Loading...
The URL can be used to link to this page
Your browser does not support the video tag.
PC Minutes
Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 Aanenson: Wouldyousaybasedoncommentsthatweregivenat themeeting tonight. Tietz: That’sfine, yeah. Thatwordingwouldbe finetobethat way. Ithink it’sjustvaluable in thissituation. Aanenson: Itwastheaesthetic. That’swhatweunderstand. Tietz: It’san aesthetic issue. It’snot atechnical issuewhereitshould belocated. Aanenson: Yes. Aller: Okaygreat. Sohaving amotionasamended. Undestad: Yes. Aller: Commissioner Undestadacceptstheamendment. What about thesecondCommissioner Yusuf, doyoualsoaccept theamendment? Yusuf: Alsoaccepted. Aller: Sowehave amotionasamended andseconded. Anyfurtherdiscussion? Undestadmoved, Yusufseconded thatthe Chanhassen Board ofAppealsandAdjustments approvesathreefootfence height varianceforasixfoot, sixinch tall, 175foot longfence in theshoreland setbackasshowninAttachment6ofthe staffreport, subject tothe following conditionsandadoptstheFindingsofFactandDecision: 1. Agate, atleast14feet inwidth, isincluded withthefence andplaced sothattheCity will have convenient accesstotheoutfall shouldmaintenance berequired. 2. Theapplicantapplies forand receivesazoningpermit. 3. Theapplicant applies forand receives anencroachmentagreementfrom theCity. 4. Theapplicant submit design detailsfortheproposed fence for staff toreviewthe aestheticsofthefence. Allvoted infavorand themotioncarried unanimously withavoteof6to0. PUBLICHEARING: 9641MEADOWLARK LANE, PLANNINGCASE2016-07: REQUEST FOR SHORELAND AND WETLAND SETBACK VARIANCES FORTHE CONSTRUCTION 25 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 OFASINGLE FAMILY HOMEAND ACCESSORY STRUCTURES ON2.40ACRES OF PROPERTYZONEDRURALRESIDENTIAL DISTRICT (RR). APPLICANT: WAUSAUHOMES. OWNER: DAVID VOGEL. Ingvalson: Okayhere is ourlastitem forthenight. Therewasanotherdocument thatwas submittedactuallyafterthestaff reportwascompleted. I’lltalkabout italittlebitmore inour, inmypresentationbutI’dliketojustnotethateveryone received this. Ifwecouldyoucanalso takeamoment rightnowtolookthroughit. Aller: Yeswehavereceived thedocumentwhich wasdated March15, 2016regarding this matter. Itwillbeattached andreviewedforpurposes ofthishearingandfurtheractionis thnecessarybytheCityCouncilonMarch28. Ingvalson: AlrightsowiththatI’llstartwiththepresentation. Thecasebeforeusisfora shorelandsetback variance from atributary. Here isthe locationofthesubjectproperty. Itis locatednorthofPioneer Trailon MeadowlarkLaneandit isalsosouthofLakeRiley. Here you’relooking overtotherighthandimage. OhI’msorry, shouldhavestartedlooking attheleft handimage. Thisisalso onthefareasternportionofthecity. Thissort ofshaded inareais EdenPrairieforthoseofyoulookingforwhere thisislocated. Lookingovertotheimageonthe right, you canseethere isatributary thatcomes acrosstheproperty andempties intoLake Riley. There isalsoanexistingpathontheproperty. Thisisnotanimprovedpath. It’scurrently justa dirtpaththatgoesontheproperty. Actually getsaccessontheneighbor’sproperty andthen comes infromthewestandcontinues north. Thelotiscurrentlyusedasarecreational lot. There isn’ta primary structureonthe property. Sohere isanimageofthatpaththatIspoke aboutearlier. Thisistaken fromthesouthsideof theproperty lookingnorth. Asyoucansee it’s fairlywoodedonboth sidesandthenthispathisdefinitelynotimproved. It’s definitelymadeof dirt. And therequest theapplicant ismakingtoday isthey’rerequestingavariancefrom the100 footshoreland setbackfromatributarytoconstructasinglefamilyhome, accessory structures anddriveway. Hereisanother location, image of theproperty. Inblueisthetributarylocation. LikeI saiditflows north takingwaterfrom acrosstheproperty. There’sdrainagethat comes across thepropertyandflowsintothetributary. Continues north. DumpsintoLake Rileyasit picks up waterfrom boththesubjectpropertyand thepropertytothewest. To therightisan image ofthattributaryand alittlebitoftheneighboring property. Neighboring structure. Little backgroundabout theproperty. InJanuary, 2016 theproperty ownerapplied forawetland alterationpermitandashoreland setbackvariance foradriveway. Atthis timethe applicantdid nothave any, submit any plans forany structures oraccessorystructures. Itwas onlyforthe driveway. February, 2016thePlanning Commission approved ashoreland setbackvariance for a portionofthedrivewaywithconditions. Theimagetotherightwasadocumentsubmitted. The portionthatwasapproved isthatgreenareaofthisdriveway. Theblackareawasnotapproved asapartofthisvariancerequest. AfterthatCityCouncilapprovedthewetland alteration permit withconditions. JustlastmonthFebruary, 2016 theapplicant appliedforashoreland setback variancefortherestofthedriveway. Sotheblack areaseenhereandthenalsoforasingle familyhomeand accessory structures. Somethings tonoteonthisproperty. Firstwedid, we 26 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 justtakea lookandseewhatis thebuildable areafortheproperty. Somethingtonoteis this property isnot sewered which meansithas different, which givesit differentsetback requirements fromtributaries andfromthelakeshore. Ifthiswasa sewered property itwould havea75footsetbackrequirement. Becauseitisnotsewered ithasa100footsetback requirement fromtributaries andLakeRiley tothenorth. Looking atthis, thewidestportionof thebuildableareais45feet. Or44feetandatthe, closest tothelakeshorewhichis100feet fromLake Rileyitis39 feet. Anotherexercise thatwe completed, that theapplicantactually completed forthisonewastoshow whatthispropertywouldlooklikeifitmetallsetback requirements. Theimageto therightshowswhatwas completed. ThereisaScurve driveway. Sothere’sapretty sharp curve righthereandthenthedriveway would gotoagarage which wouldloadfromthesouth. Thehousewouldbeverylong. Elongatedbeing thelongsidebeing north tosouth. Wouldhavelimited access toviews oftheLake Rileybeingthisisthe shorter portionofthehome andalotofthehome wouldbefacing directly totheneighbor’spropertyand tothe tributarytothewest. Theyalso wouldhavethe primary andalternative septiclocations located closertothetributary asthesepticperbuilding codeisrequiredtobesetback 75feet fromtributaries andfromthelakeshore. While structuresforthisproperty, sinceitisnot sewered arerequiredtohave 100footsetback. The applicantcompletedaproposal forthe property. Thisistheproposal asyouseetotheright. Ithasadriveway thatfollows thesame pathastheexistingdirt path. Itcomes uptothenorth. Ithas aside loadingtothegarageso loading fromthewest. Thesepticasyoucanseehereareoutside ofthedottedlinewhich representsthe100footsetback. Howevertheywillbemeeting the75footsetback fromthe tributary. Thehome isoriented withthelongsidetoLake Rileytotakeadvantageoftheviews whichalotofproperties dointhisareaandtherealsowillbeadeckwith concretepatiodirectly underneath it. Soalarge portionofthehome isoutside ofthe, whatwouldbethebuildable envelopeduetoitbeingthe, sonarrow innature. There’salsoanexisting shedonthenorthwest corneroftheproperty. Thatisbycitycode theyareallowed tohave onewateroriented structure whichthisstructuremeets. Iftheyweretohaveanyadditional structuresthisonewouldneed to beremoved astheyareonlypermitted onewater oriented structure. Alittlebitofcharacter about theneighborhood. Thestructure reallyintheproposal asdone bytheapplicant reallyis fairly consistent withtherestoftheneighborhood. Lookingheretheredisthesubject site. Alot ofthese properties areoriented facing towardsthelake. Alotofthem haveverylongdriveways. Large frontyard setbackswhichissimilar totheproposalby theapplicant. Thesize ofthe, we alsolookedatthesizeof, thefootprint ofthe proposedstructure. Houseandgarageand itisjust under 3,000squarefeet. Fairly consistent withtherestoftheneighborhood. Alittlebiteven maybe onthesmallside. 2,500isthesmallestoneintheareawiththelargestbeingover6,000 squarefeet forafootprint. Also thesetbacksfrom thelake istoday 100feet. Some ofthese are lessthan100feetwhich I believe theassumption thatthesewerepre-dated ordinance. Oneof thestructuresalso, thedirect neighbor iswithin100feetofthetributary whichIwilltalkabout laterinthereport. Sowhen stafflookedover thistherewas afewquestionsthatcame up specifically abouttheplanthat wassubmitted. Someofthesequestions, firstofall relatedwith thedriveway andthelocationofthedriveway andthingsthatcanbedone toreducethesetback fromthetributary. Oneofthem wasrotatingorrelocating theprimary andsecondary septic systems. Rotatingthegarage somaybetherewasn’tsuchaneed forawideturn. Loadingthe 27 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 garagefromthesouthandalteringthedriveway withoutmovingtheseptic systems. Also looked atthe structureto seehowthatcould bereduced. Moving thehouseto theeastwasoneof those things andwherethehousecanbe locatedwassomething staffbroughtup aspotential waysto reducethevariancerequest. Then alsonarrowing thedriveway. Theapplicanthasproposed a 12foot widedrivewaywhichwasapproved with theprevious drivewayforthe entrancewhich is whattheCityrequire wouldbea10footwidedriveway. But12footwidewouldbekeeping consistent withwhatwas approvedwiththeprevious varianceandwiththe previous variance. Sothe staff afterreceiving allthis informationandlookingoveritwesent allofitto the applicanttolet themknowaheadoftimewhatwewere, whattheissueswere. Aftersending thosetherewasno changesmadebythe applicant. Theybelieve inthe planthatthey submitted. Keptwith thatplan. Afterthat stafftookituponourselves tomake acouplealterationstoshow somedifferent optionsforthisproposed variance. Firstonethatyouseehereiswhatwaswithin thestaffreport. This oneshowsmoving thehouse totheeast sokeepingthesame footprintbut justshiftingittothe east. And thenalsorotating thegarage soit’dbe loading from thesouth. Hereanother change thatwouldbe, thedriveway insteadofcontinuingupandloading tothe garage thiswayitwouldbeloading fromthesouth. Another alternativewehadwasthen creatinga sidewalk soyou’dhaveaccess tothehousefromoutsideandalsomoving theseptic systems south. Duetoweatherconditionsstaff wasnotabletolookatthesepticsitelocations duetoweather conditions. Frozenground. When springconditions occurredalittlebitearlier thisyearwewereabletogooutandlook atthem thislastweek. Upon lookingatthemourstaff foundthat thesite could notaccommodate sitesfurther souththan wheretheyareproposed on thisimageandoriginally proposedbytheapplicant. Thattookawaythe optiontohavethesetwo green septicsitesandalso thisdriveway rotatingoverthetopofthisprimary septiclocation. Afterthatstaffcameupwithnewalternativesforyou. Thosewerethealternativesthatwere providedinthe memothatwasleftin frontofyou. There’sreally 4optionsthatwe’ll havethat I’mgoingtotalkaboutjustnow. Thefirst onewasanoptiontohavethestructure locatedsouth oftheprimaryseptic sohere arethetwoseptics in theoriginal location. This is justthebottom ofthegarage sohavingthehousebelocated awayfromthelake whichwouldreducethelong driveway, reducingthesetback andreducingthevariancethatwouldberequired. Lookingat thistherearetwoprimary issueswiththis. Numberone, there’sa20footsetbackfromseptic locationssothere’dbea20footsetbackfromtheseptic siteandthenalsoa50footsetback from thewetland. Thatleft adistance from northto southof about86feet. However thestructurethat wassubmitted by theapplicantiscloserto96feet inlength approximatelysoitwouldnotfit in thatarea. Toaccommodate thissort ofplan theapplicantwould eitherneedtoalterthestructure andeitherreducing thedeck orthegarageoraltering itinsome way. Orwould needtomovethe septic sitesfurther tothe northwhich maybe possiblebuthave notbeen inspected bycitystaff aswejustwereabletoinspectthesetwolocations. So those wouldbe thetwooptions for Option1. Soasitiswouldnotbeabletoapprovethebuildingplan thatwassubmittedwiththis one. Howeverstaffdoesbelieve thiswouldbethesmallest variance. Wouldminimize ittothe greatestextent possible. However there arenegatives thatgo along withthatspecifically losing theviews ofthe lake asyou’dbemuchfarther awayfromthelakeshorethan whatitwas proposed bytheapplicant. Option2isalotlessofavariationfromwhat wassubmittedbythe applicant. Theseptic siteswouldstayinthesamelocationand thenalsothedriveway would 28 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 stayinthesame locationasproposed bytheapplicant andalso thegarage wouldbein thesame location. Theonlychangewithoption 2would bemoving thebuilding overtotheeastsothe eastwallofthehousewouldlineupwiththeeastwallofthegarage. Thismove isabout 9feet fromthislocation tothislocation onhere. There wereafewconcerns thatwerestated bythe applicantspecifically with windowsontheproperty. Thereare2windows thatwouldbe covered ifyou movethe garage. Thebottomone completely coveredand thenthetop onewould bepartially coveredatleastbecause theroofpitchesupwhere thewindow wouldbe. The bottom room isasIbelieveitwaseither anofficeoradenareawhichdoesnotrequire anegress window asIspoke withourbuildingdepartment. Theupperwindowhowever isfora bedroom whichbybuilding coderequiresan egresswindow. The image totheleftshows thatthe window, theXistheapproximatelocationofthewindow thatwillbelost. Alsoagaragedoor outthe backofthegaragewould belost alsoifthehouse wasmoved over tothe east. However therewillbeanopportunity toputanegress windowoutofthesidelocation ortherearealso otherarchitectural designs thatcanbechangedinthehouse toaccommodate anegress window. Howthat’sdone staffdoesnotreallyhaveanycommentson. Justthatthereareopportunities thatcouldbecompleted. Option 3would betheoption thatwassubmitted bytheapplicantso this isit againzoomedupcloser. This isexactly howitlooks as theyweresubmitted. Thereis thisjogfromthegarage andhere’sthesepticlocations butthiswouldbeourthirdoptionthatwe havetonight andthefinal option, option 4whichIdon’t haveaslidefor wouldbedenial ofthe application andcompletion whichis thelastoption you’dhave. There wasa coupleconcerns in thenarrative, ornot concerns. Acouplecomments regarding otherproperties thataresort of similar innature thattheapplicant saw. I’dliketoaddressacouple ofthoserightnow. Thefirst onewasthevariancewejusthadhereat9001Lake RileyBoulevard stating thesetback fromthe housetotheshoreland. Theirsetbackisless than100 feet. Howeveritisallowed to havea setbacklessthan100feet. Itisa75footsetbackbecause itisasewered property. Ithascity sewersoitisincompliance withcitycode. 9441Great PlainsBoulevard wasanother property. There’satributary thatgoesacrossthisproperty andtheproperty adjacentandthenempties into LakeRiley. This propertyisalsoisvery closeto atributary. Definitelywithin100feetwithin probably 70feetandthispropertyhowever wasbuiltin1960. Thestructurewasbuiltandatthat timetherewasnoordinance restricting howclose itwasforthetributary asIwasinformed by ourWaterResources Coordinator. Andthenanotherpropertywe hadwas9611Meadowlark Lanewhichisthepropertydirectly adjacenttothesubject siteandthatproperty iswithin 100 feetofthetributaryontheadjacent property. That wasbylooking through ourbuildingfilesfor thatproperty thatwasapproved byanerrorbystaff. Theassumption bylookingatitwasthat the, whenthey sentintheir applicationonthesurveyitdidnotshowthatstructure onthe adjacent propertysoitwasprobablynotnoticedandthenwasapproved where, inthelocation thatthecurrent structureisin. Thelastonewasaproperty thattheapplicantbroughtup, 9536 LakelandTerrace. Thisproperty isinEdenPrairie andstaff does nothaveanycomments regardingthatproperty. Soaftergoing throughallthisstaff notedthatthe firstoption1thatI showed youthatwould bethemostminimalvariance. However withwhatwehave forwhere thestructureislocated, howit’soriented andeverything withtheapplicant whattheysubmitted forthestructurewouldn’tfitforoption1. Howeverthatwouldbetheminimal varianceallowed. Themotionthatstaffhasputforward, therecommended motion would bethatoption2would be 29 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 theoptiontogowithsotheChanhassen Board ofAppeals andAdjustments approves avariance fromthe100 footshorelandsetback fromatributarytoconstruction asinglefamily home, accessory structures anddriveway asshowninAttachment 2inthememorandum dated March 15, 2015whichshouldbe2016. Subjecttotheconditions ofapproval andadoptstheFindings of FactandDecision. Therearealsomultipleconditions thatwentwiththisreport. Something you canseetheminthestaffreport, specificallysome frombuildingandplanning conditions. Also WaterResources Coordinatoradded multipleconditionstoprotect theshoreland andthenalso ourforestry specialistadded conditions andour firemarshal. Atthis pointI’mopen forany questionsthatyoumight have regardingthevarianceapplication. Aller: Thank youDrew. It’sa lottotakeinwhenyouhave somanychoices. Ingvalson: Yes. Yes, there aremultiple. Aller: Anyquestions ofstaffatthispoint? Madsen: Ihave aquestion. Aller: Commissioner Madsen. Madsen: Are therespecific measurements ofthe sizeofanegresswindow andbyproposing to move the windowto thisnewspot isthereenough spaceforthe sizethatmight berequired? Ingvalson: Yes. Therearespecificsizerequirements. However theydogiveflexibility onwhat thesizewouldbe. Idon’thavethosenumbersin frontofme. Ididbring thisto ourbuilding department. Theysaidthere’sa lotof flexibility. Thereareminimumrequirements. I knowit needs tobe24, Ibelieve24incheswide. Gotoourbuilding department totalkmore aboutthat buttheyarevery flexible. Thereareminimumsbuttheycanvary fromhowtalltheyare. How widetheyarebuttheywould beableto beaccommodated onthatlocation. Madsen: Okaythankyou. Tietz: Mr. Chairman. Aller: Commissioner Tietz. Tietz: Drewitlookslikeitwouldtakesomepretty dramaticdesign direction changes onthecity staff’spartanditlooks likethefunctionality oftheproposed planwould beaffected significantly andI’mnotsurethatthe9feetofmoving ittotheeastproperty lineisgoing tobenefitthe neighbor. Whatreally wentintoyour thinking? Isit alljusttrying to squeezedown into conformitywithminimizing theimpactonthesetbacks? 30 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 Ingvalson: Absolutely ourcharge is towhenwearebringing avarianceforwardisto havethe minimum variancerequired tohave a reasonable useofthepropertyso. Tietz: Butyetwehaven’ttakenintoconsideration, we’renotarchitects. Thisisapretty dramatic proposal. Ingvalson: Absolutely and likeIsaidweare, I’mnotanarchitect asyou know. WhatIam chargedwithisto minimize thatvariance. Welooked atwhatthatwouldbetokeeping within citycode. Citycode states theclosestitcould befrom thatproperty linetotheeast is10feetsoI stayed withinourcitycode. Aanenson: I’djustliketopoint outoneotherthing. Ithinkfromthebeginning there’sbeen one planandthatplan’sin forbuilding permitreview. There’sneverbeen anydrawingsfromthe applicant which wewouldhavepreferred ratherthanhavingstaff trytodrawsomething togive yousomealternatives but thatplanhasnever variedfromtheapplicant so wejusttried togive yousomeotheroptionsofwhat… Tietz: Iunderstand. Aanenson: Yep. Aller: Andthis property that’s beingrequested, theactualphysical homeis notthe smallest in thearea. Ingvalson: NothesmallestonewasIbelieveslightly over2,500squarefeetand thatisonly showingthefootprint ofthehome. Thesearenotlivable space. Thesearejustthefootprints of thehome usingaerial image andapproximately… Hokkanen: Ihaveaquestion. Soifwewentwithoption3whichtheapplicant submitted, that’s the100, howmuch ofa variance isthatone? I’m confused. Ingvalson: Sureabsolutely. Hokkanen: Sorry. Ingvalson: Thesetback for thedriveway reallyvaries. Wedidn’tputasolidnumber forthat. Wedidsay theclosestlocation for thedrivewayifI’mnotmistaken I believe itwas32 feetisthe closestoryep, thisisnottheoptionbuttheclosestthatthedrivewaywould beis32feet. It meandersasdoes thetributary so thedistance varies. It’s 45feet atthislocation. Howeverthe home is70feetfromthetributaryatit’sclosest location. Theoption2whichwouldpush itto theeastwouldmakeita79footsetbackwhichwouldbehypothetically ifthis wasasewered propertywouldmeetthatrequirement because it’s75feet. Asitisrightnowwiththeoption3 which wassubmittedbytheapplicant isa70footsetbackfromthetributary. 31 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 Tietz: Itappearsthatthedeck could beshiftedtotheeastsomewhat toeliminate some ofthat non-compliance oftheedgeofthehardsurfaces. Isthatsomethingthatwasdiscussed withthe applicant? Ingvalson: Thereare multipledifferentways thatthisvariance could beminimized. Tietz: Okay. Ingvalson: Wedidn’t wanttocomehere with20different variations. That’sasyousaidbefore I’mnotanarchitect sothat’snotwithinmyrealmofevenclose tounderstanding inwhatIdobut wedidwanttocomeherewithacoupledifferentoptions thatwewouldalloworbeopen toany differentsortofdiscussions we’dhavewithhowthiscouldbeminimized. Aller: Theconditions thatwereplaced onitbyMr. Jefferyor byourbuilding thosewouldapply toeachandevery oneofthese across theboard? Ingvalson: Correct. Correct. Aller: Anyadditional questionsofstaff? Hokkanen: Dowehave adequate information fromtheapplicant orarewemissingsomething? Ingvalson: For theiroptionwhichtheyhaverequested wehaveadequate information. They have provided everything foroneoption. Hokkanen: Forthatone option. Ingvalson: Everythingelsewas justtohaveadiscussionhereofwhat wouldbepossible to minimizethisvariance. We’venevergivenanyother alternatives andwehaven’t, sincewe haven’tbeen givenany ofthosewecan’tfullyviewalotoftheotherlocations. Aanenson: Iwould justadd toowhat’sdifferentnowthanwhen thepacketwentout iswewere abletodetermine where thesepticsitescouldbe because that’sreallythedriver sowithinthat, onceweknowwhere thesepticwasacceptable andwhere itcouldandcouldn’tbemoved. Couldit potentiallymove tothenorth? Thathas majorimpactsforthevisibility oftheloton the lake so thenatthatpoint westillsaid wellisthere anotherway tominimize andthat’swhere Drewspent sometimetrying toseeifthere’s, canwegetmore conformance adherestothecity codeorless variancerequest. Yeah. Tietz: Mr. Chairman? Aller: YesCommissioner Tietz. 32 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 Tietz: Onemore question for Drew. Wedon’thave, obviously wedon’thaveagradingplanfor theentrydrive butwould weconsider trying tosheetdrain thattotheeastsothatitdoesn’tfall offtheslopetothetributary? Maybe Imissed that inthecomments fromthewater folksand thendrainitdowntowardsthat, I’llcallitaholdingpondbutit’sawetlandrightadjacent to Meadowlark. Isthat, Imeanobviously that’s, Ihaveagreater, wellavery, aconcernforwhat drainsintothetributarybecauseit eventually getsintothelake. Isthere a detailed, probably that’s thenext stepfromtheapplicant. Aanenson: There issomething inthere. Agradingplanfor thatbutIthink thatcertainly canbe acondition. Tietz: BecauseIthinkyou could, youcould drainthatand without acurbtosheetdrainittothe eastsidesothatitalways runs offasopposedtodown. Ingvalson: Sothegradingplan thattheyhavesubmitted is…numbers onitbutisofthe longer sheets. 11 by17. Itisonthe backsideofthatfirst sheet. Tietz: Ohsorry. Ididn’tnotice that. Iapologize. So itappears to, youknowitlookslike it couldtake themajorityto theeastbutit alsoisdumpingsometothetributary. Aanenson: Sothatcouldbemodified. Tietz: WellI think it’sjustthewayyouinstallthedriveway. Okaysorry, thanks. Aller: Based onthosequestionsanyadditional? Alright we’llhear fromtheapplicant, if they’d liketocome forward. State your nameandaddress fortherecord pleasesirandletusknow aboutyourproperty. DanHanson: Hi. Myname isDanHanson. I’mwithWausauHomes. I’mthecustom builder forthisprojectworkingwiththeVogel family. I’dliketostart offbythanking thePlanning Commissionand theplanningstaff for alltheworkthey’vedone. It’s beenalong road. We’ve beengoing throughalotofrevisions. Lotofinformation passed backandforthtotrytogettoa viableanswer, solution. Iwantedtostart byjust sayingthat thisisabit ofachallengingpieceof land. This waspartofa subdivisionthat wassetupin1988 anditisa, was abuildablelot back then. A lothaschanged sincethensoaswestarted lookingatithadnoideathatweweredealing withthismuch restrictionifyou will. When we didourmath onitthis lothasabout 5 percent thatis notrestricted whenyoutakeinallthe variances soandit meansit’snotbuildable aswell because wecan’tgettothelandthatisbuildable. Soitdidsetoffkindofthestageofcomingto youforavariancetogetfirstofallontothelandwhichwedidandwethankyouforthat. Atthis pointwehavegone through allthedifferent scenarios. Ijustwanted toaddresseachofthem ifI could. Ifwecanlookatthe, kindofoneatatime. First. Wedidspend afairamountoftime withourengineers forthe septicsystemtodetermineplacementbecause of howtrickyitwason 33 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 thelot. Wherethehouseisandwhere thesepticsystemisonourproposalisthehighpointof thatlotsothatdrivesalotofthat withregards tothequalityofthesoilforboththefoundationof thehomeandthedrainagesystemfortheseptic. Soaswelookedatthedifferent options we keptcoming back tothatknowing thatwe hadvery littlemovementas faras, asthose septic drainfieldswent. We actuallystartedwhenwefirsthadameeting3monthsagotrying to understand therestrictionsonthelandthatweweredealing witha75footsetback. Weactually designedthehome aroundthatandthesepticsystemsweredesignedaroundthataswell. We quicklyfoundthatthatwas100setback andthatweweredealing with100footsetback fromthe tributaryas well. Originallywe werethinkingitwas a75footsetback andalotofthat evolved overquite abitoftime withdiscussions andmeetings andthings likethatsoyouknow the comment about usnotcomingtothetablewithsomechangestothehomeplan, wefeltthatwe have. Notonlydidwecompletely rotatethehousefromtheoriginalplan. Itwasactuallythe garage ontheleftwhichputthegarage morealmost100percent ifnot100percent withinthe 100footsetback. That wasourfirstchange thatwemadetotheplan. Sincethattimewehaven’t reallychanged thelayout ofthestructureitselfjustbecause therewereso manyrestrictionsthat weweredealingwithandtheydidn’tcometousallatonce. Itwasastepbystepthing. Each timewelookedatthem weaddressed them. Weweresentinformation thatwehadtorespondto inwriting withregards todifferent restrictions andweweretryingtokindof wrestle allthose issues atonce. Alotofithadtodotostartwiththedrivewayandthedriveway location. Wefelt allalong thatthatdrivewayshouldbe placedright ontopofthat existingdirtroad ifyouwill and alotofthat wasdrivenbythefactthat wedidn’thavetodisturbanyotherpartofthelot. We couldstillgetalltheotherthingsonthelotinthelocationthatweneeded them sothatkindof setthestage forthatanditseemslike aswe’veevolvedsome oftheinitialideasand thoughts about roadplace, drivewayplacement, houseplacementhavesupportedthatpositionjust because ofthesepticsystems. Weknewallalongthatitwasgoing tobetrickytomove them. Infactbycoming from75 feetto 100feetfromthatlakeshorewiththehouse itpushedthe septics totheverymaxofwhereourengineer would accept themtobeplaced sothatwas another change aswelland again maybe we didn’tcometo thetablewithideas onhowtorebuild thathouseorredesignthathouse but therealitywas isitwas acompletepackage forus. How wewerelookingatittogetallthose moving pieces andpartsinthere andforustostartdoinga majorredesign on thehousedidn’tseemlogicalbecause wehadn’teven workedoutwhere’sthe housegoingtogo. Where’sthedrivewaygoing togo? Wherearethesepticsystems cangoand obviously wedidn’twanttochange thehouse. Wedesigneditfor thefamily. Theywanted a mainfloormasterbedroom. Thatwasabigthingbecausetheywanttolive inthehouse fortheir entire life. Theywanttoretireinthehouseand theywanttobeonthemainlevelsowechose nottogowitharamblerwhichwouldhavebeenabiggerfootprint. Wearetwostorywhichisa smallerfootprint. Ithink somebody alluded tothequestionofhowbig thisfootprintis. Well thisfootprint, allhardsurfaces allinis9.6percent ofthatlot. Weareallowed togoupto20 percentsowearelessthanhalfthanwhatwe’reallowed todo. Weunderstandweneed ittobe smallerbecause ofalltherestrictions butIthink we’vedone agood jobofselectingthe right planthatfits thelotwithallthe pieces thatwe hadto dealwith. Asfarastheother issueswith regards tothedifferentplans. IfIcouldhaveyoupullupkindofeachoption. I’djustliketo makeacoupleof quicknotes. ThefirstoptionIthinkwe’vealltalkedalittlebitaboutit. 34 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 Maybe theleastdisruptive ifyouwilltoatleasttheonethatdoesn’timpede ontherestrictionsas much. Ihaven’tseenthisoneuntilthisweek sowe hadnochancetoreallylookintoitbutIcan tellyouthey’vegotissueswiththatsepticsystemgoing downfartherawayclosertothat wetland. Closer tothefront. I’mgoing tohavethesame issueswiththesoil qualityfor a foundation setting onitsoIdon’tthinkthat’saviable option. Wehopethatwecankindof dismissthat oneandmove ontosomeothers. Number 2. Aller: Ifjustaquickquestion. Ifyouweretodothatwhatwould berequiredtoengineer it properly? DanHanson: To actuallydo that? Aller: Yeah. Notholdingyoutoanyplans. DanHanson: Wellnotknowing becausewedidsoilbores butitwasuphigh fortheseptics. We haven’tdoneanything therebecausewe typicallywouldn’tunlesswewerelookingintoit becausethat’sexpensive andit’stimeconsuming. Aller: Sure. DanHanson: Butitdepends onwhatwefind. Ifit’slowlaying ground andif it’sgot waterinit, itmightnotevenbeanoptionatall. Ifit’sjustbadsoilthat’snotcompacted properly thenit wouldberemovable andthere’smany optionsyoucangoto butthey’reallprettyexpensive. Anddependingonhowbadthatsoilisyoucouldbediggingdown, I’vegotaprojectI’m working now, they’regoing down16feet andremovingall thesoilandhaving tocomeback into good soil. Thatproject wasahousesmaller thanthisanditwas $80,000worth ofdirtwork soit wouldbeamajor thing. Aanenson: Ijustwanttoclarify again. Wekindofruleditouttoobecause itdoesn’tmeetthe setbacks fromthewetland. Iagreewith youthere’sprobablymarginalsoils there. We didn’t haveallthatinformation whenthispacketwentout sowetoowouldprobably say thisprobably islessthandesirable. Aller: Sure, thankyou. DanHanson: Thissecond option, asstaff hadstatedthisoneisprettyclose towhatwe’vebeen talking aboutfromthevery beginning andwewerepleasedthatwecametoIwouldsaysimilar conclusions ona lotoftheitemsweweredealingwith. Septicsystemplacement. Thedriveway location. Allthat. Thesetback fromthelake hasnotbeenanissue. Weagreed tothatfromday oneandwe’vegotthesetbackfrom theproperty linesotherealissue here, wewereaskedto commentonthisseveral weeksagohastodowiththeplacementofthehouseinrelationtothe garage andreallyourplan, theonlydifference isthat we’retakingthehouse andsliding itout9 feetfromthegaragesothere’sasetback. Thehouseisfurtherawayfromthepropertylinethan 35 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 thegarage. Indoing sothere’s3thingsthatchange asyou’veheard alittlebitabout. Welosta servicedoor thatwould allow youtogooutthebackofthe garagedownto thelakeforservicing. Andthentheotherpiecewas, aswediscussed thewindows thatwegettakenawayandIhaven’t hadachance toseetherealimpact tothatasfarastheegress windowandwetalked about there areoptions buttherearealsoveryrestrictive languagearoundthesizeofthatwindow. The heightofthatwindow offthefloorandtheoperation ofthatwindow. Obviouslyithasto functionacertain waysoIhavenothadanopportunity toevenlookathowwewould redesign todothatbutI’msurethere would besomeissues justbecause nowwe’vegotabedroom witha teenylittle2footwindowandit’snotgoing tobedesirable andthere’sgoingtobenowindows inthat officeonthe lowerlevel. Orthemain levelsoI guessmyquestionwouldbewhatis the 9feetrepresent? Imeanwhat istheimportance? We’reinavariance situation regardlesswith theirplanortheplanthatthestaff hadrecommended orour’s. Eitheroneisavarianceforthe houseplacement. Theroadplacementisalsosowe’retrying tounderstand whyweshouldhave togiveupsome really cooldesignthings andfunctionality things for thehousewhenwehave nothadanydiscussion around what’stherealreason fordoingit. Certainlywe’retryingtoget closertomeeting setbackbutwe’re alreadyinavariance aswell andreally whenyou talkabout wetlands everything I’veread onthecodeandrequirement forwetland protection hastodowith theentirepieceoflandthat’s beingimpactedandall ofthewetlandthat’son thatandhow the hardsurfaceinteracts, it effectsthatwetland. We’renotactuallyinthewetland. We’reinthe bufferforthewetland sowe’renotevenimpacting thewetlandssoIheard afewcomments aboutwater andhowwater would moveontheproperty. Wethinkthatwe’vegotanicebalance tothatasfarasplacement withregards toseparation ofthestructureand thehard surface with theundisturbed piecesof thelotand thetributary forrunoff. We areworking withthewatershed districttogothrough someofthesameissuesandtheyhavetheirownsetofrulesand restrictions. Bufferzonesareabig partofwhattheydowhich meansalloftheareas within, whattheywouldcallthewetland bufferswillbeunusable forthehomeownerwhich means everythingtotheleftof thatdrivewaywill beunusable. Untouchable. Theycan’ttouch it. Manicure it. Mowit. Anything andthere’llbe signsallalong that drivewaythatstate thatso thatif heeversells somebody else can’tcomeinandstart mowingthereandthings likethat so thosesignswill beupand downthatdriveway. They’llcirclethatentirewetlandin thefrontof theproperty including theditchareathatwe’regoing oversothere’salotofareaonthispieceof landforhandling thewater runoff fromthis. The engineers thatwehiredtodothe surveys and ththyousawacopyofthatsurvey. It’svery detailed. Thatisprobablythe 8 or9 generation of thatsurveythatwe’vehadtogobackwithchanges, additions andthatcamefromsomeofthe stuffthatwashappening herewiththestaff butalsowiththewater districtandalsowiththe movement ofthehome andthings likethat. Wehad adiscussionwith ourengineer. They spoke withtheBarrEngineerperson fromthedistrictthatishiredforthem bythem andtheyhada discussionaboutretention pond. Itwasone ofthose thingsthat wewererighton theborderthat theywerelookingat thinkingabout andtheythoughtthatwedidareally nicejobofhow we placedthehardsurfacematerialonthelottoallowthelottohandleandthewetlandstohandle thewater comingoffthehardsurfacesonotonlydidweIthinkbecause ofhowwedesigned things Ithink minimizethedamage or ifyouwilltheeffect onthewetlands. Weactually keptit sothat wedidn’thaveto havearetention pondwhich inmymind isfurther kindofchangesfrom 36 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 thenaturalhabitatandthewetlands. Idon’tthinkthatwithwhatwe’redealing withthesizeof thislottheideathatwehadatributarytohelpwiththerunoff. Wehavewetlandsallover. It shouldn’thavebeennecessary foraretentionpond. We’regladtohearthatitwasn’ta requirement. Anyquestions fromthecouncil? Aller: Commissioner Tietz. Tietz: Ihaveone. Just respondingtoDrew’spresentation ofoption2, did youexplore separating the3cargarage fromthehouseandeither havingitfreestanding andkindoflookat option2orcreate abreezewayconnection between thehouse andthegarage thusnotimpacting thewindows. SonowI’mplaying designerokay. IjustsaidDrewshouldn’tdothatbutnowI’m doing itbecause I, there’sappears tobemaybe somemiddleground. Didyouexplore those2 options? DanHanson: Wellthetrickistheamountofroom wehavetoworkwithupthereonthathigh ground. Wecan’tmovethe septicsystem. WedecidedthatsohowdoIget thatgarageyou know manipulated? Tietz: Well I’mjustsayingslidethe garage south andcreate thegapbetweenandwith either a breezeway. NowIshouldnotbesayingthisorcommenting butwhentheoptionispresentedand Itrustthatyouthoroughly exploredthatasanoption andthenhowcould youmakesomething similar tooption 2workforthe owners withoutdisrupting thedesign characterthatyour companyhas prepared. DanHanson: Wedidtoacertaindegree. Wedidn’tgototheeffectivedrawingsandthingslike thatbutwedidtalk interms ofwhatwould thatdoandcould itevenbedone. Tobehonest we didn’tknowwhere thisprocess wasgoing togo. Weweredealingtobehonestwithyouwith someoftheprevious, thepreviousoptions andtheyweresodrastic fromourplanthatwespenta lotof timejustaddressing the issuesrelated tothosebecausewithout theseptics where theywere without theroad. Wheretheywere inourmindsweweredead inthewatersoforustogoinand startcomingupwith10to 15options onhowto redesign thehouse to meettherestriction we spent moretimetrying tounderstanditandcomeupwithourrationale, ourargument forkeeping theplanthe wayitwas. Couldwe redesign it? Probablybut Icantellyouit’svery difficult where thatgarageistopullitawayfromthehousebecause it’sgoing toimpedeontheseptic system location andthatcan’tmove. Tietz: Wellfromwhere thegreen splotchesareitdoesn’tappear thatthatwouldhaveanimpact so. DanHanson: What’sthat? Tietz: Where thegreen patchesareindicateddoesn’tlookasthoughthatwould beanissueto pullit, pullit 10feetoffofthehouse. 37 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 DanHanson: It’spossible. I’vegottohaveseptictanks. There arejustthedrainfieldssoI’ve gottohavetanks. Thetanks can’tbecovered bythegarage. Itdoesn’tlooklikewe… Aller: Can’t wereducethesizeofthegarage toa2cargarage? DanHanson: Pardonme? Aller: Can’twechange ittoa2cargarage? Orreducethefootprint ofthehouse. DanHanson: WellIwouldsaynojustbecause youknowyou’vegotanacreage property. You’vegotahomethat’sa3stall. Youknow3plus thatnewhome. We’vegotnoplaceforany sortofastoragefacility. Youhavenoplacetoputaboat. Thethingsthattheyneedforthelake sothatthirdstall becomes extremely important. Aller: Okay. Additional questions? Commissioner Undestad. Undestad: When youwentthrough withBarrEngineeringandthewatershedandthewetland andstuffwerethereanyconcernsorcomments fromanybodyinthereabout your footprint design andthelocationwithinthetributary wetland? DanHanson: Fromtheneighbors? Undestad: No. Whenyou wentthroughwithBarr Engineering. DanHanson: Ohyouknowwe’restillworkingthroughthatwiththem. Wehavejustnowgot thethumbs upthatwe’ve goteverythingtothem tomeettheirnextmeeting. Ifwecangetinto thatmeetingwhich wewereworkingveryhard todobecause thetimingofeverything. We weren’tgetting what theyneeded. Thecomplexity oftheinformation theyneeded. Ifyoulook atoursurvey, that2pagesitislayeruponlayerofdetailofhowtheyneeded us, whatthey neededustoprepare togetready forthatmeeting soallweknowisthatwehave goteverything thatthey need. We arenow justproviding some additionalinformation andanswering questions thattheyhave. Tobehonesttheirfocusrightnowisunrelatedtothehouse ortheseptic system. Ithastodowiththedriveway thatwe’vealreadyapproved here. Theydon’tthinkthatwe’ve metthe requirement onthedrainagecomponent of thatandthe issuewastheirrequirements wouldhaveusputtwo15inchculvertsinthatdriveandthere’snotenoughmaterialtoeven covertwo15sowhat wearearguing isthatthe12would be, orone15would besufficientand thatit wouldhave noimpact ontheneighbors onthearea. Wecanonlymovesomuchwater fromthatditchareabecause itgoesintothattributaryandifitdoesn’tmoveoff, awayfromthat area, through thetributaryit’sgoing tobackupanyway. It doesn’tmatter ifyouhave 1or10 culverts theresowe’regoing through thatissue. 38 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 Aller: So Iguessthe questionIhave thenis, isthe application alittlebitpremature becauseif whatI’m hearing isif Barrsays youdon’tmeetthoserequirements, thattheproject isdead? DanHanson: They’re notsaying thatatall. They’rebasicallysayingthatweneed toaddress them andthatweneed toputintheapplication foravarianceiswhatwehavedoneforthat particular areaanditreally justhastodowithprovidingenough information forthem justlike wehave foryousothattheycanbasically speak…asa variance. Undestad: Sotheculverts. Dan Hanson: There isno, wedon’tseeanywaythat theycannotapprove it. It’saditch. It’snot evenawetland tobehonest. It’sbeendesignated awetland butthatmaterialcamefromthe wetland across thestreet. Imeanweunderstand whywearewhere weare butit’sstilldifficult andwe’retrying togetthrough itallwithallthedifferent partiesandweunderstand thatthey’re justgoingthroughthesteps thatthey havetogothroughandwethink withthetwoengineers talkingitwillgettheverbiagethattheyneed togetthat. That’stheonlythingthatwe’veheard that’sevenanissue withregards, thatwouldstoporslowtheprojectdown. Undestad: Sowhat, justtoclarify that. Whatyou’retalkingabout withBarrEngineeringisthe culvertsthatwe’ve, justtogetthroughthatditch. Initialditch rightfrom Meadowlark Lane. Aller: Right. DanHanson: They’veseen thesamedesign thatyouguyshaveseenwith regardstowidth. The material that’s beingused. Thevolume ofmaterial beingused. Theyjust, there’sa requirement andthatrequirement isunderwhatwecanproduce orprepare forthembased onthematerial we’reusing andthevolumeofmaterial. Imeansomeofithadtodowiththewidthoftheroad orthedriveway andwe’re, youknowwe squeezeitdownandnowwe can’tget… Hokkanen: Doesthatapproval need tobeacondition ofourapproval? Aller: Ithink it’sintheoriginal variance. Hokkanen: Okay. Ohitis? Aller: That’swhyI’msayingitseemsasthough it’sbeenpresentedasatwopartprocessand thefirstparthasn’t fullybeen approvedyetso. Aanenson: Butforthehouse meets alltherequirements. It’skindofmore technicality ofwhat sizepipinghecanuse so. This istheconundrum wedon’tliketohave isbouncingbackbetween twojurisdictionssowe’retrying toworktogether onthis. Itiscomplicated whenwedidthefirst applicationbecause wedidn’t, weweren’tabletoseethewholeapplicationandsohereweare todaybecause wedidn’thavethatinthefirst place. Wedidn’tseethewholehouseand 39 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 everythingsonow we’retryingtogettothat point. Havewedoneourbesttotrytominimize that. Aller: Sowiththeseptic areweusingforcefield? Arewepumpingit upandout? Whatdowe? DanHanson: Forwhat? Aller: Foryourseptic. DanHanson: Septicis adrainfields butit’dbepumpedlikeanyother every2yearsrequired by that. Aller: Okay. Anyadditionalquestions atthispoint? Okaythank you. DanHanson: Thankyouvery much. Aller: I’llopenupthe publichearing portion foranyindividual wishing tospeak either foror againsttheprojectaspresented. Welcomesir. Ifyoucouldcomestate your nameandaddress forthe record that’dbegreat. Michael Wistrand: Hello. Michael Wistrand, 9670Meadowlark. Aller: Welcome. MichaelWistrand: We’retheneighbors. We’vebeentheregoingon26years. Thislandthatwe boughtandthatDavidisplanningonbuilding on, the Vogel’s havebeen there. They’re foundingmembersofthecity. They’vebeenthere forever. When webought thelot in ’87, beforethatitwasafarmfield. This creek goes throughmyyard. It’sthiswide. Icanstep across it. It’snotthis, Imeanitlookshugeonthatbutit’sreallyjustalittlecreek. Inthe26 yearsI’vebeen there I haven’tseen thisthingmore thanacouplefeetwideatany point. When theculvertgetsflooded onMeadowlarkitflowsacrossanditrollsrightouttothelake. It’svery littleflowage out therebutthereisflowage always. There areseveral springson myproperty thatfeedthatandalsoupalong Pioneer Trail. Asfarastheneighbors goI’vetalkedtojustabout alltheneighbors, nobody hasaproblem withthis. Wewantanicehouse. Putting a2cargarage isridiculous onalakelot. I mean that’skindoflikedefeating thepurpose. He’sgotaniceplan. Itworks well. Ithinkifthevegetationiscorrect it’sgoing totakecareofanyproblem you’re going tohave. Youcaneasily youknow, ifyoulookattheplot itreallyisfairly flat. Itdoesn’t, there’snotalotofrunofftheresoIthinkifyouputtherightvegetation in. Youtreatitcorrectly it’sgoingtohandle anyrunoff. Even thedriveway, ifyou lookat thedriveway. Theway they have thislaidoutthere’svery littlesideendto it. Imean it’snotdroppingtowards thecreek. It’sprettyflatand Ithinkitwillbeeasily, you couldkeepthatrunning thatway. Youhad mentioned running itofftothe rightorsomething. Isupposethere’sthepossibility of doing something likethat ifyoucould putalittleholdingpondorrunitdown tothegutter, ortothe 40 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 gullydownbelowandrunitallthewayacross thepropertybutyouknowIthinkit’s, you’vegot tohavetherighthouse. You’vegotto haveahousethatlooksgoingtolookright. You’vegot tohaveahouse that’sgoingtoworkwith theneighborhood andworkwith thelake. Youwantit tolookgood onthelakeandthisplannumber1iskindof, that’sridiculous. There’snoreason forthat. Keepingthe septics, youknowI’vegot septic myself. It’sverycritical you’vegottodo itright. Pushingthem towardsthelake makes nosenseatall. Ithinkyouwanttogetasmuch areato, forrunoff aspossible. Numberoneifyoudoitcorrectlythereshouldbenorunoff of badthings comingoutofaseptic andthat’ssupposed togointothesystem. Ijustwantedtolet youknowthatofalltheneighbors I’vetalkedto, IthinkI’vetalkedtoallbut2ofthem sofar. Everybody’s forit. Nobody hasaproblem withtheplot. Anythingelse. Theywantitdoneright andIthinkeverybody’s prettycomfortable with, ifit’sdone properly and yougothrough the waterdistrict andeverything elseit caneasilybedonesothat’sallIhave. Aller: Thankyou. Anyadditionalcomments? Here comessomeone. Ifyoucouldstateyour nameandaddressfortherecordthatwouldbegreat. Thankyou. GayleVogel: GayleVogel, 105Pioneer Trailandpartlythatproperty, Iwasmarried toDick Vogel andthatpropertyhasbeen intheVogel family forover100yearsandasthey saidwe developeditin1988and DickandI talkedabout buildingdown therebuthewas inlovewith his cows and didn’twanttomoveacrosstheroadtothatdarn lakeand soIkind ofgave intohimso westayedwhere wewerebutourdreamwasalwaystohaveourkidsbuildsohereweareand I’m lookingattheontheplannumber 3. I’mthinkingifitwasyour 8yearolddaughterandyou wereknockingoff9footoffofherbedroom andnowindowforIthinkthequestion was, what doesthat9feetgainsoI’dreallyputastrongvoteinforoption3. AndDavid andAmyhave reallyworkedhardto, thatisabeautiful lotforthoseofyouthathaveseenitandthetreesandit isn’tatrailthatgoes. It’safarmroad that’sbeenthereforover100yearssothatroadhasbeen usedandwellcompacted andyouknowprettymuchstuckwhereitissowe’dlovetohaveyou andIthinkwestartedinSeptemberlooking atallofthisandIknowthere’sbeenallsortsof contingencies andgetting therightthingstogetherbutwe’dreallyliketogetstartedsothey couldmoveininthefall sothank you. Aller: Thankyou. Anyadditional comments? DaveVogel: Hello, DaveVogel. Oneoftwoowners. Mywifeishereaswell. I’dliketothank youagain formeetingwith us. Iknowthisisthesecond time. I’mnotgoing torehashwhyit’s thesecondtimebutjust wanttoemphasizeyouknow withthis optionnumber 3itminimizes the treesthatwecutdown. Wekeepthedrivewayyouknowtheotheradditional thingiswhen we’retalkingabout housedesign andwhat’sreasonable andreasonable canbeatwowaystreet. Imeanthere’sgiveandthetake andthere’sbeen somuchgiveandtake withallthissowhen we wereaskedtomove youknowthe9feetfarthertheinitialconcern waswellyouknowwe’vegot toredesignthehouseagain andagain atthatpointwhywouldn’twehavetodoitagain. Imean youcould takeafoot. Youcould take2feet. Itendedup at9. Imeanwejustfelt likewe worked. Weflipped theorientationof thehouse. Wehaveatwostory sothatwewentup 41 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 instead ofoutwitharambler. Allows us toexpand intothebasementifneededand alsoIknow itwasjustmentionedbutIdidtalktoalloftheneighbors. I’vemetwiththem. Iwalked the whole neighborhood. Handed outourdesign. Ihadmoreconcern thatthe, Iforget ifit’soption 2orwhatever itwasonherethat theydon’twantanarrow house built. They wantittoconform withtheneighborhood sothat thepropertyvalues aren’taffected andthatwasthebiggest concern. AndyouknowItalked toMikeMonkagaintoday. Theneighbortothe east. You knowwhen we hadoptionnumber, thelatestoptiontoshowupat3:00todayhedidn’tagree withthat aswelland Italkedto TimErhartimmediately tothewest andwe’vegot the neighborhood on boardso Ican’tpossiblybelieve you’dhear fromany ofthe12 peoplein this neighborhoodsowefeelthatwaspartofourbeingreasonable andmaking surethatwegot everyoneon boardwiththatsoanyadditional questions formeI’dbehappytotake. Andagain thankyouforyourtime andconsideration. Aller: Thank you. Anyquestions? Okaythankyou. Andwehave anotherindividualcoming forward. AmyVogel: I’llbefast. MynameisAmyVogel. Iamthe otherowner ofthepropertythat we’retryingto build. Ijustwantedtogiveyousomeperspective because itiskindofa conversationbetweenoptionnumber2andoptionnumber3. Our’sbeingoptionnumber3. We have3young children. We havea3yearold, a5yearoldandan8year oldsowhenwewere choosing towantthemaster onthemainsothatwecould liveourlivesoutonthisproperty it was, wedidhavetoputsomethoughtintothinkingofputtingourchildrenallupwhenwewere downbutwediddecideitwasworthittominimize someoftheimpactthatthishousecould haveonthispropertygiventherestrictions. Sowhenyoulookatsomethingaslittleasthat9 feet, which doesn’tseemlike alottopush thathouseovertothepropertylinethose9feet, like mymother-in-lawGaylesaiditdoesimpact thatbedroom onthatsecond floorandthatbedroom wasgoing to bemy8yearolddaughter’sandit’sanicebig bedroomandtothinkof thistiny littlewindow somewhere inthatspaceonasidewallwhenit’sabedroomthatwon’tgetalotof lightinifyou’rereally minimizingthingstojusttakethatnice doublewindowbecause you’re slidingthe houseover9feet andlosethat andIdoquestiontheabilityofa fireman togain access tothatroom when those 9feetarelostonthatwall. Ican’tsayforsureifthey, ifthatwould be anissue ornotbutjustthinking oftheaestheticquality ofabedroomthat a8yearoldgirlis goingtobehangingout inforquiteafewyearsandhowmuchlight wouldactuallyalsogetinto thatspacefor9feetisaquestion thatconcernsme aswellsinceabedroomisaveryimportant placeforachildsothankyou. Aller: Thank you. Ithink we’ve runoutofaudience membersso atthispointI’llclosethe publichearingportionandopenit upforcommissionercomments anddiscussion. Tietz: Chairman? Aller: Commissioner Tietz. 42 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 Tietz: First ofallIwanttocomplimentthestaff onreally agreat jobonthisand allofour projects Ithink thatcome. Iknowthisone’sbeen reallychallenging andIthink had weallbeen here30or40yearsagoweprobably wouldn’tbediscussing thesametopicsthatwe’re discussingtoday andthat’s, youknowthelandis encumberedbyour currentregulationsand we havetotryourbesttoworkwithinthem atalltimes andwe’vecertainlygone through anumber ofiterationsofplans anddiscussions oversetbackandhow thisisgoingtoimpact butpersonally Ifeelthatoption number 3 iswithinthe design constraints thatthey’ve establishedand the floorplan and theworkthat’sbeendone. I’dhavetosaythatthat, youknowtogo backand continue toredesignandlookatoptionsthataregoing toconformtoaminimal extentbeyond whattheyhavedone withavery, very difficultsite. Ithinkthe commentbythecontractor saying thatwehadessentially5 percentof asitethat’sactuallybuildable. Thatplaces really severerestrictions onanything that’sbeen donebutIthink giventhedesignthatyou’veselected andthe approach thatyou’ve takenthat option3 inthisinstance isvery appropriate. Aller: Anyadditional comments. Undestad: Iwouldhavetoagree. Hokkanen: Iagreeaswell. Aller: Sowhenwe lookatthisthere’s noquestion thatthisisthe typeofpropertythatrequires a varianceifyou wanttohavereasonable structureatallbecause ofthecomplexity ofthe setbacks andthewater structures thatsurround thepropertyandwevisitedthis thefirsttime. Wedo want tominimize anyimpact andsoIreally appreciate staffcoming forward andmakingthe effortto trytolookatoptionsandIwouldalsocommend staff. Thisisthethirdhearingtonightandwe always hear thattheprocess hasbeenagreat process forpeople toworkwithstaff andgoing throughandthatyou areaccommodating andthatyou dolookatoptions soIthinkthatthe staff didagreat jobinmakingpresentation that includesall theoptionsandnumber 1didn’tpass mustardbecauseoftheproperty structure conditions butIappreciate thefactthat youlookedatit because itisanother optionthatwouldminimize those, theimpacts ontherestrictionsandthat’s oneofourjobsingrantingavarianceis tomake surethatit’s minimized. JustasI asked the questionaboutreduction oftheproperty Iwantedtoseewhetherornotindividuals hadthought abouttoadegree thetypeof structureandtheamount of thehardcoverandthe footprint that’s beingusedbythepropertyandIwaspleased tohearthatobviously ithadbeenthoughtabout in great detailincluding thesafetyfactorsandissues withregard tothebedroomandthewindows andalthoughwe haverequirements andlawsandlegalscenarioswherewerequireaningress andegresswindow tobeacertain sizeitdoesn’tnecessarily meanthatwehavetoputour structures insuch aposition that wehave touse themsoIagree withtheother commentsthat the presentation bystaff wasexcellent. I thinkthat option3inmymindisprobablythebestfor the useofthispropertytomakeitareasonable use under thecircumstances whichiswhatIthink we’recharged with soIwould bevotingtoapprove amotionfor3andIwould askforsomeone tomake thatmotion. 43 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 Tietz: Mark? Yeah I’ll makethatmotion. Aller: Commissioner Tietz. Tietz: Firstdo wechange? Undestad: Justgoto 3. Tietz: TheChanhassen Board ofAppeals andAdjustments approves avariance fromthe100 footshoreland setback fromatributary toconstructionasingle family, boyyoumade italot easierformetoread it. Home, accessory structures anddriveway asshowninAttachment 3. Ohyouchanged it. Ingvalson: Correct. Hokkanen: Magic. Tietz: Inthe memorandumdated March15, 2016 subject totheconditions ofapproval and adoptstheFindings ofFactandDecision. Aller: Ihave amotion. Do Ihave asecond? Madsen: Second. Aller: SoI have amotionbyCommissioner Tietz, asecondbyCommissioner Madsen. Any further discussion? Justagainwould applaud staffinbeing prepared forthemotion. Obviously thinking ofalltheoptions presentedsoI’m happytohave staff presentthem allsoadecision that isaninformed onecanbemadeandwiththatI’ll entertainthevote. Allthoseinfavor. Tietzmoved, Madsenseconded thattheChanhassenBoard ofAppealsand Adjustments, approve ashoreland setbackvariance fromatributary forthe construction ofasingle-familyhome, accessorystructures, anddriveway, asshownin Attachment #15ofthestaffreport, subject tothefollowing conditions: PlanningandBuilding Department 1.Theapplicantshallapplyforandreceive a buildingpermitand/or zoning permitfor allstructures. 2.Theapplicant shallerect temporaryfencing around theproposed septiclocations prior toanyoperationofequipment onthe site. WaterResourcesCoordinator 3.Theplanmust clearlyindicate theshorelandimpactzone andencroachmenttherein. 44 Chanhassen Planning Commission – March15, 2016 4.Theapplicant isresponsibleforanyotheragency approvals thatmayberequired. 5.Nosite disturbance mayoccuruntilthe cityhasreceivedconfirmation from theBoard ofSoilandWaterResources thatthewetland bankaccounthasbeendebitedthereby satisfying theapproved wetlandreplacementplan. 6.Allerosion prevention andsedimentcontrolpractices mustbeproperlyinstalledprior toanyearthdisturbingactivities. 7.TypeIIsedimentcontrolbestmanagement practicesarerequired forallareas up gradient of thewetland, the streamandthe lake. Thisshallbemachine slicedsilt fencewithmetalteepostsorotherasapproved bytheCityEngineer. 8.Allotherpertinentaspects ofCityCodeSection19-145mustbeincludedwiththe site planincluding, but notlimited tothe placement ofsix (6) inchesof topsoilto all disturbedareas. 9.Thecityortheir representative shallinspect theerosion preventionand sediment control bestmanagement practicespriortoanyearth disturbing activities. Forestry Official 10.Clearing andconstruction limitsshallbe locatedoutsideofshore impact zoneandwillbe nocloserthan100 feetto theOrdinary High WaterLevel (OHWL). 11.Clearingof vegetationalong theshoreshallbe limitedtoastrip of30feet, parallel tothe shoreline andextending inward withintheshore impact zone. Theapplicantshalluse thisclearing for viewsandaccesstothe lake. Noadditionalclearing is allowed by ordinance. 12.Percityordinance, alltrees10inches andlarger within theconstruction limits shall be shown onthebuilding permit survey. FireMarshall 13.Address numbersshallbe postedatthedrivewayentrance priortoanybuilding construction. Numbers shallbeminimum 12inchesin height, locatedat thedriveway entrance, contrastingcolortothesurfacetheyareappliedto. BuildershallcontactFire Marshal forreviewandapproval ofnumbers. 14.Noburning permitswillbeissuedfortreeorbrushremoval. Allvotedinfavorandthemotion carriedunanimously withavoteof6to0. APPROVAL OF MINUTES: CommissionerYusufnoted theverbatim andsummary MinutesofthePlanning Commission meetingdatedFebruary 16, 2016aspresented. ADMINISTRATIVEPRESENTATIONS. Aanenson: Beforewegettotheyearendreportifyoudon’tmindadjustingtheschedule there we’lltakethe, sorry. We’lljustgothrough upcomingmeetingsrealquick whywegetsetup. So thwewillnothaveameetingApril5. Wedid nothaveany additionalapplications. We have quiteafewthat areinprocess thatwe’reworking on. Ialsowant toannounce atthe City 45