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PRC 2005 01 25 CHANHASSEN PARK AND RECREATION COMMISSION REGULAR MEETING JANUARY 25, 2005 Chairman Stolar called the meeting to order at 7:30 p.m. MEMBERS PRESENT: Glenn Stolar, Tom Kelly, Jack Spizale, Paula Atkins, and Steve Scharfenberg MEMBERS ABSENT: Ann Murphy and Kevin Dillon STAFF PRESENT: Todd Hoffman, Park and Rec Director; and Jerry Ruegemer, Recreation Superintendent PUBLIC PRESENT: Name Address Phone No. Kim Grant 95 Shasta Circle 401-9278 Kris Solie-Johnson 6421 Bretton Way 401-4301 Jeff Daniel 1321 Stratton Court 474-1227 Paul Modeen 6500 Nathan Road 361-6055 Jolene Vicchiollo 8046 Cheyenne Avenue 906-8926 Thomas Bergfalk 6461 Bretton Way 927-5884 Martha Newell 900 Lake Susan Drive 937-6127 Joe Fernandes 6530 Quail Xing 937-9873 Steve & Marcia Crist 6501 Welsley Court 380-0624 Eric & Kerry Sellman 6421 Pleasant Park Drive 975-9878 Matt & Beth Jones 1310 Stratton Court 474-1557 Marcus Zbinden 1640 Bretton Way 401-8866 APPROVAL OF AGENDA: Stolar: First of all what I’d like to do, I’d actually like to put the chairperson/vice chairperson out to New Business if we may. So I’m going to actually be jumping to Approval of the Agenda with that being a recommended change. Any objections? Okay. Any other changes or updates to the agenda? Seeing none, do I have a motion to approve the agenda. Kelly moved, Spizale seconded to approve the agenda as amended. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 5 to 0. PUBLIC ANNOUNCEMENTS: Stolar: Todd or Jerry, do you have any? Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 Ruegemer: I do not. th Hoffman: February Festival. But for the public that’s here now. Saturday, February 5 on the ice of Lake Ann Park so lots of activities going on that day. A $1,500 treasure hunt from the library. Medallion hunt. That’s throughout town. Not just at Lake Ann. Sliding that day and s’mores by the Boy Scouts and ice fishing on the lake and other activities so hope for good weather and plan to come on to Lake Ann that day. Stolar: How’s the ice looking? Hoffman: Excellent. If the snow doesn’t melt we’ll be fine. VISITOR PRESENTATIONS: PRESENTATION OF CERTIFICATE OF APPRECIATION TO THE CHASKA HIGH SCHOOL KEY CLUB. Stolar: First one we’d like to present a Certificate of Appreciation to the Chaska High School Key Club for their work on the Halloween event. This is, I don’t know how many years have they been doing it now? Ruegemer: Halloween and Easter Egg. Yeah, and hopefully February Festival this year too. We’re in negotiations now so it’s been 5, 6, 7 years for all those events and we’ve asked for 20 volunteers. We’ve gotten 40 so they’ve always really come through for our department and our special events. Stolar: That’s great and on a personal note, I was not there. The whole commission, many of us were out there on Halloween and just saw them running around, helping out like crazy and really appreciate it so without further ado, I’d like to present this certificate. Who’s here from. And your name is? Both Paul, thank you very much to you and your members. We have a Certificate here thanking you, Chaska High School Key Club for your dedication and contributions to the City of Chanhassen while volunteering for our community special events. Paul Modeen: Well thank you very much. Stolar: At this time we would also like to open up the floor to the visitors in our gallery here to make any presentations. I will say we’re going to talk about the playgrounds in a little bit so if it’s about that, if you would mind waiting until we talk about that. But are there any visitor presentations, comments wanting to be made? Paul, did you want to say anything to us about Key Club? Paul Modeen: It’s just been an honor. We are in school to get involved. I know like you said, there’s kids, we have sign-up’s for tons of different activities and we ask for 20 and we end up with 50 and it’s kind of hard to you know turn them down but then the next event it fills up again so that’s good to see that our high school, there’s tons of kids getting involved. Actually Chaska High School has the largest Key Club organization in the 7 county Twin Cities area so kind of, I don’t know special thing for us that there’s so many kids in our school involved so. 2 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 Stolar: Great. Well again thank you. Paul Modeen: Well thank you. Hoffman: What’s the motto of Key Club? What’s the goal? Paul Modeen: What’s the goal? Hoffman: Yeah. Paul Modeen: Just to serve the greater community so we range…the American Cancer Society a lot. We do a couple Relay for Life through… We did last year. We raised $20,000 for that. In one night so events just ranging like you said, from Halloween with the little kids, I know I was a part of it. I also did one in Chaska. Dressed as a cowboy and it’s fun. It’s just fun. I have little sisters and kind of run around, and it’s a good time so I know I’ve been in Key Club for 2 years now and it’s been a great time so again thank you very much. Stolar: Thanks. Any other visitor presentations? Seeing none, we will move onto approval of the minutes. APPROVAL OF MINUTES: Scharfenberg moved, Spizale seconded to approve the verbatim and summary minutes of the Park and Recreation Commission meeting dated December 14. 2004. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 5 to 0. Stolar: Actually Todd when I moved it to new business, the Chair/Vice Chair. I was just wondering if we wanted to let our visitors, I was just trying to get so that they could talk first. Hoffman: Sure, that’d be fine. Stolar: Okay. So why don’t we, I’m sorry. We’ll make the Chairperson/Vice Chairperson after we discuss the public comment, if there are no objections. Okay, seeing none. Let’s move then to the discussion of the public comments on the 2005 playground replacement projects. INVITATION FOR PUBLIC COMMENT ON 2005 PLAYGROUND REPLACEMENT PROJECTS: A. Chanhassen Hills Park B. Curry Farms Park C. Lake Susan Park D. North Lotus Lake Park E. Rice Marsh Lake Park Hoffman: Thanks Glenn Stolar, and members of the commission and members of the audience here this evening. One year ago in January of 2004 the department completed a safety assessment for 10 wood playground structures located within our park system. These structures 3 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 are, were manufactured by a company out of Delano, Minnesota. Landscape Structures and all of them have been in since around the mid 80’s. Some of them in the early 90’s. I want to give credit for initiating that assessment to our Park Maintenance Division. They’re trained in playground inspection and they identified, began to identify a number of significant safety concerns with our older playground structures. New safety guidelines have been implemented and those are typically through the CPSC, the Consumer Product Safety Commission, or the ASTM. The American Society of Testing Materials. Most playgrounds, or all playgrounds manufactured after 1990 and some even later than that no longer comply with safety guidelines, and that is a concern for us at the city. The Park Commission has made it clear that updating park amenities, including playgrounds to current safety guidelines is a top priority. Our city administration, our City Council supported that effort and the 2004 Capital Improvement Program included dollars to replace outdated playgrounds at Lake Ann Park. A new structure that was completed late last fall. And Meadow Green Park, and the picture displayed here this evening was the new playground that was installed at Meadow Green Park. And then a new playground was also installed at Bandimere Community Heights for toddlers aged 2 through 5 to compliment the structure already there. One note, the new playground at Bandimere Community Park will account for a planned removal of a wood play structure at Bandimere Heights Park. The smaller park located directly adjacent to Bandimere Community Park. In 2005 we included the remaining playground replacements necessary in the CIP. Recommended that to the City Council. Those include some remodeling of playgrounds in Minnewashta Heights Park, Carver Beach Park and replacement of playgrounds at Chanhassen Hills Park, Curry Farms Park, Lake Susan Park, North Lotus Lake Park, and Rice Marsh Lake Park. In total the city is investing $670,000 in cash plus labor between the two years in 2004-2005 to upgrade city playgrounds. And again I just want to commend all of you as a commission and the council and our administration for having the foresight to include those dollars for these replacement projects. It’s going to be a very exciting year for the City of Chanhassen. It’s residents in the area playgrounds. By the end of this year we will have oh 9, between last year and this year, 9 either updated or completely new playgrounds within our city park system and that’s a significant investment. The way we’d like to start this is with public input. One of the best ways to meet the needs of our residents is to ask for their input so prior to us as a commission or staff initiating any details of our plans, we call for neighborhood input. We did include a mailings to each one of these neighborhoods about a half a mile radius from the playground or the park site. Call that meeting here this evening, and so the commission action I would like tonight is that the park commission invite, take formal comments on each park site and take the comments one site at a time so we can keep them organized. And then at conclusion of the formal comments I would suggest that we take a 15 minute recess to engage the audience in some informal conversation about what their desires are at each one of these park sites. Stolar: Great, thank you. Then without objection or further ado I’d like to invite the audience to come up to the microphone and let us know your thoughts on the playground replacement initiative, and if you want to just, I’ll just kind of go in sequence here, if you’d like. Are you here for the playground? If you could please state your name and address. Jeff Daniel: Yeah, Jeff Daniel. 1321 Stratton Court, Chanhassen. Right in Curry Farms as well. It’s been a long time resident of Chanhassen. Especially recently moved into Curry Farms back in 2000 and having two children at the ages 2 and, well now 2 and 6, the opportunity for the City 4 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 to replace the playground equipment at Curry Farms, which is outdated and some of the pieces on there have had to been actually taken down because of the aging of the equipment. So like I said, looking forward to when that park. The only question I have is, which I’m sure will be explained tonight is the timeframe of when the project will be started and completed. That will be all. Thank you. Stolar: So Todd we’ll make sure we’ll talk a little bit about that after we hear comment. Thank you. Kris Solie-Johnson: My name is Kris Solie-Johnson and I’m at 6421 Bretton, also in Curry Farms. And I’m really just curious about the different play structures that are being considered. What kind of age groups are they appropriate for and just kind of timeframe and you know, I was just trying to figure out how it all gets installed and what the process is. Stolar: Okay. Thank you Kris. Hoffman: If we could just keep on Curry Farms and complete that so. Stolar: Anybody else for Curry Farms? Matt Jones: My name is Matt Jones. I’m at 1310 Stratton Court and I’m just here because I’d like to do whatever I can to help the process move forward. I’m a new resident to Chanhassen and starting in December, and one of the things that brought me to the city is the good park and rec system that they have. I came from Minneapolis and that was one of the things that we looked, Minneapolis had a strong park and rec program and we thought Chanhassen had a very strong park system. That’s something that really drew, brought us here and I’m thankful that the council is taking the time and the initiative and the forethought to start and keep updating the process to make sure that remains a strong core value for the community. So I appreciate it. I’d like to know what I can do to help and I just hopefully will get some more information on that at, throughout the course of the evening. Thank you. Stolar: Anyone else for Curry Farms? Did you want to talk a little bit about Curry Farms then or do you want us to keep taking. Hoffman: Just keep, we’ll talk about some of the questions will be similar so. Stolar: Okay. Next. I think we’re off of Curry Farms then so Todd, did you have any comments you wanted to make? Okay. Kim Grant: Hi. I’m Kim Grant. I live at 95 Shasta Circle East. I’m for North Lotus Lake Park and that’s, I’m mainly interested in also the age group. My children are almost 2 and 4 and I’m interested in making sure there’s play area for the 2 year old. Kind of the 2 and 3 year old and then also the older kids. I’m also interested in what the flooring’s going to be underneath the play area. Right now it’s pea gravel at Lotus Lake and it’s just filthy and kids throw it at each other and they eat it and it’s, I’d prefer not pea gravel again so. I like the, as you say, kind of has 5 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 the rubber underneath and I’ve been to parks like that and it’s really nice so. And thank you, I’m very excited. We use the park all the time so thanks. Stolar: Great, thank you. Anyone else for North Lotus Lake? Eric Sellman: Hi, I’m Eric Sellman from 6421 Pleasant Park Drive and we just, I have 3 boys and we use the park almost every day so we’re really excited that this change is coming. I’m just curious about what it’s going to look like. I mean my boys are 6 and 4 and 2 and so I would love it if it were geared towards that age, but I think the 6 year old uses it the most so if it were age appropriate to say 6 to 12, that would be I think that’d be the best bet. This park sees a lot of use from soccer teams just use it really heavily in the spring and I think that age group is predominantly 6 to 12 so I think that would be a good fit, and thanks. Marcia Crist: I’m Marcia Crist and I live at 6501 Welsley Court. We actually use all of the parks in Chanhassen but primarily Curry Farms and Lotus Lake, and we’ve also taken advantage of the park program, the playground program in the summer which has been terrific. So we’re interested in all the improvements to the parks and we’re really glad you guys are doing this. It’s been a great boon to our family. Stolar: Thank you. Any others for North Lotus. Okay, if not. Do you have a comment on a playground? Audience: No, I’m just here to get information. Stolar: Okay, anyone else like to come up? Jo Vicchiollo: Hi, I’m Jo Vicchiollo and we live at 8046 Cheyenne Avenue and we use Rice Marsh. Well actually we don’t anymore because it’s in, it’s not a good park for our kids. We have a 3 year old, a 4 year old and 8 year old, all boys so they’re pretty rough. We actually take them to Bandimere and I like that park a lot. I like the toddler park and I like the two climbing ones. I think that’s a really good example so we’d like to see, I think that’s kind of big for Rice Marsh but something along those lines that will appeal to the older kids as well. Thanks. Stolar: Great, thank you. Anybody else want to make a comment? Okay, and there will be time for follow-up questions and then we’ll have the informal discussion. So Todd you had a few questions that I think cut across multiple parks. If you want to take some time to talk through that. Hoffman: Absolutely. Be glad to. The idea about process is really going to be a variable one. That’s the reason we started this evening. In many new playgrounds, residents choose to install their own playground. If that was the case in any of these, we would work with the residents. Install with the specific manufacturer… If that’s not the case, we have two other options. We can have the manufacturer install them or we can have our crews here at the city install. They do that quite often. So the timeframe varies. We’re trying to put these in sometime throughout the summer. Often times it falls into the fall, and that’s mainly due to our work load schedule that we have so many people on staff. …taking care of all the parks and the trails, and so they’re 6 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 strained and summer start-up is very busy and then you have more time later on in the summer and fall. You also have to get the design and go through the ordering process which takes a couple of months, so most of these will be installed summer to fall this coming year. And again the process is variable, depending on which way we go. The commission will represent those neighborhoods who don’t have an active group that is working. If there’s an active group that wants to work on the selection process, the designing process, then the individual neighborhood will do that as well. Age groups is a big question that we have. Typically it’s toddler, age 2 to 5 and then the older kids age 6 to 12. You have to have separate playground sites for each one of those age groups so, if we don’t have the space or the budget isn’t there, we have to select either one. 6 to 12 or the toddler group. As you can imagine, most cases that goes to 6 to 12 group and then the smaller kids… Surfacing, we’re really leaving pea gravel behind. Glad to hear that. I was a strong advocate for a long time of pea gravel because it was, number one inexpensive and very resilient, but has become contaminated and it packs down and it doesn’t provide the resilient surface that you really want on these playgrounds. The number one cause of injuries is fall to the surface in playgrounds and we want to get new surfacing that’s as safe as we can get it. Meadow Green and our other neighborhood parks will all go to manufacturer or engineered wood fiber product, similar to what we put in Meadow Green this year. It’s plays two roles in one. It’s accessible so you have the mandate to provide accessibility to these playgrounds and wood fiber does that. You can traverse it and it’s also less expensive than the other model that we’re using and that’s the poured in place rubber that you’ve seen at Bandimere or the new one at Lake Ann. So all of our community parks, Lake Susan is one of the new ones we’re putting it in. Will have that poured in place rubber. It adds to the cost but the two new installations this year for that material was just over $30,000 at Lake Ann and Bandimere so it’s a very expensive, long lasting resilient material so we do that at our really high traffic sites. Our community parks. Neighborhood parks will all be the engineered wood fiber. Other questions that you guys wrote down? Scharfenberg: Do you want to go over the process, what we used last year Todd for picking the 3 sites and how we kind of went through that? Hoffman: The straight manufactured? Scharfenberg: Yeah, the presentations that we went through. Hoffman: Sure. Yeah, the commission can explain that as well if you’d like. Steve, do you want to go ahead? Scharfenberg: Sure. We had, as Todd indicated, we had Bandimere, Meadow Green and Lake Ann and we had 3 providers come in, or representatives. Market representatives from each of those companies had you know similar products but different things and so I think the staff had presented them with this is the site. This is the area that you’re working with. This is kind of what we would see, would like to see at that area and they came up with these presentations for us. These computer drawings of what that would be and we had Jack and myself and Ann and was there, was there 4 of us? So we, they kind of did those presentations and afterwards we kind of ranked them on our own what we thought would be the best fit at those sites. What we liked in the presentation and that’s kind of how we chose. We didn’t have, I can’t remember, there 7 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 wasn’t a whole lot of input from, but I missed that. I was on the back end of that coming in early so I don’t know if there was a lot of input from neighborhoods last year. Hoffman: We didn’t have a formal meeting like this one. Scharfenberg: Okay, so that’s kind of how we chose last year. Stolar: We came up with, I think didn’t we come up for each of the manufacturers, some of the key features we wanted to see and that’s what was the input into their design. So it would seem to me in this particular process, since we do have such a great showing, that some of those things might be what the neighborhoods do is help develop what are some of the key features within that and then we send it out to bid to manufacturers to say what could you do for, with these features for this project I believe. Kelly: An example of the things that we saw last time was climbing walls. Everyone seemed to have a different, it seemed…that climbing walls were pretty popular, and everyone seemed to have a different kind of a version of a climbing wall. And that was just kind of one feature that differentiated the sites from one another. Hoffman: Each of these sites will include a new concrete border and so we’ve seen in the past wood border. Plastic and each of these sites will be a poured curb, concrete poured. Just like all the other new ones that are going in. Stolar: For any of these, and this is based on the e-mails we received Todd, do we foresee any changes in locations for any of the playground equipments from where they currently are? Hoffman: Curry Farms, we’re going to try to slide a little bit to the north of the path to make more room for the sliding hill. This is modified. Sand volleyball’s gone. The trail has been relocated to accommodate some drainage problems. This park has a lot of drainage problems. We moved the ballfield so we can let the swamp go ahead and find it’s way there again but we’ll slide this in this direction to make way for more sliding hill. Right now they run right into the playground. So we’ll try to turn it this way and keep it more in this vicinity. Other than that, the rest of them will remain basically in their same general vicinity. North Lotus is pinned down with the site plan by, here’s North Lotus. The parking lot. The hillside. Hillside and then the access path and so this can actually, can only go this direction in kind of this fashion. This went through about 3 phases of expansion. In the city phase I, existing phase II and phase III the last time around so all of this equipment will come out and that will be the general area that you’ll have the new playground. Chanhassen Hills will remain at about the same location. Lake Susan will be expanded and then Rice Marsh Lake also shows indication of the high water table there so we’ll try to address that with the new installation and have some expansion as well. Stolar: Okay. Any follow-up questions from the audience or additional questions? Resident#1: A couple questions. For North Lotus, is that probably a place where only one of the parks would be allowed because the space isn’t very large? Where it’d probably just be potentially the 6 to 12 age one. 8 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 Hoffman: Yeah, I don’t think we have enough space there for both. We had to find another location in the park. Resident#1: So then is that an example of the 6 to 12 one or is that a 2 to 5…? Hoffman: 6 to 12. Resident#1: Okay. And then does each park have a certain budget per park or is each budget the same or the 5 parks that are being put in. Hoffman: They vary from about $60,000 to $90,000. Resident#1: And so when you said $30,000 for Bandimere and Lake Ann, was the installation only? Hoffman: No. That was just the resilient surfacing. The concrete is very, it’s expensive. The resilient surfacing. The poured in place is expensive. The wood fiber is less expensive. Resident#1: And that’s for the park that’s right on the beach at Lake Ann or the one up on the… Hoffman: …if you haven’t seen it, that’s a nice playground. Resident#2: I have another question on the budget then. If more of the neighborhood does installation, is that an opportunity to do, step up in park features? Hoffman: Bonus money, yes. You have probably $7,000 to $8,000. Something like that, depending on the budget you can earn in additional equipment because those labor costs simply can go away. Stolar: Now Todd are you going to be going back out to the neighborhoods asking them if they wanted a formal group to do that and own the process? Hoffman: Yeah, with the mailing list here we’ll continue the conversation with each neighborhood and see if there’s a design group that wants to work on the playground installation. Stolar: And that will contain some of the information related that we’ve asked here maybe, and that includes some of the questions and answers so that will be. Hoffman: Good follow-up. Resident#2: So then on Curry Farms, kind of the same question on the Lotus Lake. Is that a one age park or is that a two age park? Hoffman: Probably the one, yeah. 9 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 Resident#1: How do you determine if it’s one or two? Just by the size of the park. Hoffman: Yeah, the size of the park. The North Lotus, we really see as more of a community park almost. North Lotus, Roundhouse because of it’s geographic isolation and the large area that it serves, so if we could provide two we probably would. Curry Farms is a more intimate neighborhood park. Little smaller location. So it’s kind of how the park acts in our park system. Lake Susan will have both a community park. You see a lot of picnics, company picnics, family gatherings there. It’s just a very heavily used area so we want to provide both. Typically the neighborhoods pick the older age stuff because it’s a larger span of children there. And they’re more likely, just don’t have the space for both of them. Years ago you could just put both in one container. You can’t do that any longer so that’s the problem. The space. Resident#2: And how long does installation take from, til they tear down and put up, so from start to finish. If you’re paying someone to do that? Scharfenberg: For example last year I think they started what, Meadow Green first. Meadow Green first and that wasn’t completed until late August-September. Something like that. Hoffman: Yeah, the city crews took on all those installations last year. Meadow Green, Lake Ann and Bandimere and probably about a 2 month period inbetween jobs. And there’s some timing that goes along with that. There’s other issues to installation… Many times we’ll get our installations to take place in May. Resident#3: Who pours the concrete? Hoffman: Yeah, when we get involved, who knows. There’s a 3 part approach. The neighbors who provide labor were there with the Bobcats and augers and those type of things because it was quicker and we need to order concrete once they’re on site. We mix it on site and get some labor from the neighbors and then we also have representatives from the different manufacturers that are there providing the assistance…everybody chips in. Resident#2: So like the size of Curry Farms, how many people is kind of a good number to do the tear down and. Hoffman: Yeah, we’ll take it away. The city crews will tear it down and then the set-up would probably be, if you have 20 people there, that’s a good number. Resident#2: And take a day then or is it 2 weekends? Hoffman: Probably a couple of days. Resident#2: Throw a big party. Neighborhood party. Hoffman: That’s what happens. Sometimes they start on a weeknight. They start on a Friday night and get a variety of the poles set up and then they finish it on a Saturday and believe me there’s always clean-up that we can come back and complete but… 10 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 Resident#2: And I’m sure it has to go through inspection before you plan it. Hoffman: Yeah, you’re doing that as you go along and the manufacturer’s rep… Stolar: Those are great questions. Any others? Resident#3: I still had a question about the drainage. The little drainage problem at Curry Farms, and it’s gotten better with the re-routing of the path, but you’re saying the ballfields will move a little bit? Hoffman: It did. Resident#3: It did, okay. And I knew that was part of the issue. And then you don’t project anything else where the sand volleyball used to be… Hoffman: Yeah, the right field is sinking… Resident#4: …because they have conduit underneath the pad. It’s full. Hoffman: Yeah, Curry Farms Park was probably a wetland before it was filled by the developer to turn it over to the city as parks so when we dug up the right field to try to find out what was down there, you could just… If anyone, you were around during that fill operation, we still, it’s probably been filled 2-3 times in right field and so we’ve probably filled that… We give up. It wins. Removed your ballfield…it can turn into cattails. The ducks land there when it’s wet. Curry Farms grows grass, or when it’s dry Curry Farms grows grass like nowhere else. When it’s wet, it grows cattails like nowhere else. Stolar: Any other questions? Actually this has been such a great showing and actually we’d invite you, if you have other questions about park and rec in general, ask us as we do this informal discussion and any other questions about playgrounds but I really appreciate all of you coming up to give us your input and hopefully look forward to you participating in us doing these playgrounds. I know for the commission members, I speak for everyone here, for about 2 years, 3 years Jack, Paula and Tom, we’ve been wanting to get this done and congratulations to our staff for pushing it with the city and then to the City Council who also took this and ran with it and quite honestly give them credit because they are one year ahead of what we had hoped for, and they pushed it earlier by a year so I want to thank the City Council too. And thank you. So unless there are additional questions, I don’t know if the commission wants to just take our break now and meet with everybody. And then we can bring it back. Bring some questions for Todd and Jerry after we adjourn, or re-join. Okay, we’re on a temporary recess. The Park and Recreation Commission took a recess to meet informally with the neighbors regarding the 2005 playground replacement projects. Stolar: I was going to say, if the commission members want to have any additional questions on the playgrounds for Todd? Steve? 11 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 Scharfenberg: Todd, when would you think that the selection process, when, what month or so will we get into that? Hoffman: Probably in March. Scharfenberg: And using the same three manufacturers we’ve talked to last year? Hoffman: Well we have about 5 of them that were reviewed last year. Scharfenberg: Oh that’s right. Hoffman: And then we narrow it down. We’ll see who wants to get involved. We have a lot of ways we can go at this. We’re purchasing 5 new ones and a lot of times, and I’ve even talked to some council members about this. You would think if you packaged all 5 of them you’d get a really good deal, but in these playground design processes, what happens is many times a company will shy away from that because they’ll say I’ve got to work awfully hard to put in a ton of money to make 5 designs for an all or nothing deal. Whereas if they say okay, but if the process is, give me 5 designs and you might get 1. 0, 1, 2, 3, or 5, they say oh that’s not a bad investment. I’ve got a higher chance that I’m going to get at least some return on my investment of time and money. So, and then it runs into, we get into this neighborhood process and they’re talking so it’s going to be an interesting year of how we set this all up and decide to bring in the representatives. We’ll go out to the neighborhoods, you know we’ll bring them all back here for confirmation. If a neighborhood is selecting a playground, I would assume you’re getting supported unless you see something really odd along so. That’s all. Stolar: Paula. Atkins: Yeah I was wondering if you have a good committee of residents, do you need commission members also or is that. Hoffman: We need…if they’re out there working on their behalf, I’ll meet with them at their individual meetings and then we’ll bring their decision back out to the Park Commission. It’s still the city’s dollars so you have to make a confirmation and send it onto City Council. Atkins: Were the 3 that were done this year, done by the same manufacturer? Hoffman: We only selected 2. Midwest Playscapes and. Kelly: Little Tykes. Hoffman: Yep, Little Tykes. Kelly: Sorry. Hoffman: Got it first. Ever since they changed their name from Iron Mountain Forge, I just can’t say Little Tykes. 12 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 Atkins: That’s all. Kelly: Will the manufacturer actually come to the resident meetings and do what, do similar presentations to what they did for us last year? Hoffman: They sure will. Kelly: I’m assuming we’ll be responsible for Lake Susan, since there’s no community. Hoffman: Yep. We did do a mailing just to see if that neighborhood to the south would respond. My inclination is that they would not so. Stolar: Jack, why don’t you go and then I’ll ask my questions because I’m looking something up. Do you have a question? Spizale: Oh no. No. Stolar: So Minnewashta and Carver, we aren’t going to do any selection process so there’s really no need for community involvement but potentially if they want to be a part of the helping install we’d want them to help that. Or you’re just going to take and do that. Hoffman: We’re going to either do it with city crews or have it installed by…landscape structures people. Stolar: Okay, so it’s really only the other 5 that we have to worry about. Lake Susan will be a group from here but we’ll invite if neighborhood people want to sit on with us and the selection. Hoffman: Nobody’s e-mailed me and nobody’s here tonight so it’s just, it’s really e-mails, the phone calls and then this list, that’s how we’re going to start these neighborhood groups up and there’s nobody yet from Lake Susan that I’m aware of. Stolar: Okay, so we’ll be looking for some commission members to do that. Okay. Spizale: Todd, I do have one question. What is the cost when the landscape people do it? What is the average cost? And I know all the set-up’s are a little bit different but what is like an average cost of labor. Hoffman: $6,000 to $10,000. Spizale: How much? Hoffman: $6,000 to $10,000. And that’s the money you can save. Spizale: And if they do the, if they do do that, is that in the, can that be done in the spring or has that been later or how does that? 13 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 Hoffman: They can do it any time, yeah. Spizale: So they’d get it in sooner. Hoffman: If they do a neighborhood install or a manufacturer’s install, yeah. You can get it in. Spizale: Do it in the spring so they get the fall season. Hoffman: Our crews, we just don’t have the time to do it in the spring. We would be late summer or fall. Spizale: I know some other people have asked and that’s pretty much the answer I pretty much gave them. Okay. Hoffman: And that often time, with a combination if you can get it in a couple months earlier in the beginning of the play season, and you can save some cash, that often times spurs them on to get, it looks like Curry Farms is already to go. Stolar: Yeah, I think they’re actually removing the structure. Spizale: I think as soon as the ground thaws, they’re ready. Stolar: Yeah, and you know North Lotus, I was talking with a couple of the people for that too and they think that they can grab a group together so. Just a couple of quick things in the follow- up’s based on this. I think a high level time line might be good for just you know that includes some of this discussion that typically we do it in the late summer or fall. That March we’ll start sending out the RFI’s, just if we could put a. I don’t want to put down like a plan because it’s not that firm but just a guide line with the time lines when we get back to these people so they understand the timing. Just a couple of things I was wondering, as we talk about the age group opportunities and the fact that as I walked around I heard most everyone agreeing with what your judgment is that we would, if we only had one we would tend to go to the 6 to 12 because as the kids grow up they’re going to want to use that and if you limit yourself to the 2 to 5, you know if the neighborhood ages or whatever you lose it. I was wondering if it would be helpful though to understand what parts have different age group combinations so that they at least know where they could go if they wanted to go specifically to one and then also any limits. You said North Lotus Lake was a question. Curry Farms was only one, right. That they would only have one so you know these ones, what would be the likelihood and then second of all, what across the other parks have the different age. Is that, I don’t want to make anything difficult but…because I’d like to see maybe if two parks over or a park over and I can get a 2 to 4 or 2 to 5, then definitely let’s go for the 6 to 12 there because it’s not that far to go for a younger one. Scharfenberg: Is Bandimere really the only one that has a lower age group? Hoffman: Lake Ann beach I believe has 2 to 5 age group equipment. Bandimere. And where else? 14 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 Stolar: Does Lake Susan, Lake Susan’s going to have it. Hoffman: Lake Susan will have it, yeah. Scharfenberg: And then isn’t Power Hills scheduled to get. Hoffman: Second phase. Not necessarily a small, smaller groups. When we go to a second phase, they need to choose again and Power Hill, Sugarbush, Roundhouse, those were designed back when you could put both structures in a container so there’s only one container so you’re going to have to stick with the same age group play equipment. In fact I think Pheasant Hill has both age groups in one container. You just have to have separate structures. Then they said no, that’s not good enough. Now you’ve got to separate them. Put a border over here. Border over here. A separation and then sign the two. We can come up with that information. Stolar: Yeah, I mean it might be helpful to show, although I do think as we heard, 6 to 12 seems to be more logical if you only have one choice. Hoffman: Yeah, and what happens is, you start to use up so much money in border and landscaping and layout that you diminish your return on your investments so dramatically and these 2 through 5, you know they tend to be smaller structures and kids that age have more opportunities in their basement and their back yard. Stolar: Plus they always run to the, at least mine do, run to the 6 to 12 stuff anyway. And then one final thing. ADA swings and that type of requirement, are we going to be incorporating that here at all? Hoffman: Yeah, we’ll take a look at those. Accessibility, you don’t have to have the swing itself. You just have to have accessibility. Having the different bucket type seats is a choice. Stolar: The one thing I found, at least when I was over in Eden Prairie, when we did those you often could just also, because if there was availability, those could be used for smaller kids fairly easily because they have the straps, or at least they did. Then you can then hopefully allow for multiple use. Hoffman: Yep, we’ll explore that. And again if you have lots of space for swings, that one’s got a pretty good swing layout. But even that layout, you would have to take out one of those swings to put in that accessibility. At least one, maybe two and so that’s where you come down to a choice. You used to be able to put 3 swing bays in every swing so you could have 6 swings there and now you can only have 4 and those again are…regulations. We went through a tough period in our playground history when we had to go out to every playground swing bar and take out one of the swings and another swing. People were calling us, you’re taking down our playgrounds. What’s going on? That was all the safety stuff. Stolar: This has been exciting. I’m glad you invited the neighborhood. That just was really nice to happen here. 15 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 Hoffman: It is exciting, yeah. It’s invigorating. I love the process. As a commission, as a community, if we can just put a new playground in a neighborhood and people can wake up the next day with a new playground, but this is much more exciting for the neighborhoods. Stolar: I think so. Hoffman: Brings them together and some park advocacy going on. It’s not a bad thing. Stolar: Any final comments? Hoffman: We were compared to the Minneapolis park system. Stolar: Wow, I know. Except we have a parks director. They’re still looking. Oh they did? Hoffman: Yep. Ruegemer: Yeah, they named John... Stolar: Great, thank you. Alright, next. APPOINTMENT OF 2005 CHAIRPERSON AND VICE CHAIRPERSON. Hoffman: Any nominations from the floor? Kelly: How about adding Kevin? Stolar: All in favor. Spizale: I’d like to recommend Glenn. I think he’s done a great job. I think he’s got it down quite pat and that means I don’t have to do it. I’d like to nominate Glenn. Hoffman: Second? Scharfenberg: I’ll second. Spizale moved, Scharfenberg seconded to appoint Glenn Stolar as Chairman for the Park and Recreation Commission for 2005. All voted in favor, except Stolar who abstained, and the motion carried unanimously. Stolar: My only concern is I’m up for reappointment, just like you went through last year with re-question. I am up for reappointment. That would be the only concern I guess I would bring to the table for all of you. Hoffman: They can work through that. 16 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 Kelly: I’d nominate Jack for Vice Chair. Spizale: I’d do it, yeah. Atkins: I’ll second that. Hoffman: I have a nomination for Jack Spizale for Vice chair and a second from Atkins. Kelly moved, Atkins seconded to appoint Jack Spizale as Vice Chairman for the Park and Recreation Commission for 2005. All voted in favor, except Spizale who abstained, and the motion carried unanimously. Stolar: Well thank you Tom for your services as Vice Chair and you’re going to continue to be the senior member though on the commission. Spizale: Tom, any advice? Kelly: No. Works the same. Hoffman: Same class. What year would that be? Kelly: It’s our fourth year so is that 2000. Spizale: That’s when this was just a one horse town. Stolar: So in order to honor Jack’s new appointment I’m going to be going. Well thank you all and again Tom, thanks. RECREATION PROGRAM REPORTS: 2005 FEBRUARY FESTIVAL. Ruegemer: Thank you Chair Stolar. February Festival. We had briefly talked about it at the thth start of the meeting that’s coming up. Our 12 annual already. That’s coming up February 5 out at Lake Ann Park. Corey’s been busy working on that. I helped distribute the tickets to the ticket outlets a couple weeks ago now for that. Signs are going up. Advertisement is all and about right now. We’re going through and doing some ticket sales at this point but probably a good 60 to 70 percent of our ticket sales are on the ice the day of the contest so it’s, if you’re talking to people out on the community, yes. You can buy tickets the day of the contest so we’ll have hopefully some Key Club or some other volunteers selling the tickets right when you come on the ice that day. If you notice, there was an insert in the Villager, I believe it was last week and there will be another one coming up on the Thursday before, actually that would be this week wouldn’t it. I bet that was 2 weeks ago the insert for that. Boy, time flies, but taking calls on it. Staff has been working on getting all the prize layout stuff together and information put together so it always comes together. We’ve been very lucky with, for the most part pretty good weather on the day of the event. I do have, that’s good for ticket sales. I do have a volunteer sign-up sheet here. I’d like to invite all the commissioners to come out and help in some type of capacity. So I’ll start that out and pass that sheet around. If there’s certain portions of the time 17 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 that you can be there, that would be wonderful. We’d love to have everybody come out and help out with that so. Stolar: Is there any 10 day forecast that you’ve looked at that says what it’s going to be? Ruegemer: I have not looked at any forecast at this point. Hoffman: We just hold our breath. Stolar: The last years have been fantastic. Fantastic. Hoffman: We’ve been lucky. Atkins: The ice is really good though isn’t it? Good and thick. Hoffman: No problem. No problem with that. Ruegemer: Little snowfall helps out the ice thickness so we’re in great shape for ice. Hoffman: The one thing I want to make the commission aware of is Lake Ann has special regulations for both bass and northern. Northern regulations could turn into an issue at some point if somebody catches a really nice fish. If you catch a northern 24 inches to 36 inches you cannot register it. You have to immediately release it back to the water. If you catch one and you bring it up to me, the weigher person, I will measure it. If it’s inbetween those, I will not weigh it. I will release it to the water. It’s likely to make somebody very mad. Stolar: What was the winner last year? Hoffman: It was smaller than 24. Stolar: It was? But the previous year wasn’t. Ruegemer: We’ve had some over that. Hoffman: We’re guaranteed we’re going to catch one of those. Ruegemer: Absolutely. Scharfenberg: Why can’t you? Hoffman: Special DNR regulations. If you catch a bass, it has to be immediately released back to the water. You cannot weigh it. You can’t carry it around. If you catch a northern between 24 and 36, it has to be immediately returned to the water. It’s affected our summer contest as th well, which is now a completely catch and release contest for the 4 of July. We don’t weigh fish… 18 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 Stolar: And you’re going to have big signs and announce it. Hoffman: Somebody’s really going to think they’ve got a winner. Stolar: Any questions about Feb Fest? Okay. SELF-SUPPORTING PROGRAMS: WINTER 3-ON-3 ADULT BASKETBALL. Ruegemer: Just a clearly, kind of some information for the commission tonight. We’ve got our th winter basketball season started January 10 out at the Rec Center. Have the same amount of teams this year as last year with 14, which seems to be kind of our number. I think the highest we were at was about 16 to 18 so we’re holding true with that. I think people have a good experience with that being 3 on 3. It’s kind of a light, kind of a light league. Tom’s played in it before huh? In the POP’s. Kelly: Yep. Ruegemer: Past our Prime. And no referees so it’s kind of a, it’s a nice kind of a very social kind of a league. It’s been a great thing for us. It’s been a good revenue source for us as well so we do have leagues also in the fall, winter and spring with that too so winter’s going on right now. We did split the leagues into two divisions, and then we’ll have a post season tournament. Distribute some t-shirts and some…prize at the end so it will go til about the second week in March and then our spring season will start about the third week, fourth week in March and then go til Memorial weekend probably so it’s been great for us. League for us. We can play all of our games out at the rec center. And it’s nice to have all that space. That dedicated space for our program so that’s been working very good for us. It’s very successful. Stolar: Any questions? Seeing none, then we’ll move on to some administrative items. ADMINISTRATIVE: A. INTRODUCTION OF “MAPLE LEAF” NEWSLETTER. Hoffman: That’s a new piece that the City Council is putting out with the administrative staff at city hall. On the front will always be some type of a community wide topic. This time around it was the new senior center addition, and then on the back or reverse side will always be the fun for all. The Chanhassen Recreation, Park and Recreation Department so we’ll have the whole back page in it’s 9 issues. 8 issues. Because every time there’s a Chanhassen Connection, the full brochure, that month there will not be a Maple Leaf. But it is a very good piece of communication for the city and for our department. Stolar: So does it go out in a mailing to all? Hoffman: It goes out in the Villager and then for those who don’t receive the Villager, it goes out by mail. Stolar: Okay, great. 19 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 Hoffman: Did you get one? Stolar: Yeah. Mine’s already is being read by others. Hoffman: That was one of the council’s goals to have more communication with the residents. This has been a piece… Stolar: Is this also on the web site then? Hoffman: Don’t believe so. Ruegemer: I don’t think this is. We can download a format of the Connection… Stolar: That’s very good. Ruegemer: Did you get the… Stolar: I don’t know that it’s that big of a deal because I think the Connection, you’re going to want to refer to back and look at some things and see what options you had or what did you pick last time but this, not as much but I was just wondering. Hoffman: I wouldn’t be surprised if it would be… But we’re very pleased to be able to have access to that full back page each time. We think people are going to check in and really make some. People calendar on a couple month basis and this is going to be a nice touch point for them. Stolar: And in fact actually, do you ever run out of space putting the list of the major events like you gave in that packet. That’d be nice if you can plan ahead and. Hoffman: That’s our goal. Bring out a calendar on the side. Stolar: Great. Okay. B. 2004 COMMISSION ATTENDANCE RECORD. Stolar: Next is the 2004 commission attendance record, which I think is just informational I believe. Hoffman: Informational. Stolar: Okay. Which for the most part I think this is very good. Hoffman: Looks pretty darn good. 20 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 Stolar: And if you include actually the June no quorum, there were several people that did attend that night. Obviously not a quorum. Atkins: Me and Jack were there. Spizale: We should get something. Stolar: Something for that. Spizale: A star. Hoffman: You were here for nothing. Spizale: And another one was my anniversary. I should get credit for that one. Hoffman: You’re doing great. They’re not going to kick anybody out. Stolar: Thank you for this informational item. Hoffman: You’re welcome. COMMISSION MEMBER COMMITTEE REPORTS. Stolar: I think dog park, some information was included in an e-mail you sent us related to the th February 9 meeting. I do have a question on that. Are we going to, you had mentioned you had looked at some other areas. Is there an intention to just kind of list out here, here are a couple of other ideas. Here’s the pro’s, con’s of that. Or do we want to hear what Carver does? Hoffman: Yeah, well right now Three Rivers is going to build their park. Then we want to kind of hear what Minnewashta Regional’s position is. And we’ll take a look at Lake Ann and I also want to take a look at Lake Susan. Or excuse me, the storm water pond next to Lake Susan for a water training site. That’s really something that people are interested in, and that’s one location would be to the west of the ballfield. So you could have an area there for water training into that pond. You’ve got the archery range on one side so you kind of start accommodating some of these special uses. Dog park continues to be, Three Rivers District did some statistical numbers and some surveys and they’re finding in their system, you have nearly as many dog users as users who have children in their park system and so people are across the country are clearly starting to recognize that pets play an important part, and especially dogs, to people’s lives as they participate in outdoor recreation activities and so this is not going to stop. You’re going to continue to see these special use areas be developed. The other option, it’s not just doing a 10 acre, 5 acre but again nationwide a majority of dog parks are 2 acres or less. Most of them in the urban areas. Some of them are very small, and they are considered a playground for dogs and so you would have a small area off of a parking lot in a park and you would fence it. Put the rubber material in there with irrigation system that washes it down in the evening and you put playground components out for dogs. The owners show up with their pets. The dogs play in the playground with other pets. The owners talk and socialize and everybody goes home, hopefully 21 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 they pick up their…dog owners who come the next day. It continues to be said that these parks are some of the most highly maintained, you know these people keep track of what’s going on once these get these dog parks so if we develop one, I don’t think we can lose anything. It’s a great opportunity. Stolar: It seems to me that we as a commission have pretty much voiced our opinion that we’re in favor of one. If there’s any way we can get even something small going in 2005 I would consider that a huge accomplishment for this year. I mean it doesn’t have to be the be all, end all, nor the only one we have necessarily but something. I think that’s got to be one of our, now that we’ve got this playground situation hopefully settled and moving forward, that’d be like a big thing. Hoffman: Yeah, because Carver Park. Or excuse me, Carver Parks at Minnewashta is not going to be for a while. Three Rivers is going to develop their’s this summer. Stolar: And where are they putting their’s? Hoffman: In just the first park access as you head west into Victoria. You can get into Carver Park many ways but this is the first one off of Highway 5. You take a right and you go down through the neighborhood and then you go to the top of the hill. It’d be a 10 acre dog park up there. Very nice park. They’ve been highly successful in their system and so, that will be much closer than Bloomington or where people are going right now. And what they’re finding is, just like parents take kids from playground to playground, these dog owners are taking their pets from community to community. Stolar: Play dates. Hoffman: Yeah, that’s right. Stolar: People and their dogs. Scharfenberg: Todd, what’s going to happen at this meeting with Carver coming up? Hoffman: I don’t know exactly. I know they’re going to update on their, talk about their comp plan. The people who worked on their comp plan, Brower and Associates is going to come out. I think it’s a public meeting to again continue the conversation. I’m not sure if they’re going to take any specific action that night. Stolar: I have a question for you. When we had the joint committee or joint meeting with the council, one of the council members brought up about this one little park that’s near Minnewashta. Hoffman: Herman Field Park. Stolar: Yeah. That we talked about it wasn’t much use up, and is that an option? Just even making a whole park. 22 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 Hoffman: Well the access is poor. Stolar: Okay, that’s what the issue was. Okay. Hoffman: Yeah, the neighborhood would probably not take very kindly to turning Herman Field, even though it’s an out of the way park into a dog park. When Highway 5 was upgraded they closed the closest access to Herman Field Park and now the whole neighborhood has to go down farther west and then turn back and it’s a, it’s difficult for somebody who kind of knows where Herman Field Park is to find it. Stolar: It’d be impossible for everyone else. Hoffman: You’d be driving around for a half hour and turn around in 6 driveways to find that park. Stolar: Well I still think if we can find something at one of our community parks, that would you know fit some form of dog park in there. Not necessarily one with water. Not necessarily the be all end all but something. That’d be really helpful. Hoffman: I think that’s a much better approach to go. It’s similar to skate parks. What people found when skate parks came up is they said, some communities try to push them back to an out of the way area. Found out that was a mistake. That wasn’t good for the users. It wasn’t good for the equipment wasn’t good for the site. Whereas if you put one right in your main area, so if you put this dog park in your community park, it’s accessible. Visible. It’s going to manage itself much better I think. You don’t want to hide these things away. Stolar: One other question about funding. I don’t own a dog so I don’t know. Is there a dog license fee? Hoffman: Yes. Stolar: So is there a way to tax something onto there? Hoffman: Could. Stolar: To cover some of the maintenance. I’m sure it’s not a huge amount of revenue but something. Hoffman: And it’s gone up almost double I think recently. Well it depends on it’s spayed or neutered. I know mine is not spayed and she was just $10 a license a few days ago so. Some cities are using that. Stolar: Yeah, that’s what I, I think it was in one of the, some article I read. 23 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 Spizale: You know our last park and rec magazine had a neat article on the dog parks. They had some really good information and I wrote some of it down but I wish I would have brought it. Stolar: Yeah, the water fountain one I thought was… Spizale: That was a great idea. Stolar: That was pretty funny. th Hoffman: Ann plans on attending that meeting on the 9 so she’ll be there and I’ll be there and so anyone on the commission as well, come on out. Spizale: I may be. What time was that again? I’ve got it… Hoffman: 7:00 I believe. Stolar: Over at the rec center right? Hoffman: Yep, at the rec center. COMMISSION MEMBER PRESENTATIONS: None. ADMINISTRATIVE PACKET. Stolar: Any questions on the Administrative packet? Spizale: I’ve got one. On this, is it pronounced Yoberry Farm. Hoffman: Yoberry. Spizale: I’ve noticed that there’s a piece of property that would be, looks like northeast of that that square open spot. Are they planning to develop that soon? I see a lot of surveyors out there when I drive by. Hoffman: Which one? Spizale: Well if you’re looking at. Hoffman: Here? Spizale: It seems to be off of Galpin. They seem to be doing a lot of, I’ve seen the survey trucks there and I’ve seen people out in the fields for the last week. So is that a proposed new development back there? Hoffman: Yes, both of those are being proposed. This is the Mancino property and it’s called Pinehurst. That’s the first one that’s being developed. It’s up off of, this is Galpin. Right here. 24 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 The big arborvitae trees are along there. And then Yoberry is one that’s down here. And then this area around in here, and that’s Jerome Carlson’s property and currently that’s being looked at for development and potential sale. Spizale: So I know there was the problem with the park, you know not having a park close enough and the controversy with the neighbors. If that would be a possible solution to put the park in there where they would have some type of a trail or access to that park in that area. Hoffman: Yep, we’re talking with this applicant about a 5 acre, 5 to 7 acre site right on this knoll for a combination park and then water treatment, a utility property. And so that would start to fill in in a circle right over here. Somewhere in this vicinity. Spizale: That’d be a great solution. Hoffman: And then you have this property already that’s on the end of the cul-de-sac…so this is about a 3 to 5 acre park site here. So if you draw that circle, there’s a lot of, you’ve got a couple that start. You know Yoberry ends up to be in an outside conference of three different park service areas. This one’s already been acquired. And this one is a future acquisition. Spizale: So is that something in the next year possibly or two years? Hoffman: Sure. Could be. Depends on if the development goes through. I don’t care who the developer is, we’ve identified this area is drawn for a water treatment plant similar to the one they’re putting down here on Highway 5 in the park site. We did originally we identified two different locations. Two different sites and that’s just too much of a taking for an individual to try to develop 60 acres. 30, 20 of which is wetland, so we said well let’s try to combine these. We’ll do a water treatment in combination with the park and that seems to be palatable for this particular applicant that we’re working with so they’re off drawing plans for that right now. Stolar: That makes more sense too. To combine those uses. So would the trails allow access to any of those? Either of those. Hoffman: Well you’d have both street and trail systems back up through Yoberry and then back down onto this site. Spizale: Interesting. That solves that mystery. Hoffman: Got to have a plan. Stolar: Any other questions? Atkins: Not regarding this. I was wondering about the water treatment plant that was going to go down by us. Is that going in? Hoffman: It’s going to go near the overpass. Highway 5 bridge. So it’s not going in so close to where you are. 25 Park and Rec Commission – January 25, 2005 Stolar: So the tennis court and that whole issue is. Hoffman: It’s all fixed, yeah. Stolar: Did they solve the train issue? Wasn’t that the main. Hoffman: I think so, yeah. The train issue and they put in the piping… They’re going to change the trail configuration to the overpass and it doesn’t make it any better. I’m not sure it can be worst. But it changes it. Stolar: Okay, seeing no other questions I guess the next business is adjournment, Motion for adjournment. Kelly moved, Scharfenberg seconded to adjourn the Park and Recreation Commission meeting. All voted in favor and the motion carried. Submitted by Todd Hoffman Park and Rec Director Prepared by Nann Opheim 26