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CC Minutes 10-03-2016 CHANHASSEN CITY COUNCIL SPECIAL MEETING OCTOBER 3, 2016 Mayor Laufenburger called the meeting to order at 7:00 p.m. The meeting was opened with the Pledge to the Flag. COUNCIL MEMBERS PRESENT: Mayor Laufenburger, Councilman McDonald, Councilwoman Tjornhom, Councilwoman Ryan, and Councilman Campion STAFF PRESENT: Todd Gerhardt, Chelsea Petersen, Paul Oehme, Kate Aanenson, and Roger Knutson PUBLIC PRESENT: Kim Huston 18977 Twilight Trail, Eden Prairie th Kristin Kokkila 13875 85 Place No., Maple Grove Anna Bader 18903 Hanus Road, Minnetonka Denise Choiniere 8481 Bittern Court, Chanhassen rd Teawanna Burton 3425 53 Avenue No, Minneapolis Letitia Nadine Dyer 8280 Market Boulevard, Chanhassen Nardos Yeuie 312 Larpenture #6 st Sheila Clayton 1074 1 #708, St. Paul Linda Paul 8696 Stonefield Lane, Chanhassen Lisa Gillespie 183 West Sidney Street, St. Paul Erin Adler Star Tribune Matt Sepir MPR Mayor Laufenburger: Thank you and I want to welcome all of those of you that are in council chambers tonight and if it’s the first time into Chanhassen, welcome to Chanhassen and there are many of you watching at home on Mediacom cable channel or also watching live stream so welcome to this proceeding. First thing I want to note is that we have all council members present this evening so we are a full quorum. We also have City Manager Todd Gerhardt and our lawyer, attorney Mr. Roger Knutson and you’ll be meeting and hearing from other members of the city staff and consultants in a little bit. This is a City Council meeting and we have a normal and orderly process that we follow and I hope to make it easy for those of you to follow along as we navigate through this process together. The primary purpose of this meeting tonight is to act on or to review and consider an act on a proposal to rezone property located at 7801 Audubon Road from Industrial Office Park to a Planned Unit Development to facilitate the use of the building as a museum. We will hence forth refer to this as Paisley Park okay. But the first item on our agenda is a little different. It is our custom here in Chanhassen whenever we have a council meeting we offer the opportunity for a visitor presentation so if anyone wishes to speak to or address the council tonight on a matter unrelated to the specific item, Paisley Park on the Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 agenda, now would be a time to do so. Now some of you are thinking I wanted to speak tonight. Is the time that I’m supposed to get up and do that and the answer is no. We’re welcome to hear from you about any other item except Paisley Park. If you want to tell us about the food you had at Davanni’s today or how much you like the Arboretum fine. Alright there being no visitor presentations we will close visitor presentations. VISITOR PRESENTATIONS. None. PAISLEY PARK MUSEUM: REQUEST TO REZONE PROPERTY LOCATED AT 7801 AUDUBON ROAD FROM INDUSTRIAL OFFICE PARK (IOP) TO PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPMENT IOP TO FACILITATE THE USE OF THE BUILDING AS A MUSEUM. Mayor Laufenburger: Just a brief comment on our role as a City Council this evening. The action that we as a City Council take is called legislative. That means the council will decide if the proposed ordinance will be approved or not. If that legislative action or approval is complete then there’s a second element to the opening of the museum called administrative. This is the responsibility of city staff and not the council so city staff ensures that the actions by the applicant to prepare the site for it’s approved use complies with city ordinances and city code such as are the emergency lights in place and are they functional. Are the emergency exits clearly marked and identified? Are the assembly ratings and the occupancy signs in place? Are all of the conditions of the use satisfactorily met according to city staff? So these elements are related to granting a certificate of occupancy and these administrative actions are not the council’s jurisdiction. So this is the sequence of events we’re going to follow tonight. First of all I will ask for a staff report for the application and the proposal for rezoning to a planned unit development and this will be very thorough so it will be time consuming. Number two, after that staff report is complete I will ask council members if they have any questions. This is customary. There may be things that they read in the report that are unclear to them. Maybe things we hear tonight so that will be very, very thorough. That will be council questions. I will then ask if the applicant is present, and I believe the applicant is present tonight and I would ask if they would like to address the council. They will then come up and make a statement as they choose. Then I will return it to the council and say any questions for the applicant. Now this is a standard process that we use for virtually every development or anything like this so we’re following a procedure here. Now I also just want to remind people, after we ask the applicant if there’s any questions then we have to remember this. The council has had an opportunity to review all matters of the public record including the proceedings from the Planning Commission th held on September 20. Some may have actually viewed that Planning Commission meeting. We also have verbatim minutes for that. We’ve also reviewed all of the emails. In some cases people may follow social media but we’ve reviewed all of those proceedings and at this time I would normally say a public hearing is not required because that was part of the Planning Commission meeting but I know there are people here tonight who have an interest in sharing their views so I will take a period of public comment. The only request that I ask is that as you speak to the council, remember you’re addressing the council, you treat us with respect due of 2 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 the council, the applicant and also this chamber. Also one more thing, if there’s anybody present tonight that spoke at the Planning Commission I would ask that you reserve your comments until those who were not at the Planning Commission and spoke have a chance to speak. I will do this for about 30 minutes. I’ll be a little flexible on that but it’s important that we listen to and hear the things that are said as long as they’re presented in a respectful way. And then when the public comment is concluded then I will bring it back to the council for any further discussion, motion or action so that’s the sequence of events tonight. So let’s begin. Our first item is under new business is the Paisley Park Museum. Is there a staff report? Kate Aanenson: Yes thank you Mayor and members of the City Council. As you indicated everything on this project has been disseminated. I also want to remind people that the city staff report is available online. Anybody that has questions about some of the technicalities so what we gave to you tonight is an executive summary. Included in that was emails that we received after the Planning Commission meeting. With the Planning Commission meeting that staff report is attached also. There were numerous emails sent and so all the emails that we did receive were also attached. So also included in that is the proposed zoning. Some other documents which I’ll go through in a minute but all those are part of the record and anybody that’s interested in that can go to the City’s website and navigate to find that. So again the th Planning Commission held a hearing on September 20 and I’ll go through a little bit more detail on that and the application is from PRN Music Corporation. The property is located at the southeast corner of Highway 5 and Audubon Boulevard. It is a 9 acre site. Paisley Park was built in 1986. There’s been a few alterations to it since that time and the addition of a small out building which we’ll talk about in a little bit more detail. So the goal here is to, the majority of the site will not be altered. There will be some provisions for additional site planning which we’ll detail in a little bit more later and then also potential for some security items. So the request for the PUD zoning district arose from the fact that the museum is not permitted in the current office industrial park. This property is guided for office industrial so by creating a PUD which is allowed if it’s a 5 acre or more larger site is permitted as long as it’s consistent with the underlying guiding which this is. So the PUD rezoning attempts to regulate how this property will be used so as a part of your packet then we included the PUD zoning district. There was some changes from this before it went to Planning Commission and I can go through that if you will just really quickly. Offices were added as a permitted use in the zoning district when it went to Planning Commission that was not there. So that was the main change in that, in the PUD zoning district. Again the PUD zoning district is to allow the museum which could have, which also allowed for other things that could happen in the IOP district including 20 percent retail sales which we allow in other industrial office districts and then also permitted the, it being used as a recording studio if that’s what they choose to. To allow the current use of the property and then modifying that with that. The other thing that was presented when we asked them for a business plan was the existing round building on the site. To allow that to potentially become a boutique hotel. Again that would come back through the city for administratively, internally for the building permit so they’d have to go through that process so again any changes to that again would have to come back through the city. Again there’s prohibited uses. It’s not intended to have outdoor events, liquor sales or anything like that so we believe that the PUD is the 3 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 appropriate tool to allow this application to go forward as a museum. In the executive summary on the beginning, first page we did talk about reasons why we did support the PUD. It provides for limitations on the building and how it can be used, hours of operation and traffic and parking and we’ll get a little bit more detail from the traffic consultant on that. Again that was to understand how the change in use and the occupancy would regulate how the building works. It preserves the existing building and how it exists today and there’s limited expansion. Preserves existing trees. Creates additional jobs and tourism will be created. So that’s the reasons for supporting the PUD. This is how the site looks today. The current layout of the building so looking at the traffic study there was recommendations being made. I went through the PUD but one of the things that we talked about in the traffic study was some changes that need to be made to the site and the conveyance tool for that to make sure that they got done is on this slide here. We did reference, we put together a site performance agreement. In that agreement the concern was, it said we can measure the traffic into the future. Level of service. How it’s operating. Right now there’s certain expectations. I’ll let the traffic consultant talk about that in more detail but assume maximum development and operational. So we’d go back and measure that. Security has been put in place. There was a security requirement so there is cash escrow in place with the City right now to maintain that so what the agreement says is that as a part of the ordinance that we would measure that, how it’s operating so if it appeared that it was maxing capacity and we wanted to look at some improvements of the level of service then we would study that. At a minimum we’d go back and study it in October but if we needed to do it sooner than that then we’d have that opportunity too which is why the escrow is put in place. In addition that escrow ensures that the improvements are being made to the site including the additional parking and the additional access onto Audubon. Again I’ll let the consultant talk a little bit more detail in that. Mayor Laufenburger: Ms. Aanenson? Kate Aanenson: Yes. Mayor Laufenburger: When you use the term level of service, are you referring to car traffic? Is that what you’re referring to? Kate Aanenson: Yeah, vehicular, car or bus traffic. How people are exiting and entering the site and how the rest of the operations work on the road. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, thank you. Kate Aanenson: So that’s one of the attachments then. This site improvement agreement is one of the attachments that will be executed as a part of this PUD agreement. The zoning itself, the zoning ordinance is what we’re also recommending tonight so with that I’m going to turn it over to the City Engineer to go through the traffic. 4 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Paul Oehme: Thanks Ms. Aanenson. Good evening Mayor, City Council members. So we’d like to just spend a little time on the traffic study as Ms. Aanenson had indicated. Traffic study was, is typically completed for these type of developments and change of usage as well. SRF did complete the traffic study for this development. Tonight Matt Pacyna is here from SRF if you have any questions for him. One of the first things that we look at for traffic study is looking at the, is what the new site would generate in terms of traffic so based upon information that we gathered from the applicant there’d be upwards of 65 guests per hour maximum visiting the site and a 10 minute tour basis. We’re estimating that about 2.5 guests per vehicle would be entering the site and then upwards of 60 employees would also be working on the site on any given day. Based upon that information we did also gather site information with gathering trips and turning movements at the intersections off Highway 5 and at the intersections along Audubon Road as well. Knowing the background traffic information too that MnDOT has and also that the City acquires every 2 years, we looked at that information. Put it into a computer model and generated what projected traffic volumes along Audubon and turning movements into the site and along Highway 5 would be. This slide here shows what the existing traffic volumes currently are and what the projected maximum trip generated volumes would be if the PUD for Paisley Park were to move forward. As Kate indicated this is the concept plan that is being looked at. I’ll get back to that slide a little bit later on but knowing that traffic, those traffic impacts or the traffic that’s been generated we looked at what the potential impacts along Audubon, Highway 5 and then also on Paisley Park potentially would be knowing the, putting that information into the model. For example at Audubon, Highway 5, the guest traffic going southbound onto Audubon making those turning movements into the site there potentially would be a queuing issue. Basically a back up onto Highway 5 at the weekend peak period timeframe or the weekday which is, we’re projecting it to be at 4:30. Between 4:30 and 5:30. The problem with the traffic and the queuing at this intersection, at this time is that the intersection or the main access point to Paisley Park is in close proximity to Highway 5 so there’s not much stacking that potentially could take place along Audubon as it is currently configured. This potentially would impact the traffic again on Highway 5. Saturdays we also are anticipating there might be some problems as well during the noon hour based upon the traffic volumes. Existing traffic volumes plus the generated traffic volumes for the guests. So what staff is recommending basically that the north access point, which is shown right here, that be moved farther to the south about 220 feet away from Highway 5. That gets the access point out of the turn lane. The right turn lane that’s currently on Highway 5. That access point would be proposed to be restricted just to right out only since we do have a left turn lane that potentially would be going in there at that location. We also would like it to restripe Audubon Road south of Highway 5 to allow for more stacking to get into the facility. The main access point to the facility would be the south access point that is currently here today. As Ms. Aanenson had indicated that connection would be parking lot, the south parking lot would be connected with the north parking lot to facilitate parking for guests and that would be the main location. The limit of the tour sizes for the facility onto the existing parking spots that are currently available. In the future the parking could be expanded on site to accommodate more guests but at this point we would request that the parking, the guests would be limited to the amount of parking that’s available on the site as well. We have been in contact with MnDOT about the traffic potentially generated by this facility and they are 5 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 aware of the traffic study. They have a copy of it. What MnDOT would, could help out with is the timing of the left turn lanes onto Audubon Road. Their signal is tied into the main traffic center and the turning or the green arrows could potentially be adjusted during peak hours as well so MnDOT can monitor the traffic at this intersection if there were to be problems in the future. With that the site that is, site improvements are shown here again so the, again the access, main access would be to the south. South access point is currently today. The north access be closed and the right in or right out lane would be constructed at this location since there is a left turn lane that would be obstructed. Additionally parking potentially would be added in the future as needed by the applicant. Kate Aanenson: Thank you Paul. Just a couple other comments on the site plan itself and the Planning Commission summary. So the Planning Commission requested that you consider the proposed transportation plan. Not all of the parking will be put in place as shown on this rendering. This is the ultimate. That was one of the things the Planning Commission asked for too so it’s referenced in the ordinance. This is the ultimate build out so right now anything that. Mayor Laufenburger: Just could you, when you say ultimate you’re saying this is the completion of the buildout of the parking on this site, is that what you’re saying? Kate Aanenson: That’s correct. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Kate Aanenson: But at this time due to the time of year it’s not feasible to get all that done. It ha been restriped which is one of our requirements. The other one we had is that they put a connection between this parking lot and this parking lot. Not all the parking in there but there is a connection which creates a circulation through. So the other one was that in order to accommodate guests coming to the site but not enough parking they would work through a transportation system and they have worked on that so as a part of that again the site improvement agreement, that’s where the striping had to occur and then the additional improvements would have to be made that the City Engineer just went through so that’s what the security is for to make sure those improvements are done next year because we’re into winter time now so they just got what they need to to make the circulation work and the parking on site so it’s pretty close as far as meeting the current demands of parking but if it were to continue to expand so those were the Planning Commission comments to make sure those had been done. There were some other ones regarding making Highway 5 the designated route. If you look at the traffic study I believe the majority of the traffic is coming from Highway 5 and if it’s coming by bus that wouldn’t be as many trips so with that recommend that the City Council approve the rezoning of Lot 11, Block 1, Chanhassen Lakes and that you also approve the PUD ordinance, the adoption of the Findings of Fact and the site improvement, Site Improvement Performance Agreement. So with that I’d be happy to answer any questions that you have. 6 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Mayor Laufenburger: Alright thank you Ms. Aanenson and Mr. Oehme. Let’s bring this to the council. Let’s begin with questions. Anybody have any questions? Mr. McDonald. Councilman McDonald, your questions please. Councilman McDonald: Yes. I guess the first one I have is for Kate about the PUD. Normally whenever we do these we’re doing them for a reason of, there’s some concession being made for a PUD. What are the concessions here if we grant the PUD for this site? Kate Aanenson: In your staff report that went to the Planning Commission I believe it’s also in the updated staff report that you received separate from the executive summary. The findings for the PUD are in there starting on page 4 of the updated staff report. So because the site is not changing the characteristic, we’re preserving the building and other existing characteristics so the only thing really that would be changing additional parking. Otherwise the trees and existing building are being maintained. If a different use went in there that could alter significantly. Again some of the PUD things are not necessarily applicable so high quality unique design. Again the building is unique in the city so this does again preserve the uniqueness of that building. It is guided office industrial and again it is creating, the PUD does, is consistent with the Comprehensive Plan parks and open space, again preservation of existing trees. It’s not necessarily applicable to the preservation of a park. Not applicable to affordable housing. Not applicable to energy efficiency and a traffic management, that’s what we’re getting. We’re getting improved traffic management on the site with the implementation and the construction of the additional turn lanes and moving of that intersection. If you remember when this building was built in 1986 we upgraded Highway 5 and so additional right-of-way was taken along that, in front of the property so that northern entrance has always been close to that. Anybody else using that so because of the change in use in the PUD we were able to move that driveway. Well the driveway will be moved, the most northerly driveway will be moved south which as the traffic engineer indicated gives better access to the right hand turn. You’re not in that turning lane which you are today. Councilman McDonald: Okay. Mr. Mayor if I could. Mayor Laufenburger: Please do. Please continue Mr. McDonald. Councilman McDonald: Also I’ve received a lot of emails as I’m sure you’ve received a lot of emails concerning the fence. The only thing about the fence that I guess I would ask is that are we as a City requiring the fence and what I mean by that is the opaque fence or is that a decision that the management company can make and all we’re saying is we have ordinances about fences and you must follow those? Kate Aanenson: That’s what we’re saying. Nobody’s requiring them to put up a fence. We want to put that in as an option because if they were to do something that’s different than what’s out there today they would need variances. Instead of coming back through a public hearing through a variance we wanted to put everybody on notice now that that could be. Certainly it’s 7 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 not their first choice. We’ve heard from a lot of people on that. There’s no requirement to put the fence up. It’s an option as a way. What we are concerned about as they are concerned about is people that are walking up to the site and the traffic mingling. How do we manage that so it’s, we’ll observe it. That’s part of the thing that we’ll be doing over the next few months and see how it operations. We know that now that they’ve requested things not be put on the fence there’s less walk up traffic and that’s what we’re just monitoring. Both parties are. We both want to make it a good neighbor. Councilman McDonald: Okay then in dealing with the fence the next question I have would go to Mr. Oehme. As Ms. Aanenson said we’re going to monitor that. What are we looking for? To see what impact there is on Highway 5 and what safety there is as far as 5 is concerned? Paul Oehme: Correct. Not just Highway 5 Councilman McDonald but also Audubon Road as well. If there’s any back up’s. Queuing issues along Highway, on Audubon. If there’s accidents that potentially could take place, we’ll be monitoring all that information. Councilman McDonald: Okay. And then concerning Highway 5, do you know what the stacking capacity is of the turn lane on Highway 5? Matt Pacyna: Mr. Mayor, council members. My name’s Matt Pacyna with SRF Consulting. I’m the traffic engineer that worked on the report. The westbound left turn lane today is in the 300 to 350 foot range on Highway 5 today. Mayor Laufenburger: So layman’s term, how many cars is that? Matt Pacyna: We use a general rule of thumb about 20 feet per vehicle. 20 to 25 feet per vehicle so you can do the math. 12 to 16 vehicles. Mayor Laufenburger: You’re better at math than I am Matt. Councilman McDonald: Well and on those vehicles what about a bus? What if we had all of the transit to and from that would be buses, do we reach any kind of capacity at that point? Matt Pacyna: Buses are typically a little bit longer. We usually use the rule of thumb of 2 buses, or 2 passenger vehicles for 1 bus as an equivalent. We didn’t look specifically at if it was all buses coming in but typically that’s less than the vehicles just from the amount of people that you can have on a bus in relation to how many cars you need to service the same amount of people. We do work with MnDOT on a regular basis and as Mr. Oehme mentioned MnDOT does have access to remotely control the signal timing at this location and they have indicated that they are willing to do that. 8 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Councilman McDonald: Okay because I was going to ask you to elaborate on that if it’s a variable timing or if there’s a way to change it based upon demand. Time of day and those things so there is that capability then. Matt Pacyna: Yes. Councilman McDonald: Then I was asking about Highway 5 and you got into the surrounding areas as far as traffic and such goes. In listening to the Planning Commission I understand that as cars come in that you know they are going to be searched. The question I have is then based upon that are we going to create a stacking problem then on Audubon and if so is the capacity there going to be sufficient to handle that and do you know how much time per vehicle they’re going to be spending because that could relate to the stack up. Mayor Laufenburger: Before you answer that Mr. Pacyna, Mr. McDonald I think that the procedure that happens on site is probably best answered by the applicant so let’s hear the applicant’s description of what they’re going to do on site and then if that still prompts the question of stacking on Audubon, you okay with that? Councilman McDonald: Well I’m okay with that. I just want to know if he knows if it was part of the study. If he doesn’t that’s all he’s got to say and then I’ll ask the applicant about that but I am concerned about the stacking if he’s looked at that at all as to what impact that could have. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, okay. Mr. Pacyna. Matt Pacyna: Mr. Mayor, council members. That’s a great question. In our conversations with the management team they did indicate that those ingress and egress situations would happen relatively quickly. That said we still wanted to be somewhat mindful of it and the striping recommendations and utilizing that south access point along Audubon were part of those ways to help protect against those queuing challenges that may occur if it takes longer than expected to service those vehicles as they’re entering so having that restriping allows for those southbound left turning vehicles that are wanting to go into Paisley Park, that allows vehicles that are on Audubon to continue past them and not get blocked in that queue. We don’t expect there to be any queuing issues but having that turn lane striped helps provide some of that buffer. Councilman McDonald: Okay and then on the issue of not necessarily people into Paisley Park but people just wanting to walk up to the fence or walk around the property, a lot of parking is taking place on McGlynn Road. Was that factored into your study at all as to what kind of traffic we might be looking at there? Matt Pacyna: Mr. Mayor, council members. Our traffic study didn’t look specifically at all of the pedestrian traffic from McGlynn to Paisley Park specifically just because we would expect that would actually tend to decrease over time. As Ms. Aanenson had noted earlier with the 9 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 changes to the fence recently, the drop in pedestrian traffic has occurred to some extent and so that’s something that we’d just continue to monitor. Councilman McDonald: Okay. For right now Mr. Mayor I think that’s all the questions I had. Mayor Laufenburger: Alright, thank you Mr. McDonald. Anybody else have any questions? Councilwoman Tjornhom. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Good evening staff. Thank you for your report and I do have some questions that’s for sure. I’m going to start with the very beginning and the Planning Commission. Did the Planning Commission, when there’s a big development coming through sometimes they’ll get a preview or they’ll get a review of what’s going to be coming up and they have time to talk to the applicant and work out some kinks. Was that, did that ever happen with any of these conversations ever? Kate Aanenson: Well this is a really unique situation because typically administratively we change building uses all the time. We have large businesses go in and out. For example the Bernard Group who just moved what, 450-500 jobs. The only people that got involved with that was the building inspections so they’ve been in there for a year now and so they’re just talking to us now about potentially expanding the building site plan so sometimes those can be done administratively if they’re less than 10 percent. So because this building wasn’t being changed administratively then we’re looking at the building code issues and the fire marshal, those sort of things. Really the issue on this was to change tripped us up in looking at traffic management just because of the change in use so as a general rule because the building wasn’t changing, not as big of building code or site plan review issues, if that makes sense. Councilwoman Tjornhom: It makes sense. I want to go back even further. The Planning Commission does a lot with the Comprehensive Plan and they do a lot with zoning and rezoning is I think even a bigger issue than just changing buildings and sites like the Bernard Group did and so with the Comprehensive Plan did they have time to review that and look at what the impact could be with rezoning it and what that would mean to the areas around it? Kate Aanenson: Yep so we included in there the underlying IOP district. That’s a pretty deep industrial district. If you look at some of our larger employers, for example if you looked at Emerson, they have, Emerson Rosemount have over 1,100 employees coming every day. I’m trying to think of some other larger employers. IWCO Direct has about the same number of employees every day so if you had an industrial user in there they could be at that level too so it’s consistent with what’s around there in the IOP district again we left the underlying zoning district because it is consistent with the Comprehensive Plan so in that regard it’s not out of character in our mind and that’s how we presented it to the Planning Commission. That’s how we’re presenting it to you. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Can we get an aerial view of yeah. 10 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Kate Aanenson: I think my first slide. Councilwoman Tjornhom: You were so close yep, and I was too slow to say stop. Kate Aanenson: Okay. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Alright so we’re going to look at this area and we’re going to look at the zoning, what things are zoned and the potential for what the impact could be for the museum coming in and the impact of other parcels. So let’s take the parcel east of Paisley Park. What is that zoned and? Kate Aanenson: Office industrial park. Mayor Laufenburger: That’s west. Kate Aanenson: Excuse me, east? This is all zoned, whoops excuse me. That’s also zoned industrial office park. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Okay and so now let’s go west. And that’s office industrial park also? Kate Aanenson: Correct. Councilwoman Tjornhom: And who owns that property? Kate Aanenson: That’s a part of Paisley, but it’s a different identity. Entity but yes. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Okay. And so if we go then further is it all office industrial? Kate Aanenson: (Yes). Councilwoman Tjornhom: And who owns that parcel? Kate Aanenson: That is Liv Horneland’s group. Liv Horneland’s group. I can’t remember the name of the development entity. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Okay. And then let’s go south of Paisley Park. Tell me about that parcel. Kate Aanenson: This is part of General Mills. I’m not sure this developable. I’m not sure it’s all in preserve. 11 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Mayor Laufenburger: Ms. Aanenson she said south of Paisley Park. Kate Aanenson: Oh I’m sorry. Oh right here? Mayor Laufenburger: Right there. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Either or because I was going to go to all of them. Kate Aanenson: You can talk to Mr. Oehme about that, that’s the City public works building. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Okay, alright. And let’s see, yep let’s go where you before you were corrected you were south. South of. Mayor Laufenburger: So that would be west of the. Councilwoman Tjornhom: West and south yep. Kate Aanenson: That’s not buildable, this part right in here. Councilwoman Tjornhom: That’s not buildable okay. Todd Gerhardt: It’s the Bluff Creek corridor. It’s guided open space. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Okay. So let’s go back to Paisley Park and can we change that view now so it’s where we were before. Was a close up of Paisley Park. Kate Aanenson: Oh sure, sure. Like this one. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Yep. I see there’s a pond on Paisley Park. Is that considered a wetland or is that a pond? Kate Aanenson: A storm water pond. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Okay. Kate Aanenson: I’ll let Paul answer that. Paul Oehme: Yeah I believe that’s a storm water pond. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Okay so are there any wetlands in and around that parameter? Kate Aanenson: What they’re doing today isn’t impacting any of that so when they come in for their site plan they should meet all the setbacks and be able to accommodate. They will have to 12 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 accommodate additional storm water so they’ll have to come in with civil plans. Showing us how they’re going to accommodate that and provide any additional civil plans. If I can just circle back to all the industrial around, I’m not sure, I’m assuming what you’re looking at is when we do our Comprehensive Plan we also do traffic analysis zones and we’ll be doing that in the update. We just finished that right now so actually what we do is we look at, based on that zoning and the projected land use we do all the modeling for if there’s deficits in road infrastructure. Sewer and water capabilities. All that’s based on traffic analysis zone so this isn’t out of the realm of the traffic analysis that you know that we looked at even how it was before or into the future because it’s looked at as an office industrial zoning district and traffic that would be generated by it in our Comprehensive Plan. Councilwoman Tjornhom: And this did obviously generate a traffic study but what, I guess what I’m trying to wrap my head around is because this didn’t go through the Planning Commission or they didn’t have a lot of time to really analyze the impact of what’s going on. When we do have developments coming in where there’s a major traffic impact and also a possible impact to the whole neighborhood and environment around it we will have them do an environment assessment plan or something like that or an AUAR and why aren’t we requesting something like that? Why are we settling just for a traffic study? Kate Aanenson: Because they’re not really making any changes to the building. They’re just making a change to the parking lot. When we do an AUAR you have to have a couple hundred acres of improvement. There’s a threshold to that. For example you’d have to have for housing over 600 new houses or for office industrial 200,000 or 300,000 square feet. I don’t remember these numbers off the top of my head but somewhere in that park so that change, there isn’t that kind of a change here. The scope is pretty minimal. The reason why we wanted the traffic analysis done is because you know when you look at for example Rosemount or IWCO, our larger employers they’re coming in all at the same time so this is a frequency and duration throughout the day. It’s spread out throughout the day so we just want to manage, instead of having everybody coming in at once and finding their spot, maybe going to lunch, this is traffic throughout the day. We just want to make sure again because we have an access that’s non- conforming to the north. We wanted to make sure that we’re providing safe ingress and egress. It doesn’t meet the threshold for an AUAR or for an environmental study. It didn’t meet those thresholds. Councilwoman Tjornhom: When it comes to the traffic, Councilman McDonald started to talk about it when it came to stacking. When you talk about 65 potential guests coming through or being led through every 10 minutes and so that means there’s a lot of traffic coming through all the time with buses and so it’s not like a typical industrial use where people do show up at 8:00 and they leave at 5:00. This is continual and what is the hours of operation? I thought, is it 9:00 to 9:00? Kate Aanenson: Yes. 13 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Councilwoman Tjornhom: So that’s a long day for that road and that neighborhood to be impacted by all that traffic so I am a little concerned that the traffic study really wasn’t given enough time or thought or consideration when it came to the impact of the neighborhood so that I guess is a question and a comment…and I don’t believe the stacking that it’s going to work. When I went through for my look at Paisley Park I drove up at my designated time like I would if I was a ticket holder. I was stopped at the gate and I realize that the road will be moved down but still I was stopped at the gate and it took maybe 2 minutes, maybe more to look through my car and then the gate was opened and I could drive in. Now if that’s going to happen to every car that comes in, there’s a potential for we don’t know how long that stacking is going to sit there because we don’t know how long every car is going to take to be checked or every ticket is going to be you know taken and looked at. And then also there’s the potential of buses coming in and how does that all flow also. I see the traffic has, the parking lot has been marked but is it marked for buses being parked also? I think we had a good, we had a good look at what it’s going to look like to have buses driving up and down Highway 5 with the Ryder Cup this weekend and we saw the impact that had so is there any thought or maybe that’s the applicant’s. Kate Aanenson: Yep I’ll let the applicant address that. Again I want to reiterate that we did put in there that we’re studying and there’s escrow and security in place to go back if there seems to be any conflict that we would go back and restudy that and see if there’s other improvements that would need to be made. That they would have to make to mitigate those. Councilwoman Tjornhom: And now let’s talk about parking since I just ended with that and we talk about pedestrian, or people walking to look at Paisley Park as they have been doing and they have been using the Lake Ann parking lot to park there. Is that really something that we do as a city that we allow businesses to use our park parking lots for activities? Kate Aanenson: I’ll let the city manager maybe answer that. Councilwoman Tjornhom: And do we…plan for that to continue or what’s the plan with that? Todd Gerhardt: No. As a part of their site plan they had to submit a parking analysis to accommodate their number of patrons that are going to be using the facility including employees and what you’re seeing on this slide in front of you is the ultimate buildout for parking to accommodate their patrons and employees. They have one year under our agreement to build out the parking lot as you’ve seen here. In the interim they’re going to have to bus patrons into the site and they have arranged off site parking and have hired a bus service to bring individuals that are going to go on the tours onto buses through Paisley Park. Councilwoman Tjornhom: And I’m sorry maybe I didn’t make myself clear. I understand all that but what I’m talking about are those people that don’t have a ticket that just want to walk around like they have been doing. They’ve been using Lake Ann Park. The parking lot now. Is that going to continue? 14 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Todd Gerhardt: It’s a public park and we want people to use our trails and they’re more than welcome to use Lake Ann parking lots for that. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Okay. Alright I’m going to move on. We’re still on the site and we have in the Findings of Fact, and not to be funny because I usually try to lighten things up a little bit but honestly. Mayor Laufenburger: You can do that Councilwoman Tjornhom. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Well I don’t think anyone’s going to laugh. Honestly with the Findings of Fact I found 3 things that I found factual and that was what it was zoned now, what it was guided and the property description. I’m not going to go for time sake go through all the rest of them why I could content that all these statements are misleading and probably not accurate but for time sake there is one part where we are rezoning it and we talk about uses and limitations and we are allowing a hotel and it’s the round building. Kate Aanenson: Correct. Councilwoman Tjornhom: So we give them a PUD and part of that is that they can only have this as a hotel so are we saying that’s chiseled in stone so they couldn’t come back in 2 years, 3 years say you know what golly gee this is just amazing and we would love to tear this building down. Improve it and build a 20 story hotel. Can we then say no to them because it’s, the language is written like this or are we then back where we are talking about this? Kate Aanenson: I’ll let the City Attorney address that. Mayor Laufenburger: Mr. Knutson. Roger Knutson: Mayor, members of the council. If you adopt this PUD ordinance just like any other provision in your zoning ordinance, can it be changed? Yes. Would that change have to come back to you? Yes. And would you have to review that and determine whether you think it’s an appropriate change? Yes. And if you decided it was not and assuming there was a factual basis for that decision based on whatever reasons, traffic, whatever, then you could turn it down. But anyone just to be clear anyone in the city who owns property could come in and make the same request to put up a 20 story hotel on their residential lot if they wanted to. Councilwoman Tjornhom: So really having this in the paperwork saying that we’re giving them an allowance to have this right now it’s really a moot point because they could come back and try to build whatever they want. Kate Aanenson: No, what we asked them for is to give us a business plan that described the ultimate use of the property because the goal is not to, as the City Attorney stated, to keep back and renegotiating the PUD. It’s transparency for everybody. For the residents. For the council. 15 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 For the applicant so they indicated that that might be a desirable use to come back and do a boutique hotel. It was vague in the number of units. That was specified now. It was topped out at 35 but they did have, they’ll have to come back and get a building permit. Show how they’re going to park it. All that stuff will have to come back and if they need to get additional permits from anybody else that has jurisdiction on it or look at that traffic, that will also be included in any change in use on that. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Okay. Next question I have, I have 2 more left then I’ll turn it over to the rest of the council members. I’m sorry. Mayor Laufenburger: Take your time. Take your time. Councilwoman Tjornhom: I’d like to talk about the letter of credit and $25,000. How did we come to that dollar amount? Kate Aanenson: I’ll let the City Engineer, it came through the engineering department. Paul Oehme: So $25,000 is mainly for some of the site improvements necessary for basically from day one. From opening at day one so it would include, the $25,000 would include the access from the north parking lot to the south parking lot. Some of the striping. Some of the other on site modifications. It doesn’t include the ultimate buildout of the parking lot or any of those other improvements down the road. It does include some of the striping on site as well so it’s just mainly a security to allow us to have the flexibility to make some of those improvements if they weren’t forth coming. Councilwoman Tjornhom: And do we have a potential cost of what the future parking could cost? Paul Oehme: We have not calculated that. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Okay. Mayor Laufenburger: Just on that could I, Mr. Oehme could you clarify something. The $25,000 which is an escrow or letter of credit, that doesn’t replace the responsibility of the applicant to do it, is that correct? Paul Oehme: That’s correct. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay that’s just, that’s like leverage that we have please follow through on your plan. If you don’t we’re going to do it and we’re going to use your money, is that correct? Paul Oehme: Exactly. 16 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Mayor Laufenburger: Okay so it doesn’t relieve them of the responsibility to follow through on those things. It just gives us leverage and is that pretty common practice for us to use that letter of credit or escrow? Paul Oehme: Very common with developments. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, alright. I just needed to clarify that for the audience. Councilwoman Tjornhom. Councilwoman Tjornhom: And then I’d like to talk about the tent. Pretty unique situation for the City of Chanhassen to have a tent be in operation as part of a business plan. I know it’s temporary but still something I’ve never seen that we’ve really allowed except for maybe a sidewalk sale so and it’s a 20 percent, that’s the number you determined that 20 percent sales would be allowed or product. Tell me how that, where that number came from and how we’re going to decide what 20 percent looks like? Kate Aanenson: Sure. So currently that’s in the city code. We do have commercial or industrial buildings that manufacture on site that have retail operations that want to sell on site which we do allow. So they can create 25 percent of their floor space can be used for retail sales so it’d be their floor space. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Okay, 20 percent of their floor space. Kate Aanenson: (Yes). Councilwoman Tjornhom: And that’s the tent is 20 percent? Kate Aanenson: Yes. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Or. Kate Aanenson: Or probably less than that yes. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Okay and the operation, the hours of operation for that too is the 9:00 to 9:00? Kate Aanenson: Yes. And you know I guess they’ll have to see how that works as they get into the colder months and you know so. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Okay. I have more but I’ll wait. Thank you. 17 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Mayor Laufenburger: Alright, thank you Councilwoman Tjornhom. Any other questions? Councilwoman Ryan. Councilwoman Ryan: Thank you Mr. Mayor. Both of the council members addressed a lot of the questions I had so I appreciate that. One that I still have a question about is in terms of the site improvements as it relates to the traffic study. One of the biggest queuing and stacking problems that was mentioned in the report and touched again on was the relocation of the northern access 220 feet south. Why are, if as the applicant has stated his top 5 busiest anticipated days are taking place within the next 30 days, why are we allowing a year before this site improvement is made when we’re anticipating a huge volume of traffic within the first month? Paul Oehme: I think we should have the applicant address some of those issues from those peak periods and to address how he’s going to handle those days from a traffic perspective. Councilwoman Ryan: Is it, and I might just not be familiar with it but is it typical that we allow a delay in site improvements before a business opens? Kate Aanenson: Well I think what we need to understand is the operational part of how they’re going to manage this. It’s a little unique so I think letting the operator talk about how they’re going to internally manage that so their first goal is not to have people bussed but because they don’t have all the improvements the mitigation for those improvements is busing people at those peak time but they’ll be able to speak to what their ticket sales are right now and again this plan shows ultimate use of the facility at maximum potential so I’ll let him talk to where they are as far as maximizing the daily traffic and whether they’re or not and how they, again everybody wants it to be successful. For them not to have it be successful, not get people on the property is a problem as it is for us so we always have been both going for the same goal so I’ll let them talk about the operation. Councilwoman Ryan: Okay but just as a question for precedent do we typically allow a delay in site improvements before a business is opened? Kate Aanenson: I think what the challenge is when you’re at this time of the year sometimes that happens when we’ve not been able to get full improvements because we’ve got one coming up right now in another project that moving into a building and may not get all their parking lot in so we’re working through some of that right now to get on the watershed district so it happens sometimes. Councilwoman Ryan: Okay. Todd Gerhardt: Mayor, City Council. Mayor Laufenburger: Mr. Gerhardt. 18 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Todd Gerhardt: To add to that I think the mitigation plan is to do the busing so you limit the number of cars that are stacking internally so with the buses people will have to be bused out there so you have less cars so less queuing at the exit and coming in. So having less vehicles would limit that stacking so that’s the mitigation for the improvements. Councilwoman Ryan: Okay and how about the some of the striping? I know you said some of it has it been done in the parking lot but how about on the road? Kate Aanenson: That’s taking place if not today tomorrow. The parking lot has been striped. And the connection between the north and south parking lot has been made also. Councilwoman Ryan: And the pedestrian plan has been submitted? Safety plan. Kate Aanenson: Yep we walked that today. Yeah. Councilwoman Ryan: And will that be something that you cover then tonight? Will the applicant. Kate Aanenson: Well right now they’re doing some way finding of how they’re exiting the building. There is a pedestrian sidewalk around the building so they’ll be doing some way finding. Marking so people coming out know which, how to get to the front of the building and the back of the building. Councilwoman Ryan: But that’s nothing we can review tonight? Kate Aanenson: Again that’s administrative. You know we’ve met with them just like building code stuff. We haven’t shared with you the building code report either but we did walk the sidewalk and talked about where the markings can be to direct people to get to the north and south sidewalks. Between the buildings. Councilwoman Ryan: Okay it just that as part of the summary here you know as per the Planning Commission they requested us, you know require a pedestrian safety plan put forth by the Planning Commission so. Kate Aanenson: You might be talking about external safety plan, yep and that’s one of the things that they talked about and this goes back to some of the fencing. I think that’s one of the things that we talked about. Some of the comments they came up with things on the fence causing people to come up to the fence or blowing across the street, that was the safety. I think it was more external than internal. If that was your comment. Councilwoman Ryan: Okay. And then just to clarify for myself, and I read it somewhere or heard somewhere about, and I know Councilman McDonald addressed the fence and it’s up to 19 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 them. There’s been talk is it 6 foot? Is it 8 feet? I know code says it’s supposed to be 6-6 so what, or that’s what’s online. Kate Aanenson: Well typically we don’t put fences in a front yard. For some reason this was given prior to my time with the City given permission to put up a security fence so it’s a legal non-conforming fence. They obviously want a fence for security. We want that to be a secure place too but we also want to make sure that we’re not creating an attractive nuisance where there’s people congregating in areas and crossing in areas that aren’t safe. One of the things we did put in the agreement, back to your point, there is an agreement in here where it talks about, that they would have to accommodate pedestrian crossing potential. Flashing crossing and that is in, I believe that’s in the improvement agreement. So if you look in the Site Improvement Agreement, on page 2. E. 2E we added that in there and then if the level of service at any time intersection fails or the study identifies pedestrian safety issues, again the goal is to go back and monitor where we are with these issues. That the applicant would install and pay for the recommended improvements such as a rapid flash crosswalk so you’d push a button to cross the street so that was to address the Planning Commission’s concerns that were raised. Councilwoman Ryan I think that’s what you were asking me. Councilwoman Ryan: Well I was asking about the fence. Just the height of the fence. Kate Aanenson: Yeah so the height of the fence, again it has to be permitted so what we’re saying, in an industrial district it can go up to 8 feet. I don’t think anybody would want it that high. Councilwoman Ryan: Okay. Kate Aanenson: Nobody definitely wants an opaque but we also want to make sure it’s safe for people driving along Highway 5 and Audubon that are pulling over to look and interfering with the other traffic that’s going about their way. Councilwoman Ryan: Okay and then my final question and this may be something that I need to wait for the applicant is the hours of operation. Would that be best to wait for the applicant? Kate Aanenson: Sure. Councilwoman Ryan: Okay. Thank you Mayor. Mayor Laufenburger: Thank you Councilwoman Ryan. Anybody else? Councilman Campion, your questions please for staff. Councilman Campion: Thank you Mr. Mayor. My fellow council members were very thorough in their initial questions here but one that occurred to me up front is related to the PUD ordinance 20 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 and the definition of the private events versus the indoor concerts. I didn’t see a definition for that and maybe I missed it but I was just curious about you know what is the, is it a? Kate Aanenson: It could be a classroom. It could be a school. Could be a college. It could be a corporate event so something like that. So that would be something instead of doing a larger tour if they wanted to book out something, you know it’s all being driven by how much parking’s on site so if they can accommodate it and they did, instead of selling tickets for a day or an afternoon and they wanted to do a corporate event or an evening, that could be accommodated. Councilman Campion: So it’s not a head count difference or timing? Kate Aanenson: Right so there’s only so many people that can be in the building per the building code and so the assembly occupancy so if that’s something that they choose to do as a use, then that’s and accomplish it by either busing people and parking them on site, then that would be permitted. Councilman Campion: So would that be within the normal hours of operation or the extended hours? Kate Aanenson: There are, we didn’t put hours of operation on here. There’s tour hour operations but the building, if someone was in there later that’s not limited so. Todd Gerhardt: Kate wouldn’t they have to come in for a special permit for? Kate Aanenson: The way we’re, the way we’ve addressed it is saying that they would, they would just tell the City you know there’s certain rooms that would be able to have occupancy. That they would give us, you know we’d have the occupancy identified and they would tell us that they’re having a special event so we would know and as long as they say we’re meeting this occupancy load then they would move forward which is, it wouldn’t be any different than, if you look at the Dinner Theater. The Dinner Theater has multiple operations in there. So does the Arboretum. Our building folks work well with that. I mean the Dinner Theater has movies. Or plays going on. They have weddings going on. There’s a bar. There’s all kinds of things in there. Multiple operations going on all the time that’s being driven by how much capacity you have for parking. It’d be the same thing here. We certainly know how to manage that so if they wanted a corporate event that went into later hours and they can park everybody there and make it work, then we’re okay with that. Mayor Laufenburger: Mr. Campion let me clarify something here just related to these events. So Ms. Aanenson in the PUD you are stipulating 12 indoor concerts per calendar year. The concert’s specific seating plan must be filed with the City. And then you’re also stipulating private events and events specific seating plan must be filed. I think what you’re saying is that if the operator wants to have 12 indoor concerts or private events they have permission to do so and the only thing they do, they don’t have to apply for a permit and go through our permitting 21 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 process. Their responsibility is to provide a seating plan for those events that we are giving them permission to do, is that correct? Kate Aanenson: That’s correct. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. How is this different from when Prince was alive he would often have concerts, impromptu you know. How did the City deal with those type of events? Kate Aanenson: Those were special permits because at that time it was a different operational as far as you know parking and the like so lots of times those would be bused in. Mayor Laufenburger: He was using off site parking. Kate Aanenson: Correct. Mayor Laufenburger: He would tell visitors to go there and we’ll bus you in with vans and stuff. Kate Aanenson: Correct. And let us know and often we’d let the sheriff’s office know so they could manage that if there was any issues. Mayor Laufenburger: Was there any limit on how many of those we gave him a year? Kate Aanenson: Well typically in a temporary ordinance we you know it’d be about the same but I guess in this circumstance now that we’ve been through the building we want as another benefit of the PUD we’re limiting those to 12 times. Same with the corporate events. We kind of have a handle on how it’s being used so. Mayor Laufenburger: When St. Hubert’s come to us do they apply for permits if they have big events like their fall harvest and stuff like that? Kate Aanenson: That’s correct, yep. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay so we would handle those permits on a one at a time basis. Kate Aanenson: Typically those are typically 3 or 4 times a year yeah. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. So I think as I understand your question Mr. Campion, essentially the ordinance is saying operator you can do these things and you don’t have to give us a permit request as long as you follow the ordinance and just tell us your seating plan so we know that you’re going to have, if it’s in the big concert, I’m going to call it the big concert room. What’s the occupancy load in there Ms. Aanenson, do you know? Kate Aanenson: The big room? 22 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Mayor Laufenburger: The big room. Kate Aanenson: I’m not sure, we talked about it today. I don’t remember off the top of my head. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay so let’s assume it’s 300 people. Kate Aanenson: Right, yep. Mayor Laufenburger: So as long as they have an occupancy plan for 300 people coming in and they’re going to use that big concert venue then it meets the assembly requirements and they don’t have to apply for a permit. Kate Aanenson: Right. Mayor Laufenburger: But they do have to tell us how many people are going to be in there. Kate Aanenson: Right and if I may compare it to the auto Motorplex. Because they do get temporary permits. They get one a month at least or more and they don’t have all their parking on the site. This one we’re saying parking has to be on the site or you’re busing them in. Mayor Laufenburger: Accommodated. Kate Aanenson: Accommodated correct. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, alright. I didn’t mean to interrupt Mr. Campion but I think a clarification is that we’re essentially pre-permitting events of this nature of this amount. Councilman Campion: And Mr. Mayor, Ms. Aanenson if I could. So I was more looking at you know there’s a frequency defined for the, or a maximum number of the indoor concerts define 12 per year and there’s essentially unlimited number of private events and I was just wondering from an enforcement perspective you know how you delineate the difference between well this is th an indoor concert and this, you know 13 concert they’re having, well that’s not really a concert. That’s a private event and how would you distinguish between the two? Kate Aanenson: Well part of it they’re going to have to submit to us you know the plan that they’re using so we, I guess if it’s over a certain capacity we can do it on that for a minute and try to, and maybe the applicant has a response. Councilman Campion: Okay yeah I was just in reading through it I thought a definition might be helpful. 23 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Mayor Laufenburger: Anything else Mr. Campion? Councilman Campion: That’s it. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Councilman McDonald: Mr. Mayor? Mayor Laufenburger: I’m going to give it to Councilwoman Tjornhom. Ladies first. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Councilman Campion actually triggered a good thought and that is lighting. Lighting and signage. Do we have a plan for that? When it comes to you know special events. Is the whole building going to be lit up so the neighborhood glows? You know I know when the daycare center came in you know we were very particular about the lights on the building and that because of during the event it could be a distraction to drivers. It is very close to Highway 5 and Audubon, busy roads and because they do have hours of operation into the late evenings, will the parking lots be lit and also will the building be lit up and what about signs? Kate Aanenson: I would assume the parking lot lights would be on as they are on some of the other businesses in town often for security reasons all the time. They haven’t talked to us about signage so. Mayor Laufenburger: Would signage be covered under administrative code enforcement? Kate Aanenson: Correct. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. And what about exterior lighting, would that be covered under administrative code enforcement? Kate Aanenson: That’s correct. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Kate Aanenson: So we don’t allow search lights as right now. Those aren’t permitted. Mayor Laufenburger: So if somebody wants a search light they’ve got to come to us and ask? Kate Aanenson: Correct. We do, I think you can get them maybe once a year or something like that for, there’s criteria. Grand opening, something like that so. Councilwoman Tjornhom: So like lighting the Paisley Park up the color, I’m sorry. The color of green or you know events like that, I mean have we really gone through and decided what as a community we want to have this light? 24 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Kate Aanenson: Well they’re following the city ordinances. City ordinances don’t allow that now. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Does not? Kate Aanenson: No. No, that’s… Councilwoman Tjornhom: Okay…do that though in our. Kate Aanenson: Well you can ask the City Attorney but everything we have in here is expressly you’re following the other city ordinance except what is specified in the code. So they still have to follow all city ordinances. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Okay. Mayor Laufenburger: If following city ordinances, following city code, city statute, following state statute, whatever it might be, that would be administrative code enforcement, is that correct Ms. Aanenson? Kate Aanenson: That’s correct. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Kate Aanenson: Which is the only area that we thought there might be some reason to give some deference would be on the fencing. Otherwise they’re following city code and that would be the only unique attribute because of the site and walk up traffic and people that want to hang things on there. That was the only thing and we’re not requesting they, it’s just an opportunity. Mayor Laufenburger: And to be specific the deference that you’re offering is simply the possibility if the applicant chooses to build a fence in accordance with city code. Kate Aanenson: Right it could be landscaping. It could be a lot of different things, yep. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Councilwoman Tjornhom: And I just want to clarify that our city ordinance does state that we’re not going to have search lights unless there’s a permit for it and it’s a special occasion so not once a month we won’t have search lights in the sky and that the building cannot be lit up different colors or you know whatever might be decorative lighting as far as they’re concerned. Mayor Laufenburger: Councilman McDonald. 25 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Councilman McDonald: Thank you Mr. Mayor. I just want to follow up on one thing and no one else has kind of touched it but on the traffic study, and this is for Mr. Oehme. What is the area of the traffic study? Did you look at the impact south on Audubon all the way down to Lyman? Paul Oehme: We did look at traffic volumes along Audubon all the way down to Lyman. Matt do you want to? That’s right we did have a slide on that yeah. So you can talk. Matt Pacyna: Yeah so as part of our operations analysis we looked at 3 key intersections but we did identify traffic volumes going further to the south. We didn’t look specifically at the intersection of Lyman and Audubon as far as a traffic operation. That was outside the scope of our study but as you can see on this graphic you can kind of see traffic volumes we would expect under that kind of that peak condition of a sold out show through every, basically sold out throughout the day type of situation. We would expect about 600 vehicles to continue south towards Lyman. Now that’s before any type of routing type changes that could be made. I know during the Planning Commission we had talked a little bit about you know you can work with Google to actually define your specific routes. If you type in an address that you actually define them to actually use Highway 5 and so that’s something I think the applicant was considering. And so that’s basically what we looked at from Audubon’s perspective. Councilman McDonald: Okay so I guess what I’m trying to get at is what’s the impact because that’s all residential neighborhood down there below Lake Drive and I guess what my question is, what kind of impact would we have down there? I heard the thing about Google and those things and I guess there’s things you can do there. I’m willing to kind of set that aside as that being a shortcut for right now but up north as people are coming in, what I’m wondering is what’s the impact to the residents? Are they going to see anything and was that within the scope of your study? Matt Pacyna: Mayor, council members. From a traffic study perspective we look at it from a numbers game. We don’t define necessarily impacts to neighborhoods. Different things of that nature. We look at it from a volume perspective and what 400 or 600 vehicles per day means to that facility. If I look at the increase in traffic volumes on Audubon which is a 2 lane roadway with some select turn lanes, the projected ADT’s is around 5,000 cars a day. Now that type of facility can easily handle 10,000 cars a day from a roadway capacity perspective, neighborhood impacts aside but the roadway has sufficient capacity to accommodate an increase in volume of that nature. Councilman McDonald: Okay and again that 5,000 cars you talk about, that’s all north of Lake Drive West I believe. You’re not really seeing a lot of spillage coming down below that point then? It would be local traffic if I understand what you’re saying is, that’s the 600 cars you talked about should be a majority local traffic. 26 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Matt Pacyna: Correct. In theory there would be local residents that would also utilize, you know that’s just their most convenient route for them to get from their residence to the museum. There is going to be some of that. Councilman McDonald: Okay. Thank you. Thank you Mr. Mayor. Mayor Laufenburger: Alright. I also have some questions that I want to ask. Matt while you’re on that or Mr. Pacyna, this Google thing is rather intriguing to me. Do you have enough expertise about how Google does their routing that you can speak to how we could change their routing? Matt Pacyna: As far as expertise I’ve never actually done it. I know some of our staff have. It is a simple request that can be made to Google that says I would like traffic from my address routed a certain direction. Mayor Laufenburger: What about, you mean to my address? If we said 7801 Audubon Road we could say send them this way? Matt Pacyna: Correct. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Matt Pacyna: And so from that regard so if you would say if somebody was coming in off of… Mayor Laufenburger: Say if they were coming from the Mall of America. Matt Pacyna: Well Mall of America is one that they’ll direct you just because Highway 5, it’s going to send you down Highway 5 because that’s the direct route. Now let’s say if you were somewhere a little bit more southeast of there that would more likely you’d want to take Highway 212 per se, that would be an opportunity where you could make that change with Google to have them direct them up to Highway 5 and over. Taking like 101 per se. Mayor Laufenburger: So when you say southeast of Bloomington? Matt Pacyna: Well I’m just saying somewhere south of like, if you were like in southern. Mayor Laufenburger: Burnsville? Matt Pacyna: Eden Prairie. Mayor Laufenburger: Oh Eden Prairie. Matt Pacyna: Correct. 27 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Mayor Laufenburger: So if you had closer proximity to 212 versus Highway 5 then it would likely send you to 212. Matt Pacyna: Correct, correct. Yeah we do some Google searches as part of our traffic operations analysis and you do kind of look at some of those Burnsville areas and you type in the address you know what we were seeing is that it would be directing those vehicles onto Highway 5. So it sent some of those. Mayor Laufenburger: You did that in your research? Matt Pacyna: Correct. That’s part of our process when we start to develop our directional distribution for our traffic. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Who would have the responsibility to reach out to those traffic influencers or those direction influences? Would that be your responsibility? The City? Or would that be the operator or the property owner? What’s your experience with that Mr. Pacyna? Matt Pacyna: My understanding is that would typically be the property owner in that situation. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Alright. By the way I Goggled Bloomington to 7801 and it took me down Highway 5. I also Googled Burnsville and it took me down Highway 5. Mr. Gerhardt did you have a comment? Todd Gerhardt: I would like to ask Matt if he could explain, council has reviewed traffic studies in the past and increases in those and a previous traffic engineer used A, B, C, D and so with the additional traffic coming off of Lyman onto Audubon, the 600 cars during a 12 hour period or 50 cars per hour on the average, what would that do to Audubon? What’s Audubon rated today? Is it rated an A, a B and then with those additional 600 you know what would the rating be after that do you think? Matt Pacyna: Mayor, council members. From a level of service perspective we didn’t look specifically at the Audubon and Lyman intersection so I can’t definitively said one way or the other. However I would, based on my engineering judgment I’d say the increase is relatively minimal and I would expect it to significant change the level of service at that location. Or along Audubon in general. Todd Gerhardt: At the Highway 5 and Audubon intersection would you say that too? Matt Pacyna: So from our operations analysis we did look at that Highway 5 and Audubon intersection specifically. Without any improvements at that location the level of service did degrade to a level of service D which is a letter grade worst. However when working with some 28 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 of the, with MnDOT and the signal retiming and the optimization that can occur there as well as the access changes and the restriping along Audubon that improvement actually gets back to a level of service C which is, you know a level of service D is technically still considered an acceptable level of service by industry standards but C is actually a very good letter grade. Todd Gerhardt: Thank you. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay thank you Mr. Pacyna. Kate can you speak to this question? When did we receive the application for this project? I thought you had it at the top of your head. Kate Aanenson: Sorry. nd Todd Gerhardt: August 22. Kate Aanenson: Thank you. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. And what are the statutory requirements that we have to respond to or act on an application like this? Kate Aanenson: 120 days. Mayor Laufenburger: So we have to respond within 120 days. Roger Knutson: That’s correct. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Let’s talk about this tent for just a second. In the plan it talks about it will be kind of like a finishing point for the tour. Things can be sold and food might be consumed in there, memorabilia and things like that. Do you have any indication of what happens to the people after they leave the tent? Do they go back, what happens? Kate Aanenson: Yes. Yep they can exit. There’s a sidewalk that can take them around to their vehicles or the bus. Mayor Laufenburger: And is that permitted on this, it’s okay for them to do that…? Kate Aanenson: Yes. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, alright. Okay, is there any discussion about what happens to the barriers on Audubon? These would be known as the Jersey barriers. Mr. Oehme? I know I don’t think it was in there but they’re there. Paul Oehme: Yeah they’re there for the safety perspective of pedestrians that are walking up right now so we had talked about that specifically today. In order to get the striping in we will 29 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 need to move the Jersey barriers back to the back of the curb at this time but in the future we’re anticipating maybe in a month or two we’d like to remove them altogether. Mayor Laufenburger: So you’re going to move the Jersey barriers so right now, right now there’s, let’s just call it a 3 foot path between the barriers and the curb so you’re going to move them to the curb, is that correct? Paul Oehme: That’s correct. Mayor Laufenburger: So in other words you’re saying if you want to walk in front of the fence, if you want to be a pedestrian you’ve got to be on the property as opposed to on the street. Paul Oehme: Correct. Mayor Laufenburger: And you said that’s to allow for full striping, is that what you’re saying? Paul Oehme: Right so in order to put that left turn lane in there, the middle of Audubon we need the additional width for the northbound through traffic because we are pushing the, that northbound lane farther to the east. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Todd Gerhardt: Turn lanes map? Paul Oehme: No. Mayor Laufenburger: Is there anything, you know clearly those have been in place since about th April 25 if I’m not mistaken right? Since 4 days after Prince passed away. Paul Oehme: Correct. Mayor Laufenburger: Have they been served, have they been used properly do you think based on your observations based on the reports that you hear? Paul Oehme: Yeah I think they were well placed and they did their work. Mayor Laufenburger: Has there been any discussion with the applicant about the possibility of replacing those barriers with something else on the property to keep pedestrians off the street? Has there been any discussion about that Mr. Oehme? Paul Oehme: We have not directly talked to the applicant about that specifically. Mayor Laufenburger: Ms. Aanenson have you had anything, conversation with that? 30 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Kate Aanenson: Well I think we’ve talked about long term how they want to manage that and so that’s something that as we talk about level of service going forward as they see how the operations work that they would work that into future plans. Mayor Laufenburger: Sure, okay. I just have one last question and then we’re going to bring the applicant up. Kate you said the underlying zoning is IOP. Kate Aanenson: That’s correct. Mayor Laufenburger: And that stands for? Kate Aanenson: Industrial Office Park. Mayor Laufenburger: Right, okay. And what about the zoning for industrial office park does not satisfy the need for a museum? Is it only the museum? Kate Aanenson: Correct. I think that would be right. The other things could probably go in the industrial office park. Mayor Laufenburger: For example the opportunity to sell things. Kate Aanenson: Correct. Mayor Laufenburger: The retail. Kate Aanenson: Correct. Mayor Laufenburger: That’s allowed in the IOP right? Kate Aanenson: Correct. Mayor Laufenburger: So is there a zoning that we have in the city that allows a museum? Kate Aanenson: A office district but it’s inconsistent with the underlying guiding. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay so the concession, using a term that was asked earlier. The concession that we’re giving them really is adding a museum use to the IOP and calling it a planned unit development. Kate Aanenson: That’s correct. Mayor Laufenburger: Is that in it’s simplest form? 31 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Kate Aanenson: Yes except that we also are limiting other uses that could go on there that might not be as desirable. Mayor Laufenburger: Ah, okay. So we’re saying we’re giving you this museum capability but we’re going to take away some other capabilities? Kate Aanenson: Yes we’ve contracted the other uses, correct. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, alright. Okay. And then you also identify in the executive summary you talk about 5 things. Limitations on how the building, preserves existing limited expansion, creates additional jobs, tourism generated, et cetera. There’s one thing that’s not addressed and maybe this is something you cannot address and that is, is there any discussion related to turning Paisley Park into a historic site? Have you had any discussion or any responsibility in that? Kate Aanenson: No. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, alright I’ll ask the applicant that. Okay, alright before I ask the applicant any other questions of council? Okay. Alright is the applicant present tonight? And if so would you like to address the council? State your name and address for the record please. Pat Mazural: Mr. Mayor, council members. My name is Pat Mazural. My address is 9501 Virginia Avenue South in Bloomington and I’m a consultant with Bremer Trust who are the applicant and the special administrator for the Estate of Prince Rogers Nelson. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay is that the same as PRN, what’s the PRN Music? Because that’s the name that’s referenced on many of our materials. Pat Mazural: Mr. Mayor, PRN does stand for Prince Rogers Nelson. Mayor Laufenburger: Good. Pat Mazural: And it’s one of the organizations that is represented. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, okay. Pat Mazural: So thank you Mayor and council members for allowing us this time for this hearing and certainly want to thank the staff of Chanhassen for a good amount of diligent work and site work at Paisley Park and helping us to make this the best project that it can be. My comments are really going to focus on a number of the soft issues. The reason why this use of Paisley Park is proposed, the selection of the operator by Bremer Trust. How some community and staff concerns that have been raised, how they are being addressed and the perceived 32 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 community impact by this project. Mr. Nelson was an extraordinary talent. He was a unique musical artist. He sold over 100 million records. Received 7 Grammy awards, one Golden st Globe, one Academy Award and tragically on April 21 he passed away here in Chanhassen and in fact at Paisley Park which is where he created and recorded. He often performed as you’ve referenced and he welcomed renowned entertainment giants from all over the world. The purpose of a museum at Paisley Park is to preserve the legacy of an international celebrity who chose Chanhassen as his home and the people of Chanhassen as his neighbors. Paisley Park itself is a unique facility within the music industry because it represents all the work of one of the most recognized international artistic celebrities of our time. A museum at Paisley Park is the only appropriate location to commemorate the work and the life of Prince. Chanhassen is where he built his legacy. Chanhassen is surely where he would want it preserved. Preserving that legacy means honoring not only his extraordinary work but also representing the neighbor that he was within Chanhassen. To meet that goal requires the most experienced, creative, artistically sensitive and community sensitive of operators for this museum and the property closest in purpose and in operational logistics to Paisley Park is Graceland in Memphis which of course commemorates Elvis Presley and which is operated by Graceland Holdings. The operator of a Paisley Park museum will be PPark Management which is a wholly owned subsidiary of Graceland Holdings. So this Paisley Park museum will be, if you should approve this rezoning, a fully managed with the same experienced leadership that has been managing the Graceland property. The due diligence of Bremer Trust of the operations of Graceland included both an on site tour as it would be experienced by a visitor and behind the scenes open book type of investigation into their operations. On the tour we saw a high level of traffic coordination. Use of shuttles. Smooth and comfortable crowd flow. We saw guests who were welcomed cordially and technology that made the tour experience pleasant, educational and emotionally moving. All of these are matters that we anticipate would be of greatest important to the family of Prince and to the pride of Chanhassen. Our behind the scenes investigation revealed a high level of thoughtfulness, expertise and discipline in the coordination of operations. In the financial and operational record keeping and oversight. Archiving of artifacts. Present and preserving the artist’s brand and attention to impact on the surround community. We saw an attraction that is a natural emotional demonstration of the artist life and that same artistic sensitivity and community sensitivity will be demonstrated and replicated at Paisley Park. Your community development staff has worked diligently to identify issues and to gather comments from your residents to direct us in making the Paisley Park museum an attractive, safe and appreciated asset of Chanhassen. Graceland has dealt well with all of the same issues so it’s long experienced in forms and guides it’s solutions. Matters that have been accomplished since the Planning Commission hearing include first the matter of traffic flow in and out of Paisley Park. The connecting driveway between the north and south lots which has been referenced and was part of the recommended plan is in place and that of course is part of the internal traffic flow which will assist in keeping long queue lines from outside of the property. The striping of Audubon Avenue for left hand turns is in process. That currently is scheduled to be done on Wednesday and some of the work in removing current lines will begin in fact tomorrow. The striping of the parking lot within Paisley Park in order to control vehicle limits has already been done as well. The second matter that has been raised is pedestrian traffic around Paisley Park. Fence monitoring for 33 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 pedestrian safety began shortly after the Planning Commission hearing and that has produced perhaps an unexpectedly pleasant result. The amount of foot traffic, the amount of pedestrian traffic around Paisley Park has significantly reduced over the last several days as memorials to Prince have been removed from the fence. At the same time those memorials are being honored and preserved and in fact will be part of the museum tour. The third matter is security and crowd control. PPark Management is pre-selling all tickets for the Paisley Park tour so there will not be on site sales. There will not be traffic of people coming expecting to get a ticket and being able to take the tour. All will be pre-sold which allows the operator to regulate inflow and out flow of guests and of traffic and in fact also allows the operator to send messages if need be in terms of changing to a shuttle type of travel if needed on a particular day or at a particular time. So all of that will be, the timing will be regulated and it will be fully regulated access to Paisley Park. In addition there has been coordination with local and county law enforcement and a security chief has already been hired for the Paisley Park facility who will oversee all security and crowd control. Chanhassen is a, as you all know a beautiful well planned community and it holds attraction for many outside of the city currently. The city attracts those seeking entertainment with the Chanhassen Dinner Theater. It attracts those seeking sports entertainment with the adjacent Hazeltine Golf Course which as you know has hosted the Ryder Cup, the PGA tournament and the US Open. It attracts those seeking enjoyment of nature and art with the Arboretum. All has been planned well and brings people from far beyond the Twin Cities metropolitan area to your community. The museum at Paisley Park proposes to be another well planned and well managed attraction. A good neighbor providing jobs for residents and bringing customers for your businesses. Over 600 local applicants attended a job fair that Paisley Park Management hosted. Many of those are now employed and archiving and otherwise preparing the facility to be a museum. Last week Paisley Park Management hired a general manager for the museum. A permanent general manager. She is a resident of Chanhassen. She was raised in Chanhassen. She’s worked and lived in other parts of the world but has chosen Chanhassen as her city for raising her family and now she has just been pleased to be able to secure this particular position for Paisley Park. The operator of Paisley Park has engaged local suppliers for property improvement and will engage others for food, for transportation and for other necessary services to run the museum. There have been requests to locate this museum and actually to physically move the Paisley Park facility to other locations even outside of the United States where Prince remains a celebrity. Chanhassen been Prince’s chosen home for 30 years and this commemoration of his legacy we request that you let it remain his home so thank you for you time and consideration. I have with me other individuals who have been a significant part of developing this proposal and interacting with your staff. Todd Phelps here is an attorney with Stinson Leonard Street in Minneapolis. He is a real estate and land use attorney and has worked directly with your staff on this application. Deb Fossen is the lead officer for Bremer Trust and the administration of the Prince Rogers Nelson estate. And Joel Weinshanker is the majority owner of Graceland Holdings LLC which wholly owns Paisley Park Management LLC and Joel has been here nearly daily since the time that we began this effort in order to oversee the operations and assure it’s quality. 34 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Mayor Laufenburger: Thank you Mr. Mazural. Would you mind just standing for questions if they arise? Pat Mazural: Certainly. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, council members. Any questions for Mr. Mazural? Councilman McDonald: I’ll go first. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, Councilman McDonald. And this is questions for he or for other members that may be present. Councilman McDonald: Right. Thank you for coming. Very good presentation. You know it gives us a good idea of what the overview is and everything. I’ll be upfront, I mean I have a lot of concerns about this area. A lot of it deals with traffic which is I think outside of your control so we won’t get into that but I do have a lot of questions about pedestrian safety. I hear what you’re saying about the fence. About taking down the memorials that you know there’s fewer foot traffic but would you agree that the foot traffic is not going to go away. That it will always be there and it may peak at certain times throughout the year. Pat Mazural: I think we can anticipate that Councilmember McDonald. Councilman McDonald: Okay. And let me just ask you a little bit about the fence. Because of what’s happened recently with taking down the memorials do you all still feel the need to put up a different fence? An opaque fence or are you satisfied that the current fence would provide you the security you’re looking for? Pat Mazural: That is no longer the go to plan. Actually the original thought on putting up an opaque fence was to handle the safety issue so that it wouldn’t be an attraction for people coming to see Paisley Park. I think with some of the actual citizen comments that were made at the Planning Commission it became apparent that actually some of the citizens would just as soon have that view available and other avenues were approached between the operator and city staff and in fact what’s going on right now with the removal of the memorials is sort of a test so you know the preference would be not to change it if it’s not necessary for pedestrian safety. Councilman McDonald: Well I do appreciate you listening to those comments but yeah, it wasn’t just the citizens of Chanhassen. I’ve gotten a lot of emails and I’m sure you have also from people around the world that would like to just see the site in their own way to memorialize Prince and I think that that would be an important part. But then that leads to the question of their safety. What are your plans as far as having pedestrian access around the perimeter of the site? Would you put in safety barriers? Sidewalks? Do you have any plans to handle pedestrians as they walk around? 35 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Pat Mazural: Council member McDonald I think I will ask Joel Weinshanker to come up to the microphone to answer that. Mayor Laufenburger: Just identify yourself and your address if you wouldn’t mind. Joel Weinshanker: Sure, Joel Weinshanker. I’m managing partner of both PPark Management and Graceland Holdings, New York, New York. You know we issued a press release on Monday and then very, very carefully our archivist actually took off each item that was on the fence and we’ve kept it and we’ve actually photographed each item. Since then traffic has been down conservatively 90 percent or 95 percent. Almost to that there is no traffic. We still have third party security guards at the gate and it’s really just you know, we’ve asked the Prince fans to please not congregate because that’s, we want to keep the fence. We’re trying to keep everything the way that Prince had it. Anything that, any changes that we’re making are for either public safety or just a requirement for what we’re doing so it’s our, you know it’s our desire, our deep desire to keep the fence the way it is so we feel that any pedestrian, anything that would promote pedestrians from coming by since they really haven’t in the last week would actually be counter intuitive and counter productive. Councilman McDonald: Well I hear you but also this is a cyclical in nature. I mean depending upon the day of the month, the month there could be people that decide to come out there. You’re getting ready to hold a concert later this month. As a result of that there could be people that say you know let’s go see it one last time and decide to drive out. My concern comes down that a lot of those people park on either McGlynn Road and have to cross Audubon or they’re going to park down in the city park and walk under Highway 5 which I think is a safer way to do it but the people walking up and down Audubon what’s the safety plan for them because at this point that is right next to the road and one of the things that we’re trying to do is normalize our get back to normal as much as possible traffic flow on that road. What do you intend to do there as far as pedestrian safety? Joel Weinshanker: So we are working with the City and there are some things that we have talked to the City about in terms of the signals and if we would have to put a crosswalk or anything of that nature but we really feel at the end of the day the best result, and we feel it’s practical at this point. We were actually I think everyone has been very pleasantly surprised by Prince fans really heeding the warning and I understand you know you’re talking about the, it th being cyclical but once October 6 comes along you know if you’re a local resident you’ve had many, many opportunities to come by and take a look. If you’re coming from hundreds and hundreds of miles away, or thousands of miles away which people are, we have very affordable tickets so someone coming from Chicago and traveling 6 or 7 hours to get here, going to the concert, doing other things, those are the people that are coming in they don’t need to walk around and we’ve just really, so we’re going to continue working with the City. We’re going to look at the study, not only from a year standpoint. From a day. From a week. From a month and any time we get an indication that there’s a problem we’re going to work with the City like we have. We, after the planning meeting and throughout the planning meeting we’ve actually 36 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 made a lot of pivots based upon the suggestions of the residents where there were some really good suggestions from the residents. There really were from a couple of the planning members as well. From the conversations that we’ve had with the mayor and with some of the council people, it’s a work in progress and what we’ve done, just so everyone understands because everyone’s talking about these huge numbers of traffic. Because of the conversations that we’ve had we’ve really throttled the daily number of people that we’re allowing in so we’re not looking at 600 people per hour. We’ve actually throttled it to less than 200 people an hour so we’re looking at in the highest days which you can count on one hand right now, less than 40 cars per hour and less than 6 buses per hour. So the bigger numbers are what is conceptually possible based upon how many people can walk through at one time. Not the true amount of tickets that we’re selling because until it happens we want to make sure that we’re just as good of neighbors as Prince was so we’ve actually throttled back severely the amount of availability. Councilman McDonald: Well I understand that and that all deals with the internal operations and the impact that may have on traffic but I just, I’m not feeling I’m getting the answer I want about pedestrian safety. I mean that was something that was brought up at the Planning Commission and looking at this and having been out there I know that there will be people that will just want to walk around it and I know that they will drive down Audubon. They’ll probably park on McGlynn Road because it looks like that’s what it’s there for and then they’re going to try to cross the road and I agree with the one resident that said as she was taking pictures and watching people, they don’t pay attention. You know it’s as far as they’re concerned it’s a parkway and they’re going to walk right across. What are we going to do about those pedestrians? Even if it’s only one or two, what are we going to do about pedestrian safety? That’s a question that I feel is lacking in all of this and it’s especially along Audubon Road. You’ve got the sidewalk on the side facing 5 so I think everything’s fine there. I just haven’t seen anything as to how we’re going to handle people crossing Audubon from McGlynn or from any place down through there. That’s what I’m asking for. Joel Weinshanker: So to the same extent we’re talking about the moving of the northern entrance, we engaged the same consultants who did the traffic to do the study as it relates to us adding blacktop and us adding sidewalk and that’s how we were able to add on the one lane road that we’ve already added. We’re waiting for the consultant to come back to us next week to tell us, to give us our plan of action to be able to add the additional which would include the ability to add a sidewalk because once you go over a certain number of square feet the watershed district comes into play so we’re waiting to get our answer back from that and once we’re able to add the square footage we will. Councilman McDonald: Okay so it is in your plan because we talked about moving the Jersey barriers and I think that’s what you’re talking about. Moving those to the side at this point. Is that correct Mr. Oehme? Todd Gerhardt: Mayor, council members. I think what Councilmember McDonald is talking about is a pedestrian access between McGlynn Drive and Highway 5 just to the south of your 37 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 most southerly access point and staff is indifferent about introducing a pedestrian crossing mid- street. You know Paul I think would tell you that he would encourage people to go down to the controlled intersection and use the crossing at Highway 5 and Audubon to cross over and when you do it mid-street you don’t have a controlled intersection. The pedestrian is at the whim of the car. Even we kind of see this at Instant Web Companies. We have pedestrian flashing there but it is a constant battle between car and pedestrian at that intersection so staff is indifferent in, to suggest having a crossing mid-street. Wouldn’t you say Paul? Paul Oehme: Yes. And to your point Mr. Gerhardt a lot of those crossings there’s warrants that have to be, thresholds to actually put those in as well so we just don’t want to put them in willy nilly so we want you know, what the plan would be is to monitor exactly how much traffic or pedestrian traffic initially would be going back and forth between McGlynn Road. As Joel indicated that’s not the preference. We don’t want to have walk up pedestrian traffic along Paisley Park especially on Audubon Road. That area between the back of the curb and the fence is not, it’s kind of steep. It’s, there’s no sidewalk out there. It’s really not pedestrian conducive for pedestrians to be out there so we want to discourage that type of pedestrian movement as much as we can. That’s why we want to work with the applicant and see what we can do to try to mitigate and discourage a lot of that traffic as much as we can. Kate Aanenson: And can I just add one more thing. That is what we have in the performance agreement. That we’re going to monitor the level of service, that’s what part of the escrow is to manage that. That specific issue. Councilman McDonald: Okay well it’s perfectly acceptable to tell me that we’re going to discourage pedestrian traffic. That’s what I’m trying to get at is what’s your plan? It’s either we will accommodate it and this is how we’re going to do it safely or we will say that it’s not allowed and this is how we’re going to do it. People that come to this do not understand about your plan with McGlynn Road or those things. I look for positive reinforcements to tell people this is not a parking lot so you can walk across the street and view you know Paisley Park. If we’re going to set this up for a museum all I’m asking for is how do we make sure that pedestrians are safe and part of that could be you can’t walk across the road and you can’t walk north/south up and down the fence. That’s a perfectly acceptable answer. I just need to hear it from somebody that that’s what your plan is because otherwise you’ve left something open that is ambiguous and every time you do that you know that someone is going to be crossing the road and they’re going to expect well that’s what they want me to do. So that’s all I’m looking for is how do we control that. Mayor Laufenburger: Before you answer that Mr. McDonald if I may. Mr. Gerhardt and Mr. th Oehme and even Ms. Aanenson, what have we done to control pedestrian safety since April 30? Todd Gerhardt: Install J barrier along the westerly property line curb of Audubon. From Highway 5 up to their most southerly access. 38 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Have we discouraged people from parking at Lake Ann? Todd Gerhardt: No. Mayor Laufenburger: Have we said anything about if you’re going to visit, if you’re going to walk to Paisley Park don’t park at Lake Ann? Todd Gerhardt: No. Mayor Laufenburger: So do we know that there are people still parking at Lake Ann? Todd Gerhardt: Yes. Mayor Laufenburger: And is there anything to prevent them from parking at Lake Ann? Can we prevent them from parking at Lake Ann? Todd Gerhardt: No. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. So. Councilman McDonald: Mr. Mayor Lake Ann’s not the problem. Mayor Laufenburger: I understand, understand. How about McGlynn Drive, is there anything that, is there anything we can do to prevent people from parking on a public road? McGlynn Drive. Todd Gerhardt: The City Council could designate it as no parking but it would have to take council action. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Is that, that’s not part of your recommendation is it? Todd Gerhardt: No. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, alright. Councilman McDonald: Okay I guess with that I will yield. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, thank you Mr. McDonald. Any other questions of the applicant? Councilwoman Tjornhom. Councilwoman Tjornhom: I would like to address the stacking. I was addressing staff with that earlier and staff asked me to address the applicant. When I came to visit Paisley Park I took Highway 5. Got on Audubon and went to the entrance. Parked and someone else was behind me 39 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 coming to the same event and they couldn’t, they had to sit and wait for me to get processed. Now even by moving the entrance south I’m still not convinced that there isn’t going to be a huge stacking issue so if you could just, let’s say I’m here to see Prince and Paisley Park. I’ve got my ticket and I’m up at the gate. Walk me through that’s going to happen. Joel Weinshanker: Sure and I’ve had the same frustration that you have actually because I’ve been treated up to now the same way when I’m coming in. So as people come in the southern entrance, no one is going to, there’s no cars going to be checked. Not even ticketing is checked. Every car that comes in will be let in and then have them make an immediate left to go down the newly formed road. There’s going to be one parking attendant for every 4 cars so the people are going to be able to go down the road. So we have 270 feet between the, when people come in from the south to when people would get into the north parking lot so we have room for about a dozen cars based upon his 23-24 foot average estimate. So no cars are going to be, no cars are checked you know basically at all but they’re not, but they’re not going to be. But even with the ticketing standpoint they come all the way in before they’re even checked for tickets. Todd Gerhardt: Joel can you point on that drawing where the first check point is? Joel Weinshanker: So a person comes in, the people are going to come in here. There’s now a road here that obviously isn’t, well actually the road is here so it’s a one lane road this way. People will come in and then they start to be checked in this area. So people with cars will come in unchecked. Go through here and then they’ll start to be checked in this area. Obviously this doesn’t exist yet. Any cars that are, the cars that are proper will then be able to make a right hand turn. The cars that are not... Councilwoman Tjornhom: Okay. Now they’re being checked. Mayor Laufenburger: Just a moment. I appreciate that members of the audience have questions about this but it’s important that you remain quiet so that we can have this dialogue between the council and the applicant. Thank you. Councilwoman Tjornhom. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Mr. Mayor. The cars are, that are coming in that are stacked that are being checked, looks like they’ll be parked along parking spaces so is there going to be ample, are these parking spaces right? Joel Weinshanker: They don’t exist yet. Councilwoman Tjornhom: But will they be? Joel Weinshanker: No. Not for opening. Kate Aanenson: Yeah that’s long term. 40 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Joel Weinshanker: That would be for spring. That would be part of what we’re obligated to do in second phase so right now the only thing that exists is that a one lane road in that section. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Okay. Joel Weinshanker: So they’ll be just basically ready to go one way or the other. Councilwoman Tjornhom: And will the cars be checked as they’re leaving? Joel Weinshanker: No. Councilwoman Tjornhom: So they’ll just get in their car and go and that’s it? Okay. Mayor Laufenburger: As about inspection. You said that your car was inspected is that correct? Councilwoman Tjornhom: Yeah he said there wasn’t going to. Mayor Laufenburger: No inspection. So the only thing that you’re checking is timing and do you have a ticket. Joel Weinshanker: Correct. The only time, the person will be checked upon entering, before they enter Paisley Park. Right when you walk in if you remember where your bags were checked. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Yeah but not in your car. Joel Weinshanker: But not in the car. Councilwoman Tjornhom: And then I just on a happier note I’ve never been to Graceland but I’ve been doing some reading about it and it looks like you did put up a very lovely hotel right close to Graceland or on the property. Joel Weinshanker: Yes. Councilwoman Tjornhom: And then it looks like you also got approval from the City to put up an entertainment complex. Joel Weinshanker: We did. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Is that right? Joel Weinshanker: Neither of which is on the property. So you know the property as we see here, as long as it’s my say we, you know I would never ever touch a building on this property. I 41 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 would never add a building on this property. I would never take away a building on this property. This is the way that Prince built it and this is the way that you know the Mayor asked about historical. Regardless of if and when the state and the country do rightfully issue a historical preservation, we’re treating like that from day one. So we don’t even change, you know if you came in and you remember the carpet. The carpet was the original carpet but if we had just left it there it would have been decimated so what we did is we had a company reproduce the carpet and we put that carpet on top of the original carpet because it was installed in a commercial way and that was just glued so it would have been destroyed if we tried to pull it up so even the carpeting we’re not moving. We had to put something on top of it to preserve it but we’re not planning on doing anything. What was done at Graceland, and this is not Graceland. I mean very frankly you know I’m the managing partner of Graceland. I’m the managing partner of PPark Management. I’m a Prince fan and this is the way Prince wanted it and this is the way it’s going to be kept. The hotel at Graceland is not on the mansion property. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Right. Joel Weinshanker: It’s on a piece of property that was bought 20 years later a mile down. And if we have, and if this is as successful as we hope it to be and several years from now the City were to agree with us that we would want to see more of Prince, there are other properties in town. There are properties in Eden Prairie. There are properties you know, there are many places it could be but to add to this property just wouldn’t even feel right. It would feel squished. It would feel like there’s too much. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Yep no but I mean there, we did in the beginning of my questions to staff we did go through Highway 5. Down Highway 5 and the potential open spaces for such entities. Joel Weinshanker: And that would be something that the City would have to want. You know we’d want the City to come to us and say, we have such a wonderful experience what more can we do for Prince so that would be the type of conversation we would want to have with the City. We can’t buy a property and put anything on it without the great council and the mayor approving it. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Well and I think the City of Memphis assisted you also with some TIF and bonding. Joel Weinshanker: They basically, so as we’re uplifting the community they’re giving us part of the uplift back so basically they’re just, we’re filling their coffers and they’re giving us a little bit of how we’re feeling it back. Councilwoman Tjornhom: No and I think it looks like a wonderful thing but I think that’s all I have for you right now. 42 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Mayor Laufenburger: Thank you Councilwoman Tjornhom. Anybody, any other questions for the applicant? Councilwoman Ryan: Mr. Mayor? Mayor Laufenburger: Councilwoman Ryan. Councilwoman Ryan: Could you address the hours of operation? You know it’s of concern of me on the 9:00 to 9:00 timeframe. Joel Weinshanker: And again we’ve heard the town so what we’ve done is some nights we’re open 9:00 to 9:00. Mostly weekends but we’ve actually dialed back and actually refunded a few tickets going in so we’ve only put on sale less than 3 months actually so right now the only thing thst that’s on sale is October 6 to December 31. What we wanted to do is we wanted to see what the reaction was. We wanted to see what people wanted and then after hearing the City, both from the Planning Commission before and after, we’ve actually dialed back many of the weekdays to 7:00 p.m. Councilwoman Ryan: So the latest your dialing it back to is 7:00. Joel Weinshanker: So that would be yes, so right now and I actually believe there are a few days even earlier. Councilwoman Ryan: Okay. Joel Weinshanker: So we’re actually, what we’re trying to do is find that perfect mix of what is appropriate for the City and what is appropriate for the fan. Councilwoman Ryan: And did I read correctly somewhere that on some occasions it would be open til midnight or was that? Mayor Laufenburger: How about events? Joel Weinshanker: So again a private event, you know because I think there was a question of what a private event would look like. To me a private event would be, and it’s really you know and we’ve had many conversations already with many local companies because we’ve had questions so Lifetime Fitness. If they wanted to have a corporate event what we would do is we would sell them 200 tickets an hour for their people to come in and then at the end of that but during the hours they would then come in and we would get, you know we would get the approval to have banquet space for 400 or 500 people in the sound stage and they would end with a ceremony for I guess the best salesman of the year award or something similar. That’s how we view private events but very frankly I really don’t anticipate being open til midnight unless it’s very, you know it would be a very, very, very irregular occurrence and to answer a 43 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 question that you had before that wasn’t answered, we’re not promoting people coming without a ticket. If you don’t have a ticket please do not come is what we’re telling people. It’s the messaging that we’re giving everything so the concept of having a spotlight or any kind of bright lights to attract people is not what we’re looking to do. We’re giving people ample opportunity to come but come at a respectable time in a way that we can control. So we’re not looking for people off, you know to come off, and we’re really looking to operate within a specific time set. There may be an occurrence. There may be if it’s an anniversary of something that that’s important but it would really be you know from a practical standpoint the exception rather than the rule. Councilwoman Ryan: Okay because in the packet it said that Monday through Thursday was going to be 9:00 to 9:00 and then the other days was going to be 9:00 to midnight. I mean it did state that. Pat Mazural: Yeah and Councilwoman Ryan I think that was the initial packet and the initial business plan which we wanted to make sure it was as expansive as might be the case and certainly was before any tickets went on sale and before as Mr. Weinshanker is saying we were able to determine you know what is the need so that’s an old number that was intended to be more expansive than what might be needed. Councilwoman Ryan: Okay and then just in terms of I know you say that you’re going to manage it in terms of how the City feels but your ultimate goal is obviously to pay tribute to Prince, I understand that but to run a successful business and museum so after the first 3 months, I mean what are, how are you evaluating the expansion of hours? The increase of ticket sales so then. Joel Weinshanker: So we really don’t even, you know so Graceland is the number one destination attraction in America and it’s only open 10 or 11 hours a day. We really, the capacity that we would have to hit on a regular basis to have to expand hours is unrealistic for anyone so you would be, whatever the number, you know it just, you know we feel that within these hours we’re going to be able to service every single Prince guest every time they want to come so there really doesn’t need, you know what we’re looking at from a throttle standpoint is, you know the traffic study said with, when we brought in the road, which we have. When we’re coming in the south instead of the north we came up with a per hour number. We’re 40 or 50 percent below that. When we get above 40 an hour we’re bringing in buses. So although I think we were at 72 in the last part of the study, we’re not coming close to that. We’re not coming, what we want to do in the first 3 months is be as far away from the line as possible and see what happens. If everything is wonderful in those first 3 months, we’ll go from 40 to 50 to 60, still well below what the study with what we’re doing allows but that’s the throttling we’re going to do. You know there’s just, you know frankly everyone’s experience is that there’s no reason to really need to be open more to be able to service. You know this building was designed for people to tour. Prince had a strong desire. He set this building up as the council people who actually and the mayor who actually walked through the building knew, you know all we’re doing is basically 44 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 following. You know we’ve got a book. We’ve got emails. We’ve got texts. We’ve got you know messages from him on what he wanted to do here but he had his own tours so all we’re doing is fulfilling that need but we never think that we need to go beyond what is the initial. We’re actually dialing it back but when we’re talking about if everything goes well it’s just coming closer to the limits that the City has already established as a safe limit. Councilwoman Ryan: And so for as you had mentioned at the Planning Commission you anticipate in the first month the 4 peak days you had mentioned. Joel Weinshanker: 4 peak days. Councilwoman Ryan: 4 peak days. Joel Weinshanker: Yes. Councilwoman Ryan: And so what is your transportation plan for those 4 peak days? Joel Weinshanker: So we contracted with the Southwest Transit for our own parking spots for those 4 days. We hired 2 full sized buses that will allow basically one, every 10 minutes will be dropping off and every 10 minutes will be picking up. We’ve contracted with Carver County sheriff department where on those days, and very frankly they’re having a little bit of trouble getting from one time period right now because I guess the sheriffs are exhausted because of the Ryder Cup but Saturday morning but they promise us they’ll have it done so the only time we th don’t have fully staffed is Saturday morning the 8 but they promised us in another day they will and we’ve offered to pay a little bit more if we had to. And we have an abnormally large amount of traffic people on the premises. Having 4 to 7 to 1 is 20 times what Disney does. Disney has 1 traffic person for almost 100 cars in the parking lot so we’re making sure in the first several months is that we’re killing people with, we’re having too much of everything. We have too many buses so the buses will be empty but we’re still only going to do. We’re only looking at 6 buses. We looked at the traffic looked at 72 cars per hour but we’re stopping at 40 so anything over 40 triggers the buses. We’re only looking at 4 days in the first 90 so we’re comfortable and obviously as we know as it gets colder and more into winter there’s less of a likelihood and we’re seeing the build come up week to week. We’re pushing people away from opening day so we basically maxed out on opening day but still on opening day no more than, you’re not going to see more than 6 buses per hour and you’re not going to see more than 40 cars per hour. So we’ve done everything that Prince would do. We’ve been a responsible citizen because we’ve under estimated. We’ve gone well below what we think is realistic because we want it to succeed. Councilwoman Ryan: And just help me understand so when people buy the tickets they’re directed at that point whether they’re going to be on a bus or be able to drive? 45 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Joel Weinshanker: So now people are. People were not in the beginning. We left it a little ambiguous. Councilwoman Ryan: Okay. Joel Weinshanker: We’ve actually had so again each person who bought a ticket had to provide an email address. We’ve now emailed each of these people for those days. We have something, as of a couple of hours ago we checked over 97 percent of the people had opened up their emails and we’re going to call each person who hasn’t and instruct them but we’ve had great success. Prince fans are amazing. They really are. The majority of Prince fans understand that they have to be a good neighbor. That we have to be a good neighbor. Understand that Prince for 29 years was a great neighbor and I’ve never heard anything to, you know anything that really undermines that so once we explain to the fans, when we came out with that press release on Monday we were really astounded. We thought the traffic would be down 50-60 percent on Audubon. It’s down, it’s negligible. It’s a couple of people a day. We actually had a wonderful elderly lady today who’s taking ribbons off the fence and the security person said what are you doing? She goes I want to make sure all the fence is clear. Like she came there so that she could help just get everything out of there so we really feel that we’ve got a good plan. We’re listening. You know even with the planning as Pat really much more eloquently than I ever could state it, we’re listening to the city. It’s important for us. The only way we’re going to succeed is if you feel that we’ve succeeded. Councilwoman Ryan: Okay, thank you. Mayor Laufenburger: Anything else? Councilman Campion, any questions or comments? Not required. Councilman Campion: Not at this time. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, alright. Let’s see. Mr. Weinshanker you can sit down if you’d like. Mr. Mazural I have a couple questions that I really want you to answer for me. There’s been a lot of emails, phone calls, social media referencing Prince would have never wanted this or Prince wanted this or et cetera. Is there a will? Pat Mazural: Mr. Mayor no there is not a will that’s been found to this point and that was part of the appointment of the special administrator was to do that search. Mayor Laufenburger: So who’s calling the shots on what can happen to, yeah maybe a better way of saying is who gives you the authority? Who gives Bremer Trust the authority to do what you’re doing? Can you just talk a little bit about that and help me understand. Me and the rest of us here understand how do we know that this is what Prince wanted? 46 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Pat Mazural: Certainly Mr. Mayor and council members. Well first of all the authority is given by the court. All that has been done in the estate has been with court order. Because there has not been a will located and because there are potentially issues as to who the rightful heirs are, Bremer Trust has engaged the family in conversations about this. They’ve gone to the court seeking approval on virtually every move that’s been made which has included representation of the purported heirs at this point and so it’s the court that gives the authority. From the beginning the idea of Paisley Park being a museum and a commemoration to Prince has been there and surfaced. From the time that we first engaged many more family members or purported family members than there are at this point and that was a relatively common theme at that point is that this is something he wanted to do. Since that time I can tell you that I’ve personally had this discussion with Kirk Johnson who has been the property manager for Paisley Park as a long time, 30 plus year friend of Prince. Basically his right hand person. His secretary. His property manager. His do whatever needs to be done and probably knew him better than anyone else and he’s personally told me that Prince had expressed this desire for Paisley Park years ago and in fact Mr. Weinshanker that was new to me, perhaps something that’s occurred with all of the continual searching that goes on in the archiving that in fact we now, which I didn’t know before just a few minutes ago actually have texts and writings from Prince that express that desire. Mr. Johnson, Kirk Johnson had indicated to me in fact that Prince had attempted something like some tours back around 2000 and was beginning to try out the site for that purpose. So in terms of who has the authority, the court gives Bremer Trust as the special administrator the authority. In terms of the organization and the different entities that have been discussed here, a couple of them are new and have been formed as business purposes to manage this and the court has given authority to those organizations. But it all evolves from the estate of Prince Rogers Nelson. Mayor Laufenburger: So the court has made Bremer Trust the special administrator, is that correct? Pat Mazural: That’s correct Mayor. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay so Bremer Trust is really tasked with the fiduciary and management responsibility to deal with Prince’s estate. Has, we’re dealing with one piece of property, 7801 Audubon Road. Has the judge allowed Bremer Trust and it’s associated companies recently formed to address other pieces of property as well? For example I’m thinking of Councilwoman Tjornhom’s question regarding the property that’s just west of Audubon. Is that owned by PRN Music Corporation? Is it owned by another entity independent of that? Help us understand that. Pat Mazural: Yeah and my understanding of that is there has been nothing specific with regard to the other parcels at this point. Nothing that’s come before the court. However I’d like Todd Phelps, the real estate attorney to address that directly. He would have personal knowledge of that. Mayor Laufenburger: Alright, thank you Mr. Mazural. Mr. Phelps would you state your name and your address please for the record. 47 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Todd Phelps: Todd Phelps, 150 South Fifth Street, Suite 2300, Minneapolis, Minnesota. Mayor Laufenburger: Welcome to Chanhassen Mr. Phelps. Todd Phelps: Thank you Mr. Mayor. Mr. Mayor, members of the council. With respect to the two parcels located immediately to the west on the southwest corner of Audubon and Highway 5, those two parcels are owned by a nonprofit corporation called Love For One Another Incorporated. It’s a Minnesota nonprofit corporation. Mayor Laufenburger: Is it part, do you know is that part of the, let’s just call it the Prince empire? I don’t know if that’s the right word but. Todd Phelps: It’s a nonprofit corporation and I’m trying to, I want to explain this in a way that. Mayor Laufenburger: Don’t confuse us with the facts. We’re looking for simplicity. Todd Phelps: The nonprofit Love For One Another Incorporated was formed by Mr. Nelson. Having said that because of the nature of a nonprofit corporation the assets are actually held for the benefit or the purpose of the nonprofit so those. Mayor Laufenburger: I think what you’re telling me, or the question you’re answering for me is that it’s not likely in the near future that that property would become available for development without approval of the nonprofit right? Todd Phelps: Mr. Mayor that’s correct. And technically at this point those parcels are not part of the estate of Prince Rogers Nelson. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, alright. Thank you Mr. Phelps. Mr. Mazural. Any council member have any questions related to that? Okay. So it sounds like one of the questions that the council had here related to the fence has been answered and that is that the plan right now is to leave the fence as it is and to do your best to protect it from being a display of art, is that correct? Pat Mazural: That’s correct Mr. Mayor. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, alright. Mr. Mazural there’s a Site Improvement Performance Agreement. Are you fully aware of all of the elements of that Site Improvement Performance Agreement? Pat Mazural: I have read it. I would need to reference it. I have it with me. Mayor Laufenburger: But you have seen it and so it’s, you know that there are things in there that are required from an administrative standpoint. 48 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Pat Mazural: Yes Mr. Mayor. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, alright. This question, this is not for you but for Ms. Aanenson. The hours of operation are not part of the PUD. Kate Aanenson: That’s correct. Mayor Laufenburger: What are the hours of operation that are allowed in the underlying business district? Kate Aanenson: Typically they’re not restricted. For example General Mills runs 24 hours a day so typically they’re not restricted. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. So there is no restriction other than to the effect that if the hours of operation become a nuisance in any way then the City would, could step in is that correct? Kate Aanenson: That’s correct and that’s how we would handle any other business in town that would create a noise or any other nuisance. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, alright. Mr. Mazural I reserve the right to recall you if I may but I think what I would like to do at this time is take about a 5 minute recess and then we’re going to come back for a public comment period, okay? Pat Mazural: Thank you. Mayor Laufenburger: So we’re going to recess. It’s now 9:17. Well let’s reconvene at 9:22. Pat Mazural: Thank you Mr. Mayor. Mayor Laufenburger: Thank you. The City Council took a short recess at this point in the meeting. Mayor Laufenburger: So at this time I will reconvene the City Council meeting and I want to express my appreciation to all of you for being patient. This has been a deliberate process but there’s a reason for that because the council is being asked to make an important decision tonight and we want to make sure that we have all of our questions answered and that it appears that the majority of them have been answered but we’ll deal with that in just a few minutes. As I said a public hearing is normally part of the Planning Commission and there was a public hearing conducted at that time and that became part of the public record and you heard reference to that planning commission meeting earlier. So what I would like to do at this time is I’m interested in hearing from members of the audience that are with us this evening and my plan is to allow 49 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 comments to continue about 30 minutes or so as long as the comments are respectful and in accordance with the order of this council and this chamber and I’m going to ask that those, if anybody is present that was at the Planning Commission and spoke I would just ask that we already have your comments on record and I would ask that you allow somebody who was not present at that Planning Commission to speak first so at this time I’m going to just ask, is there any public comment? And if there is, I would like you to come forward and I will instruct you on how I’d like you to proceed. Anybody? I would ask that you state your name, your address for the record and then speak, or state whether or not you are supportive or you are in favor of the development, not in favor of the development or in support of the development with some concerns. Okay state your name please. Teawanna Burton: Hi, thank you for having me. My name is Teawanna Burton and my address rd is 3425 53 Avenue North, Minneapolis, Minnesota, 55429. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay and are you speaking in opposition to or in support of the plan or in support of the plan with concerns? Teawanna Burton: Yes. Mayor Laufenburger: A, B or C? Teawanna Burton: I’m going to have to say against. Mayor Laufenburger: Against the rezoning for it to be a museum. Teawanna Burton: Yes. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, state your reasons. Teawanna Burton: At this time. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Teawanna Burton: I was a volunteer for Prince this past 2 ½ years. I’ve been a fan since ’76. I moved here from St. Louis in ’92 because of him. Okay. To me this is too soon. I’m not arguing the fact that he wouldn’t have want it to be a museum or historical monument but he hasn’t been gone 6 months. He died inside of Paisley Park. He did not like to be looked upon as some kind of replica or you know some put on a platform that you just stare at him or what not so for me to say, having a museum at this time is to me too soon. It’s intrusive. I think a year would have been suffice. People keep yelling but we need to make money for him for the taxes. He has money. He has property. I don’t think doing this to pay the taxes is a reason. I think people while the iron is hot want to grab it before somebody else grab Paisley Park and make it what they want it to be or claim this what he would have wanted. It’s like, it’s not written in, on 50 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 paper like you said. There’s no will so if somebody could say yeah, I’ve been with Prince for 20 years. I’ve worked for him. He’s my best bud. Yeah he would have wanted a museum. To make a little bit light of the situation I learned from Judge Judy. If it ain’t in writing, anybody can say, he could have told me 2 weeks before he passed, I was there the Saturday night, the last Saturday night. He had a party. He could have told me hey, if anything ever happened to me yeah you can go ahead and have my furniture. If I was to present that to you’all I’m quite sure you’d say well do you have any documentation? Do you have a recording? Do you have anything to prove that’s what he said? So to me that’s you know hearsay. Now as far as this summer what we was going to do was he wanted to have a party every weekend. Okay. He was doing the tours already these past 2 ½ years. He didn’t have to reconstruct his parking lot. He didn’t have to rearrange or treat the carpet from disintegrating or whatever the case may be. We have 40 people going at a time. The tours last 60 minutes because sometimes he will come down to the studio. Talk with the guests or walk them this way or what have you. We had it in an organized fashion. We, the parking situation, if he was having a big extravaganza, first of all we always had to get permits for everything he wanted to do that consists of guests being over a certain amount of money because of the fire zones and we had to have inspections and as far as parking in the neighborhood he respected the neighborhood because the daycare as well as the neighbors was like you’ve got cars blocking our driveway. There’s trash here and there and there’s cars you know blocks away so he asked his fans, which respected and listened to him, park your car at the park and ride. He paid for the shuttles to bring them to Paisley Park. That worked for a while but like you say that intersection of Highway 5 and Audubon gets congested. That turn lane, I have been in that turn lane all the time when I had to come. The light to turn is short but the holding time is long so you have cars more than 5 cars proceeding out to the on continuing traffic. Mayor Laufenburger: Step to the microphone. Teawanna Burton: I’m sorry. Mayor Laufenburger: You’re being articulate with your hands, which is okay. Teawanna Burton: Okay, I’m sorry. Mayor Laufenburger: We have somebody who’s recording this. I want to make sure she hears it. Teawanna Burton: Okay, I’m sorry. But that’s a huge concern because you get your car sticking out in the lane and the light hasn’t changed yet and then when you do make that left turn onto Audubon Road you get cars at a stand still because they see that first driveway and we’re directing them to go and come around and then there’s people running across the street and we like go to the light but they don’t want to wait in line. I mean you’ve got some Prince fans that’s hard headed. They don’t want to listen. They want to do it their way. They figure they out number you so they’ll do what they want to do. 51 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Mayor Laufenburger: Pretty much like people all around the world is that right? Teawanna Burton: And we do get people all around the world. They either don’t understand English or they’re rude or whatever the case may be. Something that also touched me at the meeting with Graceland Holdings, I’ve been on Facebook and I’ve even said it. Prince did not want Paisley Park to be a prison. He wanted any and everybody to come as long as you respect the neighborhood and his property and each other. Okay you can’t tell Prince fans don’t come unless you have a ticket. You’ve got to keep or don’t park over there or you can’t leave flowers. Some people haven’t had the opportunity to come and pay their respects so you gonna have people coming you know all different times. The winter time they’re not coming. You know you’all have to worry about that. They’re not coming but you have. Mayor Laufenburger: Wise statement. Teawanna Burton: You have anniversaries like his passing. His birthday. Summer break. People take their vacations so you can’t really calculate the type of traffic, foot traffic and car traffic unless you sit back and watch these people come for a whole year because they come in spurts you know so you can’t say oh well you know 2 buses will take up a lane and this and that and this and that. All those buses, even if you have 3, unless they’re green buses which he tried to get further the concern of the neighborhood with pollution you know so you’ve got to take that in consideration. I’ve seen people at 5:00. I was there the day he died. I’m directing traffic. Cars. People getting off from work. You know school buses coming. That’s a lot of traffic on that little two lane street and you’re going to add buses. You’re gonna have buses. Then you’re going to have people like he said that park. Come in and park then get their ticket. No, no, no, no, no. I’ve controlled traffic on that parking lot. I’ve had to back out people off of Paisley Park parking lot because they didn’t have the proper credentials or they just wanted to drive up and see what was going on and it’s like I can’t let you get on the property because they have stayed there and it’s like if she don’t see me then she won’t put me off the lot. Mayor Laufenburger: I don’t want to be disrespectful but can you wrap up your comments in another minute or two? Teawanna Burton: Okay so you have concerns about the traffic, that’s to be expected because I’ve worked it okay. And then telling fans when they can and can’t come and when they can and can’t lay down things to show respect for him. Now you’all was talking about that concrete barrier thing. Yeah that’s been a life saver and I’ve even had to tell people don’t sit on it because if you flip over you’re road kill and we’re not responsible so just an idea if you’all want to keep pushing for this museum that he said he wanted, I would advise that green area that has turned into mud and got mulched. Mayor Laufenburger: Now mulched. 52 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Teawanna Burton: But a sidewalk there and let that continue all the way and connect to the front of Paisley Park because there’s a sidewalk there that goes in that tunnel so why not have a sidewalk to go all the way around. Not saying it’s going to stop your problem from people running across the street but yeah, that driveway and where the daycare is, that’s going to be your problem. And then you coming to the lights, telling people go to the light and come around, that’s going to be a problem so just you know think about that but to me it’s being rushed. It’s too soon. The questions you’all asked I’m so glad you asked them and it is very important so. Mayor Laufenburger: Well thank you for the work that you did with Prince when he was with us and thank you for your comments. Teawanna Burton: Thank you. Thank you for having me. Mayor Laufenburger: Is there anybody else who would like to speak at this time? Good evening. Just state your name and your address please. Kim Huston: Kim Huston. Mayor Laufenburger: Do you want to pull that down a little bit? Kim Huston: 18977 Twilight Trail, Eden Prairie but I say Chanhassen. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, welcome to Chanhassen. Ms. Huston is that right? Kim Huston: Yes. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. So the question is are you speaking in opposition, in support or in support with concerns? Kim Huston: In support with concerns. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, thank you. Kim Huston: Good evening Mayor and City Council members. I am here to represent the Prince fans based on two issues regarding the plans for Paisley Park museum. First I am here to present the petition against the wall that was proposed to be built at the previous meeting held on th September 20. I have brought a copy of the petition with me for your review. Our petition has been signed not only by the Rainbow Children, which is a group on Facebook that I’m an admin for but also fans all over the world. And they’re concerned about the fate of Paisley Park. The bottom line is that we are the target market for the museum so our concerns should be crucial in the business plan because if it isn’t addressed with everyone in mind it will affect the revenue and the success of the museum. Several people have stated that if a wall goes up they will not 53 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 come. It is in the best interest of all involved in making of the museum to ensure that it becomes a place that their target market will want to frequent again and again. During the previous meeting there was concerns for safety as a reason for a new opaque wall to be built but the current fence has never been an issue even when Price was home so there should be no safety concerns with keeping it. In fact if a wall is built making it impossible to see the building we believe that it will actually create a safety issue encouraging people to climb it in order to see the building or take pictures. We also feel that if we are not allowed to leave gifts on a solid wall construction and a solid wall construction is built people might tag it and deface it which will not only become an eyesore to the community but it will cost the museum more money for constant repainting which will affect their bottom line. As far as the gifts go that people are leaving several local neighbors have stated that they find the fence and the gifts to be charming and they even leave flowers and notes themselves. Others consider it a landmark of the city and enjoy seeing it when they pass by to see everything that people are leaving for him. It is unfair, it is an unfair expectation to state that people cannot come if they aren’t attending the tours and that only paying customers have the right to leave gifts or even see the building. We need to come up with an agreement for a place to leave gifts. If Highway, if the Highway 5 side is safer because of the path then maybe that side can be designated for an area to still leave gifts. We are hoping that the statement that Paisley Park management regarding the fence and that they no longer intend on building an opaque wall or structure, whether it be solid construction or vegetation be written and included in the agreements made with the City going forward. We would also like to address the expansion of the parking lot on the north side of Paisley Park. Mayor Laufenburger: Ms. Huston can I just stop you for a second? So you heard the applicant say that they have changed their plan and they are not going to take down the fence, you have heard that? Kim Huston: Yes but their actual word is that they have no plan to do it at this time as long as the fence cooperates so they’re not necessarily saying that they won’t ever do it which means that at any time if one person leaves one flower they can say well you didn’t listen and the wall is going up. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, your point well taken. Move to your, you said there’s a second concern you have. Kim Huston: Yes. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, keep going. Kim Huston: So we’re concerned about the expansion of the parking lot on the north side of Paisley Park so we are hoping that with the delay in the expansion of the parking lot that they can consider possibly those 2 other properties that were brought up before that are currently under Love For One Another charities to be a place where maybe parking off the main property 54 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 could be put across there and then a crosswalk could be created to make it so people can get across the street safely. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Kim Huston: Because it has been made aware to us that PPark Management will eventually need not only additional parking but possible additional buildings that those properties could possibly be for that as well. In the interim we are asking that PPark Management use the existing parking on the grounds, street parking on the street across the way and then use the Chanhassen Transit Station as Prince was doing before. There are concerns from, I think recent concerns from Chanhassen citizens that that’s going to increase traffic downtown Chanhassen but if these events are in the evenings it shouldn’t really, you know the later night ones it shouldn’t really affect the business traffic. Mayor Laufenburger: So just a second. Are you saying that people have expressed a concern that there would be more traffic downtown than desired? Kim Huston: I think there’s recent concerns with some of the citizens and some of the business owners downtown in Chanhassen that possibly having a lot of shuttles going back and forth could affect them and affect the traffic in that area and so I just, we’re thinking that if those are mostly evening and later night events that a lot of those businesses would not be open and it would also, the schools would be closed so it wouldn’t create a lot of traffic for. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay I just, just intuitively I’m thinking that it surprises me that businesses downtown like retail establishments that they would want to deter people from coming downtown. That doesn’t sound intuitive. Kim Huston: I think they were more worried about traffic and people being held up getting to and from one place to another. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, alright. Kim Huston: And those were some online concerns that we noticed so. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. st Kim Huston: Lastly I would just like to say that April 21 was less than 6 months ago. Fans from all over the world are still grieving having not been able to properly pay their respects so we created our own with fans bringing gifts and using their artistic abilities to share with Prince the way they feel and you know leaving gifts for him. It is also important to note that Graceland was built 5 years after Elvis passed away and those fans had several years and a lot more time to mourn then way they wanted to and not be told that they can’t leave gifts in any certain area. Prince built Paisley Park with the intent of having visitors and not having walls to keep us out. 55 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 He made it a beautiful place for him to create his music and share it with us. He invited us to his home and said it was our home as well and to take care of it and that’s why we’re here today. Thank you. Mayor Laufenburger: Thank you Ms. Huston. Thank you very much. Is there anybody else who would like to speak? You know the drill? Linda Paul: My name is Linda Paul. I live at 8696 Stonefield Lane. I am in support with concerns. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Linda Paul: What I’d like to know is some of the things have been brought up about the traffic. You’ve discussed the fact that MnDOT can change the timing on that light. Do they do that on the fly? Is it a permanent change? Is it? Mayor Laufenburger: Ms. Paul, address your question here okay. Linda Paul: Sorry. And if they can do that why haven’t we been doing that on the Saturday mornings when that backs up for the Cars and Coffee for the Auto Motorplex? Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Linda Paul: Another question is we say we’re going to use the Google and such to direct people to Highway 5. Mayor Laufenburger: I don’t know that we said we were going to do it but the idea has been discussed yeah. Linda Paul: Well people have proposed that option to ensure. I also know when people are sitting in traffic they grab their iPhone and go Siri give me an alternate route so I’m not how effective that would be keeping people on Highway 5 because I live down on, just off of Audubon down near Lyman. That’s where my personal concern comes in. I’m curious why this security staff that are standing out on the far opposite sides of the gates haven’t been telling the people who are crossing right at McGlynn to please walk down to the light and cross at a controlled intersection because I have to drive up and down Audubon regularly when I’m going to downtown to grocery shop. To go to Target. That kind of stuff and people just walk out in front of you and it’s dangerous and they don’t care that you’re driving in a 45 miles per hour speed limit. They’re there to see Prince and they don’t care that there’s traffic coming. A question and concern for the applicant is, how do they guarantee that people will leave the property within a 2 hour time limit because they say that’s how they’ve decided how much parking they need is that they have so many tours and that kind of stuff and that people will leave within 2 hours so then they’ve cleared out those spots for people coming in. In addition with the 56 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 hours of operation they say they’ve narrowed it down til 7:00 p.m. Does that mean that the last tour starts at 7:00 p.m. and if that’s an hour tour does it go til 8:00 and then. Mayor Laufenburger: Ms. Paul I think in that situation as I recall it was, they will vary the ending time and I think in every case the ending time was assumed to be that’s when the last tour will begin. Linda Paul: Okay, thank you. Mayor Laufenburger: That’s what I heard council. Is that what you heard council? Okay. But good question. Linda Paul: I have observed that they did put in the one lane to connect the south lot to the north lot but come next spring when those permanent changes which are due within 12 months of moving the north entrance to that 220 feet south of the intersection and adding the additional parking. Right now they just have this one little narrow probably 8 foot swath of asphalt going from the south lot to the north lot so people can queue up. Then they’ve got to stand there and they say you can stay. You can go and point you back out there. Well at some point you’re going to be tearing that all up. Moving that entrance south. Closing it. What’s going to happen to the traffic in the timeframe when all that construction is going on? So I would like that addressed and again the people in my neighborhood have to drive up and down Audubon to get access to Highway 5. To get into downtown. Thank you very much. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, thank you very much Ms. Paul. Let’s just talk about a couple of these things. Not sure who this goes to but Mr. Oehme or Ms. Aanenson or maybe even the applicant. Is there any reason why the security people who are contracted by Paisley Park, do they have a responsibility to police the pedestrian traffic on the public streets? Do they have that responsibility? Kate Aanenson: I’ll let the applicant address that. Mayor Laufenburger: Mr. Mazural, what instructions do you give to the security people that are inside the Paisley Park campus? Pat Mazural: Well I think it’s helpful to understand that up until this point there has not been an operator of the property. It’s a piece of real estate. Mayor Laufenburger: Oh that’s right. That’s right. Pat Mazural: That is in the estate and it’s been the responsibility of the special administrator to assure security of the property. That it’s continued maintenance and that private security firm there is really for security of the property within the fence. 57 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Mayor Laufenburger: Okay so there’s really no instructions for them to do anything to police outside of the property is that correct? Pat Mazural: That’s correct. Councilman McDonald: Mr. Mayor? Mayor Laufenburger: Yes sir, Councilman McDonald. Councilman McDonald: I think we could ask counsel but they don’t have any authority beyond their property line so I could understand why they wouldn’t be doing it. I mean that would be up to the county sheriff who has jurisdiction over that area. Your private security doesn’t have that kind of jurisdiction. Would you agree with that? Roger Knutson: I certainly would agree with that. Mayor Laufenburger: Alright thank you for that clarification. Let’s see, maybe this is for the operator Mr. Weinshanker. How do you intend to manage the departure of people after the tours? The question was you know you’re assuming that people are going to be cooperative and once they walk out of the tent and return to their vehicle they’re going to leave. Joel Weinshanker: Yes which is a good question. So obviously the tour’s very structured to be pushing people through. Mayor Laufenburger: Sure yeah, while they’re inside the building. Joel Weinshanker: While inside the building. Once they’re even through the tent, once they’re there a specific amount of time they’re walking through and then once they walk through we have parking people so once they come through they’re going to be, and again could 2 people stay an extra 20 minutes and just by walking around? Possibly but there’s going to be nothing to do and they’re going to be encouraged to go to their spots like we’ve done in other places. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Let’s see. This was an interesting question that Ms. Paul raised. By the way I’ve done exactly what she has suggested that if I get in some traffic I, not while I’m driving but my wife will say give me an alternate route so I know that that happens but I think, well so let’s address this question about the light change. Mr. Oehme or Ms. Aanenson, do you know anything about, does MnDOT do anything to control the traffic on that first Saturday when Autoplex does their Cars and Coffee? Paul Oehme: I’m not aware that they would or have. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. 58 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Paul Oehme: So it’s the City has requested that MnDOT look at signal timing at specific times during certain events but I’m not aware that on certain Saturday mornings that we’ve ever made that request of MnDOT. Mayor Laufenburger: Yeah. How many people, what is Cars and Coffee, how long is that? Mr. Gerhardt do you know how long that lasts on that first Saturday? Todd Gerhardt: Oh I believe it’s about 4 hours. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, do we have any estimate on how many people come during that 4 hours? Todd Gerhardt: Oh, a lot. I would say definitely over 250. Mayor Laufenburger: Cars or people? Todd Gerhardt: Cars. Mayor Laufenburger: And I don’t mean to make light of that but that is an exceptional situation and you know we’ve learned and I say this to everybody here, Ms. Paul as well, we’ve learned that there is special attention that’s required for that event and we have additional officers on duty down there. We have people actually doing pedestrian crossing there so we’re very aware of the impact of that time period and we’re also very aware that there are some people that abuse it and I know from recent reports that we issued citations and thank heavens there are even sometimes that the police stop the pursuit because pursuing a high speed vehicle whether it’s a motorcycle or a super charged 1991 GTO also endangers lives so I understand the concern Ms. Paul but I think that it would be very safe to say that we’re watching that very closely to ensure that that event on top of the tours does not get out of hand. And we listen to citizens a lot saying, say your address again? Linda Paul: 8696 Stonefield Lane. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay so you’re down, you’re a little south of what we describe as the bird neighborhood is that correct? Linda Paul: I’m in the bird neighbor. Mayor Laufenburger: My point is is that we’re very aware of the impact of that in our community but at the same time these are people who are coming into our community and they’re patronizing the shops and the businesses in Chanhassen and I have no interest in deterring that by any means so I know you may have another comment but I appreciate the comments that you made at the microphone. 59 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Linda Paul: One. Mayor Laufenburger: Oh, if you wouldn’t mind stepping up here. We have a lady who’s recording this. Linda Paul: I appreciate the fact that they do have a county officers right there at Park Road allowing the crosswalk to happen there because as the pedestrian crosswalk from Lyman all the way up to Highway 5 the sidewalk starts on the west side. Crosses to the east side. Comes up to Park. Crosses back to the west side and takes you back all the way up to that so even if I just wanted to ride my bike or walk the length of Audubon Road between Lyman and Highway 5. Mayor Laufenburger: You’re required to cross. Linda Paul: You are required to cross the road twice. That’s our concern as residents in that area down south of Park Road. Mayor Laufenburger: We have some great trails down in that area Ms. Paul. I’m thinking of Bluff Creek and all of those trails that are far away from the road. I hope you’ve had a chance to use some of those. Linda Paul: Yes but sometimes you’re trying to get to downtown and I need to go up Audubon to get there and I have to cross the road twice to do it. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Linda Paul: Thank you. Mayor Laufenburger: Thank you Mr. Paul. Is there anybody else that would like to make a comment at this point? Councilwoman Ryan. Councilwoman Ryan: There was another question that Ms. Paul had about the construction plans. Mayor Laufenburger: Oh yes, excuse me. Mr. Oehme. We often conduct construction on buildings and properties that are already in place. Is a construction permit required for that? Paul Oehme: There is permits that would have to be required yes. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, and do those permits also require how traffic is managed or how construction materials are prevented from blowing off the property and stuff like that? Paul Oehme: That’s correct and we also look at how the project would be staged too to accommodate on site traffic or traffic that’s adjacent to the property as well. 60 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. And Mr. Weinshanker if there was, if it was necessary for, you can step to the microphone. If it was necessary to stop activity on the site for a period say a week to accommodate construction would you be willing to do that? Joel Weinshanker: Absolutely. We’d be willing to do whatever’s necessary. We’ve talked with two companies. One that actually did the work and they’re looking at 2 days. 2 ½ days. They sort of laughed at us when we asked if there was enough time to complete it because the road that they did, albeit small they knocked out in a couple of hours so none of what we’re talking about doing with the parking lot expansion is taking any real time. And if we do it at a time in low season we could actually close off the entire north parking lot and close off the entire road and still allow 20 or 25 cars an hour to park. Or actually well yeah, to park in the south lot. Mayor Laufenburger: Did that cover it? Councilwoman Ryan: It did for now, yes. Mayor Laufenburger: It did for now, okay thank you. Is there anybody else who would like to offer public comment at this time? Audience: I have one quick question. Mayor Laufenburger: Yeah I appreciate you may have a question but I really would like to hear from some others. Audience: Okay. Mayor Laufenburger: State your name and address and then if you’re in. th Kristin Kokkila: My name is Kristin Kokkila. My address is 13875 85 Place North in Maple Grove. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay and are you in opposition, in support, or in support with concerns? Kristin Kokkila: Support with concerns. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, take a deep breath and begin. Kristin Kokkila: Yeah. I have things here that were actually supposedly taken down from the fence and put, and catalogued and taken photos of and such. My question is, I’m not sure why these were laying in the mud. I have a whole. Oh I’m sorry, does that go? Okay. Mayor Laufenburger: May I call you Kristin? 61 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Kristin Kokkila: Yeah. Mayor Laufenburger: And you said that these were taken down and catalogued? Kristin Kokkila: Well that’s what the newspaper has said and that’s what they said just now. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, how many of these items do you have? Do you have a lot? Okay, alright. And what’s your question or concern Kristin? Kristin Kokkila: My concern I guess is that if there’s not a place for people to put things and if they do go and put something on the fence then we’re like told that then there’s going to be a huge fence put up. I don’t, I think there needs to be a place that there can be mementos left even if it’s I don’t know, maybe down by the creek where they didn’t take down the mementos, well at least that I didn’t see last week when I went on Tuesday. Mayor Laufenburger: So it sounds to me like what you’re saying is, you think or you would like to see or you think that Prince fans would like to see a special area that is allowed for these type of memorials. Is that what you’re saying? Kristin Kokkila: Right. Yeah. I have, I mean there are things from people from around the world in here. From Australia to Berlin to San Francisco to Texas. Everywhere. I’ve tried to find the owners for them to either give them back. I don’t know what to do with them if they’re not, you know I mean this one it clearly has clips on it. That just doesn’t fall off the fence in the wind so I just, I don’t know what happened. I do know that when they came down and took the th things off the fence for May 20. Mayor Laufenburger: That was for, when they brought in a, what do they call it? A historical preservation team. Kristin Kokkila: Yes. Yes and I was there and I saw how they were taking down the things and such and that they were in a nice manner and that it was orderly and every section of the fence was done properly and pictures were taken. I know that because I was there and you know for people then to see this and like you know, I mean they put their hearts into this. Really so and I mean the trip here is not cheap and so I think to pay for maybe a section of fence for $500 for people to put up things would just be kind of, I think just a nice thing for Prince fans to be able to show their love and support. Mayor Laufenburger: Just a couple things that I’d like to say. First of all your efforts to try to find the owners of these things, I think that’s to be commended. I think that we have certainly learned over the last 5 ½ months that Prince fans are indeed passionate. I don’t think there’s any, there’s no such thing as a cool Prince fan. Everybody is a hot. Cool as in temperature because all Prince fans are cool but Prince fans are hot in their passion for his legacy and so I understand 62 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 how people would have this passion so I commend you for that. But I also want to say the reality is the fence is private property and once something gets put on the fence it becomes private property and that’s outside of the realm of what the City can address. It’s outside of the realm of really what the whoever places it there can address. You understand that Kristin? Kristin Kokkila: Yeah. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay alright. But thank you for coming down from Maple Grove and thank you for demonstrating your love for the artist. Kristin Kokkila: Yeah, thank you. Mayor Laufenburger: I think you wanted to say something. Please state your name. Letitia Nadine Dyer: My name’s Letitia Nadine Dyer and I live at 8280 Market Boulevard here in Chanhassen. Mayor Laufenburger: Could I ask you just to spell your last name? Letitia Nadine Dyer: D-y-e-r. Mayor Laufenburger: Dyer. Letitia. Welcome Letitia. Are you speaking in opposition, in support or in support with concerns? Letitia Nadine Dyer: In support with concerns. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, Letitia please. Letitia Nadine Dyer: So I’m not opposed to Paisley Park studios becoming a museum if those were indeed Prince’s wishes but I’m put off by this rush to get it done. Prince was a perfectionist in every thing he did and the music and the concerts and every time he invited us into his home it was about the experience of the people that came. When you went to his show he was concerned about your experience in watching his show and so this rush to get everything planned and executed, and if it’s going to have Prince’s name on it then it should be, it should live up to Prince’s standards and what they’re doing does not. It feels like the sole objective is just to turn a quick dollar and not to preserve his legacy and his legacy is about excellence. It’s about love. It’s about openness. It’s about family and it’s not about money. Just some of the things that they brought out during the supposed traffic studies, and I know going down Market Boulevard, or I’m sorry going down Highway 5 on Saturday just trying to get to Lifetime to work out there’s always a little back up right about there and it’s, this is going to increase it. There’s, I mean it’s going to really impact people’s lives. You see people walking down Audubon Road not necessarily to see Paisley Park but people who live there who want to walk over to Lake Ann. I mean it’s a nice community. I’m from Dallas so you don’t get to walk everywhere in Dallas. 63 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Here I could walk, I would walk to work. I work in Chanhassen. I live in Chanhassen. I could walk all the time. I mean I don’t but it’s a possibility and if they’re blocking Audubon Road people are not going to be able to walk to Lake Ann or to the store or wherever they want to go just because they happen to pass by Paisley Park doesn’t mean that that’s their goal. You know that’s just part of the community. And I think it takes time to really understand how something this big is going to impact the community and it’s important that we take the time to understand that and do it the right way. And like Ms. Huston said it was several years before they opened Graceland to the public and it gave people time to mourn. It gave them time to plan and it gave them time to really think about the impact that that was going to have on the community and be part of the legacy. That’s it, thank you. Mayor Laufenburger: Thank you for your comments Ms. Dyer. I think we have time for just a couple more comments if there’s anybody. Please. State your name and address please. Anna Bader: Good evening. My name is Anna Bader, 18903 Hanus Road, Minnetonka. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Anna Bader: I live nearby. I’ve been. Oh sorry? Mayor Laufenburger: Are you speaking in opposition, in support or in support with concerns? Anna Bader: In support with concerns, thank you Mayor. I live nearby and I have been visiting Paisley Park for a very long time. I’m a very big Prince fan and I know it is a concern with safety and I appreciate all the work the team members here and the council members have done to do research on those safety concerns. I just wanted to add to some of the comments previously about the memorials that are being left for Prince. The reality is that people still want to leave those and just like we talked about people are going to run across the street when they’re at the Cars and Coffee or we’re still going to have that desire from fans so it’s more a comment geared towards Bremer Trust and the Graceland enterprises to consider a way that fans can continue to leave mementos and really give their love to Prince because they are so passionate about him because of the legacy he leaves behind. Prince fans don’t want this to be about money. They want this to be about him and they want to connect to him so my comment is just to give fans that opportunity. I have people from all over the world who have asked me to put things at the fence and I go and I do it and I film it for them and it’s very moving for them. It helps them grieve so it’s just a request that you would consider that as Graceland and Bremer Trust to give fans some method where they can put some portion of the fence, have that dedicated for fans. Yeah we know it will eventually be taken down but I mean people really feel a very spiritual connection to Paisley Park and to Prince and to have something like an artwork that they created for Prince left there, even if it’s for one day is very special to them. Thank you very much. 64 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Mayor Laufenburger: Thank you Ms. Bader. I think we have time for perhaps one more. Just a moment, did you speak at the Planning Commission? Denise Choiniere: I did briefly. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Just is there anybody who was not at the Planning Commission who would like to speak? Denise Choiniere: Hi, thank you. My name is Denise Choiniere. I live on 8481 Bittern Court in Chanhassen. For point of reference I live on the very first cul-de-sac off of Heron which is the very north most cul-de-sac in the neighborhood as you go south on Audubon. And my comments are. I did speak. Mayor Laufenburger: Are you speaking in opposition, in support or support with concerns? Denise Choiniere: I’m sorry, support with concern. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Denise Choiniere: I think I’d echo most of what everyone else has said tonight. I think Prince has only been gone not even 6 months so it does feel soon. My biggest concern is that even before the museum opens when I go out of Heron and try to go south on Audubon to take my son to high school for the multiple activities, I already have a challenge with getting out of the intersection safely as I’m turning left with northbound traffic and I expect there will be more northbound traffic. Mayor Laufenburger: And you’re taking your, you said your son to high school is that correct? Denise Choiniere: Yes. Mayor Laufenburger: And so what time of day is that? Denise Choiniere: Pardon? Mayor Laufenburger: What time of day is that? Denise Choiniere: Sometimes it’s in the morning. Right now he has marching band at 7:00 a.m. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Denise Choiniere: Sometimes it’s any time after school. Any time after 3:00 as late a 9:00. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. 65 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Denise Choiniere: Especially with he’s in the pit orchestra so I expect it could even be as late as 10:00 so many of the same hours that the museum will be operating. And so as we do the traffic study I know that they focused on the northern part of Audubon but I’d like to remind you that that traffic if it is coming on Audubon will be coming all the way from Lyman north to get to Paisley Park and Highway 5. And so I would encourage that the traffic study does consider how this impacts our neighborhoods. We don’t have lights. We’re all sitting at a stop sign waiting for traffic to clear. The other concern I have is we have a lot of high school students in those neighborhoods who drive to school. I see the chances they take now with the current traffic. It’s not pretty. There’s also been a lot of accidents down at Lyman and that short stretch going to Chan High School so I think you need to consider that as we increase traffic during school years that is going to be an impact. The traffic study was done the weekend before school started on that Monday. I would encourage us to stretch a little further than just looking at average numbers from the DOT and actually have some live experience much like some of you have visited Paisley Park and experienced that traffic. Drive up and down during some of those times and see what traffic really does look like. Come through my neighborhood and sit at that stop sign or the one on Osprey where that hill is coming up so steep you can’t see the traffic coming. Be the kid on the bicycle who’s trying to cross because they’re trying to get to school. Bluff Creek’s not that far away either so I just want us to be conscious of you know, I’ve lived there for over 25 years. Prince has been a great neighbor and I’d really be sad if something really sad happened because we didn’t do a really thorough good job of looking at traffic. Thank you. Mayor Laufenburger: Thank you. Mr. Pacyna can you just restate for us what was the date of the traffic study, just to clarify? Matt Pacyna: Mr. Mayor, just to clarify the date of the traffic study or the date the traffic data was collected? Mayor Laufenburger: Oh the date the traffic data was collected. Matt Pacyna: Okay the day that we actually collected a couple different times. We collected on th Thursday, August 25 and then we also collected a Saturday condition as well during that same th timeframe which was on August 27 and then we did a follow up on the Autoplex Saturday of I rd believe it was September 3 and collected traffic volumes along Audubon during that period as well. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Did I hear this correctly that you were estimating 600 additional cars per day south on Lyman, is that correct? Matt Pacyna: That would be under the sold out condition. A max. Mayor Laufenburger: Oh a max. 66 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Matt Pacyna: A max condition without any reductions. Basically sold out shows throughout the entire day from the hours of operations from 9:00 to 9:00. We didn’t assume any reductions as far as transit so that was trying to really represent a worst case condition. Mayor Laufenburger: And you referenced an average daily traffic on Audubon, I think did you say 5,000? You can check your… Matt Pacyna: So typical volumes are right around that 4,400 today volume. They’re actually a little bit lower further to the south in that 3,300 range the closer you get to Lyman so traffic volumes are a little bit higher the northern part of Audubon than they are on the southern part and you know south of the Paisley Park site we would expect that traffic volume to increase by about 600 assuming about a 15 percent… Mayor Laufenburger: So that’s the average daily traffic right now is as low as let’s say, use your number. You said 4,400? So 600 additional cars and again that would be a max and that would be assuming that they go all the way south to Lyman, so let’s assume that. That would be an increase of about 14 percent. Matt Pacyna: Ballpark yes. Mayor Laufenburger: And how many cars did you say that that road is designed to handle? Matt Pacyna: It’s a two lane facility so our planning level thresholds I mean easily typically in the 8,000 to 10,000 for an urban facility without any turn lanes and then if you start to add some turn lanes that can actually increase as well. Mayor Laufenburger: So we’re looking at, we’re looking at quite possibly around 50 percent of capacity even with the addition of those 600 cars? Matt Pacyna: Correct. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Alrighty. Okay I think I’m going to close the public comment period. Thank you very much to all of those of you that did comment and thank you for respecting the chamber and the council with your comments and the manner in which you presented them. I’m going to bring this back now to the council for any additional questions, discussion or a motion. Kate would you please put the motion up just so we have it available for reference if you wouldn’t mind. Okay, yes Councilwoman Tjornhom. Councilwoman Tjornhom: I’m going to start out the way the public hearing started out where people speak in favor, in support and against or with support with concerns and I am definitely a person that would be on the side of in support with concerns. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. 67 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Councilwoman Tjornhom: I have concerns and I have concerns from the very start of the process. I think it’s very unprecedented that we’ve had this big of a change in our community, a zoning change, potentially usage change and we never had one work session regarding it. I think the Planning Commission didn’t have time to do it’s due diligence when it came to our Comprehensive Plan and the rezoning of Paisley Park to a museum. I think that the Comprehensive Plan that we really use as a road map to our future, and we’ve designed that plan to fit our community the way it is now. We have not designed it or looked at it with the implication or the impact of having a museum and a potential entertainment center or the future and what that museum brings to our community. We haven’t looked at the impact of that with our community. Right now we have a Comprehensive Plan that deals with the Met Council projections for number of households and we also have our land and we have it zoned it with potential of businesses coming in and neighborhoods being developed. Not necessarily being a tourist attraction and because of that I think that we have one chance to get this right and for our community being rushed into such a major decision I just don’t think we’re being good stewards and good citizens. Good representation to our citizens. Mr. Weinshanker who’s been wonderful talking about being a good neighbor and being very open with plans and working with the City I think started his public comments out by saying it’s a work in progress and it really is a work in progress and I believe that it’s not complete. We still have way more answers than we have questions and I think that legally we have time to sit down as a council, as a Planning Commission to really get those questions answered because once this opens up it’s not going to close down and so then we’ll just be dealing with problems that we don’t have solutions for that we could have figured out before it even started so I’m going to request that we table this and bring it back to council after it’s been thoroughly looked at from the Planning Commission and staff. Mayor Laufenburger: We don’t normally act on requests. Is that what you’re leaving it at right now? Councilwoman Tjornhom: If we’re not sometimes during comments you’ll ask for a motion too but I would make a motion that the City Council consider tabling this and bringing it back after staff, Planning Commission and council have had time to analyze and assess the impacts that this will have to our community. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay I think what I need Councilwoman Tjornhom is if you want to make a motion make a motion. Just the action that you want. Not the supporting reasons why so. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Okay, Mr. Mayor I’d like to make a motion that the City Council tables the rezoning of Paisley Park. Mayor Laufenburger: Mr. Knutson I have a question for you. Can you help me with something? Roger Knutson: Certainly. 68 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Mayor Laufenburger: Does a motion to table require a time constraint or until a period of time? Roger Knutson: It’s usually preferable to do it that way but not necessarily. Mayor Laufenburger: Not required? Roger Knutson: But I would just point out that if we take the full 120 days that would put you rdrd out til December 23 and if you hadn’t acted by December 23 it would be automatically approved. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Do you want to leave your motion as it is Councilwoman Tjornhom? Councilwoman Tjornhom: Yes. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. The motion is to table the rezoning of the, table the action to rezone. Councilman McDonald: Question on the motion. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Councilman McDonald: The question I have on a motion you’ve put it forward so that at the burden falls upon the City. Planning Commission, staff. Is that your real intent or is the intent that the City would work with the applicant to come up with the proper planning? That’s what I’m not sure about. Councilwoman Tjornhom: I think that your wordage probably is better than mine was. Of course I would direct staff to work with the applicant. Councilman McDonald: Thank you. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Thank you Councilman McDonald. Mayor Laufenburger: What I’m trying to determine is if I have a valid motion. Mr. Knutson do I have a valid motion? Roger Knutson: Yes. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, alright. I have a valid motion to table the rezoning. Is there a second? 69 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Councilwoman Ryan: Second. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay I have a motion and a second. Councilwoman Ryan: Mr. Mayor may I ask? Mayor Laufenburger: Just a moment. Councilwoman Ryan: Okay. Mayor Laufenburger: Just a moment. Okay, now questions or discussion. Councilwoman Ryan. Councilwoman Ryan: My question and seconding that motion to Councilwoman Tjornhom’s point, I think it’s imperative that the council is also involved in some of these conversations to ask the applicant questions as well. In my review of this my biggest concern, like Councilwoman Tjornhom’s was is that council never had an opportunity to have a work session to discuss this application. This concept and so that concerned me. Secondly, well I’ll just leave it at that. So is there an opportunity that council will also have time to discuss this with staff and/or the applicant? Mayor Laufenburger: Well we don’t know that yet because we don’t know whether or not this motion will pass. Councilwoman Ryan: Okay, okay. Mayor Laufenburger: But any other questions or discussion? Mr. McDonald do you have any comment? Councilman McDonald: Well I’ve got comments. Always have comments. I guess the thing is, I will speak to Ms. Tjornhom’s motion and I’ll speak to the other motion if we get to that. Mayor Laufenburger: Only speak to the. Councilman McDonald: I will only speak to her motion at this point. Mayor Laufenburger: Please. Councilman McDonald: My concern with tabling this motion at this point, I’m concerned about the timeline and to Ms. Ryan’s point about council being involved I’m just not convinced that 120 days is sufficient time to do what I feel needs to be done on this entire motion that’s before us so because of that I guess I cannot support your motion but I do want to at least put out there why and the reason is I do not believe that there is sufficient time for council to be involved and 70 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 for everybody to do their due diligence that they need to do so I will be voting against the motion. Mayor Laufenburger: Any other question or comment? Mr. Campion did you want to make any comment? Not required. Councilman Campion: I would. Mayor Laufenburger: Not required. Councilman Campion: No I would count myself as a Prince fan as well and I would like to see the museum go forward. I do though share the sentiments that it would be nice to have more time to work through more of the details to ensure that you know as we go forward it is something that we’re all proud of. I’ll leave my comments at that. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Normally I would say what are the concerns that you have that need to be addressed? Oh Ms. Aanenson, is there a minimum time that we must deliberate on an application like this? Is there a minimum time required? You said the maximum is 120 days right? Kate Aanenson: I mean you can go through the Planning Commission once and the City Council in one hearing. It can happen that way sure. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. What I’ve seen, first of all the fact that this is desired to be a th museum, this isn’t new news. I mean this didn’t occur on August, what was the date? 19? nd Councilman McDonald: I thought it was the 22. nd Mayor Laufenburger: The 22. This isn’t new news. From the day that Prince passed away there was speculation and a conversations related to what was going to happen to Paisley Park so I can’t agree with the notion that this is new news. Furthermore from my perspective in looking at this the applicant, and I’m saying the applicant Bremer Trust in cooperation with Stinson Leonard, the firm that is helping with the real estate and also the operator, they have been fully responsive to the requests that the City has made including elements related to the traffic study. Things like that. There is also a requirement on the part of the City, city staff to ensure that if it’s rezoned a museum it is the city staff responsibility to ensure that the preparation of the site meets city standards. It’s just unclear to me what additional time will give us. We know Mr. Weinshanker has told us that he’s already throttled back the, throttled back from the maximum tickets. He’s throttled back from parking only to incorporate buses. We already have a site improvement plan that requires an additional traffic study. We already have a site improvement plan that incorporates elements of the, elements of the property that will include parking expansion. It will include moving the, moving the entrance. Excuse me the egress from the current north entrance to 100 feet south of that so we have, while I recognize it’s less than 120 71 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 days but we have a great deal of information related to what their plans are including they’re changing their plans related to the fence which was a big issue and now they’re saying that st they’re going to leave the fence in place. I have concerns too. I had concerns on April 21, would the City, would the citizens, would the city staff be prepared for the visitors that are going to come to Chanhassen and clearly evidence shows that we as a city, citizens, city staff, et cetera performed remarkably. There’s no question in my mind that the same guidance that the city staff provided for all of the unexpected situations, that same guidance and experience that was in place then remains in place today. So frankly I understand your desire to slow down but we’re not running. I don’t believe that the operator intends to run. I believe the operator intends to yes, the opening coincides with a family plan. Is it a family planned tribute concert is that correct Mr. Mazural? Pat Mazural? That’s correct Mr. Mayor. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay, so the family has planned a tribute concert and yes there will be people coming from lots of places and yes they do want to pay tribute to Prince through a participation and a tour of his, of his facility. If Prince were alive and there was a concert going on those, pardon? If Prince were alive and there was a concert going on in town and he wanted to invite people over to Paisley Park he would do that and we would allow that. So I’m, I have yet to hear what I think is a real valid concern about what a delay will give us that moving forward with the museum with the caveats that the city staff has put on the planned unit development and the site improvement plan does not protect us so that’s a concern that I have. Mr. Campion. Councilman Campion: Mr. Mayor, so I guess if I could ask a clarifying question or you know in the interest of potentially adding a date or you know to amend the motion. If there is a specific issue to be resolved that would or you know set of issues to trigger it coming back to council. Mayor Laufenburger: Well frankly I’d like to hear what issue is to be resolved if you’re offering that Mr. Campion. What issue is to be resolved? Councilman Campion: One issue I could consider or throw out there for discussion would be maybe to define the throttling. To what level we would throttle the participation until the north entrance is moved 220 feet south. You know something that’s more definite that would restrict the traffic flow to a certain level until that infrastructure is put in place. That’s one potential. Mayor Laufenburger: Mr. McDonald, you have a comment? Councilman McDonald: Mr. Mayor I was going to save these for basically the motion. I have a number of concerns and I just, you know as I said I do not believe that the current motion addresses those. I do not think that we have any idea of what happens with the impact further down on Audubon Road and that concerns me. I was on the council when we put in the sidewalks and we improved roads and the neighbors came and told us about the problems that 72 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 they were going to be having. Now we’re going to impact those more. I don’t know how much and I haven’t heard how much. It may be nothing. Mayor Laufenburger: Haven’t we heard? Councilman McDonald: No. What we heard was selectively on a couple of days that I do not think a representative of the normal flow on that road would be like and what I look at for a normal flow is you take the time during the fall part of the year when school is in session and you have everybody working down there, that’s going to be one number. You can take the number in the summer which they took toward the tail end and that’s going to be another number and that will be a lesser number just because you’ve thrown out some of the big impact that can be had on that road so I’m not convinced we know what the impact is throughout those neighborhoods and I think that needs to be looked at. The other thing I did not get a good answer about the pedestrians. I really believe that the safety of how you’re going to treat those and that falls mainly upon the applicant because it is on their property and as I said we have no authority on their property just like they have no authority on our property which are the roads so that needs to be addressed. You cannot just say we put out emails to the fans and they’re going to behave. Fans do not behave as this one lady back here said. They’re going to do what they want to do because whatever reason they put the blinders on and they’re convinced that they’re right and they will go forward and do it. I know this because I work with people on a daily basis. I am an attorney and I deal with people that put the blinders on and they get into a lot of trouble so I am not convinced that you can just tell me they’re going to behave. I want to see a plan how we’re going to do it. Then we bring up the issue as these ladies did about the fence. I had never thought about this and I thank you for bringing it up but I think you do need to have something for those fans that want to come up and mourn Prince’s passing. They have done that now by putting up the signs. The artwork. Whatever. It’s individualized. That needs to be addressed. I see nothing in the plan to address that. Granted it’s not part of anything the City would do but if you want to be a good neighbor and Prince would have done this you would include it in your plan. How are you going to accommodate all these people? I also believe it is way too soon after Prince’s death to try to say we’re going to do this. This takes time and planning and I don’t see that taking place here so that’s why I have a real problem with both the motion and the motion that Councilwoman Tjornhom has brought up because I think people need to do their homework. And I will say this, look I’ve been on the council for a number of years. I have been trained as to how we do things. We take our time in doing things. I have turned down numerous people because they wanted, trust me we’re going to do this. No. We’re not going to trust you. We vote against it until you deliver a plan. I just spent last week telling people that came before this council that we had done a plan and that I was convinced that plan was valid and it needed to move forward. I feel. Mayor Laufenburger: That was a different plan. Councilman McDonald: That was a different plant. I’m talking about plans in general and the way that the City handles these things. We tend to take our time and to look at things and to 73 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 make sure it is alright. I can go back to a number of developments that have come into this town that have failed because of lack of planning. I see no difference here except for the fact that yes, it’s Prince. It’s Prince’s museum which I will state I am in favor of. I think that you should do it. I just don’t think you’ve put enough thought into it yet so you’re looking for reasons why this shouldn’t go forward. I think there are enough there to ask the question and get an answer. I’m just not convinced you can do it in 120 days. I could be wrong and if that’s the case that’s fine but as everyone has said council has not been involved in this and I think our tradition is council needs to be involved. We’re the ones who ask those final questions. I agree with you mayor, staff does a marvelous job. You know my hat’s always off to them. I’m always amazed but I do not feel that this is a situation where we can just take what staff has given us and we go forward with it without being able to correct it. I had asked if there were a way that we could you know do this on a temporary basis just to find out the answers to these problems. I understand we can’t do that so I am left with a choice of voting yes or no and you know based upon that I can’t support these motions. Either Ms. Tjornhom’s or the one before the council but those are the reasons why I think the rest of council is a little bit concerned about all this is the scope of this, you’ve done a great job within the fences. No doubt about that but what about outside the fences? I don’t think that that has been addressed the way it should and I think that’s what the rest of council is trying to say. I could be wrong. I won’t speak for them. They can all chime in but those are my reasons why I can’t support this. Mayor Laufenburger: Any other comments? Councilwoman Tjornhom. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Going back to why we’re here, we’re here to rezone a property and we are turning into a PUD and usually a PUD means that there’s give and take. The applicant gets something unusual or something out of the ordinary and the City or the residents get something back for that with change and I’m going to read you what supposedly the PUD, what the residents from Chanhassen are getting in exchange for this rezoning to a museum which is a major tourist attraction. Let’s see the PUD states provides for limitations on how the building can be used including hours of operation, traffic flow and parking. I’m not sure that that sentence is accurate because when it comes to hours of usage it’s kind of loosey goosey still. You know we talked about how yeah they’re going to have hours of operation during the weekdays and even that has been inconsistent with this hearing tonight and then we talked about the concerts they’re going to have and the hours that that could be. How long they could be going on. And quite frankly like you just said in General Mills they don’t even have hours because it’s 24 hours a day so I’m not sure how limiting hours and the traffic flow obviously is still a concern and parking is still a concern and so I just think this first statement, it doesn’t really, it doesn’t count for a PUD for why it would be a good trade off. It preserves the existing building. That too, that could be anything that, any business that comes into town that’s moving into an existing building could say well great you get a PUD because of that. I don’t think that’s a really good trade off either. It’s not necessarily something that the community, it’s going to impact the community or make it a better place for them. Limited expansion preserves the existing trees. Once again in our ordinances we already have rules that state how we preserve existing trees and so once again that’s not necessarily a benefit to our residents. That’s a given. 74 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Creates additional jobs. 60 jobs? I mean we’ve turned down developments and applicants that have had maybe 200 or 300 jobs coming into town because of traffic and the size of their development coming in so once again I don’t think that is a benefit to our residents and tourism generates and supports existing businesses. That’s something we need to talk about as a community is do we want to be a tourist town? Yes we do have those people that are already in Chanhassen. We have the Arboretum. They’re great neighbors. We have the Dinner Theater. They’re great neighbors. Let’s talk about this. Let’s talk about the fact that we could be bringing in additional 600,000 people into our town. What is that impact on our community? I just think that all of these points for the PUD, it’s not enough. I think we need to go back as a council, as a Planning Commission, as staff, as the applicant and work on these issues. Mayor Laufenburger: Anybody else? We have a motion to table the rezoning. Roger Knutson: Mayor just to be clear I assume that includes all the items on the recommended motion. Tabling. Councilwoman Tjornhom: Yes all those items also. Roger Knutson: Site plan and everything else. Mayor Laufenburger: Councilwoman Tjornhom I think we are a tourist destination already. Councilwoman Tjornhom: I didn’t deny that. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Is there any further discussion? Councilwoman Tjornhom moved, Councilwoman Ryan seconded that the City Council table the rezoning of Lot 11, Block 1, Chanhassen Lakes Business Park from Industrial Office Park (IOP) to Planned Unit Development (PUD), adoption of the attached PUD Ordinance, and Site Improvement Performance Agreement and Findings of Fact. Councilwoman Tjornhom, Councilwoman Ryan, and Councilman Campion voted in favor. Councilman McDonald and Mayor Laufenburger voted in opposition. The motion carried with a vote of 3 to 2. Mayor Laufenburger: Mr. Knutson, does that require only a simple majority? Roger Knutson: That’s correct Mayor. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Is there any further discussion? Mr. Knutson is there, is there any further action that we need to take at this time? 75 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Roger Knutson: You can discuss how you want to proceed but it’s not necessary to do so. You could discuss whether you want to have work sessions. Whether you want to give more direction to staff to do certain things or set up meetings or. Mayor Laufenburger: Well I’ll open it. Is there any further discussion that you’d like to have regarding guidance for city staff? Mr. McDonald. Councilman McDonald: Yes Mr. Mayor. Thank you. I would like to see a comprehensive plan. I would like to know how you’re going to. Mayor Laufenburger: Wait a second. Councilman McDonald: I’m talking, okay I would like to see from the applicant a plan. A full blown plan that addresses a lot of the issues you’ve heard today. The fence. Pedestrians. How you’re going to handle Prince fans that you know want to come and just pay homage to the site because I want to know what impact that’s going to have upon the City. We’ve talked about Lake Ann. I’ve made my comments there. I’m concerned about Lake Ann during the summer because that is the premiere spot for the City and recreation so do we need to worry about Lake Ann as far as it’s capacity to park cars? And again I want to know what’s going to happen to the neighborhoods to the south on Audubon. Do we need to look at something down there? Do we need to look at lights? Stop signs. You know something down there if we’re going to impact the residents more than what we currently do. So I think that’s the City’s part. The applicant’s part is yeah, I’d like to know a little bit more about what you intend to do up on the site and how you’re going to address those issues. Mayor Laufenburger: Any other council members want to make a comment or suggestion? Councilwoman Ryan: Mr. Mayor? Mayor Laufenburger: Councilwoman Ryan. Councilwoman Ryan: To echo what Councilman McDonald said, specifically I would like to see an expansion of the traffic study area. I heard tonight reference of first phase and second phase of the site improvements and I would like to see a plan where these site improvements can be done prior to opening. I would like to see some of the civil plans because in some of the context, a sidewalk couldn’t be done because we needed approval from the watershed so I’d like to have a better understanding of what we need from the watershed to move, you know move these specific plans that put forth today but as well as the expansion of parking lots, et cetera so I’d like to have the civil plans to encompass more than just the sidewalk. And I think that’s it so those are my, and then again back to the pedestrian safety plan. I’d like to see something very specific around that. Thank you. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. Anybody else? Councilwoman Tjornhom. 76 Chanhassen City Council – October 3, 2016 Councilwoman Tjornhom: I also would like to address, like you said the impact of having a major tourist attraction in our town. Can our infrastructure handle it? We’ve talked about using buses to come through and drive people back and forth. Where are those buses going to be picking people up from? Do we have agreements with those people at the park and rides for that type of arrangement? And also we’ve never really just discussed public safety because if you’re going to bring that many people into town I am convinced that we will need more public safety for our residents and that’s going to be an impact on our budget and that’s going to be an impact on our residents and so this is not just about Paisley Park and a museum. It’s about our community. It’s about Chanhassen and preparing for the future. I mean we always talk about that that’s what we do. We live here today and we plan for the future and I just want to make sure that when we are making those plans that we’re wise and we do it right the first time. Mayor Laufenburger: Anybody else? Mr. Campion. Councilman Campion: Mr. Mayor, so I’d second the comments from the other council members and request that the plan that comes back you know as we look at traffic in more detail, that the plan for installing the infrastructure you know that we have maybe a graduated plan for when the doors open to you know what level of traffic you would have in there until the various other milestones of the infrastructure such as moving the north entrance or adding sidewalks or you know the lane modifications, you know just a phased plan for how it will be implemented rather than yeah we’ll just see how it goes. Mayor Laufenburger: Okay. You’ve, staff you’ve heard this? Okay. Is there a motion to adjourn? Councilman McDonald moved, Councilman Campion seconded to adjourn the meeting. All voted in favor and the motion carried unanimously with a vote of 5 to 0. The special City Council meeting was adjourned at 10:45 p.m. Submitted by Todd Gerhardt City Manager Prepared by Nann Opheim 77