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4 Code AmendmentsCITYOF CH HASSE 690 City Center Drive, PO Box 147 Chanhassen, Minnesota 55317 Phone 612.93Z 1900 General Fax 612.93Z5739 Engineering Fax 612.93Z9152 Public Safe~v Fax 612.934.2524 Web www. ci. chanhassen, mn. us MEMORANDUM TO: FROM: DATE: RE: Planning Commission Planning Department August 30, 2000 Zoning Ordinance Amendments-Update On August 15, 2000, the Planning Commission held a public hearing on numerous zoning ordinance amendments, and tabled the item. Staff was directed to refine the buildable area, story, and wetland structure setback elements. Buildable Area Staff surveyed other suburban communities to determine the prominence of a specified buildable area. As the following table displays, the requirement is not common, although, it is typical to show a house pad with front and rear elevations as well as house type on grading plans. Table 1 SUBURBAN COMMUNITIES AND BUILDABLE AREA REQUIREMENTS Community Minimum Buildable Area Comments Andover 100 feet of depth* Chaska None Lake Elmo None Maple Grove None Minnetonka Woodbury *See Attachment 2 3,500 sq. ft. with4 sides and a minimum dimension of 40 feet* None Setbacks must be shown; building pads must be shown in PUDs Type of home and elevation must be shown on grading plan The City ~ growing community with clean lakes, PlanningCommission August 30, 2000 Page 2 Staff remains comfortable requiring 2,400 sq. ft. to be shown on the plat as indicated in 'the attached memorandum. Story Again, other communities were surveyed to determine~whethers~aff's proposed definition of story is appropriate. Our definJ_tion is consistent withothers', so no changes are proposedwith the exception of exclusion of residential_ properties_ The definition of"story" has been revised as follows: ' Story means that portion of a building included between the surface-of any floor and the surface of the fl°or next above it. Or ifthere is~no floorabove it, then the space between the floor and.the ceiling next above it and including a basement used for the principal use. If the height (H) of the basemefit is more than 12 feet at anyPoint, or ~f the height (h) is more than 6 feet formore~than 50 percent of the perimeter of thebuilding than it is considered a story. This - definition refers to nonresidential propertiesonly. - ' TOP OF FLOOR ~ ~ Wetland Accessory StructureSetback Originally, the Cityrequired a 75-~otsetback from th~edge o~f a~wetland. - Since manicuied lawns werebeingmain~taineduP-to th~ wetland~-~dge properties, the ordinance was ame~dedin1992 t~) reqff~reahuff, er~ ~and[allow a red~ced setback. Buffers allow ~reduced setback wl~ile maintain~ag-water quality benefits. ' - ' -- ~ _ : '- The issue of limiting the amount of impervious surfac~of accessorystrnctUres in wetland setbacks was discUssed atthe ~neeting. Staffb~l~eves~that-specifying a maximum percentage of impervious surfaceor a maximumsquare footage o~ structures would be difficul~to administer. For instance, specifying a maximum square footage of an acce~sorystructure may allowsome structureslikea small Planning Commission August 30, 2000 Page 3 shed, but exclude others that may be more appropriate, like a play set, which could be as large as 22 feet by 22 feet. Setting a standard for impervious surface would be troublesome since the determining the amount of hard surface for some structures may be difficult. For example, a deck is not typically considered hard surface because water can permeate through the cracks of the decking, so it would be difficult to determine the amount of impervious surface. Therefore, we recommend that the setback specified in the existing ordinance be maintained for both principal and accessory structures. The provision has been amended as follows: Section 20-406. Wetland buffer strips and setbacks. Wetland Type Pristine Principal and Accessory 100' Structure Setbacks Buffer Strip 20- 100' Natural .~ g/Urban Utilized 40' measured 40' measured 0' from the outside from the outside edge of the edge of the buffer strip buffer strip 10-30' 0-20' 0' Buffer Strip Minimum 50' 20' 10' 0' Average Width % of Native Vegetation Entire Entire Optional Optional in Buffer Strip This change will clarify the ordinance for all structures, as it currently only includes primary structures. RECOMMENDATION "Staff recommends the Planning Commission recommend approval to the city council the following code amendments: SEC 20-1 Definitions, add: Buildable area means the area of a lot remaining after the minimum yard and open space require~nents of this chapter have been met. The buildable area excludes the area required for all setbacks, which may include wetland and wetland buffer, drainage and utility easements, shoreland, and bluff setback, conservation or tree preservation easements, etc. All lots must have a buildable area of 2,400 sq. ft. that will allow for an adequate building pad. Planning Commission August 30, 2000 Page 4 Story means that portion of a building included between the surface of any floor and the surface of the floor next above it. Or if there is no floor above it, then the space between the floor and the ceiling next above it and including a basement used for the principal use. If the height (H) of the basement is more than 12 feet at any point, or if the height (h) is more than 6 feet for more than 50 percent of the perimeter of the building than it is considered a s ............. iai properties only. TOP OF FLOOR ~ ~ · h Standing Seam Roof is a deck roof consisting of fiat metal joined by vertical or overlapping seams. Body shop is an establishment primarily engaged in the repair of auto bodies, automotive painting and refinishing. ARTICLE VIII. PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPEMT Sec 20-506(b) Standards and guidelines for Single Family detached Residential PUDs, .... "The "applicant must demonstrate that each lot is able to accommodate a 60 x 40 foot buildable area. lng pad and a twelve foot by twelve foot deck without intruding into any required setback area or protective casement. Each home must also have a minimum rear yard, thirty (30) foot deep. This area my not be encumbered by the required home/deck pads or by wetland/drainage easements. It may include area with step terrain or tree cover. Sec 20-508 Minimum Lot size in PUD, (b) "Mini~nu~n lot sized. Minimum lot sizes down to five thousand (5, 000) square feet may be allowed. There shall be no minimum lot size, however in no case shall net density exceed guidelines established by the city." ARTICLE VI. Wetland Protection Sec 20-406 Wetland buffer Strip and Setback, Planning Commission August 30, 2000 Page 5 "On single-family subdivisions in the RSF district, the applicant must demonstrate that each lot provides sufficient area to accommodate the applicable front yard setback, 60 x 40 foot deep buildable area. ing pad, and a thirty foot rear yard area. All of these elements must be outside of designated wetland and buffer strip areas." Section 20-406 Wetland structure Wetland Type Pristine Principal and Accessory 100' Structure Setbacks Buffer Strip 20-100' and Setback Natural Ag/Urban Utilized 40' measured 40' measured 0' from the outside from the outside edge of the edge of the buffer strip buffer strip 10-30' 0-20' 0' Buffer Strip Minimum 50' 20' 10' 0' Average Width % of Native Vegetation Entire Entire Optional Optional in Buffer Strip CHAPTER 18 SUBDIVISIONS ART. III Design Standards Sec 18-61 Landscaping and tree preservation requirements (d) (4) "In single family detached residential developments, the applicant must demonstrate that suitable home sites exist on each lot by describing a 60 x 60 foot buildable area ing pad. (which includes deck area) without intruding into required setback and easements." ARTICLE VII Shoreland Mana~tement Sec 20-481 Shoreland Regulations, (b) "Additional Structure setbacks. The following additional structures setbacks apply regardless of the classification of the waterbody." These setbacks are inclusive. They are not to be added to the required setbacks. ARTICLE X. "A-2" AGRICULTRUAL ESTATE DISTRICT 20-575 Lot Requirements and Setbacks. (3.) The minimum lot depth is two hundred (200)feet. except that lots fi'onting on a cul dc sac shall bc at least two (200)feet at thc building setback line. Planning Commission August 30, 2000 Page 6 ARTICLE XI. "RR" RURAL RESIDENTAIL DISTRICT 20-595 Lot Requirements and Setbacks. (3.) The minimum lot depth is two hundred (200)feet. cxccpt that lots fronting on a cul de sac shall be at lcast two (200)feet at thc building setback linc. ARTICLE XXIII. General Supplemental Regulations 20-906 Alternative lot size requirement in A-2 and RR Residential District Minimum lot size requirement in the A-2 and RR Residential Zoning Districts located outside of the Metropolitan Council's Urban Service Area shall be regulated by article IX and article X of this chapter, respectively, or in the alternative may be ftfteen thousand (15, 000) square feet and, ninety (90) foot minimum lot frontage, ten (10)foot side yards and thirty (30)foot front attd rear yards, if the following conditions are met: ...... Sec 20-978 Subordinate Use The use of a dwelline for any home occupation shall be clearly incidental and subordinate to its residential use. Not more than twenty-five (25) percent of the floor area of the one (1) floor of a dwelline unit shall be used in the conduct of the home occupation. No garaee or accessory buildine except accessory a~ricultural buildings existim, on February 19, 1987 shall be used for any home occupation. ARTICLE II. Administration and Enforcement Division 5 Sec 20-94 Grading and Erosion Control. (c) Every effort shall be made to minimize disturbance of existing ground cover. No grading or filling shall be permitted within forty (40)feet o f the ordinary high water mark of a waterbody unless specifically approved by the city. All disturbed areas shall be replaced with a minimum of four (4) #tches of topsoiL To minimize the erosion potential of exposed areas, restoration of ground cover shall be provided within five (5) days after completion of the grading operation. CHAPTER 18 SUBDIVISONS ARTICLE III. Design Standards Sec 18-62 Erosion attd Seditnent control (a) The development shall conform to the topography and soils to create the least potential for soil erosion. Four (4) inches of topsoil shall be replaced on all disturbed areas. Planning Commission August 30, 2000 Page 7 DIVISION 2 PARKING AND LOADING $ec20-1124 Required number of on-site parking spaces (1)09 One (1) handicappcd parking stall shall bc placcd for cach fifly (50) stalls. Handicapped parking spaces shall be in compliance with the State Building Code. Section 20-1118 Computing requirements. There is a conflict regarding minimum drive aisle widths. It is staff's recommendation that drive aisle widths meet the standards in section 20-1101. To eliminate the conflict, staff is recommending the deletion of the following section: 20-1118(a) **Aisles which arc not between two (2) rows of ninety degree angle par~ting spaccs may bc twenty two (22)feet wide. DIVISION 2. SIGNS ALLOWED IN SPECIFIC DISTRICTS BY PERMIT Sec. 20-1301 Agricultural and residential districts (3) Non-residential signs. Only one (1) monument sign may be permitted on the site. The total sign area shall not exceed twenty-four (24) square feet of sign display area, nor be more than five (5) feet in height. Sec. 20-1303. Highway, general business districts and central business districts. (1) Pylon business sign ....This sign may identify the name of the center of or the major tenants. Sec. 20-1304. Industrial office park signs. Ground low profile business signs needs to be clarified the not every tenant receives a monument sign but rather one sign per frontage is permitted. Typographical Errors Sec. 20-109 Applications ...shall be made to the city planner on of-forms ...... Sec. 20-505(0 Require General Standards ... 50 feet fi'om Railroad lines fc, r or collector or arterial streets... ARTICLE XVIII "CDB" Central Business District Planning Commission August 30, 2000 Page 8 Sec 20-732 (14) and (19) are duplication eliminate (19) Personal services" Attachments 1. Memo from Kate Aanenson dated August 1, 2000 2. Suburban Ordinances 3. Minutes from August 15, 2000 Planning Commission meeting CITYOF 690 Oq Center Drive, PO Box I47 Chanhassen, Minnesota 553I 7 Phone 612.937.1900 General Fc~v 612,937.5739 E~gineering Fax 61Z 93 Z 915 2 Public Safi7 ~.v61293(2524 I~b wwmci.&anhassen, mn. us MEMORANDUM TO: Planning Commission FROM: Kate Aanenson AICP, Community Development Director DATE: August 1, 2000 SUB J: Code Amendments BACKGROUND Periodically the staff has recommended a series of code amendments. These amendments are a result of ambiguous language that may lead to diverse interpretations or plain uncertainty. Staff is recommending changes to the code that should resolve these known problems. Any amendments to Chapter 20 require a public hearing. There are some proposed amendments to' Chapter 18, but do not require a public hearing before the Planning Commission in order to be amended. However, they do require approval by the city council. They are shown here for your edification. ANALYSIS CHAPTER 20 ZONING SEC 20-1 Definitions, add: Buildable area. There has been a lot of confusion about buildable area. In some sections of the code it states a minimum of 60' x 40' pad while other areas it states 60' x 60' and the terms are not consistent. The PUD standard (60' x 40') was adopted in 1992. The wetland ordinance (60' x 60') was adopted in 1995. The tree removal requirement in subdivision regulations was adopted in 1996. Each lot must be buildable; this means it must meet the impervious surface requirements, meet minimum square footage for the type of dwelling and meet all required setbacks. Each lot shown for a subdivision is required to show the type of home proposed with the finished elevation. Having different definitions in different section of the code adds to the confusion. All lots are limited to the buildable area by the setbacks. They may further be restricted by easements (utility, conservation, etc.) shoreland regulations, wetland setbacks, bluff setbacks and drainage easements. The purpose of the buildable area is to provide a lot size that meets the minimum home size while providing some additional yard space. Minimum lot size was never intended to force a certain home shape (square). Lots come in all different shapes and sizes, as do homes. This variety is what allows for different price points on homes and lots. The most frequent problem faced, is homes that are too large for the lot. We have moved from two Code Amendments Page 2 car garages to three car garages, which may use more impervious surface and require a greater width. Staff is recommending in addition to the definition of building area to state: Buildable area means the area o fa lot remaining after the minimum yard and open space requirements of this chapter have been met. The buildable area excludes the area required for all setbacks, which may include wetland and wetland buffer, drainage and utility easements, shoreland, and bluff setback, conservation or tree preservation easements, etc. All lots must have a buildable area of 2,400 sq. ft. that will allow for an adequate building pad. Story This issue surfaced when the Legion proposed a building with a walk out basement. Staff made the interpretation that it was one story, based upon the Uniform Building Code Definition. The proposed language should clarify the definition of a story. Story: That portion of a building htcluded between the st,face of anyfloor attd the surface of the floor next above it. Or if there is no floor above it, then the space between the floor attd the ceiling next above it attd htclttdi, g those basements uses for the prhtcipal use. If the height is more than 12feet at arty pohtt, or if the height is more tltatt 6feet for more 50% of the peritneter than it is considered a story. C TOP OF FLOOR ~ . H~' 51 B ~ Standing seam metal roof is not defined in the city code. There are several applications of standing seam metal roofs in the city. The use of metal siding is acceptable only as accents on building and is defined in the code (Sec 20-116 (b)). This definition clarifies the application on standing seam metal on roofs. Standing Seam Roof is a deck roof consisting of flat metal joined by vertical or overlapping SClIlllS. Code Amendments August 1, 2000 Page 3 Body shop this is a permitted use in some of the commercial districts and needs a definition. Body shop is an establishment primarily engaged in the repair of auto bodies, automotive painting and refinishing. ARTICLE VIII. PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPEMT Sec 20-506(b) Standards and guidelines for Single Family detached Residential PUDs, .... "The "applicant must demonstrate that each lot is able to accommodate a 60 x d 0 foot build able area. lng pad and a twelve foot by twelve foot deck without intruding into any required setback area or protective easement. Each home must also have a minimum rear yard, thirty (30) foot deep. This area my not be encumbered by the required home/deck pads or by wetland/drainage easements. It may include area with step terrain or tree cover. Sec 20-508 Minimum Lot size in PUD, (b) "Minimum lot sized. Minimum lot sizes down to five thousand (5, 000) squarc feet may be allowed. There shall be no minimum lot size, however in no case shall net density exceed guidelines established by the city" This change eliminates the contradiction between minimum and no minimum. ARTICLE VI. Wetland Protection Sec 20-406 Wetland buffer Strip and Setback, "On single-family subdivisions in the RSF district, the applicant must demonstrate that each lot provides sufficient area to accommodate the applicable front yard setback, 60 x 60 foot deep buildable area. ing pad, and a thirty foot rear yard area. All of these elements must be outside of designated u,etland and buffer strip areas." Section 20-406 Wetland structure and Setback There is some ambiguity regarding principal and accessory structure setbacks. There is a 40' setback in the Primary Bluff Creek Zone, with no work allowed within the 20' setback nearest the primary zone. Similarly, in the 30' required bluff setback, no work is allowed within the 20' bluff impact zone, but work is allowed within the first 10' of the setback from the bluff. We are proposing that the City revise the current table and diagram to reflect the following: "Accessory structures are allowed within the first 1/2 of the principal structure setback. This accessory structure setback would vary by wetland type. For an ag/urban wetland, the back edge of the principal structure would have to be 40' from the edge of the buffer, but the back edges of accessory structures would have to be located at least 20' from the edge of the buffer." Code Amendments August 1, 2000 Page 4 Wetland Type Principal Structure Setback Accessory Structure Setback Buffer Strip Buffer Strip Minimuln Average Width % of Native Vegetation in Buffer Strip Pristine Natural Ag/Urban Utilized 100' 40' measured 40' measured O' from the outside from the outside edge of the edge of the buffer strip buffer strip 50' 20' measured 20' measured O' from the outside from the outside edge of the edge of the buffer strip buffer strip 20-100' 10-30' 0-20' O' 50' 20' 10' 0' Entire Entire Optional Optional 3 (3/I)glS~lg w~'TL. AND I LLUS TgATIorJ I ( v~E*~ t-A~Jb Code Amendments August 1, 2000 Page 5 CHAPTER 18 SUBDIVISIONS, ART. III Design standards Sec 18-61 Landscaping and tree preservation requirements (d) (4) "In a single family detached residential developments the applicant must demonstrate that suitable homes site exist on each lot by describing a 60 x 60 foot buildable area ing pad. (which includes deck area) with out intrttding into required setback and easements." ARTICLE VII Shoreland Management Sec 20-481 Shoreland Regulations, (b) "Additional Structure setbacks. The following additional structures setbacks apply regardless of the classification of the waterbody." These setbacks are inclusive. They are not to be added to the required setbacks. Lot Frontage in the A-2 & RR Districts: There is a requirement that lots fronting on a cul-de- sac be at least 200 feet in width at the building setback line. The same language appears in the tot depth requirements and is in error because it is duplicated from the frontage standard, which reads "(2) The minimum lot fi~ontage is two hundred (200)feet, except that the minimum lot fi'ontage of lots fi'onting on a cul-de-sac shall be at least two hundred (200)feet at the building setback line." ARTICLE X. "A-2" AGRICULTRUAL ESTATE DISTRICT 20-575 Lot Requirements and Setbacks. (3.) The minimum lot depth is two hundred (200)feet. except that lots fi'onting on a cul dc sac shall be at least two (200)feet at thc building setback linc. ARTICLE XI. "RR" RURAL RESIDENTAIL DISTRICT 20-595 Lot Requirements and Setbacks. (3.) The minimum lot depth is two hundred (200)feet. except that lots fi'onting on a cul dc sac shall bc at least two (200)feet at the building setback line. ARTICLE XXIII. General Supplemental Regulations Alternative lot size requirement in A-2 and RR Residential District In Section 20-906 it allows lots an alternative lot size (as small as 15,000 square feet) if the 1 unit per 10 acres is maintained. In the A-2 and the RR zoning district it states that these lots must have a minimum frontage and depth of 200 feet. Therefore, the smallest lot size permitted is 40,000 square feet. The proposed change will allow lots as small as 15,000 with the standards of RSF district. 20-906 Alternative lot size requirement in A-2 and RR Residential District Minimum lot size requirement in the A-2 and RR Residential Zoning Districts located outside of the Metropolitan Council's Urban Service Area shall be regulated by article IX and article ~ of this chapter, respectively, or in the alternative may be fifieen thousand (15, 000) square feet and, Code Amendments August 1, 2000 Page 6 ninety (90)foot mininmm lot frontage, ten (lO)foot side yards attd thirty (30)foot front and rear yards, if the following conditions are met... Sec 20-978 Subordinate Use The staff has difficulty enforcing home occupations that operate out of a garage or accessory building. The most common violator is a contractors' yard. They tend to seek out properties with a pole barn. Because there is no business license requirement, contractors' yards are difficult to track until the complaints from the neighbors start. The use ora dwelling for any home occupation shall be clearly incidental and subordinate to its residential use. Not more than twenty-five (25) percent of the floor area of the one (1)floor of a dwelling unit shall be used in the conduct of the home occupation. No garage or accessory building except accessory agricultural buildings existing on February ]9, 1987 shall be used for any home occupation. Topsoil requirement The city has adopted the best management practices book which describes limits to soil erosion. One of the practices is 3 inches of tilled soil before seed or sod is applied. The book does not specifically state that topsoil should be replaced on all distributed areas. Amendments in the zoning and subdivision chapters will require all lots to replace all disturbed area with topsoil. Topsoil should also assist in preservation of lawns. ARTICLE II. Administration and Enforcement Division 5 Sec 20-94 Grading and Erosion Control. (c) Every effort shall be made to minimize disturbance of existing ground cover. No grading or filling shall be permitted within forty (40)feet of the ordinwy high water mark o fa u~aterbody unless specifically approved by the city. All disturbed areas shall be replaced with a mhtimum of four (4) inches of topsoiL To minimize the erosion potential of expbsed areas, restoration of ground cover shall be provided within five (5) days after completion of the grading operation. CHAPTER 18 SUBDIVISONS ARTICLE III. Design Standards Sec 18-62 Erosion attd Sedintent control (a) The development shall conform to the topography and soils to create the least potential for soil erosion. Fottr (4) htches of topsoil shall be replaced on all disturbed areas. DIVISION 2 PARKING AND LOADING Section 20-1124 Required number of on-site parking spaces Code Amendments August 1, 2000 Page 7 The State Building Code requires handicapped parking stalls be provided for each 25 parking stalls. The zoning ordinance requires one stall for each fifty stalls. The State Building Code regulates handicapped parking. The amendment will not state a standard but will reference the State Building Code. Sec20-1124 Required number of on-site parking spaces (1)09 One (J) handicapped parking stall shall be placed for each fifty (50) stalls. Handicapped parking spaces shall be in compliance with the State Building Code. Section 20-1118 Computing requirements. There is a conflict regarding minimum drive aisle widths. It is staff's recommendation that drive aisle ~vidths meet the standards in section 20-1101. To eliminate the conflict, staff is recommending the deletion of the following section: 20-1118(a) **Aisles which are not between two (2) rows of ninety degree angle parking spaces may be twenty two (22)feet wide. DIVISION 2. SIGNS ALLOWED IN SPECIFIC DISTRICTS BY PERMIT Sec. 20-1301 Agricultural and residential districts Currently, a business in an A-2 or residential district is not permitted signage unless specifically spelled out in the code such as institutional or the home occupation ordinance. This amendment would provide for signage for uses like the petting farm. (3) Non-residential signs. Only one (1) monument sign may be permitted on the site. The total sign area shall not exceed twenty-four (24) square feet of sign display area, nor be more than five (5) feet in height. Sec. 20-1303. Highway, general business districts and central business districts. (1) Pylon business sign .... This sign may identify the name of the center of or the major tenants. Sec. 20-1304. Industrial office park signs. Ground low profile business signs needs to be clarified that not every tenant receives a monument sign but rather one sign per frontage is permitted. (2) Ground low profile business signs. One (1) ground low profile business sign shall be permitted per site for each street fi'ontage for each individual tenant. Such sign shall not exceed... The wall sign section needs to be changed so that the language is consistent with section 20-1302 & 1303 -- need to add language that states for each business. Code Amendments August 1, 2000 Page 8 (3) Wall business signs. Wall business signs shall be permitted on street frontage for each business occupant within a building only. The total of all wall mounted sign display areas for each business shall not exceed the square footage established in the following table .... Typographical Errors Sec. 20-109 Applications ...shall be made to the city planner on of-forms ...... Sec. 20-505(0 Require General Standards ... 50feet from Railroad lines for or collector or arterial streets... ARTICLE XVIII "CDB" Central Business District Sec 20-732 (14) and (19) are duplication eliminate (19) Personal services RECOMMENDATION "Staff recommends the Planning Commission recommend approval to the city council the following code amendments: SEC 20-1 Definitions, add: Buildable area means the area o fa lot remaining after the minimum yard and open a7)ace requirements of this chapter have been met. The buildable area excludes the area required for all setbacks, which may include wetland and wetland buffer, drainage and utility easements, shoreland, and bluff setback, conservation or tree preservation easements, etc. Ail lots must have a buiidable area of 2,400 sq. ft. that will allow for an adequate building pad. Story: That portion of a building included bet~veen the surface of any floor and the surface of the floor next above it. Or if there is no floor above it, then the space bet3veen the floor and the ceiling next above it and including those basements uses for the principal use. If the height is more than 12 feet at any point, or if the height is more than 6 feet for more 50% of the perimeter than it is considered a story. C TOP OF FLOOR ~ ~ B h ~ ~1~.-~-~~ /'''~'''' j Code Amendments August I, 2000 Page 9 Standing Seam Roof is a deck roof consisting of flat metal joined by vertical or overlapping seams. Body shop is an establishment primarily engaged in the repair of auto bodies, automotive painting and refinishing. ARTICLE VIII. PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPEMT Sec 20-506(b) Standards and guidelines for Single Family detached Residential PUDs, .... "The "applicant must demonstrate that each lot is able to accommodate a 60 x d 0 foot buildable area. ing pad and a twelve foot by twelve foot deck without intruding into any required setback area or protective easement. Each home must also have a minimum rear yard, thirty (30) foot deep. This area my not be encumbered by the required home/deck pads or by wetland/drainage easements. It may include area with step terrain or tree cover. Sec 20-508 Minimum Lot size in PUD, (b) "Afinimum lot sized Minimum lot sizes down to five thousand (5, 000) square feet may be allowed There shall be no minimum lot size, however in no case shall net density exceed guidelines established by the city." ARTICLE VI. Wetland Protection Sec 20-406 Wetland buffer Strip and Setback, "On single-family subdivisions in the RSF district, the applicant must demonstrate that each lot provides sufficient area to accommodate the applicable front yard setback, 60 x 60 foot deep buildable area. ing pad, and a thirty foot rear yard ama. All of these elements must be outside of designated wetland and buffer strip areas." Section 20-406 Wetland structure and Setback "Accessory structures are allowed within the first 1/2 of the principal structure setback. This accessory structure setback would vary by wetland type. For an ag/urban svetland, the back edge of the principal structure would have to be 40' from the edge of the buffer, but the back edges of accessory structures would have to be located at least 20' from the edge of the buffer." IVe#and Type Pristhm Principal Structure 100' Setback Accessory Structure 50' Setback Buffer Strip 20-100' Natural Ag/Urban Utilized 40' measured 40' measured 0' from the outside from the outside edge of the edge of the buffer strip buffer strip 20' measured 20' measured 0' from the outside from the outside edge of the edge of the buffer strip buffer strip 10-30' 0-20' 0' Code Amendments August 1, 2000 Page 10 Buffer Strip Minimum 50' Average Width 20' 10' 0' % of Native Vegetation Entire in Buffer Strip Entire Optional Optional A G/UF.~Ah/w~-TLANb I LLU,S TRATIoh) I I I I I I ( I i / CHAPTER 18 SUBDIVISIONS ART. III Design Standards Sec 18-61 Landscaping and tree preservation requirements (d) (4) "In single family detached residential developments, the al¥)licant must demonstrate that suitable home sites exist on each lot by describing a 60 x 60 foot buildable area ing pad. (which includes deck area) u,ithout intruding into required setback and easements." ARTICLE VII Shoreland Management Sec 20-481 Shoreland Regulations, (b) "Additional Structure setbacks'. Thefollou,ing additional structures setbacl~s apply regardless of the classification of the waterbody. " These setbacks are inclusive. They are not to be added to the required setbacks. ARTICLE X. "A-2" AGRICULTRUAL ESTATE DISTRICT 20-575 Lot Requirements and Setbacks. (3.) The minimum lot depth is nvo hundred (200)feet. except that lots fi'onti/,g on a cul de sac shall be at least two (200)feet at the building setback line. Code Amendments August 1,2000 Page 11 ARTICLE XI. "RR" RURAL RESIDENTAIL DISTR/CT 20-595 Lot Requirements and Setbacks. (3.) The minimum lot depth is two hundred (200)feet. except &at lots fi'onting on a cul de sac shall bc at least two (200)feet at thc building setback line. ARTICLE XXIII. General Supplemental Regulations 20-906 Alternative lot size requirement in A-2 and RR Residential District Minimum lot size requirement in the A-2 and RR Residential Zoning Districts located outside of the Metropolitan Council's Urban Service Area shall be regulated by article IJd and article _J( of this chapter, respectively, or in the alternative may be fifteen thousand (15, 000) square feet and, uinety (90)foot m#t#num lot frontage, ten (lO)foot side yards and thirty (30)foot front and rear yards, if the following conditions are met: ...... Sec 20-978 Subordinate Use The use of a dwelling for any home occupation shall be clearly incidental and subordinate to its residential use. Not more than twenty-five (25) percent of the floor area of the one (1) floor of a dwelling unit shall be used in the conduct of the home occupation. No garage or accessory building except accessory agricultural buildings existing on February 19, 1987 shall be used for any home occupation. ARTICLE II. Administration and Enforcement Division 5 Sec 20-94 Grading and Erosion Control. (c) Eve~y effort shall be made to minimize disturbance of existing ground cover. No grading or filling shall be permitted within forty (40)feet of the ordinary high water mark of a waterbody unless spec!fically approved by the city. All disturbed areas shall be replaced with a mhtimum of four (4) htches of topsoiL To minimize the erosion potential of exposed areas, restoration of ground cover shall be provided within five (5) days after completion of the grading operation. CHAPTER 18 SUBDIVISONS ARTICLE III. Design Standards Sec 18-62 Erosion and Sediment control (a) The development shall conform to the topography and soils to create the least potential for soil erosion. Four (4) inches of topsoil shall be replaced on all disturbed areas. DIVISION 2 PARKING AND LOADING Sec20-1124 Required number of on-site parMng spaces (1)(/) O,c (1) handicapped parki,g stall shall bc p/aced for each fifiy (50) stalls. Handicapped parking spaces shall be in compliance with the State Building Code. Code Amendments August 1, 2000 Page 12 Section 20-1118 Computing requirements. There is a conflict regarding minimum drive aisle widths. It is staff's recommendation that drive aisle widths meet the standards in section 20-1101. To eliminate the conflict, staff is recommending the deletion of the following section: 20-1118(a) **Aisles which are not between two (2) rows of ninety degree angle parking spaces may be twenty two (22)feet wide. DIVISION 2. SIGNS ALLOWED IN SPECIFIC DISTRICTS BY PERMIT Sec. 20-1301 Agricultural and residential districts (3) Non-residential signs. Only one (1) monument sign may be permitted on the site. The total sign area shall not exceed twenty-four (24) square feet of sign display area, nor be more than five (5) feet in height. Sec. 20-1303. Highway, general business districts and central business districts. (1) Pylon business sign .... This sign may identify the name of the center of or the major tenants. Sec. 20-1304. Industrial office park signs. Ground low profile business signs needs to be clarified the not every tenant receives a monument sign but rather one sign per frontage is permitted. Typographical Errors Sec. 20-109 Applications ... shall be made to the city planner on of-forms ...... Sec. 20-505(0 Require General Standards ... 50 feet fi'om Railroad lines for or collector or arterial streets... ARTICLE XVII! "CDB" Central Business District Sec 20-732 (14) and (19) are duplication eliminate (19) Personal services" g:\plan\ka\codcamd.pc.doc Planning Police Public Works (lOX, 6-6-95) Block is an area of land within a subdivision that is entirely botmded by streets, or by streets and the exterior boundary or boundaries of the subdivision, or a combination of the above with a stream or lake. Boulevard is that portion of the street right-of-way between the curb line and the property line. Buildable Lots: In areas lacking municipal sanitary sewer, ali lots or parcels shall have an area of at least 22,500 square feet with a finished grade of at least six (6') feet above the seasonal high water mark. All organic material shall be removed and replaced with granular material with no more than five (5%) percent organic material by volume. Thc lowest floor shall be at least three (3 ') feet above the seasonal high water mark in the area of construction pursuant to Ordinance No. 17 as anaended unless evidence is submitted and certified by a geotechn.ical engineer that shall be reviewed and certified by an independent geotechnical engineer hired by the City at the expense of the developer and approved by the City Council that a separation of less than three (3') feet can be achieved and is warranted. (10V, 11-17-92; 10Y, 9-25-96) In areas served by municipal sanitary sewer, all lots or parcels shall have all organic material removed and replaced with granular material with no more than five (5%) percent organic material by volume for the front one hundred (100') feet of depth of the lot at a minimum width of the lot as required for that zoning district by the Zoning Ordinance. The lowest floor shall be at least three (3') feet above the seasonal high water mark in the area of construction pursuant to Ordinance No. 17 as an~ended unless evidence is submitted and certified by a geotechnical engineer that shall be reviewed and certified by an independent geoteehnieal hired by the City at the expense of the developer and approved by the City Council that a separation of less than three (3') feet can be achieved and is warranted. (10V, 11-17-92; 10Y, 9-25-96) Butt Lot is a lot at the end ora block located between two corner lots. Comprehensive Plan means a compilation of policy Statements, goals, standards, and maps for guiding the physical, social and economic development, both private and public, of the City and its environs. 2 300.02 Zoning Regulations 10. "Basement" - any floor level below the fu'st story. 11. "Basement floor elevation (minimum)" - the lowest floor of a building. 12. "Berm" - a landscaped mound of earth used for aesthetic or buffer purposes. (Figure 1) Figure 13. 14. 15. 16. "Boarding or lodging house" - a dwelling unit or part of a dwelling unit in which meals, sleeping accommodations, or meals and sleeping accommodations are provided for compensation to no more than five persons who do not function as a single housekeeping unit. "Boathouse" - an uninhabited accessory structure built and occupied solely for the storage of marine vehicles and equipment. "Buffer" - the use of land, topography, open space or landscaping to visibly separate and filter a use of property from another adjacent or nearby use. "Buildable area" - a contiguous portion of a lot that is suitable for the location of the primary structure and that excludes all existing and proposed easements, setback areas for principal structures, wetlands, floodplains, the neck portion of any neck or flag lot, steep slopes that are unbuildable under this ordinance, and other unbuildable areas. Certain easements may be included in the buildable area at the discretion of the city if their inclusion is consistent with the intent of this code. (Figure 2) Figure 2 3-6 Minnetonka City Code CITY OF MINNETONKA 952 939 8244 P.03×04 300.10 Zoning Regnlatio~ d) e) 2) all accessory structures except detached garage~ which are located between the principal structure and the front lot line shall maintain a minimum setback of 50 feet; 3) sheds or storage buildings less than 120 square feet in size shall be located behind the rear building line of the house; and 4) swimming pools shall be located behind the front building line of the house, and 15 feet side and rear setbacks as measured to the water line are required. On corner lots, swimming pools shall be subject to front yard setbacks established for principal structures. Off-street parking shall be provided for at least two vehicles for all single family dwellings. A suitable location for a garage measuring at least 20 feet by 24 feet which does not require a variance shall be provided and indicated as such on a survey or site plan to be submitted when applying for a building permit to construct a new dwelling or alter an existing garage. Each lot must have a buildable area as defined by this ordinance. The purpose for a buildable area is to ensure that each lot has a reasonable area for the location of a house, attached garage, and associated decks or patios and that there is sufficient room for the location of the house to be positioned to minimize the physical impacts on the lot and to be consistent with the surrounding neighborhood. This does not require that a house pad occupy the entire buildable area. Each lot must have a buildable area that complies with the following: 1) The buildable area must meet the following minimums: a. minimum size: 3,500 square feet; b. minimum number of sides: 4; and c. minimum dimension of each of at least four sides: 40 feet. 2) The buildable area must be designated by the applicant and approved by the city counciI at the time of the subdivision creating the lot. For pre-existing lots, the buildable area will be designated by the director of planning based on the standards contained in this ordinance. 3-44 Minnetonka City Code RU6-25-2000 15:02 CITY OF HINNETONKR 952 939 8244 P.04×04 V Zoning Regulations 300.10 b) c) 3) The city may require that construction within the buildable area be located where the city determines it would reasonably: minimize the amount of adverse impacts to the physical environment on the lot, including such things as significant trees, grading, erosion, and surface water drainage, and b. be consistent with the location of the structures in the surrounding neighborhood. 4) No principal structure, or any portion of it, may bc located outside the buildable area, cxccpt when intrusions into setbacks are allowed by this code. if a home exists on a lot with less than the minimum buildable area, the home may be enlarged or rebuilt within the applicable setbacks without a variance from the buildable area standard. Exceptions for Qualifying Small Lots, The buildable status of R-1 lots is determined in accordance with section 300.07, subd. l(b). If a substandard lot has been declared buildable, the provisions of this subdivision (section 300.10, subd. 7) may be applied. In recognition of the exceptional circumstances of nonconforming small lots located in neighborhoods of similarly sized lots, the R-1 district setback standards shall be reduced for lots meeting the following criteria: 1) less than 15,000 square feet; 2) lot of record as of February 12, 1966, or lots approved by the city subsequent to this date; and 3) located in an area in which the average size of all residential lots within 400 feet is less than 15,000 square feet. The following standards shall apply to principal structures located on qualifying small lots: Minnetonka City Code 3-45 Plamfing Commission Meeting - August 15, 2000 17. All areas disturbed as a result of construction activities shall be immediately restored with seed and discqnulched or wood fiber blanket or sod within two weeks of completion of each activity in accordance with the City's Best Management Practice Handbook. 18. All utility and street improvements shall be constructed in accordance with the latest edition of the City's Standard Specifications and Detail Plates. Detailed construction plans and specifications shall be submitted for staff review and City Council approval. The construction plans and specifications will need to be submitted to a minimum of three weeks prior to final consideration. 19. The applicant shall enter into a Development Contract/PUD Agreement with the City and provide the necessary financial security to guarantee compliance with the terms of the developlnent contract. 20. The applicant shall apply for and obtain permits from the appropriate regulatory agencies, i.e. Watershed District, Metropolitan Environmental Service Commission, Minnesota Department of Health, and Minnesota Pollution Control Agency and comply with their conditions of approval. 21. No berlning or landscaping shall be permitted within the City's right-of-way. A 2% boulevard grade must be maintained along the City's right-of-way. 22. Tile applicant shall report to the City Engineer the location of any drain tiles found during construction and shall relocate or abandon the drain tile as directed by the City Engineer. 23. Utility and drainage easements over all utilities and storm water ponds outside of the right-of- way. The minimum easement width over the utilities shall be 20 feet wide depending on the depth of the utility. Drainage easelnents over all ponds and wetlands shall be up to the 100 year flood level. 24. Applicant shall consult with wetland expert to verify that there are no wetlands on site. 25. Tile Planning Commission xvould urge the applicant to ~vork with the existing neighborhood regarding joining their homeowners association. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously. PUBLIC HEARING: CONSIDER AMENDMENTS TO THE CHAPTER 20 ZONING ORDINANCE REGARDING THE FOLLOWING SECTIONS; ADDING NEW DEFINITIONS, STORAGE BUILDABLE AREAS, BOARD OF ADJUSTMENTS, SHORELAND REGULATIONS (ADDITIONAL SETBACKS), WETLAND REGULATIONS (ACCESSORY), PUD LOT SIZES, LOT FRONTAGES IN A2 AND RR DISTRICTS, SIGN ORDINANCE (WALL SIGNS) PERMITTED USES IN IOP DISTRICT, AND HOME OCCUPATIONS (SUBORDINATE USE). Public Present: Name Address 25 Planning Commission Meeting - August 15, 2000 Dean Paxton Sandra Johnson Jerry & Jan Paulsen 2611 Orchard Laue 2621 Orchard Lane 7305 Laredo Drive Kate Aanenson presented the staff report on this item and asked if there were any questions from the Planning Commission. Kind: Kate, do you think there's any advantage to having just the setback lines be required to be on these plats? Or do you think it's important to show building orientation? Aanenson: We display them on the survey. We check each one as they come ill before you look at theln. We look and see if it's a legitimate, buildable lot. That's part of the process. What we look at on this is to give us an elevation. Again what the top of the, the grade of the garage is and that's to get your flow down from tbe garage to the street. The other elevation we get with this is the back of the lot. So however that configures, they still have to maintain that drainage flow and that's what we look at. But tbe survey, each individual survey is what we match up with aud then detail all the setbacks. All required easements have to be on the survey and that goes with the building permit and that's what we match up. Kind: Solnetimes when l'm Iookiug at a site plau like this last Meridian one, it kind of goofs me up ahnost to see the home orientation aud that's kind of what was bugging me about those lines not being radial because they showed these houses on there kind of funky and that's probably not how the houses are goiug to be built. Aanenson: Absolutely. Absolutely, and that's what I'm saying it depends. Kind: In some ways I wish they weren't even on there. The house. Aauenson: Right. That's what I'm saying. Really for us it's to give us au elevation aud style of home because the style of home again is going to drive some of the grading, which we look at to say how much grading is needed for that type of holne and how's it going to work with tile lot next door because we've had past experiences, 10 years ago, where the gradiug didn't match up. We have less problem now because we have less lots that are the multi builders. We have got one individual builder, although we've had problems with that too because what happeus when you get a buyer that wants a certain house. Generally the builder will try to make it happen. That's a probleln. You've got a sale and that's where we have to stick to the plan that was approved. Kiud: And wheu you say type of house you're saying a walkout versus a look out versus a full basement. Aanenson: Right, and some of those minor changes, we have worked. We have worked on that. If they can bring us in a survey, we do allow some of that flexibility like the stages in the grading on an individual basis. Right, that has happened. Again, they'd have to demonstrate that on the survey and they've worked with engineering. And that's something also that tile inspectors check when they go up for inspection on the footings. They also have to have that grade cbecked to make sure it's consistent with what was shown on the survey so there's 2 or 3 places for checks for that. Kind: Another question. What do you thiuk about the idea of in addition to this 2,400 square foot designatiou for a building pad includiug a lninimum depth for that building pad area? 26 Planning Commission Meeting - August 15, 2000 Aanenson: I think, how we came up with the 2,400 square feet is, we have a place in the ordinance that requires a certain square footage of home, whether it be rambler or two story or a split and if you add a garage, you kuow the different configurations even with the deck. We came up with the 2,400 square feet because that seems like a reasonable square footage for the house. Again, most of the houses, right now the trend's to push the garage towards the front and maybe set it out 10 feet or something like that. I wouldn't have a problem with that. I guess we attempted to get that with it, that allows for adequate building pad because we do have the requirement for certain square footage. That they have to have, our ordinance does require a 2 car garage. And we do require minimum square footage so it's covered there. Could you put a trailer style home on the lot, is that your question? Kind: Yeah. Aanenson: I guess you could. Even if you look at the depth ora garage, I mean you're looking at a minimun~ maybe 25 feet with that. Are you looking at what. Kind: 30 feet or you kuow, maybe it's covered by our requirement for a garage. Aanenson: 1 can give that some thought. I guess I'd like to run that past tile attorney as far as pros or cons or flexibility. Yeah, I mean certainly something is, what's going to raise your comfort level, right. I tnean it could be either way. Minimum. But I think it's our job too when'we look at these to say that they can get something, something on them which is what we try to do tOO. Kind: Right. And I think a requirement for a garage probably satisfies the minimuln depth. Aanenson: Right. And most people again tile trend seems, they're pushing the garage out forward and then the house sets back and then if you put the deck on, you're already getting a good maybe 40 I'd say is pretty minimum for most people. And it's not a requirement. We've bounce that around to a deck. Do we want more people on a deck? I'm not sure. Then if you don't have a deck, do you have a right to a variance? Right, so good point. We can look at that. Kind: Maybe it's the garage width plus a typical deck xvidth, which probably puts it at the 40. Aanenson: Yeah, 30 or 40, sure. Kind: I don't know. I like the idea of doing something like that. Okay. Aanenson: Moving along with story. Since you've got that and there seems to be some ambiguity in what we were attempting there. I think certainly we have residential height which we talked about earlier. This really refers to the kind of the commercial/industrial and that's where the question came when the Legion was looking at building their site. They had a walkout and that caused us some consternation because now if it's a walkout it changes the parking dimensions and we were looking at the UBC, or the State Building Code which had a definition and that's what we tried to attempt to put in here and I think there's some ambiguity. Let me go through. What we're attempting to do here is to say, if it's over, at 12 feet of height which makes up a story. If50% of that is exposed, it's a story under the commercial office and maybe we should clarify that because residential has it's own definition and I don't want to confuse the two because we have that a separate. So if we look at that, that would constitute a story. So ifa commercial business, and we had one like this. If you look at, if you remember Mi'. Gorra's building that walked out. 27 Planning Commission Meeting - August 15, 2000 Blackowiak: Oil Coulter and Stone Creek? Aanenson: Correct. Okay, but he did provide parking and all that. That was included. But that would give us the better definition of story. And then if it was less than 12 feet in height, less than 50% underground, then it wouldn't constitute a story so I think what we do is give you better graphics there. Try to clean that up a little bit but that was our attempt to qualify what is meant by a commercial/office definition of story. Okay? The next one is standing seam siding and that's not defined in the code. We've bad this question come up on, it's applied in roofs quite a bit but we did not have a definition so hopefully that definition will clarify that and that would be that standing seam roof is a deck roof consisting of flat metal joined by vertical overlapping seams so there is some rib to it. It's not straight sheet metal. Again our ordinance already restricts how much metal applied to industrial buildings. It can only be used as accent detail. Okay, a body shop. This came up and a permitted use of some of the comlnercial definitions and there's a lot of different interpretations of body shops. So what we're saying is a body shop is pri~narily engaged in repair of automobiles. We've had a lot of different interpretations or opinions on that. Burton: Why tile word primarily because doesn't that lead to argument? Aanenson: Well some people do and they do other businesses there and that may be ancillary to what they're doing. So if that's your primary business, then it becomes a body shop. You know we have questions, is muffier, is painting part of that. Okay. Under the PUD. Again, this PUD section has the 60 x 40 which conflicts with the tree preservation area which we looked at...60 x 40. So again we're trying to resolve a conflict. So we would eliminate that language as proposed in the staff report that would say, the applicant must demonstrate that each lot is able to accommodate the buildable area as defined in the definition. The next one under PUD. 2508. Talks about minimum lot size. It says there is ilo minimum lot size but then it qualifies it to say, it can't be smaller than 5,000 square feet which would invalidate all of North Bay and Walnut Grove. So it hasn't been interpreted that way but just to make sure there's no ambiguity, we're striking that out. Wetland protection. Blackowiak: Excuse me Kate. Would you go back to that lninimum lot size? Aanenson: That's in multi-falnily. Blackowiak: Okay. I'm sorry. Aanenson: We're in the multi~family... Blackowiak: Because we just looked at residential at 11,000 at, you know 11,000 minimum. Average. Aanenson: Exactly. That's for single family. This would be for anything that's guided medium density or high density, which was North Bay was guided, at the time was guided high density. We rezoned it to medium density and similar with Walnut Grove. So they were, both of those have projects that have lot sizes under 5 certainly. Closer to 3,000 square feet. Blackowiak: Okay. Aanenson: The wetland buffer setback. This bas colne up on a couple of industrial projects where we had the setback from the wetlands but you've got interpretations of what constitutes an accessory structure. We had to get a legal opinion on one. Is a parking lot accessory structure? You know. 28 Planning Commission Meeting - August 15, 2000 Blackowiak: Is it? Aanenson: Yes. The legal opinion. Blackowiak: Tennis court? Aanenson: Yes. Right. Well we got in discussion, but that also has impervious surface requirements. Where we got into the gray area is when you've got a setback and mom and dad want to put a swing set in the back, or a dog run. We don't care about that. We've got to find a way to make that happen without, because that's not really affecting the impervious surface to the same extent that a tennis court or parking lot would. So Lori looked at this and came up with some language and this is the existing ordinance and so what we have proposed in the staff report is new language that says, that first 20 feet of xvhat would be proposed is this first 20 feet would be, you can't have any accessory structure. Beyond that, of the 40 foot required, so this is the area where you could put the accessory structures, swing set, etc. Play fort. Those sort of things so you can use that portion of the back yard for accessory structures. Again, it's not clearly defined what the accessory structures and how they can be applied and it comes up consistently. There's no question. Kind: Do you want to try and define accessory structures in definitions? Aaneuson: Well I think, tile ordinance does define accessory structure. Kind: Okay. Aanenson: But it's tile setback and how it plays in with the wetland, correct. Kind: Do you have a question Alison? Blackowiak: I do. Actually I have a couple of things. First we're talking about like commercial and then we switch to residential. Aanenson: Well the wetland buffer applies to anything. Blacko~viak: Okay. Aanenson: Okay, I was just giving it as a... Blackowiak: So if parking lot is an accessory structure, it could be in that second 20 feet of the wetland buffer? Aanenson: It could be in this portion, right. Blackowiak: Isn't that kind of defeating the entire purpose of a wetland buffer? Aaueuson: Right, but they're still bound by the impervious surface too so. Blackowiak: Well let's say they meet the impervious, they could stick it back there if they wanted to. Is that what the intent is? 29 Planning Commission Meeting - August 15, 2000 Aanenson': No. Blaekowiak: So why are we even allowing any accessory structure in that area if our intent is not to have things back there? Aanenson: Well I think if you waut to exclude certain things, I would recommend that because I don't think it's fair to tell someone they can't put a swing set up there. They can't put a play fort up there. Some of that stuff really is pretty nolninal. But if you want to exclude certain types of things, again this is our first blush at it. BIackowiak: Yeah, because I'm just saying, I can't imagine that anybody ~vould want to stick a parking lot back there, but let's say they do for some aesthetics or because the way the building is oriented or you know, whatever reason. I don't think that's what we want. I don't think that's our intent and I think that if we say that we can put things back there, accessory structures, we're just opening up a potential can of worms. Aanenson: Right. Again... Blackowiak: So let's find a way to exclude. Aanenson: Staff's interpretation was on that, the Gorra site plan that had to meet the setback. He had requested...and we looked at that. But we've had other requests. So if you want to exclude. Blackowiak: 1 think that that might be a better way to do it. You know just especially since you're talking about parking lots. Aanenson: If you try to list, you're not going to list everything that's permitted but if you want to exclude certain things, I think tha! might be easier. Blackowiak: You know you could exclude parking lots. You cottld exclude tennis courts. I mean because those are, you know they have a high impervious surface area. Now a swing set doesn't, I mean so 1 don't know. Do you exclude things that are impervious? Pcterson: You can exclude things that are not appropriate to the area. Have something generic like that. So they cau decide what's appropriate. Blackowiak: Yeah, like I say. Aanenson: It gets really tough. Blackowiak: Oh l'm sure it does. Aanensou: A sandbox. A dog FUll that's concrete. Peterson: Well you aren't going to be able to list everything so uses might as well be generic so. Aanenson: Right. Well that's why l'm saying, it has to be exclusive. 30 Planning Commission Meeting - August 15, 2000 Blackowiak: We could exclude parking lots. I mean you could at least list a few things impervious and then say, and other similar impervious surfaces or, I don't know. I just think you want to get... Aanenson: I guess that's how we've been interpreting up to this point is Iooking at the impervious surface. If it's a solid surface, then we would say no. Just like we would say if it was a deck or patio, then it would be no. Blackowiak: Okay. Aanenson: So it's the accessory structure. Blackowiak: Okay. Kind: Oh Kate, in that area. For clarity I'd like to remove the back edge of language in the example. Aanenson: Sure. It reads better that way. Kind: I had to read it 3 times to get through it. Aanenson: Again, I pointed this out in the report but I didn't speak to it. Thepublic hearing or amendments to Chapter 20 are reqnired to have a public hearing in front of the Planning Commission. We showed amendments to Chapter 18 just so you see how they're weaving together but technically ill your motion they aren't included because only the City Council addresses those but we wanted to show you those that we're carrying forward just for your edification. So 18-61. Landscaping D(4) which is this one. Talking about the 60 x 60 pad, which we've always interpreted as a tree removal pad. Obviously there's another interpretation to that. It says iii a single family home this would be our recommendation. Detached residential development, the applicant must demonstrate that single home sites exist on each lot by describing the buildable area. Without intruding into the required setbacks. Okay. The shoreland manager one. That falls in, the ordinance reads, additional structure setbacks and our intent on that again is to clarify some ambiguity. If you have a setback, for example if you have a 20 foot drainage easelnent in your yard and you have a 10 foot side yard setback, well you obviously have to stay at least 20 feet ahead of that Utility easement. You've already met the 10 feet because you're well beyoud it with the 20 so you can go right up to the edge of that. So the intent of this is, that if you ah'eady have the setback 75 feet from the edge of the lakeshore and there happens to be. Blackowiak: Or on a bluff. Aanenson: Which is further back, that's the one we follow. Exactly, you don't add them up, right and we haven't... Most of these, lot frontages in the A2 and RR. If you read the first one, the minimum lot fi'ontage is 200 feet except at the minimum lot frontage on a cul-de-sac shall be 200 feet. Well, then if you read the next one dowu, the minimum lot depth is 200 feet except lots fronting. It repeats the same language. It talks about fi'ontage again so it's our recommendation that on number 3 you just strike out that last sentence that's talking about frontage. Frontage on a cul-de-sac. You know there's exceptions that are involved and again it's repeated in the A2 and the RR District and somehow that got. Blackowiak: Okay Kate, can you explain to me then. I would say that's two different things. I read it as, you've got a lot of 200 feet deep, except that if you have a cul-de-sac, your 200 feet starts at the... Yeah, this is what they're talking about. Minimum lot. 31 Planning Commission Meeting - August 15, 2000 Aanenson: But like 200, there's no way you could make under you know. Biackowiak: Well I understand but I read that as two different numbers. I don't see those as the same number. Generous: Aanenson: Generous: Aanenson: Right, because it's already addressed previously on lot frontage. Right, but the same sentence is the 1 and number 2. It repeats itself. So you're making this part of the ordinance specifically to lot depth. Yeah, there's one on lot depth and one on lot frontage. Lot frontage says except for 200 feet on frontage. But 1 don't know why you'd want it again on lot depth. Peterson: I don't get it. Kind: I think it was copy and paste. Aanenson: That was our opinion. Kind: That's what it looks like to me. Aanenson: Yeah, and it happened in both sections. Kind: Because it's the exact same language. Blackowiak: I see it differently, I don't know. I'm just maybe tired. I see lot frontage as being. Aanenson: How much you need at the street. Blackowiak: Right. At the street. So you need 200 feet at the street, okay. And the A2 and R. Aanenson: Except if you're in a cul-de-sac. Blackowiak: If you've got a cul-de-sac you need at the building setback line. Well see yotu' building setback is 30 feet. You need 200 at your 30 foot line. Okay. Kind: See it pies to the street. Blackowiak: Yeah, exactly. So that makes sense to me. And then you're talking lot depth is more. Aauenson: Right, the opposite way. Blackowiak: Right. So you need a 200 foot lot depth, help me walk through this, except that if you're on a cul-de-sac you're going to need a deeper lot. That's what that says to me. In other words you've got your buildable. Kind: 230. 32 Planning Commission Meeting - August 15, 2000 Blackowiak: You need 230. Aanenson: No, you need in the RR or the A2 you need a 50 foot setback. It's completely different. Blackowiak: Whatever the building setback is. Aanenson: We don't do that in the RSF though. It's not consistent with the rest of the code. Blackowiak: Okay. Well I'm just saying that I read this as two different things. And I come up with two different... Peterson: Note the difference and let's move on. Aanensou: No, if you want to leave it in, that's fine. Blackowiak: No, I'm not saying I want to leave it in there. I'm just saying that I see that there's a difference and is there a reason for the difference? If not. Aanenson: We didn't see one. I mean it's never been. Kind: It wasn't the intent... Aanenson: Right. That's our opinion...other zoning districts. Kind: And if that's the intent, it needs to be clearer. Because obviously it's not. Aanenson: Right. Again there's, with the A2 and the RR we did allow, we still have to maintain the 1 per I 0 outside the MUSA area. Recently we had one that was done up on Deerbrook? Kind: That's not Deerbrook. Aanenson: Lakota. Where we had someone come in and they did the 1 per 10. As it ended up they did a 7 'A acre split instead of the 15,000. They could go smaller. Again, that was to provide for further subdivision and more efficiency. They could go small...to the septic site. The problem is when you look at the standards of the A2 and RR, you have to have a 200 x 200 so therefore you had to have a 40,000 square foot lot. So you couldn't meet the 15. So it was a conflict there which we did approve lots under this. But that's why it since has been vacated. But so, this resolves that and what this will say is, under the alternative lot size, 90 feet of frontage and 10 foot side yards and 30 foot rear yards. Again that's consistent with the RSF which... 15,000. We go ahead, one person make use of that minimum lot size but again it needs to be consistent. Subordinate use. This is an ongoing code enforcement issue and.., home occupation ordinance which we redid just recently within the last year. We probably should have caught this. We missed it. We have a lot of in the ag area, A2 and the RR District we have large barns, accessory structures. In that district you can go 30% of your lot size so we have some that are in excess ora thousand square feet. These end up being wonderful places for businesses to run out of which our ordinance says a home occupation has to be in the principle structure. If someone comes in for a new perlnit we can write it on the permit, cannot be used. The problem is we have, because we don't have a business license requirement, xve can't be tracking all those down. Our intent here is that when this ordinance was put in place a number of years ago, there was an exception made if you had an accessory structure you could use it. If it was in place prior to 1987. Well it just so happens a lot of 33 Planning Commission Meeting - August 15, 2000 these were built prior to 1987 so what we're trying to say is again, to be consistent with the rest of the home occupations or not, we have a lot of code enforcement problems on this that no garage or agricultural building, I don't care when it was built, you can't use that for any borne occupation. Now this does ,lot affect anybody that has a legal non-conforming use because there are some of those out there too. If they have a legal non-conforming use, as long as they don't expand it, they can continue to operate that way. Kind: What makes them legal Kate? Do they have a permit that says that they can have a contractor's yard? Aanenson: Well maybe Cindy can help me a little bit but we did at one time allow contractor's yards in the ag district and we have some of those still operating. Kind: Are they interim use permits or what are they? They were conditional use? Aanenson: And they run forever with the property. As this community's grown, they've been a problem. Unfortunately some of them weren't documented to the level of use. Similarly what we did with the beachlot ordinance. When we put tile beachlot ordinance ill place, we went through and ~ve documented what the level of all those beachlots, those non-conforming beachlots so we know how many slips each beachlot can have. That wasn't done oil these. The non-conforming ones. We know which ones through time have but. Kind: So if there's somebody that's had a contractor's yard since 1980 and it's been hidden away in their garage and they don't have a conditional use permit for it, and we find out about it, they're out of business? Aanenson: Well we send them a letter and ask them. We work with people. We find out about all kinds of things through the neighbors. We try to work with people. Give theln time to find another spot. Kind: Do we know of anybody that this affects? Aanenson: As far as bas got a business? No, anybody that's doing tbat right now, we do send them a letter because you can't do a business anyways. This is just to clarify because some people misunderstand that because they've got an agricultural building, it clearly states above it, you can't do it in your garage. I guess what we're saying is that it may ineet, xvell |'ve got an agricultural building therefore I can do it because people are seeking those out to run their auto repairs. To do contractor's business so, and clearly above it it says you can't use all accessory structure. So we just want to make sure that even if it's in the ag, because he'll be surrounding in the not too close sort of thing. Kind: Got it. Aanenson: Okay. Topsoil requirement. This came out of a discussion with the City Council. Engineering uses the Best Management Practices and that talks about 3 inches of topsoil being prepared. You know it needs to be graded or applied for soil. Kind: She's talking as far as she can. I can barely understand her. Aanenson: But what's the council's direction on this was, they wanted 4 inches. They asked us to recolnmend this ordinance to come back with 4 inches so it's ill two places. One in the grading and 34 Plalming Colmnission Meeting - August 15, 2000 erosion control section of the code and then again under tile design standards and the erosion and sediment. Again requiring 4 inches. It's also in the development contract. Parking and loading. Two places we're changing there. There's a handicap requirement of I per 50. The State Building Code says 1 per 25. Just to make sure in case it changes again, we're just going to say it has to be consistent with the State Building Code. Whatever that number is, that's what it's going to be and actually the building official enforces that anyway when we do the plan check. Computing requirement. There's a conflict between minimum drive aisle width. There's an asterisk that allows 26. Asterisk that says, they can go 22 feet wide. It doesu't work with the vehicles we have out there today. Most people aren't using it but we just want to take it out so it's not an option. Generous: Additionally this is in conflict with another section of the code. Aanensou: So it resolves that. Unless there's questions I'll go through some of the signs. Again, non- residential for Miss Rosie's Farm. We don't have a place for her. She was limited to very small signage. We do have SOlne legitimate hmne occupations. Some of those quasi interim use sort of things that again this would give some signage. Again, there's been misinterpretation of ifa wall sign can be used collectively or fi'ontage can we collectively use it with the iutent not for each business to get a monument sign but for each building. Not if they have 6 tenants. It's per building. So again that gives some clarity to that. Again for the wall signs. Then the rest of those are just typo errors that we put in there. So the recommendation agaiu, I just pdt the recommendations that refer to Chapter 20 and I just put the language in there. I didn't give you the background so anything you want to modify, certainly story xvould be one that we would recommend we give some more clarity. And then again, if the A2 or RR, any of those that you're comfortable with or want modified, we'd be happy to take any input. Kind: Mr. Chairman, just a question. Should I be moving for a public hearing on this for Chapter 20? Peterson: If you don't have any further questions of our Planning Director. Kind: l just wasn't sure, is it just Chapter 20 or 18 or? Peterson: 20. No other questions of Kate? Motion and a second for public hearing please. Kind moved, Burton seconded to open the public hearing. The public hearing was opened. Pcterson: This is a public hearing. Anyone wishing to address the commissioners please come forward and state your nalne and address please. Sandra Johnsou: My name is Sandra Johnson. I live at 2621 Orchard Lane. Your definition on the wetland buffer there, l wanted to say specifically that that area is protected. You can put a swing set in but you can't drive pilings. Cement pilings down in that buffer to hold the swing set. Swimming pools. No...drive down into the ground because you will destroy that buffer and then you've lost that wetlands so I want it clearly defined. Thank you. Dean Paxton: Dean Paxton, 2611 Orchard Lane. Just to piggy back on that maybe a little bit. I think the language and how you define the wetlands, excuse me, tile wetland setback area and what is used in that location...40 feet, I think is, you want to allow people to put a swing set but yet you don't want to open up potentially something, allowing them to build something in there so I don't know what that language would be but if you guys would give that some consideration, 1 think that would be a really good idea. Aud maybe potentially the percentage of their [and used within that area. The swing set takes up 10 to 15 35 Planning Commission Meeting - August 15, 2000 square feet. A parking lot takes up x percentage so maybe so~nething, that would be language to that effect but if you could clarify. One of the things that I saw that you had percent buildable area ofti~ese lots and that you're taking the 60 x 40 and saying well, we're not going to hold to 60 x 40 and I totally understand that but they, my assumption is that you're still maintaining the 25% ora single floor of the lot for the buildings not to take up more than 25%. Aanenson: Correct. Right. Dean Paxton: On the accessory structures, when it's being said I note an inconsistency that you probably hadn't thought about is that the other neighbor who had an attached garage and then decided then to build another garage which was detached, thus taking advantage of as much accessory structure as possible to build within that. You now have quite a bit of the land being used as garage and I don't think that there's any definition within the code which, you know it turns out it's a nice structure but I think that there's some iuconsistency there as to what that accessory structure is used for and if they already have space for, that they're using for tiffs for, do you allow that sort of thing or not? Aanenson: That's a good question. We studied that a couple of years ago. St. Louis Park did a big study because they were finding people putting 4 and 5 stall garages that were actually bigger than the homes. I know we studied that a while ago and we looked at capping and something. We do allow accessory structures iii the side yards. Some communities don't allow that. Dean Paxton: Yeah again I think there's some inconsistency there. Aanenson: I guess the way to cap it, which we talked at that time, we haven't as far as problems or issues that we have, that hasn't been a large one out here. We do have a high preponderance of 3 car garage but you raise a good point and that's something that, that would be maybe covered with a percentage of how much the garage can be compared to the house. What a lot of people do, if they have a boat, an RV, they like to put that in... Dean Paxton: Right, and another thing to be either too conservative...I think that's an area that's very gray. Aanenson: Again what's driving that, I wasjust going to comment on that. Again is the impervious sm'face which you brought up. Dean Paxton: And then on that same note, I think it's also the inconsistent to say that a person can or cannot use an accessory building for a home business when they can use it within their house itself. So is a person who has an older home built iii the 1800's who is forced to do a detached garage and throws in a wood shop, or solnething like that, wouldn't be allowed to actually maintain that business whereas if it was attached to their house they could. Aanenson: What the ordinance says is 25% of the principle structure and that's being, ! mean if you want to set up a hair cutting. Dean Paxton: Oh, that's accessory beyond 25%? Aanenson: No, you can put it inside your house. If you want to cut hair and have a chair or if you wanted to do accounting, that's allowed for. As a matter of fact Cindy just redid the home occupation ordinance and what we did is we took out specific uses because it was pretty antiquated and we did 36 Planning Commission Meeting - August 15, 2000 performance base based on the traffic. How much UPS, th.ose sort of things. How much is that there, but it's supposed to be, and the reason for that is, if you start using garages, you tend to get different types of home occupation which is mechanical or...and that's the noise element and that's what tends to disturb the neighbors. Dean Paxton: And then I had just one other on the, personally I'm very glad that you're clarifying we wanted to...I think it saves a lot of grief. But one of the things that it was interesting I think, I believe that one of the first, when you were showing the 60 x 40 lot sizes, some of the things that people have done in the past. The interesting thing is that, what you say people can do and what they actually do, I don't sense that there's any sense of enforcement. For example on one of these very first slide that you showed there's a building which has a tree preservation area and because they have... And so there's signs up there. You know if it's outside of their lot area, and to this day I don't think anybody, the city or anybody else has gone out there to see the size of the initial building. So I don't think there's really on the conservation end of it, that there's really, you have the plans initially and the builders say yeah but there's a little bit of area where they just do what they want at some point. But that's just a side note. Aanenson: Sure. Well I'd be happy to show to you how we do that because we are inspected each lot. So as far as the tree removal plan aud everything. Dean Paxton: And then one other thing that still seems gray to me is the grading. It seems like we're not concerned about grading around lakeshore property but not necessary a lot of areas that are around lakeshore and unless.., in that you know, you can put in, maintain the topsoil. But other restrictions bounce around persons bringing in tOllS of fill and where you had that example of 50% below grade and... 1 or 2 story, it just seems to me that was enough dirt brought in...take advantage of those reqtlirements. I'm wondering if there's any sort of definition around that. Aanenson: Yep. As a part of each subdivision the grading is reviewed. We try and minimize that. Also anybody that's doing an amount of grading, I believe it's 5,000 cubic yards, has to get, even if it's part of your house, which has been an approved plan. You have to get a grading permit, You have to show exactly what you're going to do. We don't allow that. Dean Paxton: Okay. And again, just...criticize or anything but there's another lot right by our house which is not really sold yet. It's tip for sale and so there's ilo plans for the lot and the guys... He just waits around and if somebody says to him well you know you shouldn't do that, then he waits 6 months and dumps some more fill in there so it seems like again, I don't know if there is a, how the planning and any requirements with the planning on how to enforce... I'm just bringing that up as a sort ofa... Aanenson: We get calls on that regularly. They're enforced... I don't know about fill on that. l'd have to talk to someone ill engineering. They're the ones that enforce that but we get calls out on illegal grading oil a regular basis. Dean Paxton: Thank you very nluch. Peterson: Thank you. Dean Paxton: Oh l'm sorry, 1 did have one more. Peterson: It's too late. 37 Planning Commission Meeting - August 15, 2000 Dean Paxton: On the private, are there definitions on a private drive? Aanenson: Yes. Dean Paxton: So I could just come to you and see what the requirements for that, because you mentioned width of a drive. Is that what you're talking about with that 22 foot? Kind: Parking lot. Aanenson: Outside of a parking lot. Yeah, parking lot. We require 26 feet. There was a place in the ordinauce allows 22. It's not big enough for the SUV's that are out there today to back up. Jerry Paulsen: Good evening. My name is Jerry Paulsen, 7305 Laredo Drive. We recognize that there are good reasons to change code and you're getting feedback froln a lot of other people here. Tweaking the code is certainly proper. I have comments on a couple items that are being proposed here. The changes, if enacted, would directly affect the Igel application to split one lakeshore into two lots in Sunrise Hills on Lotus Lake. The Planning Commission has discussed this at three previous meetings and you're scheduled to get it again on September 5th. Some of the proposed changes would make code less restrictive. If the Planning Commission approves these changes, there's likely enough time for the cotmcil to approve them and theoretically could have some impact on the Igel application specifically. We are questioning both the timing of these proposed changes and whether it's even wise to downgrade some of this code. The me,no states that the proposed change to Chapter 18 does not require a public hearing so I should squeeze in a few co~nments here, even though it's not a public hearing. Because it can go directly to the council as opposed to Chapter 20 changes. The proposed change to Section 18-61 is to eliminate the reference to the 60 x 60 pad. The other proposed changes include eliminating references to the 60 x 40 pad in the wetland and the PUD sections. The specific dimensions would be replaced by a requirelnent for 2,400 square feet instead of 3,600 square feet as is now in the code. We think it's fair to ask why is the staff changing the ground rules in the middle of the game for us? On July 31st we requested the City Attorney give an opinion on three code items relating to the Igel application. The City Manager agreed to pass those onto the City Attorney. One of them was clarification on the 60 x 60. We were still waiting on a reading on that. But we hope to find out something fi'om the City Attorney. The memo also says that the proposed changes are necessary because code is ambiguous. Changing code to clear up ambiguity is reasonable. But changing code to lower restrictions is not necessarily reasonable. The 60 x 60 pad still serves a good purpose we believe. You might think that we object to the change because our neighbors are having a problem trying to shoe horn this 60 x 60 into their two lots, which is true. In our zeal to protect the lake and to keep intact the character of Sunrise Hills we've asked the City to do what the code prescribes. The 60 x 60 pad serves as a deterrent for our particular subdivision and other developments because it restricts structures being placed too close to each other. But again here it's a mini~num area 60 x 60. Nothing to do with what might end up on the lot. They can certainly serve a 70 x 80 house if that comes along but we look upon it as a minimum and it is important that, from our standpoiut, that it be still ou the books. But the whole solution to what the city calls ambiguous code is to purge these references in regard to a building pad. We don't think that having a different pad requirements for different environments is inherently bad to leave on the books. Looking at the proposed change to Section 20-481, there's language in there for additional shoreline building setbacks and was taken directly from what the DNR guidelines prescribe. We're not sure that there's good reason to make a change there if the DNR is happy with what's in there. So I would, as a general rule ofthulnb urge the commissioners to consider seriously the portions that potentially downgrade the code fi'om our standpoint and I see another term in here that's referred to as open space. I don't see a definition for it. That might just of general interest. Lastly I'd like to mention that in our 38 Planning Commission Meeting - August 15, 2000 ever ending quest to improve our city and demonstrate that we don't really have objections to change. I'd like to propose three changes to code and give you a copy ora letter that I prepared. I know this is short notice so I don't expect you to act on it tonight but I'd like you to take a look at it if you would. Two of them are kind of, this is cleaning up what you might call glitches I suppose but the other one is different. Peterson: Why don't you summarize, you said three issues. One is the building pad. What was the other? Jerry Paulsen: Retaining, I think retaining the building pad as such in the code is still important. From the standpoint. Peterson: I'nl not asking you to go through the whole thing but I'm just saying, just to summarize the three points it was the wetland, building area around the wetland, the 60 x 60 pad. Jerry Paulsen: That is mentioned in wetland PUD and under the woodland. Kind: Tree preservation. Peterson: Okay, thank you. Jerry Paulsen: Thank you. Debbie Lloyd: I guess I'm a stickler for details. We've got to start with details. Page 1 oil Kate's melno. The 1, 2, 3, fourth reference to numbers. The wetland ordinance. It's written down there 60 x 60. The wetlands ordinance is actually 60 x 40. The third page under wetland protection, Section 20-406. The second lille again the reference there is 60 x 60. It should read 60 x 40. And I'm just going to assume that those changes will be made in the back recommendation section as well. According to city records, these codes have existed since at February of 1994, if not back to 1988. Other aspects of these codes have been changed during this time but the requirements of the past have not. ! know I'm not supposed to address Section 18 but I hope you'll listen to this statement here. Chapter 18, Section 18-61 reads, in single family detached residential developments the applicant must demonstrate that suitable home sites exist on each lot by describing a 60 x 60 foot building pad which includes deck area without intruding into required setbacks and easements. The purpose of the building pad is to determine the adequacy of thc building site, not only for the original house being built but to include room for future expansion or additions. A 60 x 60 foot pad is commensurate or you know, we can even say a 60 x 40 is commensurate with...lot size of 15,000 square feet in an area of large homes with large lots. The 60 x 60 foot or 40 foot does not define the dimensions of an actual house. It's purpose is not to build a square house as Kate had suggested, but to provide for all adequate building site. And I bad also brought a plat of Olivewood and really Kate talks. Aanenson: Those aren't 60 x 60 either. They're 55 by. Debbie Lloyd: Well this lot in Olivewood is, Aanenson: No it's not. Debbie Lloyd: Okay, well in that case let me point out that this plat does not, well yes Olivewood... 39 Planning Commission Meeting - August 15, 2000 Aanenson: Oh 60 x 60, yes. The other one is 55 x 60. You're right. The other one isn't, and that's a wooded lot too. Debbie Lloyd: And then 60 by...right here. So Olivewood is 60 x 60. They use the code and they put it on the plat. It doesn't define the house. It's not a square house. It's just as Kate shows, the house ends up being something different. But what it does on a plat is show the suitable adequate building site. When they present these plans, you don't know what the home is going to be until later through the process. I did this little drawing here and excuse my...60 x 60 but then here's a 60 x 40 showing that a 60 x 40 fits into a 60 x 60 and another part that's important about the 60 x 40 pad, it restricts a deck area. A 12 x 12 deck area. So in actuality the square foot represented by 60 x 40 is 2,400 but it's also 144 square feet for the deck which is 2,544 square feet and if you just kind of look at this and think of the 60 x 60 on a treed lot, you understand why it's showing room for additional expansion. It's just a mental thing but it just kind of gives you a picture. So in other words, a rectangular home would fit in here. Not just a square home. A rectangular home would fit iu here. A round dome home would fit in here. It allows you to do anything with that buildable area that you choose. Consumers today generally want large homes and a 60 x 60 foot pad allows some room for future expansion and should ultimately reduce the demand for lot variances. One thing I've been in the few planning commissions I've recently attended are the variance requests. Well if you establish from the start an adequate building site hopefully you'll see less of those variances come through. And Pointe Lake Lucy is a good exa~nple of a 60 x 40 that was not shown on the plat with the wetlands. They came in .for the deck and you have your problem. You had to grant the variance on a wetland because it wasn't properly documented on the plat. Just so you know, I've gone to City Hall and I've looked at a lot of plats during my lunch hour. At the end of the day today I scrambled up there for an hour trying to figure out how do l attack this. Another thing I want to say, kind of ~naybe out of order with this is, announcements are put in the paper 10 days before the meeting. We can't review what the staff is going to present really until Thursday like at 4:30. We grab this paper. We have Friday, Monday and Tuesday to deal with this. It's just, it puts a lot of pressure ou the public to present anything at these meetings and I've learned a lot through this whole process and that's one thing I would recommend a change on. Enabling people to have enongh time to present a case for or against an issue. One thing today that I realized is, I'm unclear about at what stage the owner, builder, developer ~nust document a house pad on a plat. I examined over 8 develops today looking for a standard and there doesn't seem to be one which has been uniformly applied. Either whether it's 60 x 40 or the 60 x 60. Another example of that is tonight with this Springfield Addition. Although it's still in the code, the evidence of 60 x 40, it wasn't on the plat. Housing plans were on the plat but the 60 x 40 wasn't there. Code currently does not define the building pad in terms of the square feet. That's been staff's interpretation of the code. That the code defines it in terms of area. At the July 18th planning ineeting I had my little hand thiugs on a little square grid block and I showed you a 10 x 100 or 1,000 square foot or whatever. Well the same thing holds true for this. 2,400 square feet and...adequate building site any configuration ora long, skinny... It could still fit into the site. Last time I told you I get less nervous the more I spoke. No, tonight it's the xvorst. There's no rhylne or reason. Thank you for listening again. Peterson: Thank you. Anyone else? Kind moved, Burton seconded to clOse the public hearing. The public hearing was closed. Peterson: Any comments that we haven't already went through? Blackowiak: I guess a question Mr. Chair. Kate, when does this go to City Council? 40 Planning Commission Meeting - August l 5, 2000 Aanenson: They would move through, I think if you want to table it, that's fine. There's no rush. If people want to take additional time. 1 think we got some good input tonight. Blackowiak: So we're not in any? AanellSOll: No. Blackowiak: Okay. Aanenson: No rush. I just want to bring up something. If we're all in agreement that the 60 x 60 pad doesn't define the buildable area, then what are we using it for? Because we're agreeing that it doesn't reflect... Peterson: I agree. Aanenson: And we have interpreted it differently and that's what I'm saying. That's where the problem is. ! meau we'd be happy to sit down. The Igel's can meet the 60 x 60 on the one subdivision so if we want to leave that in place, that's fine. They can meet the 60 x 60 but it's not a perfect square and that's the problem that we're saying. They are buildable. They can meet that. It's not a square so we'd be happy to meet with these folks and if they have a good definition, but even the City Attorney said that ' they're in conflict. Because technically on this subdivision here, this is a woodland subdivision: There's no variances up here. It's a...lot of different builders. These pads here are not 60 x 60. And again, while it shows this, there's really no correlation so I think we need to go back and discuss what was the purpose because the tree removal, and these are heavily wooded lots also. So we'd be happy to sit down if they want to try to colne up ~vith some language that... Peterson: I haven't read Mr. Paulsen's letter in there but if we can kill more birds with one stone, do that tOO SO. Aanenson: Sure, be happy to do that. Peterson: Motion please. Kind: Mr. Chairman, a question before a motion. Kate, 1 was looking at this wetland structure and sctback. The first speaker spoke about being really clear, l'm wondering if we are better off saying what's allowed instead of. Aanenson: Yeah, I thought those were some good comments. I agree. Kind: Instead of what's excluded. If our intent is mostly for swing sets, how about having Section 20- 406, wetland structure and setback read, fi'ee standing play structures are allowed within the first half of the principle structure setback and then talk about play structures instead of accessory structures? Aanenson: Well let me give it some thought because we've had a wide gamut of things. We've had people that want to do batting cages where they're using the ground, so as soon as we try to put a list together, we've left SOlnething out so I think that gentleman's comment about impervious surface and some of, you know pilings. Some of those cmnments you know kind of...our thinking that maybe we can come back with something taking that into consideration. Maybe come back with something that works. 41 Planning Commission Meeting- August 15, 2000 Blackowiak: And also Kate, excuse me Mr. Chair. I'd like to add structures not to exceed, you know X square feet. Aanenson: Yeah, that was another good comment. What becomes accessory and then... Blackowiak: And like giving the performance standards. You know how they have to meet those standards. And that I think is going to be self limiting in many of the cases. Kind: And then you were going to look at minimum depth for this buildable area because I think we want to avoid the totally tubular things. Aanenson: This is what we're trying to say too is to avoid the square. I mean bow do we work that out. We'd be happy to work with these folks and try to come up with... Kind: I like the idea, I'm coming down to 40 feet just because I think that would allow for a garage and a deck. A reasonable amount of space. And then we have to define how you measure it. Aanenson: I mean this subdivision's a lot different than Stone Creek. Than Lake Susan. I mean every subdivision in Rice Marsh. They're all different in meeting the character of this. Kind: And then whatever we do on this does not affect the Igel application. Aanenson: No. The one takeshore lot can meet the definition. It's not a perfect 60 x 60 square on one of the lakeshore lots. And that's our issue. But I'm saying, it can be a huge house. It just can't meet their definitiou ora 60 x 60. Kind: But eveu if we changed this, doesn't the Igel application go with what the ordinance was when they came in? Okay, so to me l'd rather table this and just let this not affect that. Aanenson: That's fine. Peterson: Well I wouldn't table because of that. Kind: But there's no reason to rush it through either. Peterson: No, to get more information. I'll entertain a lnotion please. Burton: Mr. Chairman, 1 move that we table the amendments to Chapter 20. Peterson: Is there a second? Blackowiak: Second. Peterson: Further discussion? Burton moved, Blackowiak seconded that the Planning Commission table amendments to Chapter 20. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously. Peterson: Thank you all for your feedback. Good feedback. 42