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1 Approval of MinutesCHANHASSEN PARK AND RECREATION COMMISSION REGULAR MEETING AUGUST 25, 1998 Chairwoman Lash called the meeting to order at 7:30 p.m. MEMBERS PRESENT: Jan Lash, Fred Berg, Mike Howe, Rod Franks, Ron Roeser, and Jim Manders MEMBERS ABSENT: David Moes STAFF PRESENT: Todd Hoffman, Park and Rec Director; Jerry Ruegemer and Patty Dexter, Recreation Supervisors; and Susan Marek, Facility Supervisor for Chanhassen Rec Center APPROVAL OF AGENDA: Berg moved, Howe seconded to approve the Minutes of the Park and Recreation Commission meeting dated July 28, 1998 amended to show that Jim Manders was not present at the meeting and did not move or second any motions. All voted in favor and the motion carried. INITIATE DISCUSSION ON 1998 PARK ACQUISITION AND DEVELOPMENT CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT BUDGET. Todd Hoffman presented the staff report on this item. Lash: I can come up quickly with three things. I think we touched on all of them tonight. One is a connection on TH 101 south. One is at least a Phase I at Bandimere. We'll have playground equipment going in. And I mentioned earlier the phone call from the people at Stone Creek who would like us to look at putting in Phase II playground. Those are things I can think of right off the top of my head. Howe: Didn't we talk about an interpretative center and we've been reserving for that, right? We don't really know where to even put that but. Roeser: For what? Howe: An interpretative or a nature center. That's my only thought that I can... Lash: Rod, did you have any? Franks: Yep. You know everybody's getting something this last year. I mean almost everybody in the whole city's got something so I'm wondering, since we did spend down the reserves, if we really not trying to necessarily promote a real hunker down kind of philosophy for this next year but to actually, do as few projects as we can get by with. I think we're building this expectation psychologically too that it's just going to keep coming and coming and coming and if we try Park and Rec Commission Meeting - August 25, 1998 really hard to stretch our dollars as far as it will go and spend as much as we can, we're going to kind of continue that and we're just not going to be able to keep up the pace and I think we'll have a lot of frustration. Everybody's got something now so if we maybe look at funneling as much as we can into our reserves instead of into projects in the long run we might come out a little bit ahead. So I guess that was my number one thing is to really build up the reserves as much as we possibly can spare. But I did have a few little projects that I think we should consider too. One also was that south 101 trail from Lake Susan Drive down to Bandimere Park. At one point last year we had talked about creating a beach at Lake Susan where that kind of beach area is currently. I don't think that that'd be like a huge project but we spent all that, or the city did, clearing up the lake. Cleaning up the carp. Lake Susan Park has got everything except the beach so I think that's something we might want to look at. The other thing that I think, instead of into like a capital project, is to set aside some kind of funding for like art programming. We don't have necessarily the hard facility to do it but I think we can start looking at doing programming and gearing up for that time when we do have the facility for the more art programming but really designating an effort to get that type of programming on line. So kind of taking the flip approach. Instead of building the center and getting the programs to fill it up. Maybe if you have some more arts programming going on and then everyone will see the need for a real performance facility. So that's not a capital project per se Todd but I mean setting aside some programming. Lash: Didn't we talk one time about using the Rec Center just as a sort of an interim place to try to showcase art anyway? Sort of like... Roeser: That sounds good. You know you could use that lobby area sometime for some kind of a local art show. Lash: Cases, window cases and you could definitely artwork. I don't know why we couldn't have local things displayed and. Roeser: Chaska does a great job with that little gallery there but of course ours isn't quite, it's probably not that easy. Hoffman: ...prefer to take that on or do you want to. Lash: I am prepared to take that on and look into what it would take to establish some guidelines for an art displays program at the Rec Center. I think it'd be great personally. Roeser: I was thinking even that winter festival. The February festival. Tie it in with that. Franks: That was more of my thinking too is to tie into some, some of the existing programming we already have going like the Oktoberfest or the winter festival or something like that, whatever it would be. Park and Rec Commission Meeting - August 25, 1998 Lash: Okay, this is kind of a...could it be like a monthly or quarterly kind of turnover thing where you sort of have a like a theme. If in the fall you wanted it to be like handiwork, like quilts and. Roeser: Yeah but we're not talking about, yeah. Except you're not talking about the children now. Lash: No, no. I'm not talking about kids either. I'm talking about, like if seniors or if different artists and whatever, but it could be more crafts oriented or something in the fall and in the winter it could be water colors or something and spring it could be Photography or wildlife for nature things or. You know kind of just change it. You know you don't want it to be monthly. I think that'd be too much work but quarterly or something and kind of tie it in with seasons or whatever. Berg: Maybe just throw something at the Rec Center for the people who come in who are artists and they'd like...artist community they can, you know take their suggestions too as to what type of things... Lash: And I don't think the community center when they have those on display, they're for sale aren't they? Roeser: Not always. No, in Chaska they're not generally for sale. Lash: I mean that'd be a great incentive for an artist. Roeser: Well sometime you could also tie that into the 4th of July festival or something like that. Have an art sale somewhere. Lash: Well they could be on sale, they could always be on sale. Roeser: But I think tying some of these things in with the celebrations we have is a good idea. Franks: My long range thinking too was that this type of interest, people seeing these kinds of art display. They're available. They're there. That that may create some other kind of community programming interest in those same arts. More people interested in hey, want to get out there and take a Photography or developing class or the painting or actually some performance piece or something so. Roeser: Or actually even bringing in you like the...that they have. Bring in some...in the gymnasium you could do that possibly. The seating isn't wonderful but you could certainly do it. They have an excellent band down there...there are things like that that we should think about getting involved in some of those things. Hoffman: '....budget outlook as we work with the city council for more programming staff in 1999. As you know we're on that most of just making it through the remainder of the year and Park and Rec Commission Meeting - August 25, 1998 Dawn is going to come back for 20 hours a week so we can take a look at that. We had a good laugh with Patty when we went down to...this was on her to do list for many, many months. The minute we walked into the Lakeville City Hall, the arts exhibit on the wall and we said this is all we were after Patty right here so I'm confident we can get that part of it done and then we'll... Lash: Well I just kind of side conversations with Fred, would it be okay for us to charge a small commission if things were exhibited for sale? Can we say, if you make a sale we get 10%? 5% for display or you know. Dexter: I can investigate that... Lash: I didn't know if that would be legal. You know if we could do something like that. Roeser: Generally at Chaska they're just exhibits. They're not things that are for sale. Although I have seen price tags. Lash: Fred, did you have any other. Berg: I had most of what everybody's already said. We've had people come in lately that have wanted...but it might be nice if we could honor... I don't remember any being high ticket items. 1 really like Rod's idea of creating the need before we... I hadn't thought of that. I put down that I'd like to see us, after the city council meeting last Monday, I'd like to see us designate some of our reserves for our parks. Fill in the blank. They seem to be impressed by the fact that we're saving money...trails or whatever. They seem to like... Lash: Should some of that maybe be earmark 1017... Berg: I would like to see... Lash: I like Rod's idea of the Lake Susan beach too. Ron? Roeser: Well the thing is, I think we're going to look at this year as...the controls with what's going on with Bandimere. Roundhouse Park. We can keep it, we can keep it down. These things are great ideas and they're not high ticket things. I mean even the Lake Susan beach thing, if we're going to do something there it's not going to be that expensive. I think the way we're looking now, it might not be a bad idea to... Berg: There's no danger if we set some reserves up to the city council saying one, we're going to use them. Two, you must not really need as much as...because you're able to put so much in reserve... Look at this referendum and say... Hoffman: Yeah, ! hope that's not the case. The funds need to stay in the 410 allocation. They 'can;. they~h~tv~the final ~y~in What'is~approved but they're not going to be spent on the road... Park and Rec Commission Meeting - August 25, 1998 Manders: One thing that I would direct attention to and maybe it's not necessarily a capital expenditure but it's maintenance of existing facilities. By that I mean primarily trails. I mean there's some of the older trail segments, the one that I think of the most is Lake Ann. That's getting pretty rough shape. I mean there's a lot of water problems where it's under water. ...Greenwood Shores and the beach and I think there's probably other sites and facilities that we should maintain. I don't know if it's attention that we give here or you know wash out areas. You know some of the new things. I guess that's what I would do is try and identify those components. I wouldn't go overboard... Lash: ...if we're going to have Bandimere looking sort of spiffy by the end of the year, l'd like to see for sure in the spring the silo. Something done to that. And I wouldn't have a problem with budgeting some money towards the Roundhouse. To try and get that fixed up too because we're going to have these nice looking parks starting up who have these eye sores on there. Hoffman: Two sides to Jim's point. Manpower and cash expenditures. And manpower, we will be seeking another full time park maintenance individual in the 1999 budget. We've added Bandimere and the other trails and Roundhouse Park. Then the cash side of it. We have not been successful in convincing the council that we need to be setting aside those reserve funds which pay for depreciation. Equipment depreciation. Depreciation of infrastructure. So that's a difficult road. We'll continue to attempt to do that. The Lake Ann road itself, the entire road and parking lot system is, last year was the third year it was denied as a budget item so we'll continue on down that road. The trail would be incorporated which is really a complete rebuild from Lake Ann to Greenwood Shores Park, would be included as a part of that project. To rebuild the parking lot so. Manders: I think even along your line of manpower is maintenance in terms of vegetation and tree growth. Where there's a lot of, it's encroaching onto the trail and sight lines. Hoffman: The concept there is to, so we don't look like we're just trying to build a park maintenance empire, is to put a tree person over with Jill Sinclair. Jill Sinclair is our...resource coordinator. As a forester who will be paid for half time out of park maintenance and half time out of planning. That forester's out in the field maintaining the trees that we have in our community. The dilemma and we've talked about it for years. When we get into a summer of this much of construction, all of these projects are contractual but there is a little two or three or five or 10% of every project that we have to be involved in. As the owner we're there to make sure that it happens. That it's done correctly and so all of our full time people do not do park maintenance in the summer. They are not involved, other than supervising capabilities and supervisory duties, they do not perform park maintenance. They perform capital projects. Dale, Dean, Jim Tice, Rob and Gary...all these capital projects for the most part for the entire year. Where we get into some heavy maintenance, they may be doing that stuff. The storm, when we had storm damage, they were out doing storm repair. So who is, if you will, who is watching the store on an annual basis during these high growth seasons are seasonal employees. And seasonal emploYees do not'have that same sense of respect for our park system that our full timers would have. And so they are severely torn. I'm out there, we have staff meetings every week. We're · out at the public works building every fourth Tuesday and I'm keeping them on task on these Park and Rec Commission Meeting - August 25, 1998 capital projects and they're watching their parks you know degrade as far as the level of expectation, their own expectations for quality of maintenance and there's really not a lot they can do about it. We're trying to do, just during these high growth years, we're trying to do so much. Dale does not like that he's placed in that position. I don't like putting him in that position but we're really out of options. I told him this was it. This was the year we were doing all contractual labor. We did. We contracted everything but just the magnitude of the work, he was over here doing removals. They're doing piping at Bandimere. They're, Dale's in charge of coordination between the contractor and the city for all the large projects. The trails and the community park. And then Dean has been working with the contractors in all 18 park projects. So we have 18 park projects and they're calling him constantly. You've got to get this cleaned out. You've got to move that and it's a whole lot of work so we're not, I appreciate that comment and we hear it a great deal. I'm a firm believer, if you can't take care of what you have already, you have no business out there building more so we want... Lash: I guess I'd be interested in seeing, as long as you just said that, that triggered this thought. Near the end of September or whenever you're kind of feeling like it's the end of the season of getting. Hoffman: November 1st. Lash: Yeah, some type of an update to us. From the referendum. All the projects that we took one and kind of, where they're at. What we've been able to finish and maybe what has to get carried over. It'd be interesting to see how they fell into budget too ! guess. Hoffman: I've got that sheet. The budget sheet. Lash: Does anybody have anything else for the CIP? Franks: I'm just curious about when open space acquisitions will be coming down before us. What kind of time line are we looking on that? Hoffman: Those projects are just waiting out in the wings. We have stalled out on the cost acquisition. The last conversation we had with the Council was were they prepared to move on and they were prepared to move on that issue... But before that they wanted to look at the, the other concept was to, can we, we're still working on...take the entire Bluff Creek corridor from Lyman to the segment where we were at the intersection of Lyman Boulevard and Audubon where the...and the creek comes winding down through here. The concept was identified, the creek corridor between Lyman Boulevard on the north and Pioneer Trail south...entire piece that matches up with...this whole block of open space... So we've been switching back and forth between... Then there's been debate over... Lash: I thought that the city council was really looking on that Bluff Creek corridor preserve plan that ~some ma~t-~thing that.~'eally since we would ultimately end up with something like that...regulations that it couldn't be built on and all those-things. Park and Rec Commission Meeting - August 25, 1998 Hoffman: They're working on that...put on the books. It's on paper upstairs. 10-15 years from now this property comes in. There's neighbors to the north. Developer, a new council and they say you know what, we think this city ordinance stinks. We don't want...houses down here. We don't want to transfer density up here...the council looks at each other and says, the ordinance stinks. Toss it out the window. Put houses in there... The DNR has also picked up a big interest in the Assumption Seminary. There's something called the new initiative...and the environmental and natural resources section, they want to buy the Assumption Seminary so they're working... The parcels which were identified, none of them are for sale... Franks: Do we need to have any money available for any type of capital improvements of those properties even though we're not developing, if an acquisition is made during 19997 Hoffman: Not necessarily. I think the intent... Lash: How much money actually is there? Hoffman: Well there's... Lash: So we have, what did you say? And of course I am assuming that somehow in the bank or in something that earns interest. Hoffman: Yep. Lash: So by waiting until the time is right, I mean land costs are going to only go up but the money will...but I mean you almost have to wait until. Hoffman: Interest on a million three is pretty impressive... Lash: I guess we have to wait until the time's right and then all of a sudden something's going to pop up somewhere. Manders: What seems to be the remaining focus though? There was some discussion on that 10 acres .... how many acres, a couple acres was that in the comer up there? Hoffman: Yep. That's held by Westside. Manders: So other units, I mean there's some discussion with Fox. There's this deal. Wasn't there a couple other small segments? Hoffman: Well the Degler property. Manders: Right. They're either side there. Hoffman: ... The State certified this piece...$12,000.00 and acre and he wants $32,000.00. Park and Rec Commission Meeting - August 25, 1998 Howe: Hoffman: Manders: Hoffman: But if 212 goes in, does that affect the value of that land? So he'll see... How many acres is this Fox land? About 40 acres. That increases it. Lash: What are those numbers there? I can't see that without my glasses. Hoffman: $12,000.00. Mr. Fox petitioned the staff to initiate...right-of-way acquisition...and to do that they have to do an appraisal of the property... The first appraisal on the land came in around $4,000.00. They appraised like it was farmland out in western Carver County. The second one came in at $8,000.00 an acre... Finally...the highest and third appraisal was $12,000.00 an acre and then I think... Big discrepancy there. You're not going to settle that on... Lash: And how many acres is it? Hoffman: Around 40 acres...is going to go to a courtroom and go to a panel. Rather than the landowner... Manders: ...! mean at $12,000.00 for 40 acres, is a halfa million right there. Hoffman: Yeah, that's on the whole thing... When you get into splitting land then you get into the argument, well you split my land. You depreciated the value of it... He has two parcels. Mr. Fox has a nice parcel... Lash: So it's that circle on the west side? Hoffman: Yep. Lash: Okay. That abuts Bluff Creek. Hoffman: Yes. Lash: And how much is there? Hoffman: There's about another 40 acres there and 30 acres... Lash: How about the Degler site? The eastern site. How big is that? Lash: And any kind of rough idea what's that? Park and Rec Commission Meeting - August 25, 1998 Hoffman: There's the 30 acres... We are chastised or ridiculed for not, as a city for not...on behalf of the State of Minnesota. How do we do that underneath this kind of a real estate market? We can only pay... Lash: I guess I just get a little confused when an appraiser comes out. You hire an appraiser, aren't you sort of under the assumption that they know what they're doing. I mean they come in and they say it's worth $4,000.00. And then somebody says to the appraiser, oh no. It's worth more than that so then they say, well no it's worth $8,000.00. Well that's not enough. Okay, it's worth $12,000.00. I mean aren't appraisers supposed to come out in what the appraised value of something at... Hoffman: ...highest and best use today. Lash: But they should know what they're talking about. You're hiring them to do an appraisal. 1 mean any of us could go and say well I think it's worth $8,000.00. And Fred could say, I think it's worth 12. Hoffman: ... Lash: ...does anyone have anything else on the budget? Frank, is that what you're here for? Budget? Well let's hear it. Oh, you don't have anything you want to share? Frank Scott: ...looking at some things but they haven't put together...we're going to get together this winter with the softball people and the baseball people and talk about what you might do like with...Bluff Creek or ftx up the concession stand so we can...and do some fund raisers in that area. And then it would be interesting, some projects where we could put part of the money in and...and I guess I don't know how to initiate that. But we need to...sit down and decide themselves what they want to propose to you. Like one of the things that they talk about is Bluff Creek would make a very nice softball complex for the entire age group up to 15 years old...over 200 feet, like 240 out to the trees. It's like 240 out to the trees. And the softball doesn't carry that far so. But rather than just bringing...and not have an overall plan, we would rather put it together and come in here and say this is what we can see happening at Bandimere. This is what we can see happening at Lake Ann. What we can see happening at Bluff Creek for the best of everybody and then get some fundraisers going and we can do some things. I don't know, is it possible for the CAA to work with the city and...stuff like that. Hoffman: Absolutely. We'd be happy to. Frank Scott: ...interested. Like up at Bluff Creek. There is no bleachers. Some people bring in their cars and others are sitting on the ground, but now with soccer, you're starting soccer up there and so it's only going to...that makes it real tough to sit on the ground so those kind of ,things that we have bleachers. And we checked the price and they were like 750 for...so you're talking $1,500.00 a ballpark and there's six parks... But like I say, I just came down to hear what was going to be said. If there was any big things going to happen, I'd like to know. And Park and Rec Commission Meeting - August 25, 1998 hopefully by November-December we'll have put together a plan and bring it in. It will include possibly District 112. We'd like to get them involved because they do use Lake Susan. They do use some of the bigger parks. And even possibly the Chaska Soccer. One question I have. That land that was the hockey people were looking at and decided to go to Chaska. Is that still open or are they using it for something? Hoffman: It's being used as a public works storage site right now and there's talk about a cold storage building there in the future. So there's getting to be an increase in desire to see that use for storage activity. Frank Scott: I talked to Tom Bren...plays winter soccer and we have places where we could use something that doesn't need to have even a dirt field or artificial grass type of thing that we could use and I don't know what they have to do to that property but there's a lot of things out there that they're talking about and I do get the agenda for the meetings so...I'd better stop by and see what that all means. Hoffman: Frank, I think if you offered this commission 50 cent dollars they'd be hard pressed to turn you down. They want to put some money in reserve and work with the CAA. Frank Scott: Okay, and that's what...like I say rather than, a lot of people say let's do this, let's do that and I say let's put the whole thing together so it's not, well what are you going to want next year .... once we put it together, hopefully it's good for five years... Lash: Okay. Does anybody else have anything? Is that enough to work on there for a while Todd? Hoffman: I've got a couple to add. Buildings for City Center and Bandimere on the to do list at some point. The warming house will be gone. It will be a temporary trailer here...actually two buildings. And then some old news in capital improvements. As you recall the Lions pledged $98,000.00 to Lake Ann lights in the softball...and have not had the ability to regain their charitable gaming. So they made the first payment of $26,000.00 but it does not appear as though they'll be able to make those other payments at least anytime in the near future. We had $26,000.00 allocated for playground at the recreation center. And in conversations with the City Manager Ashworth and the Council, it seems appropriate instead of pursuing that acquisition, to book that $26,000.00 against their debt and then take on that debt. Hold that $60,000.00... so that's the mood right now. I have not been successful in contacting the new leadership of the Lions to discuss that but that's the way... Lash: Talking buildings, are you talking about a warming house back there? Hoffman: Yep. Lash: ~.g,nd~en'two:bui}dings'at,Bandimereq~,c,~:::;~,+ .... 10 Park and Rec Commission Meeting - August 25, 1998 Hoffman: Yeah, there's a building concession...building on the focal point between the two ballfields and then there's a much larger park building over in the picnic area. Lash: What kind of a building is that? Hoffman: Those would be stone structures. Lash: Like a picnic shelter kind of thing? Hoffman: Pavilion, picnic shelter. Manders: ... Hoffman: We did come up with a list of some fairly, you know there's a fexv small items in there but there's a lot of big items so we're going to have to select...prioritizing to do here. Lash: Okay. Next item. PROGRAM REPORTS: 1998 HALLOWEEN PARTY. Ruegemer: Thank you Chair Lash. Just an update for the commission. The Halloween party's going to be Saturday, October 24th. 6:00 to 8:00 again at the Chanhassen Recreation Center. We're going to be working on a lot of you know new games. Adding some new games. A lot of activities will be moved out of the smaller rooms and added to the gym area where we have a little bit more room for that. Because it's been busy trying to, I've already been hitting up people for volunteering already. Different groups .... I needed to speak with Charlie again. We always need to add additional props. If anybody has any you know props in their garage or something or old fencing in their backyard or something they want to get rid of, we'll take it for props so always looking for new things to scare kids with. Anticipate the level...I think are conservative at 600 to 700 people. I think we did close to 800 last year. With that we need to buy more candy and plan accordingly for that so we'll be asking for volunteers at the September meeting so if anybody's up for that, I can certainly supply costumes if you don't have any so. That's coming up fast and we'll certainly work on that. Lash: You don't want to have it on the 30th because you don't have enough time to set up or what? Ruegemer: Well it would have been the 31st Lash: No, if you have it on a Friday. Ruegemer: Oh, if we had it on Friday. Yeah, it's easier to have it. Well it's easier now having it at the Recreation'Center but it seems like as we get a lot closer to Halloween, it's harder to find Volunteers and just, it's just a lot harder. It's a lot easier for finding you know larger groups to 11 Park and Rec Commission Meeting - August 25, 1998 help out with that. It seems like a lot of people are really busy on the actual day or close to the day. Do you have any questions? Lash: ... Ruegemer: $2.00 per child and parents do not have to pay. Lash: Okay, anything else? Okay. ADMINISTRATIVE REPORTS: RECREATION CENTER. Hoffman: I'd like to introduce Susan Marek. She is the Interim Recreation Center Coordinator. She has worked at the Recreation Center almost since it's start, both as an aerobics instructor and then more recently as a recreation facility supervisor so she's taking on a big task in managing all of the administrative duties. Scheduling, hiring, cleaning, plants. The whole gammet. I appreciate that and she's here to report on the activities of the Recreation Center. Marek: Nothing too big going on. We are going to have some banners placed on the outside of our gym wall on September 8th. The banners were completed. Todd brought them out to the Rec Center. They look really nice. Please stop out there and take a look at them when they are put up. I think you'll find that they're very attractive. Manders: To be viewed from the outside the idea? Marek: They'll be on the north side of the gymnasium facing Highway 5. And they'll be fairly high on the gymnasium wall as well. We're coordinating the placement of those banners, having them installed on September 8th. We can have them up for 30 days and that brings us up to and through our third anniversary celebration at the Rec Center so it coincides nicely with the events that we'll have planned for our third anniversary. Again we are trying to generate new interest in the rec center and highlighting the fact that we are a fitness facility and also child care is available. So we hope that that spurs some interest or at least some community recognition of where we are since we seem to have an identity crisis out there. So we're happy about that and looking forward to the third anniversary. Programming. Our preschool soccer began on Monday evening. We were at capacity enrollment so that's over 90, well over 90 children involved in soccer. Fall and winter programs. We're taking registrations for that. Our dance program continues to grow and be very popular. Many of the classes are filled and we're opening up additional classes to accommodate the interest so it's a very successful program for us. Manders: What kind of fees associated with that preschool? Marek: Preschool sports? Manders:': Yeah:~:What kind of fees? 12 Park and Rec Commission Meeting - August 25, 1998 Marek: It's $26.00 per session and I believe each session runs about, I think that's 11 weeks. Maybe 8 weeks. Manders: And you said 90 kids? Marek: Yeah. And it's...but it's a great program because it brings children as well as parents to our site and ! think that that's very good... Another thing that we're working on is proposing a streamline, more simple child care program at the Rec Center. We realize that we have some financial responsibilities that we need to meet by January 1 st. We do have a plan almost ready. And we want to have that plan ready to implement on September 1 st when our childcare reopens after this two week break that we've had out there. So again I just want to thank you for your patience in allowing us to work through the childcare issues, understanding that we do have some requirements ~ve need to meet by January 1 st. Howe: ...the banner. 30 days only? Why, you say it will only be up for 30 days? Marek: Yeah. I think it's an ordinance and Todd is working on that. Hoffman: City ordinance. Temporary sign. 30 days. Lash: And can you take it down for a week and put it back up for 30 days? Hoffman: You can have a total of what, three times a year? Marek: I'll have to look at the details. Hoffman: Total of three times a year. Hoxve: Can we break our own rules on this? Berg: Let's follow that example and decide that it's a stupid ordinance. Hoffman: We did that for special events and we obtained an exemption for special events so we can place our special event signs anywhere we please as long as we're in public right-of-way. Lash: Hook this in with the art display. And every month or two there's a new art display and so then that's... Berg: ...special event. Hoffman: It won't work. You'll note an outcome of your meeting, your past meeting was a temporary sign at the coruer which we got yelled at. 13 Park and Rec Commission Meeting - August 25, 1998 Marek: By the way, personally when I was working generated, I had I think 8 to 10 people or families stop in and say hey I saw the sign on the comer. What have you got going on here? What's this all about? Howe: Why did that go? 30 days? Hoffman: Illegal. Howe: Who said? Hoffman: City ordinance. And then the developers can't do it either Mike so we beat up on those guys, or those people all the time and then they were the ones calling the planning department and said your city has an illegal sign on the comer of Highway 5 and Galpin Boulevard and get it off. You would never let us do that. You guys can't either. Lash: Is that a certain size or what? Hoffman: Type of sign. Marek: The banners, I think when you view the banners that your first words won't be tacky. Hoffman: They'll be very nice, yeah. But then the long term is, like a Merit Heating and Cooling sign~ Put a sign on, a pylon sign on Highway 5 which says Bluff Creek Elementary/Chanhassen Recreation Center and has letters on it and you can say Halloween Party this Saturday. But that's a you know $70,000.00 or $60,000.00 investment that's very difficult to find the money. Howe: Those things cost that much money? Hoffman: You bet. And it's the best 60 or whatever, whatever Berquist said, he said it's the best $40,000.00 1 ever paid in advertising. By the time, what 30,000 cars go by there a day so his first day of advertising cost him a buck and a quarter a car. And every day after that, now it's down to pennies per car per day. Lash: How about something on the roof?. Can we put something on the roof?. A blow up gorilla. Hoffman: Not on the roof. Pylon sign. It's got to be on the ground. It's got to be so many feet off the property line. So many square feet. Set type... Berg: What about a great big flag pole with an American Flag on top and a flag underneath saying Chanhassen Recreation Center. Hoffman: ~They even ordinance that in Chanhassen. That's why the Perkin's flag is so small in Chanhassen. 14 Park and Rec Commission Meeting - August 25, 1998 Roeser: We have a smaller Perkins sign than anybody. Hoffman: And the flag. The flag itself. They have those great big flags in all the other cities. Not in ordinance here... We'll get away with itjust as long as it's legally possible. Lash: Okay, thanks for that. Does anybody else have questions? Roeser: Just do it for 30 days and be slow about taking it down. REFERENDUM PROJECT BUDGET. Hoffman: I've got a budget report and then for the most part...comptete report at the end of October. Projects, improved neighborhood parks. The 18 projects are noted there. The total budget was $495,000.00. We paid cash out of $56,000.00. We have bills in, or encumbrances of $348,000.00. So the balance is $89,956.00. Lash: We held off on Herman Field, didn't we? Hoffman: Yes. Yeah, there's some hold offs in there. There's some items which aren't billed yet and so that's pretty much on task. On target. Approved community parks, $1.610. $1.4 was from the referendum and then $200,000.00 was this year's CIP money. You put 100 into Bandimere and 100 into City Center. There's the expenditures. The encumbrances include the remainder of...contract and the remainder of the Brauer contract. We have a total there and so on a million six project, our balance, a precarious balance is only $9,000.00. We do not have a lot of leeway for change orders and other problems on the project. Flip it over to open space. You have a million 755 to start. Expenditures through August 12th orS11,000.00 and then the Hansen acquisition is at $388. That's an attorney appraisal and recording fees. Current balance is about $1,350,000.00. And the construction of trails is also for the most part completely invested. Encumbered, $1.54 and the denotation there is a million 24 for the referendum and then up $200-300,000.00 in CIP, which by the time this is done will be money out of the bank. So we have a total balance there of about $100,000.00, which by the time we add in attorney fees for appraisals, appraisal, the remainder of the appraisal fee and the remainder of the easement acquisition, that will be evened out or better so. Projects are moving along. They're under contract. They're not all in the ground yet but everything has been, everything with the exception of the largest open space acquisition has been put in place. Howe: Todd, does this account for interest we've earned since we sold those bonds? Hoffman: When I look at the detail. No, it did not have interest in there. It had the cost of the bonding and cost for other legal... Howe: ...we have a $9,000.00 balance. There's the flip side on the community parks. We could allocate interest to cover some of that, right? Hoffman: Yep. Correct. 15 Park and Rec Commission Meeting - August 25, 1998 Howe: Because interest has got to be the low five figures. $10,000.00 or $20,000.00. Hoffman: Yeah. There will be some interest. They'll want to keep the interest in each category so open space will have the most interest. Howe: Okay, good. Lash: So we've got that $89,000.00 balance under neighborhood parks. A chunk of that would be the Herman Field, which we're going to hold off on...problems. Was there anything else that we just postponed or is everything else? Hoffman: There's some dollars in there for the roundhouse itself. Under Roundhouse Phase II development. There's some dollars in there. There will be some cost overruns that will go into there. The Stone Creek trail that we were just out on tonight. On the Stone Creek side had a washout which we will have to hire a contractor back to correct that. Do a new design. Put a culvert underneath and so this thing will be nickel dimed over the summer as we complete these projects. But this is as of August 17th, that's what we're looking at. There's also outstanding bills that have not been in yet for these projects. Miracle Recreation has some outstanding bills. Lash: That would not be included under the encumbrances? Hoffman: Correct. Yeah, encumbrances only include what I have on my desk for contracts or bills. Berg: Powers Boulevard trail realistically going in in the spring? Hoffman: Well we talked about that yesterday. My preference, it looks like Bluff Creek is going to be held up because of a land issue down at the south. My preference would be to modify the contract and allow Midwest to go to work on both Galpin and Powers at the same time. And see if we can't punch it up. Roeser: It'd be nice to have Powers done this year. Hoffman: Yeah, that's a call we have to make in the next couple of weeks. Otherwise, Galpin would go and then we would have two rollovers with Powers and Bluff Creek and I don't want to see that happen. Lash: Okay, any other comments on this? Okay, thank you Todd. COMMISSION MEMBER COMMITTEE REPORTS. None. COMMISSION MEMBER PRESENTATIONS: None. ADMINISTRATIVE PACKET: 16 Park and Rec Commission Meeting - August 25, 1998 Howe: The John Glenn thing went okay? Marek: I was there. I came fully clothed with no make-up on .... they had all four community rooms rented. They did have about 80 people show up. Almost all of those people were from their own organizations, which is the Free Christian Assembly. They're out of Illinois. And they just sort of travel around the country, leafletting metro areas and then holding these revivals. But it went off without a hitch. They were very pleasant and courteous renters. They cleaned up after themselves and left early. And they paid their bill ahead of time. So, we prepared for the worse. Hoffman: Don't be too quick to judge. The anniversary party on Friday night was much worst. Marek: ...40th anniversary party that got a little out of hand. They stayed late. Made a mess. Kids running all over the place. We could have used the public safety department on that one. Manders: You got some free advertising. Hoffman: Couldn't buy that advertising now could we. Lash: Just one thing...skateboarding and rollerblading...City Council. How does that, what does that have to do with us? Hoffman: Nothing. We've opted out because we're building our own. They wanted us to join in a coalition. Lash: Oh! Hoffman: They wanted, there's other cities doing it where they buy a set of ramps and then they move them around from city to city, city to city. Lash: Have the kids who...any contact with you whatsoever? Maybe this would be the time to kind of. Hoffrnan: They stole my video and ran. I've got to get my video back as well. Lash: But this is the time though for them to put their money where their mouth is and get... Roeser: Anything new...at Lake Ann? Ruegemer: They're really slow... They have a little loitering you know down there a little bit at night a little bit but as far as the...painting on the walls or throwing tables over or that type of stuff, it's been really good. No troubles at the concession building. Breaking into that. Didn't have any cases'of that this summer af all. 17 Park and Rec Commission Meeting - August 25, 1998 Roeser: ... Ruegemer: Yeah, it has for 2 or 3 seasons now. Manders: Did you know the concession building was open last weekend? I thought that was going to shut down here, Ruegemer: It has. Last Sunday was. Manders: That was the last? Ruegemer: Yep. Record year. About 16.8 in revenues, which is our highest even. Hoffman: They save their money at the gate. They buy candy bars. Lash: So what's a person? You're walking through the park with a friend. The dog's on the leash on the trails. The police stop you and then as you get in a little deeper you find this group of about 15 under aged kids drinking beer out of glass bottles. Roeser: Make them drink out of cans. Lash: I know, I was thinking the same thing. Did you know glass is illegal down here and I thought well okay. They're all under age and this is... The cop is stopping us for walking our dog on'the trail and there's an under age party going on. Hoffman: 1 hope you talked your way through that dog in the park on the trail thing. Lash: Well yeah, we won't... Okay, anything else anybody? Manders: i just wanted to add a note about reading the Minutes from last week. I enjoyed the discussion on... (A tape change occurred at this point in the discussion.) Manders: I could see the struggle you know. Roeser: I'm really glad I wasn't here because I'm afraid I would have... Lash: Well what would you have done? Roeser: I don't know...Sugarbush Park? Lash: .-,You.didn'~t tikethat~ -~:~ ,~.:~,:~ ~.,'.,~';~-~,~,~: ~. ~. ~, :~,,~,:-:, ........... 18 Park and Rec Commission Meeting - August 25, 1998 Roeser: It sounds like Candyland or you know. That's what it reminded me of, Winnie the Pooh. Manders: Maybe I shouldn't have brought that up. Ruegemer: And one more quick item here before we adjourn. A representative of Westwood Church had contacted me late last week. They would like to do kind of a family event out at Lake Ann on Sunday, October 25th. What they're looking to do is kind of just have a fun activity. They would like to do a bonfire, which I see we don't have campfires at Lake Ann but you know I wanted to bring that to the commission's attention. And also they wanted to do hayrides within the park itself. I see we have an ordinance against pets in the park. I wanted to bring it up to the commission to gather your thoughts and ideas for that. Basically it's just a fun event for the church. If the commission would like to grant their wishes on there or grant their permission, I'll certainly work with Westwood to coordinate that event for them. I guess what I'm asking is what are your thoughts about having hayrides and stuff in the park itself. They would be a paid rental. They would like to kind of congregate down in the pavilion area down, kind of closer to the lake. Obviously the picnic pavilion will be winterized by that point so I've made them aware of that. I think xvhat they're looking for is just somewhat of some shelter. Kind of a gathering point and then do the hayrides and stuff kind of right down in that area. And potentially do a bonfire too with that. Lash: It's down in the like the drive through kind of thing maybe? Ruegemer: We could probably keep it right down on the northern part of the park. Either on the road itself, because October 25th, it's not going to be busy at Lake Ann so we can certainly, it certainly would be a safe event. Berg: Would they be liable for any damage that the wagons do or whatever to the sod? Ruegemer: We certainly could require you know. Lash: Handle the clean-up and. Ruegemer: This is really kind of the initial stages too of this event. This isn't you know a done deal by any... They're certainly checking out all their options at this point so I just wanted to bring that to the commission. If there's some type of sanctions you wanted to wedge against Westwood having to give insurance. Pick up all your candied apples from the horses, that type of stuff, you can do that. Howe: They can do that. They clean up the park, don't they? Hoffman: They're a good neighbor. Howe: They're a good neighbor. 19 Park and Rec Commission Meeting - August 25, 1998 Lash: ...satellites for them if there's no plumbing anymore and as long as they police after the horses and pick-up hay that falls off. I guess I would encourage the wagons to stay on the, I mean you've got that big turnaround down there. Hoffman: On the road. Lash: Yeah. There's plenty of places they could stay and keep them off the grass. I wouldn't have a problem with it. Roeser: What is the time? Ruegemer: 2:00 to 4:00 p.m. on the Sunday afternoon, October 25th. Lash: You'd have to think of where you could put a bonfire that would create the least. Ruegemer: I would have to talk to Mark Littfin, our Fire Marshal on that. Lash: What, like down by the volleyball court. Ruegemer: Yeah, in that area or by the rental dock area where there's sand. Build some type of a ring for the fire. Lash: Okay. Is there a motion to adjourn? Howe moved, Franks seconded to adjourn the meeting. All voted in favor and the motion carried. The meeting was adjourned. Submitted by Todd Hoffman Park and Rec Director Prepared by Nann Opheim 20