PRC 1988 06 14
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CHANHASSEN PARK AND RECREATION COMMISSION
REGULAR MEETING
JUNE 14, 1988
Chairman Mady called the meeting to order at 7:40 p.m..
MEMBERS PRESENT: Jim Mady, Ed Hasek, Carol Watson, Larry Schroers, Mike
Lynch and Sue Boyt
MEMBERS ABSENT: Curt Robinson
STAFF PRESENT: Lori Sietsema, Park and Rec Coordinator; Todd Hoffman,
Recreational Supervisor; Mark Koegler and Dale Gregory
APPROVAL OF MINUTES: Hasek moved, Mady seconded to approve the Minutes
of the Park and Recreation Commission meeting dated May 24, 1988. All
voted in favor and the motion carried.
REVISED PARKING PLAN FOR GREENWOOD SHORES.
Hasek: Mark, is there anything different between this plan and that last
one? The 8 1/2 by II?
Mark Koegler: Let me cover that quickly. Not a great deal, no. We
don't have an elaborate presentation because the only additions that have
been put on here were the few items that specifically were requested at
the last meeting which essentially were the abutting residences of three.
Lori and I went out and we field taped those locations and then
I verified those on half section aerial photos so those are quite close.
They're not exact because they're not surveyed but they're close. The
other item...since the print set that went out in the packet was the
Commission had talked about some type of a walkway extension coming back
from this point and coming up to Utica Lane. We have shown one manner in
which that can be accomplished for your consideration this evening. One
of the residents last time pointed out the question, the distance here
between the bituminous path and the beach and Lori and I checked that and
it was off by about 8 or 9 feet. It's been moved up so now it is in as
accurate a location as we can get again, without having a survey. The
parking plan itself remains unchanged. This was the scheme for anybody
who wasn't here before. It looks at including the spaces up on the top
area instead of the lower area. We had also talked about and looked at
the berm and there was consideration by the Commission as to whether or
not there was value to retain that. Our reaction after looking at that
again in the field is that we will keep that there because I think it
serves as a buffer to help mitigate the parking there but it did not
preclude view of the parking spaces from this area where somebody might
potentially pull in, observe they're full and than depart the area. So
with those modifications, the plan and the location of the spaces is the
same. The only additions are the items that I just noted.
Hasek: When you were out there Mark, did you happen to notice where the
location of the park sign was? I guess it's not so much that it's says
it on the map. I wondered if you thought that perhaps it was a visual
Park and Recreation Commission Meeting
June 14, 1988 - Page 2
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barrier for access/egress.
Mark Koegler: To be honest with you, we didn't specifically look at it
when we were out there.
Mady: We talked about doing the gravel in the bottom part of the
existing parking area. I'm looking at all the rest of that gravel that
exists there down to the lift station, the lift station that is in
private beachlot that I belong to does not have gravel going to it. The
City doesn't have to go and work on that thing, it's not that often. I'm
wondering if it's possible to take all that gravel out of there and make
it a green space. Are we going to be gaining anything by that or would
the street department have a problem with that?
Sietsema: Dale might be able to answer that better than I.
Dale Gregory: utilities is down there just about every day.
Mady: I know they look at it just about every day but they don't
actually have to drive up to it.
Dale Gregory: I really don't know how much maintenance they're doing or
how often they're working on the lift station.
Boyt: At our beachlot they drive down the hill and walk to get to it. ~.
Mady: It would be about the same distance I think with ours.
Hasek: Even if they do have to pull maintenance on it, do they have to
go right up to it?
Dale Gregory: Yes. They have to back their trucks right up to the lift
station so they can pull the pumps.
Hasek: What's the possibility of maybe lightly overlaying the gravel
with top soil and seeding it and leaving the bed in place?
Dale Gregory: With the gravel underneath you're not going to get very
good growth in your grass.
Hasek: I know. It's always a little spotty.
Dale Gregory: And this year it would really be bad. As soon as it's dry
it's going to dry up.
Hasek: Have you ever tried that in the City?
Mady: Another thing I was thinking, I would not go up extending the
trail into the street. If we had all this extra gravel there, being
used for that gravel... What would you use for underneath the path? If-,
you have a paved path?
Park and Recreation Commission Meeting
June 14, 1988 - Page 3
J!I""'"
Mark Koegler: Class V. To answer your questions, presumably this also
would take the gravel out completely. It hadn't been considered before
and I think that's something ultimately we could refer to Jerry Boucher
and see what his reaction was but there's no steep grade in there or -any
reason they couldn't conceivably drive across turf areas. The concern
obviously also is in the wintertime when they have to provide any
maintenance to that and if so, what does that do to the grass. Will it
get dug up? If they're willing to walk in just to check the lift station
and for the very infrequent occasions they'd have to actually pull up to
service it, I wouldn't think that could be any problem.
Boyt: I think they plow all the way to ours. They plow the grass.
Dale
them
up.
they
Gregory: During the wintertime they plow up to just about all of
so when they're broke down they can go right to them and get them
Otherwise, if they get a lot of snow, it takes a long time before
can get them plowed out so they try to keep them open all the time.
Boyt: It's never affected our grass.
Mady: Dale, do we seed up here where the hockey rinks, the skating rink
is every year?
~
Dale Gregory:
We seed all of our family rinks every year.
Mady: That would be a possibility.
Mark Koegler: I think the main value to that would be returning the
green space to the park more so than using the Class V. It mayor may
not be suitable for use.
Mady: I'm looking at green space in the park is all.
Hasek: Do we want to take advantage of the possibility of talking to the
maintenance or other people to see if we can...
Mady: I think the discussion in making it green space, the problem is
going to be whether or not the street department or maintenance
department feels it's acceptable for them to get to.
Sietsema: Your discussion will be reflected in the Minutes that will go
along with your recommendation and I can ask Jerry Boucher and talk about
that in my cover memo to Council as well.
Mady: There's no reason for us to have a road going down into the park.
As long as it's a park there I'd like to see green space.
",,-,
Hasek: I guess my comments are that I think it accomodates what we had
intended without disturbing the park...that it did before with the
parking spaces in place. The site has been checked and rechecked and
some of the items that were of concern to us before and I'd like to make
a motion that we send this to Council for approval.
Park and Recreation Commission Meeting
June 14, 1988 - Page 4
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Lynch: Is there identification on that sketch that we can refer to?
sietsema: I'll have it dated.
Mady: It's dated June 10th.
Hasek: That one's revised.
sietsema: I'll have it dated June 14th.
Boyt: Do you know if they'll put, slow them up for this stop sign?
Mady: Does this plan include the bollards? That's a gate post but
that's not going to prevent cars from driving out over the gravel area.
Sietsema: No, it doesn't. Do you want us to put the bollards on the
plan?
Mady: Yes. As long as we have the money available in the budget I'd
like to see it done otherwise they'll just end up driving around it.
Schroers: ...that requires lighting?
Sietsema: There is a light down in the park.
....."
Hasek: But it shines towards the beach.
Schroers: I know where that light was. My question is, is there
additional lighting that goes into the parking lot?
Sietsema: Not automatically. If you want to include that in your
recommenadtion, you could.
Hasek: I guess I would just as soon the lighting stay out of it. All it
does is just encourage people to stay and park later than they should
anyways.
Hasek moved, Lynch seconded that the Park and Recreation Commission
recommend to approve the Parking Plan for Greenwood Shores dated June 14,
1988 with bollards and stop sign. All voted in favor and the motion
carried.
Sietsema: I will be scheduling this for the July 11th City Council
meeting and I will be notifying everybody who signed up previously and
was on that petition that you gave us and that is on tonight's sign up.
REVIEW PARK MAINTENANCE STAFF NEEDS, DALE GREGORY.
...."
Sietsema: I put for your review a memo that I received from Gary Warren
on Friday after the packets were already out. It addresses some of the
issues that I brought to his attention and I also had talked to him about
Park and Recreation Commission Meeting
June 14, 1988 - Page 5
"......
your concern about enough maintenance staff. Dale's here to discuss any
questions that you might have and let you know what his needs are. Gary
indicated that your recommendation would be appreciated.
Mady: Council approved our revised budget which included placing a trail
along Laredo and Carver Beach Road. How do we stand on being able to get
to that?
Sietsema: Our first two priorities this summer were those two Lotus Lake
parks. I believe Dale will be working on South Lotus now that North
Lotus is pretty much in good shape. I would anticipate that the trails
could come right after that. We have to figure out what the street
people are doing as well because they're help in needed in putting in
trails. Do you have any idea when a trail could be ready along Laredo?
Dale Gregory: It's going to be a while. Jerry's got his guys so busy
right now. I got them into North Lotus.
Boyt: Like fall?
Dale Gregory: It's so hard to say. It depends on weather. It depends
on how much work they're got going now and like I say, right now they are
busy. We pull both of the maintenance, heavy pushing operators into
North Lotus Lake and we've got them there for just about 3 weeks and
~ Jerry wasn't too happy that I took those 2 guys for that long but it's
going to be a while. I really couldn't say how long. It depends on how
much work they've got. I did get one back into South Lotus Lake. He did
a little bit of work in there today and I think he'll be back in there
tomorrow to clean out the retention ponds so we can start working on
those.
Mady: I have a question Dale. On the trail on Kerber Blvd., driving by
that, how long do you figure it will be before we're going to have to
resurface that or sealcoat it?
Dale Gregory: The one right alongside of Kerber?
Mady: From the street anyway when you're driving by, it's starting to
look pretty worn.
Dale Gregory: You're looking at probably within the next year to two
years.
Mady: Will we be able to do that in-house?
Dale Gregory: We don't even do the sealcoating of the roads anymore in
house.
Mady: When they go to do that in two years, let's include that on the
bid.
,.....,
Dale Gregory: That's basically the best. That's what we did with Lake
Ann Park a year or so ago. They just included it in a bid and had it
Park and Recreation Commission Meeting
June 14, 1988 - Page 6
......"
resealed with their mat.
Watson: The ones along Kerber now, is that been in a specifications for
how often they have to be sealcoated? That hasn't been there that many
years yet.
Dale Gregory: The thing of it is you've got to watch them and as soon as
they start cracking up and that, you want to seal them and that will keep
the water and moisture from running into that. You can look at Lake Ann
that was sealcoated I believe a year ago, a year or two years ago and
that has got a lot of bad cracks on it. That park, after looking at an
overlay, in the very near future before it's completely breaking up bad.
Watson: Is there anything we can do to make those last longer?
Dale Gregory: The trails aren't so bad because you don't have the heavy
equipment on them. What hurt Lake Ann is all the construction in there.
With the building of the boat landing where we started running building
trucks in there and all this sort stuff and it just tore the heck out of
that blacktop. I'm surprised that it held up as good as it did.
Hasek: It's also on some pretty unstable soil.
Dale Gregory: Right. It's got some spots that are really getting bad.
...-I
Mady: Where do we stand on some maintenanc items such as totlot
equipment and we've got some already sitting that needs installing.
Dale Gregory: We've got two of them that were purchased and didn't get
here until late last fall and we were out of help. Pete and I were back
to ourselves again and we weren't able to get them in. They will
basically be the first ones going in now. What's helped, they sent out
Lori this year and we've got everything ordered for this year early so it
should be getting here. In fact we've already picked up the border for
all of these places. Basically schedule wise, I've got, in fact I've
talked with Todd and we're working on getting the barbed wire and
everything out of between Lake Ann and Greenwood Shores. I'd like to get
that done first and then we'll basically be starting on the playgrounds
and getting those in. I'll talk to Lori or Todd and see if they've got
any preference on where they want to start with.
Mady: I know we've got some that we'd like to see some things would be
taken out and some repair. As far as I'm concerned, I guess I'd like to
see those repairs being made first. There are some safety situations.
Dale Gregory: We've got the one in the Estates. We'll probably just
pull those because they've got plenty of other playground equipment
there. Lake Ann down by the beach, the swings are going to be replaced.
The ones that are there will hold up until the other ones get there so I
hate to take those out because there is nothing else down there for them -'
at that point but the ones like in the Estates where there is plenty of
other equipment, there would be no problem. We could go in there first
and pull those and at least get them out of there.
Park and Recreation Commission Meeting
June 14, 1988 - Page 7
,....
Mady: Teeter totters, we've got a couple of those sitting around. The
totlot equipment up by the ball fields at Lake Ann, that needs to be
screened off.
Dale Gregory: It was worked on today. I had Dean up there today. He
was working on that.
Mady: How are they coming with the structure at Lake Ann? Have they
poured the cement floor yet?
Sietsema: What happened with that is I called up the Legion to see where
they were at. They were going to have the interior completed by Memorial
Day and the week before I called them to see where they were at and I
don't think they really knew so I asked them if the City could just take
over the project and complete it and I would get quotes and they could
approve it and we would oversee it. Since that time they've had
difficulty with the State with their pulltab business and they don't know
if they're going to, right now they have no pulltab business for the last
two weeks and they don't know if they're going to get it reinstated. If
they don't, they can't expend any more money. The quotes came in at
$10,000.00 to finish the interior. To pour the concrete, stub in for
electrical and put up the walls and the counters and the roll-up doors
,.... and everything. It came to about $10,000.00 and they don't have the
money on hand right now to pay for that and if their pulltab business
isn't reinstated, they aren't going to have the money in the future.
They are having an emergency meeting tonight to make a decision on how
they want to handle this. If they're going to walk away from it and the
City has to pick it up or what. I don't have any answers for you right
now because they're meeting right now too to decide what they can do.
Hopefully, I think what we could hope for is that they would be able to
approve one of the quotes and add it to their bill. We would need the
City to front them $10,000.00 more. They've already expended about
$11,000.00 and we allowed them up to $15,000.00 but they've paid
$7,000.00 in construction costs.
Hasek: Will you pay back their front money?
Sietsema: No. They were supposed to provide the labor, the volunteer
labor to build the building and they decided that they couldn't get that
done so they hired a firm to do it and those bills came in at about
$7,000.00 so they paid those but they haven't paid for any of the
materials yet.
Boyt: So far it's cost us $18,000.00 and it's going to cost another
$10,000.00.
Sietsema: Right and to get electrical to it is another $10,000.00.
~ Dale Gregory: It's getting to be an awful expensive building for what
you're getting. For a small building you're spending an awful lot of
money.
Park and Recreation Commission Meeting
June 14, 1988 - Page 8
......"
Watson: Considering we stood over there and nonchalantly walked around
and asked, well heck we'll build another one right over there one of
these days.
Hasek: It should be able to be built for half of what we're going to
spend for this silly thing.
Watson: Obviously they're not going to be putting up several of these
things.
Hasek: Can I ask a question? How did this project begin? Did the
Legion come to us with it?
Sietsema: Yes.
Hasek: Have they done this before to us? Started projects and not
completed them?
Sietsema: No.
Hasek: This is the first time?
Sietsema: Right.
......"
Hasek: What is the reason that they've had such trouble with this
particular one?
Sietsema: As I understand it, Tom Klingelhutz was the commander when
this all began and they started thinking about it in 1985. They came to
the Park and Rec and to the Council and said, we have this pull tab
business. If we don't spend the money on charity things, we lose the
money but we would like to build a shelter because they at that time were
doing the concessions on the 4th of July and they wanted to have
tournaments out at the park and that kind of thing so they wanted to have
a shelter out there that would accomodate concessions. They didn't have
the money in their budget to go ahead and build it and buy all the
materials so they came to the City and said, if you front us the money
for the materials, we'll provide the labor. At that time they said the
building would cost between $20,000.00 and $25,000.00. The City said we
can only afford to give you $15,000.00. They said okay, that's fine.
Well, Tom was no longer the commander by the time they got all that
approval. I don't know if they were have legion wars or what but he
dropped the project. He decided he didn't want to have anything to do
with it and it fell to other people within the organization and I don't
think there was really a leader, someone who was carrying the ball. I
think everybody was kind of, it was like a hot potato within. Once they
were committed, Tom bought all the materials, all the building materials
and everything and then he decided he wasn't going to be involved in it
anymore. He was down in Texas for 3 months and I' don't know if it was "
business. I don't really know why and nobody else picked it up. A -'
couple of times somebody has attempted to and that's when they decided to
hire Bosser-Christianson to construct the building but at one time they
had volunteers from the Fire Department and a lot of people willing to
Park and Recreation Commission Meeting
June 14, 1988 - Page 9
"'"
help but they never got it all together.
Lynch: Once we were going to pick it up and they told us no. We're-
going to get a handle on this and we're going to get it completed.
Sietsema: Then last August Bosser-Christianson came in and said they
were going to do it. Our building department said they had to have a
structural engineer look at it and sign off on it. That took a while
before they got someone hired to do that. They finally got their
building permit and Bosser-Christianson didn't get out there until
December to start building the thing. They finally finished it this
spring and again, the Legion wanted to have it done so they could have a
big Memorial service our there for Memorial Day and it never happened. I
thought I would hurry up and take the ball and run with it and get it
done by the 4th of July and now we're into money problems. So 3 years
later we're still looking at an incomplete building.
Boyt: Is the Rotary interested in taking this over?
Sietsema: I don't know. I know that there is some money that's becoming
available through the Lion's club has made a couple more donations and
that money would be available.
~. Boyt: The Chaska?
Sietsema: Yes.
Boyt: I don't want to use the money for that. From the Lion's to cover
up, to take care of...
Sietsema: They did make a donation, it wasn't to the Park Department as
I understand it. It was $7,000.00 that Don said that he would earmark
for that project and he talked to the Lion's and they were interested in
having it earmarked for that. I just got another donation to the Park
and Rec Department for $4,100.00 so what we want to do with that donation
we still have to decide.
Hasek: How much of the cost of that structure that's there right now has
been from...
Sietsema: $7,500.00. They paid for the Bosser-Christianson bills which
came to roughly $7,000.00 and last summer they made two months payments,
the monthly payments of $250.00 and they made two payments last summer.
So towards their bill they've paid $500.00. You can expect to see this
on the next agenda. I don't know if I'll be able to come to you to get
approval for quotes. I might have to just go to the Council so we can
get this thing done but I will have something on the agenda to update you
on what the latest is.
""""
Mady: This isn't the only group that's looking to get money out of our
pockets. The Hockey Association owes $4,000.00 to the bank for putting
in the lights for the little arena down behind the Dinner Theater and
I've been approached to see if the City, the City has co-signed the note
Park and Recreation Commission Meeting
June 14, 1988 - Page 10
..."",
at the bank and they haven't made a payment on that note yet outside of
interest. Apparently the Hockey Association has changed and the current
orgranization is instituting putting money into Chanhassen. There are
more Chaska people involved or something. In any event, there are other
people who can burn our donated funds.
Sietsema: I haven't been formally approached on that yet.
Mady: I'm surprised because I was about 2 or 3 weeks ago.
Schroers: As far as we're sitting right now with that structure at Lake
Ann, it would be unrealistic to hope to have that in operation before the
4th of July?
Sietsema: ...surface so we can put up some tables in there and use it
for concessions that way but there's no way that the concrete will
probably even be poured.
Mady: I wouldn't have any problem, if we could get a guy out there with
a little Bobcat and just level it so they get a lot of those bumps out of
there, we can live with it I guess for the next year and a half. By the
4th of July it would be nice to see that done.
Dale Gregory: The crushed rock is already there. It's a matter of
grading it up and we've held off in doing anything out there until the
cement was there so we could take and grade it off nice. We can do the
best we can right now and we'll have to redo it once the cement is in
that's all.
..."",
Mady: Because it looks like it's probably going to be a while.
Boyt: So you and Dale have a list of this year's projects of everything
to be accomplished with the staff that's available? Depending on the
weather.
Dale Gregory: We've gone through and basically I picked out the things
that we felt that we could handle. You've got things on there like ice
shelters and things like that...
Sietsema: I haven't gone over with Dale the revised capital
improvements. Ice shelters have been deleted.
Boyt: One of our real high priorities is the Laredo trail before school.
We'd like to, if it looks like your department will have trouble getting
to it, we'd like to make a recommendation that you need extra help so you
can get to that project.
Dale Gregory: I guess I'm lost because I don't know what you want done
on Laredo Trail.
Sietsema: Along Laredo Drive.
..."",
Mady: An off-street trail.
Park and Recreation Commission Meeting
June 14, 1988 - Page 11
~
Boyt: A sidewalk.
Dale Gregory: From Laredo to?
Boyt: Frontier Trail to West 78th Street.
Mady: Basically from the Fire Station down on the west side.
Dale Gregory: That's going to be a tough one for us to complete.
Boyt: That's what we need to know. If it's not a project that you
should be undertaking, than we need to be getting another source.
Dale Gregory: Right, because something like that, it's a matter of we're
going to have to get into the maintenance department again to pull their
men for that.
Boyt: Are they working on the downtown?
,....
Dale Gregory: No, they're working on their own streets and everything
else and they've got their own projects that they've got to get finished.
I've got about 4 of them blacktopping or different projects unless
they've changed with Lori, we can get ready ourselves but again, we'll be
calling in the maintenance department for blacktopping that to complete
some of these projects. That one would be tough for us to get to this
year. Like I say, with the five structures we've got to complete, the
playground structures we have to complete.
Boyt: Will you have time to do the playground structures? Do you need
more part-time college help?
Dale Gregory: Right now I think we're sitting pretty good. I've got two
high school kids that just started last Friday and we picked up another
CETA boy this week so we should be sitting pretty good. What I've got
planned for, if we get back into the rainy season where we're cutting
grass a lot, I'll be able to take one of the high school kids and the
CETA boy and put them out for cutting all the grass and keep them going
and then the rest of us can work on the projects.
Boyt: Do you have that list too? The list of projects for this year?
Sietsema: The revised? No I don't. I will be going over that with
Dale.
Boyt: One of them is building a basketball court, Carver Beach
playground. Things like that.
~ Dale Gregory: We've got a basketball court too we've got to put back in
in Chaparral now that they're through with the tennis courts. We'll have
to decide when that's going in.
Boyt: It says fencing around property? Is that for here?
Park and Recreation Commission Meeting
June 14, 1988 - Page 12
...".,
Dale Gregory: That was one I talked to Lori to yesterday. We haven't
decided how we're going to attack that one. I really don't know what
we're going to do on that one.
Boyt: You said space to drop sewer. Are they going to run the sewer...
Mady: This would be on top.
Boyt: The ballfield at South Lotus Lake.
Sietsema: Wasn't that deleted?
Boyt: South Lotus Lake, we talked about a ballfield.
Dale Gregory: Nothing can get going on that until they've got a large
pile of clay. That all has to be out of there and then you're getting
back to the whole park is going to have to have a final grade done.
Sietsema: I think that was taken out of the final revision.
Dale Gregory: We're looking at quite a few large projects that they're
going to take time. Where we're running into trouble too, I've already
had trouble this year is with I've had two high school kids that can
drive and I can send them out to go to jobs and I haven't had vehicles
for them. I've got 2 pick-ups in the park department and I need them
myself. I gave my pick-up to the kids today and the last two days so
they can be out working in parks and I've driving around in the dump
truck. We don't have the vehicles anymore. We're just out. It's really
sad but even the maintenance department in the morning, when they get all
their crew out on the job, every pick-up is gone and we don't have the
vehicles anymore for summer help.
...""
Schroers: At one time we talked about a Cushman type vehicle for doing
work in the park. Since the trail proposal was defeated, did that
vehicle go out along with it?
Sietsema: That was never put in any budget and for the amount of trails
that we have. It was planned for when the trail system was really in
place.
Schroers: Do you have more of a need Dale for a regular pick-up truck or
for like a working sized vehicle?
Dale Gregory: I need a pick-up. I need a three-quarter ton pick-ups.
Something I can hook up trailers to and send these guys out working in
that.
Boyt: One or 2. You couldn't get 2 but...
...",
Dale Gregory: If I could 1 it would be great because I could put 2 guys
together and they could go out and work and this type of thing. But like
I say right now we're down in pick-ups. A Cushman would be fine staying
Park and Recreation Commission Meeting
June 14, 1988 - Page 13
,...,
in the Lake Ann Park and when that expands and going to the neighboring
parks real close to that but it isn't going to do me any good for hauling
lawn mowers around and stuff like that. We're spread out so much in the
City with our parks and that that we need the vehicles to get our
equipment there.
Schroers: I think that I'm probably sort of responsible for having you
here tonight. It didn't appear to me that when we're sitting here making
a lot of the plans for the parks in the City of Chanhassen and maybe not
talking to you enough about whether or not you have enough help to get
all this work done. I guess that's what I was wondering. I just wanted
to, in looking at this memo from the Public Works Director, if you agree
with that and if you feel that presently you have enough help or if, in
your opinion you would like us to make a recommendation to Gary Warren to
provide you with more help, be it full-time or seasonal.
,....
Dale Gregory: Right now for this year, like I say again, for the amount
of people I've got and the equipment I've got, we'll be fine. with the 2
kids I've got and the summer help. As long as Jack's can hold up there,
Jack Curtis basically takes care of Lake Ann for me all the time and Jack
is, he's getting up there in age and I don't know how long Jack is going
to keep cutting grass for us. But with the downtown corning in next year,
I've been informed from Gary that that's going to be park too. That we
are definitely going to have to look next year for a full-time person.
Schroers: Knowing how things typically go, just using that structure at
Lake Ann as an example, we expected that would have been operational a
long, long time ago. I think that now is the time to start working on
it. It takes a long time to get people hired. I know that and I think
that we should probably be making a recommendation to start looking to
adding staff.
Sietsema: This is the right time to be doing it because we're going to
be receiving our budget sheets for 1989 probably next week so your
recommendation will be very timely.
Mady: From what I'm hearing, I guess I'd be inclined to ask staff in
putting their budget together to see if it's possible of adding a pick-up
truck to the park equipment list for next year for just the current staff
and then adding another full-time person with a vehicle also so he's not
going to be short. There are a lot of little things that we'd like to do
that we know that we can't get done. A lot of things seem to get, it
always seems that our stuff because you have to give the street
maintenance people so much and this is the busiest time for everybody and
we like to see our stuff done right now. Well, we know that we can't but
we know that it can get done while the kids can still utilize the
equipment before winter sets in the better so I guess I'm kind of
inclined to...
,.....
Sietsema: The vehicles go as a recommendation to Gary Warren because all
of the park maintenance equipment and staff is under public works so that
should be included in your recommendation to Gary.
Park and Recreation Commission Meeting
June 14, 1988 - Page 14
--'
Boyt: Next year in our CIP we have some major projects that will take a
lot of time. More than just one more person.
Schroers: If we were to make up a recommendation right now that we look
at acquiring a pick-up truck for the parks department as soon as possible
and then start whatever process is necessary for hiring an additional
full-time person for 1989 park season and whatever, if you think another
vehicle is necessary at that time. Do you think that would be adequate?
Dale Gregory: We're going to be looking at, not only the vehicle but
we're also going to be looking at a lawn mower for sure too. We've got
the 2 Toros right now. One is tied up strictly at Lake Ann just about
all the time. The other one, one of our smaller mowers is out doing the
other parks. We're going to add North Lotus Lake and we're going to add
South Lotus Lake plus Curry Farms is coming in and we're definitely going
to need another full time 72 inch Toro so we can send 2 of them out at a
time. It's just getting to the point where, like I say with all these
parks we're adding and it's not just 1 or 2 acres. We're talking 10-15
acres at a time we're adding.
Schroers: Do you want to come up with a list of equipment and personnel
that you think you would need full-time and part-time and give that to
the Commission and then we'll make a recommendation off of that?
-"
Dale Gregory: We could do that and like I've been talking with Gary.
We've been working together and we've been putting some of these projects
together and trying to come up with how long we're talking about for
doing all of these projects and basically seeing how much more help we're
going to need.
Lynch: If we can stage this Dale, if you can come up with something that
says now we need this. When Curry Farms happens, when Lake Ann expansion
happens, we're going to need this. When Lake Susan opens up, we're going
to need. If we can get some of these things in a little easier feel for
Gary and Don, if they've been told it's coming.
Sietsema: Chanhassen Hills will probably be graded within the next year
so that will be a park that we'll be looking to develop within a 1 to 2
year timeframe. Curry Farms will probably be developed next year. As
Lake Susan Hills West develops, that's 36 more acres of active parkland
there in the next 5 years.
Mady: Do you ever need equipment such as, I'm sure you borrow from the
street department like the Bobcat or tree spade or things like that?
Dale Gregory: Basically we've got our own tree spade. The Bobcat, the
maintenance department just bought a new Bobcat last year so we've got a
little more flexibility. We've got one that we try to keep out at the
park department. We've got our own Bobcat. Dump trucks and stuff like
that, usually always the City we can borrow from them and get that type
of stuff.
-'
Park and Recreation Commission Meeting
June 14, 1988 - Page 15
,...,
Schroers: In relation to your budget Lori, how soon do you have to have
a recommendation?
Sietsema: I recommend that we have a recommendation by next meeting. We
could wait and have Dale make a list of what his needs are going to be
looking at all the new parks and everything and get that back and make a
recommendation off of that at the next meeting.
Schroers: I think that makes a lot of sense because it's difficult to
sit here and think of everything.
Dale Gregory: I'm going to get a handle from Lori as to what you're all
talking about.
Sietsema: We'll hopefully be approving the 5 year capital improvement
program and that will also give us a handle on what our needs are going
to be and what projects we're anticipating in the next 5 years. You
talked about a truck being purchased as soon as possible. We can make
that recommendation. I doubt that there's going to be funds available in
the 1988 budget to purchase a truck. You might know more about the
public works budget that I don't know. I certainly wouldn't have in my
budget an extra $10,000.00 or whatever you're talking about.
~. Schroers: We're talking about the money like the $4,100.00 that came
from the Lion's and that sort of thing. It's in a different budget and
that money can not be earmarked towards the purchase of a vehicle.
Sietsema: No, that has to go to a capital improvement project. They
want to see improvements in a park. Something like the bleachers or like
the park shelter or like new tot lot equipment or something. Not
maintenance.
Hasek: So we're just going to have you and Dale put together a list.
Why don't you try and put together your thoughts and ideas as to how that
might be phased in...
Mady: Any other thoughts?
Boyt: Are we talking about Gary's letter? I have something about the
Novak-Fleck. I would like to recommend that the City pull the housing
permits if Novak-Fleck doesn't clean up instead of just badgering them.
I think it's important that we take steps that have an impact on them. I
didn't bring my pictures tonight of stuff that was down there.
Schroers: I'll support that. I think that's almost standard operating
procedure for construction companies and developers... If they don't
have the time to clean-up...
~ Boyt moved, Schroers seconded that the Park and Recreation Commission
recommend pulling housing permits from Novak-Fleck if they do not take
measures to clean up their construction debris. All voted in favor and
the motion carried.
Park and Recreation Commission Meeting
June 14, 1988 - Page 16
...;
REVIEW REVISED 5 YEAR CIP.
Hasek: I have a quick question here. Herman Field. We have $38,000.00
for that, $35,000.00 of that is for this year. Do we know what's
happening with that development and how things are shaking out and if the
plans that we even proposed are going to happen?
Sietsema: What happened with HSZ is that they put the cul-de-sac through
the Gary Reed property and it ended in the middle of his property so it
did not bring that street down to the corner of Herman Field. That
leaves the park entrance back at Forest Avenue where it was so we can now
proceed with revising the park plan now that we know that.
Hasek: I was wondering if they had a trail easement or something that
connects that cul-de-sac to the park.
Sietsema: No. What we could do is retain...
Hasek: There's a road easement in there right now.
Sietsema: There's Oriole Lane is a street right-of-way in there and the
residents there are now petitioning to vacate that and before that would
happen I would hope that the Park and Rec Commission would recommend that
we at least obtain a trail easement along that right-of-way to get down -'
to the park.
Mady: Should we do that tonight?
sietsema: Sure. If you want to make a motion to that effect and to
direct staff to go ahead with the revised plan.
Mady moved, Boyt seconded that the Park and Recreation Commission
recommend to obtain a trail easement along the Oriole Lane right-of-way
to Herman Field Park and to direct staff to go ahead with the revised
plan. All voted in favor and the motion carried.
Boyt: We had talked about a revised master plan for City Center.
that on here? Did you talk about that last time. A revised park
We were talking about how we could make additional space up there
redesigning where the ballfields are and the hockey rinks.
Hasek: I think the problem with redesigning the ballfields is that if
you relocate them, you've got two years without a ballfield. The
question is can we afford that.
Is
plan?
by
Boyt: Why?
Dale Gregory: If you can get them seeded in in the fall you're going be ~
working on them to seed them in in the fall, you should be able to use
them the next summer pretty much so you're looking at about two years by
Park and Recreation Commission Meeting
June 14, 1988 - Page 17
,.....
the time you tear it up and reseed it and leave it sit for the next year.
Sietsema: That'd be ugly. We'd have people in here like crazy.
Mady: Retaining the two ballfields where they exist and just adding
to...
Schroers: I thought our main focus on City Center was the hockey rinks.
Mady: What I was talking about last time, here's how the park sits right
now. We've got all this space in here. All this space over here.
There's lee feet between this tennis court and the park boundary.
Schroers: You're talking about a total redesign of the entire park?
Mady: Yes. I want to put the community center on one.
Hasek: So what are we talking about at the City Center? The possibility
of looking at a design?
Mady: I tell you, if we're serious about that we ought to get it to Mark
and let him take a look at the topo and everything and see what's
possible in there. Give him some direction...
,.....
Lynch: The City Center was really not planned. It occurred over the
years.
Boyt: There's some real nice plantings out there.
Hasek: Do you realize you could put all of this inside. You've got
ball fields inside your buildings. A dome.
Boyt: Speaking of domes...it looks a lot like the dome. It used to
cover the Excelsior Merry-go-Round. Did you ever see that? It's in
victoria. I think they decided to take it last night didn't they? The
Council did.
Sietsema: Yes, they allocated $le,000.00.
Hasek: Now we've got a dome and a railroad depot.
Dale Gregory: Have any of you had an opportunity to go look at this yet?
Boyt: I did yesterday. I thought it would be nice for a farmer's
market. I don't know where they'd put it. They talked about Lake Ann
last night.
,....."
....... ... ......'::1......""'''''' v...... "'u"'" ""'Q.1 \1""'.....1 QU"'" ... w""',,"'" vu... ...U""'.."'" , .1vu v"", '::1v... .1.,1'0'0
windows in this thing. Everything is all windows.
Lynch: You're looking at another Legion project.
Park and Recreation Commission Meeting
June 14, 1988 - Page 18
~
Schroers: They've had horses under it or something?
Dale Gregory: Yes. They were using it kind of as riding arena out
there. He used to have a merry-go-round in there at one time.
Schroers: Right on the farm there?
Dale Gregory: Originally when they moved it out there, it used to have a
merry-go-round in it. I used to live just a quarter mile from there and
he bought it and used it as a merry-go-round.
Sietsema: We could even go out to that before the next meeting and look
at it. We probably will have that on the agenda within the next two
meetings to decide where we'd like to put it as long as the Council's
decided we're going to have it. What they're talking about is taking
the windows out and putting in some screen or some different things.
Schroers: Contracting it out to someone and not sticking...
Sietsema: Yes, it would definitely be contracted out.
Hasek: There's a gentleman that owns 49 acres up by Herum that takes old
barns and houses. We might give him a call find out exactly how we place
these on the land.
Sietsema: We might want to mention too that the Kerber barn issue isn't -'
dead yet because Councilman Boyt loves barns and he'd like to see if we
can't put it somewhere. They talked about that at the Council meeting
last night too so Hamilton and Boyt want the barn.
Hasek: I think this old building is really considered a legal
collection.
Boyt: If it's 25 years or older.
Sietsema: The thing with the carosel building is we might be able to
qualify for some historical money for refurbishing it but if we get that
kind of a grant, there are certain stipulations on how you retain it's
original flavor.
A tape break occurred at this point in the meeting.
Hasek: ...a park shelter, $199,999.99.
Sietsema: That's the community park shelter with the boat rentals,
concessions and I don't know if you remember the plan from last year but
it's got the community room with the fireplace in the upstairs.
Hasek: The land acquisition was the other question I had there.
Sietsema: The land acquisition was...
-'
Hasek: In 91, yes.
Park and Recreation Commission Meeting
June 14, 1988 - Page 19
,....
sietsema: Actually that could be moved to beyond because that was if the
land all the way around the lake should become available so we have
money. We can keep moving that back until it becomes available.
Lynch: Lake Susan?
Mady: Are we hoping to get a road next year?
Sietsema: Yes. We're still waiting on Opus. There's another proposal
in and we don't know who the company is but we're again in the running
with Chaska for this corporation, whoever it is. They're being kind of
hush hush about who the company is. We lost to Chaska on the IDS. If we
would have gotten it than we would have had a road probably this year but
if we get this one, they'll be putting in the rest of Lake Drive East.
If the company does corne in, that gives us 2 1/2 acres extra at Lake
Susan to move that boat access proposal to the east of the stand of trees
down there.
Mady: North Lotus Lake. I had a question on the boardwalk. Last week
we were purchasing the boardwalks for the Estates... On the orange, can
we wait until we get it, get it installed before we look at it...
~. Sietsema: Yes. Did we approve it for Chan Estates too? No. Just North
Lotus because it's a lot further out at Chan Estates.
Mady: South Lotus Lake. Didn't we talk about the fishing pier at South
Lotus Lake? That it was going to be difficult to do one down there?
Hoffman: South Lotus Lake?
Mady: Or was it just the fact that we wouldn't be able to get it under a
grant loan at South Lotus Lake?
Hoffman: Parking availability. Space at South Lotus Lake. I don't know
if you want to attract that many people. Where they're all going to park
if'you're going to put that size of pier out there and how favorable they
would look at, they don't like putting fishing piers, in part of their
requirements they don't want to put fishing piers in a high activity area
which they would consider a boat access. They probably would not.
Sietsema: Just from what's been happening this year, I'd like us to not
even consider the boat access portion as park. That's just boat access
and not attract any other uses at this point. We had the first weekend
it was open we had 125 boats launched in one day on South Lotus.
Boyt: And I heard that the Sheriff's department had lost the people who
patrol lakes. They quit.
~
Mad y :
They were out there two weeks ago.
Boyt: They weren't out this weekend.
Park and Recreation Commission Meating
June 14, 1988 - Page 20
......",JJII
Sietsema: They probably don't get out every weekend because they only
had a couple guys for the whole County. I hadn't heard that they quit.
Jim hasn't told me that but that doesn't mean that it isn't...
Lynch: Were there any enforcement problems with that? Have there been
any?
Sietsema: Our parking has been pretty much, they are parking at the
Apple Valley Redimix and at the Taco Shoppe and I don't know where else.
They're not talking along the street too much because they are getting
ticketed. We had a problem with people driving around the gate when it
was closed to launch early, early in the morning or take their boat out
late at night if they didn't get out in time. We only own about 15 feet
on either side of the pavement so Bloomberg Companies put in a split rail
fence and we'll see if that works. They may just take that down and
drive through anyway.
Hasek: Is 125 boats launched in one day create a problem on the lake?
Sietsema: It's kind of a safety problem. I have a hunch that a lot of
those boats might have been people launching for the first time of the
season. But the next weekend we still had 75 people.
Boyt: There's a lot of ignorance. People driving boats that don't know
that you shouldn't drive your boat right next to a swimming area. As ~
close to the bouys as you can get.
Hasek: It doesn't matter even if they do know. What is it supposed to
be, 150 feet?
Boyt: Yes. But they were pulling some water skiers right next to the
beach.
Hasek: We've got a floating dock out probably 125 feet and the skiers go
between that dock and where the kids swim on Lake Minnewashta. You can't
tell me that common sense doesn't tell you that that's inappropriate.
It's not that they don't know. It's just that they really like it.
Mady: Do you have a bouy?
Hasek: No, but that's part of eventually...
Mady: They $70.00 a piece.
Hasek: If you do think there's a problem, you should get somebody out
there to dock them and if there is a problem than maybe we can do
something to limit the number of boats that go out.
Sietsema: There's no way we can.
Hasek: We could always go to the other park to see if we couldn't
convince those people not to let them park there and eliminate some
potential places to park.
...,;
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 22
'"
Lynch: What's going to happen eventually is, and I don't know how long
eventually is going to be but this is what I first felt for 10 or 15
years that the horsepower needs to be regulated on that lake. This is
boats with... on the lake and it's awfully easy to say that the landing
is the problem. It's not the landing that's the problem. It's the
people that use it and have always used the lake. We've had two bad
accidents out there. We have many inappropriate boats. We have some
that are 150-190 horsepower on a 73 acre lake. This is like the bad
corner in your neighborhood. We have to have a few more people killed
there and then they will limit the horsepower.
Boyt: We can make a recommendation to the Public Safety Commission that
our lakes be patrolled more.
Mady: That would be a good idea. I know it's going to be a very
difficult thing to restrict horsepower on Lotus.
Sietsema: What we could do is restrict it at certain times of the week
or day. Sunday afternoons from 10:00 until 6:00.
Boyt: The problem is you don't enforce...
Sietsema: Exactly. It would be enforcing the speed limit, not the horse
""'" power.
Lynch: The problem there, if all the boats were trailered in, that would
be fine. You could do it in that manner but when the boats are already
docked on the lake with your larger horsepower and you try to prevent
them from pushing off to take you around the lake, you've got to have
water patrol sitting there in right numbers...
Boyt: They used to do that in Rhode Island on the highways. They'd sit
there with 10 cars at one junction and they just grab every single car.
If they do that once people are going to remember that. If they would
patrol Lotus and Minnewashta thoroughly a couple of times, it would have
an effect for a while.
Lynch: I don't believe that. It's too easy to look out on that lake to
see if they're there. You know whether they're there.
r
Mady: I know the problems are increasing and I know a lot of them are
coming in through the access. Lots of the boats out there, the horse
power is just getting, and the size of the boats coming on that lake is
getting astronomical. It's just society in general, the people I know
who own boats, they buy a new boat they always get a bigger one. They
add 2 feet to it and they add about 50 horsepower. We're getting some
boats out there that would be inappropriate for almost any lake outside
of Minnetonka for this area. I'm very concerned. I think there are a
number of people that live on the lake that are very concerned about the
quality of the lake. I have a feeling that in two years we're going to
send a recommendation to Council to restrict the horsepower on the lake.
I don't know how the DNR's going to do that with the public access and
all that stuff.
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 23
......."
sietsema: They will be all in favor of it as long as the homeowners, the
riparian people have the same restrictions.
Lynch: We talked about this years ago during the lake useage ordinance.
What you can do and can't do and so forth. You can have any horsepower
that you want. It can be sailing kind of lonely, you can say anybody
coming through with an electric motor, like Lake Ann, they can use it
there. They also...
Mady: The only thing we need to talk about there, let's go on.
Greenwood Shores. The land acquisition is take it when it becomes
available for around Lake Ann.
Boyt: Are we going to do the canoe launch?
Sietsema: Yes. That may be an Eagle Scout project.
Schroers: Actually that canoe launch is going to be directed towards
Lake Lucy rather than Lake Ann.
Sietsema: Right. That's the clearing out.
Schroers: I think in conjunction with the parking lot that will...
Mady: At Carver Beach, the $3,~~~.~~ for off-street parking. Have we
determined where that's going to be?
.......",
Sietsema: No.
Mady: Because I know right now when I go over to watch my daughter play
ball, parking on that road and back out of the park, it's a very narrow
street. Maybe as off-street putting a lane in for parallel parking. I
don't know if that's public road there or if that's...
Dale Gregory: It's public.
Mady: Because it's so narrow.
Hasek: I think parallel parking would be good, or a parking bay or
something.
Mady: Lotus Trail. Is this the trail and the beach?
Sietsema: It's the linear strip all the way. It's all one long big
park.
Mady: Including the trail and the beach?
Sietsema: The general improvement in 1989 was landscaping. Landscaping
the old boat access area and also landscaping around the parking area. ~
We're going to be doing some this year but there was possibly more that
we might want to do. The thing is there is potential Eagle Scout
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 24
JIll"'"
projects within that park and I wanted to have some money in the budget
to be able to do those without having a budget adjustment in the middle
of the year.
Hasek: When we were out there, didn't we notice that the old access, is
that where people had been backing in and across the grass and stuff
there?
Hoffman: We've got reports on that activity also.
Dale Gregory: There is a sign out there now that says the boat landing
is closed and asking people to launch their boats at South Lotus Lake
Boat Access.
Mady: It's pretty good. You can do it with a 4-wheel drive if you really
had your mind set on it. It's a challenge.
Dale Gregory: They're wearing off the top a little bit. It was more of
a berm and now it's getting a little bit rounded.
Lynch: Do you have any nice rocks that you could put out there?
,...,
Dale Gregory:
I don't have any great big ones, no.
Hoffman: That's a long strip too to cover.
Boyt: Speaking of signage, we need signs that have just general
information at all of them. No dogs. Is there liquor allowed?
Hasek: I don't think it is, is it?
Sietsema: It is allowed. No intoxicating liquor except malt beverages
is the ordinance.
Mady: If you're of age.
Sietsema: I've got a memo coming on the next agenda that addresses some
of those ordinance amendments that we've been talking about. Finally
make a recommendation on those.
Hasek: Are we addressing the glass?
Sietsema: Yes. That's next.
Mady: I spent 10 minutes picking up one shattered beer bottle.
Schroers: We're having the same problem.
"'"'
Sietsema:
It's unbelieveable this year.
Boyt: It's a public safety thing too. Todd and I were both down at Lake
Ann at different lunch times and the amount of liquor that's down there,
the teenagers at lunch time.
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 25
.....".,
sietsema: I don't know if it's going to decrease a little bit now that
the senior parties are done with. I know that towards the last couple
weeks of school...
Boyt: ...knew where those parties are going to be and they stayed away
from those parties.
Sietsema: The Public Safety?
Boyt: Yes.
Sietsema: I tell you the Carver County Sheriff's department hasn't been
as cooperative in our parks as we would have liked them to be.
Lynch: Drinking in the parks has always concerned me. It's really
impossible to police only malt beverages. Just to rib me, when I had my
Little League team down there, we were scheduled for 2 to 4 on the field.
At 3:30 the guys show up with the tackler in there saying let's have a
party. So they're all there starting on the keg ahead of time. The boys
felt that that kind of activity was not real conducive to family use of
the park or young junior leagues at the park. My wife felt that if
you're going to have beer there it should be on a license basis, that
you're going to have to go down and you're going to have to get a permit.
Without a permit you're going to get your butt arrested and hauled out of
there. ...".,
Sietsema: I'll add that to the list for next time because we will be
talking about a number of other ordinance amendment things and I'll add
that to the list for discussion at the next meeting.
Mady:
Park.
area.
Rice Marsh Lake and Chan Estates Park. A question on Chan Estates
We have the road that goes down into the park and the parking
Then there's a road that goes off that back around.
Dale Gregory: That's the Metro Sewer Waste Commission.
Sietsema: Did you want to put boardwalk in here for 1991 or something
like that?
Boyt: Yes.
Lynch: We don't have a boardwalk down there. I've looked at that for a
lot of years. I still concerned about safety of a boardwalk in that
area with the kids. I really am. You go out on that soup and I'm an old
duck hunter and I've portaged through enough muck in my life to know how
dangerous it can be. That floating bog out-there can really be a trap.
Sietsema: That's a good point.
Lynch: You go and wade through it, you're finished unless you've got ~
somebody who's got the knowledge and ability to pull you out of there.
It's worse than water. One little drowning kid and the next little
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 26
"'"
drowning kid is going to go help him out and he goes down too. The
floating bog is worse than that.
Schroers: I went down in there and the landowner told me, when he asked
who I was, he told me several times to stay out of there. ...try to do
whatever they're going to do out there and he just never came back. He
claims that it's quicksand. I personally have never seen any quicksand
down there but I agree that it could be potentially a hazardous area.
Lynch: The problem with a floating bog is that it has a generous number
of root sections that form a Chinese bubble. You go through it, you
can't get back up through it. If you go completely through it, you'll
find that hole where he went down. I've gone through and the only thing
that kept me from going all the way through was the canoe yoke. I was
walking along and I stopped and all of a sudden barn, you break through
and I grabbed the yoke right up to here... You can't get out of it
yourself. You have to have somebody to come along and get you out of
there. I pulled waist up boots off out hunting because my feet stuck
down in that muck and pulled them both right out of the waist up. It's
real scary stuff.
Sietsema: You want to take out the boardwalk in Rice Marsh Lake?
~ Lynch: I think you'd have to be darn careful where you put it. Just to
shoot out across Rice March Lake, like go over the lake with a long
skinny floating trail, that's really asking for a neighborhood problem.
Sietsema: So you don't want to put the boardwalk in there then?
Lynch: If we want two and try a very down scaled boardwalk someplace
like North Lotus Lake and see how it works and see what the complaints
are and if the parents are worried about it.
Hoffman: The purpose initially was to get people out there to drop in a
canoe and go fishing there in the bummer? Is that what we're thinking?
Sietsema: Yes. I won't put that in there.
Mady: Bandimere Heights. Was there anything changed in Bandimere
Heights? Bluff Creek.
Hasek: Where's the land acquisition for that at? Just additional...
Sietsema: That was to add land to either end to get down to the
Minnesota Valley Wildlife Refuge and then up. Purchasing easements more
than land acquisition.
Boyt: Jim, when we do the basketball courts, I've had some parents
~ ~ay~ng, w~en we put up ~he normal height.basket~ will you also put up a
Junlor helght for the klds because the 11ttle klds use.
Sietsema: For what park?
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 27
...-;'
Boyt: They asked for Bandimere. I think at any of them. If you put one
basket up at the junior size.
Hoffman: Better make it strong.
Hasek: That is my biggest concern right there because I
get torn down. Every adult in town will be pulling that
will be so much fun. I can dunk the ball in a 9 footer.
can get my elbows into the thing. It's fun to do. You
down and you pull on the basket. They'll be down on the
you can...
think they'll
thing down. It
An 8 footer I
go up and jam it
ground before
Mady: If we do that we're going to have
court or on the court stating that there
City doesn't have the liability problem.
jams the ball through and breaks his arm.
to put a sign up right by the
is no dunking. That way the
The guy who goes up there and
Hasek: I think I'm even more concerned about replacing the baskets all
the time. I understand it would be nice to have them a little bit lower
but I think we'd be asking for trouble if we started lowering baskets
because I think they're just going to get torn apart.
Lynch: Besides that, I started out at full height when I was 8 years
old.
Boyt: But you guys are 6 feet tall.
....""
Mady: Until I came here I never saw them at 8 feet tall. When I was a
little kid, that's why I can't play basketball.
Sietsema: The design of the stuff is, we just want to know if you want
the money in there or not.
Hasek: That's fine. I think really if you want to try that we should
try it at 1 or 2 parks just to see. I guess I'd like to try it at 1 or 2
parks so we know that we're going to get some heavy use.
Boyt: They have them at the school and one of them is a real mess
because someone had broke it down.
Hasek: I know for a fact, I have friends who used to have them for their
kids and then moved them back up to 10 feet because they couldn't stand
the neighborhood kids there.
Boyt: Bandimere is a pretty small area. Pretty small park. Light use.
Mady: We could try it. The cost to put a sucker up would be about a
couple hundred dollars.
Dale Gregory: If you put a decent backboard up and pole like we've got
at Chaparral Park, you'll probably be looking at $600.00. ~
Sietsema: Were there any other changes on Minnewashta Heights then?
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 28
11""
Mady: I don't think so.
Boyt: City Center Park we have some money set aside for totlot equipment
next year. Chan Elementary is planning on putting another $10,000.00
towards totlot equipment with us. I'm going to contact Betsy Gross in
District #112 and her job is to write up proposals for grants. I thought
she could use our CIP to apply for a grant for matching funds for totlot
equipment.
Mady: One thing at City Center, once we get a park plan and we go
through a major, we're not a major totlot setback for kids. We need to
address the shade. It is barren out there. We've got to install some
sizeable trees that we're going to have to go out and probably buy.
Maybe some artificial shade. When I was up there 2 weeks ago Sunday, my
daughter and a couple other kids, I thought they can go up there and play
on the swings. After 5 minutes they were in the car it was so doggone
hot up there and I'm still trucking around the park... Make a comment to
that when we put playground equipment in. Having shade available.
Sietsema: Do you want to put money for landscaping in here then?
.".
Mady: Yes. I'm not sure what those big trees cost. A 10 inch diameter
tree or something.
Hasek: You can't get them that big.
Boyt: Halla Nursey donated two 10 inch diameter trees to our silent
auction. I think they were $1,500.00 a piece but we sold them for
$500.00 almost a piece and they donated more to us so they could sell
more at $500.00 so they might be willing to work with us.
Dale Gregory: Unless you get a good deal from Halla, Halla is one of
your most expensive nurseries around.
Boyt: For the publicity he was willing to...
Dale Gregory:
somewhere else
Yes, but your $1,500.00 trees would probably have gone
for. . .
Boyt: $500.00?
Mady: Shouldn't we put for like 1990 money for Curry Farms?
Sietsema: Yes.
Watson: That thing is going up fast. We're going to have kids from that
area.
~ Boyt: Are we going to pass this onto Council?
Sietsema: It goes into the Comprehensive Plan and it does need Council
approval but it will go in as a whole package with the Comprehensive
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 29
Plan.
-'
Boyt moved, Mady seconded that the Park and Recreation Commission
recommend approval of the revised 5-Year Capital Improvement Program.
All voted in favor and the motion carried.
REVIEW REQUEST TO SEED HOCKEY RINKS.
Boyt: Two more years?
Hasek: You don't need two more years do you?
Dale Gregory: Oh yes, at least. They were treated with... to keep the
weeds down.
Hasek: That's a 4 year deal?
Dale Gregory: About 5. You're starting to get a little bit of weeds
growing occasionally.
Hasek: Are they still using it for soccer?
Mady: It was so dusty.
Dale Gregory: If you wanted to get it into grass and that, the ideal ~
thing would be to get rid of some of the clay that's in there and get in
some decent dirt.
Hasek: How would that affect the ice in the wintertime? ,
Dale Gregory: Grass?
Hasek: No, if you changed the soil to accomodate grass. How would that
affect the ice?
Dale Gregory: It wouldn't be any different than any of the family rinks
around. Like the family rink along side of it, that's just on a dirt
base.
Hasek: Do you get better quality ice on clay than you do on dirt?
Dale Gregory: I don't think it makes a difference. It really doesn't.
You see like Shorewood and some of the other ones, some of them in Chaska
leaves theirs into grass. It takes them longer to get ice because of the
grass and everything.
Schroers: I think what's more important there is if you have the surface
level so you don't have to come up with dirt...
Dale Gregory: The bad part of this thing here is if we could have it as
nice and level as we wanted for the freeze up and everything else and we -'
started flooding it, after a while...boy we get those bumps and
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 30
,.....
everything. We don't know what to do with them. I don't know how to get
rid of them.
Mady: We'll just have to let nature take it's course and hopefully Dale
can reduce the weeds in the park in both of those hockey rinks.
Hasek: So really what we're looking at if we want to do that for soccer
would be we'll have to treat it and just try and establish seed in there.
My kids play in there and it's an ideal thing for kids. They don't have
to chase that ball around.
REVIEW CARVER BEACH PARK.
Hasek: I guess the interesting thIng about this was that the main beach
was approved by the Park and Recreation Commission in the mid-70's so it
was established on approval. The only problem that I have with it is the
way that it's acquired sand. It was put in there, it was my
understanding the staff put it in there.
Sietsema: Street maintenance. It wasn't for a drainage problem. It was
because it was washed out during the big storm last year. The sand that
was there was washed out so they just put more sand to replace it.
,.....
Hasek: That's just in-house maintenance. If we have a problem with
that park we shouldn't allow that to happen.
Lynch: My problem with it was just like maintaining a private park.
Hasek: It's not really. It's not really private. It's certainly less
public than some of the other places but it's on the street. The access
is right off the street.
Hoffman: If you had parking there, there would be a continuous shore
fishing there.
Lynch: I've been told several times when I was over there that I was
standing on private property. They tell people to split. There's no
parking. There's no boat access and in view of the Council's
recommendation that in order to maintain park property be accessible.
There's never going to be anyplace to park there. I'd like to see this
thing, if we heard from the residents out there and the letter from Lori
May 31st that outlined a lot of the problems. I'd like to see those
passed up to the Council. I'd like the Council's recommendation on what
they would like to have done. If they say that okay, this is going to be
a park. It's alright to have that park there. I don't think the Council
is in a position where they can say well, in this instance we're going to
let some of the citizens maintain a private beach on our property. The
Council is going to have to either say the City is going to have a mini-
~ beach or the City is not going to have a beach on that property.
Sietsema: They have said that they will.
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 31
Lynch: The Council?
.....""
Sietsema: Yes. There's a recommendation of the Park and Recreation
Commission back in the mid-70's to approve that mini-beach and that was
approved by City Council.
Lynch: So it is an official park property and officially to be used for
that?
Sietsema: Yes.
Lynch: Okay. That I never knew.
Sietsema: It was established and approved by the City.
Lynch:
than it
Okay, then we'll say that we better sign and maintain it better
is now.
Boyt: We haven't treated it like it was our beach because I can remember
standing there...up a ways.
Mady: It's closer to them.
Boyt: It's also at a bottleneck. The way the drivers go along that
lake, they must be coming real close to that swimming beach.
Sietsema: It's actually safe for swimming.
..."",
Lynch: Our official swimming area should be moved to that position
because of the lay of lake. It is dangerous where we maintain the
present beach. I guess for now I would like if we could make a motion, I
will make a motion that it has been brought to our attention that that is
officially slated as a beach. That it be signed as a public beach and
maintained as beach property in accordance with our park maintenance
guidelines because now it looks shabby and I know now it's being used as
a private beach and represented as such by people who live near there
so I think we better bring it up to standard.
Sietsema: I didn't get all that.
Lynch: Bring it up to park standards with signing and maintenance.
Boyt: And bouys.
Lynch: Anything to do with normal maintenance.
Mady: I'd like to see the Council allow us to open up the parking on
that street on the lake side or at least 4 parallel parking spots with
proper signage on that street. We talked with one of the neighbors
there. He indicated he would have no problems with parking on that
street there because people are doing it anyway. This way they can do it
legally and utilize it. ..."",
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 32
,....
Watson: If you can park at Greenwood Shores Park, you should be able to
park at here. I maintain that these people aren't going to be real
pleased that there's suddenly going to be a swimming beach.
Mady: This is true but we need to address the problems with the boats
being stored on that park property. The reason it's such an old problem
is because it's now added to the beach.
Sietsema: It has but it's like the minute you turn around, you turn your
back, they know that you're going to be gone for a couple of weeks and
they'll put their boat back there.
Mady: What you do is you confiscate their boat. We've got a request
somebody who wants to put a boat down there at that lake and we've got to
tell him no, you can't do it. Why can't I do it, you've got 4 of them
sitting down here now. We've got to clean it up. This city's always
been kind of lax in their enforcement. Now they're starting to get a
little tougher but we need to get tough on everybody. If you've got the
law, you've got to enforce it. Just because you live across the street
from it doesn't mean you get to go by a different set of rules than
somebody who lives down on Chan Estates.
Watson: What constitutes having a boat on a public park? As long as
it's out in the water a ways it's alright?
,....,
Lynch:
It can't be on the parkland in excess of 24 hours.
Watson: As long as it's completely in the water it's alright.
Lynch: That's what we're being told.
Sietsema: The boat that's moored there on the very, very northern end,
there's nothing we can do about it. There's nothing we can do about that
raft because we have nothing on the books that prohibits mooring a boat
or a raft out from park property. That's on the memo...
Mady: I tell you what, when we go to bouy that, putting bouys out there,
I'm going to make part of the amendment of the ordinance is we're not
going to allow people to put anything out from park property. To me
putting a raft out on a public beach is no different than somebody else
coming in and deciding to put their own play structure in a city park and
saying that's theirs. You just don't do those things because once it's
there, the City has the liability. That's it. It's ours.
Sietsema: It's on the list for the park amendment issues for next time.
Lynch: Okay, I made a motion, Carol seconded it that we add four parking
spots.
Mady: Signed off-street parking.
'"
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 33
Lynch moved, Watson seconded that the park along Lotus Trail at Carver ~
Beach be brought up to park maintenance standards with four parking
spaces, proper signage and swimming bouys. All voted in favor and the
motion carried.
REQUEST TO REMOVE SEAWEED AND WATER LILIES AT CARVER BEACH.
Mady: Lori, did you ever find out what part of the lake this was?
Sietsema: It is at the Carver Beach. The designated beach. The main
Carver Beach. There are lilies that are encroaching.
Mady: Are they lilies or are they those...
Sietsema: I don't know.
Mady: I do know that I don't want to see us do too much weeds. There
are a lot of residents around that lake that if you start removing
vegetation from the shoreline, they're going to be real...
Lynch: Do you have to have DNR approval?
Sietsema: You have to have a DNR permit and there is a cost involved in
having the weeds removed. I still don't know what that cost is.
Schroers: I have some personal expertise in that. We hire every year a
private company to come in and remove weeds at our park and it's very
expensive. It's time consuming. There are a number of problems involved
with it. Their equipment is very large and very bulky. They have to
have an adequate place to load it and unload a very good launch facility.
They need a place to discard the material after it's harvested and that
stuff gets rank.
.....""
Sietsema: There would be no way they would be able to get their
equipment down that hill then to Carver Beach.
Schroers: Besides being expensive, it's not 100% effective. They don't
get all the weeds. Propelling their machines through the water creates a
wake out in front which pushes some of the weeds away from their cutters
so it's difficult. They do get a majority of it but it's lot like mowing
your yard. It comes back. Not quite as bad but it does come back.
Hasek: Don't they only go out 4 feet or something too?
Schroers: Yes, 4 or 5 feet is probably as far down as you can do it and
the main reason that we do it is to eliminate swimmers itch because the
swimmers itch actually comes from the snails and the snails live
underneath the weeds. They remove the weeds and that eliminates the
environment for the snails and eliminates the swimmers itch.
Mady: How extensive is the problem? I've seen a few weeds and it's kind-'
of bothersome when you walk out or is it choking the beahc out?
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 34
,...,
Sietsema: I know that this is all she wrote. Please remove seaweed and
lily pads from public swimming access on Lotus Lake off of Carver Beach
Road. Over the past years it has always been free of such particals.but
since people are back swimming they've noticed the seaweed. It would be
a great help and make swimming there much more enjoyable. That's all I
know.
Schroers: It's roaming vegetation. It's not seaweed that's floating in
that's been cut up by motors.
Mady: I know from my experience on the lake it's a bad year for them.
The water got warm real fast. The lake levels are down. You didn't have
a lot of snow cover so the lake vegetation was going earlier so light
penetration was in there. The weeds are growing fast here but I know
swimming in the lake and walking through the weeds is a problem.
Sietsema: The other thing is that the lake is so far down you're a lot
further out than you used to be. Where the swimming area is, where they
had the weeds controlled, is now swimming out further. At my folks house,
is the same thing. I said morn you've got so many weeds this year.
What's the problem and she said I don't know. We've never had this many
weeds and the thing is the lake is down 8 feet. We used to swim where
there is all this nice sandy open space. We're out in the weeds that
we've never been able to touch bottom before.
,....,
Schroers: The other thing with the weed harvester is that they are
presently in very high demand and to be able to call them up and have
them corne over and take care of your weed problem, you'll probably be
waiting for months.
Sietsema: The recommendation was to wait a year and see if the swimmers
don't, if you do have a lot of swimming and a lot of people swimming,
that sometimes will take care of a small problem. And if it doesn't,
then maybe put some on the end of the budget for next year.
Mady: ...a policy of ours to see how the lake handles it. If the lake
level comes up.
Hasek:
tonight?
Is there anything that's on this that's absolutely mandatory for
Do we have to finish these up?
Sietsema: I need a schedule for City Council meetings.
SITE PLAN REVIEW: CHES MAR FARMS.
,....,
Sietsema: This is the proposal being proposed by Lotus Realty, Brad
Johnson. It's located just off of TH 41 about a quarter mile north of
TH 5. There are no parks in the area currently servicing the area but it
is a rural part of the City and it's not a high priority for parkland.
The trail plan calls for trails along TH 41. You can see in the staff
report, it's pretty short and the recommendation is to request that
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 35
...."."
payment of park dedication fees be requested in lieu of parkland and a 20
foot trail easement along TH 41 with the trail fees requested instead of
trail construction.
Hasek: This is not being affected by what we're proposing along the
south side of Lake Minnewashta is it? The trail through that new
development that's down there. Hoping to tie in... You know when we
talked about trails.
Sietsema: It's south.
Hasek: The question is, is the trail go through or does it go up to the
Regional Park?
Sietsema: We don't have anything going through. The trail goes through
the development to the south and then up to the little Tanadoona Drive
and out to TH 41.
Watson: So you pick up there at TH 41.
Sietsema: It's just a small section along TH 41.
Mady: There's not a lot of space for us to do much. You've got a park
on one side and a camp on the other.
......",
Sietsema: This area here, this Outlot A, they are proposing as a
recreational area. I think they're hoping to get a beach10t to it.
Mady moved, Hasek seconded that the Park and Recreation Commission
recommend payment of the park dedication fees in lieu of park land and to
request a 20 foot trail easement along Highway 41 and request payment of
the trail fees in lieu of trail construction for Ches Mar Farms. All
voted in favor and the motion carried.
SITE PLAN REVIEW: HIDDEN VALLEY.
Sietsema: This proposal lies on the north side of Lake Drive East just
east of Q-Superette. It's zoned business neighborhood. The neighborhood
in this area is served by Rice Marsh Lake Park and the sidewalk is
already in place along Lake Drive East. Due to the size and the nature
of the development, staff is recommending to accept park and trail
dedication fees in lieu of parkland and trail construction.
Boyt: Do they pay trail dedication fees if there's already a trail
existing?
Sietsema: Yes.
......"
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 36
,.....,
Hasek moved, Watson seconded that the Park and Recreation Commission
recommend to accept park and trail dedication fees in lieu of parkland
and trail construction for Hidden Valley. All voted in favor and the
motion carried.
PARK NAMING CONTEST - WEEKLY FEATURE PARK.
Mady: This is real quick. There is no handout. I called Lori about 2
weeks ago. I drove by the park that exists next to DataServ. No one
knows there's no sign. There exists right now a road, no park benches or
picnic tables or anything but there is a road there and I believe there
are 2 swings. It's mowed. It's a nice looking spot. It's not real big.
We don't have a name for that park.
Sietsema: It used to be the sewage treatment plant site.
,....
Mady: No one knows it exists. We need to name that park so we have
something to go by. Maybe what we need to do is get a whole publicity
thing going with the Chanhassen villager and see if maybe she would be
willing to go in every week or every other week and write a little blurb
on a particular park. This week they're going to talk about Bluff Creek.
Next week Chan Estates and work with staff and find out about them and
get some information into the hands of the public. In line with that go
with a name the park contest of some sorts and start doing some things
for publicity. I don't need a motion but maybe just mention it to Mary
and see if she has any interest in doing that.
Sietsema: I did talk to her about the weekly feature and she didn't
know. . .
Mady: If she could give us a couple of columns every couple weeks.
Watson: Especially right now.
Sietsema: If there's an event tied in with it. If there's some
development going on in the park or there's something happening in the
park, she said that would be fine but to just say here's the park of the
week and it's got this, this and this located there. She said no. She
didn't actually say it in those words.
ESTABLISH COMMISSION SCHEDULE TO CITY COUNCIL MEETINGS.
July 11
July 25
Aug. 8
Aug. 22
Sept.12
Sept.26
- Ed Hasek
- Sue Boyt
- Jim Mady
- Carol Watson
- Larry Schroers
- Curt Robinson
,-..-
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 37
-.-".
Sietsema: If I could just over a couple things that I handed out. The
referendum related authorizations. Engineering will be proceeding with
getting plans and specifications for Lake Ann Park expansion. We hope to
be doing grading this fall.
Hasek: That's another park that's not going to be ready for at least two
years, maybe three?
Sietsema: If we get going this fall than we should be able to get it
done next year and maybe have it done by 1990.
Hasek: But it won't be ready for the season anyway.
Sietsema: No, I don't think we'll be able to play on it that first year.
The way it sounds. The other big thing on that was that the community
center task force will not be because as we told everyone during the
referendum process, it was a one time deal. We aren't able to afford a
community center and after the little auditing business and Don's gone
through all the finances, we don't have enough money to put a community
center anywhere else so we'll be contacting the people who wanted to be
on... He said that we should be able to afford the trails so we're still
planning to go ahead with the trails on the November ballot. I will be
forming that task force. There were about 5 people that were interested
in being on that.
.......,
Schroers: I think we should form a task force of those people that said
we could afford to build one out at Lake Ann and ...
Sietsema: The other thing was that the chain of lakes clean-up project.
The City Council did commit to that. I put that in front of you too.
Making a commitment and if you read through there, that outlines,
specifically says that the Park and Recreation Commission will be the
lead agency in holding the public hearings for these boat accesses in the
next couple years so just keep in mind that that may require some extra
meetings. That may require some meetings that are dedicated solely to
that topic. Especially in Lake Lucy.
Mady: Are you going to start then looking at Lake Lucy and kind of
figure out how we do it?
Sietsema: I have been.
Mady: Is there anything we should know about the 4th of July
celebration? Anything that we'll be asked to do?
Sietsema: Yes. Just a minute.
Boyt: I've been talking to people about it because...and they don't want
to be in the celebration.
Mady: On all of that asphalt?
--'
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 38
I""""
Boyt: Yes. Are you going to tak~ a family of kids up there and sit on
the asphalt and watch the fireworks? No. They'd rather not go. They
don't want to go. There's no place for the kids. They don't want to sit
on the asphalt. They can bring their lawn chairs and sit on those. It
doesn't appeal to them. I talked to Craig Westerman who owns a business
in town. He says he wasn't interested... I was trying to get people to
work up there and when they find out where it is, they're not interested
anymore. Since we're asked to be a part of it, I think we should have
some input.
Sietsema: The reason that it is where it is is because the HRA is going
to be involved and a good portion of what goes on on that night, they're
having their downtown lighting ceremony so similar we had the ground
breaking last year. They are going to have the free hot dogs again this
year and that whole bit so they thought for the lighting ceremony,
instead of having people being moved allover the City, they wanted to
have it all downtown so they could flip the big imaginary switch and all
the new lights downtown go on and that kind of thing. That was the
reason why that spot was chosen.
Boyt: I know it's the HRA and lighting the downtown lights but I think
it's going to hurt the 4th of July celebration. I'd like to see it back
up behind City Hall.
~. Sietsema: We haven't got a place to shoot fireworks.
Boyt: You can shoot them off the same place you're going to shoot them
off here. You can shoot them off ~ight back over here and watch them
from the lawn up here. There's nothing back there.
Schroers: What would be wrong with having that part of it down at Lake
Ann and then just having...
Mady: The fireworks?
Schroers: The fireworks and the dance and the whole program down there
and then have the lighting ceremony up here.
Sietsema: It's a matter of shuttling people back and forth and the
traffic and what not. The other thing about having everything out at
Lake Ann Park is that the traffic. Where are we going to park cars and
then once the whole thing's over, getting cars out of there onto TH 5.
Directing traffic in the middle of the night like that is a dangerous
situation. We're going to have to be looking at Lake Ann as our future
spot for the whole thing because we're running out of places elsewhere
where we can shoot off the fireworks. It's getting to the point where...
Schroers: Aesthetically it would certainly be the nicest spot.
"....
Sietsema: I agree with that and I agree, I have the same arguments on
the downtown.
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 39
"""'*""
Schroers: It's kind of absurb that we can't use our main park to have
our 4th of July celebration.
Boyt: I think it is our own celebration too. It's park's staff that
organizes most of this except for the free hot dogs and the free food and
that's HRA. Otherwise we do most of it. We do the band. We do the
organizing of the games that are played.
Watson: I don't think we're talking about the same old people. When you
saw the people that actually went to that ceremony at the 4th of July
celebration last year, the people had their kids on the grass and just
have a picnic and just be a part of the City's celebration aren't
necessarily all that fascinated with watching the lights on the main
street of Chan go on. Maybe at a separate time maybe but I don't know
that it's necessarily going to be fitting for now.
Schroers: They're capitalizing on an event.
Boyt: They are. They're capitalizing on our event.
Schroers: I guess it's reasonable but it's really too bad.
Mady: They're trying to build some interest in downtown because there
have been so many people that have had misconceptions.
-'
Hasek: Exactly. If you kill what we've been trying to establish as the
main event related to the City by putting it on tar and everybody is
going to say, I'll pass on that and go next year.
Boyt: They know they had a good time last year and the people are
thinking that it's going to be the same this year. When I talk to
neighbors and people at the beach and I say it's going to be up here, oh.
They won't go. They'll go to another place.
Watson: When you're up here you're not close to the main street. You
don't have to watch your kids as closely. They can get a few feet away
from you without getting run over.
Hasek: I guess I'd like, I think all of us here would like to be able to
see it moved up here if it's at all possible to do that. I don't know if
there's some people you can talk to and get it...
Sietsema: Everything went in the paper and the paper comes out tomorrow.
Boyt: Tonight's the dealine. Tuesday night.
Hoffman: There's a long string of publicity items that are out there
that are publicizing it as downtown.
Sietsema: The flyers are printed up.
Hoffman: It was a long battle among staff on where to put this thing.
....,I
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 40
;/"""
Schroers: I think we should get out some publicity that says ha, ha just
kidding.
Hasek: Two things. Can we keep it in mind next year that it's
ridiculous to have all this grass around and we're going to... Secondly,
it would seem to me like we still only have one main access to Lake Ann
and if you think of doing major events like this, we better think about
separating traffic.
Sietsema: The plan is to move the entrance for Lake Ann.
Hasek: You're going to move it but if you're going to get people in and
out of there, you're going to have to have more than just a little street
that you've got. I think the thing to do is to have two access points.
One for an event like this where you can separate traffic eastbound on
end and westbound on the other way.
Watson: When Eckankar develops, there might be a possibility.
Sietsema: It might never.
Watson: That's true but...
Sietsema: My point is, if we're going to wait for Eckankar, we could be
,~ waiting 25 years. They're not selling. They were approached and they
aren't going to sell. They have no plans to develop in the near future
so we can't really count on them.
Mady: Will you be asking Commissioners to participate in anything?
Sietsema: Yes.
Hoffman: If there's anything on there that appeals to you that you would
like to help out, you certainly can.
Boyt:
I need
Laredo
year.
We need to set up a meeting with the Public Safety Commission and
to, on our next meeting I guess, talk about how we're going to get
trail down because Dale can't do it and that was to do done this
Hasek: We just have to direct staff to get bids out on it but then it
has to have a design for it too.
Boyt: Well, we have those sections marked.
Mady: But we don't have the layout of the land and all that.
,.......,
Sietsema: We don't have all of the easements either.
to Frontier.
All the way down
Boyt: I think we need a meeting with Public Safety Commission to talk
about our parks and patrolling the drinking in the parks.
Park and Recreation Commission
June 14, 1988 - Page 41
......"
sietsema: Yes. I'll talk to Jim. About the trail along Lotus Drive.
We will have to hold public hearings before that happens because it does
affect people. Even though it may be going in the right-of-way, they're
going to want to have their input.
Mady: Can you have Larry Brown give us information for our next meeting.
We're looking now at July. There's only another two months left before
school starts and I don't want those kids walking on the street next
year.
Hasek: How are we going to affect that if we haven't got the easements?
Are you going to buy them?
Mady: My understanding is we've got enough right-of-way to do it.
Sietsema: But we need to hold public hearings though.
Mady: We'll have to do that in July. I want a trail along there.
Hasek moved, Watson seconded to adjourn the meeting.
and the motion carried. The meeting was adjourned.
All voted in favor
Submitted by Lori Sietsema
Park and Rec Coordinator
--'
Prepared by Nann Opheim
....""