year so I would be for putting it on in 2014 just so we can talk about it next year and see where we sit. Cole Kelly: Any comments from anybody on any of the other items outside of the Rice Marsh Lake? Scharfenberg: Well I think we still have to, within the 5 years I think it's wise to put some money out for those Bandimere projects. I think you've got to put it out there. We know that given the purchase of that land that we've got some additional projects out there and I think we have to put some money towards the tennis courts, the hockey rink and at least the parking lots. Hoffman: And currently your 2017 would have zero in it. Cole Kelly: So Steve were you thinking in 2017? Scharfenberg: Whenever. It's got to be some. Cole Kelly: That would put it in the 5 year plan going forward and I think that was your original comment is you'd like to see it in the 5 year plan. Scharfenberg: Right, if not earlier than that but if we have to push it out to 2017 then I'm fine with that. I'm just trying to you know justify everything with staff's recommendations that we keep spending within the $300,000 limit per year. I know that we, given the situation with the two parks that we need to move up the other two items so I think we, as a commission need to take that all into consideration. Hoffman: And again just to remind the commissioners you have another month so you can just say stop now staff. Go ahead and blend this all together. Bring it back a formal recommendation to the commission. You can think about it for another month and then you can take a look at this. I'll print it up and ready to go for your approval. We can give you the cash balances here. We can give you the actual numbers so you can take a look at that you know a week before the next meeting and so you can settle in on some of those numbers. You know it's not a position any of us want to be in I don't think. It would be nice to have that cash balance we had a few years ago but there's been a lot of projects going on. The other thing, we've done some future cash receipt analysis and it's somewhere just under $20 million dollars in future park dedication fees by the time this community's built out 50 years from now and so when we're talking about the numbers you have now and where the fund balance was, you know this 13 Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 community has invested over $20 million in parks and trails up until this time and now we have another you know future $20 million at least in this fund to fund park and trail dedication projects into the future. And then it's always good I think to take a look at, we talk about leveraging dollars and for example the Rice Marsh project, that's one in a quarter of a million dollars worth of land that you're going to run this trail through that at least in the first blush the State said we'd like you to buy those from us and so we asked for the appraisals and we ordered the appraisals and we ordered the appraisals and they said well this one's worth a million. This one's worth $250,000. You can buy them you know anytime you want. We said well, we really don't think we have a million and a quarter to buy these two parcels to run this trail through. How about will you give us an easement and their response was almost immediately, sure. We'll consider an easement. Now that's a Limited Use Permit. If there's some future project that they have that somebody buys the land and they want to do something else then we're out. A Limited Use Permit is limited and it needs to be resubmitted for right now they're on about a 10 to 15, 10 to 20 year timeframe. They're kind of fluctuating but I don't think that land's going anywhere in the future so right off the bat you've got a million two five in land for a trail. You just bought $500,000 worth of land at Bandimere for your future park so those are great things to keep in mind that you know even though you're investing another $400,000, you're leveraging a million two five in land that's available there to put this trail through. That land is what makes that trail, at least that section of the trail so attractive. And then the fact that you can complete work on another 2 1/2 miles of trail that had been you know in place for the last 20 years. You know section by section by section so I think that project, like I said a few meetings ago, that's the ribbon cutting you want to be at when that baby connects. You've got the mayor of Eden Prairie and the mayor of Chanhassen and the two park boards and all the public there, that's one you can really hang your hat on. That would be a tremendous accomplishment, as these neighborhood parks. The first two neighborhood parks acquired in you know 15 years. Where has the rest of the money been that's been invested in all those parks that were acquired up until that point and you know leveraged to do trail projects and to expand our trail system. Again this community is just in a fantastic position. That box culvert going in I think is our 12 pedestrian underpass. Other than, we were talking that other than Minneapolis and maybe St. Paul I don't think there's a community you'll find that has that kind of pedestrian access and so even though the money's tight right now, there's no reason to be discouraged with the park fund and the park projects. And we still haven't talked about just throwing up some general fund capital projects for their consideration. You know that's happened in the past as well so. Cole Kelly: So what's the general feel on the board here? Would you like to have Todd's crew put together a recommendation based on what we've discussed tonight for us to vote on next week or are you looking to make some moves tonight? Boettcher: I'd like to wait. Cole Kelly: Okay. We need a motion. Boettcher: I make a motion that we wait until the August meeting and get the numbers from Todd's group. Cole Kelly: Is there a second? Scharfenberg: Second. Cole Kelly: Any further discussion? Carron: Do we want to add in a couple hundred thousand for 2017 for Bandimere? 14 Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 Scharfenberg: I would ask that staff include some money. I don't necessarily put a dollar amount on it yet but however, in terms of staff's recommendations on how that all balances out for Bandimere. Hoffman: Yep, we will. I'll be a quarter million or more. Scharfenberg: Okay. Cole Kelly: Any other comments? Boettcher moved, Scharfenberg seconded to table the 2013 -2017 Park and Trail Acquisition and Development Capital Improvement Program (CIP) to the August meeting. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 6 to 0. RECREATION PROGRAM REPORTS: 2012 FOURTH OF JULY CELEBRATION EVALUATION. Johnson: Thank you Chair Kelly and good evening commissioners. Fourth of July, our third of four community events we host throughout the year annually. This is the 29 annual celebration we had this year in 2012. It was definitely a hot one. Everything we heard in the feedback, everybody oh we had a blast but next year can you turn the heat down. I think 2 of the 3 days we broke record heat. I think they were over 100 degrees, if I remember right so, but it's still a great celebration. We predicted about 45,000 to 60,000 people enjoyed some aspect of the celebration over the 3 days. The report here I put together kind of breaks down, there's so much going on throughout the event. I kind of broke down each individual topic. I'll kind of go through it rather quickly. If you have any questions feel free to stop and I'd be happy to further explain any of them. The family night at the carnival on July 2" d . This is the second year we've offered that. It was a work day for a lot of people on the 2" d . I think we started at about 3:30 or so in the afternoon so it was a little slow in the beginning to get going. Obviously the heat kept away some families too so we predicted about 1,000 or 2,000 people ended up participating that night. Still a great event. Really looking forward to it early. You know small lines at the carnival gives family with young kids able to get in. You know have some rides, have some fun and kind of hopefully come back the next few days too. On the 3r is really the big day that kicks off everything. Start with the baseball clinic in the morning. That still continues to be very successful at the high school. I think we had about 150 kids this year out there. Jerry's done a great job kind of coordinating that and working with the high school. The kiddie parade continues to be very popular with kids and if you guys have ever seen it, everybody kind of lines up at the elementary school and they decorate their bikes and their scooters. We had some with the plastic Hot Wheels all decorated up this year and it's fun. A lot of families walk with the children too and neighbors on their parade route, they put their lawn chairs on the curb and really kind of gets that festive spirit. The business expo, turning over the page there. Working with the Southwest Metro Chamber of Commerce. They kind of organize that aspect. Great way for the local businesses to kind of play part of the celebration as well. Kind of get their products out there. Kind of tie in that whole community spirit with that. Bunch of vendors we had again this year. You can kind of, I kind of recap each of them. Most vendors, we collect 20% of the revenue. Most reported slower than normal sales so you know our revenue was down in that aspect. In the back of the report I broke down kind of each one that we've received the funds so far on that one. That's kind of the couple pages there in the middle. Huge thanks to the Chanhassen Rotary. A great organization to work with. They kind of organize the Taste of Chanhassen along with the beer tent sales. It's just been great. I think it draws a lot more people to the celebration and they kind of really enjoy everything. Crowds I think were down a little bit compared to past years due to just, you know I guess like I said with the heat and stuff but it seemed like the 8:00 -9:00, once the sun kind of went down, all of a sudden they just started coming in droves so real fun to see. The carnival, we were down I think about $2,000 in revenue from the carnival this year just due to the crowds being smaller. The street dance, we had CBO back. I think this 15 Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 is the 15 year they're back and still continues to be a huge draw. I think people really look forward to coming back each year and seeing them and they put on a great show. It's real fun to look forward to continuing that partnership in the future. On the 4 th we kind of go out to Lake Ann for a few events. We've got the adult fishing contest still remains very popular. We had 48 participants. We max it out at 50 each year so we generated about $1,000 in revenue with that one. Fun thing with that, you know without the local community event sponsors we have throughout the year, a lot of our community events wouldn't be possible. A lot of cash donations are made as well as prizes and gift certificates. Things like that. For the adult fishing contest we awarded almost $4,000 in prizes. They were all donated by local sponsors so that really kind of helps keep our costs down and I think they really enjoyed kind of being a part of the celebration in that aspect too. Also on the 4 1h in the morning out here at City Center Park the Chanhassen Rotary organizes the classic car show. Numbers were a little down with that too just because of the heat. A lot of the older cars kind of tend to over heat and stuff. A lot of people don't like to bring them out of the garage. Pre - registration isn't required for that. Just kind of a you know that day you can show up and participate. The big one there on the 4 1h obviously is the 4 th of July parade. We estimated you know I think we had about 90 floats. A few backed out at the last minute so the parade was just as big, and it was bigger than last year. Kind of one of the larger ones in recent years. It seemed like the downtown area was a little scarce but if you went up on the north side of town in kind of the neighborhoods where there was kind of more shade and stuff, I mean I've never seen it packed like I had up there and so it's kind of fun to watch the crowds kind of rotate and find their best spot depending on the weather. After the parade we continue to try to find ways to bring the crowds back up into town here at City Center Park and you know kind of visit the vendors and things like that. We had the live music. We had a great band that performed for a couple hours up there. I think people really enjoyed it. It's still kind of like I said that continuing, how do we get people up here. How do we get them to participate so looking forward to keep on working that in the future. Fourth of July kind of wraps up that evening out at Lake Ann with the fireworks show. We thought about 25,000- 35,000 viewed the fireworks either from inside the park or in their residence or neighbors houses or across 5. It's always fun to see how many cars kind of line the roads up and down the area so it was a great show. It lasted about 20 minutes or so. I put a few suggestions here. Just kind of things. We're always looking ways, you know what can we do to make this better. You know we've kind of grown as far as, you know maxed our limit as far as space wise for the carnival and things down here but what can we do to increase the overall experience people are having. Make things easier to find. You know family friendly for all ages so I just kind of put a few recommendations there. One thing, going to kind of do some research and kind of see what we think is maybe the possibility of eliminating the large tent that we have the street dance in. It seemed like most of the night, and I don't know if it was the heat or just the loud you know kind of enclosed there, maybe we eliminate that and have like a stage or something. Tom Kelly: It was the heat. Johnson: It was the heat. Tom Kelly: Yeah, because in past years that tent is jammed and outside is vacant and because it was about 110 degrees inside that tent. That's the reason why it was so empty inside because it was pretty stagnant in there. Johnson: It seemed like that breeze was coming out of the south and city hall was kind of stopping it. You couldn't get no air movement in there so we did rent a couple portable fans. We kind of put up by the band to just kind of keep some air circulating but you know in an area that big we just couldn't get it moving so but. A couple other things, looking forward to continuing making the color brochure that comes out every year. I think people really look forward to just getting that in the Villager and kind of lays out that celebration. We're always looking forward to kind of seeing what we can do to you know ramp that up a little bit more each year. Next year, 30 ' annual celebration. Looking forward to it. I think 16 Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 we're 343 days away so, not that we're counting. But yeah, first one's under the belt for me. You know special thanks to Todd and Jerry. They've been great to work with and all our park maintenance staff and all the local organizations, like I said the sponsors. It's great to see commissioners out there and the people in the community, I think they really enjoy it. Hoffman: Do you think or are you sure? Johnson: I'm sure of it. From the looks on their faces I think they were having fun so, but you'll see in the administrative packet, maybe you saw, we kind of dug up the first annual Fourth of July celebration. We were able to locate the original flyers. Kind of fun to look back and kind of looking forward to next year. You know what can we do to kind of incorporate that as kind of a throwback celebration so I'd be happy to answer any questions anybody has or take suggestions for next year. We're going to have a wrap up meeting tomorrow with a few of the Rotary Club and people who helped plan. Be happy to discuss it. Hoffman: I was referring to the days. Are you sure on the days? Johnson: Oh the days, oh okay. Scharfenberg: No just wanted to comment Mitch, nice job to Jerry and Mitch and Todd and all the staff for this event. Just a lot of good comments from people in the community and despite the heat I think it was a wonderful several days of events. Cole Kelly: I'm usually out of town over the 4 . I happened to be in town until the morning of the 4 th so I went to the party on the night of the 3r and I called my wife who was up north and I said, you missed out a great event. We've got to stay down in the cities next year for it. It was really a wonderful event and I was amazed at all the people that were there and all the people, you know a lot of our neighbors and friends were there and it was like wow. A lot of people go to this thing so it was very cool. Nice job. Tom Kelly: It was outstanding. Great job. It was a great time. One of my suggestions, I know I've made this suggestion in years past and I'm going to make it one more time but with a little twist. We seem to lose a lot of money on t -shirt sales. I realize that the t -shirt sales go beyond just making the $700. There's a bunch of good will so my recommendation either to be, to eliminate the t -shirts or go to the other extreme because the issue with the t -shirts is it's a one day t -shirt and there really isn't, you don't see many people wearing 4 "' of July t -shirts on the 5 or 6 t ''. Because it is the 30' anniversary, could we make the t -shirts something that someone would wear all year that, instead of going towards the 4 th of July, maybe something that really reflects the 30 years of Chanhassen. Maybe make that the focus of the t -shirts and maybe even play around with the material a bit. Go away from 100% cotton and something that maybe breaths a little better. Just either, you know if you don't want to eliminate them then maybe make them more appealing for the entire summer. Not just that one evening. Hoffman: Great suggestion. Mitch, do you have an estimate on how many t- shirts, the dollar amount that we give away to our sponsors? Johnson: You know not with me. I could certainly get that though but I think we just did a count. I think we had like 40 shirts left over of the how many you know hundreds we order just because of sponsors. So many get large amounts. Tom Kelly: So you're giving most of them, most of that $3,000 bucks you give, okay is going to sponsors. 17 Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 Johnson: Yeah. We have different levels of the sponsorship so if you fall in this level you get 30 shirts you know for the big corporations in town so, and it's kind of a way that we can reward them you know for their dollar amount so. Hoffman: And when we take a look at this balance, the $51,000 expenditures, that does not, it's not tempered at all by the $28,000 which was collected for the special events series so the $28,000 comes in and that gets spread over 4 th of July, Halloween, Easter and Feb Fest so again that number is lower yet but is just not included in there. And then the, I would estimate at least $1,000 maybe $1,500 bucks of those t -shirts are given away to sponsors. And then they in turn give them to their employees. Byerly's dresses all their employees for their Taste of Chanhassen in the t -shirts that they get so it is an important part of the. Tom Kelly: It is okay. Hoffman: But I think, I agree with you. It can be tweaked. We talk about it each year and it's a visible component of the, but we can do a better job of making sure. Tom Kelly: Just the 30 years is important. Chanhassen, Chanhassen, Chanhassen, Chanhassen, Chanhassen so we're all wearing something with the maple leaf on it. Or most of are, sorry. Scharfenberg: With respect to the raffle prizes, was that all left up to the booster club this year to support, you know do their own prizes? Johnson: Yep. So they solicit the community. They get their own prizes and can have their own sponsors and so. Scharfenberg: Tom and I thought they were a little light this year. Tom Kelly: Which may have kept the raffle sales down a little bit because they weren't as enticing as they had been in years past. Hoffman: Yeah, what did they earn, 800 -900 bucks? Johnson: Yeah, it wasn't large amounts but yeah. Tom Kelly: I thought the final crew for the raffle did an outstanding job of drawing everything and passing out so I want to publicly commend them, whoever they might be. Cole Kelly: Any other comments or questions for Mitch? Hoffman: We fall on a Wednesday night, Thursday next year. Johnson: Yep, Thursday next year is the 4cn Hoffman: So Wednesday night, street dance. Thursday 4 "' of July and 30' anniversary of the event. Tom Kelly: Is the plan to retain Melrose and Casablanca going forward? Johnson: Right now for the Melrose we're in a 3 year contract. Next year will be the third year of that contract so yeah, they'll be back. We're looking at ways, you know what can we do to commemorate the 30 ' You know do we go a little bigger on the fireworks so we can certainly up that contract but right 18 Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 now we're locked in for a minimum so. For CBO, I mean we're getting a lot of positive feedback. You know they really kind of turned into a tradition. I think they love coming here. You know the price is still alright but something to evaluate. Tom Kelly: We upped the fireworks a little bit 4 years ago for 25 didn't we? Hoffman: Yep, it went up for the 25 and in fact we are working on our budgets right now and we submitted a little bit of an increase to the finance department for the 30 and they said 30" We just did that for the 25 What happened to those 5 years so yeah. They remember the 25 and the 30 we're coming back. Feel free to comment but as far as CBO, until they either completely blow it or dissolve it's pretty much a lock so, unless you feel otherwise. I don't know who wants to talk to that crowd when CBO doesn't come on at 7:00 but it won't be me. Ruegemer: Chair Kelly. Hoffman: Ladies and gentlemen, we have a change in venue Tom Kelly: I was impressed for as hot as it was under that tent how many people were actually dancing around 10:00 p.m. at night. Hoffman: Dancing. They want to dance. Tom Kelly: Yep, they sure do. Hoffman: Yeah that crowd comes out for that night so, and they love it. They played their encore for free this year. In the early days we had to pay for that encore so they are engaged. Don't tell them but they love this town and they locked on. Ruegemer: Yeah, Melanie does do a lot of kind of pre -event promotion too through their email blasts and that sort of thing here too so we do get a lot of exposure from their website and their fans as well so it's a good fit for us, and for them. Scharfenberg: Have we ever toyed with the idea of doing fireworks on Wednesday night as opposed to, or the night before as opposed to the 4" Hoffman: People have talked about it. The challenge is you have everybody here and they would have to watch from city hall and so you would stop all of the events and people would watch and so it would be a break from tradition but people have talked about it. We used to shoot the fireworks from City Center Park and that can no longer occur so. But yeah, there's always people talking about it. What would that do to that evening and. The 4 th itself is really a day where we've tried to encourage additional traffic for the carnival or the Taste of Chanhassen or the beer gardens but people act almost in a patterned way on the 4 th of July. They're getting up after the street dance late. That's a good portion of your community. They're not rolling out of bed at, except the fishermen that come down at 6:00, and then they do some stuff around the home. It's a holiday and then they go to that parade and then they want to go home or to anyone's, they're either going to somebody's house for a picnic and then they're going to watch those fireworks and that's about I swear 90% of the people's day is patterned that way. You can't change that mentality. People are partied out from the night before and to get them back downtown to do more beer drinking or more carnival or more Taste of Chanhassen has just really been a struggle for us so we might bring some recommendations back just how to modify that. And the other challenge, when you think about it is you're set up for a party for 10,000 on the night before and nobody likes to come back to a party that looks empty and so we have the second day party and you've got 3,000 people in a 10,000 19 Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 person venue and it looks a little bit strange and so there might be some changes that need to occur there too. So if you have any thoughts about that, let us know. We're talking to the Rotary about it you know because everybody's still putting out the same amount of effort. The carnival's there. The Taste of Chanhassen is there. The beer garden's there but there's obviously a lot smaller crowd and we just don't think there's a lot, you just can't, that 4 th of July mind set is pretty well set. If you talk to people, they don't have one invitation to go to somebody's house for a picnic. They have 4 invitations and they're certainly not going to spend their day downtown. They're going to be at somebody's home or on the lake or somebody's deck. Cole Kelly: Thank you Mitch for a great event with you and the City putting on. Next I think we're talking about the disc golf course grand opening event. COMMISSION MEMBER COMMITTEE REPORT: ESTABLISH DATE AND PROGRAM FOR BANDIMERE DISC GOLF COURSE GRAND OPENING EVENT. Hoffman: Tom and company. Tom Kelly: And we had tossed around a date in August I thought Hoffman: And that's just a date that's just floating out there. You can pick any date you want. We have a date scheduled, September 22 d for the skate park. Tom Kelly: Okay. And you had thought to do it, we talked about maybe doing it on the same day or not necessarily? Hoffman: No. So that's why we just put it, we just popped it up a month earlier. I would think about the, how you want it to work. Do you want it to be an evening or do you want it to be an weekend morning event? We talked about I think just before noon so people would come out 10:00- 11:00. Come to this grand opening and then they could go off and have the rest of the day but that's completely up to the commission on how you want to manage that and staff will plan accordingly. But I think the council's excited. They've heard the good news and they're tracking the blogs as well and disc golf chat rooms. Tom Kelly: Personally I'd almost prefer it to be a Saturday morning, either maybe the 18 or the 25 of August but I can easily be convinced to do it on a week night as well. Hoffman: 18 is Miracles for Mitch. Ruegemer: I was just going to say yeah, that's the 18 is Miracle Kids Triathlon at Lake Ann so you may want to stay away from that date. Tom Kelly: Okay, that's out. Do you think we would get more participation on a Saturday morning than we would on a week night? Hoffman: That's hard to say. I don't know what others think. We said Thursday, August 23r That's a Thursday evening or Saturday. So that Saturday would be the 25 Tom Kelly: Right 20 Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 Scharfenberg: If it's during a week night you'd probably, during the week night you may have some school stuff with the school's open houses and stuff are probably ramping up around that time so you might run into some of that. Tom Kelly: Okay. Cole Kelly: And you've got kids sports activities are already ramping up on about the 15 Well I think we're kind of looking at August 25th. What do you think? Tom Kelly: 25 sure. That sounds good. Like about 10:00 a.m. ribbon cutting. Ryan: I am out of town for that but you can move forward without me if everybody else can make it. What? Tom Kelly: You're out of town too? Boettcher: What events are all being planned for that day? I mean you going to run people through and show them what it's all about. Have special competition. Prizes. What was planned? Tom Kelly: I mean I would have liked to have gotten either Lyle or. Cole Kelly: Chuck Tom Kelly: Chuck out there to kind of maybe do a demonstration of how to throw a disc and the different types of discs and maybe just have the ribbon cutters play a couple holes. I mean maybe we could even do a closest to the pin contest for the ribbon cutters on hole 1 or hole 2, just something like that. I don't think we can get people to, I doubt we can get the ribbon cutters to play all 9 holes but if we can get them to just do something with the first hole. Hoffman: Yeah it would be two stages. The ceremony and the ribbon cutting and then the ribbon cutters would do a small, and those who want to play would go on and then we would have some refreshments and those type of things for probably about an hour. Tom Kelly: Is the next weekend, the next weekend is Labor Day right? The first. Cole Kelly: Yes. Ryan: And the Thursday evening doesn't work for you guys? Tom Kelly: No that would be fine on the 23r If you wanted to do it then. Sun's still up. How long would the sun be up? Hoffman: 8:00 Tom Kelly: Okay so we need something at 6:30 you think. Boettcher: I've got another meeting that night, the 23r I wouldn't be able to be there but. Carron: I'm gone as well. Tom Kelly: You're gone as well? 21 Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 Carron: But again I mean there... What's the Thursday before? Boettcher: The 16 Hoffman: You have anything on the 16 th9 Or anything on the staff calendar? Ruegemer: I don't know off hand. I think that'd probably work. Cole Kelly: What about like Tuesday the 28" Hoffman: Park board meeting. Cole Kelly: The park board meeting doesn't start til 7:30. We could do the ribbon cutting at 6:00. Hoffman: Sure could. Ryan: I like that idea. Cole Kelly: It might be a good night to do it just because if you try to push it to that Thursday too many people on the 30 will be leaving town to take a long weekend for the Labor Day so otherwise we're looking at something in September I think. Ryan: I like your idea of the 28 Tom Kelly: Yeah, that'd be good. Hoffman: 6:00 to 7:00 and then back here at 7:30. Tom Kelly: Do you think we'd get some council participation at that? Hoffman: Oh absolutely. Carron: What you'd say 6:00 p.m.? Tom Kelly: 6:00 p.m., yep. Boettcher: Would we meet here as a group and drive over or? Hoffman: Meet there. Tom Kelly: Yeah. Boettcher: Meet there instead, okay. Hoffman: Staff will draft up an agenda. We'll send it out to the group. Get some comments. We'll finalize it. We'll check dates on everybody's calendars. Send out some feelers to the council. They have a meeting the night before so I would assume most of them will be around. Tom Kelly: Okay. And would it be appropriate to have like a little closest to the pin contest? I've got some discs at home... 22 Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 Hoffman: I think maybe we make you cut the ribbon with a disc. Accurate shot Tom Kelly: I'd like to talk too about maybe having a tournament there at some, I don't know if we can do it this year. Something that the City sponsors or not but I was at one this weekend and it was a lot of fun. Johnson: Thanks for asking Tom. In the new Connection I just, I think you might have one I set up there. It should be mailed out this week or just dropping off today. Page 10 on Saturday, October 6 th we have our first annual disc golf tournament planned out there so kind of geared towards the teenage and then I also have an adult competition as well category so looking to kind of solicit some sponsors and kind of get it built up and it should be a nice fall day hopefully. Tom Kelly: Do you need any help with that? Johnson: Absolutely. I'll put you on my list. Tom Kelly: Put a potential sponsor too, I kid you not, Air Traffic has probably become of the most popular stores at Eden Prairie Mall now because they well discs and I know a bunch of kids in our neighborhood have just been going over there and buying discs so maybe they could be a possible sponsor. You know they aren't a Chanhassen business there but they're definitely reaping the rewards of our disc golf course. Johnson: Okay, great. Yeah thanks. Cole Kelly: So Todd we don't need a, do a formal thing to establish a time and date. We can just, that time and date works for everybody. Hoffman: Yeah, we'll do that administratively and publish it... Cole Kelly: Okay, we'll put that on the schedule. COMMISSION MEMBER PRESENTATIONS. Cole Kelly: Do we have any commission member presentations tonight? No member commissions. We'll move right into the administrative. Ryan: What, Steve did you want to talk about a recommendation by Chairman Laufenburger? Scharfenberg: Denny Laufenburger had approached us about a potential name change to the pavilion at Lake Ann and Todd and I had exchanged emails with Denny about that and I think he's taking, it can't come to us, at least at this time. Some additional work has to be done on the front end and so I think Denny's taking care. It has to go to the council I think first, is that right Todd? Hoffman: Correct. Scharfenberg: And so that may be coming back to us at a later date Ryan: Oh okay, thank you. Scharfenberg: Yep. 23 Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 Cole Kelly: Thank you Hoffman: There's a naming policy and by that policy all those proposed go directly to the City Council and they decide if they should be considered. If they decide a naming request should be considered then they'll choose a course of action. Ryan: Okay, thank you. Cole Kelly: So now we'll move to the administrative section. ADMINISTRATIVE PACKET. Cole Kelly: Todd, you have any comments? Hoffman: I'm glad to answer any questions of the commission from the packet. There are a variety of documents in here. There's the trail. Mr. Casper that wrote about. That bridge over 101 on the Minnesota River Valley, the river bluff's LRT, it just simply will not happen until that road is upgraded at this point because nobody wants to invest those kind of dollars in a pedestrian bridge when there's going to be a road project following it. But the good news is that whole river project with 101 and the river crossing is really picking up some steam and same thing, once they get the piece across the river done nobody's going to want to sit and wait and have this piece between Pioneer, past Halla down to the river so I'm confident that that is, although we did talk a 20 year timeframe which he was not happy with you know in the life of the city. There's a naming policy. There are some documents from the first 4 th of July back in '84 so you see the first City of Chanhassen. It was a one day event and then it went up to 4 days after that. It is always interesting to look back at old news and the same article that it says Chan makes big plans for the 4 th of July. There's also word that if we didn't keep taxes down to 1.5% people are going to move out of town so I hope nobody left at the time but the threats are still being made so 4 1h of July's continue as do tax discussions. And Jerry always does a great job with our picnics and there's lots of evaluations this time around. Cole Kelly: Now Jerry are the reservations up for our parks right now? The level, the number of reservations? Ruegemer: Oh yes they were. We looked at that probably about a month ago and we were up in comparison to last year at this time so. Cole Kelly: In looking through the packet you know people for the most part are real happy. They're actually happy with the reservation fee but there's always a couple who say reservation fee? And I'm going I think our reservations are up which to me means our reservation fee might not be high enough is the way I look at it, and it may be I don't know how it compares to other ones around the other cities around us. Ruegemer: Yeah we are definitely on the higher end with that because we're always getting compared to Chaska. Chaska's resident fee is usually, yeah extremely cheap and then people call here and I think they, I have to put the paddles on them after I tell them what the non - resident fee is but, and I think people are a little bit surprised but you know we don't, at Lake Ann Hilltop and Lakeside, we don't have any availability on Saturdays and Sundays this year so it's been pretty busy. Hoffman: You know it's one of those tricky situations because there are corporations that come out and they pay $200 bucks? 24 Park and Recreation Commission — July 24, 2012 Ruegemer: Yeah, $250. $200 bucks Hoffman: Yeah, and then they drop 3 grand on their picnic so you know. What Cargill brought coach buses and entertainment and so there are some that get a better value for their dollar because we're picking up additional trash and cleaning bathrooms and those type of things so there's a balance but if you tried to charge at a rate where you're going to make all your costs back, there's a residual positive effects to having a program like this. People come out. They love the community. They come back and do other things. They support the community in other ways. They move to the community so there are residual positive benefits to having a program like a picnic program. Cole Kelly: Great, thank you. Any other comments from anybody on the administrative packet? Thanks Jerry for a great job on the picnics and the grounds. With that I don't think we have anything else going. Todd, I'm not missing anything am I? Hoffman: Done Cole Kelly: Does anybody want to make a motion? Carron moved, Scharfenberg seconded to adjourn the meeting. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 6 to 0. The Park and Recreation Commission meeting was adjourned. Submitted by Todd Hoffman Park and Rec Director Prepared by Nann Opheim 25