PC Minutes 7-19-05
Planning Commission Meeting - July 19, 2005
20. No alterations are allowed within the primary corridor or within the first 20 feet of the
setback from the primary corridor. All structures must meet the 40-foot setback from the
primary corridor.
21. Based on the existing canopy coverage for the site, the developer will need to meet
minimum planting requirements.
22. Bufferyard planting will be required along the south and west property lines.
23. Landscaping for the attached housing area should include native species for overstory and
foundation plantings as well as non-native, ornamental selections.
24. Large groupings of materials will help extend the natural areas into the developed sites and
create privacy for residents.
25. A strong, boulevard tree planting element is recommended within the development and
required along any collector roads.
26. The development should establish viewsheds to be preserved as part of the development."
All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 6 to O.
(The Planning Commission took a short recess at this point in the meeting.)
PUBLIC HEARING:
REQUEST FOR REZONING OF PROPERTY FROM AGRICULTURAL EST A TE
DISTRICT (A2) TO PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPMENT (PUD). PRELIMINARY PLAT
APPROVAL. AND WETLAND AL TERA TION PERMIT ON PROPERTY LOCATED
ON THE NORTHWEST CORNER OF THE INTERSECTION OF LYMAN
BOULEVARD AND GALPIN BOULEVARD. CHANHASSEN WEST BUSINESS PARK.
EDEN TRACE CORPORATION. PLANNING CASE NO. 05-23.
Public Present:
Name
Address
Tom Witek
Jim Leonard
JoEllen Radermacher
LuAnn Sidney
Rick Buan
Mimi & Nate Espe
Cathy & Kevin DiLorenzo
Ron Blum
Christine & Mark Fischer
Peggy Emerson
2318 Stone Circle Drive
2360 Stone Circle Drive
2479 Bridle Creek Trail
2431 Bridle Creek Trail
2569 Stone Creek Lane West
2300 Stone Creek Lane West
2382 Stone Creek Lane West
2081 Stone Creek Drive
2407 Bridle Creek Trail
8409 Stone Creek Court
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Planning Commission Meeting - July 19,2005
Aleta & Alex Donaldson
Steve & Sarah Dale
James Wise
Peter Sidney
Roger & Gay Schmidt
Paul & Amina Rinkes
Mike Krych
Rodney & Janice Melton
Barry LaBounty
2460 Bridle Creek Trail
2487 Bridle Creek Trail
2747 Wagner Drive
2431 Bridle Creek Trail
8301 Galpin Boulevard
2208 Boulder Road
2127 Boulder Road
2413 Bridle Creek Trail
2421 Bridle Creek Trail
McDonald: Before we start on this I'd like to make a couple announcements. First of all Mark
Undestad is not going to participate in this portion of the meeting because of a conflict of
interest. Secondly, this particular proposal before us has drawn a lot of comments and a lot of
concerns from the people that live over in Trotters Ridge. We received numerous letters. I know
individually we received letters. The council has also received letters. Everything has been
forwarded to all members of the commission. We have read all of your letters and all of your
comments. One of the other things I would like to also address is that I know I did receive some
phone calls that I did not return. I'm not sure if anyone else on the commission did, but the
policy of the commission is to not have an exparte communications with individuals and the
reason for that is that we want to make sure that everyone gets a uniform response to their
questions and answers. We welcome your questions to us and they are addressed by staff and
also by the commission. With that we will now start the hearing on this particular project and I
will ask for a report from staff.
Bob Generous presented the staff report on this item.
McDonald: Let's start with Debbie.
Larson: I have a question for you. I went out and looked at the site today and my concern tends
to be with Lots 1 through 5 say. The homes that are over there. Beautiful homes over there.
There are no trees within this area and this building's going to go up and I'm wondering if
they're planning on putting substantial tree cover and buffer in there. I mean it says there's a
100 foot buffer but is it going to block the side of the building because if I lived there, and
certainly would like it to be camouflaged as much as possible.
Generous: Yes to both of that. They are proposing some berming. As part of the letter you
received, the neighbors have requested some larger berming and the applicant has actually had a
neighborhood meeting with them and so I'll let him present what he's agreed to do on that. But
there is extensive landscaping that our buffer yard requirements have to go in and that would be
done as part of the subdivision review, so those trees would go in no matter, let's say lots may
not build for another 2 to 3 years but the trees that they put on the edges will time to grow over in
this area. And they're also looking at some switching on the site because they're over on some
areas and under on others so they're going to meet all those areas where they're under. On the
west side where they're over, they're going to transfer that to the north side I believe...
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Planning Commission Meeting - July 19,2005
Larson: Okay. And my other question is, it kind of looks like where this Lot C would be in, and
actually maybe even part of Lot 8. It looks like quite a ravine that leads up to where the homes
are. Is that going to be the area that you're talking about that's going to be filled in? And will it
be filled in all the way back up to where the homes are?
Generous: I don't know that it's totally all the way up there.
Larson: And maybe it's because the trees on Outlot C were high. Maybe that's.
Generous: They're raising that whole area on the east and then on the end of that they're going
to put the berm into so.
Larson: So if they raise that, that raises your building higher too, correct?
Generous: Yes.
Larson: Okay.
Generous: Also it's down low from, if you look at it from the road, it will still be below that
elevation where they have the parking lot elevation and then the first floor is a little bit up above
that.
Larson: So what's the purpose of raising that? Is it a drainage issue or is it a?
Generous: Well partially it's also to prepare the site for development and to make sure that the,
everything, the utilities all work because they're going to put the road in and they have to meet
minimum driveway elevations so they can't be too steep on that.
Larson: Because like I say, it puts the buildings down in the ditch, then the people wouldn't
have an issue. Okay, that's all I have.
McDonald: Okay. Dan.
Keefe: Yeah, I think you spoke to this a little bit in the report and maybe just a little bit now.
Can you address the access to Lyman Boulevard?
Generous: I think I would defer to Alyson on that.
Morris: Good evening. I've had some conversations with Bill Weckman over at Carver County
Public Works. With both Galpin and Lyman being county roads, we really defer to the county
regarding access. Mr. Weckman has expressed that the county prefers the access to be at Galpin.
They are looking at Lyman Boulevard to be an east/west collector. The significance of that
being an east/west collector throughout the county is, particularly with the 212 project. How that
meets up with 212 there. They want to limit the access onto Lyman Boulevard for safety reasons
so that Lyman Boulevard can carry a larger amount of traffic with fewer conflict areas, i.e. where
an intersection would be. The other reason for the proposed access to be at Galpin is the city
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Planning Commission Meeting - July 19,2005
standard for access spacing on this type of road. The 2020 comp plan has directed a regional
analysis of the roadway system identifying both Lyman and Galpin as arterial roads. As such
they recommended access spacing guidelines. The city's code requires a 1,320 foot spacing. If
you're looking at Lyman Boulevard and also with the wetland in the southwest comer there, the
closest, or pardon me the further away they can have an access from Galpin is 1,000 feet, so it
wouldn't meet the city's requirement but it would meet the city's access spacing as far as
intersecting at another cross street, i.e. the street to the east. So that was the reasoning we went
through with this proposed access to Galpin.
Keefe: How far is the current access from Lyman?
Morris: The current access from Lyman actually does not meet the city standard. That's correct.
But it does meet, it's a lesser of two evils if you will. Neither access would meet the access
spacing. However there's currently an access to Galpin at, I apologize. I can't remember the
cross street. At Stone Creek Drive, so that's the place that they said to have the location for the
street connection.
Keefe: Okay. Let me see that one... to the building height and the buffering between Trotters
Ridge and the proposed buildings. It looks like the design standards that you're proposing would
not allow a building over 40 feet, and we're looking at an elevation of it looks like around 956 I
think, so we're looking at a substantial height for a building. You know you have to take about
40, essentially we don't know that they're going to go to that necessarily and they have to corne
in for review on each particular lot, is that correct?
Generous: That's correct. They have to do a site plan review.
Keefe: Okay. And is berming that they're proposing what is on, and I'm not sure if I've got the
right plan or not but is 966 the berming height they're proposing?
Generous: What showed up on the original plan.
Keefe: Yeah, okay.
Generous: It should be 3 feet above the ground floor elevation.
Keefe: Okay, and then that's on the northeast comer and then to the northwest comer we're
looking at, I mean I don't even see any berming.
Generous: No, they're using some distance in that instance.
Keefe: Yeah, so you've got 200 feet. 200 feet from the property line and okay.
Generous: And then preservation of the existing vegetation and then additional landscaping.
Keefe: At least on my plan I'm looking at, it doesn't appear that there's many trees, but I may be
not looking at the right thing in that northwest comer.
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Planning Commission Meeting - July 19,2005
Generous: No there's not. Significant trees.
Keefe: Northwest. Well really in either case from what I could tell. I mean Outlot C had all the
trees.
Generous: Yes. The majority.
Keefe: Right. And then Lots 5 and 6 it looks like are, don't have a lot of trees on them so okay.
Generous: No. If you go up.. . you can see from the entrance all the way down to the
development.
Keefe: Right. I'm particularly sensitive to the residents to the north and trying to make it as
little visual intrusion as we can in regards to that. Okay.
McDonald: Okay? Deborah.
Zorn: Come back to me.
McDonald: Okay. Kurt.
Papke: What's the responsibility of the developer and the city in terms of the drainage on the
northeast comer? This kind of gets back to one of the points that was raised before when you
put, if you look at the topo maps here, there's a natural drainage to the south to the wetland and I
have some concerns with Trotters Ridge. It looks like Lot number 1, 2, 3 and 4 maybe 5, all
drain towards that berm. How would that be accommodated in this plan? Would there be a
storm sewer? Would there be a swale? I mean these people probably don't want a pond in their
back yard. What's, what would, how would that be mitigated?
Generous: Well I know there's already a pipe in the back yard to take water to the north. I'm
not sure if it's, the developer could probably.
Papke: Maybe we can defer until you, maybe defer until it's your... The other question I had on
the plans is, on the west side of Lot 6 there's a retaining wall that goes down to the cul-de-sac.
That looks like that's quite substantial. If I'm reading the plan correctly, it's not marked on the
plan but if Ijust look at the elevations and so on, it looks to be almost a 12 or a 13 foot retaining
wall. Does that kind of match your understanding of the plans? Is it a pretty good sized wall?
Generous: Yes, that's my understanding that that, so they don't have to grade into that treed
area.
Papke: Okay. The intersection of the proposed access road with Galpin and Stone Creek there, I
assume it would have to be at least a two way stop obviously, but are you looking at a potential
four way or how will traffic be controlled at that intersection?
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Planning Commission Meeting - July 19, 2005
Morris: Traffic control at that intersection again we'd have to refer to the county since it's under
their jurisdiction. We can certainly work with the developer so that they can post a stop sign at
their entrance. I think that would be a good place to have them stopping traffic so that they can
make a safe passage out to Galpin.
Papke: So were you talking about a stop sign on Galpin to, or from the exit of the development?
Morris: From the exit of the development.
Papke: So you would not foresee any kind of a four way stop at that intersection? It would
strictly be a two way stop at best, is what I hear you saying.
Morris: At Galpin and the proposed access?
Papke: Yes.
Morris: I would, at this point we can, all we can do is get them to have a stop at their
intersection. To make Galpin a four way stop we have to then bring the county in because it's
their jurisdiction.
Papke: Okay, thank you.
McDonald: Okay. Now we'll go back to Deborah.
Zorn: Bob, is it safe to assume that each of the individual lots will be further discussed at
another time, but is it safe to assume that all these lots are showing a 40 foot height building and
that respective parking would include that so if the buildings were proposed to be lower, that
parking would decrease.
Generous: I don't know that we were looking at the 40 foot height. I think they were spreading
these out more, but the parking would correspond to the square footages that they had in their
site plan. Concept site plan. So yes, if they had smaller buildings on the individual lots the
parking would be down. If they are two lots together that had complimentary units, we could
look at shared parking.
Zorn: Okay.
Keefe: I have one Jerry.
McDonald: Okay.
Keefe: Going back to the access onto Galpin. Do you have any sense on what the traffic count
will be coming out of this development? One of my concerns is now if these buildings are built
individually, it would be nice to sort of have a sense on what we're really dealing with in regards
to traffic. Because it sure looks like a lot of parking.
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Planning Commission Meeting - July 19,2005
Larson: Yeah, it looks like a lot of parking.
Morris: Bob did a preliminary analysis of the number of trips based on the most intense use of
the property. Based on that he carne up with 26, just around 2,600 trips. Again looking at the
2020 comp plan transportation, they use the land use as their guide when they generated traffic
volumes. Since their proposed land use of this parcel is consistent with the 2020 plan, we can
feel with confidence that the numbers that were generated in our comp plan showing that Galpin
as it is right now, 52 foot wide street is sufficiently designed to carry that additional traffic.
Keefe: Just to follow up on that. The type of use being office industrial would be, you know
leads you to believe there might be some larger trucks going in and out of there. I know there's
some going in and out of there today but if you're talking 2,600 trips, you'd be talking a
substantial increase potentially in what goes in there. Can you give me your thoughts in regards
to volume of larger trucks going up and down, you know the increase in the volume of larger
trucks going up and down Galpin. I mean do we try to guide them in any particular way out to
Lyman or do we have them go up Galpin or give me some sense on the traffic flow in regards to.
Morris: Well without knowing the exact uses on the property it's very difficult to give you a
number of tractor trailer turning movements into and out of the property. What we can look at is
on a regional basis where would these tractor trailer units be corning from and the most logical
route that they would take. Ultimately if they're corning from an east/west they would take 212
up to Lyman, north on Galpin. That's just a guess. As far as a turning movement there. In order
to improve the safety at the intersection, I did talk to the county engineer about striping and turn
lanes. Right now there's right turn lanes for both north and southbound traffic on Galpin at the
intersection of Stone Creek, and the entrance to the site there. When I talked to him about that,
about the possibility of striping a turn lane, he expressed that the county wants to have a
consistent striping pattern throughout that corridor. That they would keep, if this project were to
move ahead they would keep an eye on the traffic volumes going in that area, and at that point on
a system wide basis of going and striping turn lanes which would have a taper into a left turn
lane and then the sufficient length of the left turn lane going, if you're going northbound on
Galpin, to make a left turn onto this public street to access the proposed development. So we've
done a lot of, we've had a lot of conversations with the county trying to work with the resident's
concerns. I understand we want to keep traffic off Galpin but also looking at, on a regional
basis, what the county wants for a regional corridor and trying to make the proposed access on
Galpin as safe as possible.
McDonald: Could I just follow up on that, while we're talking about that. With the number of
trips you're talking about and the parking spaces and the potential for the people that are in there
and everything, what would trip a traffic light study at that point? Because corne 5:00 you get
everybody in the world trying to get out of there. We're creating a problem.
Morris: To do an analysis as to whether a signal is warranted, there's several warrants that need
to be met in order to meet the requirement to get a traffic signal. They include traffic volumes,
traffic speeds, accidents, accidents with fatalities, that sort of thing. Those are the criteria for a
street light. That's not closing that, of course we don't want to have fatalities out there, but those
are the warrants for traffic signals.
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McDonald: Now who controls that? Do we have any input into it or because it's a county road,
is that strictly something that they would control?
Morris: Unfortunately I don't have a lot of experience with Carver County. I've had more
experience with Dakota County and I guess it's whether or not they wait until all the warrants are
met or if they feel that they want, if they foresee the need for a street light there, for a traffic light
there. If they want to do something of that nature. The forecasted volumes on Galpin actually
within the 212 project going through are, there's a reduction in the forecasted volume because
212 will alleviate some of the traffic off Galpin, so there is, you know there is some positive...
with 212 going through there, there will be reduced volumes on Galpin. But again it's, with the
county being in control of that, that road, we would have to defer to see what they would do.
McDonald: Well let me ask you this. What input do we have to get the county to look at that? I
mean do we get to call them up and say hey, we've got a lot of traffic there. We want to see a
study. We want to see something done, or are we just at their mercy?
Morris: We certainly could, and like I said I've had several conversations with the county
engineer. He's been very responsive to the proposed project and the questions that have come up
by residents, so we could certainly ask what his thoughts are regarding a signal at that location.
McDonald: Okay, and again the whole thing kind of depends upon the details of what goes into
these lots. I mean the way it's laid out right now... the mercy of waiting until the details fall into
place. But this is something that we do stay on top of and watch and okay.
Papke: Could you explain the rationale or the logic behind how 212 will reduce traffic on
Galpin. It seems somewhat counter intuitive in that right now most of the homeowners along
Galpin would naturally drive up to Highway 5 and now with 212, the natural inclination would
be to drive down to Lyman. Take Lyman to the 212 on ramp at Lyman and 101. So it seems,
you know it doesn't you know seem immediately obvious to me that that would be the case.
Another thing, considering the other two projects we've approved tonight, there's going to be a
lot of population down in the AUAR area and we have Lifetime Fitness now and the natural path
from the AUAR to Lifetime Fitness is right up Galpin. Okay, so I'm kind of struggling with,
you know and I understand the computer models and everything but I'm kind of struggling with
you know how, you know is this really going to be indicative of the kinds of traffic levels we're
going to see.
Morris: I apologize.. . regarding how 212 helps out on the traffic volumes. With the traffic going
to the site. Being able to access from 212 to Lyman then going north on Galpin versus taking 5,
Galpin and going southbound. Reducing the length of Galpin that they would have to travel.
And unfortunately I haven't seen any of the traffic forecasts for 212 to see how the different
divergents go. In the 2020 comp plan they do have the forecasted volume for Galpin with 212
being in place. The 2010 count would be 6,000 with 212 being in place. Otherwise it would
have been 10,000, so they have their computer models that take all the streets and place the
collector roads in place and that's how they generate those numbers. Unfortunately I'm not
aware of how the traffic is being directed by the anticipated growth on Galpin.
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Planning Commission Meeting - July 19,2005
Larson: I've got one more. You know I'm not quite fully understanding, and maybe you could,
you explained it once but it didn't sink in. Explain to me why we can't have the entrance on
Lyman versus Galpin. I'm looking at this. A logical spot would be between the pond and 2, to
me. Are there safety reasons or what's the reason why they couldn't come in off of that road?
Morris: Okay. There's from two different perspectives. From the county's perspective, they
want to limit the access onto Lyman Boulevard because they see it as an east/west collector road
through the county where they want to take larger traffic volumes with minimal entrances to
make it a safer path, a safer road. Minimal road connections to it.
Larson: But aren't you compromising the safety of Galpin for the safety of Lyman? You know
what I mean? I mean I'm just thinking, you know the residents here and all the traffic, I'm
looking at these parking spaces and I'm going man, that's a lot of traffic going in and out of
there. They're going to be going both directions. Not necessarily one way or the other.
Morris: Right. Lyman also has a higher traffic volume. Projected traffic volume than Galpin
does.
Larson: Not after this... I mean truly I'm looking at these parking spots and I'm just counting
what, and you know there's a lot.
Morris: Well the information that we had was, like I said, the SRF analysis with the 2020 comp
plan which included, which analyzed the whole, the city wide based on existing and proposed
land use. Existing and proposed road systems, and based on that information they came up with
a traffic volume of 6,000 vehicles per day on Galpin, which is a little higher than what it is right
now. That's for the 2010 count. That's the 2010 projection. So with Lyman having higher
traffic volume the county wanting to use Lyman Boulevard as an east/west collector, that was
one of the reasons why we weren't proceeding with the access to Lyman. The second one was
that the city's requirement for, with Lyman Boulevard being classified as an arterial, the city's
requirement is that any access, accesses have to be 1,320 feet apart and/or meet an existing
intersection. So it doesn't meet the city's requirement for spacing. However as Councilmember
Papke had mentioned, the proposed access doesn't meet that 1,320 foot spacing requirement
either. However it does meet up with Stone Creek Drive, which is an existing intersection.
Larson: But it's residential. You know what I mean?
Morris: I agree, and.
Larson: It's not the same kind of road to me. It's a residential thing going into trucks and other
things and to me that seems not logical in my opinion, but that's what they're, because it's a road
they just consider it.
Morris: It's an existing intersection. We're responding to the county's request.
Larson: Sorry. Didn't mean to drill you.
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Planning Commission Meeting - July 19,2005
Morris: No, that's okay.
McDonald: Further questions from the council. Commission.
Larson: Yeah, I have one more actually.
McDonald: Okay.
Larson: Getting back to the building site for Lot 6. There's, I know that we've got a proposed
height of 40 feet. Could that possibly be reduced rather than accommodating, such as a 3 story,
maybe a 2 story building? Would that be a consideration just for that lot, because other, the
other residents seem to have a nice buffer. You know the ponds and the trees and everything, but
that lot, I mean those people in those homes, they're going to be looking at buildings and I don't
know if that would be a consideration that they could just for that particular one.
Generous: As part of the PUD you could make specific standards for specific lots.
Larson: Okay, well that would be something that I would be interested in pursuing if in fact this
goes through.
Keefe: That's a good question. So would we do that at this point or would we do it at individual
site review?
Generous: No, you would have to do it as part of the design standards. To create those building
parameters. An example would be Villages on the Ponds. On the east side of the project there's
a two story height limit. As you go to the middle ofthe project it's a 4 story height limit.
McDonald: Any further questions? Okay, seeing no further questions from the commissioners, I
would ask if the applicant is present and wants to address the commission.
Ben Merriman: Good evening Chairman and commissioners. My name is Ben Merriman. I'm
with Eden Trace Corporation. I'm the developer of the site. Would like to just kind of go over
the site plan a little bit and how we arrived at some of the design standards that we have in
working with the city. Address a couple of issues that have come up. First of all, if we can go to
this drawing. When we looked at this site, it was a lot of different things. . . and then after
reviewing it with staff... put this into a preserve. This whole Outlot C goes into a preserve. That
preserves these trees. Now we were dealing with additional trees that run through this way, and
there are some more here and down here. We preserved these by running the lot line from these
two lots right down the center of the trees. So with the setbacks of those lots we're able to save a
great deal or all of these trees that are in green right here. We're also saving the trees that are
here, and along here. We are losing some in here. This area actually is raised by about 6 feet, so
this area comes up through here. Comes up about 6 feet so we will lose some of these trees
through here. We did look at an access point coming off of Lyman that came up through this
way and at the county's request it was switched to here. We had both, we looked at both
alternatives and this is the county's request. We're doing a couple of unique things with respect
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Planning Commission Meeting - July 19,2005
to water on the overall site and then I'll address some of the questions that have arisen in this 100
foot setback with the neighbors to the north in Trotters Ridge. In most of our developments we
take all the water off the impervious surface, off the roof, off the parking lots and it runs into a
pipe and then it's piped down to a regional pond. What we're going to try on this development is
to take the water off of these impervious surfaces and actually into the ditches. We're going to
design the ditches so that they run towards the regional pond and then pipe it across roads and
then into the regional pond. And what this does is it allows a lot of the water to actually
penetrate back into the soils in this area versus going directly to the holding pond, so it's a new
type of way to transfer the water and we think it will work quite well. We've also in this area up
in here again to preserve some of the trees, what we did is we put a shared driveway through here
and we kind of bent it into the Lot 4 and 5, so Lot 4 and 5, this lot and this lot will share a
driveway versus each one having their own, and that preserves some of the additional trees and
from there. With respect to trucks, yes. This will create traffic and the traffic counts that they
projected I think are probably fairly accurate. With respect to large semi truck traffic, these
buildings, people may say that a 50,000 square foot building is a large building. It actually isn't
that large when it comes to a distribution type of a facility. If you're going to have a distribution
facility and run large semi trucks, which are going to carry large volume of product, you're
probably going to be in a building that's going to be 150 to 300,000 square feet. And they're
prevalent around the Twin Cities. And so that's the type of building that would house a large
semi truck traffic. Most of our developments, and we've developed a number of different
properties here in Chanhassen, are companies that are in very light manufacturing. Some are in
software companies. It's a very diverse mix of companies. And most of them, we don't have
anyone that's in heavy manufacturing of any type and we don't have anyone that's really per se
in distribution as well. We have some people that re-package items and then send them out.
They're just duplicating type machines. Those type of things. Want to talk one more thing
about this retaining wall was brought up and it is a fairly steep retaining wall. And what that
allows us to do is to, if we build this retaining wall we can get access to this lot and we can also
preserve and stay out of the drip line of all those trees. If we slope it, it becomes a longer,
elongated and we're looking at doing that so we may reduce this retaining wall some by sloping
but there will be a retaining wall in here and that's basically so that we can build up to it without
going into the drip line of the tree. Otherwise we have to maintain a certain grade level from
trees coming down, and so by putting in a retaining wall, we can bring this cul-de-sac up to the
retaining wall and still stay out of the drip line of the trees. If we go into the drip line of the
trees, you'll lose the trees. If you run the caps on any type of the roofs, that tends to kill the trees
so that's what we're trying to alleviate there. Want to talk a little bit about this is a 100 foot
setback that's in here, and want to talk about two things. One is with the 100 foot setback we
can put a berm across in here and the berm with a 3 to 1 ratio we can get about a 12 foot high
berm, and that will be sloped up. Hit 12 feet and then slope back down. We'll plant spruce trees
along the top of it and then on both sides, or a majority will be on this side but on both sides we
can plant spruce, maple, lindens, those type of things. Ash. And we think that will help out a
great deal. We'd like to plant the spruce on the top of it because it offers a great deal of visibility
blockage during the entire season versus just in the summer months, and we think that will help a
great deal. The 100 foot setback is basically a code issue that we've complied with here. The
water drainage, all of the water in this entire project filters this way and as I explained, a lot of it
runs through the ditches because that's a new way of running the water that we haven't tried that
the watershed district would like us to comply with. It all runs this way. The only water that
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would actually go towards these homes would be from the top of that berm going that way. So
you could essentially say for approximately 50 feet if the berm was centered through this 100
foot easement, the water from the top of that berm would go towards these homes. There is an
outlet pipe that runs from here and runs under and actually runs towards the wetlands to the
north.
Papke: If I may interrupt at this point, as long as we're on the topic.
Ben Merriman: Sure.
Papke: My concern was not your development draining into Trotters Ridge but rather the
opposite. My concern was let's take the example of Lot 2 here. Lot 2 drains towards your berm.
Ben Merriman: It does.
Papke: Okay. And where will that water go?
Ben Merriman: There's a pipe that runs out here and it actually runs north.
Papke: So is there a, is there a storm sewer? How is that water captured and transported to this
pipe you're speaking of? I guess I'm not understanding how the water gets out of this low lying
area.
Ben Merriman: Drainage. It naturally drains to this point or, it's either here. It's right in this
area here. It doesn't show up on this plan. And it naturally drains that way currently and then
runs that direction. There's no really, to my knowledge there's really no standing water over in
this area except in heavy rains and then it slowly runs out of that pipe. We could, and can, if we
believe that there may be a problem, take the water around and run it towards our site. So we
could put an outlet for this area to run towards our regional pond if it's deemed necessary.
Because we certainly don't, by putting a berm in I do not want to increase the amount of water in
this area, and we can certainly run a pipe and get it around the berm and take it towards our
regional pond here. That wouldn't be a problem. Does that sort of address that? Okay. With
respect to building heights, on this particular building what currently I think you have is it 45 feet
and 4 stories or how is again?
Generous: 4 and 50 is what the lOP district would permit.
Ben Merriman: It's what?
Generous: 4 stories and 50 feet.
Ben Merriman: 50 feet. I think what we would be willing to do is to drop that down to 35 feet
for this building, so that this building comes down and has a 35 foot limit. And that would be to
the top of the parapet. In other words there's a finish floor elevation and then it goes up and then
there's a roof, a flat roof and then the roof actually extends above that and that's called a parapet,
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so it would be at the top of the parapet. So it'd be 35 feet from the ground to the top of the
parapet. So we'd be willing to do that on that particular building.
McDonald: Excuse me. If you do that on that particular building then you've more or less
limited that building to pretty much office space haven't you?
Ben Merriman: No. When people start stacking pallets, and this gets to a fire issue so I won't
get too in depth into it, but when people start stacking pallets you can basically if you take 3
pallets high, you put on racks and go 3 high. After you go to 4 pallets or 5 pallets high, you get
into a fire code issue and then you have to get into in rack sprinkling. Early suppressant fast
response systems in order to suppression that much product in that much area, and so generally
people don't do that. Unless you're going to the distribution facilities that I mentioned before, if
you've got a 200,000-300,000 square foot building, then that's exactly what they do. They go 8
racks high. But this one will be limited, this would be basically a building that would have about
3 pallets high or it'd be an 18 foot, 20 foot, 24 foot clear building. Inside. Bob mentioned this as
he was going through the presentation. We've got access trees over here on the west side and
we're going to take that down to the standard. The city standard. We're going to take those
trees plus a lot extras and we'll wind from here across with trees. As many as we can get in,
given that in 5 years we have to allow for growth, but within landscaping design standards we'll
basically pack this area with trees with the berm. The same thing on this area over here. We'll
also line this area with trees and we're going to increase the amount of trees along Galpin
Boulevard on the top, on the road side. On the hill side, and so that will act as an additional
visible block from neighbors here. And the same thing for here.
Larson: I've got a question for you while we're on the subject of trees. In the woods that it
looks like you're going to be taking out the trees. The gray area.
Ben Merriman: Here or here?
Larson: Yeah. Are any of those trees mature oaks, because I know there's some oaks.
Ben Merriman: Yes, some of them are.
Larson: Yeah. How many proposed old mature oak trees do you plan on taking out, do you
know off hand?
Ben Merriman: I don't know exactly how many oaks are in there. I'd have to go to the tree,
yeah we've done a tree count and with species so we know exactly how many trees are on here
and what type of trees they are, and that's how we get to the calculation for tree replacement and
we're actually going to exceed the tree replacement count. And I understand these are large
trees, and that's the whole premise of what happened up in here. That's why we went through
this process of Outlot C and made this a preservation easement to retain all those trees. We're
not able to save all of them.
Larson: Okay.
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McDonald: Any other questions?
Keefe: Can you speak to your sidewalks and where they go throughout the site.
Ben Merriman: There's a sidewalk down I believe it's just one side of the cul-de-sac that runs
through here. It's not on both sides is it Bob?
Generous: I thought there was just one.
Ben Merriman: Yeah, it's just on one side. There will be a sidewalk that runs on the cul-de-sac.
Keefe: Okay, and then how about up along Galpin, what is the.
Generous: Trail on both sides of Galpin currently.
Keefe: Okay, and does that tie, go down to Lyman as well or where does it go? I mean does it
terminate at Lyman?
Generous: I believe so, yes. Eventually Lyman will have a trail system too. When it's
upgraded.
Keefe: Okay, the future would have a tie in, but it terminates at Lyman. There will be a
sidewalk going into this site. A sidewalk along the street that goes into the site, and then all the
way up Galpin.
Generous: Right.
Ben Merriman: That's correct.
Keefe: Is there anything on the west side, and I don't even know what's on the west side.
Generous: It's an industrial park.
Ben Merriman: The west side, the industrial lots back right up to this property. There's a berm
that runs across there and that's about it.
Keefe: There's no path system. . .
Generous: Not internally, no. On Lyman there will be.
Keefe: Yeah, okay.
McDonald: Any further questions of the applicant?
Ben Merriman: Thank you.
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McDonald: Okay. Thank you very much Mr. Merriman. With that I will throw the meeting
open to public comment and what I would ask is that you come up to the microphone. Address
the commission. Give us your name and address as it relates to your interest within this plan and
everything. So whoever wants to come up first. And also, as you're doing so, it's 10:00 right
now. What I would ask is that you not repeat the same things over and over again and I would
hope that you all would have gotten together and you've got your lists down and thank you very
much.
LuAnn Sidney: Yes, I should be passing out coffee right now. Chair and Planning
Commissioners, my name is LuAnn Sidney and I live at 2431 Bridle Creek Trail, and I'll put this
up here so that can be projected. I live in the Trotters Ridge development and my house is the
fifth house on the south side of the neighborhood and I would be directly impacted by this
proposed development. Last Thursday evening a number of neighbors got together and met
about the proposed development and to discuss the staff report. I will be speaking on behalf of
the neighbors for a few minutes when I present a request concerning buffering and restrictions to
the PUD. First let me set the stage by showing you an aerial view of the.
McDonald: Excuse me ma'am. Would you point out your house on the map?
LuAnn Sidney: Oh sure. Right here. First let me set the stage, like I said, to show you this
aerial view of the Trotters Ridge and Stone Creek neighborhoods and the industrial development
in Chaska to our west, southwest and southeast. Trotters Ridge and Stone Creek are truly on the
edge of residential civilization in Chanhassen and we truly need some relief from the intense
industrial development near us in the proposed development we're talking about tonight. This is
why we're asking for increased buffering and restrictions to the PUD. We really need a
reasonable and satisfactory transition between these vastly different land uses, industrial and
residential to maintain the quality of life in our neighborhoods. And I'll point out a few features
here on this map. Hope they can hear me. We have Trotters Ridge to the north. And this is
Galpin Boulevard. Right in here we have the subject property, and then Stone Creek to the east.
Please note the intense, large area of industrial development and I think that really points out the
fact that we are really just, well we really need some kind of reasonable transition between these
uses. And also as I was listening tonight the commissioners did point out justifiably that we have
some very severe traffic concerns too in this area because of all the development in Chaska and
we're adding to it with this development as well as the school just south of Stone Creek. So
when the neighbors met, as I said we discussed the staff report and we would like to present a
request in the form of condition amendments to the development design standards. Hopefully
this will be useful to you on the Planning Commission. Be both concise and time saving and
obviously I've had experience as a Planning Commissioner and I was hoping that these would
help you and you wouldn't have to formulate conditions as you go here when you start
discussing them. I'm wondering if you received the revised list today? Everyone. Yes, I believe
so. We'll go through here and there should be some highlighted areas. Bolded areas in the
conditions that we'll point to this as a revised version of today. In condition 1 of the staff report
we'd like to increase, and this will be added to the current condition. Increase spruce, ash,
maples and lindens to the east and north side, including Outlot B of the development to exceed
buffer yard requirements by 100%. And on the north of buffer yard D, which the developer has
selected the 20 foot depth, we'd like 40 feet and more trees at the same intensity. And on the
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east side it's buffer yard D at 15 feet depth and we'd like 30 feet of the same intensity tree
plantings in that area. Plantings along Outlot B should be outside the wetland buffer zones, and
we noted in the landscape plan, which I don't have marked a sheet whatever, that they had noted
that they were planting the buffer zone which is a no no. Okay, condition 3, we'd like to
increase the buffer zone around trees and that's to protect the root system of these mature oaks.
We have a lot of mature oaks in that area. And I'd like to see and we would all like to see I
should say, the people who met, increasing the space between the tree and where any Bobcat
might run. Okay, condition 5. Trees should be planted beyond the wetland buffer zones. I know
that that needs to be revised from the site plan from the developer. 23, condition 23. If you look
on sheet 5 of 13, and you do have a reduction in your packet, ... the retaining wall on the outside
line of Building 6 be moved outside of the 100 foot buffer zone on that side. Now maybe Bob
would look at that. I wondering if you can pass this around. Okay, so the retaining wall we're
concerned about is that this is impacting mature trees, and especially impacting the folks on Lots
1 and 2. So we'd like to have this retaining wall moved so that we can save more trees on that
northeast comer and east side of Building 6. And even more down there. Now we talked a bit
about.
Keefe: How far are you talking about because it's a 100 foot setback and then, so you're talking
what?
LuAnn Sidney: 200 feet. Yes, we'd like a large buffer there. Especially if we're going to ask
for increased plantings, it makes sense that we'd have a larger buffer zone. Okay, 26. We talked
about the moving the primary access to Lyman Boulevard. Because of the intense, potentially
intense development of this property we'd like to see a secondary safety access road be provided
and that could be the Galpin entrance, but that would not be the primary entrance. We'd like to
move the primary access to Lyman Boulevard and again it's really a concern about safety and
Commissioner Larson mentioned the fact that we're going from a residential street intersection
to an industrial street right across the road, and that seems unsuitable. And why not put all the
trucks on Lyman? That's what it was built for. And will be expanded to accommodate. And
also I received a note from one of the neighbors that there is a current need for marked
crosswalks on Galpin. And I guess that's more of a note to staff. 36(h), construction of the rock
entrance must be off Lyman, again pointing to Lyman Boulevard as the primary access and all
construction traffic shall stay off Galpin. And then 51 we also reiterate the concerns we have
about moving the primary access to Lyman Boulevard. When I asked staff a few questions and
we did talk about the fact that the plan doesn't show a water surface stub for Lot 6, I guess
there's a little bit of juggling of the shared driveways to make it more symmetrical for Lot 5. But
I guess what was most concerning to me was learning that potentially what we're talking about
in off site grading, we're actually talking about grading to provide the berm... We're showing
potentially grading actually into Lots 1 through 4, and I don't think people want that. So I think
that really speaks to the fact that we need a larger buffer there and I'm sure a number of the
neighbors will be addressing the water issue after me but I need some relief here. There's no
reason to encroach onto the property owners back yards to put this berm in, so we need more
space. And we do have the new condition 53. And then we also thought of some additional
conditions we'd like you to consider recommending. Truly we need 100% screening from the
north boundary properties and like I said, we'd like the buffer zone to be increased to at least 200
feet. And that's condition, new condition 54. 55. The applicant shall reduce the square footage
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of building 6 to a maximum of 50,000 square feet and provide appropriate articulation using
staff's term, especially on the north property boundary . We'd like to see the heights of buildings
5 and 6 not to exceed one story, plus whatever screening or parapet might be there for the roof
top equipment. The applicant shall add a minimum 15 foot berm and again landscaping to
provide screening for Outlot B on Lots 1 through 4 in Trotters Ridge. This would be a mixture
of trees and also the berm along Lots 1 through 4 will have grass and be mowed and maintained.
That's what the neighbors who own those properties would like. So not a natural berm but
something that would be maintained and have grass. We haven't gotten word about Outlot B.
What they would like to see if they want a natural berm or manicured so that will have to be
addressed later. 57. That has to do with our property. The silt fence or tree protection fence on
the north boundary, we'd like that at least 10 feet away from the drip line of a large oak that we
have in our back yard. This tree is a 40 inch diameter white oak with a 60 foot crown and we've
been babying it for many years and spending a lot of money on it and I'd like to see tree
protection fencing way away from the dripline and also not extend the berm into our lot area but
in the berm at Lot 4. 58. I added, which is saying, directing the fact that we want a permanent
conservation easement. I guess I'm still confused because we have options given in the
conditions to condition 53 that it be city owned or private owned. Whatever it is, it should be
permanent. Outlot not to be developed. Okay, 59. Keep the retaining wall 10 feet outside the
drip line of existing trees on the northeast corner, and I think that whole area needs to be
revisited. We have some encroachment on trees and with a little bit of give from the developer
we could save more trees if we increase that buffer. And move the retaining walls. 60. Again
we'd like a larger buffer. Increase it from 50 feet to 100 feet along the east side of Galpin and
add more trees. And I added as I was writing here and this is my contribution here this evening,
is that the applicant will conduct a traffic study based on current uses in Chanhassen and similar
industrial developments to include the impact of the proposed school and the new Town and
Country development because I can see where we're going to have a heck of a lot of a traffic on
Galpin as a result of those developments. Plus we already have what we have with Chaska
industrial parks. So you have the power as the Planning Commission to recommend to City
Council these changes which will help both us and the city. And I'd like you to consider these
new conditions. And we also as a neighborhood discussed some other conditions which Bob
Generous suggested should really be a part of the development design standards and this sets the
tone for ongoing site plan reviews that will be, being brought before you. We'd like to see the
applicant limit the hours of operation of any business from 7:00 to 6:00 p.m. and that would be
changing in the staff report under the development design standards the permitted uses. And also
under that same section, business type shall not include conference, convention centers, hotels,
motels, or research labs. Now the reason for research labs is we have enough odors and fan
noise already. We don't need any more so anything that would contribute to that, please you
know make that a use that's not permitted. Also the applicant shall not permit outdoor storage of
any kind. We'd like that as part of the prohibitive, and I created a new section ancillary uses.
That's an eyesore and it really will be detracting from the views from our neighborhood.
Businesses shall not have outdoor paging systems. Again another prohibitive use. We're dealing
with that already from Chaska. The applicant shall provide for additional sounding proofing
materials in Building 5 and 6. That can be added into any building materials and design. And
also the light level for site lighting shall be zero. Not one-half. Zero foot candles at the north
property line. That's under H(4), lighting. And really the light pollution is really severe from
Chaska. Just no lights if we can, I'd love that, no lights in the development but at least no lights.
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I don't think that that would go over but at least no, we can minimize the light pollution at the
property line, and also no lighted signs, either externally or internally lighted will be permitted,
and you can add that into the signage part. Also another personal note, under E. Building
Material and Design. E(5). Concrete shall be finished in stone or textured. I just really have a, I
don't know, I do not want to see painted concrete buildings anymore. It just doesn't do a thing
for me and I don't want to look out from my back yard and see that as well. So anyone I thought
I'd end with that. Maybe just read a comment from our meeting and we came up with kind of
our statement concerning this development. The Trotters Ridge development requests special
consideration and a reasonable transition between the residential industrial areas due to the fact
that we are being made an island of residential within a sea of industrial development, which is
truly true after you look at that aerial view. Residents chose to live in this area for the natural
beauty in the area provided by mature growth of trees and safety of the area for our children. So
be happy to answer any questions if you have any.
McDonald: No questions. Who'd like to speak next? Thank you very much for coming up. Go
ahead. If you could just state your name and where you live.
Mike Krych: Yes Mr. Chair. Chairman and members of the commission. My name is Mike
Krych. I live at 2127 Boulder Road in the Stone Creek neighborhood. Ijust wanted to add a few
things that she had mentioned from prior to me but a couple things I did sit through a good
portion of this meeting and I was encouraged to hear the discussion regarding planning, zoning
and land use as it related to the other developments that you were looking at east of Audubon and
south of Lyman, and specifically as that related this idea of blending. And I think that's very
important component as it relates to this specific development that's being proposed here as well.
As you drive along Galpin from Highway 5 down to Lyman it's essentially all single family
housing there with the exception of some multifamily housing on the west side of Galpin up
towards Highway 5, and then there's the Bluff Creek Elementary School. And that is there when
you get down to Lyman, there's some natural breaks. I guess in terms ofthe land use, I don't see
this particular parcel falling into that concept of blending and I would have a slightly different
term for it in that what we've got here is several neighborhoods that do have some connectivity
and I think that's very important here. That we maintain a sense of continuity and connectivity
between neighborhoods. And this, by introducing this specific type of development being
industrial use, it doesn't provide that sense of blending or connectivity. Again if you look at the
aerial maps of the city, again south of Lyman that's I think obviously natural break from going
from residential to actually the industrial south. There's much development along those lines
anyways. I think the other natural break is at where the wetlands occur on the west side of this
proposed lot. In terms of the natural break from the industrial uses to the west, versus as you
travel east towards the intersection at Galpin, that is a dramatic change and again you're entering
into a neighborhood that's very much residential. I would like you to just consider that intensely
as you look at this and review this. Our neighborhood, Stone Creek we put together some issues
that I'm not going to go through. I think you probably have a copy of it. It was again issues
regarding proposed development and there are some city planning zoning issues as well, but I
wanted to just make a couple of comments regarding that and it had to do with good design and
providing quality solutions as they relate to land use, aesthetics, safety and function. I think
we've talked quite a bit. You have brought up a number of those points as well so, but in terms
of land use, there needs to be an appropriateness of the contacts in the surroundings, you know
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professional service types of buildings. Might be okay. I guess I'm looking at this realistically
that something's going to happen there. So I'd like to make sure that that quality of the project
and the design of that hits on all these points that the previous speaker was talking about. Just
one quick thing regarding aesthetics with industrial buildings. I would actually like to propose
an amendment as well that speaks to the materials and character of the architecture. That it
sticks with (a), quality materials. Not secondary types of materials and I view rock face block or
painted block, you know colored block, that's all concrete block no matter which way you slice
it. And I think it's a distant second cousin to the materials such as brick, stucco, architectural
pre-cast, even metal if it's used in the right way. So, and then I guess I have a couple of specific
questions. I'm not looking for answers but one has to do with the retaining wall as proposed in
the middle of the site. I think on the south edge of Outlot C, well can I ask. What is the height
of that wall? Okay. As soon as you exceed a height of 4 feet or so, then it has to be engineered
and typically often times has to have tie backs into the landscaping so you're not only, you're not
just building a wall at that point necessarily. If you have to have tie backs, it does affect the
grade beyond where the wall is which could possibly mean going into the tree line, into the drip
line and affecting the trees that are there so even though I respect the idea of trying to protect the
trees that are there, I ask that it, we be careful in terms of how it's engineered so that it actually
serves it's purpose. And I guess with that I guess that's all I have for tonight so thank you for
listening.
McDonald: Thank you very much. Next. Ma' am.
Christine Fischer: Hi, I'm Christine Fischer. Sorry, wake up everybody. I'm at 2407 Bridle
Creek Trail and I just, I'm going to be very brief. LuAnn articulately represented my neighbors
and I in her comments to us but 2407 is Lot 2 and so we are directly impacted by this and just a
couple comments on the building height. I encourage you to seriously, I'm one who's requesting
the one story height on this because I'm looking out my windows at, I don't want to be seeing
the Great Wall of China as I'm looking out, so that will definitely impact us directly. Another
comment on the water. The developer indicated that he wasn't aware that there was any standing
water issues. But that is our lot that, Lot 2 and the drainage pipe that he's referring to is there
and after a significant rain we do have standing water back there for a while, so there is a
drainage issue there. At this point. And then one other comment that I want to make is about the
safety issue and we talk about the roadway and to the traffic, the increased traffic, and I just want
to make a comment again referring to our neighborhood being in this kind of, this little island by
itself. There are no lighted crosswalks for our kids to get across the road to go to Bluff Creek, to
go to a park. If they go up to the light at Highway 5, there's a sign that says no crossing to cross
the street there. There is not a lighted, so in terms of safety, there isn't a lighted crosswalk for
them and so just increasing the traffic at this point, and we've only got the painted on crosswalks
which you know how effective those are. So those are a couple kind of real specific to our lot
and our situation that I wanted to share with you. So thank you.
McDonald: Thank you. Next ma' am.
Sarah Dale: Hi. Sarah Dale, 2487 Bridle Creek Trail. Our lot is adjacent to lot, to the number 1
that looks out on Outlot B. In the back of Trotters Ridge. And our concern is that we back up to
D.S. Brown, an 80,000 square foot warehouse, industrial site that makes a lot of noise. Has a lot
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of lights and we are now going to be surrounded by a lot of noise, a lot of lights if we have two
industrial complexes on either side of us. It clearly is a very intense, dense development they are
proposing for this site. Building number 6, the front is approximately the same size as the D.S.
Brown building. Square footage wise. In Chaska and that is a huge building. 5, which would be
our view to the south of our lot, over the wetland which has no trees, has only grass, would be
the back wall of Lot 5 and I really do not want a Great Wall of China everywhere I look out my
bedroom and back doors. I just don't think that is fair to the residences of Trotters Ridge. Thank
you.
McDonald: Thank you. Next.
Ron Blum: My name is Ron Blum. I'm at 2081 Stone Creek Drive. Ijust have a couple of
comments to make regarding what I think the implied use of these buildings might be. As I look
at this preliminary plat, it looks like these are set up for multi tenant uses. Most of the back of
these buildings to me indicate that there's a dock door, as many as 5 to 7 dock doors per
building. And not knowing the developers, or I should say from the developer's standpoint, he
probably doesn't know exactly the use of these buildings yet as I think was earlier stated but I
think there's a high potential for not only the 2,600 vehicle traffic but also numerous larger truck
type deliveries and will calls that the developer didn't think are going to happen. Just the
indication that the multiple back doors on all these buildings are susceptible to multi tenant
rather than single tenant use. You're going to have as much as I calculated, if all these dock
doors are used on a regular basis, you know close to 600 deliveries or will calls per day. So the,
that all plays into with the traffic items that were brought up earlier. The noise obviously is an
issue. The comment that the developer made as far as the building heights and the early
suppression fire systems. More and more companies that, I should say more and more building
owners are going to the ESFR type sprinkler systems for the resale value of their building, not
knowing the tenant use or the purchaser of that building down the road. They are putting in
these ESFR systems so that they can better have, have better resale for their buildings so they are
spending the money up front and the ESFR system allows them to pretty much bring in any type
of tenant for high piled storage as he's referred to earlier. So I think the trend is going more and
more to future use of these buildings and I hope you keep that in mind as you look at this long
term use of these buildings because there are some things that should be considered. Obviously
a lot of them are, some of them are visual. Not a lot of the comments that were made that I have
a concern with for on the east side of the development areas as far as the buffer. Not knowing
the street elevation. The building pad elevations and the height of the buildings that are being
allowed by city ordinances. I'll have to do a little more homework on that but I have a concern
for height of building and how the east side is buffered as well as the north side as it relates to
the Stone Creek development. Lighting is an issue. It's already been brought up. The tree
preservation that the developer spoke to earlier. Again is addressing and probably benefiting his
buildings from an aesthetics standpoint and also buffering the north development but speaks very
little to the east side buffer, not knowing what berm elevations are again so I probably need to do
a little more homework with getting the plan in front of you and the elevations and such too. But
most importantly I think the traffic issue has been noted numerous times but I don't know if the
2,600 number that was mentioned earlier plays into the high potential for truck traffic, and it's
going to be not panel truck. It's going to be semi traffic. I can guarantee you that because I have
a little experience with knowledge in these buildings and these buildings are being set up for
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high truck traffic by the indication of the multiple back doors on the buildings as the plan shows.
Thank you.
McDonald: Thank you. Next.
Drew Dingman: Good evening. My name is Drew Dingman. I live at 2403 Bridle Creek Trail
which is Lot 1 in Trotters Ridge. Directly impacted primarily by Building 6, which is the topic
I'd like to discuss briefly tonight. The comment that was made to me last week at the open
house at the rec center was that a lot of thought was put into the design of buildings 2, 3, 7 and 8,
as well as 1 and 2 staggered the loading zone and such to provide screening, and I was impressed
by that consideration. That stands in my opinion in stark contrast to the design of building 6
with it's very long straight edges against both Trotters Ridge and Stone Creek. It's hard to not
take it personally. It's a very dramatic, here's the building and I struggle with that. Both in our
neighborhood as well as at Stone Creek. If you look at the, I'm not sure what's available
visuall y but if you look at this design here, there's a great deal of pre-existing brush and trees
along this entire, or where the parking lot is designed to be. I guess I ask the commission to
consider requesting that building 6 be redesigned in the spirit of building say 3 or 7 such that it's
a much smaller footprint. It also provides a much smaller front edge to both neighborhoods. It
would allow the parking lot that currently is providing a terrible view to the Stone Creek
neighborhood, would allow that to move back to the south or even to the west, tucked in. And it
would also limit those straight edges that I think are unsightly and are creating a lot of the angst
and a lot of the discussion about buffers here tonight. My second request would be that, not to
reopen the whole access road issue, but real briefly I would ask that the commission either
contact the county on our behalf and just ask that a modicum of logic be used. I think the
comments that were related here earlier I would echo those completely that the intersection of
residential and industrial is really not logical. The gentleman from Stone Creek mentioned flow
and Galpin from north to south is very residential. Lyman from east to west is very industrial. It
makes much more sense for the industrial access to be on Lyman simply from a flow perspective
as. . . from an aesthetic perspective so thank you for your consideration.
McDonald: Thank you. Anyone else? Yes sir.
Roger Schmidt: My name is Roger Schmidt and I live at 8301 Galpin Boulevard. That would be
the property right across the street from Trotters Ridge. East across Galpin from Trotters Ridge,
and actually most everything that I had concern about was addressed tonight but and Ijust want
to reissue, or reiterate what the last gentleman said too that Galpin Boulevard is essentially, as far
as traffic goes, is essentially residential and Lyman is commercial so it just doesn't make sense
but I think staff can tell you this, but I'll pass it on too so make sure you know but when you
come to Galpin Boulevard, there's school bus stops on that road now. From a safety standpoint.
As far as I know, I don't know of any on Lyman. There's, if you're coming from the north on
Galpin to the turn off going to this development, you're coming over a pretty good sized grade
and the traffic on Galpin is I think a 45 miles per hour speed limit. But there is a lot of it going a
little faster than that so I think that there's a safety issue as you come over this grade where you
turn, make your right hand turn into this development. And I think, well as far as on Lyman
Boulevard, I think that's due for an upgrade if!, I think I've heard that and so if it's, if it isn't set
up now to handle that kind of traffic, I would think when they upgrade it they should be able to
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get it to the point where you could put the entrance off of Lyman instead of Galpin. And the
only other thing I'll say about traffic is that when I pull out of my driveway now and turn north
to go up 5 and I've got a little hill behind me, people come from the south and if I turn up here
and by the time I get up to my 45 mile per hour speed, you know I've probably got like 2 or 3
people right on my tail already so these people are coming in a lot faster than probably what the
speed limit is, so. Okay, then LuAnn mentioned about hours of operation within the
development and I don't know what, if the city has any standards but how about hours of
operation for the construction part of this. You know for re-grading. Putting up the buildings
and stuff like this, I would think that too that there should be some kind of limits put on the
operation there. Probably very similar to what they do for you know what she proposed for the
use of the buildings after they've been put up. And sitting there I was wondering, there's an
awful lot of screening going on here with berms and trees, and I'm wondering who is responsible
for keeping that up once it's in place. In other words, you know we had a hot spell. Getting up
there and watering the trees. Is that the developers you know, and perpetually. I mean not only
for the first year or second year or third or fourth year. Who does it? The city? The developer?
Or it certainly can't be the residents around it or people who own those lots, so there's got to be
some, you know some kind of control of maintaining that and if trees die, replace them. Or if
trees die as a result of construction, you know getting too close to roots and stuff like that. I
think there should be something put into the plan that those get replaced properly too and so on.
That's all I have. Okay, thank you.
McDonald: Thank you. Anyone else? Sir.
Jim Leonard: I'll keep it brief because I've been here since 7:00 waiting for a chance to talk. I
know everybody wants to go home. My name's Jim Leonard. I live at 2360 Stone Creek Drive.
Second house I on the left. Okay, so this directly impacts me quite a bit. Just recently moved to
Chanhassen. Purchased the house back in March. Chose Chanhassen as a place that I wanted to
live. Ended up in Carver County. Okay. So my loyalties are with the city as we're talking about
this. There's two points that I really have concern about. One I'll address to the developer.
Those trees in the southeast comer, you're taking out too many. You need to do something to
save some more of those trees that are over there. We've talked about all the other areas. My
neighbors from the other, from Trotters Ridge and our neighborhood, we talked about the rest of
it. I trust you as our chosen representatives will make the right decisions to protect the things
that need to be protected, but let's look at those trees in the southeast comer. Secondly, we need
to get this thing exited out onto Lyman. I mean Galpin is just the wrong place for that. There's
too many kids in the neighborhoods. There's way too much stuff there, like I said. I chose to
live in Chanhassen. I live in Carver County as a result of that. If it's a dispute with the County
we've got to figure out how to handle this. I know we need to co-exist but we need to handle
this and have it exit out into the right place. I'm all in favor of economic development. I
understand the needs for these things but we've got to make sure that makes sense for the
community. Thank you very much.
McDonald: Thank you. Next.
JoEllen Radermacher: Good evening. My name is JoEllen Radermacher. I live at 2479 Bridle
Creek Trail. I'm number lIon the plan. I look right out onto Outlot B and it is a wildlife
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preserve area. I do ask you to take into consideration the setbacks that we have requested and
the berm requirements that we have requested. There's a multitude of wildlife back there and
when I look out my kitchen window or I sit on my deck, right now we have a beautiful view out
there and I hate to think of looking out there and seeing a building out there. And without a
berm or some kind of control, that's exactly what we would see. We have, as I mentioned
previously, we have a multitude of wildlife out there which includes, we have deer, pheasant,
ducks, including wood ducks, even the pileated woodpeckers, and of course the others, raccoons
and everything else too. But we all as a neighborhood have come to enjoy them and talk about
them frequently. I hope you take into consideration the impact of all of this on our wildlife and
also on our views that we see. Thank you.
McDonald: Thank you. Next.
Sara Morlock: Good evening. My name is Sara Morlock. I live at 2325 Boulder Road, and I'll
show you... My lot is this one right here. So we too are directly impacted by the proposed
development across the street, basically in our back yard. The picture I passed out to you shows
you the existing trees today and as you can see what they are proposing keeping is minimal. And
they'll replace it with 2% inch saplings which isn't going to provide any kind of decent
screening for our back yards, and these are our back yards. So I really ask that you thoughtfully
consider your decision making regarding this, the proposed development. Thank you.
McDonald: Thank you. Next.
Peggy Emerson: Hi. I'm Peggy Emerson from 8409 Stone Creek Court and I'm on a committee
at Bluff Creek Elementary and I just happened to see the long term plan for the school. That will
either be a middle school or a high school within, I think it was 5 or 8 years and I could be totally
wrong on that. But I know that one thing that they were planning on was having a bridge for
children, pedestrians to go over the train tracks, so that would make all those kids you know go
up Galpin and.
Aanenson: There's a railroad trestle underneath the tracks already.
Peggy Emerson: No, on Lyman. You know there's a train that goes right across Lyman.
Aanenson: Yeah, there's a track, the trestle that goes underneath.
Peggy Emerson: So the school you know would be down Lyman. A bridge going along side
Lyman that will cross, let the children cross over the.
Aanenson: We're still looking at trying to do something underneath too.
Peggy Emerson: Oh, okay.
Aanenson: Yeah, we're working with Steve Pumper on that too to go underneath. There's some
grade issues there.
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Peggy Emerson: Okay, but then this goes to the traffic issue. I mean if you have semi's turning
that comer right and going up north on Galpin, I'm thinking it'd still be a problem with all the
children traffic, and especially with Lifetime Fitness, you know maybe the over 12 year old kids,
you know that can go there by themselves, they can ride their bike over or whatever and then
there's going to be the crossing Galpin problem. Thank you.
McDonald: Thank you. Next. Okay, no more comments? Okay. Then the public meeting is
closed and at this point I will bring it back up to the commissioners for comments. And start
with Debbie. Or would did rather I go to the other end?
Larson: No, that's alright. I'm getting punchy. It's almost 11:00. As this sits, I'm not
comfortable with it. I know there's a lot of thought that has gone into trying to preserve trees but
I think not enough thought was put into the neighborhoods that surround this. The traffic. The
streets and I tend to disagree with the county that this is the best exit for this particular
subdivision going into a residential area. I really strongly oppose that and as it stands right now I
don't think I can go along with this. That's all I have to say.
McDonald: Okay. Dan.
Keefe: Yeah, I have a question of staff. Follow-up question. In regards to the access to Lyman,
you know one of the things I'm thinking is Chaska's business park, which is directly west of this
empties onto Lyman. They've got a big access onto Lyman, and the county has allowed them to
have access of a commercial industrial facility onto Lyman. And I wonder why they wouldn't
allow Chanhassen to also have an access onto Lyman for it's commercial industrial use, and
maybe they don't want more commercial industrial use on Lyman. Even if they go to upgrade
Lyman to four lanes, they're still going to have to accommodate Chaska's business park of all
the trucks and traffic which is going in and out of that, you know that. I mean there's a lot more
industrial and commercial there than is going to be in this park. So I don't know what we can do
to press the issue. I don't know if we press it all the way or you know ended up berm, or I don't
know. It's just an area where I feel fuzzy for me. I guess what I'd say is I'm not in support of
pushing all this traffic out onto Galpin, and I live right next door to that development in Chaska
and I see them push all their traffic out there, I think they ought to be able to accommodate the
amount of traffic out of here onto Lyman like they do out of that park. In regards to, so in
regards to the road I guess I would want to see a revisit on that. The, and just one more
statement on that. It would be, you know I agree with the residents in regards to, I don't think
it's the industrial residential mix in regards to traffic going out onto Galpin really makes sense,
just especially given in light of the neighboring property just to the west. Neighboring
development to the west. In regards to, I would potentially be in support of this development
this evening in regards to, if we could revisit the road and then what I'd like to do is to look at a
number of different things in regards to berming and buildings. One, I would be in support of a,
if we limited Outlot 6 to something less than 35 feet. I think it would be either a 1 or a 2,
possibly a 2 story on Outlot 6. I'm thinking something in the line of, I don't know what the
building is, 12 feet? Is that what we're looking per story. Plus a 4 foot parapet. Is that kind of
what it is? So you'd be 16 feet or 28 feet. I think probably 16 feet. And then, and I would like
to see the berm increased and I would like to accommodate what the residents have proposed on
that one which would be a 15 foot berm which I think pushes the setback to 125 feet versus 100
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feet on the north side. I would like to see the, one other. I'd like to increase, you talked about
increasing the number of trees on Outlot 5. Or not outlot 5 but Lot 5. And maybe you have a
better feel for that in terms of the number of trees but there's reasonable screening on that given
the, it looks like it's an over 200 foot setback to the building, or it looks like it's over 200 feet
from the lot line to the building with appropriate screening there we might be alright. And then I
would like to see more trees saved on the east side. So those are my comments at this point.
McDonald: Okay. Deborah.
Zorn: My overall impression of this proposal is, it's quite difficult for me to find the blend, as
many people have discussed this evening. In particular the access point. If we were to work
through an access point, that would make much more sense off Galpin as I'm a resident on north
of Highway 5 Galpin so I can feel what the residents are expressing this evening. There is a
concern with the Galpin entrance. If we were to work through a Lyman access point, my
concern then would be maintaining the integrity of the trees along the boulder walls. A lot of the
comments that have been made this evening. Something that hasn't been discussed as much but
simply sound proofing and having that be a great part of the purpose of the berms and how to do
that. The size of building 6 and I would agree with Dan's comments on the 16 foot proposal.
And again the walking paths, lighted paths. All aspects related to that. I think those are my main
concerns moving forward with this proposal and I guess encouraging the developer to rethinking
maybe the best use of that building 6 lot and how he can, or my standpoint I think a residents is
to make that much smaller, which I guess makes that a little less desirable to develop but that
greatly impacts the amount of trucks and other traffic that would be coming through as that is the
largest I believe building on the site. Moving towards building 7 or building 3, that's been
mentioned this evening. I think that's maybe what would mirror the rest of the proposal and so I
really think Lot 6 or building 6 right now just doesn't make much sense to me. So that's it for
now.
McDonald: Okay. Kurt.
Papke: I think I'm going to be a little bit of a contrarian tonight. Several of the residents have
pointed out both audibly and in writing that they feel that for instance Trotters Ridge is a bit of
an island of residential within an industrial office park. To me it seems, it feels more like a fault
line. Okay, we've got the residential continental plate meeting up with the industrial office
continental plate and we're getting the Rocky Mountains kind of erupting between the two. And
I think a lot of our issues come around to the fact that there's no transitioning here. I mean it's
just you know very nice homes to boom, office park and unfortunately you already have that.
You already have that abutting up to the Chaska office park so it's, this is just intensifying an
issue that I think already exists. I think where my contrarian views are going to come into play
is, I feel very strongly that we're going to have to connect to Galpin. You know we can debate
whether an industrial office park meeting up with Stone Creek Drive on Galpin right there is a
good thing or not but I think ultimately when this parcel gets developed, that's where it's going
to have to come in. You know from what we've seen of the other developments that have come
through, I just don't see Carver County you know letting us put another outlet onto Lyman. I
just, I think Chaska gets away with it because they meet the list. They're more than 1,000 feet or
quarter mile what it is apart. That's why they do it because they have the spacing and this one,
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we either rip up a wetland or we come out onto Galpin, so you know I don't see a way out of that
Impasse.
Keefe: Except the Galpin entrance is not in conformance with the county guidelines as well.
Papke: No, Galpin is okay. I beg your problem? The north/south connection is too close or
what's the issue?
Keefe: From Lyman to the entrance it's not long enough already anyway. So that one's not...
McDonald: We will defer to city engineer on this.
Morris: For clarification, the quarter mile spacing is the city's guideline in the city code. And
that's correct, the one on Galpin doesn't meet the quarter mile access but the city code also
stipulates that access onto an arterial street such as Galpin should be made at an existing cross
road which the existing cross road would be Stone Creek Drive.
Papke: Okay. Another thing to consider is that the Chaska residents, or the residents of Stone
Creek and Trotters Ridge and also along Galpin are also going to use Lyman so they're, you
know some percentage of the time so they're going to have to cope with whatever additional
intersection comes out to Galpin. And in terms of butting up industrial office with residential, I
believe we have some similar situations up on Audubon inbetween 5 and Lyman where we have
residential on the east side. We have industrial office on the west side.
Aanenson: Yes. We also have it off of Dell Road up against Eden Prairie.
Papke: Right. So we do have several precedents for this occurring and are we aware of any
safety issues surrounding that at this point?
Aanenson: No, but I would like to, as long as you opened up that topic. And the issue came up
of who's going to maintain. On the Eden Prairie side, those neighbors actually worked to
increase the buffer. Provided land. They maintain their side. It's difficult, there's something
we need to be honest and discuss. It's difficult for a developer to go on somebody else's
property to try to maintain it. That is going to be a problem. So what we've worked on on those
is the property owners manage their own, especially when you're negotiating because this is a
PUD and it got loaded up. The developer could come in and do a straight subdivision and if it
didn't meet any ordinance, you'd be compelled to approve it. So now we ask them to do a PUD.
Now we've gone kind of way over on the other side and somewhere we need to find kind of that,
because if we're going to go 125 feet, then someone needs to take responsibility. The person
that buys that business, they're responsible for sprinkling that, which we would require because
otherwise it's not going to live. Especially when we're on that tall. Somebody needs to take
responsibility for the other side.
Papke: I have a question about that setback. The Chanhassen City Code here, if I read it, we've
got, correctly for lOP we've got a minimum setback of 50 feet when it abuts a residential district.
And then we have 100 foot buffer yard required when the interface occurs on intemallot lines.
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And the next paragraph says the buffer yard is an additional setback. It is to be cumulatively
calculated with required setbacks outlined above. Now that sounds to me like 150 foot setback,
if I read it. Or am I reading it wrong?
Aanenson: We have not interpreted it that way.
Papke: Cumulative says add them up.
Aanenson: Correct, but the two other examples I gave you are not 150 feet.
Papke: So, but you know the way I read it, I would interpret this situation as 150 the way I read
the code. I mean, you know. For lOP so you know I would be supportive of 150 foot setback on
that line if that's, you know we're the Planning Commission. If that's how we read the city
code, we either got to change the code or we've got to lay it down that way. Couple other issues.
On the wetland areas, I'm not real in favor of berming along the edges of that. You know water
quality, the wetland person isn't here tonight but I suspect their opinion wouldn't be real
favorable with putting a big berm right next to a wetland there. I mean that would, I imagine that
would really mess with the drainage along that wetlands so you know a couple trees or
something like that might work. Oh let's see. I think I'd be in favor of somewhat more limiting
the uses in here. I think the residents pointed out, I think motels/hotels would be a very poor use
of this area. It doesn't look like that's what's being suggested but I don't have any issue with
eliminating that. I think we've done a good job of keeping those sorts of things along Highway 5
and I think that's a good thing. I'd also like to take out contractor's yards because those are
notorious noise makers and early, you know early morning noise makers. I think if we have 150
foot setback on Lot 6 and we do, the developers sound very amenable to doing very intensive
landscaping and given that additional size we might be able to get a berm to the point where
from ground level you can't see the roof line anymore so I think if we had a condition like that in
here, you know I think that'd be reasonably, reasonably palatable.
Keefe: At 35 feet?
Papke: Yeah. So I guess I'm not as pessimistic about this proposal as perhaps my fellow
commissioners. I really think the developer did a great job here with Outlot C. I mean that's, for
a commercial development to come in with that kind of a dedication and buffer zone and tree
conservation, you know the alternative could be a lot worst here. Okay, so I think we've got to
be realistic that if we deny this proposal and City Council denies this proposal, the next time
you're in here, you're going to have a lot longer faces potentially, okay. So do keep that in
mind.
Aanenson: Commissioner Papke, can I just ask a question?
Papke: Yeah.
Aanenson: Mr. Mayer who owns the property right now has a contractor's yard. That is one of
the desired owners right now so obviously that.
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Papke: That ain't going to fly.
Aanenson: It's in the southeast comer and... so I just, he is one ofthe owners. I just need to...
Papke: Well okay. You know if it won't fly, it won't fly.
Aanenson: I just want to point that out for the record.
Papke: No, I'm glad you brought that up. That could obviously be an issue for that. That's all I
have to say.
Aanenson: Yeah, that's his business there right now.
McDonald: Does anyone else want to add to their comments or anything? Well, I'm not sure
quite where to start either. If we adopt the proposals that have been put in here, I don't think this
becomes developable land. You squeezed it down to where there's nothing left. I tend to agree.
I've been out to the site and looked at it. I can't see how what's there right now is better than
what's being proposed, and I do look at, I understand about the buffering between residential and
industrial. We'll have to tell you about that one but yes, the land will be developed and you may
not like what goes in there on the next go around. I think that we should jump on the offer of
limiting building 6 to 35 feet. If we can do some things as far as the berming, we can minimize
any of the impact there as far as the views of the neighbors and try to mitigate that as much as
possible. The other issues, I'll go along with what the commission wants but it seems as though
if we put too many restrictions on this it's just going to stay what it is and I don't know what he's
going to turn into from that standpoint but I mean you go out there and you've got rolls of tar
laying around. You've got gravel pits. You've got all kinds of stuff, and what they're,
especially the area there to the northeast is, it's not high quality wetlands I would say. So, and
the whole issue about Galpin versus Lyman. Okay, if we put the exit on Lyman, the only time
anybody's going to be going up Galpin is to get to 5. They're still going to be going up Galpin
A venue. Most of the turns are going to be down to Lyman, which are to the south, which are
away from the residential areas. These are county arterial roads. They do not differentiate
between residential or commercial. They're arterial roads and we have no control over that. We
have been through this before about exits onto highways. We went through it with the State
about 41 because of, oh the farm. I forget the name of it now.
Larson: Yoberry.
McDonald: Yeah, we went through it there. You're not going to get these, you're not going to
get that changed. They have done studies. They've got rules. They've got regulations and they
do not bend. We've already been through this on a number of different projects. Well it's the
county too. I mean they follow the same thing. So I mean I'm in favor of some of these
restrictions. Others I have to tell ya, if you start restricting hours, I don't know who's going to
be able to go in there and do a business. We have to be realistic. These are businesses. People
will go in there to make money. Yes, they can't be hotels. They can't be anybody that generates
loud music, stamping plants or anything such as that. You should get good neighbors and I think
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you're entitled to that and part ofthe restrictions that we've put on here about who's going to go
in should help to ensure you get some of that. Yes.
Papke: A comment about hours. Something else for surrounding homeowners to consider. If
we restrict hours, that intensifies the traffic flow during rush hour, okay by not allowing a second
or third shift. That means everybody goes in at 7:00 or 8:00 and everybody comes out at 5:00,
and so you know, yes. There will be a little bit more noise at night but it also makes the traffic
problem worst so you're kind of trading off one problem for another.
McDonald: And I guess the other thing, the question I was asking about a traffic light. I mean
that's one of the things that. Someone want to make a comment?
Audience: I just, I guess if you're going to have the possibility of being able to have three
shifts... wouldn't you have three different, you know you could possibly have 300% more
employees going there. Logically that would be the next step so.
McDonald: One of the things that I wanted to get back to was a traffic light there and I would
hope that the city will follow up and we will push, if it's required, we will look at putting one in
there. That will also help the issue there. Otherwise yeah, we're going to create a big problem
come 5:00 and 7:00 with everybody in the world trying to come in and out ofthere. And I guess
that's it. I mean at this point I'll throw it open for a motion from the commissioners.
Audience: If people have a question...
McDonald: No, the public meeting is over.
Papke: Okay. I'll attempt to stumble through this one. Okay, I make a motion that we
recommend rezoning of the property located within the Chanhassen West Business Park from
Agricultural Estate, A2 to Planned Unit Development, PUD incorporating the development
design standards contained within the staff report based upon the findings of fact attached to the
report. Second motion, the Chanhassen Planning Commission, I recommend approval of the
Preliminary Plat for Chanhassen West Business Park, plans prepared by Schoell and Madsen
dated June 17, 2005 based on the findings of fact attached to the report and subject to the
following conditions, 1 through 53, with your additional one Bob. Is that correct?
Generous: That's 1 through 53.
Papke: 1 through 53. I'd like to add condition number 54. That in the northeast comer abutting
Lot 6, that we follow the city code and have 150 foot setback. Condition 55. We restrict use for
no motels/hotels. Condition 56. The combination of the berm height and landscaping and the
height of the building on Lot 6 be such that you cannot see the roof line while standing on the
ground on Lot number 2 of Trotters Ridge. And condition number 57. We resolve, they work
with city staff to resolve any drainage issues with Lot number 2 in Trotters Ridge. Then motion
C. I recommend approval of the wetland alteration.
Keefe: Can we do an additional amendments?
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Papke: Why don't you let me finish then you can toss in your friendlies. I recommend approval
of the wetland alteration permit to fill and alter wetlands within the development, plans prepared
by Schoell and Madsen Inc. dated June 17,2005 subject to conditions 1 through 10. And at that
point I'll entertain friendly amendments.
Keefe: Friendly amendment to B. Increase the tree preservation or landscaping on the east side.
Of the development.
Papke: To what? It has to be somehow.
Keefe: Yeah, right.
Papke: Objective.
Keefe: I'm trying to, what do we say right now in terms of that?
Papke: Did you want to increase it by some percentage beyond the proposed landscape plan as
given on the drawing? There is a drawing. I think it's what, drawing 6 or something like that,
that has, that shows all the landscape plans.
Keefe: The east property line. Well at least bring it up to the required amount. Is that already in
here?
Papke: Yeah, I think that's.
Keefe: Is there a recommendation in here to bring it?
Papke: Yeah, I think it was in there. Yeah, it's number 1. Did you want to go beyond minimum
somehow or what are you proposing?
Keefe: Well, the question is whether the minimum would meet what we want it to do.
McDonald: Well, can I ask a question of city staff on this. I mean we've been through this
before with trees. We have a forester within the city. Aren't there limits as far as the density of
trees that we look at?
Generous: For replanting. New plantings, yes.
McDonald: Right, and as a part of any project, isn't that part of the process as far as going in
there?
Generous: Yes. You would review the landscape plan that looks at the viability of the trees over
a long period.
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McDonald: Okay. And should also look to make sure that it meets city code as far as spacings,
quantity, density and those types of things.
Generous: Yes.
McDonald: Then I'd say it's in there.
Aanenson: Let me just add one other thing. Just for clarification, for everybody's edification
actually. Each one of these projects again has to come back through site plan so you will get
another chance to address screening, buffering, additional landscaping with each plan. Not to
say you don't want to add something more but just to make sure that everybody understands that.
Papke: Sure, sure.
Keefe: Alright, then I'll retract that amendment. But let me take a run at another one. Which
would be to address the access to Lyman with Carver County again.
McDonald: I'm not sure we can do that. That's a condition we're putting on there we have no
control over. I mean we've been through this before with 41 and again that comes down to,
those were interagency.
Papke: Well we can request city staff I would think to revisit it with Carver County engineering.
Aanenson: Sure.
Papke: You know we all understand what the likely outcome is going to be but we can certainly
ask the City Engineer to please revisit this, given the consideration and the fault line that we're
creating here. Okay, I accept that amendment.
McDonald: And then did we say anything about the building height on building 6?
Papke: The condition I put in was a combination of berming, landscaping and limitation of the
height must be such that from ground level on Lot 2 you cannot see the roof line.
McDonald: Okay. So it could be less than 35 feet.
Papke: Could be less. It depends upon how, my preference in these kinds of situations is to, is
to specify the outcome to the developer and then let the developer trade off berming and
landscaping versus building height.
Larson: What about buffering on building 5?
McDonald: Are you proposing an amendment?
Larson: Do I have to?
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Planning Commission Meeting - July 19,2005
McDonald: Well again, all of this is covered by. . .
Larson: Okay, never mind. Alright.
McDonald: Trees and those things.
Keefe: And then they're coming back for each one.
McDonald: And then again, each one is... Okay, so it looks like we will accept amendments, or
conditions 1 through 53 and then we have added 54 through 58. Okay. Do I hear a second?
Keefe: I'll second that.
McDonald: And I have a second.
Papke moved, Keefe seconded that the Planning Commission recommends approval of the
ordinance rezoning the property located within the Chanhassen West Business Park from
Agricultural Estate District (A-2) to Planned Unit Development (pun) incorporating the
development design standards contained within this staff report based on the findings of fact
attached to the report. All voted in favor, except Zorn and Larson who opposed, and the
motion carried with a vote of 3 to 2."
"Papke moved, Keefe seconded that the Planning Commission recommends approval of the
Preliminary Plat for Chanhassen West Business Park, plans prepared by Schoell & Madson,
Inc., dated June 17,2005, based on the findings of fact attached to the report and subject to
the following conditions:
1. Applicant shall increase landscape plantings in the south and east property line bufferyards to
meet minimum requirements. A revised landscape plan shall be submitted before final
approval.
2. Tree protection fencing shall be installed prior to any construction activities. Fencing shall
remain in place until construction is completed.
3. All trees shown as preserved on plans dated 6/17/05 shall be protected. Any trees damaged
or removed shall be replaced at a rate of 2: 1 diameter inches.
4. Wetland replacement shall occur in a manner consistent with the Minnesota Wetland
Conservation Act (MR 8420). A Minnesota LocallStatelFederal Application Form for
WaterIWetland Projects (Parts I and II) shall be submitted for the proposed project. The
application shall include sequencing discussions and sequencing flexibility requests, if
applicable. The applicant must receive approval of a wetland replacement plan prior to or
concurrent with final plat approval and prior to wetland impacts occurring.
5. A wetland buffer 16.5 to 20 feet in width (with a minimum average of 16.5 feet) shall be
maintained around all wetlands and proposed wetland mitigation areas. Wetland buffer areas
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Planning Commission Meeting - July 19,2005
shall be preserved, surveyed and staked in accordance with the City's wetland ordinance. The
applicant shall install wetland buffer edge signs, under the direction of City staff, before
construction begins and must pay the City $20 per sign. All structures (including parking lots)
shall maintain a 40-foot setback from the edge of the wetland buffer.
6. The applicant shall submit a letter of credit equal to 110% of the cost of the wetland creation
(including grading and seeding) to ensure the design standards for the replacement wetland
are met. The letter of credit shall be effective for no less than five years from the date of
final plat approval. The applicant shall submit a cost estimate for wetland creation (including
grading and seeding) so the City can calculate the amount of the wetland creation letter of
credi t.
7. The proposed development shall maintain existing runoff rates and meet NURP standards.
Storm water calculations shall be submitted to ensure the proposed storm water pond is sized
adequately for the proposed development.
8. Stable emergency overflows shall be provided for the proposed pond on site. The emergency
overflows shall be clearly labeled on the plan and a detail is needed. The emergency
overflows may be stabilized with a turf re-enforcement mat or fabric and riprap.
9. Notes on the plan describing timing of temporary stabilization with Type 1 mulch and seed
or erosion control blanket and seed shall be included. The notes shall include timing of
stabilization as well as the rate of mulch application (2 tons per acre, disc anchored).
10. All riprap/fabric at the flared end section shall be installed within 24 hours of flared end
section installation.
11. Erosion control blanket shall be installed on all slopes greater than or equal to 3: 1. All
exposed soil areas shall have temporary erosion protection or permanent cover year round,
according to the following table of slopes and time frames:
Type of Slope
Steeper than 3: 1
10:1 to 3:1
Flatter than 10: 1
Time
7 days
14 ,days
21 days
(Maximum time an area can
remain open when the area
is not actively being worked.)
These areas include constructed storm water management pond side slopes, and any exposed
soil areas with a positive slope to a storm water conveyance system, such as a curb and gutter
system, storm sewer inlet, temporary or permanent drainage ditch or other natural or man
made systems that discharge to a surface water.
12. Erosion control blanket shall be specified in the swale from the flared end section to the
wetland along the west boundary of the site. The blanket specified shall adequately protect
the area from designed velocity and depth of flow. The blanket and seed in the swale shall
be installed within 5 days of culvert installation. Erosion control blanket is recommended for
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Planning Commission Meeting - July 19,2005
the pond slopes from around 952 to 942 contours. All blanket on the plan shall be shown as
a shaded area.
13. Temporary sediment basins shall be installed prior to disturbing upslope areas. The areas of
temporary sediment basins shall be labeled on the plan. A temporary outlet (e.g., a
perforated riser and rock cone) shall be provided for the pond; details should be provided.
Temporary basins shall be constructed in the area of the proposed permanent storm water
pond, the southeast corner of the site prior to discharging to the culvert under Galpin
Boulevard, and possibly in the northwest area of the site to handle water run on from the
north prior to discharge to the wetland.
14. Any and all area inlets or drop inlets in paved areas shall be protected with alternate
controlslWimco details. The engineer shall research and provide alternate designs for
Wimco-type inlet controls to fit the various types of inlets.
15. Additional inlet controls shall be provided for adjacent inlets on Galpin Boulevard and Street
A.
16. Silt fence shall be installed around Outlot A along the east side between the pond the
wetland.
17. Type 1 and Type 2 silt fence locations shall be specified on the plan. Type 2 silt fence shall
be installed around all wetland areas and in the southeast corner of the site to protect the
culvert under Galpin Boulevard. The silt fence shall be extended along the south side to
close the gap in the silt fence.
18. Street cleaning of soil tracked onto public streets shall include daily street scraping and street
sweeping as-needed.
19. The estimated total SWMP fee, due payable to the City at the time of final plat recording, is
$413,661.
20. The applicant shall apply for and obtain permits from the appropriate regulatory agencies (e.g.,
Carver County, Minnesota Pollution Control Agency (NPDES Phase II construction permit),
Minnesota Department of Natural Resources (for dewatering), Army Corps of Engineers) and
comply with their conditions of approval.
21. In lieu of parkland dedication and trail construction, full park fees shall be collected at the
rate in force at the time of final plat for the proposed Chanhassen West Business Park. At
current rates, the park fee would total $359,500 (35.95 x $10,000 per acre).
22. A demolition permit must be obtained before beginning demolition of any existing structures.
23. Retaining walls over four high must be designed by a professional engineer and a permit
must be obtained prior to construction.
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Planning Commission Meeting - July 19,2005
24. Provide a water service for Lot 6.
25. A 10-foot clear space must be maintained around fire hydrants i.e., street lamps, trees,
shrubs, bushes, Xcel Energy, Qwest, cable TV and transformer boxes. This is to ensure that
fire hydrants can be quickly located and safely operated by firefighters. Pursuant to
Chanhassen City Ordinance #9-1.
26. Fire apparatus access roads and water supplies for fire protection is required to be installed.
Such protection shall be installed and made serviceable prior to and during the time of
construction except when approved alternate methods of protection are provided.
27. The new proposed street will be required to have a street name. Submit proposed street name
to Chanhassen Building Official and Chanhassen Fire Marshal for review and approval.
28. No burning permits will be issued for trees to be removed. Trees and shrubs must either be
removed from site or chipped.
29. Fire apparatus access roads shall be designed and maintained to support the imposed load of
fire apparatus and shall be surfaced so as to provide all weather driving capabilities.
Pursuant to Minnesota Fire code Section 503.2.3.
30. Temporary street signs shall be installed on street intersections when construction of a new
roadway allows passage be vehicles. Pursuant to 2002 Minnesota fire code Section 501.4.
31. Prior to final platting, storm sewer design data will need to be submitted for staff review.
Depending on the size of the drainage area, additional catch basins may be required at that
time. The storm sewer will have to be designed for a lO-year, 24-hour storm event.
Drainage and utility easements will need to be dedicated on the final plat over the public
storm drainage system including storm water ponds, drainage swales, emergency overflows,
access routes for maintenance, over all existing wetlands, wetland mitigation areas, and
buffer areas used as PVC. The minimum easement width shall be 20 feet wide.
32. The interior lot storm sewer will require private easements to be dedicated where the sewer
crosses from one lot to another.
33. Private utility easements are required for the sanitary sewer and water lines that serve Lot 4
but go through Lot 5.
34. The sanitary sewer and water hookup charges will be applicable for each of the new lots.
The 2005 trunk hookup charge is $1,458 for sanitary sewer and $2,955 for watermain.
Sanitary sewer and watermain hookup fees may be specially assessed against the parcel at the
time of building permit issuance.
35. On the site plan:
a. Revise the cul-de-sac pavement radius to 48 feet.
b. Revise the parking driveway aisle from 24 feet to 26 feet wide.
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Planning Commission Meeting - July 19,2005
c. Revise the public street width from 32 feet to 36 feet wide.
d. Increase the full access width off Galpin Boulevard to 44 feet and create three
lane access.
e. Shift Lots 1 and 8 easterly access further toward the west and realign the across
each other.
f. Show at least one, 6-foot wide, side walk along the public street.
g. Show the access off Galpin Boulevard turning curb radius.
h. Realign lot 5 access perpendicular to the shared driveway.
1. Show street lights.
J. Show handicap parks and ramps.
36. On the grading plan:
a. Extend silt fence type between the storm pond and Outlot A. Silt fence Type II
must be used adjacent to wetlands and storm pond.
b. Revise contour lines to match 3:1 maximum slope and tie the proposed contour
lines with the existing contours for Lots 4, 5, south of Lot 2 and northeast of Lot
1.
c. Show the proposed contour lines for Lot 6.
d. Show all retaining walls top and bottom elevations.
e. Show all emergency overflows (EOF). The EOF must be 1.5' lower than the
adjacent lowest floor.
f. Revise Lot 6 parking slope to 0.7% minimum.
g. Add a note to remove any existing structure and access off Galpin Boulevard and
all disturbed areas, as a result of construction, must be seeded and mulched or
sodded immediately after grading to minimize erosion.
h. Show 75-foot minimum construction rock entrance.
1. No retaining walls structure is allowed within public street and/or public utility
easements, revise accordingly.
J. Show 20-foot utility easement for the storm sewer between Lots 2 and 3
37. On the utility plans:
a. Show all existing and proposed drainage and utility easements.
b. Show the proposed sanitary and storm sewer stubs inverts.
c. Add storm sewer schedule.
d. Public storm sewer pipe type must be RCP and IS-inch minimum diameter.
e. The last street accessible storm manhole (STMH#2) must be built with a sump.
f. Revise sanitary sewer pipe from DIP to PVC-C900.
g. On the utility profile show all sewer and pipe crossings.
h. Minimum vertical separation must be 18 inches between watermain and sewer.
1. Call out watermain fittings
38. Any retaining wall over four feet in height must be designed by a registered Civil Engineer in
the state of Minnesota with an approved safety fence on top of it. Also, it will require a
building permit from the Building Department.
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Planning Commission Meeting - July 19,2005
39. Add the following City of Chanhassen Detail Plate Nos. 1002,2109,21102204,3104,3109,
5201,5205,5214 and 5215.
40. Prior to final plat approval, a professional civil engineer registered in the state of Minnesota
must sign all plans.
41. All of the ponds are required to be designed to National Urban Runoff Program (NURP)
standards with maximum 3:1 slopes and a 10:1 bench at the NWL.
42. Cross-access easements for the shared driveway accesses must be obtained and recorded
against the lots for each of the entrance drives.
43. Any off-site grading will require easements from the appropriate property owner.
44. Public utility improvements will be required to be constructed in accordance with the City's
latest edition of Standard Specifications and Detail Plates. Detailed construction plans and
specifications will be required at the time of final platting. The applicant will also be
required to enter into a development contract with the City and supply the necessary financial
security in the form of a letter of credit or cash escrow to guarantee installation of the
improvements and the conditions of final plat approval. The applicant must be aware that all
public utility improvements will require a preconstruction meeting before building permit
issuance. Permits from the appropriate regulatory agencies must be obtained, including but
not limited to the MPCA, Department of Health, Watershed District, Carver County,
MnDOT, etc.
45. If importing or exporting material for development of the site is necessary, the applicant will
be required to supply the City with detailed haul routes and traffic control plans. The
applicant should be aware that any off-site grading will require an easement from the
appropriate property owner.
46. All private streets are required to have 24-foot wide paved streets from back-of-curb to back-
of-curb, be built to a 7-ton design and contained within a 40-foot wide private easement. At
the completion of the project, the developer will be required to submit inspection/soil reports
certifying that the private streets were built to a 7-ton design.
47. Six-foot wide sidewalks are required.
48. All plans must be signed by a registered engineer in the state of Minnesota.
49. All of the proposed building pads must have a rear yard elevation at least three feet above the
HWL of the adjacent ponds.
50. Installation of the private utilities for the site will require permits and inspections through the
City's Building Department.
51. Comply with Carver County memo dated June 28,2005 and revise the plans accordingly.
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Planning Commission Meeting - July 19,2005
52. Revise plan sheet size to 24 x 36 using scale 50.
53. The developer shall either dedicate Outlot C to the City for open space purposes or dedicate a
conservation easement over Outlot C."
54. The northeast corner abutting Lot 6, follow the city code and have a 150 foot setback.
55. No motels/hotels be allowed.
56. The combination of the berm height, landscaping and the height of the building on Lot
6 be such that you cannot see the roof line while standing on the ground on Lot number
2 of Trotters Ridge.
57. The applicant work with city staff to resolve any drainage issues with Lot 2 in Trotters
Ridge.
58. City staff be directed to revisit the issue of access from the site onto Lyman Boulevard
with Carver County.
All voted in favor, except Zorn and Larson who opposed, and the motion carried with a
vote of 3 to 2.
"Papke moved, Keefe seconded that the Planning Commission recommends approval of the
Wetland Alteration Permit to fIll and alter wetlands within the development, plans prepared
by Schoell & Madson, Inc., dated June 17, 2005, subject to the following conditions:
1. A no loss determination shall be completed for Basin F 31-34.
2. Exemption requests shall be completed for Basins F 51-80 N, Basin F 91-97 and Wetland A.
3. Wetland replacement shall occur in a manner consistent with the Minnesota Wetland
Conservation Act (MR 8420). A Minnesota Local/State/Federal Application Form for
WaterIWetland Projects (Parts I and II) shall be submitted for the proposed project. The
application shall include sequencing discussions and sequencing flexibility requests, if
applicable. The applicant must receive approval of a wetland replacement plan prior to or
concurrent with final plat approval and prior to wetland impacts occurring.
4. A five-year wetland replacement monitoring plan shall be submitted. The replacement
monitoring plan shall include a detailed management plan for invasive non-native species,
particularly purple loosestrife and reed canary grass. The plans shall show fixed photo
monitoring points for the replacement wetland. The applicant shall provide proof of
recording of a Declaration of Restrictions and Covenants for Replacement Wetland.
5. Several corrections must be made to the Wetland Mitigation Plan (sheet 10 of 13):
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Planning Commission Meeting - July 19,2005
a. Wetland A is shown as an impact area. Upon finalization of exemption
paperwork, mitigation will not be required for this wetland;
b. Wetland C (Basin F 87-90) is 0.05 acres in area; and
c. Wetland D (Basin F 81-86) is 0.09 acres in area.
6. A wetland buffer 16.5 to 20 feet in width (with a minimum average of 16.5 feet) shall be
maintained around all wetlands and proposed wetland mitigation areas. Wetland buffer areas
shall be preserved, surveyed and staked in accordance with the City's wetland ordinance. The
applicant shall install wetland buffer edge signs, under the direction of City staff, before
construction begins and must pay the City $20 per sign. All structures (including parking lots)
shall maintain a 40-foot setback from the edge of the wetland buffer.
7. The applicant shall submit a letter of credit equal to 110% of the cost of the wetland creation
(including grading and seeding) to ensure the design standards for the replacement wetland
are met. The letter of credit shall be effective for no less than five years from the date of
final plat approval. The applicant shall submit a cost estimate for wetland creation
(including grading and seeding) so the City can calculate the amount of the wetland creation
letter of credit.
8. Drainage and utility easements a minimum of 20 feet in width shall be provided over all
existing wetlands, wetland mitigation areas, buffer areas used as PVC and storm water
ponds.
9. Silt fence shall be installed around Outlot A along the east side between the pond the
wetland.
10. The applicant shall apply for and obtain permits from the appropriate regulatory agencies (e.g.,
Carver County, Minnesota Pollution Control Agency (NPDES Phase IT construction permit),
Minnesota Department of Natural Resources (for dewatering), Army Corps of Engineers) and
comply with their conditions of approval."
All voted in favor, except Zorn and Larson who opposed, and the motion carried with a
vote of 3 to 2.
APPROV AL OF MINUTES: Commissioner Keefe noted the verbatim and summary minutes
of the Planning Commission meeting dated June 21, 2005 as submitted.
Acting Chair McDonald adjourned the Planning Commission meeting at 11:15 p.m..
Submitted by Kate Aanenson
Community Development Director
Prepared by Nann Opheim
78