01-07-98 Agenda and Packet FILE
AGENDA
CHANHASSEN PLANNING COMMISSION
WEDNESDAY, JANUARY 7, 1998 at 7:00 P.M.
CHANHASSEN CITY HALL, 690 COULTER DRIVE
CALL TO ORDER
PUBLIC HEARINGS
1. Consider an amendment to the City Code to allow fast food restaurants without a drive
through in a BN,Neighborhood Business District and a conditional use permit for a
Dominoes Pizza to be located in the Seven Forty-one Crossings Center.
NEW BUSINESS
OLD BUSINESS
APPROVAL OF MINUTES
ONGOING ITEMS
OPEN DISCUSSION
2. "Old Town"Chanhassen Schedule- Discussion.
3. Comprehensive Plan Update.
ADJOURNMENT
NOTE: Planning Commission meetings are scheduled to end by 10:30 p.m.as outlined in official by-laws. We will make
every attempt to complete the hearing for each item on the agenda. If,however,this does not appear to be possible,the Chair
person will notify those present and offer rescheduling options. Items thus pulled from consideration will be listed first on the
agenda at the next Commission meeting.
i
CITY OF
CHANHASSEN
690 COULTER DRIVE • P.O. BOX 147 • CHANHASSEN, MINNESOTA 55317
(612) 937-1900 • FAX (612) 937-5739
'`mss
MEMORANDUM
TO: Planning Commission
FROM: Cynthia Kirchoff, Planner I
DATE: December 30, 1997
SUBJ: Amend Section 20-694 to include fast food restaurants without drive-through
windows as a conditional use in the BN, Neighborhood Business district and a
request for conditional use permit#97-6 for the operation of Domino's Pizza at
2407 W. Hwy. 7 (7 & 41 Crossings)
PROPOSAL
Ed Carr of Domino's Pizza has requested a zoning ordinance amendment to allow fast food
restaurants without drive-through windows as a conditional use in the BN, Neighborhood
Business, district. This amendment would allow customers to eat the food at the restaurant,
carry-out the food or have it delivered. There is also a request for a conditional use permit to
allow Domino's to locate at 2407 W. Hwy. 7. This development is zoned BN, Neighborhood
Business.
BACKGROUND
The BN,Neighborhood Business district intends to provide"low intensity neighborhood retail
and service establishments to meet daily needs of residents." The following are some of the
permitted uses in this district: convenience stores without gas pumps, neighborhood oriented
retail shops, dry cleaners, personal services, professional offices and health services.
The conditional uses in this district are:
1. convenience store with gas pumps
2. drive-in banks including automated kiosks
3. standard restaurants
4. bed and breakfast establishments.
•
Amendment to Section 20-694
December 30, 1997
Page 2
Although these uses will serve the needs of the neighborhood, they will create additional traffic.
This traffic and other concerns (i.e.,parking, lighting,noise, hours of operation, etc.)warrants the
need for the conditional use permit.
The City Code differentiates between standard and fast food restaurants. Standard restaurants are
a conditional use in this district but are permitted in the BH, CBD and BG districts. In this type
of restaurant the food and beverages are served by an employee and they consumed within the
building. Whereas, the fast food restaurant"means an establishment whose principal; business is
the sale of food and/or beverages in a ready-to-consume state for consumption:
1. Within restaurant building;
2. Within a motor vehicle parked on the premises; or
3. Off the premises as carry-out orders;
and whose principal method of operation includes the following characteristics:
a. Food and/or beverages are usually packaged prior to sale and are served in edible containers
or in paper, plastic or other disposable containers;
b. The customer is not served food at his table by an employee, but receives it at a counter
window, or similar facility and carries it to another location on or off the premises for
consumption."
Fast food restaurants are not permitted nor are they a conditional use in the BN district. They
are, however, permitted in the BH, Highway Business, and BG, General Business, districts. In
the CBD, Central Business District,they are a permitted use if they are part of a shopping center,
but are a conditional use if they are free standing.
ZONING ORDINANCE AMENDMENT
ANALYSIS
The amendment limits the type of restaurant to fast food without a drive-through and the location
as being part of a shopping center in order to maintain the intent of the district. A restaurant
without a drive-through window located in a shopping center will not create the traffic as a
"traditional"fast food restaurant in a free standing building. This will still allow those
neighboring residents to enjoy such services without altering the character of the neighborhood.
This use may also fill in a service void that may exist in that area of the City.
This type of use would serve the residents of the surrounding residential developments.
Customers could consume the food at the restaurant,pick it up or have it delivered by an
employee. Being this request is specifically for Domino's,the use would not substantially
increase traffic because many of the customers would not be traveling to the restaurant.
Amendment to Section 20-694
December 30, 1997
Page 3
However, if the tenant would change to a more intense fast food restaurant, more issues may
surface. This is the basis for the requirement for the conditional use permit.
Staff believes a conditional use permit should be required because a fast food restaurant without
a drive-through will still increase vehicular movements and affect the intent of the district.
Although the amendment was requested by Domino's ,who only deliver pizza, it could change to
a more intense user. Therefore, staff would like to protect the intent of the district by requiring a
permit.
Staff recommends approval of the zoning ordinance amendment to allow fast food restaurants
without drive-through windows as part of a shopping center as a conditional use permit in the BN
district.
RECOMMENDATION
Staff recommends that the Planning Commission adopt the following motion:
"The Planning Commission recommends approval of the amendment to Section 20-694 to permit
fast food restaurants without drive-through windows as part of a shopping center(not a free
standing building) as a conditional use in the BN,Neighborhood Business district."
CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT
ANALYSIS
The conditional use permit would allow Domino's Pizza to locate in an existing shopping center.
This operation would only deliver the pizza, so the customer would have no need to travel to
Domino's. These customers intend to be within 1 to 1 %2 miles of the restaurant. Staff does
believe that this service will be a benefit for those residents in the northern portion of the City.
Staff recommends approval of the conditional use permit to allow Domino's to operate a
restaurant without a drive-through at 2407 W. Hwy. 7.
FINDINGS
The Planning Commission shall recommend a conditional use permit and the council shall issue
such conditional use permits only if it finds that such use at the proposed location:
1. Will not be detrimental to or damage the public health, safety, comfort, convenience or general
welfare of the neighborhood of the city.
Amendment to Section 20-694
December 30, 1997
Page 4
Finding: The restaurant will not be detrimental to or damage the public health, safety,
comfort and general welfare of the community. This will enable residents in the northern part of
the City to have pizza delivery.
2. Will be consistent with the objectives of the city's comprehensive plan and this chapter.
Finding: This area of the City is guided medium density residential. As part of the current
comprehensive plan amendment staff intends to change the land use top commercial
to make it consistent. Staff believes that the proposal will be consistent with the
objectives of the comprehensive plan.
3. Will be designed, constructed, operated and maintained so to be compatible in appearance with
the existing or intended character of the general vicinity and will not change the essential
character of that area.
Finding: The applicant will not alter the exterior of the existing building but interior
remodeling will take place. However, a building permit is required prior to the
restaurant locating in the shopping center.
4. Will not be hazardous or disturbing to existing or planned neighboring uses.
Finding: The restaurant will not be hazardous to existing or planned neighborhood uses.
5. Will be served adequately by essential public facilities and services, including streets, police
and fire protection, drainage structures, refuse disposal, water and sewer systems and schools;
or will be served adequately by such facilities and services provided by the persons or agencies
responsible for the establishment of the proposed use.
Finding: The restaurant will be served adequately by public facilities and services.
6. Will not create excessive requirements for public facilities and services and will not be
detrimental to the economic welfare of the community.
Finding: The proposal will not create excessive requirements for public facilities and services
and will not be detrimental to the economic welfare of the community.
7. Will not involve uses,activities,processes,materials,equipment and condition of operation that
will be detrimental to any persons, property or the general welfare because of excessive
production of traffic,noise, smoke, fumes,glare,odors,rodents,or trash.
Amendment to Section 20-694
December 30, 1997
Page 5
Finding: The restaurant will not be detrimental to any persons,property or the general welfare
because of excessive production of traffic, noise, smoke, fumes, glare, odors,
rodents or trash. Hours of operation will be from 8:00 a.m. to midnight.
8. Will have vehicular approaches to the property which do not create traffic congestion or
interfere with traffic or surrounding public thoroughfares.
Finding: The proposal has vehicular approaches to the property which do not create traffic
congestion or interfere with traffic surrounding public thoroughfares. Access will
be gained through the existing driveway.
9. Will not result in the destruction, loss or damage of solar access, natural, scenic or historic
features of major significance.
Finding: The restaurant location will not result in the destruction, loss or damage of solar
access, natural,scenic or historic features of major significance.
10. Will be aesthetically compatible with the area.
Finding: Since the exterior of the existing building will not be altered, the restaurant will be
aesthetically compatible with the area.
11. Will not depreciate surrounding property values.
Finding: The proposal will not depreciate surrounding property values.
12. Will meet standards prescribed for certain uses as provided in this article.
Finding: The proposal meets the standards provided in this article.
RECOMMENDATION
Staff recommends that the Planning Commission adopt the following motion:
"The Planning Commission recommends approval for conditional use permit #97-6 for the
operation of Domino's Pizza, located at 2407 W. Hwy. 7 (7 & 41 Crossings), based upon the
findings presented in the staff report and with the following conditions:
1. All signage must comply with the City Code.
2. The operation shall comply with all conditions of site plan review#86-2.
Amendment to Section 20-694
December 30, 1997
Page 6
3. The hours of operation shall be from 8 a.m. to 12:00 a.m.
4. The applicant shall obtain a building permit for the interior remodeling."
ATTACHMENTS
1. Application
2. Section 20-691, BN District Requirements
3. Site Plan
4. Site Plan Review#86-2 Conditions of Approval
5. Property Owners
\\cfs I\vo12\plan\ck\zoabn.fastfood.doc
CIN OF CHANHASSEN
CITY OF CHANHASSEN
690 COULTER DRIVE
CHANHASSEN, MN 55317 DEC 0 8 1997
(612) 937-1900
C,HANhra-1:-w rLn1a.1wu L.'_rT
DEVELOPMENT REVIEW APPLICATION
APPLICANT: LOD424 OWNER: 4,1/1-c—/4/✓t. crne
ADDRESS: J 4,' / /Q f//�/tJ`S /4224 ADDRESS: ST-92— I,/ S G� L-A/
ll( /A/A/6T0/1 A4A/
TELEPHONE (Day time) 93 — 2i U 0 TELEPHONE: 923-2 24 0
Comprehensive Plan Amendment
Temporary Sales Permit
X Conditional Use Permit _ Vacation of ROW/Easements
Interim Use Permit Variance
Non-conforming Use Permit Wetland Alteration Permit
Planned Unit Development' Zoning Appeal
Rezoning _ Zoning Ordinance Amendment
Sign Permits
Sign Plan Review Notification Sign
Site Plan Review` X Escrow for Filing Fees/Attorney Cost"
($50 CUP/SPRNACNAR/WAP/Metes
and Bounds, $400 Minor SUB)
Subdivision* TOTAL FEE$ M.CO
A list of all property owners within 500 feet of the boundaries of the property must be included with the
application.
Building material samples must be submitted with site plan reviews.
`Twenty-six full size folded copies of the plans must be submitted, including an 81/2" X 11" reduced copy of
transparency for each plan sheet.
**Escrow will be required for other applications through the development contract
NOTE-When multiple applications are processed,the appropriate fee shall be charged for each application.
PROJECT NAME 1)0/Al f•J P12.-ziete
LOCATION 2 Vol W. ,/(,t) v 7 (74- y/ CASs/c,‘ CE,✓rele)
LEGAL DESCRIPTION
TOTAL ACREAGE
WETLANDS PRESENT YES NO
PRESENT ZONING
REQUESTED ZONING
PRESENT LAND USE DESIGNATION
REQUESTED LAND USE DESIGNATION
REASON FOR THIS REQUEST CSM C1 ItCY){l . --dim l+ ft-+ cp t gut C1
of Ci t iood r tauran t
This application must be completed in full and be typewritten or clearly printed and must be accompanied by all information
and plans required by applicable City Ordinance provisions. Before filing this application, you should confer with the Planning
Department to determine the specific ordinance and procedural requirements applicable to your application.
A determination of completeness of the application shall be made within ten business days of application submittal. A written
notice of application deficiencies shall be mailed to the applicant within ten business days of application.
This is to certify that I am making application for the described action by the City and that I am responsible for complying with
all City requirements with regard to this request. This application should be processed in my name and I am the party whom
the City should contact regarding any matter pertaining to this application. I have attached a copy of proof of ownership (either
copy of Owner's Duplicate Certificate of Title,Abstract of Title or purchase agreement), or I am the authorized person to make
this application and the fee owner has also signed this application.
I will keep myself informed of the deadlines for submission of material and the progress of this application. I further
understand that additional fees may be charged for consulting fees, feasibility studies, etc. with an estimate prior to any
authorization to proceed with the study. The documents and information I have submitted are true and correct to the best of
my knowledge_
The city hereby notifies the applicant that development review cannot be completed within 60 days due to public hearing
requirements and agency review. Therefore, the city is notifying the applicant that the city requires an automatic 60 day
extension for development review. Development review shall be completed within 120 days unless additional review
extension are approved by the applicant.
/b//t/A"' l 'M 7
Signature of Applicant Date
Signature of Fee Owner �1rr11 Date
Application Received on Gr7 Fee Paid 1U .� Receipt No. a-Ce
The applicant should contact staff for a copy of the staff report which will be available on Friday prior to the meeting.
If not contacted,a copy of the report will be mailed to the applicant's address.
C`Iry OF CHANHASSEN
RECEIVED
CITY OF CHANHASSEN
690 COULTER DRIVE DEC 0 3 1997
CHANHASSEN, MN 55317
(612) 937-1900 CrlhfY(InJJGy I-4.011111U utPT
DEVELOPMENT REVIEW APPLICATION
APPLICANT: ti-7)•-i�i��rti_ �.t E =r+F OWNER: ') I Ce11:71*--\
ADDRESS: 1))2-1-1- 7` I mcr `L, f. ADDRESS:
TELEPHONE(Daytime) (..c I l-- tipI ".)?(.0 TELEPHONE: ( _ -'Y`-i l D)( '+T
Comprehensive Plan Amendment
Temporary Sales Permit
Conditional Use Permit Vacation of ROW/Easements
interim Use Permit Variance
Non-conforming Use Permit _ Wetland Alteration Permit
Planned Unit Development` Zoning Appeal
Rezoning X Zoning Ordinance Amendment
Sign Permits
Sign Plan Review Notification Sign
Site Plan Review' X Escrow for Filing Fees/Attorney Cost**
($50 CUP/SPRNACNARANAP/Metes
and Bounds, $400 Minor SUB)
Subdivision' TOTAL FEE$ 500-CD
A list of all property owners within 500 feet of the boundaries of the property must be included with the
application.
Building material samples must be submitted with site plan reviews. ,
`Twenty-six full size folded copies of the plans must be submitted, including an 81/2" X 11" reduced copy of
transparency for each plan sheet.
**Escrow will be required for other applications through the development contract
NOTE-When multiple applications are processed, the appropriate fee shall be charged for each application.
PROJECT NAME 1 `i �f 1 �, ::` (__� : ;� •
LOCATION t- ('-•f-m L,A ` y I
LEGAL DESCRIPTION Tto-v-i7
TOTAL ACREAGE -fi- �t��--`�-
WETLANDS PRESENT YES NO
PRESENT ZONING 1.1 \\ I` : .�
REQUESTED ZONING cr``ic !, L (;,Yk.-r G; l �� C -L-L Z ..
PRESENT LAND USE DESIGNATION
` it -
REQUESTED LAND USE DESIGNATION - \�. �,' �_ r -
REASON FOR THIS REQUEST •L= L„ ,:i- •`�.� i-1.c \
• �\ .' t-C�i .'�,i.�Z �1.�.)�:, , moi` �_ rr LLA C: c" . -\c <
) ;_l_}: 1�-� C�tl l`_L 7L� l� �-rl:��j ‘, Ti,Z<<•-
This application must be completed in full and be typewritten or clearly printed and must be accompanied by all information
and plans required by applicable City Ordinance provisions. Before filing this application, you should confer with the Planning
Department to determine the specific ordinance and procedural requirements applicable to your application.
A determination of completeness of the application shall be made within ten business days of application submittal. A written
notice of application deficiencies shall be mailed to the applicant within ten business days of application.
This is to certify that I am making application for the described action by the City and that I am responsible for complying with
all City requirements with regard to this request. This application should be processed in my name and I am the party whom
the City should contact regarding any matter pertaining to this application. I have attached a copy of proof of ownership (either
copy of Owner's Duplicate Certificate of Title, Abstract of Title or purchase agreement), or I am the authorized person to make
this application and the fee owner has also signed this application.
I will keep myself informed of the deadlines for submission of material and the progress of this application. I further
understand that additional fees may be charged for consulting fees, feasibility studies, etc. with an estimate prior to any
authorization to proceed with the study. The documents and information I have submitted are true and correct to the best of
my knowledge_
The city hereby notifies the applicant that development review cannot be completed within 60 days due to public hearing
requirements and agency review. Therefore, the city is notifying the applicant that the city requires an automatic 60 day
extension for development review. Development review shall be completed within 120 days unless additional review
extensions are approved by the applicant.
/-1(:,
Signature of Applicant ff. L,<-c Date
Signature of Fee Owner Date
3
Application Received on C� Fee Paid 4i i c 5W (3° Receipt No.
The applicant should contact staff for a copy of the staff report which will be available on Friday prior to the meeting.
If not contacted,a copy of the report will be mailed to the applicant's address.
F r '
• L
November 17, 1997
f � z
f Ms. NallCyMallcino
6620 G.alpin Blvd.
Excelsior;MN 55331
z
:• 7 41 Crossings Shopping Center
Chanhassen,MN 55331
Dear Mayor Maneino,
I am writing on behalf of the owner of the above referenced shopping
center and Mr Ed Car-r-, owner of BloomiRgton Pizza which operates as
Dominos Pizza. As you are most likely aware,Dominos Pizza is a pizza delivery
business which operates primarily from strip centers located in the
neighborhoods which they service. Mr. Carr recently opened another Dominos
Pizza location in Chanhassen located near Highway 5 and whose appearance
and operating practices have been exemplary. A1r. Carr and the Landlord have
come to an agreement of terms whereby Mr. Carr would open a second location
at the above referenced location in Chanhassen,primarily to service the hollies
within one and one half miles of 7&41 Crossings. During the process of
working with planning staff it became clear to the surprise of all, that a pizza
• deli very business is strangely precluded from tenancy at this center due to the
current neighborhood business zoning The pizza delivery business is a
common tenant within shopping centers similar to 7&41 Crossings,however;it
1 c 1101 1117i'o177r11 o11 for zoning to call for a special use permit. We do not believe
the o1 igJ17 al intent of the cur ent zoning was to preclude this particular t l pe of
tenant, but to control fast food types of tenants. Dominos Pizza would fit
• appropriately with other allowable uses outlined in the zoning and it would
•
seem most appropriate to add this classification,Pizza Deliver, to the other
classifications r'equifi g a special use perillit rather than to rezone the center
Both the Landlord and Mi: Carr-have enjoyed positive experiences working with
the City of Chai111aSSe17 in the past,and we look forward to work nig with you
toward a C0171111O11 SOlflti011 tO this su1171is74 coni licafli)ll.
I have attached a copy of the zoning code ill question Ihr your review as Hell
••• f' as a site plan indicatnlg the desired location for the store. I would be pleased to
answer au questions which you may have or provide you with additional
information. Malik you in advance for your attention to this matter:
Sincerely,
�viler H Greene
Ie President
} _.
z
11.1
November 18, 1997 CITY C.=�
E-
K
v
Ms Kate Aaneson
Director of Planning
City of Chanhassen
690 Coultier Drive
Chanhassen,MN 55317
RE: 7&41 Crossing Shopping Center
Chanhassen,Minnesota
Dear Ms.Aaneson,
Attached please find a copy of the letter that was sent to Mayor Mancino
and the four members of the City Council indicating the desire of Domino's
Pizza to locate a second store in Chanhassen at the above referenced center and
the problem that exists relative to the current BN zoning as pointed out by your
staff. As indicated in the attached letter, we hope consideration may be given to
adding this specific use to those categories outlined under the conditional use
section of the zoning rather then to require the rezoning of the property which
would give much broader rights relative to permitted uses than necessary or
desired.
It is our hope that this solution may be acceptable allowing us to proceed
with Mr. Ed Carr, the owner of the business. Thank you for any consideration
you may provide in this matter.
Sincerely,
>/ '1
ems . . Greene
5500 Way •to Blvd. VI'- President
Suite 1050
Minneapolis
Minnesota
-- i6
si.:.
Phone
- 6i2-591-2260
Fax
612-591-221;1
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City of Chanhassen AT AC4iEKT
Carver and Hennepin Counties , Minnesota
In the matter of Chanhassen Planning Case : 86-2 Site Plan Review
Owner: Seven Forty One Partnership Applicant: Roger Zahn
Street Address : P.I.N. : 25-7940020
Legal Description : Lot 2, Block 1, Seven-Forty One Crossing
roval of retail shopping center.
Purpose: App
Zoning District: BN, Neighborhood Business District
The above entitled matter was heard before the Planning Commission
• on March 16, 1988 and up for final
action berore the Chanhassen City Council on April 11, 1988
The City Council ordered that a site plan approval
NRSV9 be granted based upon the documentation contained in
Planning File 86-2 Site Plan Review subject to the conditions on attached
Exhibit A.
State of Minnesota)
)ss
Carver County )
I, Jo Ann Olsen City Planner for the City of Chanhassen,
do hereby certify that I have compared the foregoing with the
original record thereof , and have found the same to be a correct
and true summary thereof .
Witness my hand and official seal of Chanhassen, Minnesota, this
day of , 19
Chanhassen City Planner
NOTE
Pte,; -
._ t
EXHIBIT A
1 . The site plan shall meet the conditions of the conditional
use permit approval .
2 . The wall signs shall meet the requirements of the ordinance.
3 . No signage will be permitted on the gas canopy.
4 . All rooftop equipment must be screened from view from any
direction.
5 . The trash enclosure must be totally screened.
F . The applicant shall not receive a building permit until MnDOT
has approved access permits for Hwy. 7 and Hwy. 41 , the access
points have been installed and the final plat and development
contract for HSZ had been recorded with Carver County.
7 . The revised plan shall be reviewed and approved by the
Minnesota Department of Transportation prior to final site
plan review and comply with their conditions .
8 . Storm sewer calculations shall be submitted to the City
Engineer for approval prior to final site plan review.
9 . A^ erosion control plan shall be submitted to the City
Engineer for approval prior to final site plan review.
10 . The applicant shall provide the City with a copy of the exe-
cuted roadway easement for the portion of Lot 2 , Block 1
which serves the westerly access for the subject parcel .
11 . Utility service for this property is contingent upon the HSZ
site improvements .
12 . No building permits shall be issued to SuperAmerica until all
building permits have been provided to HSZ and development
starts on the shopping center.
OFFISTATE OF MINNESOTTA DER
COUNTY OF CARVER
Filing Fee
ALZ.2_____
This is to certify that th�i+s, do�c�'�-ent
w/filed 19fD ate?th o clock
M. and was duly recorded as
document no. 111125
CAR W.HANSON JR.
aunty
a �_ ./
&,) /4 %)-b<__.-
ttiz
(\
NOTICE OF PUBLIC HEARING .
PLANNING COMMISSION '' _
Wednesday, January 7, 1998 ���I��"-� ''�� ������
at 7.0 p �4 ��� ��� ,��`,+ �
Cit Hall Council Chambers o�i�■isl\` ���! I
y 690 Coulter Drive OWT4 11111No 444 AA —
-44
SUBJECT: Zoning Ordinance Amendment c iNot 4
and Conditional Use Permit a7
for Domino's Pizza co j: '
APPLICANT: Bloomington Pizza/PBK w�� Mit��
aiv
Investments, Inc. ,,
i
LOCATION: 7 & 41 Crossing Center
Hwy. 7 and 41
NOTICE: You are invited to attend a public hearing about a proposal in your area. The
applicant, Bloomington Pizza and PBK Investments, are requesting a zoning ordinance
amendment to allow a restaurant without a drive through in a BN, Neighborhood Business
District and a conditional use permit to allow a restaurant (Domino's Pizza) in a BN,
Neighborhood Business District located in the 7 & 41 Crossing Center.
What Happens at the Meeting: The purpose of this public hearing is to inform you about the
developer's request and to obtain input from the neighborhood about this project. During the
meeting, the Commission Chair will lead the public hearing through the following steps:
1 . Staff will give an overview of the proposed project.
2. The Developer will present plans on the project.
3. Comments are received from the public.
4. Public hearing is closed and the Commission discusses project. The commission will then
make a recommendation to the City Council.
Questions and Comments: If you want to see the plans before the meeting. please stop by City
Hall during office hours, 8:00 a.m. to 4:30 p.m., Monday through Friday. If you wish to talk to
someone about this project, please contact Cindy at 937-1900 ext. 117. If you choose to
submit written comments. it is helpful to have one copy to the department in advance of the meeting.
Staff will provide copies to the Commission.
Notice of this public hearing has been published in the Chanhassen Villager on January 1 , 1998.
BENJAMIN GOWEN JOANNE&SHAWN KILLIAN 7-41 PARTNERSHIP
6440 HAZELTINE BLVD 2449 WEST 64TH STREET C/O R.SOSKIN 5591 BRISTOL LANE
EXCELSIOR, MN 55331 EXCELSIOR, MN 55331 MINNETONKA, MN 55343
RICK G BATESON RUSSELL&LYNN PAULY 7-41 PARTNERSHIP
6440 ORIOLE AVE 2447 WEST 64TH STREET 5500 WAYZATA BLVD. SUITE 620
EXCELSIOR, MN 55331 EXCELSIOR, MN 55331 MINNEAPOLIS, MN 55416
JODY B. MAJERES HOWARD&MICHELLE NELSON SUPER AMERICA 4366
6450 ORIOLE AVE 2445 WEST 64TH STREET PO BOX 14004
EXCELSIOR, MN 55331 EXCELSIOR, MN 55331 LEXINGTON, KY 40512
AGNES ANDERSON S. STEWART/F. BRITZIUS MARK& LORENA FLANNERY
6470 ORIOLE AVE 2444 WEST 64TH STREET 2350 MELODY HILL ROAD
EXCELSIOR, MN 55331 EXCELSIOR, MN 55331 EXCELSIOR, MN 55331
DALE&KELLY HANCE MICHELLE CURTIS GARY BRUNSVOLD
6480 ORIOLE AVE 2446 WEST 64TH STREET 6287 CHASKA ROAD
EXCELSIOR, MN 55331 EXCELSIOR, MN 55331 EXCELSIOR, MN 55331
THOMAS RODE NANCY JO PERKINS ALLEN PUTNAM
8275 CHASKA ROAD 2448 WEST 64TH STREET 6285 CHASKA ROAD
EXCELSIOR, MN 55331 EXCELSIOR, MN 55331 EXCELSIOR, MN 55331
BARBARA PIKE ROR INC
6421 ORIOLE AVENUE 2461 WEST 64TH STREET
EXCELSIOR, MN 55331 EXCELSIOR, MN 55331
MARJORIE/C.E. WOOSLEY JR JAN REED
2511 HIGHWAY 7 2461 WEST 64TH STREET
EXCELSIOR, MN 55331 EXCELSIOR, MN 55331
GARY REED GARY CARLSON
2461 WEST 64TH STREET 3891 WEST 62ND STREET
EXCELSIOR, MN 55331 EXCELSIOR, MN 55331
GARY S. REED MARJORIE COLLINS
2471 WEST 64TH STREET 3931 ASTER TRAIL
EXCELSIOR, MN 55331 EXCELSIOR, MN 55331
CHANHASSEN PLANNING COMMISSION'
REGULAR MEETING
DECEMBER 3, 1997
Vice Chairman Joyce called the meeting to order at 7:05 p.m.
MEMBERS PRESENT: Allyson Brooks, Alison Blackowiak, Kevin Joyce, LuAnn Sidney, and
Matt Burton. Ladd Conrad arriving during item 2.
MEMBERS ABSENT: Craig Peterson
STAFF PRESENT: Kate Aanenson, Planning Director; Bob Generous, Senior Planner; Dave
Hempel, Asst. City Engineer; and Sharmin Al-Jaff, Planner II
PUBLIC HEARING:
CONCEPTUAL PUD REQUEST FOR AN OFFICE-INDUSTRIAL PROJECT WHICH
WOULD PERMIT A CHURCH/INSTITUTIONAL USE ON PROPERTY ZONED A2,
AGRICULTURAL ESTATE AND LOCATED SOUTH OF HWY 5 AND NORTH OF
COULTER BOULEVARD AT STONE CREEK DRIVE ON 27.3 ACRES, LAND GROUP
INC. AND BLUFF CREEK PARTNERS, BLUFF CREEK CORPORATE CENTER.
Public Present:
Name Address
Liv Homeland 8804 Knollwood, Eden Prairie
Ron Erickson KKG Architects
Ken Adolf Schoell & Madsen
Jim Sulerud 730 Vogelsberg Trail
Steve Nomes 1451 Heron Drive
Randy Koepsell 1110 Dove Court
John Arnott 8816 Ridge Ponds Drive
Dorothy Downing 7200 Juniper Road
Margaret M. Parsons 3732 Hickory, Excelsior
Bob Generous presented the staff report on this item.
Joyce: Are there any questions for staff at this time? Bob I have one question and it might be
cleared up when the applicant stops up here but I noticed on the original concept that there was a
north, excuse me. Yeah. Northeast corner there's an 80 foot setback for the Bluff Creek. Is that
going to be, have they changed that or what's the theory behind that?
Generous: They haven't changed that yet. They said, in their comments they said they shifted...
20 foot on the other side of the creek. As you can look at our design standards...
Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
Joyce: So that's what we're sticking to right now is a 100 foot? Okay, that's I guess what I
wanted to clear up. So obviously they're going to have, well we'll see what happens, right.
Okay. One last, there was one last question. There was a question, there was a letter from the
DNR regarding those setbacks and the accuracy of the calculations of the setbacks. Are you
pretty firm on the setbacks as far as, I just noted that, where the heck is that letter. It says in
addition it's unclear on the site plan where the structure setbacks are being measured from on the
creek. The watershed district measures setbacks from the center of the creek and the city
shoreline regulations measure from the OHW, which is the top bank of the channel on the creek.
I'm just pointing that out. Was there any concern on your part or do you feel comfortable with
it?
Generous: I think we can...that up. The center line...is the easiest to measure.
Joyce: That's what I was thinking of, yeah. Okay. All right. Is the applicant here and willing to
address the Planning Commission please. If you could step forward to the.
Ron Erickson was not speaking into a microphone and his comments were not picked up on tape.
Ken Adolf: Good evening, I'm Ken Adolf with Schoell & Madsen. First of all on item 17. At
this point drainage calculations have not been done to size the ponds. The intent is to provide
much of the storm water storage requirements in the basin on the north side of the church and
without having done all of the calculations, we don't know if that's large enough so we had
identified secondary area to provide additional storage if necessary. Again those basins would be
designed and sized in accordance with the city and watershed district requirements. On item 25,
just refers to the public streets. The item talks about a cul-de-sac. With the revised plan here the
intent is to go with a thru street connecting to Highway 5 allowing a right-in and right-out access
at that point. I think that's the extent of the engineer issues.
Ron Erickson made some more comments at this point.
Joyce: Well I think we're all just giving everybody a little direction here. We have to give you
some and then the City Council and decide if this concepts makes any sense or not so, yeah.
Does anybody have any questions for the applicant?
Brooks: I don't know if...
Ken Adolf: Well at this point no work is proposed below the ordinary high water elevation.
Actually the city ordinances prohibit any type of disturbance in the 50 feet setback from the creek
so we're not anticipating that there would be.
Blackowiak: I had a question. I don't know who to address this to but in the narrative, one of
your statements has to do with the creation of a TIF district. I'd like to hear from you about some
of the benefits...city or why we should consider that.
2
Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
Liv Homeland made a comment that did not get picked up by the microphones.
Sidney: Question for the applicant. What was the motivation for switching to the access to
Highway 5 from the original plan?
Liv Homeland...
Sidney: Okay, and then for the grading, the smaller buildings seem to work, yeah.
Liv Homeland...
Sidney: I have a few more comments Mr. Chairman.
Joyce: Sure.
Sidney: Okay. This question for staff. I guess I should have asked that on the first part but I'm
wondering whether these buildings are actually larger in terms of square footage than what we
could have gotten in just a strictly office industrial park.
Generous: We calculated what the...maximum square footage...
Aanenson: ...reason that...
Sidney: Yes. And remind what is the benefit to the city for the next type of use and.
Generous: Well the potential for the use...transitioning from one use to...more intensive use.
Plus there's a...
Sidney: And then I'm wondering, you had suggested having a parking lot on both sides of that
church and I guess I'm wondering about the views from the Bluff Creek side to the west.
Aanenson: That was kind of an issue... On the other hand, we felt that the parking was quite a
ways from the church itself and...so I guess we just asked that they re-examine that...
Generous: The other thing is they could segregate their parking. Their day to day parking...
office industrial uses...overlapping parking both ways. On Sundays when church...
Sidney: I guess I'd kind of opt for not having parking to the west. Just simply to preserve that
view. However,then when I was looking at the proposal that we had in our packet about the
parking and the loading docks on the east side, and I was much more concerned about that view.
And I'd like to enhance that to, that view from Highway 5 would look great coming east on
Highway 5 but I'm afraid that going westbound it would... I like the variety of uses and I
guess... concerned about the fact that when I saw the two smaller buildings,now I'm wondering
if there's any potential for expansion of these buildings in the future and that might be a concern
that the developer would want to look into. And I was thinking on the original plan to have that
3
Planning Commission Meeting - December 3, 1997
larger building with the longer side,the loading docks to the south, so the longer side would be
along Highway 5, you would have the potential for expansion in that case and I guess I would
just hope that the developer would think about that so that we can enhance the site for office
industrial use in the future. I guess that's what I have for now.
Joyce: I have one last question before I open the public hearing. And I don't know Kate or
Dave, how are we going to handle this item 17 with the SWMP fees? What?
Hempel: Thank you Mr. Chairman. Typically when storm, the comprehensive storm sewer plan
is developed, it's the City's intent to regionalize the storm water ponds so we don't have a pond
here, a pond here, a pond here. From a maintenance and water quality standpoint it works better
to have one regional pond treating all the runoff. In this case,just looking at the grades real
quickly, it looks like they could achieve draining that area with storm sewer, probably into the
larger pond or a combination of... I guess based on the narrative from the applicant, I felt maybe
that the pond was serving as an amenity as well. If that's the case, we felt the SWMP fees would
not be, credits would not be appropriate.
Joyce: So this is an item that once we get to the public hearing...
Hempel: Again,being a conceptual plan, that pond may relocate somewhere else based on
grades.
Aanenson: We're willing to look at it... At this point I guess we'd leave it the way it is.
Joyce: You'd leave it open ended type of situation?
Aanenson: Yeah. And we'd...
Joyce: Okay. Well I'll open this up for public hearing. Anybody like to address the Planning
Commission on this item,please step forward and give me your name and address. I should have
opened that up for a motion shouldn't I have?
Aanenson: You don't really have to.
Joyce: I don't have to. So I don't have to close it either then?
Aanenson: You should close it. You don't have to have a motion.
Joyce: Don't have to have a motion? That will save time. Well seeing one, I'm going to close
the public hearing and bring it back to the commission. LuAnn we'll start with you.
Sidney: I made a lot of my comments already I guess. I guess I don't have any problem with
having an institutional use in this PUD. I'm concerned about maximizing the office industrial
portion as much as possible, if we can get the square footage up. I have some questions,
although I guess I'm thinking that I'm not totally opposed to access on TH 5 but I am thinking I
4
Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
would really like to keep the access off of Coulter as the main entrance rather than off of TH 5 if
possible,just to alleviate TH 5 and it's traffic problems that it has now. Other than that I think I
already made most of my comments.
Joyce: Allyson.
Brooks: I don't have too many comments...I'm not too worried about the traffic. I don't think a
right-in/right-out off of Highway 5 or Coulter Boulevard is going to make a difference with the
traffic... It's a done deal. So I really don't have any more comments.
Blackowiak: Well I've got a few comments here. In general, I do think that the church could fit
in there and provide a nice transition between the school, the neighborhood and the proposed
industrial, office building. However, I feel that the church is too close to Bluff Creek. I talked to
Bob today. I asked him to get some more information from Phil regarding the primary and
secondary corridors and based on where it was drawn, the primary corridor involves half of the
church and I, regardless of whether or not it's been farmed, that has been defined as a primary
corridor,then I think...and we should not be building in the primary corridor. I realize the Bluff
Creek overlay has not been officially implemented yet. I know that we're close to having final
implementation. However I feel that this would be a wonderful test case. I think we should
apply the Bluff Creek standards to this project and not make exceptions in terms of setbacks and
location of the primary and where the secondary areas of the creek. In terms of the setbacks, I
would like to suggest that we include the Bluff Creek overlay district standards in the setbacks
when we talk about the minimum building setback and maximum setbacks. I would also like to
point out that the Bluff Creek study talked about a 300 foot setback along both sides of the creek
and I don't think that this is the time to start compromising. We've spent a lot of time and effort
in this Bluff Creek study and to start out with a brand new project and say well, let's forget this
300 foot setback I don't think sends a good message. So I really would hope we could look at
that a little bit more intensely because the study recommends this 300 foot setback. I think we
should really take that into consideration. ...split so I'm not as concerned about that. But I think
it's Lot 3 on the southeast corner. I'm rather concerned about the loading docks facing east. It
screams post office to me all over again. ...residential area directly to the south of...boulevard
and worry about noise. We've been through this exercise before...well aware of the problems
that...of that lot. And finally I especially agree with the...point number 3 talking about the
structures meeting the minimum required setbacks in the report. I think they said that very well.
Probably better than I did but we've worked hard on the project. The Bluff Creek plan and I
really think that we should...standards in place for this proposed PUD. And that's it.
Joyce: Thank you. My comments are pretty similar to what's already been said. Number one,
we're obviously just looking at a concept right here and I like the concept very much. I really do.
I think it's great for the mixed use and I think we can work this out. I think it'd be good for that
area. As I said before, we're just trying to give direction for when these sites come up in front of
us, what we're going to be looking for. And I think that, well the next item after you folks is the
Bluff Creek corridor and we've taken that to heart. Alison has mentioned about the 300 foot
setback. I can certainly see where she's coming from. But I also feel that you have to have some
sort of latitude and ability to develop this parcel of land. And seeing as, I feel that the comments
5
Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
from staff were good that the land really was not, with the agricultural usage before, it's not what
we were targeting for preservation as far as the vegetation in the primary areas. But I would
strongly enforce 100 foot setback all the way around it, which staff has recommended, so that's
certainly important to me and important to the City. The truck bays, as Alison mentioned, I
worry about those too. That's something that would definitely, something we'd have to look at
once the sites come in front of us. And the shared parking is another issue that I think staff has
I'm sure discussed with you. I think they've done a marvelous job at the St. Hauberk's up the
street here and I think that we can share, even I saw and was impressed by the progress that's
gone on with what you've considered for the site, but I still think there can be more shared
parking and less impervious parking lot area. But otherwise I'm in favor of the concept itself and
those are my comments. So I guess from here we can make a motion.
Brooks: I move the Planning Commission recommends the City Council approve of Concept
PUD#97-2 subject to the following conditions.
Joyce: We'd have to amend the five that are in there,right?
Brooks: Yeah. Let's see.
Aanenson: No.
Brooks: ...I move the Planning Commission recommends the City Council approve of Concept
PUD#97-2 subject to the conditions...
Joyce: Do we have a second?
Sidney: Second.
J I
Joyce: Any discussion? We don't have to amend any of these then?
Aanenson: If that's your request, you certainly can do that. What we're saying is that staff, we
understand...We agree with number 3.
Joyce: Well, like I said. I'm a little shaky on like 17 too so.
Aanenson: Right. I think that we'd like the time between now and when it goes to Council to
address those and...more comments...some concurrence.
Joyce: Okay. That's the motion then. No other comments?
Brooks moved, Sidney seconded that the Planning Commission recommends that the City
Council approve Concept PUD #97-2 subject to the following conditions:
6
Planning Commission
December 29, 1997
Page 2
June, 1998
Review and adoption by the City Council.
July, 1998
Submit Plan to the Metropolitan Council for review and approval.
CITY OF
CHANHASSEN
690 COULTER DRIVE • P.O. BOX 147 • CHANHASSEN. MINNESOTA 55317
(612) 937-1900 • FAX (612) 937-5739
MEMORANDUM
TO: Planning Commission
FROM: Kate Aanenson, AICP, Planning Director 0
DATE: December 29, 1997
SUBJ: Comprehensive Plan Update Statue
The purpose of this memo is to give you current information on the progress of the
Comprehensive Plan update. So far the Planning Commission has reviewed the first draft of the
elements of the Comprehensive Plan. The following is the proposed tentative schedule for the
completion of this plan. All drafts submitted to the Planning Commission will also be available
on the city's home page.
Wednesday, February 18th 1998 Planning Commission Meeting
Review Land Use- This section includes the proposed land uses, the housing element
and the proposed staging for MUSA expansion.
Wednesday, March 18th 1998 Planning Commission Meeting
Public Facilities -This section includes the Transportation, Sewers, Parks and Open
Space, Water and Storm Water elements of the Comprehensive Plan. The capital improvements
plan will also be included with this review.
April, 1998
Neighborhood meeting will be held to get input from the proposed drafts of the plan. These
meetings will include the Planning Commission and the City Council
May, 1998
Planning Commission will hold a public hearing and make a recommendation to the City
Council.
Planning Commission
December 29, 1997
Page 2
February 24, 1998: Follow same previous steps with Residential portion.
March 3, 1998: Follow same previous steps with Frontier, Dinner Theater, Country Suites
Hotel, Entertainment Center.
March 10, 1998: First Draft to be reviewed with the neighborhood to evaluate findings and
seek additional input.
April 1, 1998: Presentation to the Planning Commission in the form of a public hearing
accompanied by ordinances to accomplish the vision.
April 27, 1998: Forward findings to the City Council for review and adoption.
L.,
0 CITY OF
01, CHANHASSEN
690 COULTER DRIVE • P.O. BOX 147 • CHANHASSEN, MINNESOTA 55317
(612) 937-1900 • FAX (612) 937-5739
MEMORANDUM
TO: Planning Commission
FROM: Sharmin Al-Jaff, Planner II
DATE: December 29, 1997
11
SUBJ: Schedule for"Old Town"Chanhassen
On December 3, 1997, staff presented an issue paper to the Planning Commission dealing with
the "Historical District" and requested input and direction. Based upon the feedback received at
the meeting, staff prepared a schedule which highlights the steps we intend to follow to
accomplish our mission.
December 3, 1997: Issue paper presented to the Planning Commission for input and direction.
January 13, 1998: Neighborhood meeting to focus on why we are here, boundaries of the
study area, what do we want to accomplish, define all existing uses, weak
spots, eyesores, strengths and anchors of the district within the defined
boundaries. Develop a Vision Statement.
January 20, 1998: Provide analysis of the gathered data and input from the neighborhood and
property owners.
January 27, 1998: Divide area into sectors (Schlenk, Village Hall, St. Hubert, Kenny's &
Medical Arts, Residential, Frontier/Dinner Theater & Country Suites Hotel
& Entertainment Center). Provide a vision concept for Schlenk's property
then create design standards (overlay ordinances) to accomplish this
vision.
February 3, 1998: Follow same previous steps with Village Hall.
February 10, 1998: Follow same previous steps with St. Hubert.
February 17, 1998: Follow same previous steps with Kenny's, Country Clean, Medical Arts.
Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
Joyce: I'm serious though. I mean do we need another hockey rink? Some people like hockey
rinks but I think libraries are very important. I think it's something, it's an issue I appreciate you
bring it up Jill and everyone that's attended. Is there any mechanism Kate where they'll
definitely know when this comes. It's in the paper and everything. When the comprehensive
plan.
Aanenson: We'll be putting it no the home page.
Joyce: Okay, so that's a must that you're aware of when we visit this as a Planning Commission
would be the next time really is with approving the comprehensive plan budget, which we say is
sometime in the spring.
Jill Shipley asked a question from the audience that was not picked up by the microphone.
Aanenson: Back through me.
Jill Shipley...
Aanenson: We'll get it back. If they need additional information...
Joyce: All right. You're on the docket. We'll make a recommendation. I think from the
comments that were made, people want more information. They feel uncomfortable making a
complete recommendation to the City Council as far as this. Go ahead Jill.
Jill Shipley...
Joyce: One thing about the City of Chanhassen, they're pretty good about communications.
They really are and they'll try. They're not going to you know slide anything by you or anything.
We're very open here and try to keep you posted as best as we can, okay. So thank you all for
coming. Appreciate the discussion. It was very interesting.
Chairman Joyce adjourned the meeting at 9:25 p.m.
Submitted by Kate Aanenson
Planning Director
Prepared by Nann Opheim
Planning Commission Meeting - December 3, 1997
Conrad: ...more information about the library needs. If we see that there's a need, then we'll
compare that to the plan that the planning staff gave us where they laid out the capital
improvements for the next 20 years. Then we'll make a decision, or we'll try to understand
where this priority should be. So it's not an independent item. We're slotting it someplace into
the overall budget.
Joyce: I understand that.
Conrad: Okay.
Joyce: Matt.
Burton: Oh I'm a new resident of Chanhassen and also I'm a new member of this Planning
Commission. In fact this is my first meeting and this is the first time I've even spoken as a
member of the commission. But I'm a parent of two little girls and I was shocked at the small
size of the Chanhassen library. It wasn't something I checked out before I moved here. I do
think that waiting until 2005 is a very long time to wait on an issue like this. I'm not real
comfortable with the Planning Commission's role in the process because I'm just learning it
myself but I do think that this issue should be given a very high priority. Another idea that I was
intrigued by was perhaps keeping the library downtown I think would be important, but also
perhaps separating it from the City Hall and that's also an issue I don't know much about and
Kate talked about the concerns there but we talked earlier tonight about the, what was referred to
as a possible historical district. That seems to me might be like a good place for a library down
the road. Where there's a lot of pedestrian traffic and you can get a lot of use. I guess that's all
my comments. I look forward to looking at this issue when it comes to the comprehensive plan.
Joyce: Great. Thanks.
Sidney: A lot of good comments. I think I might just add to Ladd's comments a little bit. When
you think of planning commissioners, you think of comprehensive plan and land use and I think
what I'm kind of itching to do is you know find out what the ideas would be for a site or how
could the library be expanded on this location. What are their options? What could be done and
that might make things a little bit more concrete in talking about what would be needed for a
budget in the future. Maybe I'm jumping the gun a bit but I still, you know the first thing I
thought of was, like what Matt was saying. The proposed historical, somewhat historical district
down the road here where you could have the library on the first floor and then have another use
on a second floor or something like that. But that's where my mind was going. I wanted to look
at land use and those issue being a planning commissioner. That's all I have.
Joyce: My comments are quite similar to the other commissioners. I think we should look at a
library. I think we should look at open air theaters.
Conrad: You've got my vote on that.
Blackowiak: Woke him right up.
32
Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
Blackowiak: Yeah, it really does. If we're to make a recommendation. I would not feel
comfortable just saying something tonight without having more facts. I would like to have it in
front of me so I can take a look at it and make an educated recommendation. Something I feel
comfortable with. Something I'd be able to back up if a Council member asked me why we
decided to, why are you saying this. I can say okay, if you look at this and I feel comfortable
saying, backing this out a couple years. This up a couple years and have some rationale to my
recommendation.
Joyce: Allyson.
Brooks: It seems that when it comes to spending $4 million on trails, we're quick to do that but
when it comes to building a library to expand our minds, we have to think about it and put it off.
(applause from audience) What I was going to say is that,you know when I look at my kids, it's
important for them to ride their bikes on trails but it's important for them to expand their minds
too and in fact in a sense, I'd like to see them ride their little bikes down the trails to the library.
I don't think that this should be as difficult of an issue as it is. A library. Andrew Carniege built
libraries all over the nation because he understood the importance of a library. And it's kind of
amazing to me that we're spending, we question something that should be so fundamental to our
community. That we have to look at it over and over. Go look at it. That's not a library. 1 lived
in a town of 9,000 people in Vermillion, South Dakota and our library was bigger. Way bigger
than that. I think that we should make a recommendation to the City Council to, if they don't
prioritize the library, to at least they should be putting together a task force to look into it.
Chanhassen is a growing community. As Jill said, it's an educated community. I think if we had
a good library,we would use it. If we sit around long enough Barnes and Noble will show up
anyway eventually but I mean it's just a fundamental foundation to any community anywhere.
And I feel pretty strongly about it.
Joyce: Obviously. Ladd you're next.
Conrad: Nothing more.
Joyce: Okay.
Conrad: But just that, we have the control as the comprehensive plan that Kate presented to us.
We prioritize. It can be changed but we do this so. We've done it before. What we don't like,
so it's up to us to identify whether there are higher priorities. So it's not like we're just going to
send a recommendation up to them to say take a look at it. We have a responsibility to
understand more about this and if we don't, do get a task force. Recommend that to the City
Council so again I think...everybody's understanding the process here. We can change things. I
have nothing to add.
Joyce: So, let me ask you a question real quickly. So what you're saying is that get more
information. Clean this up a little bit so that we can make a formal presentation, a formal
recommendation to City Council.
31
Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
Joyce: I understand that but I'm just saying that it becomes etched in stone sometime in April or
May, okay. So you have some time here and we need to get some information to the City
Council.
Aanenson: I think the other issue is ...and I'm not sure where that form fits. If that's facilitated
here... That's another request that she's making. That's what I said last time...
Joyce: Are there any other questions for Jill?
Blackowiak: I have a comment. Actually a couple comments.
Joyce: I was going to come back and just do it like we do the Planning Commission so it's in the
nice form that they can read it and, and since you have the comments, you go first.
Blackowiak: Oh good. Well I just wanted to respond to Allyson's idea of putting an
interpretative center. Definitely piggy backing the library with that facility would be good but I
would certainly hope the library could retain what I consider to be the downtown Chanhassen
area because not only do we get a lot of people that don't necessarily drive to a library. I think
we have a lot of people that can't drive to a library. They like the ability to be able to walk
downtown and go to a library. If we had it too far removed from downtown we might have better
parking. There might be some advantages to that but I think we'd lose a lot of the core people
who couldn't walk or bike to the library. I'd like to have it downtown. Often I'll go to the bank,
to the post office...a full loop and I do everything and it's nice to have it here and I think
it's...future that we keep it in downtown Chanhassen if at all possible.
Joyce: Do you want to make a recommendation to the Council that they put this as a priority as
far as?
Blackowiak: I would certainly hope that they could look at it. I know I've heard the history a
little bit. I realize that...until January. I think that we should definitely, I would like to look at it
again. I think Ladd has asked for information and we need a little more information. I would
like to see that information, Kate together with the strategic plan. Let's look at the whole thing
again. I need to kind of get all together in front of me so I can figure out if this gets moved up,
what affect does it have on other...of the plan. That's kind of what I need to see and I'd like to
see it all laid out in front of me.
Joyce: So you want to it come back to the Planning Commission?
Aanenson: You will see this again anyway. You will see it again.
Blackowiak: We'll have to.
Conrad: It's got to come back.
30
Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
Aanenson...
Sidney: Okay. But still there's this matter of convincing City Council and how to do that.
Joyce: It's called the squeaky wheel.
Jill Shipley: How much interaction is there between Council and the Planning Commission I
guess is the question that I have because I feel like I'm getting fairly favorable responses from
Council as far as recognizing the need.
Sidney: Are you getting action?
Jill Shipley: I'm getting no action yet. Nancy asked me to wait until January when again the
strategic plan was done, and the budget process was done. But are you two communicating or
working together?
Joyce: We think so.
Sidney: But I guess I'm just, you need to convince them that there is a need and to have
something in, you feel like in a report.
Aanenson: I think she's asking you to be an advocate and to move up the prioritization on the
capital improvement plan...
Sidney: We see the need and.
Aanenson: We see the need. We would like you.
Sidney: Address this sooner than later, yeah.
Aanenson: ...and if you need other documents,as Ladd indicated, and I can facilitate...but this
will come up again in the capital improvement plan...public hearing...on the comprehensive
plan and ultimately that will be the plan...and that's what they're doing...
Joyce: What's the time line like on that capital, when they approve the capital improvements
for?
Aanenson: When the entire comprehensive plan is adopted...late spring, first part of summer.
Joyce: There's one time line right there.
Aanenson: Right,but she needs.
Jill Shipley: We have a sense of urgency on this issue.
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Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
Conrad: Well yeah. What do they need to have,and really are people using libraries more and
more? I saw that, I saw some figures that indicated that this was being used here but I don't
know how many people were using it. I really have no idea the real use and the future. Libraries
in general and then future of Chanhassen library. The way you would project it. We're going to
grow to 30,000 people so what's the need to service those 30,000 people so I'd like to get more
background,more specifics so I really know what we're talking about here. We don't,as you
heard Kevin say, we really don't make the final... Just as a footnote, we never use,I live in north
Chanhassen. We never use the...and so the graphs made a lot of sense. They were really
reflective, the parts that I saw but you don't have the same number of materials that we can find
other places and I think that's a disservice to us. Again, that doesn't mean that I'm saying we
should fork billions of dollars into it but it really, you've identified a real problem. So Jill I need
more information and I hope staff can give us...in the future as to what they perceive the need to
be and then we can merge that into the capital plan.
Joyce: Anybody else have a question?
Sidney: I guess I, the first thing I wanted to ask was, you know what do you want to be the
outcome of this meeting? And I guess I still want to know.
Jill Shipley: I would like the outcome of this meeting to be that you would tell me that you are
going to send a recommendation, if that is the maximum that you have the power to do. You will
send a recommendation to Council that the library be addressed as it's number one priority in
capital improvements. Or as a very high priority. And for us that we need to be working with
the library and it's needs for a new facility by the year 2000. I requested a task force be
appointed in August. Council was reluctant to do this until they had their strategic plan in place
and the budgeting process. There's tremendous potential for a library in Chanhassen. I'm not
going to go into it now with you Ladd. Not necessarily as just the Carver County regional but
maybe as a total regional library. This needs to be,we need to sit down. We need to talk. We
need to address this issue and determine what does Chanhassen really want. Does it just want an
improved community facility so maybe just do the 15,000 that I'm talking about. Or do we want
to have something larger, bigger, better, that serves as a draw into our community just like Target
and Byerly's are draws into our community as well. A library does that. A library pulls people
in. Ask these people, ask them how many go to Ridgedale or to Southdale for library service.
They do.
Joyce: I believe it.
Jill Shipley: We need to find out what does the City want.
Sidney: What I'm struggling with and what Ladd was alluding to, I need more information and I
almost felt like I wanted a staff report you know the way this was developing. And somehow I'd
like to see a process implemented or a plan for how this might be addressed before it's really
brought before.
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Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
Brooks: And I'm sorry, I guess I just didn't get this and that's why I was confused as to where
you were going. So I guess this came separate?
Jill Shipley: I mailed them. I didn't get them here so.
Joyce: Oh, you mailed them? Yeah. Yeah, that's right you did mail them. That's right.
Brooks: ...no reason but I guess one thing that popped into my head, and I don't know if you've
considered it is. Right now you're associated with the City Hall and I know we're talking about
Chanhassen building that interpretative center. Is it possible to look at combining a new library
with a new interpretative center? That might be a nice compatible.
Jill Shipley: I know nothing about this center. Can you fill me in a little bit?
Brooks: Well I don't know too much about it but I was asking Kate, it seemed like we were
planning to pour money into development a Bluff Creek interpretative center. And yet we have
what appears to me as a real need with our library. Maybe we should consider pulling the two
together because they're both community resources.
Aanenson: The interpretative center probably...
Brooks: That small?
Aanenson: Yeah... The library being...economies of scale. It was projected to be expanded
with the City Hall expansion and the City Council's... There have been discussions...
Brooks: 15,000 square feet...
Jill Shipley: I think there's a lot of options that need to be considered really in planning for this.
Where is the interpretative center? That's going to be out at Bluff Creek or?
Aanenson: Across the street. The west side.
Brooks: I do agree with you. I think it's pretty amazing that Chanhassen,being the community
that it is,has a library this small. Fairly astounding...resources.
Joyce: Any other questions?
Conrad: ...and maybe, I don't think we have it. I really need to know...projected. I don't know
what is...use. I saw some, it was hard to read your graphs...couldn't see anything and that's
tough. I wish you would give us some materials that, maybe staff could distribute it... Number
two,you really do need to...
Aanenson: You're talking about what technological changes?
27
Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
•
process and I think we'll probably leave it at that, okay? But like I said,this will certainly be in
the packets for the City Council and you've all signed in and we know you have a lot of support
for this issue and I think it's something that you should probably take on and consider with the
City Council. Try to make, get a showing in front of them to present your issues, okay?
Jill Shipley: May I ask you Kevin to clarify what will go to the City Council?
Joyce: Everything you just said is going to the City Council.
Jill Shipley: Will there be a recommendation from, as the Planning Commission.
Joyce: If the commissioners would like to recommend this, that it be seen in front of the City
Council, I have no problem with that. They're citizens of Chanhassen and if they think that this
should be, a recommendation that your presentation be seen by City Council, I don't see any
problem with that.
Jill Shipley: Actually City Council has seen this. We did the work session with them so they're
well aware of the issue. To me, and I'm not sure I understand totally how everything works. I
feel like Council needs a recommendation from you that this issue be addressed sooner.
Aanenson: I think what she's looking for as far as the capital improvement...comprehensive
plan. Your recommendation...
Joyce: I'll leave the commissioners comments to allow it as that and then I would suggest that
you follow up with our comments saying that you presented it to the planning council and that
you'd like to have their input. That you want their direction as far as what they were going to do
with, concerning this issue and the funding that's necessary for it. And I'm going to let the
commissioners say what they want to say, okay. Just like a normal planning session, okay. But
you can just kind of wrap things up here and we'll.
Jill Shipley: That will be fine. I told you what my goal was. We want a new facility by the year
2000. At least 15,000 square feet. We need space for administrative purposes. I'm willing to
listen to what.
Joyce: I didn't want to cut you short either. I'm just, I just want to make you understand what
we're trying to do here.
Jill Shipley: Yes, I think it's important to hear what you have to say about this now so I'm going
to sit down.
Joyce: Are there any questions first for Jill while she's up? Or while she was up.
Brooks: Actually I do.
Joyce: Allyson has a question for you.
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Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
affluent community. You all know that. We are a highly educated community. These are the
characteristics again of people who use libraries the most. Really value the library. One of the
other questions on the Decision Resources survey was designed to identify how people use their
libraries. They created a list of all sorts of possible uses, whether it was to...and we asked each
person how would you rate these. Very important to you. It's somewhat important. Not too
important or just not at all important. This chart shows how Chanhassen ranks the various
services but from your perspective as a...important to note how much more Chanhassen...than
the other cities and counties. ...continuing education was the number one...for our residents...
navigate the non-fiction stacks and fiction stacks but it's those...Chanhassen. So how do we
compare with other libraries in the metro area? The Carver County library system is a part of a
cooperative of library systems known as MELSA. MELSA consists of Hennepin County, Dakota
County, Washington County, Scott County, Carver County. Those five county systems as well as
the Minneapolis and St. Paul public library systems. Let's look at the cities in these areas that
have libraries with population is less than 25,000 and see what they have to offer their
communities. There are 38 communities that fit these characteristics. They have libraries and
their population is less than 25,000. Ranked by population, Chanhassen is 13`h, and this is... If
you compare the size of libraries,rank this by size of the library, Chanhassen ranks 27`h out of
38. And if we refer to that formula of 0.7...Chanhassen ranks 366. So it's not a very respectable
showing for this highly educated... Personally I find this very disappointing. I'm not trying to
sound negative. It's almost embarrassing that we've not as a community made a stronger
commitment to life long learning, education. In his travels across America it was Charles
Kurault who said you can always tell the quality of a community by it's grocery store and it's
library. I don't know what he would say about Chanhassen. Right now the capital improvement
plan calls for no action to be taken until the year 2005. And then only$1.5 million is budgeted
for that, which includes the City Hall expansion. Now 7 years from now how are we going to
rank with these other libraries? How are we going to be serving the needs of our ever growing
population and how much is $1.5 million going to buy to fix the City Hall and the library? It
scares me to think. I don't think we're planning ahead well enough on this issue. As a
community, as a planning department,as a citizen I think we've all been too passive on this issue
for way too long. It's time for us to find a genuine effective solution to this problem instead of
continuing to band-aid the issue with a 250 square foot addition. This community has
been...upon high standards in so many areas of it's development. Now is the time to apply those
high standards to the public library and provide something that's a true reflection of our value,
our ideals and our commitment to life long learning and our commitment to community. Before
I go on, are there any questions or comments from members that Mary or I could address?
Joyce: I'd like to make one comment here before you do go on. Just for the audience to
understand that we are appointed by the City Council. We don't set fiscal policy as such. We
appreciate all of you coming out here tonight. We appreciate,you're doing a wonderful job Jill
and I think this is an important issue but I just want to make it understood that we don't set the
policy. It's set at the City Council level. We can certainly, this will go to the City Council as
you're presenting it to us and I think the way I'll handle this, we're kind of getting the idea from
you okay so if you want to cut it. So what might be best is if we can just kind of wrap it up here.
I think what I'll handle is, if anybody has any questions from the Planning Commission, you can
certainly ask Jill and then I'll ask the commissioners just for their advice or their thoughts on the
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Planning Commission Meeting-December 3, 1997
much greater rate of increase for a patron going into the library...population in this city. You as
a Planning Commission, Kate and Bob as the planning department and our City Council
members are faced with the challenges of this city's growth I'm sure day in and day out. I'm sure
it's the ever present factor that affects your planning for sewers, for parks, ballfields, all of it.
Well,couple the growth of our city's population with the even greater increase in the use of the
library and you can see the need to address the needs of library space for our community. Library
systems have guidelines to follow. As far as space needs go, Minnesota guidelines, which are
also the same as the national guidelines, recommend 0.7 square feet per capita for library space.
This is the amount of space which is deemed to be most effective for a library as far as allowing
enough space for the librarians to work. Allowing enough room for quiet reading areas.
Allowing enough study carols. Allowing a large enough reference section. You understand. If
we apply that figure to our existing population of 17,000, we should have a library of 11,900
square feet. Today. In 1997. Obviously to plan for the future and anticipated growth in
Chanhassen we would need an even larger facility. We currently have 3,250.00 so we are a far
cry from that figure. If you look at the growth of the library from 1981, you can see that we've
been consistently behind. We're always trying to catch up. We're falling farther and farther
behind all the time. So this line represents... It's not that the city has not known of this need.
It's addressed in the '91 comprehensive plan. This plan states that the city will work with the
County to provide a new library location when space needs exceed availability of room in the
City Hall location. It was also addressed in the Vision 2002 plan, which projected a library of 10
to 20,000 square feet. We got really excited in '92 because things started to happen. The City
recognized the need for a library. A new library. They started evaluating various sites. We hired
a consultant and we thought that things were finally going to happen for the Chanhassen library
but unfortunately some financial difficulties befell the city and it just was not to happen. So
what's happened since then? That's 5 years ago. Really basically nothing. Other than the
additional 250 square feet that we received last year, right about this time when the City Hall did
the expansion, there's been no other changes or increase. I ask you, is there any other aspect of
our city's development that has remained so much the same since 1981? This community has
added new restaurants. Added new retail. All of our churches in the community have expanded
or built new facilities. Our park system is undergoing major improvements. We have brand new
neighborhoods but we have that same, tiny, little library. If our residents were satisfied with the
existing facility I wouldn't be here tonight. We'd just let the status quo continue. Our residents
are not satisfied. They're wanting and they're needing more from the library. Exactly one year
ago Decision Resources was hired by the Carver County Library Board to conduct a survey for
us. This survey was conducted county wide,but there were 107 residents out of Chanhassen who
were surveyed so we had the biggest representation on this sample. One of the questions asked
residents to rate various service characteristics of the library such as staff availability, size,hours,
quantity of materials, and the quality of materials. This graph will show how Chanhassen ranks
their library with respect to Chaska and Waconia. Chanhassen is orange. Chaska is the blue and
Waconia is... The top part recognizes... Everybody is happy... The middle bar is for the hours
that the library is open. Again,we're faring quite well. And the bottom bar, the quality of
materials...not quite as happy...but it's still... So when you start looking at sizes, quantity... our
residents are crying out for more space...in that library. If we get more space we can get more
residents... I mentioned to you a couple weeks ago when I was here about the demographics of
our community and how that is so attuned to a library system. We told you that we are a very
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Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
books...to another library to find... The same thing happened...grade school...Now it's
happening the fourth time because she's used all...Carol Gray lives over in Stone Creek. Carol
has three daughters. She...curiosity and intellectual development in her kids and her love
for...literature. Carol's about to start in a mother daughter book club. She's hoping...
Kelly...lives down by Lake Susan Hills. Kelly's the Assistant Director of Nursing at a long term
health care facility. She brings her kids to the library every... For Kelly the library is important
just as well because she needs reference materials...at the facility that she works at but she needs
more general, broad based...good ice breakers for group situations. Laurie Gauer... Laurie's an
avid library user... that there is in the community. Laurie's a little disappointed in the...offering
her the materials that she wants. Laurie would like...Girl Scouts, she would like to be able to
bring her Girl Scout troop to the library...for their badges but there isn't room... lives north. She
is one of the people who live in the Minnetonka School District but has been coming and Kathy
always makes such wonderful recommendations...quality books to read. So Nancy's an avid
user. Carla Nolan lives off of TH 101. She's a school teacher in the Minnetonka School system.
She thinks that the value of a library is to provide good quality information for
students...projects for their schoolwork. As you can see, a library in this town is more than a
collection of books. It's more than...of information. More than a place to read and think. It's a
physical and a social space that enhances people's lives and encourages social interaction. It can
be that one central gathering place which can serve all members of the community from age 3 to
93. For 6 days a week, 52 weeks out of the year. It doesn't matter if you're Catholic or Lutheran
or if you go to Eckankar. It doesn't matter if you're a member of the Chaska school system. The
Minnetonka school system or the Eden Prairie school system. All of these things divide our
community. We are united by a strong library. And it's that feeling of connection to the
community that builds the loyalty and the spirit that we really want to get in our community.
This issue was addressed in the '91 comprehensive plan. The plan read, Chanhassen fails to
exhibit a total community identity. So there's a real easy solution to this. The library already
exists as our hub, as you can see on the map here. All we need to do is strengthen our library and
it is going to strengthen our community.
Brooks: Are you interested in expanding the library then or are you interested in a new facility?
Jill Shipley: I said,on the history that I sent you that we need a minimum sized facility of at least
50,000 square feet. If you can achieve that by expanding this structure, that's okay. We may
have to do...
Aanenson: The reason that we're back to this point is, in the capital improvements element, the
library wasn't addressed...
Joyce: Jill, why don't you make your presentation and then we can make some questions and
discuss it,okay? I think we'll do it that way.
Jill Shipley: Can you put the graph up there? This graph shows the increase in usage in the
library over the years. Compared with the increase in population. It's the orange line here is
population. Shows some steady growth...all aware of. The blue line here shows the increased...
library much more rapid growth. This line shows the increase... Now as you can see,you have a
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Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
Aanenson: No. This will be your last meeting.
Joyce: Our last meeting until next year.
Aanenson: Yes. We have, we've already calendared a couple items for the January...
APPROVAL OF MINUTES:
Blackowiak moved to note the Minutes of the Planning Commission meeting dated
November 19, 1997 as presented.
OPEN DISCUSSION: LIBRARY NEEDS-JILL SHIPLEY, LIBRARY BOARD.
Public Present:
Name Address
Calla Baxter 2655 Longacres Drive
Beth Larson 7590 Canyon Curve
Cindy Schallack 7501 Canyon Curve
Lois Fiskness 8033 Cheyenne Avenue
Steve Cudzinski 6890 Utica Lane
Jill Shipley 261 Eastwood Court
Cindy Hart 951 Homestead Lane
Carman McMan 9391 Foxford Road
Sue Herby 8660 Flamingo
Laurie Gauer 3820 Lone Cedar
Janet Dengel 9351 Foxford Road
Carla Noran 6760 Brule Circle
Jackie Schott 9350 Foxford Road
Sharon Gatto 9631 Foxford Road
Nancy Parker 540 Pineview Court
Rose Novotny 560 Pineview Court
Greg Hromatka 7580 Canyon Curve
Joyce: Jill Shipley, as you remember, she was at our last meeting when the budget needs were
presented to us and Jill would like to talk about the library needs here in Chanhassen so we'll
leave it open for you Jill.
Jill Shipley: Mr. Chairman,I'd like to introduce Mary Higiss who's the Director of the Carver
County Library System and also Kathy Purshman,who is the Head Branch Librarian here at
Chanhassen. These are... Gayle Vogel lives in...likes to use the library to pick up audio
books... Gayle made the comment to me that she's almost at the point of outgrowing the
library...when her children were preschoolers they used the library. They eventually read all the
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Planning Commission Meeting - December 3, 1997
designs on the site of...talk about park and ride. We'll come back with some more and try to get
this thing brainstorming until we understand what we want...
Joyce: Okay. I thought it was a good discussion.
Sidney: Mr. Chairman? Kate. I was wondering about neighborhood involvement. When does
that come into play?
Aanenson: I think we'll start doing that now.
Sidney: Yes. I'd really encourage that.
Aanenson: We talked to, I've talked to Al tonight. Klingelhutz. I've talked to Mr. Schlenk. His
property is zone...density. We know what's happening with the Colonial Square building. The
City owns that and we've certainly been in dialogue...but we need to be working with the
adjoining property owners...
Sidney: Yes.
Blackowiak: And Kate, what is the status of St. Hubert's right now? I had asked for it today.
Aanenson: ...school. That's probably a strong possibility. There was another...Chapel Hill
Academy. And there was another strong user looking at it. A mix of senior housing, assisted
living and...and commercial. That was...
Joyce: Great. We lease it out right now, right?
Aanenson: Yeah. But there's other uses to look at with that and that's I guess what we're
saying. I mean...Sharmin had some different ideas. Park and ride...and that's what we're
saying. We've got these there. These uses. What can we do instead of just putting up a few
sculptures. Saying what can we do to promote the downtown...
Joyce: Maybe when you present it back to us, show us what the City does own in that area.
Aanenson: That'd be great.
Blackowiak: And also as an addition to that, what do we know? That was one of my questions
that I wrote to myself. I mean what's there? What do we know is going to happen. You know
like you say, the Medical Arts building is looking to expand. Well that's something we know
but it's, you know...if we can have time lines. If we could have just kind of general information
that would help us understand the dynamics of what's going on right now and what's going to be
happening in the next couple years.
Joyce: Good. Okay. Following our format here. Any old business we need to take of?
Discuss?
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Planning Commission Meeting - December 3, 1997
Aanenson: The issues on the boundary, I'd like to hear those comments...because that specific
piece that has the potential to change which kind of affects what's happening down there. That's
really what the moratorium issue was about because...property and there was some request to
rezone that. That's where that came from... Uses on that property and what, something that did
go in there and we had changed the flavor of that. And that also was an opportunity to...pull that
building out towards the street...but those are the comments as far as...helpful for staff to hear.
Joyce: I think, and I'm kind of taking up what Nancy said as far as combining the commercial
with the residential. I think that would make a wonderful addition to the downtown area.
Having residential above the commercial. We're doing that in the Villages on the Pond and I
think that brings the people, now it makes a downtown a vibrant area. People living there.
People commercing there. People walking around there. That kind of stuff.
Brooks: But that's new urbanism. Not...
Joyce: No, no. I agree. I agree.
Brooks: That's where I just, I want to be real careful with our terms.
Joyce: But I also think that we have to have a district and we have to have at least something set
out saying we're trying to attempt to do this. Is that correct Kate?
Aanenson: Yep. But what I'm hearing historic is not the correct district...true sense of the word.
Brooks: It really shouldn't. I think that we should be looking in Chanhassen at the historical
area and our history is, you know Ladd says well we don't really have historical. No, that's not
true. Our history is rural. That's where we need to look and that's where we need to...but we do
need to, I think the idea of having the district in town is really...
Sidney: You were talking about an interpretative center and moving a building there. That's the
kind of thing.
Brooks: ...we do have farmhouses in Chanhassen. And the other thing that's being promoted
around the United States is something called rural landscape. Where communities now are just
looking at the landscape itself and the path, as an example of our cultural, trying to preserve that,
before it becomes warehouses.
Aanenson: That's our Bluff Creek alignment.
Brooks: There we go. We have, yeah. Two things going at once.
Joyce: Do we have enough here or do you want to see this again or what?
Aanenson: Yeah, I'm going to bring it back to you. I've got some good direction and I'm trying
to get it so I can, I'll give the feedback to the Council. Sharmin's been working on more specific
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Planning Commission Meeting - December 3, 1997
balance to what I'm saying. I know there's some negatives to what I'm saying. Again,just to
feed that back to,bounce that off of you. My opinions on that site. I think we do need park and
ride facilities. They very definitely have to encourage that. I'm just, as we think about this and
as we talk to staff, I guess I'd like to see what...recommend besides what they...make downtown
a little bit more friendlier from... I don't have much... I'm not sure if we need a district. I
honestly don't know what we need to do. I don't know by putting a district in what it means
other than design standards. I know that the old St. Hubert's church will take a lot... That is an
icon. That is something that I really feel is significant. It's probably the only major landmark
that I know of that is real significant to our history and I would hope, I don't know the
economics...
Blackowiak: Well I just have a couple quick things. My first impression, looking at the map,
that I totally understand the area south of West 78th Street. I don't understand why the area north
of West 78th Street would be included. I just don't see anything north of West 78th Street that
really calls out to me and says you know, save this. We need to preserve it. We need to do
something special with it. South, definitely. There's some areas. The old church. The old
Village Hall. We really need to take good care of them and whether it be with architectural
standards and streetscaping, you know whatever it takes. I think we need to do that but just again
my first thought was that north of West 78`h Street didn't make a lot of sense to me. I do like the
idea of the townhomes that you showed in the packet. I think those are very interesting. But
again I guess it's not time to do any rezoning or anything but 1 just think that they look nice and
if that would work on that far eastern property, I would certainly support looking at a design like
that because...
Joyce: LuAnn.
Sidney: I was listening intently to all the commissioners comments and I agree with many of
them. I think my first impression when I looked at this proposed district is, like Allyson, first
Allyson's comments. That I was a bit confused that I wasn't quite sure of the historic
significance of many of the buildings on the site. I guess what I'm really feeling at this point is
that what we're trying to do is, like Ladd said, try to apply design standards to this area to mimic
old main streets of you know Minnesota. And if that's the intent, I guess I agree and I like the
idea of having buildings close to the street. Drawing people from the neighborhood with
pedestrian traffic and gathering places. I do have a problem you know thinking of it in terms of a
historical district though. If it's something like a main street development or extension district
with design standards, I can see that. I think that would be a great benefit to the downtown. I
guess that's it.
Joyce: My only comments are, I can certainly see what Allyson is saying about the historical
district. I believe though that it should be made into a district. I believe in a district. Now that
might be opposed to what other people say but I think it should be considered a special area. I do
think that we should consider the boundary possibly, but I think that's not what we're talking
about right here. We're just trying to get the issues out.
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Planning Commission Meeting - December 3, 1997
here is a nice idea. It's a very good idea, but we're creating what we call in preservation an
architectural...Deerfield, Massachusetts. But my concern is that by calling something a
historical...when it isn't, we have historical resources that have, like the brick farmhouses that
are historic. That are important. That we're losing. And what you do is give this false
impression to the public we're preserving something that's not really there. I mean yes we do
have some structures like the Village Hall, old, old Village Hall, but the 1976 church is not
historic. I don't want to give the impression to the public that we're preserving things that we're
not. The heritage of Chanhassen is rural. Not urban. And we need to think about how we're
preserving the rural landscape and the rural... That's not included in this. Every subdivision that
goes in, we lose a farmstead and we lose another brick house, and those brick houses of Carver
County are nationally, not locally, not state, nationally significant structures. And you can see
them on down Audubon Road and so I want to make sure that if we do something like the
historical district, I'm not comfortable with calling it a historical district.
Joyce: Are you comfortable with the district?
Brooks: I am comfortable with doing the district. I am comfortable with the concept of making
an area walkable. Having design standards. I'm not arguing with that. My discomfort is taking
away from the rural heritage of Chanhassen, and like I said before, giving the public the
misimpression that we're preserving something that we're not and losing the things we ought to
be preserving.
Joyce: Plus historic might be just so generic maybe we can figure out something. I'm just
thinking heritage district or anything like that. She has, Allyson has a good point.
Brooks: If we are going to do, I know there's been a move to start a historical society in
Chanhassen or historical commission. If we are going to do some historic preservation, let's
really preserve what needs to be preserved and that's the rural heritage. ...those brick farmhouses
are important,and we can do both. I mean maybe if we're trying to do something like this, we
should consider doing urban and rural. But I just don't want to give the impression, I'm saying
get rid of the idea. I'm just saying.
Aanenson: No. This is what I want to hear.
Joyce: Anybody else want to comment quickly or?
Conrad: Yeah. I don't think it's appropriate for a park. I guess I'd like staff to tell me why we
should put, not tonight but why park and ride would make sense. It seems like it's tokenism.
Plus I'd probably have a more philosophic. That is create a downtown. Create a sense of main
street which would be buildings and at that intersection, leaving it open doesn't seem right to me.
Putting cars there doesn't seem right to me. Putting something that feels like a downtown...to
me. It'd be hard for me to change that opinion ever, regardless of what we talk about. It just, I
want a lot of parks. I just don't know that that's where I'd like to embellish the city. You bring
up buildings to the street. That makes a real good feeling of the downtown. That's what we
should be encouraging in that. I don't know if it's a good commercial though. I know there's a
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Planning Commission Meeting - December 3, 1997
Blackowiak moved, Brooks seconded that the Planning Commission recommends approval
of the Bluff Creek Overlay District ordinance, Draft#4, amending Section 20-1461, adding
item (f) to include this ordinance to all land uses, including industrial and commercial, with
accompanying graphics. All voted in favor and the motion carried.
Conrad: Chairman,one comment to staff. Will this change to the PUD ordinance as a result of
this?
Generous: Yes.
Conrad: When will that come forward?
Generous...
CHANHASSEN HISTORICAL DISTRICT-DISCUSSION.
Public Present:
Name Address
Kathy& Jacqueline Schroeder 7720 Frontier Trail
Vernelle Clayton
Kate Aanenson presented the staff report on this item.
Joyce: Looking at the comments made by City Council, is there a little bit of urgency involved in
this or do you feel the urgency? I guess the reason I'm asking is that, I feel this is a really
important area, obviously and something we really should kind of digest and getting this right
now, it might be better for us to think about it.
Brooks: I have a lot of comments.
Aanenson: The urgency is that, I don't see the urgency.
Joyce: I guess I'm asking, can we bring this back at our next Planning Commission?
Aanenson: Oh yeah. If you want to spend a month on it, that's fine. ...back to the Council
what issues you have and what...working on.
Joyce: I'm happy to let anyone make any comments they'd like but I'm just saying that I'm
definitely going to suggest, let's bring this back and...
Brooks: ...that I think are really. First of all...and I have real, maybe because I'm in Historic
Preservation. I have real difficulties with calling something historical... What we're trying to do
17
Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
Skip Cook: I had thought of that too, to a point.
Blackowiak: So although you may be reducing a lot size, I would hope. I mean it might not be
dollar for dollar but I would hope that there would be some appreciation in value.
Skip Cook: ...take in-between though with the amount of, you know we can have a whole bunch
of open space too and.
Brooks: I just want to say I agree with Alison on that one... I think that's a lot of the reason
people come out to Chanhassen...they're looking for a sort of a rural, country atmosphere and if
you keep something like Bluff Creek and cluster your houses to get that open space, it makes the
land much more...
Joyce: Thank you. Anybody else like to address the Planning Commission on this topic?
Seeing none, I'll close the public hearing. Are there any comments in regards to the ordinance?
Allyson?
Brooks: No,just the ones I had about the industrial.
Joyce: Okay.
Blackowiak: No comments.
Sidney: None at this point.
Joyce: Great job. Thank you very much Mark for putting this together. You certainly put a lot
of effort into it and we've had it a few times in front of us and tweaked it a little bit and I think it
could work pretty well. We need to make a motion though correct? Can I get a motion for
putting this ordinance.
Blackowiak: Well I'll make a motion that the Planning Commission approve the adoption of the,
we don't have a number of course. The Bluff Creek ordinance, Draft#4 adding in Section 20-
1461, letter f. Verbiage to the effect of application of the ordinance to all land, etc. Plus some
sort of graphic...industrial sites and that was it.
Joyce: Does that work?
Aanenson: Yep.
Joyce: Okay. Do I have a second?
Brooks: Yes.
16
Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
Aanenson: No. It would...primary zone...
Skip Cook: What could you...
Aanenson: Outside the primary zone...that property...
Skip Cook: So that would have no use?
Aanenson: Well that's one that we'd have to look at because.
Joyce: Skip has the garden, what property are you talking about?
Aanenson: He has that piece and he has a piece across the street. The garden center has property
outside the primary zone but the hotel is right...
Skip Cook: If you went 300 feet back from the property line, you'd encompass most of it.
Aanenson: That one we'd have to look specifically when it comes in because he does have
limitations...
Skip Cook: Yeah and then you push to the other side and then property setbacks.
Aanenson: ...would probably have to...but it is a lot of record...but there's not a different, the
defining factor is where the primary...
Skip Cook: I had another question...concerning any of mine at this point but the example of the
one property you gave. When you reduced the actual buildable area for those people on that
acreage,aren't you actually in essence reducing the value of that property for those people? The
amount of land that they can develop if they plan to put in so many houses, the example was
given 11,000 square feet...20,000 square feet.
Aanenson: That's the lot size.
Skip Cook: Yeah. But the value of a 20,000 square foot lot is possibly worth more than 11,000
square foot lot or you could put more in on that property.
Joyce: Get two houses in.
Skip Cook: Yeah,just curious. I mean you're reducing...value of the land.
Aanenson: But you're also reducing your cost to put in streets...
Blackowiak: Kate can I add something? I would hope that there would be a trade off in terms of
increased value because of the creek.
15
Planning Commission Meeting - December 3, 1997
Joyce: Where, Mark where, are we at the intent, right at the beginning of the intent section?
Mark Koegler: Yes. One potential option would be to add that as part of Section 20-1461 as
another intent statement, which would be item f.
Brooks: I'm sorry, what was that Section 20?
Mark Koegler: It's on page 4. Starting with line 15. That could become an item f as a part of
that section and we could certainly craft verbiage that would reflect the application of the
ordinance to all of the land uses envisioned within the corridor.
Joyce: All land.
Brooks: I don't know how the rest of you feel but it would make a little more... I have thought
it out...
Joyce: You don't think it's redundant at all do you Mark?
Mark Koegler: No, I don't think it's redundant and Kate just pointed out another good idea.
That we try to make this at least somewhat graphic in it's orientation and perhaps there's a
graphic that we can put in there as well to help relay.
Brooks: That would be wonderful...
Mark Koegler: Very quickly,very visually that applies to both.
Brooks: Yeah, I think that would be a very,very good idea.
Mark Koegler: We drafted a section f there, all land uses envisioned in the corridor including
commercial industrial.
Kate Aanenson: According to the underlying land... We can just list all the...
Brooks: I think we should just specifically say though...and I think the idea of having a visual
graphic geared towards industrial and commercial would be very, very useful. I just don't want
any developers coming in...
Joyce: No, it's a good suggestion. Thanks. Anybody else? Okay. I guess I'll open this up for a
public hearing. If you're interested in speaking on this topic,please step to the podium and state
your name and address. Be happy to listen to your comments. Anybody interested in
discussing the Bluff Creek overlay district. Thank you.
Skip Cook: My name is Skip Cook. I just had a quick question for you. A question on the
setback on commercial. Is that going to be broken up from residential? The setback from Bluff
Creek...
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Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
do a comparison here. The comparison being if the Bluff Creek ordinance for the size of this
property...shaded area, is off on this side of the site, that is the area...primary and dashed lines
and the secondary the more gray area. You can see the impact. It's a fairly significant portion of
this property. What that would mean in one alternative in this particular case would be to still
develop this in a single family lot pattern but to do so on smaller lots preserving open space both
in it's bulk form along the corridor as well as some islands, some little greenways that might be
associated with the development itself. Through the provisions of the City's PUD ordinance
there would be other development options that would be possible here also. For example
townhouses could occupy a portion of this site. Thereby obviously freeing up potentially even
more open space or permitting a mix with single family lots that were of a larger size. These
particular lots I think average about 11,000 square feet. The previous example I believe the lots
averaged, what was it? About 20-21,000 square feet. The density incidentally that is shown here
is very much consistent with the tabulation that staff maintains of recent development projects,
recent within at least the last 5 years or so. On sites with similar physical characteristics to which
you'd find throughout most of the Bluff Creek corridor. Mr. Chairman with that, that's a
summary of the ordinance and at least a taste of how it is to be applied. I and staff would
certainly respond to questions you might have.
Joyce: Any questions for Mark or staff?
Brooks: I had a quick question for Mark. You had talked about strengthening the ordinance so it
clarifies the industrial areas. I didn't see that or did we decide not to do that?
Mark Koegler: Well we have looked at that and talked about that and I think if that's still a
concern of the commission we can certainly look at probably putting a couple of words in here or
there. I guess what we looked at more was how the mechanics of it worked and did it still
support the industrial properties as well as the residential. I think we're satisfied that it does do
that. But if you'd like to earmark perhaps a little more closely, you had the word commercial
industrial in there, we certainly can do that. We haven't made that change.
Joyce: Where exactly are you looking at that you'd like to?
Brooks: Just in general I guess.
Joyce: In general.
Brooks: ...didn't feel that there was anything specifically for...it was more geared to residential.
Mark Koegler: We actually could begin that, almost even in the intent portion in making it
clear...to really apply to all types of land use as envisioned in the city's future land use plan for
this area, including commercial, industrial and residential.
Brooks: That would make me a little more comfortable. I do feel that we have some of those
types of, those areas and...within the Bluff Creek area as Alison talked about.
13
Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
staff resources that are available or based on resources that an applicant might bring to bear as
part of the application process. What's required essentially is the developer will propose a plan
that if you will, will kind of ignore the primary and secondary first, in order to define a threshold
of kind of quote, unquote, normal development. Development that would include areas of the
primary and secondary but not include those other areas that are already not permitted in the plan
such as wetlands for example. That would formulate either a base density in residential or a base
impervious cover level in a commercial industrial development that then could be clustered on
other portions of the site. So the central premise of this ordinance is not to prohibit development
but I think was stated earlier, to channel development into areas that are outside of the significant
resources that make the Bluff Creek corridor unique as it is. So a quick word there on how it
works and it's in that fashion. Boundaries maps then would be maintained by the City.
Essentially the maps that have been developed to date and as I indicated, could be modified with
more specific resource information and more on site information. I think the appropriate analogy
there as you look at the NWI maps on wetlands you get one configuration but when you actually
do the field research, typically you'll have a better delineated boundary and that kind of thing
could happen here as well. There are portions of the ordinance that deal with impervious cover.
It makes reference to the City's Best Management Practices Handbook with regard to some of the
erosion control measures and other things that are a part of that. Sight views are referenced in
the ordinance. There is an attempt, at least language that seeks to preserve sight views, not only
from a site but through a site in some cases, allowing more public access,at least in a visual
sense to the Bluff Creek corridor itself. One of the central portions of this ordinance deals with
density clustering, and in essence what we're looking at there is will borrow from a current
resources...but typically a subdivision might look like this in a very generic sense...lots that are
larger lots. Simply referring those resources that are either undevelopable or...as wetlands are
today. The approach of clustering then becomes one of taking that same number of units, or in
essence that same density, and clustering that into what may be smaller lots in this particular
example, on an individual...but preserving a vastly larger amount of open space and in this case
Bluff Creek corridor that would be adjacent to it. So that kind of helps I think focus perhaps on
the premise behind this ordinance. Again, it's shifting the focus of the development shifting the
density if you will from out of the sensitive areas to areas that lie adjacent to them. Other
features of the ordinance itself deal with natural habitat preservation. Within the primary zone
essentially the ordinance is consistent with the plan recommendations, seeks to preserve that as
open space. Entirely 100% open space. Development can occur within the secondary portion
and certainly the portions of the site that are not within either of those. There are some structural
setbacks that are referenced as part of the ordinance as well. It's consistent with the wetland
portion of the city's code and it looks at a 40 foot setback for structure from the edge of the
delineated edge of that primary zone. In summary I just want to refer to one more example, if I
may very quickly. We did, as the Planning Commission is aware,periodically do some kind of
spot checks on some of the properties. It's not meant to be a comprehensive look at every
property within the corridor but a representative sample to see, and...for us to assess what
problems may occur. An example of that, which is more real...is the Erhart's property across TH
101 in the area of Bandimere Park. TH 101... would run right up along this portion of the site.
This is the traditional layout which...just quickly concept form so it's not 100% accurate but it's
very close in that it preserves the wetlands and it shows right-of-way...standards. That particular
plan...but it ends up with that density of about 2.04 units per acre...could be a little bit higher...
12
Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
ordinance it states that the primary zone is the buffer zone that directly impacts Bluff Creek
and/or it's tributaries. The primary zone which is generally delineated in the Bluff Creek
Watershed Management Plan is intended to be preserved as permanent open space. The
secondary zone means a buffer zone that contains habitat areas that are valuable to the delicate
balance of the Bluff Creek ecosystem. Secondary zone is generally delineated in the
management plan. Is subject to development limitations in order to minimize the impact of new
development on the primary zone. Both of those terms, and essentially those definitions as really
does much of the body of this ordinance, come from the management plan that preceded it. On
the exhibit that's on the table, if you look this darker green color, that comes and meanders, kind
of follows the center line...primary area. More of a grayish tone that you can see that's adjacent
to that in the secondary area that's more of a light color... area within the watershed itself and
not designated as either primary or secondary. Primary for example is the center line...
Secondary in this... It is delineated, albeit somewhat hard to see on this exhibit but it is clearly
delineated as part of the management plan itself. The ordinance,as in typical ordinance fashion,
does contain a purpose statement and intent statement. I want to refer to those briefly and I'll
stick those on the overhead... The purpose really revolves around a number of premises, virtually
all of which again are taken from the management plan itself to protect the Bluff Creek corridor,
the wetlands and so forth to encourage development patterns that allows people and nature to
mix in the ecosystem that's present along the creek and it's tributaries. To promote innovative
development techniques such as cluster development and open space subdivisions. To foster the
creation of a greenway connecting Lake Minnewashta Regional Park and Minnesota River
Valley. Encourage cost effective site development and then to implement the policies and
recommendations that are found in the plan. And for sake of not having to spit out that long title
each time, I'll refer to it as the plan and that's the watershed plan itself. The urban draft also
contains...supported by criteria by which development can be judged. Development within the
district should blend into the natural environment while protecting Bluff Creek and sensitive land
areas abutting and in the vicinity of the water course and it's tributaries. Criteria that is
essentially supportive of that, you would look at developments to determine whether first of all
they're consistent with the provisions of the comprehensive plan, and the plan is included within
that. Preservation of natural conditions found in the primary zone and to the greatest extent
possible preserving resources within the secondary zone. Looking at developments to determine
if there's a balance between the arrangement of open space, landscaping, views, some of the
other features such as bluff protection and vegetation. Then finally creation of an interconnected
open space network. Again this corridor is looked at and very strongly stated in the management
plan that it fulfills a variety of functions,both in terms of it's natural habitat for wildlife, but also
as a resource that really meanders through this community from north to south providing
potentially a trail linkage and educational resource as well within the community at large. So
those are some of the kinds of statements that are being looked at as part of the intent behind this
ordinance and what the purpose of the ordinance actually is. The ordinance itself, much like the
city's Highway 5 ordinance will be an overlay ordinance. It will work with the existing zoning
and really fit over the top of that and put on another layer of criteria if you will. More on the
nitty gritty basis of how it works. When an applicant comes in with a project,as a part of either a
zoning or a subdivision request that will come before you and the City Council, they will be
required first of all to reference the City's maps which identify these zones. Those maps, as you
talked about in your previous case,potentially can be modified from time to time, either based on
11
Planning Commission Meeting - December 3, 1997
33. "No parking" fire lane signs and yellow curbing shall be provided. Contact the Chanhassen
Fire Marshal for exact locations of signage and painted curbing. Pursuant to Chanhassen Fire
Department/Fire Prevention Policy#06-1991. Copy enclosed.
34. Fire apparatus access roads shall be provided for every facility, building or portion of a
building hereafter constructed or moved into or within jurisdiction when any portion of the
facility, or any portion of an exterior wall of the first story of the building, is located more
than 150 feet from apparatus access as measured by an approved route around the exterior of
the building or facility. Exception:
When buildings are completely protected with an approved automatic sprinkler system
the provisions of this section may be modified by the Chief.
When access roads cannot be installed due to topography, waterways, non negotiable
grades or other similar conditions, the Chief is authorized to require additional fire
protection as specified in Section 10.501 (b). Note: As building plans become available
we will review the plan to determine if standpipes are required in any portion of the
building due to the fact that we cannot achieve 150 foot access of all portions of the
building."
All voted in favor and the motion carried.
PUBLIC HEARING: BLUFF CREEK OVERLAY DISTRICT.
Public Present:
Name Address
Mark Koegler HKGI, 123 No. 3rd Street, Mpls.
Kurt Papke 1131 Homestead Lane
Skip Cook Eden Prairie
Kate Aanenson presented the staff report on this item.
Mark Koegler: Thanks Kate. Good evening Mr. Chairman,members of the Commission. I'd
like to provide a brief summary of the ordinance. The specific items that are within that and
then...obviously answer any questions that you might have. This ordinance is,as Kate indicated,
is a follow-up implementation tool,or one of the implementation tools of the Bluff Creek
management plan itself. The ordinance will actually amend both the portions of the zoning
ordinance and subdivision ordinance and will create what we're calling the Bluff Creek Overlay
District. The ordinance as you look through it, first of all begins to define some definitions that
currently are not part of city code. Things like clustered development, ecosystem,natural habitat
area. The two I want to focus on were a couple of terms that were bantered around in the first
discussion item you had this evening. That's primary zone and secondary zone. From the
10
Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
22. The public street and utility improvements throughout the development will require detailed
construction plans and specifications in accordance with the City's latest edition of standard
specifications and detail plates. Final construction plans and specifications shall be
submitted for City Council approval. The private utilities shall also be constructed in
accordance with City's Standard Specifications and Detail Plates.
23. The developer will be required to enter into a PUD Agreement/Development Contract with
the City and provide the necessary financial security to guarantee utility and street
construction as well as the final plat conditions of approval.
24. The proposed wet tap on the watermain near the trail in the southeasterly corner of the site
shall be relocated to avoid interference with the existing trail.
25. Public streets shall be incorporated to provide access to all three lots. A 60-foot wide right-
of-way with a 60-foot radius cul-de-sac shall be incorporated into the site plan. The private
street shall be constructed to a 9-ton design.
26. All parking lot drive aisles adjacent to 90 degree parking shall be a minimum of 26-feet wide
pursuant to City Code. Drive aisle configurations near the intersection of Lots 1, 2 and 3 lot
line shall be reconfigured to minimize drive aisle points onto main street.
27. The developer's right for a future right-in/right-out access to Trunk Highway 5 shall be
extinguished upon final platting unless the developer negotiates with MnDOT to transfer the
right-in/right-out access to the adjacent property to the east.
28. The City's standards for boulevard street lighting shall be incorporated in the public portion
of the streets.
29. A 10 foot clear space must be maintained around fire hydrants, i.e., street lamps, trees,
shrubs, bushes, NSP, US West, Cable TV and transformer boxes. This is to ensure that fire
hydrants can be quickly located and safely operated by firefighters. Pursuant to Chanhassen
City Ordinance 9-1.
30. Install post indicator valve on fire water service coming into the building. Contact
Chanhassen Fire Marshal or Fire Inspector for exact location.
31. An additional fire hydrant will be required near the church main entrance. Contact
Chanhassen Fire Marshal for exact location of hydrant.
32. When fire protection including fire apparatus access roads and water supplies for fire
protection is required. Such protection shall be installed and made serviceable prior to and
during time of construction. Pursuant to Minnesota Uniform Fire Code 1991 Sect. 10-502.
9
Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
dedication of the"creek"outlots into public domain desirable, the Park& Recreation
Commission would review this offer. But, again, no park fee credits would be granted.
12. The applicant is required to plan private internal trail connectors from their site to the
surrounding public trail system, thus maximizing their benefit of the recreation system
already in place.
13. The applicant shall dedicate a 20 ft. trail easement over the trail segment located in the
southeast corner of the site that lays outside the Coulter Boulevard right-of-way.
14. The development shall maintain the natural vegetation and landscape where it still exists,
intensify the proposed landscape plan along the creek to improve the buffer and to keep
setbacks from the creek at a minimum of 100 feet with a 50 foot buffer area.
15. This area has been identified by the Bluff Creek Management Plan, as a candidate for
floodplain forest restoration. The applicant shall incorporate some element of forest
restoration in the landscape plan along both branches of bluff creek.
16. The developer shall supply the City with a detailed haul route for review and approval by
staff for materials imported to or exported from the site. If the material is proposed to be
hauled off-site to another location in Chanhassen, that property owner will be required to
obtain an earthwork permit from the City.
17. The applicant's engineer should review the possibility of connecting into the City's existing
storm sewer in Coulter Boulevard from the southerly drainage pond or combining the pond
with the proposed storm water basin north of the church. If the developer desires to construct
the southerly pond, the City shall not be responsible for maintenance and the developer shall
not receive credit against their SWMP fees.
18. All ponding basin side slopes shall be 4:1 overall or 3:1 with a 10:1 bench at the normal
water elevation.
19. The grading, drainage and erosion control plan shall incorporate temporary sediment basins
to address site runoff during the grading operations.
20. The storm sewer system shall be designed for a 10-year, 24-hour storm event. Ponding
calculations and drainage maps including pre-and post-development conditions for a 10-year
and 100-year storm event will also be required by City staff for review and approval prior to
final plat consideration.
21. The applicant shall work with MnDOT in coordinating the storm drainage system from Trunk
Highway 5 into the proposed stormwater basin north of the church site. The applicant may
be entitled to credits against their SWMP fees as a result of pond oversizing and pipe
extension.
8
Planning Commission Meeting- December 3, 1997
1. The applicant shall submit site coverage and impervious surface calculations for each lot and
the overall site.
2. Staff recommends that the church commit to provide approximately 160 parking stalls for the
industrial office users of the property.
3. Staff recommends that the amount of parking and impervious surface on Lots 2 and 3 be
reduced.
4. Staff believes that a U-shaped building on the northerly portion of the property would be
more appropriate to address pedestrian circulation to the proposed warehouse as well as
address the sight lines for the truck loading facility. Staff would recommend that the building
orientation be primarily toward Highway 5 and Coulter Boulevard, especially for Lots 1 and 2,
rather than the orientation shown on the concept plan. This would require the building on Lot
1 to be reoriented 90 to 180 degrees and the building on Lot 2 to be reoriented 90 degrees. Staff
would also suggest that the church investigate a walkout type facility, similar to that used for
the St. Hubert Catholic Community in Villages on the Ponds,to help reduce site grading. To
improve the layout, staff suggests to design a parking lot on both sides of the building and
add sidewalks.
5. Staff strongly recommends all 34 boulevard trees be preserved and guaranteed by the
applicant. Where trees need to be removed for entrances, they must be replaced elsewhere
along Coulter Boulevard. Protective tree fencing shall be installed around all boulevard trees
prior'to any grading activity.
6. Additional landscape islands are required in the parking lots; a minimum of one island for
each 6,000 square feet of vehicular use area.
7. The loading docks of the southern warehouse building are visible from Coulter Boulevard
and require evergreen plantings to screen the area.
8. Visibility of the expansive parking lots from Highway 5 should be limited as much as
possible.
9. The applicant shall incorporate increased evergreen plantings and berms to obstruct sight
lines into the parking areas.
10. Plantings along Bluff Creek and the proposed storm water pond should be chosen based on
wildlife food and/or cover value. Proposed overstory and ornamental trees could be a choice
of quaking aspen, amur maple, willows,black cherry, serviceberry, swamp white oak, or
aborvitae while proposed shrubs could include highbush cranberry, winterberry, elders,
sumac, and red-osier dogwood. City staff shall approve final landscape schedule.
11. In lieu of parkland dedication and public trail development, the city shall collect full park and
trail dedication fees for this development. In the event that the applicant deems the
7